NBA's initial proposal to union: $45 million hard salary cap

[Isitjustme?]

http://aol.sportingnews.com/nba/story/2011-05-16/sbj-nba-proposes-45-million-hard-salary-cap#ixzz1MY8wVC6I
:lmao

[Isitjustme?]

The NHL has a $59 million dollar cap...

[rayjayjohnson]

bet memphis is praying the fedexforum gets washed away now

[Kyle Orton]

I'm surprised all the owners want this. This would more or less break up Miami's big 3 unless they all took a massive pay cut. Something like this wouldn't happen before a 2-3 year lockout.

[benefactor]

The proposed hard cap is something the NBA has never had under collective bargaining, but it has become a critical element to owners.
The same owners that spent shitloads of money last summer...some of it in max contracts to marginal players. You can't whine about the cap with your mouth while writing huge checks with your hands.

[daslicer]

I'm surprised all the owners want this. This would more or less break up Miami's big 3 unless they all took a massive pay cut. Something like this wouldn't happen before a 2-3 year lockout.

I would say Miami would still keep their big 3 due to grandfather clauses but the goal of doing this would be to prevent future big 3's from forming through free agency.

[Kyle Orton]

The same owners that spent shitloads of money last summer...some of it in max contracts to marginal players. You can't whine about the cap with your mouth while writing huge checks with your hands.

This. Cheap kike Sarver is the chief of owners complaining and it looks ridiculous after the payroll moves he made last summer.

[Kyle Orton]

I would say Miami would still keep their big 3 due to grandfather clauses but the goal of doing this would be to prevent future big 3's from forming through free agency.

Grandfather clauses keep them together till their contracts are up. That "8 title" fantasy would be gone if a $45,000,000 hard salary cap was in the new CBA.

[Cessation]

I thought, spreading superstar players among teams, rather than concentrating them on one, would be good for the league.

[Nick Manning]

I thought, spreading superstar players among teams, rather than concentrating them on one, would be good for the league.

Nobody watches the shit teams anyways, no sense in perpetrating the charade.

[Venti Quattro]

Wow what a fucking joke...

[4>0rings]

If the NBA owners just knew... these street rats have NOTHING ELSE, they make millions to play a game. They have no education to do anything other wise.

Scrap the teams, play shitty backups. Shitty backups vs shitty backs ups = no one knows they are shit.

[Cessation]

Nobody watches the shit teams anyways, no sense in perpetrating the charade.

You might have a point there.

[baseline bum]

RIP 2011-12 NBA Season. I guess we have seen the final games in the careers of Tim Duncan and Kevin Garnett, and Kobe's dropoff is going to be really nasty by 2012-13 when we get to see basketball again. Good luck to LeBron paying for that new house on unemployment.

[baseline bum]

Kentucky and UNC better fucking be amazing next year. :pctoss

[ElNono]

I can see Derek Fisher fighting tooth and nail to keep retirement benefits, but I really don't see him being the kind of guy that's going to put a fight against a ruthless Stern...
Next season is probably done, but I have a feeling players are going to lose, and lose big this time around...

[LnGrrrR]

The NHL has a $59 million dollar cap...

Not really the same though. An NHL team has four lines of three frontliners, plus three lines of two defensivemen, plus a goalie. (that's 19 right there) then there's a few bench players as well.

[Isitjustme?]

Not really the same though. An NHL team has four lines of three frontliners, plus three lines of two defensivemen, plus a goalie. (that's 19 right there) then there's a few bench players as well.

Plus smaller revenues...

[venitian navigator]

The old cba needs, obviously, some adjustments...but imho the way the owners are going is not the right one.
I don't like the hard cap...I think you have to give the chances to any team to improve, if they want and can, and that's possible only with the exceptions.
The soft cap is the only way.

That said, I Think the players goal must be to give money to the higher possible number of players but at the some time esteblish some economic differences between "good" and "not so good" players that's acceptable also for the owners.

One thing to do, imho, is to determine a maximum salary (ex. 15.000.000) you can not going over : then, if a player is really a phenomenon, he can make more money in other ways (sponsor contracts).

But the main point is that, like some others said, the owners are co-responsable for the situations for letting the market going too much "up" for mediocre players who have been evidently overpaid...but you can't blame the player's agents too much...for doing what they're payed for from their clients.

I think Stern has made the only possible moves, considering he's paid by the owners...but it's time for the owners too to face reality : they are the ones that makes the market, not the players.
And that's, simply, 'cause they are the ones that have the money.

The ridicule thing is that, given the fact that some rule need to be re-made, Stern gave the owners the only real weapon to "govern" the market : the lux tax rule.
That's, imho, the only way : to increase it to a higher level, that's really descouraging teams from spending more just 'cause, doing so, they're gonna re-inforce the finances of other teams. In all these years, the worst move the owners made is the "Finley rule" : I say no.
Owners have to recognize and pay if they make mistakes, not be absolved from themselves.

I say more : put the fine for exceeding the lux tax to three to five dollars for dollar.

Then not only just the "richest" teams will be able to overspend, but the weaker teams will be able to really became richer by the years and avoid financial instability.

[Muser]

If there is a lockout, will there be a 2012 draft?

[LnGrrrR]

Plus smaller revenues...

Yeah, but you're talking about a team of 25 players as opposed to a team of 15. (Not saying the NBA salary cap shouldn't be larger, but having to fund 10 extra people is a chunk of change.)

[SpursIndonesia]

Yeah, i'd rather see a harsher luxury tax ratio, a hard cap on max player salary (percentage of the salary cap), and MLE money not available each year (interchanging with LLE would be nice).

Basically, the damage was done by the owners themselves, they outbid one another to oblivion.

[ambchang]

So with a $45M cap, and a 15 man roster, it projects to an average of $3M per player.

If they go a 12-man roster, it projects to $3.75M per player.

However, a team's starter earns way more than $3-$4M a season, a normal winning team usually has:

a player earning $12M+, a 2nd star earning $10M+, and a 3rd player earning $8M+, this alone goes around $30, leaving $15M for the remaining 9 to 12 players, with each earning a little over $1M.

In other words, only rich teams that could afford luxury tax can be competitive from now on. The other alternative is to get fantastic players on the rookie scale like the Bulls are currently doing, but this only means a team could keep the core and supporting players together for about 3 years. Not entirely sure if this actually benefits the league.

[Kyle Orton]

You stupid fuck, there is no luxury tax with a hard salary cap.

[Leetonidas]

It amazes me how these rich morons are complaining about revenue losses and player contracts when they are the idiots giving people like Joe Johnson a max contract while LeBron and Wade are making less. Any person who watches the NBA with a brain can tell you that players like Brendan Haywood, Hedo Turkoglu, Rashard Lewis, etc, should have NEVER been given those contracts. How can you even rationalize giving these mediocre players that much cash? Lewis boggles my fucking mind man, I don't understand how Ray Allen's subpar sidekick in Seattle gets paid more than anyone in the NBA for what he gives you. Same thing with Arenas. What kind of moron hands out a 100 million dollar contract, which generally should be reserved for the Kobes, KGs, Duncans, and Shaqs, to a chucking PG who was rehabbing from major knee surgery?

The owners are the morons. I guess they are trying to save themselves from their own stupidity.

[cheguevara]

:lol Fisher not retiring

:lol 30 mill for Kobe

:lol lakers

[romsho]

No mention of ticket prices, parking, concessions, etc with a similiar decrease. Of course the whole economic pie is fucked, but it starts with what the fans are paying. Wake me up when that becomes a part of the negotiation.

[silverblk mystix]

Blow it up.

Let the players start their own league...

[hater]

what the fuck is 'initial' proposal? waste of time. put in your final proposal and let them take it or leave it. lawyers trying to get paid in this shit..

[venitian navigator]

No one benefit from a lck out...and the owners have to face too the fact that ther's the risk of some judge who's gonna order them to stop it.
That said, the players can't go on pretending thet the actual cbe works...the rules bust be made in a way that helps the managements to both try to improve their team without putting them in a bankrupt situation.
Fisrt thing is understand that the "guaranteed" money exceeding a certain amount per year isn't fair for both owners and players...

[baseline bum]

No one benefit from a lck out...and the owners have to face too the fact that ther's the risk of some judge who's gonna order them to stop it.
That said, the players can't go on pretending thet the actual cbe works...the rules bust be made in a way that helps the managements to both try to improve their team without putting them in a bankrupt situation.
Fisrt thing is understand that the "guaranteed" money exceeding a certain amount per year isn't fair for both owners and players...

How is guaranteed money not fair? (and especially to the players?) What's the point of having a contract if the owner doesn't have to honor it? Why should contracts only go one way? What if the player blows up and has an amazing year while being on an undervalued 4 year deal? He can't just walk away from it and into free agency. But if the opposite happens the owner can just cut his losses and tell the player to piss off? That's garbage.

[cheguevara]

it's all the slave owners fault. They say run nigga run and show the money. They cut the paychecks and do the finances. Now they wanna replace the money bag with a banana tied to a stick. fuck them. they deserve what they gonna get which is no NBA for a while.

[Killakobe81]

I agree. I'm all for the players on this one. We have successful businessmen in all walks of life doing something they would never do ... overpay their workers, shut down operations by locking out their labor force no matter the losses. anti-trust exemptions,
they are the ones inflating their market I can understand controlling future costs but If im the players I aint giving shit back. A stiffer lux tax makes sense but if I was a spending club I would force and luxt tax dividends to be allocated to team improvements. No way should a scumbag slumlord owner like sterling get checks from owners that actual care about winning like Buss, cuban, Holt, Arison and whomever owns the Celts ...if they were forced to spend that money on either acquiringtalent or lowering ticket prices then Im all for it. I am NOT for an owner that makes money subsidizing folks that dont know how to run a business ...

[ChumpDumper]

I agree. I'm all for the players on this one. We have successful businessmen in all walks of life doing something they would never do ... overpay their workers, shut down operations by locking out their labor force no matter the losses. anti-trust exemptions,
they are the ones inflating their market I can understand controlling future costs but If im the players I aint giving shit back. A stiffer lux tax makes sense but if I was a spending club I would force and luxt tax dividends to be allocated to team improvements. No way should a scumbag slumlord owner like sterling get checks from owners that actual care about winning like Buss, cuban, Holt, Arison and whomever owns the Celts ...if they were forced to spend that money on either acquiringtalent or lowering ticket prices then Im all for it. I am NOT for an owner that makes money subsidizing folks that dont know how to run a business ...Sterling definitely knows how to run a business.

[baseline bum]

I doubt Sterling could do all that well if he wasn't in a market of 18 million people. Any idiot can make money in a huge market in the NBA; look at Dolan.

[Jace]

Contract a few teams, add roster spots and maybe increase payroll. Imagine breaking up teams like the Hornets and Timberwolves and dispersing them throughout the league. Would make the league more competitive, more uncertain, more enjoyable.

[jacobdrj]

In all sports, the rookie contracts should be fixed and should never count against the cap. Ever. Period.

[Brazil]

please do it ! 45 million, lakers are a dead franchise

[davethedope]

I say do it so scrubs and benchwarmers can't get rich riding pine.

[Killakobe81]

please do it ! 45 million, lakers are a dead franchise

short term, yes. But some of you are really dense. If every team had a hard cap and there was still FA then maybe you avoid the 2.5 superstar Heatles ...

BUT Dwight and stars of his ilk would have MORE incentive to choose NY, LA and Boston. If you are a megastar drafted by the bucks and you can not make anymore money by staying with the club that drafted you wouldnt the ancillary endorsement income, lifestyle and big city charms of the major markets become even MORE of a factor? Wouldnt every agent steer their clients to the cities where they can make the most money off the court?

Hard cap hurts the Lakers now ...but the Lakers would be able to pick their star after Kobe'c contract expires. 4 years may seem long ...but I have watched the Lakers for 30 ...I can wait. when Kobe's contract expires every FA that year or the next would be dying to play for the Lakers.

[ChumpDumper]

I doubt Sterling could do all that well if he wasn't in a market of 18 million people. Any idiot can make money in a huge market in the NBA; look at Dolan.Sterling definitely knows how to locate a business.

[Brazil]

short term, yes. But some of you are really dense. If every team had a hard cap and there was still FA then maybe you avoid the 2.5 superstar Heatles ...

BUT Dwight and stars of his ilk would have MORE incentive to choose NY, LA and Boston. If you are a megastar drafted by the bucks and you can not make anymore money by staying with the club that drafted you wouldnt the ancillary endorsement income, lifestyle and big city charms of the major markets become even MORE of a factor? Wouldnt every agent steer their clients to the cities where they can make the most money off the court?

Hard cap hurts the Lakers now ...but the Lakers would be able to pick their star after Kobe'c contract expires. 4 years may seem long ...but I have watched the Lakers for 30 ...I can wait. when Kobe's contract expires every FA that year or the next would be dying to play for the Lakers.

IMO franchise who are used to develop young players, draft wisely would have an advantage over a franchise who signs / trade big names over and over. but thats just an opinion

[Killakobe81]

dont disagree ...completely. Problem is, after the team develops that talent, will they stay? Many teams can draft talent and develop it ...holding on to it is MUCH harder ...ask toronto Denver and Cleveland about that ...

[Killakobe81]

IMO franchise who are used to develop young players, draft wisely would have an advantage over a franchise who signs / trade big names over and over. but thats just an opinion

sounds like spurs ...

4 rings vs. 16 and 17 rings says otherwise.
Lakers drafted Bynum, Fisher and made a draft day deal for Kobe. Celts drafted Bird rondo and Pierce but had to trade for Mchale and KG ...smart trades and srafting well are important but Lakers dont 3peat without signing shaq ...they dont repeat without signing artest and re-signing Lamar.

[lefty]

sounds like spurs ...

4 rings vs. 16 and 17 rings says otherwise.
Lakers drafted Bynum, Fisher and made a draft day deal for Kobe. Celts drafted Bird rondo and Pierce but had to trade for Mchale and KG ...smart trades and srafting well are important but Lakers dont 3peat without signing shaq ...they dont repeat without signing artest and re-signing Lamar.
True

[Brazil]

sounds like spurs ...

4 rings vs. 16 and 17 rings says otherwise.

I was saying that in the potential 45 million hard salary cap context. So no 4 rings vs. 16 and 17 rings doesn't say otherwise.

I do expect a team, with unlimited financial ressources, has more rings than a franchise with limited ones tbh. thats not a big surprise.


Lakers drafted Bynum, Fisher and made a draft day deal for Kobe. Celts drafted Bird rondo and Pierce but had to trade for Mchale and KG ...smart trades and srafting well are important but Lakers dont 3peat without signing shaq ...they dont repeat without signing artest and re-signing Lamar.

we agree and you can add they don't repeat without the possibility to pay more than 100 million in salary.