The Dallas Mavericks dared Lebron to beat them, and he wilted.

[Nick Manning]

Tied 100-100, you have Kidd on you isolated on the wing, and you face up and shoot? Kidd was on him down the stretch and LeBron didn't take advantage of it once. The Mavs were scared shitless of Wade and they doubled him hard, leaving Bron a favorable matchup and he shrunk AGAIN.

All his detractors were right, his lack of a post game is his downfall.

A choker and a cuck. Not a bad day's work for the Chosen One

[HarlemHeat37]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental + refs not giving calls..

He played fine in this game, he didn't take any bad shots, other than the jump shot over Kidd..the 3s he took were fine, he just missed them, he was making all these shots in the previous rounds, which is why I say it's mental..

[peskypesky]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental

this

[Budkin]

What do you mean? He had 2 points in the 4th.

[resistanze]

He plays worse the more shit you talk about him.

[TE]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental + refs not giving calls..

He played fine in this game, he didn't take any bad shots, other than the jump shot over Kidd..the 3s he took were fine, he just missed them, he was making all these shots in the previous rounds, which is why I say it's mental..

:cry

[Nick Manning]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental + refs not giving calls..

He played fine in this game, he didn't take any bad shots, other than the jump shot over Kidd..the 3s he took were fine, he just missed them, he was making all these shots in the previous rounds, which is why I say it's mental..

For the first 3 quarters, I thought he was brilliant...brilliant.

Down the stretch he needed to score and take advantage of Jason Kidd guarding him. He didn't. I'm not even lynching him for the wide open 3 he missed when it was 102-100 (although he had time to eat a snack before that shot). Not posting up Jason Kidd was mind-boggling

[HarlemHeat37]

For the first 3 quarters, I thought he was brilliant...brilliant.

Down the stretch he needed to score and take advantage of Jason Kidd guarding him. He didn't. I'm not even lynching him for the wide open 3 he missed when it was 102-100 (although he had time to eat a snack before that shot). Not posting up Jason Kidd was mind-boggling

Exactly, it's all mental..I'll be the first to admit that he choked, if he doesn't do anything in the 4th, in these next 2 games..if he doesn't, then he's content with the money and fame..

[Nick Manning]

He plays worse the more shit you talk about him.

:lol

[peskypesky]

He plays worse the more shit you talk about him.

:lmao

[mariners]

He just hates the pressure, honestly going to the Heat is probably the dumbest decision he made in his life now that he has talent around him and no excuses

[cobbler]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental + refs not giving calls..

He played fine in this game, he didn't take any bad shots, other than the jump shot over Kidd..the 3s he took were fine, he just missed them, he was making all these shots in the previous rounds, which is why I say it's mental..

It can't be physical for gods sake! He should dominate any player one on one. Jason Kidd? Are you kidding me? Of course it's mental. LBJ is a choke. He defers when the lights get bright. Heck, Chalmers had a more go for it attitude tonight. So mental it is and as the OP said... he wilted because of it.

Whining about the refs is and always will be a bithch move. It fits though. :toast

[Killakobe81]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental + refs not giving calls..

He played fine in this game, he didn't take any bad shots, other than the jump shot over Kidd..the 3s he took were fine, he just missed them, he was making all these shots in the previous rounds, which is why I say it's mental..


post game fine? bullshit. but he played well for 3.5 quarters ...

[Nick Manning]

Exactly, it's all mental..I'll be the first to admit that he choked, if he doesn't do anything in the 4th, in these next 2 games..if he doesn't, then he's content with the money and fame..

He slayed his Boston demons and was Capt. Clutch against Chicago. Tonight he was dissecting the dallas defense and took over in the 3rd quarter when his team needed him. What magically changes when it's the 4th?

I agree, some of it is mental, but wtf? Seriously, the man cannot be this mentally weak. 11 4th quarter points in 5 games.

[Ace]

LeBron choked, can't defend that. Hopefully two days of rest helps Wade...

[DMX7]

He plays worse the more shit you talk about him.

I was thinking the exact same thing. Jason Terry says LeBron can't defend him in a 7 game series, then Stevenson says LeBron "checked out" of game 4, now they'll probably say something along the lines of LeBron was "Lil Bow wow'ed" in his butt at the hotel.

[LnGrrrR]

Honestly, I hate seeing Lebron take 3's. I know I criticized him for it in the Boston thread, and then he made 2 daggers to send us home, but with his atheleticism he should be driving, only taking a 3 when there's no other option, maybe 2 to 3 tries from downtown a game at most.

[jeebus]

LeBron is still taking mental notes of the people calling him out...

[Amaso]

Honestly, I hate seeing Lebron take 3's. I know I criticized him for it in the Boston thread, and then he made 2 daggers to send us home, but with his atheleticism he should be driving, only taking a 3 when there's no other option, maybe 2 to 3 tries from downtown a game at most.

It's unrealistic to ask a guy who has the ball as much as he does to drive to the basket every single time he wants to score, defenses adjust and refs don't give you the call unless you are 2006 Wade. The problem is his entire offensive game is jacking up 3s or driving. He doesn't have anything midrange that he can rely on to get a good quality shot at any time.

[resistanze]

Sometimes I think he doesn't have a real jumpshot. Like he's just a freak that's able to fling to ball at the net like I do at when playing carnival basketball. Sometimes it's on, sometimes and off. I wouldn't rely on his shooting to win me a championship.

[frodo]

rashard lewis cuckolded this bitchass ###### which might explain all this. bron be really good in game one imo, hitting half-court 3 twice, and he played like shit the next 3 games for some odd reason. he seems to have recovered from it tonight, managed a triple double but still lost

[HarlemHeat37]

Lebron's mid-range jump shot has been very good, all year..did any of you people watch basketball, before this series?:lol..he dominated Chicago and Boston with a variety of offensive attacks..he's struggling with everything right now, it's 95% mental, he didn't lose his talents after game 1..


In 2007, he was at 36 percent from 10 to 15 feet, and 34 percent from 16 to 23 feet. This season, he posted career-bests of 44.7 percent and 45 percent, respectively.

[Nathan89]

Exactly, it's all mental..I'll be the first to admit that he choked, if he doesn't do anything in the 4th, in these next 2 games..if he doesn't, then he's content with the money and fame..

Lebron is definitely not content with money and fame. The perception of Lebron by other is probably one of the major mental struggles he has. If he was content with fame he wouldn't care what others thought.

[Ace]

LeBron will be fine, as I said before the season Wade will have to lead the way. After the Heat win it this year, next year, LeBron will be fine...

[Killakobe81]

Lebron's mid-range jump shot has been very good, all year..did any of you people watch basketball, before this series?:lol..he dominated Chicago and Boston with a variety of offensive attacks..he's struggling with everything right now, it's 95% mental, he didn't lose his talents after game 1..

mid-range different than an effective back to the basket low post game ...

[picc84]

Jon Barry is damn near jacking off right now.

[frodo]

Lebron's mid-range jump shot has been very good, all year..did any of you people watch basketball, before this series?:lol..he dominated Chicago and Boston with a variety of offensive attacks..he's struggling with everything right now, it's 95% mental, he didn't lose his talents after game 1..

if all these struggles he be suffering are mental, hes a choker

[ogait]

mid-range different than an effective back to the basket low post game ...

Contrary to what many say Lebron can be effective posting up, but normally that comes when matched up against much smaller defenders. He still lacks the foot work or the variety of moves to be considered a good post player.
He's more like Joe Johnson who has a very big weight and height advantage against most of his defenders and therefore can be an efficient post player.
Compared to what it could be, I would say Lebron post game is certainly not anywhere near the potential his physical abilities could allow.

[hitmanyr2k]

The Dallas Mavericks are disrespecting Lebron putting Jason Kidd on him at times in this series and I can't believe he can't take advantage of the matchup.

I've been saying the last 2 years there's no reason for a player of that size with that kind of athleticism and speed not to have a high/low post game. When those driving lanes are cut off and your shot isn't falling it's just another weapon to go to in your arsenal. It's rare that something bad comes out of a good post game. It's a high percentage shot. It's a matchup nightmare when you have a smaller player guarding you. It forces the defense to react and double which opens up passing lanes for cutters and shooters. Anything is better than sitting on the perimeter looking like an idiot with a midget guarding you. And you don't bail him out shooting a jumper like Lebron did tonight. I got flashbacks of T-Mac in Game 7 against the Jazz when they put Derek Fisher on him in ISOs and he clanked jumpers instead of PUNISHING THAT MIDGET!!

The same can be said for Kevin Durant. He has all the length in the world and a great shooting touch. He could kill with even an average post game. Who's going to block a jumphook from him with those long arms? Instead he's either getting denied the ball on the perimeter by good defenders, shooting 30 foot shots at the end of games or forced to watch Westbrook take over down the stretch. It's just retarded. He and Lebron need to wise the fuck up and seriously develop their games. There's no good fuckin reason Lebron doesn't have at least average foot work or some basic up and under moves in his 8th season.

[badfish22]

he dominated Chicago and Boston with a variety of offensive attacks..he's struggling with everything right now,

Thats because of Mr. Marion

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Lebron has had no post game in this series. He backs down someone smaller for a few seconds looking awkwardly and then passes out. Dallas has dared him to dominate them in the post and he hasn't because he doesn't have a post game.e

[DirkDoesWork]

In this series? LeBron has NEVER had a post game.

[TDMVPDPOY]

the heat need him to score then facilitate stat padding his assist column

[SenorSpur]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental + refs not giving calls..

He played fine in this game, he didn't take any bad shots, other than the jump shot over Kidd..the 3s he took were fine, he just missed them, he was making all these shots in the previous rounds, which is why I say it's mental..

LeBron's post game IS NOT fine because he doesn't have one.

Aside from that, his troubles are inside his head. He's never had to work through adversity before at a competitive level. He doesn't know how to develop his game, how to think the game - and ultimately how the win the game, at the highest level.

Until he humbles himself, allows himself to be coached up, and seriously spends time developing his all-around game, he'll continue being a choker.

[ElNono]

He's gonna have a one on one special with Jim Gray before game 6... He'll tell the kids why he struggles in the 4th (:cry) and then he'll be fine. I expect much better from him with home cooking... More worried about Wade and his injury, tbh

[Killakobe81]

The Dallas Mavericks are disrespecting Lebron putting Jason Kidd on him at times in this series and I can't believe he can't take advantage of the matchup.

I've been saying the last 2 years there's no reason for a player of that size with that kind of athleticism and speed not to have a high/low post game. When those driving lanes are cut off and your shot isn't falling it's just another weapon to go to in your arsenal. It's rare that something bad comes out of a good post game. It's a high percentage shot. It's a matchup nightmare when you have a smaller player guarding you. It forces the defense to react and double which opens up passing lanes for cutters and shooters. Anything is better than sitting on the perimeter looking like an idiot with a midget guarding you. And you don't bail him out shooting a jumper like Lebron did tonight. I got flashbacks of T-Mac in Game 7 against the Jazz when they put Derek Fisher on him in ISOs and he clanked jumpers instead of PUNISHING THAT MIDGET!!

The same can be said for Kevin Durant. He has all the length in the world and a great shooting touch. He could kill with even an average post game. Who's going to block a jumphook from him with those long arms? Instead he's either getting denied the ball on the perimeter by good defenders, shooting 30 foot shots at the end of games or forced to watch Westbrook take over down the stretch. It's just retarded. He and Lebron need to wise the fuck up and seriously develop their games. There's no good fuckin reason Lebron doesn't have at least average foot work or some basic up and under moves in his 8th season.

great post. I guess when i think of a "post game" ... being able to be effective only when you have a MUCH smaller defender, does not come to mind. Great low-post players are able to use their body positioning, foot-work and patience to score, even when guarded by players their own height and even taller. We all know Lebron has the size, athletic abilty and is such a great passer that if he develops a true post game, he would be even more dangerous.

But because the Lebronimati and the Hollinger and Henry Abbott stat lovers (and even more importantly Lebron himself) feel he is good enough as is, why should he change his game? Because PER and win shares says he is one of the best regular season and playoff performers of all-time, that is good enough ...right?
That is the same bullshit people use to defend shaq. Sure they are great dominant players, but they could/shoulda been even better ... Mj better ...but they settle for just being great.

Like i said he will win titles, but I will be very disappointed if he never threatens MJ As GOAT. he has gifts even Mj never had ...but his lack of a mental game, footwork and fundamentals will not let him realize his full potential ...even though he is better passer and defender than MJ. Oh, well ...

[crc21209]

The Dallas Mavericks are disrespecting Lebron putting Jason Kidd on him at times in this series and I can't believe he can't take advantage of the matchup.

I've been saying the last 2 years there's no reason for a player of that size with that kind of athleticism and speed not to have a high/low post game. When those driving lanes are cut off and your shot isn't falling it's just another weapon to go to in your arsenal. It's rare that something bad comes out of a good post game. It's a high percentage shot. It's a matchup nightmare when you have a smaller player guarding you. It forces the defense to react and double which opens up passing lanes for cutters and shooters. Anything is better than sitting on the perimeter looking like an idiot with a midget guarding you. And you don't bail him out shooting a jumper like Lebron did tonight. I got flashbacks of T-Mac in Game 7 against the Jazz when they put Derek Fisher on him in ISOs and he clanked jumpers instead of PUNISHING THAT MIDGET!!

The same can be said for Kevin Durant. He has all the length in the world and a great shooting touch. He could kill with even an average post game. Who's going to block a jumphook from him with those long arms? Instead he's either getting denied the ball on the perimeter by good defenders, shooting 30 foot shots at the end of games or forced to watch Westbrook take over down the stretch. It's just retarded. He and Lebron need to wise the fuck up and seriously develop their games. There's no good fuckin reason Lebron doesn't have at least average foot work or some basic up and under moves in his 8th season.

I especially agree with you that the Mavs are disrespecting the Heat and LeBron by putting Kidd on him. Hell, I think Wade should feel disrespected when they put Kidd on him too. Although Wade has actually taken it at him instead of clanging jumpers like LeBron....

[Pelicans78]

great post. I guess when i think of a "post game" ... being able to be effective only when you have a MUCH smaller defender, does not come to mind. Great low-post players are able to use their body positioning, foot-work and patience to score, even when guarded by players their own height and even taller. We all know Lebron has the size, athletic abilty and is such a great passer that if he develops a true post game, he would be even more dangerous.

But because the Lebronimati and the Holliner and Henry Abbott stat lovers (and even more importantly Lebron himself) feel he is good enough as is, why should he change his game? Because PER and win shares says he is one of the best regular season performers, that is good enough ...right? That is the same bullshit people use to defend shaq. Sure they are great dominat players but they could/shoulda been even better Mj better ...but they settle.

Like i said he will win titles, but I will be very disappointed if he never threatens MJ As GOAT. he has gifts even Mj never had ...but his lack of a mental game, footwork and fundamentals will not let him realize his full potential ...even though he is better passer and defender than MJ. Oh, well ...

He'll never approach GOAT status. Doesn't work hard enough on his game. He will probably end up similar to Shaq and Wilt. Dominant physical specimens with a couple of rings. No way he will be GOAT. He's been in the league for 8 years and still has a long way to go to polish his skills despite what Booker T says.

[LkrFan]

The Dallas Mavericks are disrespecting Lebron putting Jason Kidd on him at times in this series and I can't believe he can't take advantage of the matchup.

I've been saying the last 2 years there's no reason for a player of that size with that kind of athleticism and speed not to have a high/low post game. When those driving lanes are cut off and your shot isn't falling it's just another weapon to go to in your arsenal. It's rare that something bad comes out of a good post game. It's a high percentage shot. It's a matchup nightmare when you have a smaller player guarding you. It forces the defense to react and double which opens up passing lanes for cutters and shooters. Anything is better than sitting on the perimeter looking like an idiot with a midget guarding you. And you don't bail him out shooting a jumper like Lebron did tonight. I got flashbacks of T-Mac in Game 7 against the Jazz when they put Derek Fisher on him in ISOs and he clanked jumpers instead of PUNISHING THAT MIDGET!!

The same can be said for Kevin Durant. He has all the length in the world and a great shooting touch. He could kill with even an average post game. Who's going to block a jumphook from him with those long arms? Instead he's either getting denied the ball on the perimeter by good defenders, shooting 30 foot shots at the end of games or forced to watch Westbrook take over down the stretch. It's just retarded. He and Lebron need to wise the fuck up and seriously develop their games. There's no good fuckin reason Lebron doesn't have at least average foot work or some basic up and under moves in his 8th season.

Great post hitman. I've been saying it for a while now: LBJ has not progressed in 8 years. It's funny how Dallas is frustrating him with their zone and giving him different looks. If he had a post game he could stop living and dying on the perimeter. He should be able to take anyone on the block and punish. Anyone. But he doesn't because he can't.

I know you are no Kobe fan, but Kobe has a complete repertoire of moves that he can go to be it on the perimeter or in the post. His footwork is sick and one reason why he can still be effective despite losing a step and a lot of his hops. LBJ better develop an array of moves and counter moves because after his athleticism is gone so will his eliteness as a player.

[joshdaboss]

You guys do realize he's getting double teamed on every pick and roll right?

When he posts or isolates, it's either a hard double or there's a man right there zoning him up.

[joshdaboss]

Thats because of Mr. Marion

ROFL @ Marion being a better defender than Deng.

[LkrFan]

You guys do realize he's getting double teamed on every pick and roll right?

When he posts or isolates, it's either a hard double or there's a man right there zoning him up.

Every superstar gets that kind of treatment. No excuses.

[joshdaboss]

Every superstar gets that kind of treatment. No excuses.

Really? I could have sworn I've been seeing Nowitzki guarded 1 on 1 on almost every play. The same for Wade.

[Jace]

Lebron's post game has been fine, his struggles are all mental + refs not giving calls..

He played fine in this game, he didn't take any bad shots, other than the jump shot over Kidd..the 3s he took were fine, he just missed them, he was making all these shots in the previous rounds, which is why I say it's mental..

Nothing you said is right, his post game is awful, had it 8 times and got one 18 foot jumpshot. If you are that massive and that athletic, you need a better a postgame. As to the threes, Lebron jacked up a couple of them with very little time off of the shot clock and of course missed. The pressure ruins his skills and destroys his ability to make good decisions

[LnGrrrR]

It's unrealistic to ask a guy who has the ball as much as he does to drive to the basket every single time he wants to score, defenses adjust and refs don't give you the call unless you are 2006 Wade. The problem is his entire offensive game is jacking up 3s or driving. He doesn't have anything midrange that he can rely on to get a good quality shot at any time.

I probably wouldn't mind as much if he had some good footwork, and didn't just rely on barrelling through people.

[Venti Quattro]

Champ or not, LeBron has to watch a shitload of game tape of Jordan and Kobe in the post, take mental notes and practice it till he pukes.

Oh wait, how many years have experts said that?

[Ice009]

He'll never approach GOAT status. Doesn't work hard enough on his game. He will probably end up similar to Shaq and Wilt. Dominant physical specimens with a couple of rings. No way he will be GOAT. He's been in the league for 8 years and still has a long way to go to polish his skills despite what Booker T says.

What are you talking about? Shaq has 4 rings. That number is a lot closer to Jordan than a player with a couple of rings.

[Axe Murderer]

http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_llu79iQuYa1qerjlgo1_400.gif

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Champ or not, LeBron has to watch a shitload of game tape of Jordan and Kobe in the post, take mental notes and practice it till he pukes.

Oh wait, how many years have experts said that?
His face up game is also overrated. He's a good but no great ball handler, and he has no real moves to get his defender off balance. It's simply using his size and athleticism to beat his defender to the spot and then drive or pull up.

[Ice009]

His face up game is also overrated. He's a good but no great ball handler, and he has no real moves to get his defender off balance. It's simply using his size and athleticism to beat his defender to the spot and then drive or pull up.

Watching Lebron in crunch time makes me really see How good Tim, Kobe and Manu were. I'm used to seeing those guys close out games so I'm not used to seeing this kind of horrid play in crunch time. You are definitely right about Lebron's ball handling, that is definitely something I've noticed watching these games that he doesn't seem to be a great ball handler, and that's affecting what he can do at the end of games.

[Killakobe81]

Really? I could have sworn I've been seeing Nowitzki guarded 1 on 1 on almost every play. The same for Wade.

not true Dirk has had defenders double in every game ...not every play but multiple times each game ...not sure what game YOU are watching. the #1 player on every team faces double teams, I agree no excuses.

[stretch]

Really? I could have sworn I've been seeing Nowitzki guarded 1 on 1 on almost every play. The same for Wade.

you are a fucking idiot

they run a double at dirks weak side every time he puts the ball on the floor

wade gets his double right when he starts his drive, to keep him from getting full momentum and out of his comfort, but sometimes hes just too damn quick to be affected by it. I swear I have never seen a SG with as quick of a first step as D-Wade. I think a good argument can be made that he could be the best one-on-one perimeter player in NBA history, heavily because of his first step being sooooo quick.

[Findog]

http://img.ly/system/uploads/001/169/705/large_image.jpg?1307706098

[Nick Manning]

http://img.ly/system/uploads/001/169/705/large_image.jpg?1307706098

:lmao

[badfish22]

ROFL @ Marion being a better defender than Deng.

He isPERIOD

[Nick Manning]

If LeBron goes for 50 on Sunday and the Heat lose, does he salvage his reputation?

[Nick Manning]

Nope..his reputation will be fine if the Heat win the title, it doesn't matter how..

Could not disagree more. If the Heat win but he has two more non-existent 4th quarters, the media will lynch him and exalt Wade (rightfully so).

He's already option #3 in the Finals, and even that's looking shaky with the way Chalmers is playing :lol

[pass1st]

If LeBron goes for 50 on Sunday and the Heat lose, does he salvage his reputation?

People will just call him a ball hog if the Heat lose and say he should have just let Wade take over.

[Nick Manning]

Lebron has the ball in his hands more than any other player on the Heat, he's option #1..there's a difference between "option" and the way a player is playing..Wade has obviously been the best player on the team during the Finals, by far..

He'll have to step up in the 4th, but if he plays the same way as game 5, they'll be fine, if he makes he shots..he made good decisions..

When you have Jason Kidd guarding you one-on-one for the majority of the 4th quarter and you don't post him up or take him to the hole--you made poor decisions. The Heat needed him to be a facilitator the first 3 quarters. In the 4th they needed him to be a dominator, and he pussed out.

Jason Kidd has been torched this series when he's guarded Wade, what's LeBron's excuse? LeBron's not getting doubled (especially in the 4th, watch the game again). There's a difference between making good decisions and being too chickenshit to take over.

[Ace]

I think his legacy will be fine, winning changes everything. Of course that means he needs to be in Wade's current role going forth. I said before the season Wade had to lead the way this year and many laughed at me for saying its Wade's team. Talent wise LeBron is better than Wade but Wade has the been there, done that swag.

[Nick Manning]

I said as much as well, Ace. Wade knows what it takes.

LeBron is 26, has experience, and all the tools needed to be a closer. He's just mentally weak.

Kobe was closing Finals games when he was 21-22 y/o, what's Bron-Bron's excuse?

C7Lp5aQq4zI

[Ace]

I said as much as well, Ace. Wade knows what it takes.

LeBron is 26, has experience, and all the tools needed to be a closer. He's just mentally weak.

Kobe was closing Finals games when he was 21-22 y/o, what's Bron-Bron's excuse?

C7Lp5aQq4zI

This could be it, we will find out soon enough...

[LkrFan]

http://img.ly/system/uploads/001/169/705/large_image.jpg?1307706098

:lmao

[LkrFan]

Lebron has the ball in his hands more than any other player on the Heat, he's option #1..there's a difference between "option" and the way a player is playing..Wade has obviously been the best player on the team during the Finals, by far..

He'll have to step up in the 4th, but if he plays the same way as game 5, they'll be fine, if he makes he shots..he made good decisions..

Serious question HH:

Who is the best player on the Heat - Wade or LeBron? Your answer will determine how I judge you as a poster from now on.

I'm going on record to say that Wade is better. LBJ has some serious holes in his game if he wants to be considered better IMO.

[LkrFan]

This could be it, we will find out soon enough...

Damn Ace, that was an honest post from you for once. Maybe you are not a little fag after all? :toast

[JoeTait75]

Nope..his reputation will be fine if the Heat win the title, it doesn't matter how..

His reputation is shot regardless of what happens these last two games. Haven't you noticed the feeding frenzy of ridicule after Games 3-5? People despise him.

[DMC]

Could not disagree more. If the Heat win but he has two more non-existent 4th quarters, the media will lynch him and exalt Wade (rightfully so).

He's already option #3 in the Finals, and even that's looking shaky with the way Chalmers is playing :lol
You're wrong. History remembers champions very favorably. It's the losers that can do no right. They will say that, with a brand new squad, Lebron was able to lift the Heat to a come from behind victory in the Finals against a team that swept the defending champs, even if James only scores 20 points or so and does diddly in the 4th.

[TE]

http://img.ly/system/uploads/001/169/705/large_image.jpg?1307706098

Oh shit! :lmao

[TE]

I said as much as well, Ace. Wade knows what it takes.

LeBron is 26, has experience, and all the tools needed to be a closer. He's just mentally weak.

Kobe was closing Finals games when he was 21-22 y/o, what's Bron-Bron's excuse?

C7Lp5aQq4zI

Solid post.

[BobKnight]

The Mr.Bean game against the Indiana Pacers was an exception rather than the norm. Being on a damn good laker team his first four years in the league and not being able to do shit with it. Shooting air balls and getting swept. He came into the league all buck wild and shit with no self control. Didn't display any maturity until later...much later.

When Shaq left, he couldn't even lead the lakers to the playoffs. He proved his bitchassness was surpassed by none with his trade me stunt. Crying about his team is the ultimate in mental weakness. Bean isn't exactly a Finals performer so the decision to use him as reference boggles the mind. He never led a team to the Finals without some talented big to back up his poor performance. Pathetic and overrated if you asked me.

[joshdaboss]

Serious question HH:

Who is the best player on the Heat - Wade or LeBron? Your answer will determine how I judge you as a poster from now on.

I'm going on record to say that Wade is better. LBJ has some serious holes in his game if he wants to be considered better IMO.

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao @ Wade

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao

LeBron does everything that Wade can do, except he does it better. I lold @ Wade having no holes in his game. Hard. What is he? A 29% shooter from the 3? Please, dude, act like you know.

[mariners]

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao @ Wade

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao

LeBron does everything that Wade can do, except he does it better. I lold @ Wade having no holes in his game. Hard. What is he? A 29% shooter from the 3? Please, dude, act like you know.
wade has actually shown up in the 4rth lebron is a no show :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

[LkrFan]

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao @ Wade

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao

LeBron does everything that Wade can do, except he does it better. I lold @ Wade having no holes in his game. Hard. What is he? A 29% shooter from the 3? Please, dude, act like you know.

I didn't say Wade has no holes in his game but his game is more polished than LBJ's (for the record, Kobe is the most complete player in the game). Wade does have holes in his game. Your post tells part of them, but he is still better than LBJ. LBJ is being exposed (again) on the biggest stage. He's 0-4 w/o Wade and 2-3 with him. He's "awesome" if you ask me. :downspin:

[LkrFan]

wade has actually shown up in the 4rth lebron is a no show :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

In five 2011 Finals games (not 1, not 2, not 3, not 4), he scored 11 points more than I did. :lol

[BobKnight]

(for the record, Kobe is the most complete player in the game).

I disagree. What good is his physical skills when his mental skills negate it. He may have a lot of knowledge of the game off the court, but on the court, he's extremely low IQ'd. He doesn't know how to utilize the strengths of his team and use it for his advantage. He constantly suffers from the hero complex. A complete play would be Jordan. A player who encompasses both physical and mental skills.

[LkrFan]

I disagree. What good is his physical skills when his mental skills negate it. He may have a lot of knowledge of the game off the court, but on the court, he's extremely low IQ'd. He doesn't know how to utilize the strengths of his team and use it for his advantage. He constantly suffers from the hero complex. A complete play would be Jordan. A player who encompasses both physical and mental skills.

Jordan's legend grows every day. Every single damn day. :wakeup

[Giuseppe]

A complete play would be Jordan. A player who encompasses both physical and mental skills.

He kept fucking around with the gambling until a couple crackers murdered his father & Stern suspended his ass.

MJ, he was a real piece of work.

[LkrFan]

He kept fucking around with the gambling until a couple crackers murdered his father & Stern suspended his ass.

MJ, he was a real piece of work.

:lmao

[BobKnight]

He kept fucking around with the gambling until a couple crackers murdered his father & Stern suspended his ass.

MJ, he was a real piece of work.

I was talking about MJ as a player. His off court lifestyle ? I could care less.:lol

But if you want to talk about off the court ? Kobe takes the bill for bitchassness. Socially awkward, recluse, superstar who can't get pussy, buys his love, hides his insecurity with his hero complex, snitches, shit, I could go on and on.

[Giuseppe]

I was talking about MJ as a player. His off court lifestyle ? I could care less.:lol

But if you want to talk about off the court ? Kobe takes the bill for bitchassness. Socially awkward, recluse, superstar who can't get pussy, buys his love, hides his insecurity with his hero complex, snitches, shit, I could go on and on.

If off court lifestyle affects on court result then that is part & parcel. In MJ's case that is clear & convincing.

& I neither deny nor ameliorate Bryant's deeds. I bear his/my crosses in public. My only condition? I insist that everybody else follow suit.

[BobKnight]

If off court lifestyle affects on court result then that is part & parcel. In MJ's case that is clear & convincing.

Regardless, I stand by what I've originally stated.
Kobe is not the mental wizard people are making him out to be.

[Giuseppe]

Regardless, I stand by what I've originally stated.
Kobe is not the mental wizard people are making him out to be.

Agreed. Kobe is a sociopath. Functioning, yes, but, without conscious nonetheless.

But, MJ's actions prior to his one year suspension cost his father his life & the Bulls another shot at a Quad Peat. Then the shit tried to sneak back 15 games left in the season to steal a ring. Only Penny & Daddy were able to put the stopper in the bottle on that little charade.

MJ has no room.

[BobKnight]

Yes, MJ is quite the despicable character both on and off the court I agree. So much so, he came back and raped Big Daddy the following year and the rest of the nba the following 3 years.

I don't even like the guy but the man just hates losing more than anyone else.

[Giuseppe]

Yes, MJ is quite the despicable character both on and off the court I agree. So much so, he came back and raped Big Daddy the following year and the rest of the nba the following 3 years.

I don't even like the guy but the man just hates losing more than anyone else.

Then he turned into a bagman for Stern, went to D.C. & gave it away.

Just shows ta go ya.

[BobKnight]

I agree ?

But we're talking about Kobe here. :lol

[Giuseppe]

I agree ?

But we're talking about Kobe here. :lol

Uh, uh, none of that crapola.

Everybody is fair game.

[joshdaboss]

I didn't say Wade has no holes in his game but his game is more polished than LBJ's

No. It isn't. LeBron destroys him in every statistical category, including statistics pertaining to jump shooting.


(for the record, Kobe is the most complete player in the game)

Really? When LeBron can score better, pass better, shoot better and defend better? That's interesting. These aren't opinions, by the way, I'm going by statistics.


. Wade does have holes in his game. Your post tells part of them, but he is still better than LBJ.

So basically what you're saying, is despite every piece of hard evidence, Wade is still better. Reason being, he just is. LOL The same goes for Kobe, too!


LBJ is being exposed (again) on the biggest stage.

LeBron isn't playing up to his standard (his standard being far and away the best player in the league) for the series, I'll agree with that, but at the same time the referees are giving him no respect and sending a jump shooter to the line if anyone even dares to play defense on him.



He's 0-4 w/o Wade and 2-3 with him. He's "awesome" if you ask me.

This is obvious trolling, or you just don't know very much about the game. LeBron James taking a team of Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Drew Gooden, Sasha Pavlovic and Eric Snow to the finals is FAR more impressive than ANY championship Kobe Bryant has EVER won. That's painfully obvious.

I'll go a little bit deeper as well. Just curious, but what was Cleveland's record this season after he left the team? What was their record last year? You'll have to refresh my memory on that. :downspin::downspin::downspin:

[LkrFan]

No. It isn't. LeBron destroys him in every statistical category, including statistics pertaining to jump shooting.

LeBron check my stats James, bitch! That's all you got? How pathetic is he when the chips are down? Very pathetic.


Really? When LeBron can score better, pass better, shoot better and defend better? That's interesting. These aren't opinions, by the way, I'm going by statistics.

Bullshit. Kobe is the 2nd best scorer in NBA history behind Wilt (100 > 81 > 69 > whatever LBJ ever scored). Kobe doesn't have to score as much as he did when he had Kwame, Mihm, Smush, and Cook as teammates. He has help now. LBJ a better defender? How many All Defensive teams does Kobe have v. how many for LBJ? It's all subjective anyway.


So basically what you're saying, is despite every piece of hard evidence, Wade is still better. Reason being, he just is. LOL The same goes for Kobe, too!

Wade is outperforming LBJ. That's something people like you and HarlemHeat won't come to grips with. Kobe, even in his 15th year, is still the most complete basketball player on the planet. He's equal to or better than LBJ and Wade in the following categories:



Scoring
Rebounding
Better footwork
Better jumper
Better range on his jumper
Better low post game
Better leader

Again, Kobe can still give the Lakers 30/night but we don't need him to.


LeBron isn't playing up to his standard (his standard being far and away the best player in the league) for the series, I'll agree with that, but at the same time the referees are giving him no respect and sending a jump shooter to the line if anyone even dares to play defense on him.

Dallas figured his ass out. Rebound: to prevent him from turning into a an out of control locomotive destined for and-1s and FTAS. Form a wall behind his primary defender - the Matrix: just in case he gets by him and tries to get to the rim. Make him a jump shooter: his jumper is erratic and since he can't get a clean look like he's used to, he's building condominiums with his premium brickage. Zone his ass: because he has no midrange game. He hasn't progressed in 8 years and has no counter for what Dallas is doing to him. I've seen Kobe outscore Dallas by himself through 3 qtrs (62-61 (http://espn.go.com/nba/recap/_/id/251220013/dallas-mavericks-vs-la-lakers-lakers)), but they are locking LBJ down. Why? Because he has no counter moves when they take away what he wants to do. :lol


This is obvious trolling, or you just don't know very much about the game. LeBron James taking a team of Zydrunas Ilgauskas, Drew Gooden, Sasha Pavlovic and Eric Snow to the finals is FAR more impressive than ANY championship Kobe Bryant has EVER won. That's painfully obvious.
His supporting cast >> Kobe's. They went lottery year after year stockpiling lotto picks prior to tanking for the #1 pick (LBJ). The team was custom built for LBJ. Kobe? After the 2004 season, Malone, GP, Shaq, Fisher, Fox, and ever other decent veteran bolted leaving Kobe by his lonesome. Despite it all they were one rebound away from upsetting the heavily favored Suns that year. Maybe you are the one trolling.


I'll go a little bit deeper as well. Just curious, but what was Cleveland's record this season after he left the team? What was their record last year? You'll have to refresh my memory on that. :downspin::downspin::downspin:

Cleveland didn't just lose LBJ. They loss Varejo, Big Z, and suffered a ton of injuries to many of their key players. Not saying LBJ wasn't a big loss, but it wasn't the only one. Show me any team that loses as much players they have due to free agency, trades, or injury, and I'll guarantee you they will be a lottery team.

[BobKnight]

Bullshit. Kobe is the 2nd best scorer in NBA history behind Wilt (100 > 81 > 69 > whatever LBJ ever scored).One 81 point game in chucker mode against a shitty team doesn't make you the the 2nd best scorer in the NBA history. MJ>Bean and does so in the Finals as well.


Kobe, even in his 15th year, is still the most complete basketball player on the planet. He's equal to or better than LBJ and Wade in the following categories:


Scoring
Rebounding
Better footwork
Better jumper
Better range on his jumper
Better low post game
Better leader

Complete players wouldn't go out of the playoffs in bitchass fashion.
What happens when Mr.Bean's talented bigs plays well ? He rings.
What happens when Mr.Bean's talented bigs suck ? He gets swept.
Complete player ? I think not. He's too dependent on quality bigs. Plus he's too low IQ'd to be a complete player.

Kobe scored more than LB and Wade this year, but also took more shots.
LB's and Wade's scoring would go down this year due to both of them being teammates. LB/Wade both rebounded better than Kobe this year. Better footwork, jumper, and low post is just aspects of the game.
LB/Wade is superior in other areas (defense, athleticism, power, size, etc.).
Kobe is a wannabe leader. He's a loner and a recluse. Who the fuck would follow that ? Derek Fisher is the real leader on the team.


After the 2004 season, Malone, GP, Shaq, Fisher, Fox, and ever other decent veteran bolted leaving Kobe by his lonesome. Despite it all they were one rebound away from upsetting the heavily favored Suns that year. No, he quit on Game 7. He mentally waved the white flag.

[Giuseppe]

No, he quit on Game 7. He mentally waved the white flag.

Your James quit in last year's playoffs.

You've no room.

[BobKnight]

My Lebron ? Who says I'm a Lebron's fan. :lol

I don't even live in the States, just ask Kori to check my IP. I've no allegiance to any teams or players. If I had to pick one player, it's Wade.

[Giuseppe]

My Lebron ? Who says I'm a Lebron's fan. :lol

I don't even live in the States, just ask Kori to check my IP. I've no allegiance to any teams or players. If I had to pick one player, it's Wade.

That's your problem. You, you designated [Miami Heat] as your team.

And you're livin' with it. Good & bad.

Let us proceed...

[joshdaboss]

LeBron check my stats James, bitch! That's all you got? How pathetic is he when the chips are down? Very pathetic.


Triple doubles are pathetic. Just goes to show you his true greatness, when people are all over his ass after scoring triple doubles.


Bullshit. Kobe is the 2nd best scorer in NBA history behind Wilt (100 > 81 > 69 > whatever LBJ ever scored).

HAHAHAHAH. You can't Possibly believe that? He isn't even the best scorer of his generation. Shaq, Iverson and LeBron are all definitely better at scoring.


Kobe doesn't have to score as much as he did when he had Kwame, Mihm, Smush, and Cook as teammates. He has help now.

Yet, he still manages to shoot 20 times per game.


LBJ a better defender? How many All Defensive teams does Kobe have v. how many for LBJ? It's all subjective anyway.

You're completely correct here, the all-defensive teams are totally subjective, as evidenced by Kobe being on the first team. Tbh, when Kobe was selected all-defensive first team this year, I think everyone that knows anything bout basketball stopped lending any credence whatsoever to it.


Wade is outperforming LBJ. That's something people like you and HarlemHeat won't come to grips with.

Is he playing better in the finals? Yes, absolutely. But playing better for 5 games doesn't erase James playing 100x better than Wade the first 3 rounds.


Kobe, even in his 15th year, is still the most complete basketball player on the planet.

Based on what? Your opinion? rofl :lmao:lmao



He's equal to or better than LBJ and Wade in the following categories:



Scoring
Rebounding
Better footwork
Better jumper
Better range on his jumper
Better low post game
Better leader



Can you show me the numbers to prove any of this? In science, theories need to be proven before they're accepted. This will be the case here, as well. Unfortunately for you, you'd never be able to, considering everything you're spewing out is utter horse shit. lol


Again, Kobe can still give the Lakers 30/night but we don't need him to.

He can? Maybe he should have done that when he was in the process of getting swept by the Dallas Mavericks.




Dallas figured his ass out. Rebound: to prevent him from turning into a an out of control locomotive destined for and-1s and FTAS. Form a wall behind his primary defender - the Matrix: just in case he gets by him and tries to get to the rim.

Basically what you've just described is illegal defense, which the referees are not calling.


Make him a jump shooter: his jumper is erratic and since he can't get a clean look like he's used to, he's building condominiums with his premium brickage. Zone his ass: because he has no midrange game. He hasn't progressed in 8 years and has no counter for what Dallas is doing to him.

Really? I believe he was 3rd in the entire NBA in midrange jump shooting this season. lol Funny how actual statistics don't seem to line up with your misguided opinions.


I've seen Kobe outscore Dallas by himself through 3 qtrs (62-61 (http://espn.go.com/nba/recap/_/id/251220013/dallas-mavericks-vs-la-lakers-lakers)), but they are locking LBJ down.

When was that? 5 years ago in the regular season? :lmao



His supporting cast >> Kobe's.

Name a player on his NBA finals roster that is better than Lamar Odom.


Kobe? After the 2004 season, Malone, GP, Shaq, Fisher, Fox, and ever other decent veteran bolted leaving Kobe by his lonesome. Despite it all they were one rebound away from upsetting the heavily favored Suns that year. Maybe you are the one trolling.

LMAO @ comparing a first round exit to an NBA finals appearance. I refuse to believe you're an actual poster.


Cleveland didn't just lose LBJ. They loss Varejo, Big Z, and suffered a ton of injuries to many of their key players. Not saying LBJ wasn't a big loss, but it wasn't the only one. Show me any team that loses as much players they have due to free agency, trades, or injury, and I'll guarantee you they will be a lottery team.

Ok, in that case, just answer this question: do you think Kobe Bryant could have led the same Cavaliers to back-to-back best records in the NBA? (the question is actually rhetorical, don't bother answering it.)