Brian Cardinal >>> Bonner

[cheguevara]

true or false?

[lefty]

True


I've always LOLed at those who say that Cardinal = Mavs' Bonner

He is wayyyy tougher than Bonner and he can rebound

[cheguevara]

not only is Cardinal way, way tougher than Ginger, Cardinal actually sinks 3s in the playoffs.

my point is, Jim Carrey uses Cardinal when he is forced to due to injuries. Pop uses Bonner as first bigman off the bench.



:lol

[TJastal]

Cardinal has good mechanics as a shooter. No big surprise he's hitting em under pressure with guys running at him while Bonner and his right shoulder shot-puts end up being wild bricks that have no chance of going in when especially if there's anyone within 5 feet of him.

[TDMVPDPOY]

he came in and was the enforcer that force the heat players into fetus position and pushed back into their asses, dude came in with no tolerance bs handing out hard veteran fouls....

[Blake]

these threads are hilarious

[TJastal]

these threads are hilarious

Keep reading em, you might actually learn something someday.

[Blake]

Keep reading em, you might actually learn something someday.

I am learning that some Spur fans are even dumber than I might ever imagine. It's hilarious.

I will definitely keep reading. :tu

[Ginobilly]

Brian Cardinal reminds a shit load of Danny Ferry:lmao Those annoying bald white guys that get our nerves. Absolutely, he is way better. Higher Bball IQ and just plain tougher than Bonner.

I could see the Bonner and Pop love oozing out of Blake. It pains him to see Dallas scrubs being better under pressure than our ginger and fat boy Blair.

[Blake]

I could see the Bonner and Pop love oozing out of Blake. It pains him to see Dallas scrubs being better under pressure than our ginger and fat boy Blair.

:lmao

Me making fun of your pure Bonner/Pop hate does not mean I have pure Bonner/Pop love.

I do love your hate though. It's hilarious.

[Leetonidas]

Cardinal and Bonner are similar players to compare. Bonner will probably win you a lot more games in the regular season but Cardinal will do the things it takes to win the playoffs and he can actually hit shots. As someone mentioned, I think Bonner chokes so much because of his retarded form, it's not natural and when the defender is closing out on him and he has to shoot faster, his shitty form is fucking his shot up. He needs to work with England. Or spend some time with Neal.

[Ginobilly]

:lmao

Me making fun of your pure Bonner/Pop hate does not mean I have pure Bonner/Pop love.

I do love your hate though. It's hilarious.


I think every knowledgeable San Antonio Spurs fan hate POP and Bonner right now( I'll throw in Jefferson in there too). I used like POP before 2008. What happened to the defensive minded, tough/gritty Pop of 1999-2007??? If anybody seen our coach, please tell him Tim Duncan and the San Antonio Spurs are looking for him.

[Blake]

I think every knowledgeable San Antonio Spurs fan hate POP and Bonner right now

I think you aren't a knowledgeable Spurs fan

[Leetonidas]

I don't hate Pop or Bonner. I think Pop has been a fucking idiot for the last few years but honestly our team wasn't winning any recent titles with the cast we had. Playing Ian/Blair/Dice/whoever instead of Bonenr wasn't going to get us a title. I don't hate Bonner because he is what he is. It's not his fault he has t-rex arms and is slow and unathletic. He busts his ass out there, anyone can see that he tries, he's just not very good. And Pop is a dumbass for playing him so much. But he also coached this team to 4 titles and managed an excellent team defense for a decade so I can't hate the man.

R-Gay is another story though.

[ChumpDumper]

:lmao

Me making fun of your pure Bonner/Pop hate does not mean I have pure Bonner/Pop love.

I do love your hate though. It's hilarious.:lol

[cheguevara]

:lmao

some ppl still thinking Bonner is > Cardinal

[Blake]

:lmao

some ppl still thinking Bonner is > Cardinal

:lmao:lmao:lmao:

some ppl saying that Cardinal >>> Bonner when they themselves admit that Cardinal is a player that the coach was forced to play due to injuries.

just hilarious.

[cheguevara]

exactly. Jim Carrey would also not play Bonner in prime playoff minutes.

get it? in other words any decent NBA coach not named Pop would only insert Bonner if all the other backup bigs were immobilized due to injury.

[GSH]

Cardinal has good mechanics as a shooter. No big surprise he's hitting em under pressure with guys running at him while Bonner and his right shoulder shot-puts end up being wild bricks that have no chance of going in when especially if there's anyone within 5 feet of him.


As usual, you have to talk about shit you know nothing about. Hate Bonner all you want - everybody is entitled to an opinion. But his stroke is extremely good, and the rotation on the shots (especially those 3's) is incredible. Of all the things you could say about him, talking about his shooting mechanics and calling them "shot-puts" is probably the stupidest thing I could think of.

If you knew shit about the actual game, you might have noticed that late in the season he couldn't hit a 3 unless he was stepping into it. (And had one foot in front of the other.) If he was standing still and had both feet planted evenly, he couldn't knock one down to save his life. Guys develop quirks like that sometimes when they are trying to compensate from an injury. Gee... did Bonner have an injury that might make it necessary to step into long shots? Something like a knee, maybe? Ya think?

Bitch about him not stepping up in the playoffs. Bitch about him looking clumsy. Bitch about him not being able to defend Zach Randolph. But don't talk about fucking shooting mechanics if you don't know anything about shooting mechanics. And don't bother me with one of your three page, mind-numbing responses. You're just wrong about this one. Let it go.

[Blake]

exactly. Jim Carrey would also not play Bonner in prime playoff minutes.

get it? in other words any decent NBA coach not named Pop would only insert Bonner if all the other backup bigs were immobilized due to injury.

I get it perfectly.

You are now implying that Carlisle is a better coach than Pop.

crofl.

:lmao:lmao:lmao

[ohmwrecker]

Cardinal is a much better defender than Bonner and has a toughness that Bonner lacks. Bonner shoots threes . . . so, yeah . . . Cardinal > Bonner.

[cheguevara]

I get it perfectly.

You are now implying that Carlisle is a better coach than Pop.

crofl.

:lmao:lmao:lmao

this season of course he was. Carlisle was not only immensely better than Pop, he was the best in the league. Only a moron would disagree.

[Blake]

Carlisle was not only immensely better than Pop....

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

[yavozerb]

Honestly, I would not say one is better than the other..Bonner is much better all around on offense and Cardinal is much better on defense. However, Cardinal may get the nod with his janitor nickname though..

[cheguevara]

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

Pop's round 1 exit really showed Carlisle

:lmao

[Blake]

Pop's round 1 exit really showed Carlisle

:lmao

immensely!

:lmao:lmao

[GSH]

Cardinal is a much better defender than Bonner and has a toughness that Bonner lacks. Bonner shoots threes . . . so, yeah . . . Cardinal > Bonner.

Cardinal comes into games with the expectation that he is going to use up a lot of fouls. He gets paid to lay wood on opponents, and he's pretty good at it. He's no more or less athletic than Bonner.

Bonner used to come into games the same way. And he wasn't bashful about giving a hard foul, and he wasn't bad at it either. When he started getting longer minutes, he also had to start watching his fouls. It requires a totally different approach. If Cardinal had to do that, he would be in a world of hurt. It's a lot harder to keep guys from going around you when you can't just bang the hell out of them.

Put Cardinal in the same situation as Bonner, and he probably wouldn't be as good on defense. Definitely no better. Cardinal is a niche player - always has been. He wouldn't stand up to being a starter. Not now, not ever.

[cheguevara]

you are thinking way too much into this.

All that is requested from Bonner is go in there and play your ass off. Same thing from Cardinal. Cardinal obviously did. Bonner, not so much. Case closed.

[yavozerb]

you are thinking way too much into this.

All that is requested from Bonner is go in there and play your ass off. Same thing from Cardinal. Cardinal obviously did. Bonner, not so much. Case closed.

Am I missing something? Cardinal averaged 6 minutes per game,1ppg,0.2 rpg(yes, thats 0.2), and almost 2 fouls. Wow, I know you hate Bonner and all, but this is not the guy to prove your point with...

[Ginobilly]

Am I missing something? Cardinal averaged 6 minutes per game,1ppg,0.2 rpg(yes, thats 0.2), and almost 2 fouls. Wow, I know you hate Bonner and all, but this is not the guy to prove your point with...

That's how many minutes Bonner should be playing. Between 6 and 10 per game. Anything more than that only hurts your team in the long run.

[ohmwrecker]

Cardinal comes into games with the expectation that he is going to use up a lot of fouls. He gets paid to lay wood on opponents, and he's pretty good at it. He's no more or less athletic than Bonner.

Bonner used to come into games the same way. And he wasn't bashful about giving a hard foul, and he wasn't bad at it either. When he started getting longer minutes, he also had to start watching his fouls. It requires a totally different approach. If Cardinal had to do that, he would be in a world of hurt. It's a lot harder to keep guys from going around you when you can't just bang the hell out of them.

Put Cardinal in the same situation as Bonner, and he probably wouldn't be as good on defense. Definitely no better. Cardinal is a niche player - always has been. He wouldn't stand up to being a starter. Not now, not ever.

Well, the obvious counterpoint is that Bonner shouldn't be entrusted with those extra minutes if he can't put a complete two-way game together. It depends on what you want from a rotation big. Personally, I value a guy who isn't afraid to get dirty, knock a few guys down and play defense over a 6'10" jump shooter who has no post game.
My main point was that Cardinal has the qualities that I would like to see in Bonner. Remember, Cardinal can stand around and shoot 3s too, but he can also be a post presence and utility role player.

[yavozerb]

That's how many minutes Bonner should be playing. Between 6 and 10 per game. Anything more than that only hurts your team in the long run.

I dont disagree with you, but that not whats being discussed here...

[GSH]

Am I missing something? Cardinal averaged 6 minutes per game,1ppg,0.2 rpg(yes, thats 0.2), and almost 2 fouls. Wow, I know you hate Bonner and all, but this is not the guy to prove your point with...

Yep. The facts mean nothing. The guy averaged over 9 PF/36 minutes in the playoffs. That's a foul-out every 19 minutes. But somehow that doesn't matter.

This is nothing but another worn-out "Bonner Sucks" thread. The only reason Brian Cardinal got brought into it was to try and make it look like something different than the last 500 "Bonner sucks" threads. And maybe it would have worked with someone other than Brian Cardinal.

[ohmwrecker]

I think you throw stats out the window with an argument like this. What is happening here is that people see Cardinal contributing in a positive way to a championship team. He is doing what is required to help the team win. Playing sharp D, making good rotations, sacrificing his body, etc . . . Sure, Bonner may be the superior offensive player, but if you take away those 3 pointers (which is what happened in the playoffs) what are you left with? What good is the only advantage Bonner has if it's taken away?

[GSH]

Well, the obvious counterpoint is that Bonner shouldn't be entrusted with those extra minutes if he can't put a complete two-way game together. It depends on what you want from a rotation big. Personally, I value a guy who isn't afraid to get dirty, knock a few guys down and play defense over a 6'10" jump shooter who has no post game.
My main point was that Cardinal has the qualities that I would like to see in Bonner. Remember, Cardinal can stand around and shoot 3s too, but he can also be a post presence and utility role player.


Both of us trying to discuss basketball in the middle of just another troll-Matt-Bonner thread.

The only real difference between what you and I are saying is that I think Bonner isn't that much different from Cardinal, when he's playing short minutes off the bench. I've said for a long time that he isn't suited for long minutes OR for being a starter. Cardinal is more of a banger than a defender. Bonner can play that role fairly well when he doesn't have to pace himself. Cardinal really isn't a great defender, which is why he draws so many whistles.

Bonner isn't soft. He's just not athletic enough to defend first-string players without fouling. (Neither is Cardinal.) When he has to pace his fouls, he gets victimized. He could be worthwhile off the bench, just like Cardinal. I've always said Bonner wasn't suited for a starter role, but it's not his fault that he's starting. Just like it wasn't Cardinal's fault that he got handed that ridiculous big contract in Memphis. If Bonner was making half as much, and coming off the bench, he would be a great player to have. He would still be the same player, but he'd catch a lot less grief.


I think you throw stats out the window with an argument like this. What is happening here is that people see Cardinal contributing in a positive way to a championship team. He is doing what is required to help the team win. Playing sharp D, making good rotations, sacrificing his body, etc . . . Sure, Bonner may be the superior offensive player, but if you take away those 3 pointers (which is what happened in the playoffs) what are you left with? What good is the only advantage Bonner has if it's taken away?

I didn't see this while I was typing. The difference is, if you gave Cardinal the same minutes as Bonner is playing, he'd foul out of about half of his games. What good is the only advantage Cardinal has if he's fouling out of games, and keeping the other team in the penalty?

[Blake]

you are thinking way too much into this.

All that is requested from Bonner is go in there and play your ass off. Same thing from Cardinal. Cardinal obviously did. Bonner, not so much. Case closed.

nah, let's think even more about this and get right down to it.

If the Spurs and Mavs swapped Bonner for Ian and Cardinal, and Carlisle for Pop, do the Spurs win the title?

[yavozerb]

So you guys are comparing Bonner, who had to play against memphis and all the monsters they have at pf and center against cardinal who played against Haslem,anthony, and howard...seriously :lol

[Ginobilly]

nah, let's think even more about this and get right down to it.

If the Spurs and Mavs swapped Bonner for Ian and Cardinal, and Carlisle for Pop, do the Spurs win the title?

Is this with an injured or healthy Manu?

I don't know about winning the title, but I think they get past Memphis. Mavs wont win the title with Bonner and Pop running the show. Bonner and Dirk would of lost game 6! ( chandler would of been in foul trouble all game long) Haslem and Ostrich would of had a field day with Dirk and Bonner guarding the rim. Miami would of taken this in 7 imo:wakeup Probably Neither Team would of won the championship if they swapped. Swap Chandler for Dice and I think all of us would of woken up from a bad hangover from yesterdays championship.

[ohmwrecker]

I've been saying for a while now that Bonner needs a little more "banger" in his game. He is too comfortable behind the arc. That's where his game and his head is. It is hard for him to switch modes when his shots aren't falling. He doesn't contribute in other ways when the main part of his game fails him.
If the Spurs decide to keep Bonner (or are unable to move him) it would be a good idea to get Danny Ferry to mentor him and bring a little muscle to his game. I want to see Bonner box out with his body and deliver some hard fouls. Then if his shot isn't falling, he isn't completely worthless.

[Blake]

Mavs wont win the title with Bonner and Pop running the show. Bonner and Dirk would of lost game 6! ( chandler would of been in foul trouble all game long)

What exactly would Bonner do as a Mav to lose game 6?


Haslem and Ostrich would of had a field day with Dirk and Bonner guarding the rim

The Heat actually did have a field day when Mahinmi tried to guard the rim.

I don't see much difference there.

[Ginobilly]

What exactly would Bonner do as a Mav to lose game 6?

uh...play in it doofus:bang Just his presence alone would of motivated Lebron, Wade and Bosh to drive towards the rim. Remember that Haywood was injured(and like many predicted Tyson to be in foul trouble), so Dallas wouldn't have any other choice other than put the season and championship on the line into the hands of the ginger and dirk guarding the rim.

The Heat actually did have a field day when Mahinmi tried to guard the rim.

I don't see much difference there.

Mahinimi at least gave an effort(tried to contest shots) and knocked some fools down when they tried to drive towards him. He scored a bucket, grabbed a few boards, and his points contributed to a mavs victory in game 6. Can't say that Bonner would of had the same impact.

[Blake]

Mahinimi at least gave an effort(tried to contest shots) and knocked some fools down when they tried to drive towards him. He scored a bucket, grabbed a few boards, and his points contributed to a mavs victory in game 6. Can't say that Bonner would of had the same impact.

Unless you are stupid, you can't say that anyone that played 11 minutes and gave up 5 fouls had a real positive impact on the game.

You also can't smartly say that someone that played limited minutes and only in 3 out of 6 games had any kind of real impact on the series.

[GSH]

I've been saying for a while now that Bonner needs a little more "banger" in his game. He is too comfortable behind the arc. That's where his game and his head is. It is hard for him to switch modes when his shots aren't falling. He doesn't contribute in other ways when the main part of his game fails him.
If the Spurs decide to keep Bonner (or are unable to move him) it would be a good idea to get Danny Ferry to mentor him and bring a little muscle to his game. I want to see Bonner box out with his body and deliver some hard fouls. Then if his shot isn't falling, he isn't completely worthless.

Can't disagree with a single word of that.

When Bonner first came here, he would deliver some harder fouls. And he would come into a game and pick up an offensive board or two, maybe a steal, knock down a 3. And almost always pick up a foul or two - sometimes within seconds. I remember some of them being some pretty stiff shots - and some guys on opposing teams losing their cool at him, which is pretty much what you want from a banger. Maybe he wasn't as rough as Cardinal, but he was far from soft.

He doesn't play the same game anymore. I think it's because of the role, and the minutes he has to play. Maybe he really is mentally out on the arc. Either way, I think Ferry is the perfect role model for what Bonner should be doing when he's not shooting 3's.

But don't forget that Ferry spent most of his career coming off the bench. As a starter, playing longer minutes and pacing his fouls, he got beaten on defense a lot, too. In that '01 WCF, he looked a lot like Bonner playing defense. A lot. I know he was a few years older, but the basics are the same. He was a lot more suited for coming off the bench, just like Bonner. And I think Bonner could/would bang more if he was back in that role.

[Ginobilly]

Unless you are stupid, you can't say that anyone that played 11 minutes and gave up 5 fouls had a real positive impact on the game.

You also can't smartly say that someone that played limited minutes and only in 3 out of 6 games had any kind of real impact on the series.

His team did win no? Or is game 7 scheduled for tomorrow?:rolleyes

Did you even see the game Blake, seriously? Those hard fouls that Mahininmi, and the custodian delivered really fucked with the Heats offensive rhythm as they tried to make a comeback as the 3rd q ended. And they paid off didn't they? How many free throws did the Heat missed? This is almost like when Sacramento choked on the line during game 7 of the 2002 wcsf when the Lakers delivered some hard fouls on the kings players that messed with their confidence.

[ElNono]

If Matty would be playing 6 mpg, I don't think there will be much to complain about with him. I would still call him a soft choker, but I would be glad he only gets 6 mpg. Somewhat what happened with RMJ when he fell out of Pop's favor. Nobody really missed him, most were glad when his ass was shipped.

Now, that Matt used to foul a lot before he was assigned this 'extended' role (which allegedly is Cardinal's job) is a bunch of baloney. A cursory look at his career numbers will tell you that he never even reached an average of 3 fouls per game in a season, 2 being his career average. Truth be told, his rotations are so awful he's normally late even to foul. From just looking at the games my perception (could be wrong) is that most of his fouls actually come from opposing players jumping on him to draw a foul, more than Matt actually proactively committing one.

Matt is a great guy, just a very below average NBA player overall. A role like Cardinal has in Dallas is probably the right role for him (5th big, under 10 mpg when somebody else is injured). Unfortunately, our top dog can't play a lot of minutes anymore, and Dice has been on his last legs. Which IMO ties with FWD observation in another thread about this roster being deeply flawed when talking about contention.

[ChumpDumper]

Sure Bonner is overused.

[ElNono]

Danny Ferry had a nasty side to him. That's something Matt simply doesn't have, and you can't teach. It's part of your personality. You either have it or you don't.

[ElNono]

And I'm not 'bashing' Matty for being a nice guy. I'm just pointing it out. Some nice guys like Dirk make positive contributions too using sheer talent.

[TJastal]

So you guys are comparing Bonner, who had to play against memphis and all the monsters they have at pf and center against cardinal who played against Haslem,anthony, and howard...seriously :lol

Randolph & Gasol were tough matchups for Bonner. But he also got dominated by 6'8" Darrel Arthur.

With that in mind, what makes you think it would have been any different with Haslem/Anthony/Howard? Not to mention he would have been matched up against Lebron for stretches of every game every time the heat went small.

I think its just the intensity and physicality of playoff basketball that Bonner can't handle, and he's proved it every year so far. Last year it was Dudley, Amundson, & Frye that pulled down Bonner's panties and spanked him all over the court.

[TJastal]

As usual, you have to talk about shit you know nothing about. Hate Bonner all you want - everybody is entitled to an opinion. But his stroke is extremely good, and the rotation on the shots (especially those 3's) is incredible. Of all the things you could say about him, talking about his shooting mechanics and calling them "shot-puts" is probably the stupidest thing I could think of.

If you knew shit about the actual game, you might have noticed that late in the season he couldn't hit a 3 unless he was stepping into it. (And had one foot in front of the other.) If he was standing still and had both feet planted evenly, he couldn't knock one down to save his life. Guys develop quirks like that sometimes when they are trying to compensate from an injury. Gee... did Bonner have an injury that might make it necessary to step into long shots? Something like a knee, maybe? Ya think?

Bitch about him not stepping up in the playoffs. Bitch about him looking clumsy. Bitch about him not being able to defend Zach Randolph. But don't talk about fucking shooting mechanics if you don't know anything about shooting mechanics. And don't bother me with one of your three page, mind-numbing responses. You're just wrong about this one. Let it go.

What do I care whether Matt Bonner stepped into his 3's or not late in the year? It's not even relevant to the argument. His motion, mechanics and release are all flawed, which is evident from this video.

c5VWaYNMqBI

Pause at :17 and you can see how he releases the ball from his right shoulder shot-put style. It's like a cross between a jumpshot and setshot and since he shoots it from the shoulder instead of above his head it's easy to disrupt. Add the pressure of playoff basketball and these poor mechanics just exacerbate the problem which is why his 3pt% tumbles every year. He didn't get the nickname "snowman" for nothing.

[Big P]

Bonner is a liability and he disappears in the playoffs....huge mistake giving him a 5 year contract....they should have let rj walk as well.

[GSH]

Danny Ferry had a nasty side to him. That's something Matt simply doesn't have, and you can't teach. It's part of your personality. You either have it or you don't.


Echhh - you and Ohmwrecker are probably right. Ferry definitely had that nasty side, and Cardinal has always been a banger. Not quite dirty, but just this side of it. Bonner may have put some wood on guys, but I can't convince myself he's cut from the same cloth as the other two in that department.

I still don't think Cardinal could guard first-string bigs for long without fouling out, or learning to play matador. He's not heavy in the lateral movement department. They're both niche players, or should be. But it's a different niche. The biggest problem is that the Spurs need help in the bigs department. It's not Bonner. I know Cardinal bangs, but he's not the answer either. If we had that hole filled, then either one of them could contribute for 8-10 minutes. Without it, everyone would just be frustrated looking to either of them to be a solid big man.

[GSH]

What do I care whether Matt Bonner stepped into his 3's or not late in the year? It's not even relevant to the argument. His motion, mechanics and release are all flawed, which is evident from this video.

Pause at :17 and you can see how he releases the ball from his right shoulder shot-put style. It's like a cross between a jumpshot and setshot and since he shoots it from the shoulder instead of above his head it's easy to disrupt. Add the pressure of playoff basketball and these poor mechanics just exacerbate the problem which is why his 3pt% tumbles every year. He didn't get the nickname "snowman" for nothing.


You don't know shit about shot mechanics, and shouldn't pretend to. He shoots like Dave Hopla. He's not going to elevate and shoot over a leaping defender. We all know that. He's not the only spot-up 3-point shooter in the league. But "flawed mechanics"? Dumbass comment. "Shot-put"? Even more dumbass comment. Hell, Sean Elliott [edit: can't believe I spelled freaking Elliott wrong] knows a thing or two about shooting, and he talks often about Bonner's stroke.

Have you ever bothered to watch the rotation on a shot? Do you even know what it means? No shot-put is going to look like Bonner's shot. It can't. Your problem is you never know when to quit. You get in over your head, and then you just keep digging the hole deeper. I'm not going to argue with you, you're just wrong.

[ElNono]

Echhh - you and Ohmwrecker are probably right. Ferry definitely had that nasty side, and Cardinal has always been a banger. Not quite dirty, but just this side of it. Bonner may have put some wood on guys, but I can't convince myself he's cut from the same cloth as the other two in that department.

I still don't think Cardinal could guard first-string bigs for long without fouling out, or learning to play matador. He's not heavy in the lateral movement department. They're both niche players, or should be. But it's a different niche. The biggest problem is that the Spurs need help in the bigs department. It's not Bonner. I know Cardinal bangs, but he's not the answer either. If we had that hole filled, then either one of them could contribute for 8-10 minutes. Without it, everyone would just be frustrated looking to either of them to be a solid big man.

The problem is that the proposition in this thread is retarded, that's why I didn't even really entertain the actual comparison. This is like asking who's better, Raef LaFrentz or Shawn Bradley. You're going to end up arguing about technicalities because at the very bottom you really know they're both awful overall players if given any important role.

[Cessation]

These bonner lovers never learn. How many times does he have to choke? Ginger is too unathletic and too much of a pussy to handle playoff basketball. It's no wonder that since he got here, spurs have been bounced in the first, or swept in the second. You have to be efficient in the playoffs, and Matty's 20 minutes a game, don't help that at all. By the way, when you say he's trying really hard out there, I'm not so sure, tbh. I think he's got that face of "I'm really working hard out here" down packed.

[ohmwrecker]

lol "down packed"

Dude, wtf are you talking about? There aren't any Bonner lover's in this thread.

TJ! Come take your little brother home!

[8FOR!3]

Yep. The facts mean nothing. The guy averaged over 9 PF/36 minutes in the playoffs. That's a foul-out every 19 minutes. But somehow that doesn't matter.

This is nothing but another worn-out "Bonner Sucks" thread. The only reason Brian Cardinal got brought into it was to try and make it look like something different than the last 500 "Bonner sucks" threads. And maybe it would have worked with someone other than Brian Cardinal.

Dirk Nowitzki > Matt Bonner :lol

[thOOdee]

lmao at anyone who thinks bonner is better than cardinal.....bonner is barely a off the bench player....tbh i don't think this fool should even be playin in the nba.

[ChumpDumper]

lol flawed mechanics

[GSH]

The problem is that the proposition in this thread is retarded, that's why I didn't even really entertain the actual comparison. This is like asking who's better, Raef LaFrentz or Shawn Bradley. You're going to end up arguing about technicalities because at the very bottom you really know they're both awful overall players if given any important role.


Short and sweet. You made me laugh, and that's a pretty good way to end the day.

[joshdaboss]

Can't begin to explain how false.

[itzsoweezee]

I get it perfectly.

You are now implying that Carlisle is a better coach than Pop.

crofl.

:lmao:lmao:lmao

He just might well be. Carlisle won a championship without the greatest power forward of all time. Popovich has gotten his ass handed to him two years straight by inferior teams. Popovich is a washed up has-been. Kick his ass to the curb already, and have him take Boner with him.

[Cessation]

lol "down packed"

Dude, wtf are you talking about? There aren't any Bonner lover's in this thread.

TJ! Come take your little brother home!

Sure there are scro, anyone saying anything positive about ginger, is a bonner lover, as far as I'm concerned. Extreme? Maybe so. Uncalled for? I think not. How many years have we seen that ginger choke over and over? and there are 3 more to come. :cry:cry:cry

[cheguevara]

The problem is that the proposition in this thread is retarded, that's why I didn't even really entertain the actual comparison. This is like asking who's better, Raef LaFrentz or Shawn Bradley. You're going to end up arguing about technicalities because at the very bottom you really know they're both awful overall players if given any important role.

congratulations Nono. You finally get the point of my thread after 3 pages...




my point is, Jim Carrey uses Cardinal when he is forced to due to injuries. Pop uses Bonner as first bigman off the bench.
:lol

[Blake]

The problem is that the proposition in this thread is retarded, that's why I didn't even really entertain the actual comparison. This is like asking who's better, Raef LaFrentz or Shawn Bradley. You're going to end up arguing about technicalities because at the very bottom you really know they're both awful overall players if given any important role.

:lol this.

[Blake]

congratulations Nono. You finally get the point of my thread after 3 pages...

I'm not sure you even get the point of your thread.

[cheguevara]

I'm not sure you even get the point of your thread.



my point is, Jim Carrey uses Cardinal when he is forced to due to injuries. Pop uses Bonner as first bigman off the bench.
:lol

[TimDunkem]

lol "down packed"

:lmao

[Blake]

I'm not sure you even get the point of your thread.

[in2deep]

Cardinal was really great in that closing game. Reminded me of Oberto's closing game but in a lesser level. Doing all the intangibles. He even stole the ball from Lebron and manhandled Wade a couple of times.

You know, things that Bonner would never even dream of doing. I will go ahead and say Cardinal is much better defender than Bonner. But hell, 95% of the NBA also is.

[hater]

Had Bonner entered the game instead of Cardinal for the mavs, Lebron would have probably regained his confidence by monster dunking on the Ginger a few times.

[ChuckD]

Comparing Cardinal and Bonner? Really? That's like someone asking you if you want your shit sandwich on wheat or rye. Guess what? It's still a shit sandwich. If Cardinal were a Spur you'd be hating on him just as hard, believe it. This is strictly a case of "the grass is greener...".

[Cessation]

Had Bonner entered the game instead of Cardinal for the mavs, Lebron would have probably regained his confidence by monster dunking on the Ginger a few times.

Very true.

[TJastal]

Comparing Cardinal and Bonner? Really? That's like someone asking you if you want your shit sandwich on wheat or rye. Guess what? It's still a shit sandwich. If Cardinal were a Spur you'd be hating on him just as hard, believe it. This is strictly a case of "the grass is greener...".

Once again, I come across a ChuckD posting that is chock full of FAIL...

Cardinal is much better than you're giving him credit for. He's the perfect 'glue guy' to have on your team whether its taking a charge, getting into an opponents head, diving for a loose ball, boxing out, you name it. Pretty much everything that you never see Bonner do. The one and only advantage Bonner has is better 3pt%, but even that advantage dissappears once the playoffs start.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

As unwarranted as I think a lot of the Popovich hate on this site is, the Spurs fans STILL defending Bonner are a little strange. 3rd straight year he's absolutely shit the bed for you guys in the playoffs, even dumber than the Suns fans who still loved Barbosa after 2008.

[Cessation]

Once again, I come across a ChuckD posting that is chock full of FAIL...

Cardinal is much better than you're giving him credit for. He's the perfect 'glue guy' to have on your team whether its taking a charge, getting into an opponents head, diving for a loose ball, boxing out, you name it. Pretty much everything that you never see Bonner do. The one and only advantage Bonner has is better 3pt%, but even that advantage dissappears once the playoffs start.

Quality post, bipolar ohmrecker must be cutting himself with rage once again. Clearly, I'd rather have Cardinal in the playoffs, than bonner. Cardinal made an impression immediatelly, as soon as he checked in game 6. Those hard fouls, made the heat think twice before trying to drive in the paint. Which they barelly did to begin with. What would you rather do? Drive on Cardinal and know he'll lay the wood on you, or drive on bonner and get an and1.

[DMC]

Cardinal doesn't spread the floor like Matty does.

[DirkDoesWork]

Cardinal doesn't fuck everything up like Matt Bonner does

[Fireball]

Just listening to the 4-Down-Podcast at 48MoH and somebody compared Matt Bonner to winter shoes ... they are great in Winter but it stinks if you put them on over the summer. That much sums it up.

[TJastal]

Quality post, bipolar ohmrecker must be cutting himself with rage once again. Clearly, I'd rather have Cardinal in the playoffs, than bonner. Cardinal made an impression immediatelly, as soon as he checked in game 6. Those hard fouls, made the heat think twice before trying to drive in the paint. Which they barelly did to begin with. What would you rather do? Drive on Cardinal and know he'll lay the wood on you, or drive on bonner and get an and1.

+1

You could easily see how rattled the heat became when they realized they were going to get hammered by "The Custodian" if they attempted to get into the paint. They went from exuding supreme confidence and swagger to little wimpering pussies with their tales tucked between their legs.

:lol

[TJastal]

Cardinal doesn't spread the floor like Matty does.

You meant to say 'his buttcheeks'

[Kamnik]

he came in and was the enforcer that force the heat players into fetus position and pushed back into their asses, dude came in with no tolerance bs handing out hard veteran fouls....

that was awsome to see!

[nkdlunch]

Red rocket is a complete failure. Pop still inserting him in prime playoff minutes just shows Pop has completely lost his marbles. Pop did not age well

[ohmwrecker]

Quality post, bipolar ohmrecker must be cutting himself with rage once again.

:lol It's not my fault that you are a barely literate borderline retard.

lol "down packed"


btw, Who is surprised by the union of dipshits that is Cess & TJ?

[cheguevara]

As unwarranted as I think a lot of the Popovich hate on this site is, the Spurs fans STILL defending Bonner are a little strange. 3rd straight year he's absolutely shit the bed for you guys in the playoffs, even dumber than the Suns fans who still loved Barbosa after 2008.

and some ppl will actually vote for Palin.Some things just cannot be explained

[TJastal]

and some ppl will actually vote for Palin.Some things just cannot be explained

Like your retarded poorly photo-shopped sig pic for example.

[cheguevara]

:lmao

that's an actual pic no photoshop

:lmao

[Cessation]

:lol It's not my fault that you are a barely literate borderline retard.

lol "down packed"


btw, Who is surprised by the union of dipshits that is Cess & TJ?

lol butthurt

I'm far more educated than you, tbh. I'm sorry if my agreement with with tjastals quality posts, has upset you. Do you wish to talk about it?

[ohmwrecker]

lol butthurt

I'm far more educated than you, tbh. I'm sorry if my agreement with with tjastals quality posts, has upset you. Do you wish to talk about it?

:lmao "down packed"

:lmao "educated"

[ChumpDumper]

lol quality posts

[Bruno]

Between Cardinal and Bonner, the choice is quite easy: you take the one with a min contract and not the one with a +$10M contract...

[Stalin]

looks like ohm is quickly becoming the next dmc

[ohmwrecker]

looks like ohm is quickly becoming the next dmc

Another troll? What a fucking girl you've become.

[Stalin]

Another troll? What a fucking girl you've become.

relax scrah..i meant it as a compliment

[angelbelow]

Cardinal>Bonner cause he doesnt get consistent playing time :p:

[GSH]

Between Cardinal and Bonner, the choice is quite easy: you take the one with a min contract and not the one with a +$10M contract...


It was pointed out that it's a silly thread to begin with. But the question is which is the better player, not which is the better value. Their salaries are a reflection of the FO's, not the players.

[taps]

Between Cardinal and Bonner, the choice is quite easy: you take the one with a min contract and not the one with a +$10M contract...

and that's what novak is. Empirical data is limited but he seems to be able to contribute in an smaller, old-man Ferry style.

[ohmwrecker]

and that's what novak is. Empirical data is limited but he seems to be able to contribute in an smaller, old-man Ferry style.

Except that (contract aside) he is actually even worse than Bonner on just about every level. I don't see Novak taking charges, boxing out or throwing elbows either.

[TJastal]

Except that (contract aside) he is actually even worse than Bonner on just about every level. I don't see Novak taking charges, boxing out or throwing elbows either.

Novak has some versatility and can be used as a 3. That right there
makes him infinitely more valuable to the team than Bonner, especially given the spurs lack of size after Jefferson.

[ChumpDumper]

When was Novak used as a three?

[ohmwrecker]

Novak has some versatility and can be used as a 3. That right there
makes him infinitely more valuable to the team than Bonner, especially given the spurs lack of size after Jefferson.

What versatility? He and Bonner have the same skill . . . shooting 3s. Think of everything else that Bonner is bad at and Novak is worse. His only advantage is that he makes less money. That's it.

[TJastal]

When was Novak used as a three?

Since he began his nba career.

[ChumpDumper]

Since he began his nba career.How many of Steve Novak's 225 NBA games have you watched where he played rotation minutes at the three? Tell me more about the lineups in which he played.

Thanks in advance.

[TJastal]

How many of Steve Novak's 225 NBA games have you watched where he played rotation minutes at the three? Tell me more about the lineups in which he played.

Thanks in advance.

Your welcome in advance.


http://www.best-basketball-tips.com/Steve-Novak-bio.html

He is commonly known as “Steve Novak” and plays in a small forward and power forward position.

http://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/the_los_angeles_clippers_acquire_small_forward_ste ve_novak_from_the_rockets/876864


[The Clippers have acquired backup small forward Steve Novak from the Rockets

[ChumpDumper]

Your welcome in advance.


http://www.best-basketball-tips.com/Steve-Novak-bio.html


http://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/the_los_angeles_clippers_acquire_small_forward_ste ve_novak_from_the_rockets/876864

[QUOTE][The Clippers have acquired backup small forward Steve Novak from the Rockets/QUOTE]I didn't ask you to Google "Steve Novak small forward" and give me your results.

You aren't good at this.

lol best basketball tips

[TJastal]

[QUOTE=TJastal;5309604]Your welcome in advance.


http://www.best-basketball-tips.com/Steve-Novak-bio.html


http://www.yardbarker.com/nba/articles/the_los_angeles_clippers_acquire_small_forward_ste ve_novak_from_the_rockets/876864

I didn't ask you to Google "Steve Novak small forward" and give me your results.

You aren't good at this.

lol best basketball tips

I could really give a shit less what you "asked" for. Obviously he has played small forward in his nba career and those links back that up claim. Dumbass.

[ChumpDumper]

I could really give a shit less what you "asked" for.Sure you do; you tried to answer with a Google query.
Obviously he has played small forward in his nba career and those links back that up claim. Dumbass.Obviously you have never actually seen him play small forward in his NBA career. Your Google "answer" backs up that claim.

[TJastal]

Sure you do; you tried to answer with a Google query.Obviously you have never actually seen him play small forward in his NBA career. Your Google "answer" backs up that claim.

Well, as flattering as it is that you want my own personal references and observations of Steve Novak's career as validation, if the information that is out there on the internet is not good enough for you I guess you'll just have to remain unconvinced.

[ChumpDumper]

Well, as flattering as it is that you want my own personal references and observations of Steve Novak's career as validation, if the information that is out there on the internet is not good enough for you I guess you'll just have to remain unconvinced.No, I am convinced you have never seen him play small forward in his NBA career and are simply talking out of your ass when you say he can play that position for the Spurs.

Thanks for confirming it for me. :toast

[TJastal]

No, I am convinced you have never seen him play small forward in his NBA career and are simply talking out of your ass when you say he can play that position for the Spurs.

Thanks for confirming it for me. :toast

Great, I hope you feel "validated" now.

[ChumpDumper]

Great, I hope you feel "validated" now.You serve no such purpose for me.

[William Hung]

:lol

[lefty]

http://static.fjcdn.com/pictures/Joker_df31d6_569159.jpg

[William Hung]

funny junk doesn't like image sharing apparently