Kawhi Leonard - thoughts from someone who's actually seen him play

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I've seen Kawhi Leonard play a lot of games in his two seasons at San Diego State. I have a subscription to The Mountain West channel; have watched SDSU play in person or on television probably twenty times the past two years. I may have a little better basis than most when it comes to making an assessment of his potential. Here are my general observations of his game and my opinion of how he'll impact the Spurs:

I was actually a little surprised initially to see how highly Kawhi was being rated by Chad Ford and some other draft analysts. I thought 5 to 7 was too high. The only reason I say that is that Kawhi was pretty limited offensively in college. His college scoring was due in large part to his genetics and his hustle. Kawhi's form on his shot was something I doubted could be translated consistently to an NBA game. Watching him during the college season, though, I still figured he'd be a late first round pick because he’s definitely one of those guys with NBA level talent. But when I saw how limited this year’s draft talent was, I realized a guy with Leonard’s potential was certainly lottery level compared to the competition. There’s no doubt he’ll contribute. He’s not a project-type player that the Spurs will have to stash away. He’ll come in and produce at a high level his rookie year.

When I saw Kawhi fall to the Pacers I had flashbacks to their drafting Danny Granger a few years ago. I know the Pacers scout the west a little better than some NBA teams, and I figured they recognized Leonard’s potential, similar to how they understood that Granger would be an impact player in this league. He and Danny have completely different skill sets, so you can’t compare the two, but I thought what the Pacers had done was pull off another draft day steal. When I saw that they actually had traded that pick to San Antonio I was pretty excited for my Spurs.

Kawhi Leonard could be the best rebounding 3 in the league if given the minutes. And he’s definitely quick enough and long enough to guard any 3, and a lot of the 4s in the NBA. His body is too slight, I think, to man the post against the beefier 4s out there, but no one will out-length him which is a nice change for this team. What Kawhi brings to the table is tremendous hustle. He’s amazingly athletic, and so I was shocked at his poor combine stats – a fluke is all I can surmise. He’s going to bring back a defensive intensity to this team not seen since the days of Bowen. I’m not sure he’ll ever have Bowen’s ability to guard 4 different positions, but if he can guard all of the small forwards that have been murdering the Spurs the last few years that may be enough. I think we’ll see him guard most of the better 2s, 3s and some of the better scoring 4s, that this team faces.

As for the shooting weaknesses, I know he’s been working hard on his shot mechanics. He’s completely changed his release point, his shooting motion, and the way he holds the basketball. Give him some time with Chip and I think we’ll see a guy capable of doing a reasonable job shooting the rock. I wouldn’t expect him to be a double figure scorer this season, but if Pop will trust the rookie, I could see him seriously displacing many of RJ's minutes next season. At this point he doesn’t have the ability to create his own shot, but that may come with time.

Kawhi’s greatest asset is his work ethic. He’s going to inject a certain energy level onto the defense that I think will be contagious. What he’ll have to work on is his shooting, his ball-handling, and his lateral movement on defense. But he’s not going to be satisfied with being average. He’s one of those guys that’s a winner, plain and simple. Some people have that gift and bring it to the table. Guys like Bowen, Mario Elie, Gary Neal. Guys who make their team better. I think that’s what the Spurs saw. Some players have that knack and desire, and you can just see it in how they play…losing is personal to them. I’d expect Kawhi Leonard to live in the workout facility, he’ll work to eliminate his weaknesses, and he’ll be a much better-rounded player in the NBA than he ever was in college. People will need to remember that he’s not even 21, and so he’ll need a little time, but fans will also be pleasantly surprised by his learning curve I think. He’ll probably average 4 and 3 his first couple of months in the league, the doubters and George Hill lovers will be screaming about him being a wasted pick, but then you’ll see him start to click. I don’t think I’d expect him to be a double-figure scorer as a rookie, but he’ll definitely contribute, and I think we’ll see him getting starter minutes by the playoffs. He’ll be our team’s primary defensive specialist by season’s end.

The Spurs have finally found their long 3.

[jjktkk]

Nice writeup Ed. :tu

[Solid D]

Thanks for the insight, Chopper! Leonard may have decent burst enough to get to the rim off one dribble to get his own shot.

I share in your last sentiment.


The Spurs have finally found their long 3.

[DesignatedT]

For a kid that is only 19 years old, he sure does have a lot of pressure on him to perform but from everything I have seen on the guy so far, it sounds like he can take the pressure.

[ohmwrecker]

It's nice to read something on ST about Leonard that isn't completely insane.

Obviously, an RJ trade is a best case scenario (highly unlikely as it is), but maybe having a hungry, aggressive, talented rookie who wants his job will inspire RJ to give the Spurs what he did at the beginning of last season on a more consistent level. Butler is going to provide some more insurance as well. At the very least the Spurs will have options @ the 3 this season.

[Fabbs]

Could you compare the 20 games you saw vs the 5 big ones vs BYU Xs3/Temple/UConn? (combined 1-4 record with the one win vs BYU coming only after their frontline player was suspended.)

NCAA tourney they beat Temple in spite of him (fellow frontliners Malcolm Thomas and Billy White were vastly superior) and vs UConn he was meh.

Both games he and D.J. Gay were ball hogs.
What i am seeing is consistent rebounding.

[ElNono]

It's a chopper baby!

Thanks for the writeup :toast

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Could you compare the 20 games you saw vs the 5 big ones vs BYU Xs3/Temple/UConn? (combined 1-4 record with the one win vs BYU coming only after their frontline player was suspended.)

NCAA tourney they beat Temple in spite of him (fellow frontliners Malcolm Thomas and Billy White were vastly superior) and vs UConn he was meh.

Both games he and D.J. Gay were ball hogs.
What i am seeing is consistent rebounding.

BYU had SDSU's number. One of those odd things about college basketball...matchups. New Mexico, for example, was 4-1 verses BYU the last two seasons but it's hard to say they were that the Lobos were better than the Cougars. UNM just had a better executed game plan and had the ability to shut down everyone on BYU not named Jimmer.

Leonard's offensive game left something to be desired, even in games other than those you mentioned. He gets his points by being faster than his opponents and from putback opportunities. Offense has been his weakness. My hope is that he's developing that shooting touch. Against UConn he tried to do too much...he's not a creator offensively at this point.

But SDSU had a lot of talent...IMO, Billy White was always the guy you worried about beating you from a scoring standpoint, and so, yeah, you'd see other guys step up depending on the game you were watching. It wasn't a one man show for them.

[taps]

Butler is going to provide some more insurance as well.

At this point Butler is a completely unknown quantity at the NBA level; we probably have a better idea of what Green can give us than Butler. Given all he's been through it's hard to say what he can provide at all.

Change the verb "is" with "could" and I would agree with you.

[Mr. Body]

The Spurs have finally found their long 3.

Amen.

[Mr. Body]

People will need to remember that he’s not even 21.

Actually, he's a full year away from 21. He turns 20 tomorrow.

[Fireball]

Thanks for the insightful write-up ... looking forward to see him compete

[tdunk21]

good write up....u told things which some of us didnt know about kawhi....

[Man In Black]

Could you compare the 20 games you saw vs the 5 big ones vs BYU Xs3/Temple/UConn? (combined 1-4 record with the one win vs BYU coming only after their frontline player was suspended.)

NCAA tourney they beat Temple in spite of him (fellow frontliners Malcolm Thomas and Billy White were vastly superior) and vs UConn he was meh.

Both games he and D.J. Gay were ball hogs.
What i am seeing is consistent rebounding.
Shouldn't that say 2-3? They won the MWC Tourney against BYU and beat Temple in Round 1 71-64 in double OT.

[TimmehC]

I'm just curious to know if you have an opinion of his overall BBIQ, after watching him so much.

[Fabbs]

Shouldn't that say 2-3? They won the MWC Tourney against BYU and beat Temple in Round 1 71-64 in double OT.
yes :lol
To me the Temple game was a loss for Kawhi -not the team.

Ed it appears I saw his worst games. Temple we watched and were wondering if he was in cement shoes and/or on reefer. I hope you're right about him guarding SFs cause in the games i saw he'd get blown by.

[Man In Black]

To me...it seems as if you can't organize. If that was a Kawhi loss, then wouldn't you reference 2 separate win-loss records?

And as someone who's seen as many games as Chopper...I concur. The long arms that we raved about for GHill will be an even bigger asset for Kawhi, especially since h has monstrous hands.

[pancakechef]

Nice write up. I would like to know, since I too have seen him play, what you though about his halfcourt game, and the Spurs offense?

[Fabbs]

Lighten up Francis.

[lefty]

Great read

Thanks EHJ:tu

[spurs10]

Thanks for this write-up. I too, am encouraged by the options we now have at the 3.

[ohmwrecker]

At this point Butler is a completely unknown quantity at the NBA level; we probably have a better idea of what Green can give us than Butler. Given all he's been through it's hard to say what he can provide at all.

Change the verb "is" with "could" and I would agree with you.

It's an assumption, sure, but Leonard is an unknown at the NBA level. All rookies are.
No doubt Butler suffered a pretty bad injury. He has the luxury of youth on his side and according to everything I've heard or read, from his surgery to his recovery and rehab have gone amazingly well. The Spurs' medical staff is really good as well. If we are to assume that he can return to be the player he was in college, then the Spurs have essentially two lottery level rookies going into the season.

[Mel_13]

It's an assumption, sure, but Leonard is an unknown at the NBA level. All rookies are.
No doubt Butler suffered a pretty bad injury. He has the luxury of youth on his side and according to everything I've heard or read, from his surgery to his recovery and rehab have gone amazingly well. The Spurs' medical staff is really good as well. If we are to assume that he can return to be the player he was in college, then the Spurs have essentially two lottery level rookies going into the season.

Butler was never projected as a lottery level talent:

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Da-Sean-Butler-1184/mock-draft-history/

[objective]

Butler is much worse off than Leonard going into a new season. All Leonard has to adjust to is the NBA game. Butler has to do that, plus adjust to playing off a severe injury, plus overcome the setback of not playing competitive basketball in over a year.

That's a lot more to overcome. He might be more suited to playing a year in the d-league than playing a year in the NBA.

[lefty]

By the way, Ed Helicopter Jones, Leonard says he likes to model his game after James Worthy's

Do you see any similarities?

Thanks

[Mel_13]

Thanks for the post, EHJ.

[Mr. Body]

It's a major plus Leonard even knows who James Worthy is. I like it when a player knows the past. Even if he was a dirty Laker.

[ohmwrecker]

Butler was never projected as a lottery level talent:

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Da-Sean-Butler-1184/mock-draft-history/

I was implying that he would have been lottery level talent in this year's draft, imo. I didn't state that clearly though.

[Mel_13]

I was implying that he would have been lottery level talent in this year's draft, imo. I didn't state that clearly though.

If that's true, the Spurs are sitting pretty.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

By the way, Ed Helicopter Jones, Leonard says he likes to model his game after James Worthy's

Do you see any similarities?

Thanks

I think they both have that ability to get out on the break and make pretty good decisions with the basketball. Worthy was bigger than Leonard, and definitely had a more polished all-around game.

I saw glimpses of Leonard being able to play with his back to the basket or facing it. I remember Worthy being pretty versatile in the post as well. I think as Kawhi's body matures he'll be able to post up bigger players simply because his body is so long. Worthy was a lot stronger than this 19-year old.

Other than both of them being extremely mobile forwards I think it's a bit of a reach comparing him to James Worthy at this point. But I believe he has tremendous upside, and has a lot of the same raw tools that Worthy had.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I'm just curious to know if you have an opinion of his overall BBIQ, after watching him so much.


I saw a big difference in his game from his freshman to his sophomore year. That shows me that he's a pretty quick study. Primarily on the offensive side of the ball I saw him doing a lot more with the ball in his hands in year two. As a freshman he mostly just cleaned up the trash, but some of the offense started to go through him as a sophomore. I think his offensive game will continue to improve. I think he'll pick up Pop's schemes fairly well. I'm sure he'll suffer through some of the rookie dog days that Pop tends to dole out, but I don't think they'll be as severe as we've seen with a few other rookies through the years.

[silverblk mystix]

Anyone can answer this;

Does anyone think that Pop will actually allow him to play?

Does anyone else think that Pop will be the biggest obstacle to this rookie's success?

I have no faith whatsoever that Pop will allow this rookie plenty of playing time to get the rookie mistakes out of his system.

I have plenty of faith that all the Pop apologists will be here at the end of next season making excuses for Pop and parroting the old, " It takes two years for new players to really excel in Pop's system...blah...blah..."

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Anyone can answer this;

Does anyone think that Pop will actually allow him to play?

Does anyone else think that Pop will be the biggest obstacle to this rookie's success?

I have no faith whatsoever that Pop will allow this rookie plenty of playing time to get the rookie mistakes out of his system.

I have plenty of faith that all the Pop apologists will be here at the end of next season making excuses for Pop and parroting the old, " It takes two years for new players to really excel in Pop's system...blah...blah..."


I think if Leonard gets significant court time he's going to catch an earful from Pop in similar fashion to Parker during his rookie campaign. Hopefully Kawhi will take it and not get flustered by it. If he panicks or gets tentative he'll be in trouble. TP needs to spend a little time teaching Kawhi in the way of the Pop.

Pop takes a lot of what guys are showing in practice as his basis for seeing the court in games. I think this is where Kawhi should have an advantage because I don't know if anyone on the Spurs will have a better work ethic. If he can stay confident he should be fine as far as seeing minutes goes.

[jimo2305]

ttCvogGVtas

i didn't see anyone post this interview yet.. but if anyone did.. my bad..

[Vic Petro]

Anyone can answer this;

Does anyone think that Pop will actually allow him to play?

Does anyone else think that Pop will be the biggest obstacle to this rookie's success?

I have no faith whatsoever that Pop will allow this rookie plenty of playing time to get the rookie mistakes out of his system.

I have plenty of faith that all the Pop apologists will be here at the end of next season making excuses for Pop and parroting the old, " It takes two years for new players to really excel in Pop's system...blah...blah..."

Again Pop played Tony Parker. He played Gary Neal. He played DeJuan Blair. He played George Hill. He played James Anderson (before he got hurt). He was an asshole for not playing Splitter, but it's not like he Larry Browns every rookie in the program.

[Nathan89]

Nice write up. I would like to know, since I too have seen him play, what you though about his halfcourt game, and the Spurs offense?http://www.pancake.co.uk/chef.gif
http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.pancake.co.uk/chef.gif&imgrefurl=http://www.pancake.co.uk/pancake_recipe.html&usg=__Q9J1WQp82-UqEBsCN2USxRjelrE=&h=128&w=200&sz=7&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=-0jEEdqglJpwYM:&tbnh=102&tbnw=160&ei=WFMKTpuPDeSn0AHMlqBc&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dpancakes%2Bchef%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D102 4%26bih%3D587%26gbv%3D2%26tbm%3Disch&itbs=1&iact=rc&dur=649&page=1&ndsp=16&ved=1t:429,r:3,s:0&tx=80&ty=64

[GSH]

The only reason I say that is that Kawhi was pretty limited offensively in college. His college scoring was due in large part to his genetics and his hustle.

Kawhi Leonard could be the best rebounding 3 in the league if given the minutes. And he’s definitely quick enough and long enough to guard any 3, and a lot of the 4s in the NBA.

I think we’ll see him guard most of the better 2s, 3s and some of the better scoring 4s, that this team faces.

At this point he doesn’t have the ability to create his own shot, but that may come with time.

Kawhi’s greatest asset is his work ethic. He’s going to inject a certain energy level onto the defense that I think will be contagious. What he’ll have to work on is his shooting, his ball-handling, and his lateral movement on defense. He’ll probably average 4 and 3 his first couple of months in the league, the doubters and George Hill lovers will be screaming about him being a wasted pick, but then you’ll see him start to click.

Gread write-up. Thanks. You touched on a lot of the things I've been wondering about:

Getting most of his points from genetics and hustle isn't all bad. The way the game is played and officiated now, a lot of players are getting points that way. It's one of the things the Spurs have been conspicuously short on. They really have to get more athletic to compete in the game that's being played these days. Chip Engellund will teach him to shoot - better. Nobody can teach our current earthbound crew to be athletic.

You really think he'll be quick enough to guard NBA 2's and 3's? I read a couple of scouting reports that didn't speak glowingly about his lateral movement, and then there were those combine stats. But you said the stats were a fluke. If he can stay in front of quality 3's that would be incredible for this team. If he can really cover quick 2's and finesse 4's, it would be a real bonus. I'm glad to hear you say that you think he can. It would be nice for teams not to be able to create instant mis-matches when we switch.

Jefferson can't create his own shot either. No change there, but no loss from what we currently have.

Work ethic is huge. Energy on defense is huge. Posting 4 and 3 wouldn't bother me too much either. Jefferson gave us about 6 and 4 in the playoffs, and was a matador on defense. If Leonard can really play D, we'll be ahead of the game getting 4 and 3 from him. (BTW - I'm glad you didn't predict more boards for him. They're going to be harder to come by, especially if he's defending the perimeter.) If he starts out getting 4 and 3, it will mean he gets it, and he's focused on defense first. Then the numbers can improve.

[Budkin]

Mexican is his favorite type of food... he'll love SA.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

Gread write-up. Thanks. You touched on a lot of the things I've been wondering about:

Getting most of his points from genetics and hustle isn't all bad. The way the game is played and officiated now, a lot of players are getting points that way. It's one of the things the Spurs have been conspicuously short on. They really have to get more athletic to compete in the game that's being played these days. Chip Engellund will teach him to shoot - better. Nobody can teach our current earthbound crew to be athletic.

You really think he'll be quick enough to guard NBA 2's and 3's? I read a couple of scouting reports that didn't speak glowingly about his lateral movement, and then there were those combine stats. But you said the stats were a fluke. If he can stay in front of quality 3's that would be incredible for this team. If he can really cover quick 2's and finesse 4's, it would be a real bonus. I'm glad to hear you say that you think he can. It would be nice for teams not to be able to create instant mis-matches when we switch.

Jefferson can't create his own shot either. No change there, but no loss from what we currently have.

Work ethic is huge. Energy on defense is huge. Posting 4 and 3 wouldn't bother me too much either. Jefferson gave us about 6 and 4 in the playoffs, and was a matador on defense. If Leonard can really play D, we'll be ahead of the game getting 4 and 3 from him. (BTW - I'm glad you didn't predict more boards for him. They're going to be harder to come by, especially if he's defending the perimeter.) If he starts out getting 4 and 3, it will mean he gets it, and he's focused on defense first. Then the numbers can improve.

Thanks GSH. I do think he's quicker than he's being given credit for. I wonder if these guys that are extremely long-limbed have a hard time with some of the agility tests, because as a fan just watching the games I've always viewed him as very quick. That said, he probably won't be fast enough to guard too many point guards, I don't think, unless their name is Andre Miller or Jason Kidd. But I do think with his length he stands a good chance to stay in front of a lot of the league's shooting guards. If the Spurs are smart they'll mold him into a three/four and not a two/three because I think that's where he'll be able to best shine as he develops his game. I do think he'll add bulk as he matures and be pretty good in that role.

I see him as a role player/defensive specialist. Especially his first year or two while he's still growing up. But he has the tools to evolve into a pretty good player. I wish he could spend a summer working with Bowen...probably would be more beneficial to his long-term success than working with a shooting coach.

[Solid D]

When players show results and energy, they get playing time. Rookie or not. The death knell to the rookie is injury in training camp. That's the foundation where Pop puts his emphasis and trust. It's where the player puts his imprint on Pop's mind.

A player playing through dings is good with Pop. If a player misses too much time early-on...it's like a boat anchor on his back the rest of the year.

[Fabbs]

When players show results and energy, they get playing time. Rookie or not.
:rollin
http://i125.photobucket.com/albums/p55/RackTheMouse/bonpop.jpg

[benefactor]

Good stuff Chopper. :tu

[Solid D]

The death knell to the rookie is injury in training camp. That's the foundation where Pop puts his emphasis and trust. It's where the player puts his imprint on Pop's mind.

A player playing through dings is good with Pop. If a player misses too much time early-on...it's like a boat anchor on his back the rest of the year.

Injured Traing Camp Rookie = Ian Udrih-Splitter

[DPG21920]

Thanks for the write up. The only reason I'm not sold on everything is because RJ is still on the roster. If they can move RJ, I have high expectations of the kid. Not that I expect some 19 year old to come in and turn a fringe contender into a legit one; that would be unreasonable.

I have high expectations because of what the Spurs did and how they don't miss when they do things like this. Many things happen along the way sometimes that dictate how a player performs, but the Spurs are banking on him somewhat from a talent perspective.

If you move RJ, and replace him with a true defensive, rebounding 3, I have no doubt that while the overall talent may dip, the team will be more balanced and better off.

[jjktkk]

Anyone can answer this;

Does anyone think that Pop will actually allow him to play?

Yes.


Does anyone else think that Pop will be the biggest obstacle to this rookie's success?

Nope.


I have no faith whatsoever that Pop will allow this rookie plenty of playing time to get the rookie mistakes out of his system.

Tp, George Hill, DeJuan Blair, Gary Neal, and James Anderson, until his injury, think your a goofball.


I have plenty of faith that all the Pop apologists will be here at the end of next season making excuses for Pop and parroting the old, " It takes two years for new players to really excel in Pop's system...blah...blah..."

Who apologizes for silverblk mystix? Are not most rookies better after 2 years in any coach's system? That seems pretty common sense imo.

[Indazone]

This dude thinks he can play the 2. I don't think his handles are good enough.

BA1GYjD1yHo

[jjktkk]

This dude thinks he can play the 2. I don't think his handles are good enough.

BA1GYjD1yHo

Probably not, but I like his confidence.

[SenorSpur]

The Spurs have finally found their long 3.

Hallelujah! And after 3 seasons (1 missed Batum opportunity and 2 years of screwing around trying to force fit RJ), it's about damn time too!

Very nice writeup, Wild Helicopter.

Thanks for sharing these thoughts. :toast

[SenorSpur]

No doubt Butler suffered a pretty bad injury. He has the luxury of youth on his side and according to everything I've heard or read, from his surgery to his recovery and rehab have gone amazingly well. The Spurs' medical staff is really good as well. If we are to assume that he can return to be the player he was in college, then the Spurs have essentially two lottery level rookies going into the season.

Saying that Butler would've been a lottery pick prior to his injury is a stretch. I will admit I don't know a lot about him, but the thing that scares me most about him, besides coming off such a serious injury, is his apparent lack of athleticism. I hope he fully recovers and finds a spot somewhere.

However, other than the arrival of Leonard and the return of Anderson, quite frankly, I'm next most excited about seeing the progress of Danny Green.

Whatever way this goes, the SF position on the Spurs' roster finally appears to be a position of strength, instead of a position of weakness.

[tp2021]

Whatever way this goes, the SF position on the Spurs' roster finally appears to be a position of strength, instead of a position of weakness.

Mayyybe...I'd say that as far as the SF position goes, to use a baseball analogy, we have a great stable of pitchers but no Ace. I myself am in agreement that I'm most excited about Anderson's return. IIRC dude almost averaged a block a game! I may be counting my chickens, but I have visions of Kawhi and Anderson holding down the perimeter together and it makes me feel alright about the team going forward.

[SenorSpur]

I think they both have that ability to get out on the break and make pretty good decisions with the basketball. Worthy was bigger than Leonard, and definitely had a more polished all-around game.

I saw glimpses of Leonard being able to play with his back to the basket or facing it. I remember Worthy being pretty versatile in the post as well. I think as Kawhi's body matures he'll be able to post up bigger players simply because his body is so long. Worthy was a lot stronger than this 19-year old.

Other than both of them being extremely mobile forwards I think it's a bit of a reach comparing him to James Worthy at this point. But I believe he has tremendous upside, and has a lot of the same raw tools that Worthy had.

If Leonard is ever able to develop a Worthy-esque first step, oh my!

[SenorSpur]

The only reason I'm not sold on everything is because RJ is still on the roster. If they can move RJ, I have high expectations of the kid. Not that I expect some 19 year old to come in and turn a fringe contender into a legit one; that would be unreasonable.

I have high expectations because of what the Spurs did and how they don't miss when they do things like this. Many things happen along the way sometimes that dictate how a player performs, but the Spurs are banking on him somewhat from a talent perspective.

If you move RJ, and replace him with a true defensive, rebounding 3, I have no doubt that while the overall talent may dip, the team will be more balanced and better off.

I thought the same thing the morning after the draft. I figured that keeping RJ around would likely impede this kid's progress. Part of me still feels that way. His progress will almost certainly be slowed by the absence of summer league and what will likely be a delayed start to training camp and the regular season.

I'm sure if the Spurs can find any takers at all, they will ship out RJ. Until then, if RJ cannot be traded, I would expect Kawhi to kick ass in practice, works hard (which apparently is a given). If he does all that, perhaps he'll ultimately even displace RJ from the starting lineup.

[lefty]

I think they both have that ability to get out on the break and make pretty good decisions with the basketball. Worthy was bigger than Leonard, and definitely had a more polished all-around game.

I saw glimpses of Leonard being able to play with his back to the basket or facing it. I remember Worthy being pretty versatile in the post as well. I think as Kawhi's body matures he'll be able to post up bigger players simply because his body is so long. Worthy was a lot stronger than this 19-year old.

Other than both of them being extremely mobile forwards I think it's a bit of a reach comparing him to James Worthy at this point. But I believe he has tremendous upside, and has a lot of the same raw tools that Worthy had.

Thank you ! :tu

[Mr. Body]

Saying that Butler would've been a lottery pick prior to his injury is a stretch. I will admit I don't know a lot about him, but the thing that scares me most about him, besides coming off such a serious injury, is his apparent lack of athleticism. I hope he fully recovers and finds a spot somewhere.

He wasn't terribly athletic and was also old for his draft class. Rarely do you see a senior get drafted in the 1st round nowadays.

[ducks]

splitter and him better stay healthy during training camp

[mingus]

i hope you're right about his skills and what he can bring to the table.

one thing i've learned though is that athleticism is important, but what determines a guy's worth is bball IQ and confidence (see: George Hill). some guys just shrink when they get the NBA, so i'm not going to make a judgement or prediction, not going to get my hopes up until i see him play a couple games at least in the NBA.

if you are right though and the Spurs have found the long, defensive-minded 3 they've been looking for since Bowen left, i hope he starts. bring RJ in as a 6th man and hope he thrives in that role.

[Interrohater]

BA1GYjD1yHo
The thing most exciting about that video is at around 00:32, you can see him recover from a pick to put a hand in his man's face, then rotate to help defense and get the block. There are a couple more defensive plays for him after that, and it's exciting

[blkroadrunners]

I really like the write-up, good job :tu

I'm curious what his ceiling will be offensively when he's more mature.

[TJastal]

i hope you're right about his skills and what he can bring to the table.

one thing i've learned though is that athleticism is important, but what determines a guy's worth is bball IQ and confidence (see: George Hill). some guys just shrink when they get the NBA, so i'm not going to make a judgement or prediction, not going to get my hopes up until i see him play a couple games at least in the NBA.

if you are right though and the Spurs have found the long, defensive-minded 3 they've been looking for since Bowen left, i hope he starts. bring RJ in as a 6th man and hope he thrives in that role.

Unless Leonard develops a 35%+ 3pt shot RJ will still be the better fit in the starting lineup.

[TJastal]

The thing most exciting about that video is at around 00:32, you can see him recover from a pick to put a hand in his man's face, then rotate to help defense and get the block. There are a couple more defensive plays for him after that, and it's exciting

lmao getting all excited over a scrimmage where guys are half assing

[Brazil]

Now this is a ST offseason ! 90% of B/S threads and then you find a thread like that !

Thanks great reading really. I fell I know a little better Leonard and what he can bring to the team.

[lefty]

But the problem is that Pop is still having sex with Bonner :pctoss

[Brazil]

The thing most exciting about that video is at around 00:32, you can see him recover from a pick to put a hand in his man's face, then rotate to help defense and get the block. There are a couple more defensive plays for him after that, and it's exciting

His defensive work at around the 00:52 is not bad too.

On the other point I do hope we will see a lot of alley oups TP / Leonard, TP / RJ had a good connection on that move in the beginning of the season, too bad RJ faded away later but TP will be surely happy to have this guy on the fast break and on alley.

[Brazil]

lmao getting all excited over a scrimmage where guys are half assing

lmao having an agenda on an internet board

[mingus]

Unless Leonard develops a 35%+ 3pt shot RJ will still be the better fit in the starting lineup.

Obviously, that's why I'm not making any predictions. Gotta be able to spread the floor for Manu and TP. It's a must for the 3 position in this offense.

I'd like to see RJ come off the bench and have JA starting if Leonard can't hit the 3. RJ showed in the post season that he's too much of a mental midget to get over 20 minutes a game.

[GSH]

Injured Traing Camp Rookie = Ian Udrih-Splitter

It's not just injuries, and it's not just rookies. Don't forget about Nazr Mohammed and Robert Horry's last season. Missing a chunk of camp is the kiss of death.




I thought the same thing the morning after the draft. I figured that keeping RJ around would likely impede this kid's progress. Part of me still feels that way.



Not just Jefferson-bashing - but I can't think of anything Leonard could learn from RJ, if they kept him around. So I don't see the Spurs wanting to keep Jefferson around as a mentor.

[pancakechef]

Jefferson is a soft little girl, but when running he used to be a decent player. Its not his fault our coach is an idiot who didnt let him play up-tempo. This year was his best year, and we ran more. Shouldnt take homers like you to figure out the problem.

AGAIN its the same with the draft. You take players who dont fit your system or you dont coach to their strengths then you're left with nothing

[nkdlunch]

so we should have restructured the entire team to accommodate Richard Jefferson?

:lmao

[Fabbs]

It's not just injuries, and it's not just rookies. Don't forget about Nazr Mohammed and Robert Horry's last season. Missing a chunk of camp is the kiss of death.
True, and it might have been cutsie when he had the best rosters in the NBA to compensate for his bullshit ineptitude.

Since 2007 when he's actually had to coach, his little "bench the training camp missers, I'll show em who is 'lil Hitler" hasn't worked out so cutisie. :rolleyes

[TacoCabanaFajitas]

Correct me if I'm wrong but GH was getting garbage minutes his rookie year and everyone on here was throwing fits when he didn't play at all until the second half of Game 5 of the Dallas series while RMJ was clanking threes.

[Solid D]

It's not just injuries, and it's not just rookies. Don't forget about Nazr Mohammed and Robert Horry's last season. Missing a chunk of camp is the kiss of death.

Absolutely right! I should have said Training Camp. Missing for personal, religious or other reasons basically messes up everything with the learning curve. This includes Pop's famous "muscle memory" concept and rotating on D without hesitation. It still takes 2 years, at least, to get the feel for defensive rules with the Spurs. Even the high IQ players like Bonner struggle (he still struggles).

[GSH]

Jefferson is a soft little girl, but when running he used to be a decent player. Its not his fault our coach is an idiot who didnt let him play up-tempo. This year was his best year, and we ran more. Shouldnt take homers like you to figure out the problem.

AGAIN its the same with the draft. You take players who dont fit your system or you dont coach to their strengths then you're left with nothing


Amazing! I thought you had perfected ignorance during your first 131 posts. Then you post something even more stupid on post 132 and prove me wrong. Who says you can't improve on perfection?

Just for laughs - did it even occur to you that, while it may have been RJ's best year, the Spurs lost to an 8 seed and suffered the most humiliating post season of the Tim Duncan era? Of course it didn't. You are quite possibly the only human being on the planet who thinks the answer is to double down.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

I agree that Leonard will have to be decent at shooting the 3 if he's going to work his way into Pop's rotation. In college his three was not good....at all. I know he's been reworking his shot mechanics. I don't think the Spurs would have made the moves to get him if they thought he was incapable of developing that part of his game. But it definitely is an "if" at this point.

My guess is that the Spurs organization evaluated his shooting potential and also saw something in his ability to defend that made them want to move up in the draft for the first time ever to get this kid. There was a reason they made that move, and for a team as conservative as San Antonio is when it comes to taking risks they must have seen something they really liked in Leonard.

[pancakechef]

Amazing! I thought you had perfected ignorance during your first 131 posts. Then you post something even more stupid on post 132 and prove me wrong. Who says you can't improve on perfection?

Just for laughs - did it even occur to you that, while it may have been RJ's best year, the Spurs lost to an 8 seed and suffered the most humiliating post season of the Tim Duncan era? Of course it didn't. You are quite possibly the only human being on the planet who thinks the answer is to double down.

Again, the ignorance on here is AMAZING. Please tell me the difference between the regular season and the playoffs..... TEMPO.

We ran the ball in the regular season allowing RJ's crap 1/2 court offense to be slightly miraged by pacing. When we got to the playoffs we slowed it down and ran 1/2 with TP/Manu and Tim.

This has NOTHING to do with restructuring. It has everything to do with PLAYING TO YOUR STRENGTHS. If we arent running the ball then Jefferson shouldnt be playing OR on our team. If we picked up Jefferson since we thought he could provide offense WHICH WE DID, then WE NEED TO PLAY IN A SYSTEM THAT ALLOWS US TO UTILIZE HIM FOR WHAT HE DOES BEST.

Quite Frankly, it doesnt matter how you respond. I am correct. If I werent then RJ would have great years in a slow paced offensive scheme. He never has.

The fact that you think just because a player has success in an entirely different system and that will translate well into our stubborn old system is the problem with 99% of the homers (posters) on the site.

Take a class in statistical analysis, learn the game, watch the game, then comment.

Makes it better for you in the end.

Appreciate the teaching opportunity.

[Mel_13]

it doesnt matter how you respond. I am correct.

chazley 2.0

Like most sequels, not as good as the original.

[pancakechef]

Mel,

IF you could prove me wrong please do. Responding off topic makes me look even more correct.


Thanks AGain

[Mel_13]

Not as good as the original.

[pancakechef]

I win again. Great conversation. But without any comments cut and pasted from local SA sports of Pops comments I wouldnt think you have much to say.


I take comfort in knowing you need tutoring and I am sorry if I am impatient with you. I will slow down

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Mel,

IF you could prove me wrong please do. Responding off topic makes me look even more correct.


Thanks AGain

You need to prove yourself right first, dipshit.

The only place that there is a presumption that you are right is in your own head.

[Mel_13]

Not as good as the original.

Take note. Your schtick has been done already, and done with much more style:

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=157895

[pancakechef]

I already proven myself right. Unfortunately people on here are just FO yes men who cant have opinions of their own. Better though. I have seen some people try to come up with an analysis on here. Stick to being yes men. Makes you look less stupid.

Check and MAte

[ChumpDumper]

Nah, you're wrong. It's been proved.

See? We can do it too.

GAME OVER

[ChumpDumper]

[holds up hand for high five from others]

[Bruno]

Nice post, EHJ.

[xellos88330]

Again, the ignorance on here is AMAZING. Please tell me the difference between the regular season and the playoffs..... TEMPO.

We ran the ball in the regular season allowing RJ's crap 1/2 court offense to be slightly miraged by pacing. When we got to the playoffs we slowed it down and ran 1/2 with TP/Manu and Tim.

This has NOTHING to do with restructuring. It has everything to do with PLAYING TO YOUR STRENGTHS. If we arent running the ball then Jefferson shouldnt be playing OR on our team. If we picked up Jefferson since we thought he could provide offense WHICH WE DID, then WE NEED TO PLAY IN A SYSTEM THAT ALLOWS US TO UTILIZE HIM FOR WHAT HE DOES BEST.

Quite Frankly, it doesnt matter how you respond. I am correct. If I werent then RJ would have great years in a slow paced offensive scheme. He never has.

The fact that you think just because a player has success in an entirely different system and that will translate well into our stubborn old system is the problem with 99% of the homers (posters) on the site.

Take a class in statistical analysis, learn the game, watch the game, then comment.

Makes it better for you in the end.

Appreciate the teaching opportunity.

The key to up tempo basketball is outside shooting. No outside shooting = no defensive gaps for a pg to exploit, narrower passing lanes, and requires much more time to get a decent shot inside of 18 feet or so. Had the Spurs shooters been hitting jumpshots at their regular season rate, then you would have seen a much different outcome to the series.

If you want an example, lets use Parker. Game 5 in overtime, Parker finally strings together a couple of jumpers and the Grizzlies defense starts to fall apart giving the Spurs the victory easily in OT. The Grizz are a young team against an old team, and should have been the team with the most energy and speed. Yet, something so simple as 1 player hitting consecutive jumpers, could completely derail their defense.

[pancakechef]

The key to up tempo basketball is outside shooting. No outside shooting = no defensive gaps for a pg to exploit, narrower passing lanes, and requires much more time to get a decent shot inside of 18 feet or so. Had the Spurs shooters been hitting jumpshots at their regular season rate, then you would have seen a much different outcome to the series.

If you want an example, lets use Parker. Game 5 in overtime, Parker finally strings together a couple of jumpers and the Grizzlies defense starts to fall apart giving the Spurs the victory easily in OT. The Grizz are a young team against an old team, and should have been the team with the most energy and speed. Yet, something so simple as 1 player hitting consecutive jumpers, could completely derail their defense.

No, the key to up-tempo basket ball is aggressive defending, and the ability to get the ball into transition. Parker cant do this effectively. He can attack the rim but court vision is low. Additionally PNR does not constitute up-tempo, which is what we ran almost every time.

We had no one to attack the rim either. Our bigs (McD) has no post up game and cant run the floor.

[xellos88330]

No, the key to up-tempo basket ball is aggressive defending, and the ability to get the ball into transition. Parker cant do this effectively. He can attack the rim but court vision is low. Additionally PNR does not constitute up-tempo, which is what we ran almost every time.

We had no one to attack the rim either. Our bigs (McD) has no post up game and cant run the floor.

If you have no shooters to force a defender to make a decision while running a break, where is the best opportunity to score? THE PAINT!!! If you know that the shooters are not at the top of their game, what happens? You defend THE PAINT therefore destroying the opportunity. The Spurs were using pick and roll a lot because they didn't have any other choice once the break was broken up. All the defenders were sagging into the paint because nobody could hit a consistent jumper and causing the passing lanes to narrow, and it also denied penetration forcing the Spurs to make the outside shot to beat them. The shooters weren't up to the task. PnR can be considered up tempo depending on how fast you set it up. If you want an example, look at PHX. They are widely considered up tempo, and would always use the Stoudemire/Nash PnR. Yet nobody was calling them a half court team because they were PnR dominant.

The Spurs weren't just considered up tempo, but deadly efficient. Why is that? You couldn't leave a Spur with an open shot. It was more than likely going to be 2 or 3 points if you gave them the daylight. Memphis dared the shooters to beat them, and the shooters weren't up to it, therefore destroying the Spurs tempo. On the other side of the court, every damn one of Memphis' players were knocking down jumpers. Or didn't you notice that too? How hard is it to play defense and get into transition when you can't defend all 5 positions on the court? Once again, this contributed to the Spurs' seeming lack of up-tempo basketball. Had the Spurs shooters continued shooting as they did in the regular season, the Spurs would have won that series easily as now Memphis is forced to play the Spurs game.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

In fairness, the Grizzlies perimeter defenders were overplaying the perimeter and counting on Gasol to clean up the mess. Manu made Allen look stupid several times because of it. Overall it worked because just like against Ibaka, Tony and to a lesser extent Manu would not challenge Gasol at the rim.

Gasol was amazing that series.

We had no one to contend with their bigs. McDyess was courageous but he had to give everything he got to just keep Randolph out of the paint and no one else could rebound after a good defensive possession.

And pancake, you are really dumb. Parker is not effective in an up tempo game or in transition? Just shoot yourself, please. We are more stupid for having read you.

[Solid D]

In fairness, the Grizzlies perimeter defenders were overplaying the perimeter and counting on Gasol to clean up the mess. Manu made Allen look stupid several times because of it. Overall it worked because just like against Ibaka, Tony and to a lesser extent Manu would not challenge Gasol at the rim.

Gasol was amazing that series.

We had no one to contend with their bigs. McDyess was courageous but he had to give everything he got to just keep Randolph out of the paint and no one else could rebound after a good defensive possession.

And pancake, you are really dumb. Parker is not effective in an up tempo game or in transition? Just shoot yourself, please. We are more stupid for having read you.

Quality observation, Fuzzy.

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSMiYsXH0rtkozLzScDJX0BHSsA-b6f0b-Pnuoe0r38FCzuwh_X

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Quality observation, Fuzzy.

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSMiYsXH0rtkozLzScDJX0BHSsA-b6f0b-Pnuoe0r38FCzuwh_X

No gold star?

:depressed

[Solid D]

No gold star?

:depressed

Let's not get carried away.

:smokin

[Spursfan092120]

Thanks Ed...got me really excited to see this guy..after this lockout bullshit.

[Interrohater]

lmao getting all excited over a scrimmage where guys are half assing
I meant exciting in the purest sense of the word. In that, it's exciting to think about what he can bring. I'm not bouncing off the walls and salivating. I would like to point out, though, that while you're being pessimistic and pointing out that they're "half assing", Leonard was still playing defense. THAT is a good sign. Even during a half-speed scrimmage, he doesn't just give up easy buckets because it doesn't count, he actually got two blocks. That to me is exciting because it speaks volumes about his work ethic.

[xellos88330]

In fairness, the Grizzlies perimeter defenders were overplaying the perimeter and counting on Gasol to clean up the mess. Manu made Allen look stupid several times because of it. Overall it worked because just like against Ibaka, Tony and to a lesser extent Manu would not challenge Gasol at the rim.

Gasol was amazing that series.

We had no one to contend with their bigs. McDyess was courageous but he had to give everything he got to just keep Randolph out of the paint and no one else could rebound after a good defensive possession.

And pancake, you are really dumb. Parker is not effective in an up tempo game or in transition? Just shoot yourself, please. We are more stupid for having read you.

:toast

[TDMVPDPOY]

In fairness, the Grizzlies perimeter defenders were overplaying the perimeter and counting on Gasol to clean up the mess. Manu made Allen look stupid several times because of it. Overall it worked because just like against Ibaka, Tony and to a lesser extent Manu would not challenge Gasol at the rim.

Gasol was amazing that series.

We had no one to contend with their bigs. McDyess was courageous but he had to give everything he got to just keep Randolph out of the paint and no one else could rebound after a good defensive possession.

And pancake, you are really dumb. Parker is not effective in an up tempo game or in transition? Just shoot yourself, please. We are more stupid for having read you.

still cant even win the series when we got them into foul trouble or tony allen fouling out of the games, cant help it when conley + mayo fluking shots on our backcourt...fck there bigs against our softcock bigs....where was that intensity we showed all year, none of that aggression was shown in the playoffs....

[++SaiNt TiAg0++]

nice read :)

[pancakechef]

If you have no shooters to force a defender to make a decision while running a break, where is the best opportunity to score? THE PAINT!!! If you know that the shooters are not at the top of their game, what happens? You defend THE PAINT therefore destroying the opportunity. The Spurs were using pick and roll a lot because they didn't have any other choice once the break was broken up. All the defenders were sagging into the paint because nobody could hit a consistent jumper and causing the passing lanes to narrow, and it also denied penetration forcing the Spurs to make the outside shot to beat them. The shooters weren't up to the task. PnR can be considered up tempo depending on how fast you set it up. If you want an example, look at PHX. They are widely considered up tempo, and would always use the Stoudemire/Nash PnR. Yet nobody was calling them a half court team because they were PnR dominant.

The Spurs weren't just considered up tempo, but deadly efficient. Why is that? You couldn't leave a Spur with an open shot. It was more than likely going to be 2 or 3 points if you gave them the daylight. Memphis dared the shooters to beat them, and the shooters weren't up to it, therefore destroying the Spurs tempo. On the other side of the court, every damn one of Memphis' players were knocking down jumpers. Or didn't you notice that too? How hard is it to play defense and get into transition when you can't defend all 5 positions on the court? Once again, this contributed to the Spurs' seeming lack of up-tempo basketball. Had the Spurs shooters continued shooting as they did in the regular season, the Spurs would have won that series easily as now Memphis is forced to play the Spurs game.

We had no transition game. It doesnt take OUTSIDE SHOOTING. It takes a PG with court vision to run. Parker takes it to the rim. And although the best part of his game is finishing at the rim, his selfishness is ultimately a killer because he CANNOT GET ANYONE ELSE GOING.

Thinking TP has transition game is ignorant. Just because he makes layups doesnt make him a good transition player.

STUPID

[admiralsnackbar]

What a boring troll.

[xellos88330]

We had no transition game. It doesnt take OUTSIDE SHOOTING. It takes a PG with court vision to run. Parker takes it to the rim. And although the best part of his game is finishing at the rim, his selfishness is ultimately a killer because he CANNOT GET ANYONE ELSE GOING.

Thinking TP has transition game is ignorant. Just because he makes layups doesnt make him a good transition player.

STUPID

LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL! LOL!
Wow, you are an idiot.

[Interrohater]

We had no transition game. It doesnt take OUTSIDE SHOOTING. It takes a PG with court vision to run. Parker takes it to the rim. And although the best part of his game is finishing at the rim, his selfishness is ultimately a killer because he CANNOT GET ANYONE ELSE GOING.

Thinking TP has transition game is ignorant. Just because he makes layups doesnt make him a good transition player.

STUPID
That's really dumb. I agree that TP has low court vision, but to say that he's not great in transition is asinine. If he's able to get the ball in transition and he scores, that's being good in transition because whether he scores or he hands the ball off to RJ to score, the points are the same. I'm not a huge fan of TP and I'd be okay with seeing him go for a more pass-happy PG, but you don't make sense.

I'm curious, which Spurs player(s) DO you like? You bash a large part of the organization, which players do you actually cheer for?

[EmantheSpursFan]

Abunassar: Leonard's Shooting Form Correctable

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/214483/Abunassar_Leonards_Shooting_Form_Correctable

sorry if posted, cant wait to see this guy next season! I think he's going to be used a lot by pop (tony parker style)

[pancakechef]

Hey no basketball IQ... IT TAKES MORE THAN DRIVING TO THE RIM to be considered A GOOD TRANSITION PLAYER. A GOOD TRANSITION PLAYER gets it into the open court and finds players AS WELL AS DRIVES to the lane. There were countless times tony passed up an open teammate to miss a layup and complain about no foul. Good transition means making good decisions, not just being one dimensional.

Fact is a good pg would know that to get shooters going you have to build confidence. An easy way to get a shooters confidence up is to ASSIST them with easy layup opportunities. TONY DOESNT DO THAT IN TRANSITION or in the half court game. If you dont believe that youre a retard because tony's assists come DIRECTLY off PNR situations.

Its funny that you know so little about the game. You should pay more attention to how the game is played rather than trying to "prove me wrong"

Eat up ladies

[xellos88330]

Hey no basketball IQ... IT TAKES MORE THAN DRIVING TO THE RIM to be considered A GOOD TRANSITION PLAYER. A GOOD TRANSITION PLAYER gets it into the open court and finds players AS WELL AS DRIVES to the lane. There were countless times tony passed up an open teammate to miss a layup and complain about no foul. Good transition means making good decisions, not just being one dimensional.

Fact is a good pg would know that to get shooters going you have to build confidence. An easy way to get a shooters confidence up is to ASSIST them with easy layup opportunities. TONY DOESNT DO THAT IN TRANSITION or in the half court game. If you dont believe that youre a retard because tony's assists come DIRECTLY off PNR situations.

Its funny that you know so little about the game. You should pay more attention to how the game is played rather than trying to "prove me wrong"

Eat up ladies

You know what? You are right. Parker had all of those turnovers because he was too busy missing layups and not passing to his teammates. IT MAKES PERFECT SENSE!!!




























































































Dumbass.

[xellos88330]

Abunassar: Leonard's Shooting Form Correctable

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/214483/Abunassar_Leonards_Shooting_Form_Correctable

sorry if posted, cant wait to see this guy next season! I think he's going to be used a lot by pop (tony parker style)

I am also excited about this guy. I do hope he gets playing time and doesn't ride the pine due to "corporate knowledge".

[pancakechef]

It doesnt matter about shooting technique this is one of the most overrated and asinine things to address. All that matters is it goes in a la Kevin Martin.

AND
How does commenting on TOs directly relate to missing layups. Please count the times parker lost the ball or dribbled off himself and complained about fouls..


Cant teach stupid

[jjktkk]

Cant teach stupid

True, but if you could, I think you would make a great teacher.

[Spurs Brazil]

Buck Harvey: The way Leonard can beat a lockout
Posted on June 30, 2011 at 2:28 am by Buck Harvey

The founder and president of Impact Basketball began his business with low overhead.

“It used to be me and the ball,” Joe Abunassar said.

Now his one-stop training school has dozens of employees operating in four states. So he’s busier. But Abunassar still works the gym, and he did this spring. Then, he oversaw the pre-draft training of Kawhi Leonard “every day” for two months.

Abunassar thinks Leonard showed both improvement and promise. Then again, Abunassar should say that; Leonard is a client, after all.

Keep reading: http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2011/06/30/buck-harvey-the-way-leonard-can-beat-a-lockout/

[xellos88330]

It doesnt matter about shooting technique this is one of the most overrated and asinine things to address. All that matters is it goes in a la Kevin Martin.

AND
How does commenting on TOs directly relate to missing layups. Please count the times parker lost the ball or dribbled off himself and complained about fouls..


Cant teach stupid

How about you count the times. You won't believe anything I say anyways. I know you won't count them because you don't want to be proven wrong by your own damn eyes.

You were saying earlier that Parker wasn't passing the ball. A person doesn't get that many turnovers if he wasn't trying to. To think that all of his turnovers were off of himself are delusional comments. One thing funny about all of this is your argument went from not playing up tempo, to Parker not passing the ball in transition. Now it becomes Parker being selfish and not making the right decision, to him being the only cause of his turnovers by dribbling off of himself. It wasn't just Parker turning the ball over like crazy. The whole damn team was. Which further explains my point that the passing lanes were clogged due to the Grizz loitering in them and not really worrying too much about the shooters on a late closeout.




































































Dumbass. :toast

[urunobili]

awesome writing chopper thanks a lot!

[admiralsnackbar]

Nobody is sincerely as attention-starved and diligently, systematically wrong as Herr Pancake.

Y'all be gettin' trolled.

[pancakechef]

How about you count the times. You won't believe anything I say anyways. I know you won't count them because you don't want to be proven wrong by your own damn eyes.

You were saying earlier that Parker wasn't passing the ball. A person doesn't get that many turnovers if he wasn't trying to. To think that all of his turnovers were off of himself are delusional comments. One thing funny about all of this is your argument went from not playing up tempo, to Parker not passing the ball in transition. Now it becomes Parker being selfish and not making the right decision, to him being the only cause of his turnovers by dribbling off of himself. It wasn't just Parker turning the ball over like crazy. The whole damn team was. Which further explains my point that the passing lanes were clogged due to the Grizz loitering in them and not really worrying too much about the shooters on a late closeout.




































































Dumbass. :toast

If you dont know how Parkers assists come then you are blind to the game. The argument, idiot, is that it takes more than DRIVING TO THE HOLE in transition to be considered a GOOD, transition player. Add up the fact that he doesnt pass the ball, loses the ball (off himself, stripped, uncontrolled dribble) and doesnt push effectively then HES NOT A GOOD TRANSITION PLAYER.

Good finisher, most of the time, unless there is ANY contact.

FYI if the passing lanes were "clogged" then parker would have had a 1v1 with his man in transition. A GREAT TRANSITION PLAYER would have ate that up.

ADDITIONALLY, douche, it is the PGs JOB to attack the defender and make him commit, help OR hedge. When that is done then man one pass away can cut. PARKER DOESNT DO THIS

great try though......

Owned at 2k posts... AGAIN

[xellos88330]

If you dont know how Parkers assists come then you are blind to the game. The argument, idiot, is that it takes more than DRIVING TO THE HOLE in transition to be considered a GOOD, transition player. Add up the fact that he doesnt pass the ball, loses the ball (off himself, stripped, uncontrolled dribble) and doesnt push effectively then HES NOT A GOOD TRANSITION PLAYER.

Good finisher, most of the time, unless there is ANY contact.

FYI if the passing lanes were "clogged" then parker would have had a 1v1 with his man in transition. A GREAT TRANSITION PLAYER would have ate that up.

ADDITIONALLY, douche, it is the PGs JOB to attack the defender and make him commit, help OR hedge. When that is done then man one pass away can cut. PARKER DOESNT DO THIS

great try though......

Owned at 2k posts... AGAIN

So, he will almost always get the defender to commit as his is great around the basket in transition. When he gets the ball to the shooter and the shot is missed. How the fuck is he supposed to get an assist off of a missed shot by a teammate? Another thing, how in the hell is the guy supposed to cut to a lane already clogged by defenders, retard. The shot would be just as contested as Parkers would have been.

Owned like the dumbass bitch you are. AGAIN!

We can go back and forth like this as much as you want. In the end you are only proving to all of Spurstalk that you are more of a dipshit than originally thought. So please... keep posting.



















































































DUMBASS!!! :toast

[FuzzyLumpkins]

If you dont know how Parkers assists come then you are blind to the game. The argument, idiot, is that it takes more than DRIVING TO THE HOLE in transition to be considered a GOOD, transition player. Add up the fact that he doesnt pass the ball, loses the ball (off himself, stripped, uncontrolled dribble) and doesnt push effectively then HES NOT A GOOD TRANSITION PLAYER.

Good finisher, most of the time, unless there is ANY contact.

FYI if the passing lanes were "clogged" then parker would have had a 1v1 with his man in transition. A GREAT TRANSITION PLAYER would have ate that up.

ADDITIONALLY, douche, it is the PGs JOB to attack the defender and make him commit, help OR hedge. When that is done then man one pass away can cut. PARKER DOESNT DO THIS

great try though......

Owned at 2k posts... AGAIN

Parker finishes on breaks most of the time because he is one the 5 fastest players in basketball. When you are in front of all the defenders then you take it to the hole. If he was bad about it you could call to plays where he made the wrong play or pass when he actually had someone on the wing ahead of him to pass to.

He did that plenty with Manu and RJ. Parker is one of the best finishers in the game and capitalizes on it. That does not mean he is unable to distribute.

If you were not so incredibly stupid and wanted to attack Parker you would comment on his outside shooting that went into the toilet this season and swirled around the whole way. That 18 ft jumpshot which was what made him magnificent in 2007 was gone. He showed how him making jumpers ,when they play off him and peel under screens, pays off when he dominated in OT against the Grizzlies.

He clanged jumpers the rest of the time.

You really should stop. I realize that in your little world you think you are getting somewhere but you are not. Just stop.

[Fabbs]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/archive/1/14/20091009163519!Ralph_Wiggum.png
I can use the scroll bar.

[patos]

kawhi leonard > ghill > parker so i guess the trade is good but not optimal

[pancakechef]

So, he will almost always get the defender to commit as his is great around the basket in transition. When he gets the ball to the shooter and the shot is missed. How the fuck is he supposed to get an assist off of a missed shot by a teammate? Another thing, how in the hell is the guy supposed to cut to a lane already clogged by defenders, retard. The shot would be just as contested as Parkers would have been.

Owned like the dumbass bitch you are. AGAIN!

We can go back and forth like this as much as you want. In the end you are only proving to all of Spurstalk that you are more of a dipshit than originally thought. So please... keep posting.



















































































DUMBASS!!! :toast

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Do you even understand the concept of dribble penetration?
Obviously not. Keep thinking that sebastian telfair and dejuan wagner were great PGs too!!!

IDIOT

[xellos88330]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH
Do you even understand the concept of dribble penetration?
Obviously not. Keep thinking that sebastian telfair and dejuan wagner were great PGs too!!!

IDIOT

Here, see for yourself how completely retarded you are.

http://www.82games.com/1011/10SAS1.HTM

I am certain however that you will find some stupid thing to bitch about which is going to be the same fucking thing that I have been saying all along.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

It doesnt matter about shooting technique this is one of the most overrated and asinine things to address. All that matters is it goes in a la Kevin Martin.

AND
How does commenting on TOs directly relate to missing layups. Please count the times parker lost the ball or dribbled off himself and complained about fouls..


Cant teach stupid

Please tell me you are trolling, Rockets fan. Either you are trolling, have never participated in a basketball practice in any way ever, or are monumentally stupid.

i will go with A and C?

shooting technique doesn't matter? :rollin:rollin:lmao:rollin:rollin

[pancakechef]

Please tell me you are trolling, Rockets fan. Either you are trolling, have never participated in a basketball practice in any way ever, or are monumentally stupid.

i will go with A and C?

shooting technique doesn't matter? :rollin:rollin:lmao:rollin:rollin


Sorry, Matt Boner led the league in threes this year correct? And he has perfect technique?

Pick D
I own you

[pancakechef]

Here, see for yourself how completely retarded you are.

http://www.82games.com/1011/10SAS1.HTM

I am certain however that you will find some stupid thing to bitch about which is going to be the same fucking thing that I have been saying all along.


Interesting stat that he HAD 80+ bad pass TOs and 80+ HANDLING TOS

haahahahahahah

Laughs on you buddy

[ChumpDumper]

Interesting stat that he HAD 80+ bad pass TOs and 80+ HANDLING TOS

haahahahahahah

Laughs on you buddyAre those figures high?

Does any good point guard have higher figures for those stats?

[pancakechef]

Not in terms of what "good" pgs do for their team, the pace they run, the tempo they play, etc.

[ChumpDumper]

Not in terms of what "good" pgs do for their team, the pace they run, the tempo they play, etc.Then you're saying those stats don't mean anything unless you say they do.

Convenient.

[Bill_Brasky]

OK pancake has moved the goal posts too many times to count in this thread....can we move on?

[pancakechef]

Then you're saying those stats don't mean anything unless you say they do.

Convenient.

Doesnt take a genius to figure out that trying to compare players that you have to take into account SYSTEM.

Moving goal posts? Im only trying to keep up with the circular argument from your peers.

Take into consideration Tony, who shares PG time with Manu, and has a TON of mishandling TOs. Then you take a guy like Nash who has the ball in his HANDS CONSTANTLY with minimal TOs from poor handling skills. Now obviously Nash is a better dribbler/ball handler in general. If you took nash and threw him into our system his TOs would decrease. Throw parker into the suns mix and you would really see some ugly basketball.

The idea that all of our players are great and our system is perfect is INSANE. You guys dont know anything about playing the game and its obvious you have minimal experience because you cant understand how to visualize players in different situations and systems. I would be willing to bet 1 million dollars that a majority of you never saw manu play overseas and thought POP struck gold by taking a "chance" on him.

This isnt changing goal posts, its trying to explain to the fools on this board in simplest terms how basketball is observed and played.

Like the D bag talking about clogged lanes, well the lanes are always clogged when you run a pick and roll. Parker is good at that its no different on trying to get someone to turn their body or beat them at an angle in transition.

[Brazil]

we really need a troll detector ! why bothering answering to a pancakechef troll ?

[ChumpDumper]

Doesnt take a genius to figure out that trying to compare players that you have to take into account SYSTEM.

Moving goal posts? Im only trying to keep up with the circular argument from your peers.

Take into consideration Tony, who shares PG time with Manu, and has a TON of mishandling TOs. Then you take a guy like Nash who has the ball in his HANDS CONSTANTLY with minimal TOs from poor handling skills. Now obviously Nash is a better dribbler/ball handler in general. If you took nash and threw him into our system his TOs would decrease. Throw parker into the suns mix and you would really see some ugly basketball.

The idea that all of our players are great and our system is perfect is INSANE. You guys dont know anything about playing the game and its obvious you have minimal experience because you cant understand how to visualize players in different situations and systems. I would be willing to bet 1 million dollars that a majority of you never saw manu play overseas and thought POP struck gold by taking a "chance" on him.

This isnt changing goal posts, its trying to explain to the fools on this board in simplest terms how basketball is observed and played.

Like the D bag talking about clogged lanes, well the lanes are always clogged when you run a pick and roll. Parker is good at that its no different on trying to get someone to turn their body or beat them at an angle in transition.As I said, stats only mean something when you say they do. You will make excuses if the stats look bad for a player you like and downplay them when it makes a player you don't like look good.

Convenient.

How nice for you.

[xellos88330]

Interesting stat that he HAD 80+ bad pass TOs and 80+ HANDLING TOS

haahahahahahah

Laughs on you buddy

Chris paul had 100+ bad pass turnovers, and 50+ handling turnovers. Rougly translating to around 20 fewer turnovers than Parker during the ENTIRE 82 game season.

http://www.82games.com/1011/10NOH1.HTM

So by your logic, Chris Paul is a terrible PG who can't pass and turns the ball over in transition. After all, he is not as good as Parker is at scoring around the basket, and cannot find his teammates cutting to the basket.

Now... disappear.

[xellos88330]

we really need a troll detector ! why bothering answering to a pancakechef troll ?

I think that I am the one trolling him now TBH. :lol

[Vic Petro]

If you are in SoCal, Kawhi Leonard is doing a radio interview at 3:15pm Pacific on 1090am

xxsportsradio.com

[pancakechef]

As I said, stats only mean something when you say they do. You will make excuses if the stats look bad for a player you like and downplay them when it makes a player you don't like look good.

Convenient.

How nice for you.


Then prove me wrong Richard Jefferson. When he was in a SYSTEM opposite of ours he flourished, when he was IN OUR sytem he sucks why??? WOW

Take the steve nash example (who handles the ball more than tony and aggressively advances the ball AND has less handling issues and more APG) how many LESS TOs would he have on our team. How many MORE assists would he have on our team.

Its funny that you "think" you have great knowledge but tiptoe around every point that is made.

Great assessment though.

[pancakechef]

Chris paul had 100+ bad pass turnovers, and 50+ handling turnovers (less than Parker). Rougly translating to around 20 fewer turnovers than Parker during the ENTIRE 82 game season.

http://www.82games.com/1011/10NOH1.HTM

So by your logic, Chris Paul is a terrible PG who can't pass and turns the ball over in transition. After all, he is not as good as Parker is at scoring around the basket, and cannot find his teammates cutting to the basket.

Now... disappear.


Ironically enough you thought you proved a point. You did, mine... Idiot

So your point was Chris Paul handles the ball more than parker and turns it over less than parker in a higher paced system than ours?

odd.

And wasnt your original point that Parker DIDNT have many handling issues.

[xellos88330]

Ironically enough you thought you proved a point. You did, mine... Idiot

So your point was Chris Paul handles the ball more than parker and turns it over less than parker in a higher paced system than ours?

odd.

And wasnt your original point that Parker DIDNT have many handling issues.

My point was his aggressiveness towards the basket. Not his turnovers. You were the one talking about the turnovers and mishandles. I was talking about his ability to score in transition. A turnover is a turnover is a turnover. No matter if it is bounced off your leg or not, it is still a turnover. Chris Paul has about the same amount as Parker. So therefore, Chris Paul is a terrible point guard and can't do anything in transition. It is pretty shitty since he is the best player on that team. Chris Paul has no business being the number one option on the Hornets because the ball is in his hands all the time and all he does is turn the ball over.

Great fucking assessment.

Next.

[pancakechef]

My point was his aggressiveness towards the basket. Not his turnovers. You were the one talking about the turnovers and mishandles AGRESSIVENESS TOWARDS THE BASKET DOESNT = GREAT TRANSITION PLAYER.

I was talking about his ability to score in transition (which I said in the first post he was good at but it doesnt make him a great transition player).

A turnover is a turnover is a turnover (NOT TRUE). No matter if it is bounced off your leg or not, it is still a turnover.

Chris Paul has about HILARIOUS the same amount as Parker. So therefore, Chris Paul is a terrible point guard and can't do anything in transition. It is pretty shitty since he is the best player on that team. Chris Paul has no business being the number one option on the Hornets because the ball is in his hands all the time and all he does is turn the ball over.

Great fucking assessment.

Next.

Again, if you had reading comprehension skills you would have a better life and a better job. I cant even try to debate you because nothing you say relates to anything. You just mindlessly type.

This was your own stupid comment:
If you have no shooters to force a defender to make a decision while running a break, where is the best opportunity to score

This is where GOOD transition players, ESPECIALLY PGS, come into play. THEY ATTACK THE DEFENDER TO MAKE HIM "commit, help, or hedge" BY ATTACKING. BY ATTACKING THEM. BY ATTACKING THEM.

As the man with the ball dictates the most defensive pressure
STOP BALL STOP BALL STOP BALL STOP BALL
If good enough to think AHEAD OF THE PLAY (Nash, WIlliams, Paul, Rondo, etc) will make man commit and open up this defenders man for an open shot OR AN OPEN LANE to cut to basket.

Again, I know its hard to grasp. And unfortunately you have never been a pg, watched a good pg, played with a good pg, or even played the game period if you cannot understand this concept.

[ivanfromwestwood]

hey assholes. why dont you guys get a room. this is a Kawhi Leonard thread. find a Parker thread and post this shit.

[pancakechef]

We can switch this right back to topic:

Doesnt matter that we drafted him at 7
1. Pop wont play him
2. He would surely have to be PERFECT on D to break even considering we will be playing 4 v 5 on offense cause he cant create and has no pg to get him good looks
3. LOCKOUT

[Bill_Brasky]

4. Pancakechef licks balls.

[pancakechef]

Theres only one man in my life: Pillsbury

[xellos88330]

Again, if you had reading comprehension skills you would have a better life and a better job. I cant even try to debate you because nothing you say relates to anything. You just mindlessly type.

This was your own stupid comment:
If you have no shooters to force a defender to make a decision while running a break, where is the best opportunity to score

This is where GOOD transition players, ESPECIALLY PGS, come into play. THEY ATTACK THE DEFENDER TO MAKE HIM "commit, help, or hedge" BY ATTACKING. BY ATTACKING THEM. BY ATTACKING THEM.

As the man with the ball dictates the most defensive pressure
STOP BALL STOP BALL STOP BALL STOP BALL
If good enough to think AHEAD OF THE PLAY (Nash, WIlliams, Paul, Rondo, etc) will make man commit and open up this defenders man for an open shot OR AN OPEN LANE to cut to basket.

Again, I know its hard to grasp. And unfortunately you have never been a pg, watched a good pg, played with a good pg, or even played the game period if you cannot understand this concept.

So Parker never attacks the basket? :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

So you played basketball? You must have been a shitty player. You have no idea what a PG is supposed to do. You seem to completely disregard talent and make the game one of robotic precision. You cannot grasp the human element at all. You are so concerned with one player and forgetting that there are 9 more players on the court. Way to go Mr. PG. You failed. You also seem to think that if you penetrate automatically the defender is going to come out at you, you forget the trailers and pretty much everyone else on the court.

Here is an example. Let us say that you are a talented basketball PG. Highly unlikely because your complete denseness is mind-boggling. But for shits and giggles, you are. You are running in transition on a 2 on 2 break. You are really good at completing 3 point plays in the paint and are basically known for having that ability. You also seem to draw fouls consistently when you attack the basket and are a decent free throw shooter. The other teammate you are with is earning their brick laying degree. The first defender commits and the second defender cuts off the cutter by venturing into the passing lane. What do you do?

[ChumpDumper]

So Parker never attacks the basket? This.

[monkeypunk]

hey assholes. Why dont you guys get a room. This is a kawhi leonard thread. Find a parker thread and post this shit.

+100000000

[pancakechef]

So Parker never attacks the basket? :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

So you played basketball? You must have been a shitty player. You have no idea what a PG is supposed to do. You seem to completely disregard talent and make the game one of robotic precision. You cannot grasp the human element at all. You are so concerned with one player and forgetting that there are 9 more players on the court. Way to go Mr. PG. You failed. You also seem to think that if you penetrate automatically the defender is going to come out at you, you forget the trailers and pretty much everyone else on the court.

Here is an example. Let us say that you are a talented basketball PG. Highly unlikely because your complete denseness is mind-boggling. But for shits and giggles, you are. You are running in transition on a 2 on 2 break. You are really good at completing 3 point plays in the paint and are basically known for having that ability. You also seem to draw fouls consistently when you attack the basket and are a decent free throw shooter. The other teammate you are with is earning their brick laying degree. The first defender commits and the second defender cuts off the cutter by venturing into the passing lane. What do you do?

PLEASE READ MY FIRST POST. I said that he was good at one thing. FINISHING. Which doesnt make him GREAT or EVEN GOOD IN TRANSITION.

Then I claimed that he had more dribbling TOs than passing. He doesnt but its EXTREMELY CLOSE and more than most PGs in the league. SOMETHING YOU SCOFFED AT.

Wrong Again dipshit. I claimed that GOOD PGs CAN MANIPULATE ANY DEFENDER INTO stopping them. That son, is a fact.

Drawing fouls is your only good point in this argument. Yes that is important. But Parker has the awesome feature of getting tick tacked lately, missing, and NOT DRAWING THE FOUL. Which I stated in a previous post. AGAIN, you have to be aware of what you are doing as the PG. If I needed to get my shooters going, I WOULDNT LOOK JUST TO SCORE OR GET FOULED. I WOULD LOOK TO GET THEM EASY BASKETS.

YOU DO what any PG would do. What any good QB WOULD DO. What steve nash or any pg with vision would do: you throw it where the cutter WILL be. Again this goes right back to my previous post when I said that tony cant "think ahead"

The lane doesnt get "clogged" the defender either is on the top side or the bottom side of the play. You saying that is probably the most ignorant thing I have ever heard. ESPECIALLY when YA BOY runs the PNR all day long. SAME CONCEPT. How does he find Duncan rolling???? Well Duncan sees where the defender will be and makes himself available at the other side (top/bottom) and parker throws it where duncan will be away from defender.

We all know what parker does in transition. He takes it to the hole and sometimes he scores, some times he gets fouled, and other times he bricks, and bitches about the foul. All the while we are struggling as a team with scoring, as in the playoffs. Thats his skill. Which was an asset when we had the most dominant big in the league. Now we dont and we need Parker to be a TEAM player because hes successfully shown he cant score ENOUGH when it matters to make us win.

Irony strikes again. Parker's robotic precision of being unable to involve more players into a scoring role and taking it to the rack is really what kills the team

[xellos88330]

YOU DO what any PG would do. What any good QB WOULD DO. What steve nash or any pg with vision would do: you throw it where the cutter WILL be. Again this goes right back to my previous post when I said that tony cant "think ahead"

You fail miserably. The correct answer is to evaluate the damn defense. Great PG skills there mate. The point guard is meant to evaluate and guide the team to break down an oppositions defense to create easy opportunities for either your team, or yourself. You never once asked, "How big is the guy defending the paint? How big is the guy cutting off the passing lane? Are the defenders athletic? Am, I fast enough to get to the basket without being contested? Is my cutter able to recognize the passing lane is closed and to move into a different position? Will the defender follow? Are they shot blockers? Is my defender a shot blocker? What are his tendencies in defending a penetrating guard? What are the tendencies of the 2nd defender? Do I have enough time to reposition the defenders to get off a good pass before the other 3 defenders show up?

Once again, the human element. No defense is the same. A defender can make different choices throughout the course of a game from one play to the next. You are completely wrong and should watch a sport more akin to your brain power. Special Olympics maybe? I will cheer for you. Until then, RUN FORREST RUN!!!

Tony Parker really kills the team. I wish he were more like CP3. That whole .4 of a percent in win percentage is just unacceptable. He really needs to stop doing what he is doing because he loses a whole .4 of a percent that a team needs to win. Dumbass.




For all you other Spurstalkers, Kawhi Leonard will hopefully be what the Spurs have needed at the 3. Anyone know if he has any plans on working with someone outside the NBA on his jumper?

[pancakechef]

You fail miserably. The correct answer is to evaluate the damn defense. Great PG skills there mate. The point guard is meant to evaluate and guide the team to break down an oppositions defense to create easy opportunities for either your team, or yourself. You never once asked, "How big is the guy defending the paint? How big is the guy cutting off the passing lane? Are the defenders athletic? Am, I fast enough to get to the basket without being contested? Is my cutter able to recognize the passing lane is closed and to move into a different position? Will the defender follow? Are they shot blockers? Is my defender a shot blocker? What are his tendencies in defending a penetrating guard? What are the tendencies of the 2nd defender? Do I have enough time to reposition the defenders to get off a good pass before the other 3 defenders show up?

Once again, the human element. No defense is the same. A defender can make different choices throughout the course of a game from one play to the next. You are completely wrong and should watch a sport more akin to your brain power. Special Olympics maybe? I will cheer for you. Until then, RUN FORREST RUN!!!

Tony Parker really kills the team. I wish he were more like CP3. That whole .4 of a percent in win percentage is just unacceptable. He really needs to stop doing what he is doing because he loses a whole .4 of a percent that a team needs to win. Dumbass.




For all you other Spurstalkers, Kawhi Leonard will hopefully be what the Spurs have needed at the 3. Anyone know if he has any plans on working with someone outside the NBA on his jumper?

You are clueless of the basic concepts of passing or running the floor. It doesnt matter any of the stupid questions you asked. First of all, these guys are pros, if they cant cut, catch, and finish they should be shot. Second IT DOESNT MATTER HOW THE DEFENSE PLAYS YOU WHEN BUSTING A CUTTER or HELPING. They have to commit to one side, you throw it to where the cutter WILL BE.

Whatever "move" the defense makes is the WRONG one. So those arent my shitty PG skills that cant get it done, its ya boy Parkers.

You're right man, NO keeps begging us to do the Parker for Paul swap and we keep turning them down. You do know what was offered for Parker right... Sacramento Junk....

Owned again.

[TJastal]

I thought the poodle stepped it up a notch as far as passing the ball this year, esp early on in the year. Still would like to see more, and ESPECIALLY on the fast break instead of always trying to force contact with the 1st defender he sees to get to the line.

It's always hit or miss when he does that, and he rarely ever makes the layup anymore if he's fouled (hardly ever gets the AND-1 anymore) and to top it off he's no Steve Nash at the free throw line either.

All in all, I'd have to side with pancakechef about TP's "transition" game needing improvement. Needs to see the floor better & realize the odds rest more with finding a cutter for a layup or dunk rather than him shooting 2 free throws or throwing up an ugly shot while yelling his standard "Hey!" then sitting on the floor pouting when there's no love from the officials.

[xellos88330]

You are clueless of the basic concepts of passing or running the floor. It doesnt matter any of the stupid questions you asked. First of all, these guys are pros, if they cant cut, catch, and finish they should be shot. Second IT DOESNT MATTER HOW THE DEFENSE PLAYS YOU WHEN BUSTING A CUTTER or HELPING. They have to commit to one side, you throw it to where the cutter WILL BE.

Whatever "move" the defense makes is the WRONG one. So those arent my shitty PG skills that cant get it done, its ya boy Parkers.

You're right man, NO keeps begging us to do the Parker for Paul swap and we keep turning them down. You do know what was offered for Parker right... Sacramento Junk....

Owned again.

So you admit to having no point guard skills, no concept of what it is to be a point, and keep referring to a cutter which is stated in the scenario as being defended. Do you still forget about that guy? I am done with you. Like a good toy, it gets boring after you see all the things it can do.

Hope you enjoyed getting schooled son. I know I did. :toast

[Thompson]

Don't know if this has been posted already, but it has a few more Leonard highlights. Not a whole lot there, but a few good steals and a nice block.

rs4pf-h5EzU&feature=channel_video_title

[Vic Petro]

"There's no question that Kawhi's legacy will live long after today with his leaving San Diego State," coach Steve Fisher told reporters. "It's already done that, the ripple effect when Kawhi's name is mentioned.

http://es.pn/jsgHUQ

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Sorry, Matt Boner led the league in threes this year correct? And he has perfect technique?

Pick D
I own you

And Bonner's release is low and takes forever to get off. Notice how well he performed against athletic defenders that could close the gap quickly like Memphis? Gary Neal gets those shots off because of his technique.

There are otehr forms that will work as evidenced by guys like Shawn Marion and Bonner. that does not mean that traditional technique does not have a huge success rate.

[Vic Petro]

“He’s going to be a regular in the NBA; how soon I don’t know,” Fisher said. “Most of the guys I’ve talked with, the scouts that came in, they said, ‘We’re not as worried about his shot as you might think. If he’s a professional — if he’s as committed as you say he is — the shot will get better; that he will cultivate his shot.’

Nice article

http://bit.ly/jtmo67

[Kindergarten Cop]

Founder and president of Impact Basketball Joe Abunassar thinks Kawhi Leonard’s jumpshot is a simple fix.

He says the ball rotation and footwork is fine. In drills, he tried to shorten his stroke and get the basketball on his fingertips and out of his huge hands.

It’s likely something the Spurs tweaked this week, too. Abunassar thinks it’s easily correctable when Leonard returns to work with him in a few weeks.

“It’s just a repetition thing,” Abunassar said.

But repetition isn’t always fun. Leonard turned 20 on Wednesday. How many guys that age, finally free of school and with some money, really want to spend summer sweating in a gym?

Leonard appears to be one. “If his workout was scheduled for 9 a.m.,” Abunassar said, “then he was in at 7:45 a.m.”

Sometimes he stayed until 11:30 p.m. Sometimes they had to tell him he had to leave.

“Kawhi is one of the most focused and serious,” Abunassar said, “I’ve ever had.”
Via Buck Harvey/San Antonio Express-News

Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/214483/Abunassar_Leonards_Shooting_Form_Correctable#ixzz1 QzGtntxP

[benefactor]

Nice. Work hard, young man. Work hard.

[Cessation]

"Sometimes they had to tell him he had to leave." (out of the gym) Thats not a bad sign, tbh.

[Brazil]

I think that I am the one trolling him now TBH. :lol

well then you're trolling a troll

[xellos88330]

well then you're trolling a troll

:lol

[Bill_Brasky]

Sounds like the guy has a lot of good Spur qualities. Keep it up bro :tu

[Solid D]

Ironically enough you thought you proved a point. You did, mine... Idiot

So your point was Chris Paul handles the ball more than parker and turns it over less than parker in a higher paced system than ours?

odd.

The Hornets ranked 29th of 30 teams in Pace (# of possessions per 48 minutes) at 88.7. The Spurs ranked 14th at 92.3 poss/48min.

[TDMVPDPOY]

i thought chipp was working on him to improve his shot? or trainers not allowed due to cba?

[Cessation]

The Hornets ranked 29th of 30 teams in Pace (# of possessions per 48 minutes) at 88.7. The Spurs ranked 14th at 92.3 poss/48min.

You owned that guy.

[Hooks]

I watched a regular season game against BYU, and the two games vs. UConn and Temple.

Here are my thoughts even though it was a small sample:

Kawhi is a very good passer he's got GREAT court vision for a SF I was really impressed, and a great rebounder as well. He can also handle to ball very well and create his own shot, there wasn't anybody that could guard him, he got to the basket at will. But what hurt him the most was his ability to knock down a damn shot lol, he is a REALLY bad shooter, there were sooo many times where he'd drive it in, get within 5 feet of the basket and miss an easy shot. He can post up as well, but of course his shooting is so bad he bricks everything.

His defense? I can't really say. It was REALLY odd that almost NOBODY he guarded tried to score on him, nobody tried to drive it in on him or anything. The only guys that did were Jimmer (he scored like twice on him) and Moore from Temple (he drove it in once on him). Example, in the UConn game Leonard was guarding Jeremy Lamb the entire game. Lamb went for 24 points on 9/11 shooting in that game. How many points did he score on Leonard? Just 4, from two fouls committed by Leonard, every time Lamb received the ball he gave it up when guarded by Leonard. The rest he scored on Leonard's backup. Same shit happened in the BYU game and Temple game. I was pretty disappointed, I didn't get to see his lateral speed/contesting shots, etc. It was weird as hell.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

So far so good.

[Brazil]

So far so good.

u called it Ed
Spurs have found their long 3

[capek]

:tu

[Splits]

Nice bump.

Even better initial analysis. I remember reading this when you first posted it thinking, "damn I hope that guy knows what he is talking about". And you did.

[DarrinS]

Good call

[Raven]

Great take.

[moisaenz]

I watched a regular season game against BYU, and the two games vs. UConn and Temple.

Here are my thoughts even though it was a small sample:

Kawhi is a very good passer he's got GREAT court vision for a SF I was really impressed, and a great rebounder as well. He can also handle to ball very well and create his own shot, there wasn't anybody that could guard him, he got to the basket at will. But what hurt him the most was his ability to knock down a damn shot lol, he is a REALLY bad shooter, there were sooo many times where he'd drive it in, get within 5 feet of the basket and miss an easy shot. He can post up as well, but of course his shooting is so bad he bricks everything.

His defense? I can't really say. It was REALLY odd that almost NOBODY he guarded tried to score on him, nobody tried to drive it in on him or anything. The only guys that did were Jimmer (he scored like twice on him) and Moore from Temple (he drove it in once on him). Example, in the UConn game Leonard was guarding Jeremy Lamb the entire game. Lamb went for 24 points on 9/11 shooting in that game. How many points did he score on Leonard? Just 4, from two fouls committed by Leonard, every time Lamb received the ball he gave it up when guarded by Leonard. The rest he scored on Leonard's backup. Same shit happened in the BYU game and Temple game. I was pretty disappointed, I didn't get to see his lateral speed/contesting shots, etc. It was weird as hell.
haha ppl scared of Leonard's defense

[DPG21920]

Man, Kawhi has been so awesome. He has blown away my expectations. I was naturally apprehensive at how good he could be with regards to helping a contending team, but wow has his growth been spectacular.

We all knew he could rebound, but the wide array of offensive abilities (3 ball, improved handles, finishing with both hands at the rim, mid-range pull up and ability to post up and score) has just jumped of the charts to me. It's scary to think where the Spurs would be if Kawhi would have been picked by another team one or two spots ahead of 15. It's really hard to remember a player this young having this sort of an impact on a title contender.

Love Kawhi.

[Budkin]

Helicopter dropping the goods.

[RodNIc91]

EHJ with the goods. You were spot on!

[lefty]

EHJ :worthy:

[phxspurfan]

Chopp-stradamus with the goods.

[milkyway21]

But repetition isn’t always fun. Leonard turned 20 on Wednesday. How many guys that age, finally free of school and with some money, really want to spend summer sweating in a gym?

Leonard appears to be one. “If his workout was scheduled for 9 a.m.,” Abunassar said, “then he was in at 7:45 a.m.”

Sometimes he stayed until 11:30 p.m. Sometimes they had to tell him he had to leave.

Duncaholic, I mean workaholic? :lol like it :tu

[siraulo23]

:tu

props for calling it when he hadnt even touch a basketball as a spur

[mrjap2x]

Anyone remember watching him together with RJ during his rookie season? How did he fare as a SG.

[ducks]

dude worked on his handles he played point this summer league ball

[ducks]

he also said he is not sure he is going to usa camp his main goal is to get his knee healthy this summer

[siraulo23]

he also said he is not sure he is going to usa camp his main goal is to get his knee healthy this summer

quote?

[KL2]

he also said he is not sure he is going to usa camp his main goal is to get his knee healthy this summer


Thats disappointing, he could learn a lot there, but health comes first. He needs to be off of his knee at least 1-2 months for his type of injury to heal.

[apalisoc_9]

Thanks for the write up. The only reason I'm not sold on everything is because RJ is still on the roster. If they can move RJ, I have high expectations of the kid. Not that I expect some 19 year old to come in and turn a fringe contender into a legit one; that would be unreasonable.

I have high expectations because of what the Spurs did and how they don't miss when they do things like this. Many things happen along the way sometimes that dictate how a player performs, but the Spurs are banking on him somewhat from a talent perspective.

If you move RJ, and replace him with a true defensive, rebounding 3, I have no doubt that while the overall talent may dip, the team will be more balanced and better off.

fast forward a few months and he turned the spurs into a contender.

Fast forward a year and they play in the finals

fast forward two years and he wins FMVP

[wildchild]

Nice bump.


I watched a regular season game against BYU, and the two games vs. UConn and Temple.

Here are my thoughts even though it was a small sample:

Kawhi is a very good passer he's got GREAT court vision for a SF I was really impressed...

This season we can see it, too. Good take.

[cjw]

Totally hit the nail on the head. Rebounding, defensive stud, work ethic and improved shot.

[FkLA]

I've seen Kawhi Leonard play a lot of games in his two seasons at San Diego State. I have a subscription to The Mountain West channel; have watched SDSU play in person or on television probably twenty times the past two years. I may have a little better basis than most when it comes to making an assessment of his potential. Here are my general observations of his game and my opinion of how he'll impact the Spurs:

I was actually a little surprised initially to see how highly Kawhi was being rated by Chad Ford and some other draft analysts. I thought 5 to 7 was too high. The only reason I say that is that Kawhi was pretty limited offensively in college. His college scoring was due in large part to his genetics and his hustle. Kawhi's form on his shot was something I doubted could be translated consistently to an NBA game. Watching him during the college season, though, I still figured he'd be a late first round pick because he’s definitely one of those guys with NBA level talent. But when I saw how limited this year’s draft talent was, I realized a guy with Leonard’s potential was certainly lottery level compared to the competition. There’s no doubt he’ll contribute. He’s not a project-type player that the Spurs will have to stash away. He’ll come in and produce at a high level his rookie year.

When I saw Kawhi fall to the Pacers I had flashbacks to their drafting Danny Granger a few years ago. I know the Pacers scout the west a little better than some NBA teams, and I figured they recognized Leonard’s potential, similar to how they understood that Granger would be an impact player in this league. He and Danny have completely different skill sets, so you can’t compare the two, but I thought what the Pacers had done was pull off another draft day steal. When I saw that they actually had traded that pick to San Antonio I was pretty excited for my Spurs.

Kawhi Leonard could be the best rebounding 3 in the league if given the minutes. And he’s definitely quick enough and long enough to guard any 3, and a lot of the 4s in the NBA. His body is too slight, I think, to man the post against the beefier 4s out there, but no one will out-length him which is a nice change for this team. What Kawhi brings to the table is tremendous hustle. He’s amazingly athletic, and so I was shocked at his poor combine stats – a fluke is all I can surmise. He’s going to bring back a defensive intensity to this team not seen since the days of Bowen. I’m not sure he’ll ever have Bowen’s ability to guard 4 different positions, but if he can guard all of the small forwards that have been murdering the Spurs the last few years that may be enough. I think we’ll see him guard most of the better 2s, 3s and some of the better scoring 4s, that this team faces.

As for the shooting weaknesses, I know he’s been working hard on his shot mechanics. He’s completely changed his release point, his shooting motion, and the way he holds the basketball. Give him some time with Chip and I think we’ll see a guy capable of doing a reasonable job shooting the rock. I wouldn’t expect him to be a double figure scorer this season, but if Pop will trust the rookie, I could see him seriously displacing many of RJ's minutes next season. At this point he doesn’t have the ability to create his own shot, but that may come with time.

Kawhi’s greatest asset is his work ethic. He’s going to inject a certain energy level onto the defense that I think will be contagious. What he’ll have to work on is his shooting, his ball-handling, and his lateral movement on defense. But he’s not going to be satisfied with being average. He’s one of those guys that’s a winner, plain and simple. Some people have that gift and bring it to the table. Guys like Bowen, Mario Elie, Gary Neal. Guys who make their team better. I think that’s what the Spurs saw. Some players have that knack and desire, and you can just see it in how they play…losing is personal to them. I’d expect Kawhi Leonard to live in the workout facility, he’ll work to eliminate his weaknesses, and he’ll be a much better-rounded player in the NBA than he ever was in college. People will need to remember that he’s not even 21, and so he’ll need a little time, but fans will also be pleasantly surprised by his learning curve I think. He’ll probably average 4 and 3 his first couple of months in the league, the doubters and George Hill lovers will be screaming about him being a wasted pick, but then you’ll see him start to click. I don’t think I’d expect him to be a double-figure scorer as a rookie, but he’ll definitely contribute, and I think we’ll see him getting starter minutes by the playoffs. He’ll be our team’s primary defensive specialist by season’s end.

The Spurs have finally found their long 3.

:worthy:

[apalisoc_9]

I've seen Kawhi Leonard play a lot of games in his two seasons at San Diego State. I have a subscription to The Mountain West channel; have watched SDSU play in person or on television probably twenty times the past two years. I may have a little better basis than most when it comes to making an assessment of his potential. Here are my general observations of his game and my opinion of how he'll impact the Spurs:

I was actually a little surprised initially to see how highly Kawhi was being rated by Chad Ford and some other draft analysts. I thought 5 to 7 was too high. The only reason I say that is that Kawhi was pretty limited offensively in college. His college scoring was due in large part to his genetics and his hustle. Kawhi's form on his shot was something I doubted could be translated consistently to an NBA game. Watching him during the college season, though, I still figured he'd be a late first round pick because he’s definitely one of those guys with NBA level talent. But when I saw how limited this year’s draft talent was, I realized a guy with Leonard’s potential was certainly lottery level compared to the competition. There’s no doubt he’ll contribute. He’s not a project-type player that the Spurs will have to stash away. He’ll come in and produce at a high level his rookie year.

When I saw Kawhi fall to the Pacers I had flashbacks to their drafting Danny Granger a few years ago. I know the Pacers scout the west a little better than some NBA teams, and I figured they recognized Leonard’s potential, similar to how they understood that Granger would be an impact player in this league. He and Danny have completely different skill sets, so you can’t compare the two, but I thought what the Pacers had done was pull off another draft day steal. When I saw that they actually had traded that pick to San Antonio I was pretty excited for my Spurs.

Kawhi Leonard could be the best rebounding 3 in the league if given the minutes. And he’s definitely quick enough and long enough to guard any 3, and a lot of the 4s in the NBA. His body is too slight, I think, to man the post against the beefier 4s out there, but no one will out-length him which is a nice change for this team. What Kawhi brings to the table is tremendous hustle. He’s amazingly athletic, and so I was shocked at his poor combine stats – a fluke is all I can surmise. He’s going to bring back a defensive intensity to this team not seen since the days of Bowen. I’m not sure he’ll ever have Bowen’s ability to guard 4 different positions, but if he can guard all of the small forwards that have been murdering the Spurs the last few years that may be enough. I think we’ll see him guard most of the better 2s, 3s and some of the better scoring 4s, that this team faces.

As for the shooting weaknesses, I know he’s been working hard on his shot mechanics. He’s completely changed his release point, his shooting motion, and the way he holds the basketball. Give him some time with Chip and I think we’ll see a guy capable of doing a reasonable job shooting the rock. I wouldn’t expect him to be a double figure scorer this season, but if Pop will trust the rookie, I could see him seriously displacing many of RJ's minutes next season. At this point he doesn’t have the ability to create his own shot, but that may come with time.

Kawhi’s greatest asset is his work ethic. He’s going to inject a certain energy level onto the defense that I think will be contagious. What he’ll have to work on is his shooting, his ball-handling, and his lateral movement on defense. But he’s not going to be satisfied with being average. He’s one of those guys that’s a winner, plain and simple. Some people have that gift and bring it to the table. Guys like Bowen, Mario Elie, Gary Neal. Guys who make their team better. I think that’s what the Spurs saw. Some players have that knack and desire, and you can just see it in how they play…losing is personal to them. I’d expect Kawhi Leonard to live in the workout facility, he’ll work to eliminate his weaknesses, and he’ll be a much better-rounded player in the NBA than he ever was in college. People will need to remember that he’s not even 21, and so he’ll need a little time, but fans will also be pleasantly surprised by his learning curve I think. He’ll probably average 4 and 3 his first couple of months in the league, the doubters and George Hill lovers will be screaming about him being a wasted pick, but then you’ll see him start to click. I don’t think I’d expect him to be a double-figure scorer as a rookie, but he’ll definitely contribute, and I think we’ll see him getting starter minutes by the playoffs. He’ll be our team’s primary defensive specialist by season’s end.

The Spurs have finally found their long 3.

spot on

[Ice009]

Unbelievably great take, Ed Helicopter Jones. Your player evaluation was/is great.

[DarrinS]

OP was quite prophetic with this thread.

[jmard5]

Yeah, very good take. Prophetic!

[Agloco]

Good takes are an expectation with the old cadre of ST members. Chopper is no exception. This is in stark contrast to the trash that has infiltrated the boards over the past 2-3 years.

The old schoolers need to come back in force and dispense knowledge bombs. Only then will the cesspools tide recede.

[vander]

Well, other than putting Gary Neal in a category with Bowen. Ed had obviously visited the future