In Congress, July 4th, 1776

[Wild Cobra]

The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America,

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.--Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

He has refused his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.
He has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.
He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.
He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.
He has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.
He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected; whereby the Legislative powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the mean time exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.
He has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.
He has obstructed the Administration of Justice, by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary powers.
He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone, for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.
He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harrass our people, and eat out their substance.
He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures.
He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil power.
He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:
For Quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:
For protecting them, by a mock Trial, from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:
For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world:
For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:
For depriving us in many cases, of the benefits of Trial by Jury:
For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences
For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies:
For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws, and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments:
For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.
He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.
He has plundered our seas, ravaged our Coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.
He is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.
He has constrained our fellow Citizens taken Captive on the high Seas to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands.
He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages, whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.

In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.

Nor have We been wanting in attentions to our Brittish brethren. We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred to disavow these usurpations, which, would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends.

We, therefore, the Representatives of the united States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the Name, and by Authority of the good People of these Colonies, solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States; that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the State of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent States, they have full Power to levy War, conclude Peace, contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent States may of right do. And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.

Click on image:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/07/Us_declaration_independence.jpg/505px-Us_declaration_independence.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/07/Us_declaration_independence.jpg)

[Wild Cobra]

Too bad most people have lost the desire to keep this nation free of tyranny. Too many people want an ever expanding government to take over our lives. The 4th seems to be nothing more to most than a day to have off from work, and party.

[boutons_deux]

corporate shills and liars for corporations like you are the problem, NOT the govt.

The power of corporations and capitalists were already seen to be threat to the country at its founding, by the founders:

The New War of Independence - Against Corporate Politics

... unfulfilled desire to "crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country."

-- Thomas Jefferson

http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/151506

===

Govt has many problems, but the overriding problems, and the impediments to their solutions, are created and sustained by coporpate/capitalist money.

America is fucked into permanent decline, and there's no unfucking it.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Too bad most people have lost the desire to keep this nation free of tyranny. Too many people want an ever expanding government to take over our lives. The 4th seems to be nothing more to most than a day to have off from work, and party.
Or a day to promote your political agenda on a message board

[boutons_deux]

In the long list of “abuses and usurpations” the Declaration documents, taxes don’t come up until the 17th item, and that item is neither a complaint about tax rates nor an objection to the idea of taxation. Our founders remonstrated against the British crown “for imposing taxes on us without our consent.” They were concerned about “consent,” i.e., popular rule, not taxes.

The very first item on their list condemned the king because he “refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.” Note that the signers wanted to pass laws, not repeal them, and they began by speaking of “the public good,” not about individuals or “the private sector.” They knew that it takes public action—including effective and responsive government—to secure “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.”

Their second grievance reinforced the first, accusing the king of having “forbidden his governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance.” Again, our forebears wanted to enact laws; they were not anti-government zealots.

Abuses three through nine also referred in some way to how laws were passed or justice was administered. The document doesn’t really get to anything that looks like Big Government oppression (“He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance”) until grievance number 10.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/print/what_our_declaration_really_said_20110703/

===

and the tea bagger corporate shills, always going Pravda on history, totally miscontrue/lie about the Boston Tea Party:

The Boston Tea Party was a direct action by colonists in Boston, a town in the British colony of Massachusetts, against the British government and the monopolistic East India Company that controlled all the tea coming into the colonies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Tea_Party

=====

So the real culprit was the East India Company having a corrupted (bought) Parliament grant EIC a mononoply on importing tea both to England and the colonies.

[Wild Cobra]

corporate shills and liars for corporations like you are the problem, NOT the govt.

The power of corporations and capitalists were already seen to be threat to the country at its founding, by the founders:

The New War of Independence - Against Corporate Politics

... unfulfilled desire to "crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country."

-- Thomas Jefferson

http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/151506

===

Govt has many problems, but the overriding problems, and the impediments to their solutions, are created and sustained by coporpate/capitalist money.

America is fucked into permanent decline, and there's no unfucking it.
Sorry, but our current unrestrained government is the biggest problem our nation faces today. The Heart of America is all but lost.

[Wild Cobra]

Or a day to promote your political agenda on a message board
Consider this a day that I remind people that too many do not stand with our forefathers.

[Wild Cobra]

In the long list of “abuses and usurpations” the Declaration documents, taxes don’t come up until the 17th item, and that item is neither a complaint about tax rates nor an objection to the idea of taxation. Our founders remonstrated against the British crown “for imposing taxes on us without our consent.” They were concerned about “consent,” i.e., popular rule, not taxes.

The very first item on their list condemned the king because he “refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.” Note that the signers wanted to pass laws, not repeal them, and they began by speaking of “the public good,” not about individuals or “the private sector.” They knew that it takes public action—including effective and responsive government—to secure “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.”

Their second grievance reinforced the first, accusing the king of having “forbidden his governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance.” Again, our forebears wanted to enact laws; they were not anti-government zealots.

Abuses three through nine also referred in some way to how laws were passed or justice was administered. The document doesn’t really get to anything that looks like Big Government oppression (“He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance”) until grievance number 10.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/print/what_our_declaration_really_said_20110703/

===

and the tea bagger corporate shills, always going Pravda on history, totally miscontrue/lie about the Boston Tea Party:

The Boston Tea Party was a direct action by colonists in Boston, a town in the British colony of Massachusetts, against the British government and the monopolistic East India Company that controlled all the tea coming into the colonies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boston_Tea_Party

=====

So the real culprit was the East India Company having a corrupted (bought) Parliament grant EIC a mononoply on importing tea both to England and the colonies.
I didn't specify taxes now did I?

We are passing stupid laws, and not the type we need.

We are electing politicians that will give us the hard worked earnings of others.

We are losing true social justice in favor or political correct ideals.

I could go on, but America today is flat out worse than America of the past.

Sure, we have more material items, but have lost wealth of the soul.

[angrydude]

The govt. is just the financier's tool to get what they want.

Yes, ppl are being naive when they assume the problems stop at the govt and not the people behind the govt.

But can you really blame them?

If the govt was doing its job, it wouldn't be bought and paid for. The financiers wouldn't legally be able to do anything without the govt's blessing.

So to pretend the govt isn't at fault in all this and laud it as the be all end all to all our problems is also wrong.

And short of lynching bank executives, focusing on govt is the only thing people can do.

[boutons_deux]

"our current unrestrained government is the biggest problem our nation faces today"

You Lie, GFY

Our current unrestrained UCA (corporations, capitalists) is the biggest problem our nation faces today (and there is no achievable solution).

[Wild Cobra]

"our current unrestrained government is the biggest problem our nation faces today"

You Lie, GFY

Our current unrestrained UCA (corporations, capitalists) is the biggest problem our nation faces today (and there is no achievable solution).
So you agree our government is not making the necessary laws regarding corporations, right?

Corporations will do what is best for them. Don't blame them for following the laws.

[boutons_deux]

"Don't blame them for following the laws"

You're a fool beyond silliness.

Corporate lobbyists write the legislation, then they write the rules and regs that implement the laws.

No law gets passed and implemented unless UCA is being protected and/or being enriched.

[Wild Cobra]

"Don't blame them for following the laws"

You're a fool beyond silliness.

Corporate lobbyists write the legislation, then they write the rules and regs that implement the laws.

No law gets passed and implemented unless UCA is being protected and/or being enriched.
Have you considered why that happens and who's to blame?

[ChumpDumper]

Consider this a day that I remind people that too many do not stand with our forefathers.That's it?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Consider this a day that I remind people that too many do not stand with our forefathers.
:lol the good old tea party logic

Lets take a document written over 200 years ago and pretend its most literal interpretation possible should dictate how laws are written.

Even though the 2nd amendment was obviously written to give America a militia if the British came back, lets pretend our forefathers knew we would become a world power having no need for a militia but wanted the 2nd amendment so Jared Lee Loughner could carry a gun everywhere he goes!

[Wild Cobra]

:lol the good old tea party logic

Lets take a document written over 200 years ago and pretend its most literal interpretation possible should dictate how laws are written.

Even though the 2nd amendment was obviously written to give America a militia if the British came back, lets pretend our forefathers knew we would become a world power having no need for a militia but wanted the 2nd amendment so Jared Lee Loughner could carry a gun everywhere he goes!
Ideas don't require literal interpretation.

[boutons_deux]

Did somebody say 2nd amendment? :)

People denied guns due to their mental health problems are agitating to get their guns back. Of course, the NRA and guns&ammo industry will undoubtedly be pushing hard to expand their membership and market.

[Winehole23]

Happy 4th, SpursTalkers.

[DMX7]

Too bad most people have lost the desire to keep this nation free of tyranny. Too many people want an ever expanding government to take over our lives.

The EPA keeping our drinking water clean and making sure that there isn't rat feces in our tuna fish isn't exactly the kind of tyranny that our founding fathers were fighting against.

[ElNono]

Those tyrants are really dragging our HGI... :rolleyes

Happy 4th for everyone else... :tu

[jack sommerset]

"There is never a democracy that did not commit suicide.” - John Adams

[EVAY]

Happy 4th, SpursTalkers.

:toast To all of us this day!!

[Vici]

It actually took place on July 3. They were missing a few signatures (John Hancock) so it wasn't ratified until July 4.

[Drachen]

It actually took place on July 3. They were missing a few signatures (John Hancock) so it wasn't ratified until July 4.

Oh ok, cool. So you are saying it didn't happen until July 4th?? Thank you.

[boutons_deux]

Independence, end of the war, with huge help from the French, didn't arrive until 1783.

[Vici]

Most of the delegates weren't even there. John Adams thoguht it was stupid to make it July 4 but whatever.

[MannyIsGod]

Or a day to promote your political agenda on a message board

Boom - headshot

[ducks]

thomas jefferson said people in dc should not be paid once they were it would be corrupt
TRUTH IN THAT STATEMENT!

[Stringer_Bell]

Sorry, but our current unrestrained government is the biggest problem our nation faces today. The Heart of America is all but lost.

http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2010/5/5/129175879366890107.jpg

Stop throwing a gd pity part on the most important day of the year!

Let the government grow, fuck it. It either gives out money to poor minorities or wastes it on projects that never even get started...OR it sticks its dick in every household and tries to tell you how to live your life according to the values of religious zealots. No one wins except for the assholes with shit tons of money, and at this point if you don't have shit tons of money you won't be getting it because the American Dream has been dead for decades. Thanks, Reagan!

[boutons_deux]

"Independence Day is celebrated two days too late. The Second Continental Congress voted for a Declaration of Independence on July 2. No one actually signed the Declaration of Independence at any time during July 1776. Signing began on August 2 and wasn't completed until late November. July 4 was when the document was edited and approved."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/04/independence-day-9-myths-_n_889857.html#s302818&title=The_Declaration_of

[boutons_deux]

"But when it became clear that the struggle for independence would be long and difficult, the enthusiasm of many American men for fighting began to wane, while their concerns for the well-being of their farms and other livelihoods grew. After initial enlistment rushes, many colonies resorted to cash incentives as early as 1776 and states were drafting men by the end of 1778, "

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/04/independence-day-9-myths-_n_889857.html#s302822&title=Patriots_Flocked_to

[boutons_deux]

"The Revolutionary War also pitted Americans against Americans in large numbers. Between 15 and 20 percent of all Americans were loyalists who supported the crown, according to the U.K. National Army Museum. Many others tried to stay out of the fight altogether. Records from the period are sketchy at best, but an estimated 50,000 Americans served as British soldiers or militia at one time or another during the conflict, a significant force pitted against a Continental Army that may have included a hundred thousand regular soldiers over the course of the war."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/04/independence-day-9-myths-_n_889857.html#s302824&title=America_United_Against

[Wild Cobra]

Huff~n~Puff post...

Give me a break.

I'll bet it's revisionist history in progress.

[ChumpDumper]

Prove it.

[Wild Cobra]

Prove it.
Me, or Boutons?

I simply said "I'll bet."

In my case it is a clear indication of my opinion, which I have no desire to prove to your sorry ass. If you are incapable of accepting that as my opinion, then how can I possible prove that to you?

Bye Chump. Don't give me reason to put you back on IGNORE.

[ChumpDumper]

Me, or Boutons?

I simply said "I'll bet."

In my case it is a clear indication of my opinion, which I have no desire to prove to your sorry ass. If you are incapable of accepting that as my opinion, then how can I possible prove that to you?

Bye Chump. Don't give me reason to put you back on IGNORE.I expected you to puss out. It was only a question of degree and expressed butthurt.

lol all caps threat

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Too bad most people have lost the desire to keep this nation free of tyranny. Too many people want an ever expanding government to take over our lives. The 4th seems to be nothing more to most than a day to have off from work, and party.

Fuck off, you're the spawn of Alexander Hamilton and need an Aaron Burr.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

"The Revolutionary War also pitted Americans against Americans in large numbers. Between 15 and 20 percent of all Americans were loyalists who supported the crown, according to the U.K. National Army Museum. Many others tried to stay out of the fight altogether. Records from the period are sketchy at best, but an estimated 50,000 Americans served as British soldiers or militia at one time or another during the conflict, a significant force pitted against a Continental Army that may have included a hundred thousand regular soldiers over the course of the war."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/04/independence-day-9-myths-_n_889857.html#s302824&title=America_United_Against

I have read some of those documents and using the term militia in that context is so misleading. Some municipalities had militias and elected to stand by the crown. Some would support the British army but then the Brits would leave them hung out to dry.

The Continental Army and its supporting militias would come back and rape these local militias after the Brits left. As the war wore on fewer and fewer would remain loyalists becasue the Brits refused to take them along with them. King Charles was cheap.

And do you have any other sources than an obviously liberal biased news outlet. I am not saying that the source is inherently wrong but all that does is reinforce that you are a mindless partisan. You literally spam the conventional liberal platform to a T.

[boutons_deux]

What does Fox Repug propaganda network, tea baggers (VERY wrong about the BTP), red-state bubbas ( ignornant fuck who don't read books) says about early US history?

We know nutcase, slime-bag evangelicals like Barton and other "Christians" absolutely lie about American history, the founders, etc.

[boutons_deux]

And what's "liberal" about posts from Huff posts above? Some facts that upset your dishonest, emotional, myth-riddled fairy tales about early US history?

[Wild Cobra]

What does Fox Repug propaganda network, tea baggers (VERY wrong about the BTP), red-state bubbas ( ignornant fuck who don't read books) says about early US history?
I don't know. Do you watch Fox? I don't.

We know nutcase, slime-bag evangelicals like Barton and other "Christians" absolutely lie about American history, the founders, etc.

You know within your irrational knowledge, but to be honest, I don't even know who they are.

[Wild Cobra]

And what's "liberal" about posts from Huff posts above? Some facts that upset your dishonest, emotional, myth-riddled fairy tales about early US history?
You expect me to accept that when they are a blatant, biased media organization, with an agenda?

Look. They could be right for once. I simply dismiss anything that publication says without verification. They are generally lying when ever they publish anything.

[boutons_deux]

"They could be right for once"

those were statements of historical facts. If you have different, negating facts, unbiased, non-ideological historian that you are, then post those facts.

[boutons_deux]

And just exactly what is the HuffPo "agenda", other than not being a Repug party thought-leader and mouthpiece like Fox's propagandists, liars, and bullies?

[fyatuk]

In the long list of “abuses and usurpations” the Declaration documents, taxes don’t come up until the 17th item, and that item is neither a complaint about tax rates nor an objection to the idea of taxation. Our founders remonstrated against the British crown “for imposing taxes on us without our consent.” They were concerned about “consent,” i.e., popular rule, not taxes.

The very first item on their list condemned the king because he “refused his assent to laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.” Note that the signers wanted to pass laws, not repeal them, and they began by speaking of “the public good,” not about individuals or “the private sector.” They knew that it takes public action—including effective and responsive government—to secure “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.”

Their second grievance reinforced the first, accusing the king of having “forbidden his governors to pass laws of immediate and pressing importance.” Again, our forebears wanted to enact laws; they were not anti-government zealots.

Abuses three through nine also referred in some way to how laws were passed or justice was administered. The document doesn’t really get to anything that looks like Big Government oppression (“He has erected a multitude of new offices, and sent hither swarms of officers to harass our people, and eat out their substance”) until grievance number 10.

http://www.truthdig.com/report/print/what_our_declaration_really_said_20110703/

While you have a decent point (by your standards anyway), you expand the sphere the Colonials wanted.

The founders and framers basically wanted to be able to pass laws that were needed in their area which the King wasn't allowing. Their ideal, as shown by first the Articles of Confederation, then the Constitution, then the Bill of Rights expressly shows that their ideal was a small central government focused mainly on insuring the cooperation of member states with the member states being able to rule as they see fit.

The Declaration itself clearly shows they wanted the central government to be restricted by law in its capabilities, held accountable for it's infractions, and some semblance of sovereignty granted to provinces.

As large of a federal government as we have (armed services included) is expressly against what the founders wanted, and there's no valid argument to dispute that. Whether the larger government is necessary given the changing times is a completely different thing, but according to nearly everything in existence that shows the founder's will, most of our current federal government's capabilities should be handled at the state level or not at all.

[boutons_deux]

"large", "small", what is the Founders "right size" of the current federal govt for a non-agrarian, service-based, high-tech economy in a country of 300M+ where one of the main drivers of the economy is diseases that the medical industry charges so much to treat that almost nobody can afford it?

[George Gervin's Afro]

You expect me to accept that when they are a blatant, biased media organization, with an agenda?

Look. They could be right for once. I simply dismiss anything that publication says without verification. They are generally lying when ever they publish anything.



Sincerley,

the guy who lives by the heritage foundation...

[Drachen]

You expect me to accept that when they are a blatant, biased media organization, with an agenda?

Look. They could be right for once. I simply dismiss anything that publication says without verification. They are generally lying when ever they publish anything.

LOL GOPnews.net

[fyatuk]

"large", "small", what is the Founders "right size" of the current federal govt for a non-agrarian, service-based, high-tech economy in a country of 300M+ where one of the main drivers of the economy is diseases that the medical industry charges so much to treat that almost nobody can afford it?

Like I said, completely different argument than you trying to show the founder's supporting large government. Obviously the founder's couldn't have envisioned half of what society is now, and they did intentionally allow for the main laws of the land to be changed to meet future needs.

It is my personal belief that things like Social Security, med-care reform, insurance reform, etc, could be run more ethically, efficiently, and effectively if run at the state level rather than the federal (of course, depending on the state since some are more ethical and efficient than others).

[Blake]

Too many people want an ever expanding government to take over our lives.


What if...

What if we changed the laws so that anyone getting pregnant that didn't have a proper financial future could be subject to legal recourse?


lol

good thread :tu

[TE]

^

:lmao

[Wild Cobra]

Sincerley,

the guy who lives by the heritage foundation...
I didn't know that I read they stuff. I must be getting senile in my old age.

[Wild Cobra]

lol

good thread :tu
One is taking understanding we don't need countless laws. The other is taking responsible measures against those who refuse to be responsible.

Not quite the same thing.

[Blake]

One is taking understanding we don't need countless laws. The other is taking responsible measures against those who refuse to be responsible.

Not quite the same thing.

lol responsible measures.

Whatever you say, komrade.

[FromWayDowntown]

We should only have the laws that I like. Other laws -- the ones I don't like -- are superfluous and evidence that the nation has lost its philosophical moorings and is careening towards hell.