3rd night of rioting in England

[Winehole23]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2023874/LONDON-RIOTS-David-Cameron-returns-home-police-face-gangs-petrol-bombs.html

[Proxy]

There's no real reason for it, correct?

[Winehole23]

Who knows? The Tottenham thing allegedly started over 15 policemen beating a 15 year old girl.

(edit -- a man named Mark Duggan (http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-news/uk-world-news/2011/08/09/duggan-did-not-fire-at-officers-100252-29207779/) was shot by police last Thursday. Probably should have started there.)

[Drachen]

There's no real reason for it, correct?

I think this downturn combined with the fact that they are on an austerity budget also has something to do with it. At least this is what I think I heard on a TV that was on for background noise at work (I wasn't actively listening)

[ElNono]

Perfect excuse to militarize their police...

They're common thugs though... rioting is one thing... looting is another.

[DarrinS]

Wow. Crazy shit.

[Wild Cobra]

What a riot... over a cab driver?

Seems he was far more than a cab driver!

[Capt Bringdown]

I wonder how England's far-right English Defense League will respond, or if they are covertly involved in these riots somehow. It's hard to see how the EDL wouldn't try to use these riots to their advantage, especially after the negative publicity garnered with their affiliation with the Norway shooter.

One of my Brit co-workers is sympathetic to the EDL. They really do seem like a crude and scary bunch whose basic message is "They're takin' over me country."

[boutons_deux]

"They're takin' over me country"

Which is true. The English Banksters are as criminal and predatory as the US Banksters, with the same results, no pain for the Banksters, all pain on the non-Banksters.

[Capt Bringdown]

"They're takin' over me country"

Which is true. The English Banksters are as criminal and predatory as the US Banksters, with the same results, no pain for the Banksters, all pain on the non-Banksters.

Wow, that's dumb. Do you know anything about the EDL?

[boutons_deux]

I don't need to know anything about the EDL. It's BLACKs in Tottenham and elsewhere doing most of the riotig, because, like in USA, they are getting most screwed by the Banksters' Great Depession.

[Muser]

It's just scumbags who want a free TV or to set fire to hard working peoples businesses just because they can.

[boutons_deux]

What about the Bankster scumbags want free money and set fire the lower 95% to get it? Banksters have caused a lot more damage to Britain than rioters.

[DarkReign]

Boutons, the "banksters" you refer to for both the US and England are one and the same. There is no delineation between the two based on national borders.

Not that has anything to do with whats going down in Her Majesty's backyard.

[boutons_deux]

yeah, I know that, duh. The UK Banksters' Great Depression is imposing even worse austerity on UK. But I figure the Repugs will match their austeriry sooner or later.

[ElNono]

Looking at the pictures, half or more of those people looting are sporting some nifty Adidas and Nike gear. I have a hard time thinking they're anything but petty criminals on a stupid rebellious rush.

[Cane]

k7H02HSip_c

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Tbh as cynical as it is I'm surprised there aren't more riots in relatively densely-populated metro areas like the UK.

UK police and government are kinda fucked after how they handled the student riots. And apparently the initial riots started because an officer shot at another officer resulting in them shooting down an armed gang member suspect. Yikes.


The Brits have a great new generation of youths on the horizon and we all know how promising their Western future is right? Anarchy in the UK. The young and old have-nots are going to take to the streets V for Vendetta style :wow :downspin::depressed

[SnakeBoy]

What a riot... over a cab driver?


That's not what it is over...

ZUzuYoCkYAY

[cheguevara]

IMO these are similar to the France riots. Those goverments treat the minorities like shit, especially the dark skinned ones.

[Bartleby]

I wonder how England's far-right English Defense League will respond, or if they are covertly involved in these riots somehow. It's hard to see how the EDL wouldn't try to use these riots to their advantage, especially after the negative publicity garnered with their affiliation with the Norway shooter.

One of my Brit co-workers is sympathetic to the EDL. They really do seem like a crude and scary bunch whose basic message is "They're takin' over me country."

I don't think the EDL have the cojones to march there. They would probably get stomped.

[cheguevara]

you think minorities have it bad in the USA. go to England, Italy, France, Argentina. They are not considered above animals over there.

[Yonivore]

you think minorities have it bad in the USA. go to England, Italy, France, Argentina. They are not considered above animals over there.
And our President wishes we were more like Europe? Go figure.

[Winehole23]

Yoni likes to tell us about Obama's state of mind. How did you get so well-placed to get such information, Yoni?

[cheguevara]

And our President wishes we were more like Europe? Go figure.

if he does, he needs to travel through Europe incognegro. Let's see how he fares

but there are countries in Europe miles ahead of USA in those terms.
Netherlands, Denmark, Switzerland,etc,etc.

[Yonivore]

Yoni likes to tell us about Obama's state of mind. How did you get so well-placed to get such information, Yoni?
President Obama.

[ChumpDumper]

How did this get to be about Obama?

Oh, nevermind.

[boutons_deux]

As London Explodes in Riots, There is a Context That Can't be Ignored: Brutal Cuts and Enforced Austerity Measures


http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/newsandviews/647514

[Slomo]

I've been following this quite closely because I have to travel there tomorrow and while the initial accident seems to be a tragedy, it has been used as an excuse for something totally different.

They just did the bravest thing on Sky News 5 minutes ago. The reporter was talking to some people in the streets of Birmingham live, when a group of "protesters" came by. The reporter invited them in front of the camera (or to stay behind it for privacy sake) and basically explain themselves. What are they doing, why...

It was sad to see those 15 years old boys struggling to invent a reason for their presence until one of them finally admitted they were there to get drunk and "get paid". Sad and stupid.

Props to Sky News to not switch off the camera and letting the whole thing play out live (even ignoring a few F-bombs and other foul language from the "protesters").

The again it was on Sky, so it could have been staged :lol

[Slomo]

Fuck me sideways!

Live footage by a full TV crew of looters using riot barriers to break into a photo store across the street from the town hall in Manchester. Not a cop in sight.

The looters themselves are not bothered by the cameras and are calmly going about their business of breaking in.

I wonder if they will call in the military (it has been suggested by quite a few people).

[boutons_deux]

I heard they're going to send 10K policemen

[Slomo]

Yes, the news was all leaves and holidays were cancelled and that 16000 policemen would be in the streets tonight. But the looting has spread all over the country (well at least as far North as Manchester/Liverpool) and for such a large territory even 16000 is not enough.

London seems to be calm tonight because that's where the biggest Police concentration is.

One of the more dangerous developments is the self organization of vigilante groups intent on fighting back. We are rapidly losing the right to call ourselves civilized.

[RandomGuy]

Yes, the news was all leaves and holidays were cancelled and that 16000 policemen would be in the streets tonight. But the looting has spread all over the country (well at least as far North as Manchester/Liverpool) and for such a large territory even 16000 is not enough.

London seems to be calm tonight because that's where the biggest Police concentration is.

One of the more dangerous developments is the self organization of vigilante groups intent on fighting back. We are rapidly losing the right to call ourselves civilized.

Londoners strike back with 'Operation Riot Clean-up' (http://news.yahoo.com/londoners-strike-back-operation-riot-clean-155127609.html)

Not all is descending to barbarism.

That minor note aside, I also wonder how long it will take before armed vigilantes take to the streets with people fed up with this shit.

[Sisk]

6SHKhvVjLIc

[RandomGuy]

As London Explodes in Riots, There is a Context That Can't be Ignored: Brutal Cuts and Enforced Austerity Measures


http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/newsandviews/647514

It is probably a mix of a lot of things, this included.

Since no one has beat me to it...

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_vZhR4a7LLS8/R_QdQtJCOUI/AAAAAAAADeo/exSPowguae4/s320/v4.gif

I see this guy running around, and I am heading to the hills.

[Yonivore]

Europe has finally run out of other people's money and the deadbeats to whom they were redistributing it are throwing a temper tantrum.

[ElNono]

Europe has finally run out of other people's money and the deadbeats to whom they were redistributing it are throwing a temper tantrum.

You sure would like it to be that, Yoni. So does bouttons.
15 year old deadbeats wearing Nikes? I don't think so.

[RandomGuy]

Here is the live coverage:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14449675

:corn:

[Yonivore]

You sure would like it to be that, Yoni. So does bouttons.
15 year old deadbeats wearing Nikes? I don't think so.
Really? They're all over the United States. Hell, deadbeats have been known to kill for tennis shoes.

Besides, they've been looting for a couple of days now. Perhaps he "picked" them up.

Also, when other people are paying your bills, you can afford to buy that flat screen and a pair of Nikes.

[RandomGuy]

Seriously though, irreverant me aside:

It seems as if the guy who got shot did NOT shoot at the police.

(edit)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14449675

[RandomGuy]

London appears to be "quiet", but other cities appear to have outbreaks.

YIKES. I take that back....

"Four loud explosions have been heard at a deisel depot near tottingham".

[RandomGuy]

Taking stock of the damage:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14460111



About 157 Tesco stores in London, Liverpool and Bristol were closed overnight or shortened their opening hours as a precautionary measure, while 26 stores "suffered varying degrees of damage"

Sainsbury's said 16 stores had experienced "serious incidents" and three convenience stores remained closed

Argos said some stores would be closing early after 18 of its branches had suffered various degrees of damage

JD Sports and Carphone Warehouse both said a number of stores were looted or damaged

The chief executive of Greggs, Ken McMeikan, told the BBC that the company's Peckham branch, which had been set alight, looked like it was "pretty much a write-off". A branch in Ealing was also looted

Debenhams said that it was working with the police and that its Clapham Junction store remained closed after it was looted on Monday night

Ealing Broadway Shopping Centre and several shops on the High Street all closed early on Tuesday

Sony said that UK deliveries of CDs and DVDs could be affected after a fire hit its warehouse in Enfield

All the major banks said that some branches were closed all day, while others closed early, on police advice

Meanwhile, London & Partners, the official promotional agency for the capital, were hopeful that London's tourism would not take too much of a knock.

"It is currently too early to anticipate the effect on tourism but we are monitoring the situation and we will work with the industry to respond to specific issues as they arise," a spokesman said

[DarrinS]

6SHKhvVjLIc

:clap

[ElNono]

Really? They're all over the United States. Hell, deadbeats have been known to kill for tennis shoes.

Besides, they've been looting for a couple of days now. Perhaps he "picked" them up.

This looks like a deadbeat to you?

http://img.thesun.co.uk/multimedia/archive/00488/riotmain_488741a.jpg


Also, when other people are paying your bills, you can afford to buy that flat screen and a pair of Nikes.

That makes no sense. If they already have them, why do they need to steal them again?

More deadbeat with nice haircuts...

http://dailybail.com/picture/uk-riot-14.jpg?pictureId=7936830

[ElNono]

deadbeats with twitter... that's pretty cool...

[DarrinS]

Probably a bunch of conservatives

[ElNono]

Probably a bunch of conservatives

The ruling party sure is. I have a hard time the austerity measures are really hitting Cameron hard though...

[boutons_deux]

"You sure would like it to be that, Yoni. So does bouttons."

no, I don't care. But I ask what drives 1000s of young people to such anger. It's not unprovoked. And it's not because the police shot someone.

UK society, much like US society, is stictly organized to enrich and maintain the top, which top goes back many 100s of years, blatant discrimination based on class, the royalty, aristocracy, the bourgeoisie, while providing almost nothing for the people on the bottom, esp black and South Indian ones.

[DarrinS]

Motivated be "extreme" austerity measures

-dO25MITPMc

[Yonivore]

This looks like a deadbeat to you?
I'm not aware of a stereotypical deadbeat "look."

[DarrinS]

I'm not aware of a stereotypical deadbeat "look."

He was showing that they were white because he was sooo sure you meant something else.

[Yonivore]

http://dailybail.com/picture/uk-riot-14.jpg?pictureId=7936830
Whether or not it signifies his deadbeat-ness, you think that's a nice haircut?

[ElNono]

Motivated be "extreme" austerity measures

I'm on the record saying that these are petty criminals and 'rebel' kids.
Not surprised though that the suckers that end up paying for 'austerity' are the have-not though. Isn't that what happened with the TARP too?


I'm not aware of a stereotypical deadbeat "look."

Plenty of photos out there. Since you already know they're deadbeats, it should only take you a cursory look.

[Yonivore]

deadbeats with twitter... that's pretty cool...
Deadbeats have a lot of amenities others cannot afford, simply because whatever money they do have -- whether it be a government stipend or some relative off of whom they're mooching -- can be spent on wants instead of needs.

Are you unfamiliar with the phenomenon?

[ElNono]

He was showing that they were white because he was sooo sure you meant something else.

I'm showing well dressed people... not surprised you're pulling the race card though. I bet you want to see their birth certificate too. :rolleyes


Whether or not it signifies his deadbeat-ness, you think that's a nice haircut?

I would kill to have that much hair at this point, tbh :lol

[ElNono]

Deadbeats have a lot of amenities others cannot afford, simply because whatever money they do have -- whether it be a government stipend or some relative off of whom they're mooching -- can be spent on wants instead of needs.

Are you unfamiliar with the phenomenon?

I'm familiar with that phenomenon.
You haven't made the connection that these people are those people though.
There's actually fairly good indicators that they're not, like all of them getting organized via twitter. Or being well dress. Or being 15 year old kids. etc, etc, etc.

[Yonivore]

Plenty of photos out there. Since you already know they're deadbeats, it should only take you a cursory look.
If they're destroying their city because austerity measures threaten to cut them off the public tit...they're deadbeats.

So, tell me why they're burning down London.

[ElNono]

If they're destroying their city because austerity measures threaten to cut them off the public tit...they're deadbeats.

I don't think there's any proof that's the reason. When asked point blank, they sure didn't say that. That's why I said earlier you would wish that to be the case and so does boutons (to which boutons already responded).


So, tell me why they're burning down London.

Because they can get away with it? I don't know. They were asked and didn't know either.

[ElNono]

I've been following this quite closely because I have to travel there tomorrow and while the initial accident seems to be a tragedy, it has been used as an excuse for something totally different.

They just did the bravest thing on Sky News 5 minutes ago. The reporter was talking to some people in the streets of Birmingham live, when a group of "protesters" came by. The reporter invited them in front of the camera (or to stay behind it for privacy sake) and basically explain themselves. What are they doing, why...

It was sad to see those 15 years old boys struggling to invent a reason for their presence until one of them finally admitted they were there to get drunk and "get paid". Sad and stupid.

Props to Sky News to not switch off the camera and letting the whole thing play out live (even ignoring a few F-bombs and other foul language from the "protesters").

The again it was on Sky, so it could have been staged :lol

[Yonivore]

I don't think there's any proof that's the reason. When asked point blank, they sure didn't say that. That's why I said earlier you would wish that to be the case and so does boutons (to which boutons already responded).
Why would I wish it to be the case?


Because they can get away with it? I don't know. They were asked and didn't know either.
Whatever the case, it's not because they're productive members of society.

[ElNono]

Do UK cops even carry guns these days? I remember they didn't use to.

[ElNono]

Why would I wish it to be the case?

Because you wouldn't miss the opportunity to rag about Europe handouts (an opportunity you couldn't pass up), while boutons would rag about oppressive austerity measures (an opportunity he didn't pass up either).


Whatever the case, it's not because they're productive members of society.

Certainly agree with that. Looks like spoiled kids to me.

[Yonivore]

Certainly agree with that. Looks like spoiled kids to me.
I don't see "kids" in either of the two pictures you posted. One man appears to be in his mid to late 20's and the other are a bunch of middle-aged men.

[ElNono]

I don't see "kids" in either of the two pictures you posted. One man appears to be in his mid to late 20's and the other are a bunch of middle-aged men.

Sorry, I'm getting close to 40... anything under 25 is a kid these days.

Here's an interesting read about this 'generation' of rioters. Apparently they're mostly youngsters.

London riots: 'A generation who don't respect their parents or police' (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/09/london-riots-kids-parents-police)

[Yonivore]

Sorry, I'm getting close to 40... anything under 25 is a kid these days.
I'm fifty and anyone over 18, isn't a kid.


Here's an interesting read about this 'generation' of rioters. Apparently they're mostly youngsters.

London riots: 'A generation who don't respect their parents or police' (http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/aug/09/london-riots-kids-parents-police)
So, deadbeats.

[ElNono]

I'm fifty and anyone over 18, isn't a kid.

Okay


So, deadbeats.

How do you know they're getting any handouts? Link please.

[Yonivore]

Okay

How do you know they're getting any handouts? Link please.
I don't. But, until we know why they chose to burn down London, I'm standing by my assumption they're deadbeat who are pissed because austerity measures are fucking up their lifestyle.

Your links to the contrary?

[ElNono]

I don't.

I didn't think you did. You probably didn't read one article linked to this thread either. I provided a link. Did you read it?

[Yonivore]

I didn't think you did. You probably didn't read one article linked to this thread either. I provided a link. Did you read it?
Nope. Why should I? As with every topic that is hotly debated in this forum, there are media outlets willing to support any and all positions.

The facts are this:

A bunch of people are rioting in England and pretty much laying waste to the London area.

I'm probably on safe ground assuming they aren't the productive segment of society that is probably watching their livelihoods being burned and ransacked on the nightly news.

So, why, exactly, are they scorching the earth?

If it's due to the austerity measures, then they're deadbeats.

If they don't know why they're doing it, then they're unproductive members of society and, therefore, deadbeats.

If it's some other reason, I'm open to hearing it.

[ElNono]

Nope. Why should I?

Because you're asking for links?

So you don't know they're deadbeats, and you don't care to find out if they are or are not.

Okay, Yoni.

[ElNono]

This isn't the first time the UK has to deal with rioting youngsters either. Anybody with good memory that knows a thing or two about the UK should remember their hooligans and constant clashes with the police. Had nothing to do with austerity measures either.

[Yonivore]

Because you're asking for links?
It was a tongue-in-cheeks response to your demand for a link. Still, if you thought it a serious request, you failed to provide any.


So you don't know they're deadbeats, and you don't care to find out if they are or are not.
So, you don't know they're not deadbeats. And, no, I don't care to find out. What I do know, is no one is forwarding a reasonable explanation for why they have any good cause to be doing what they're doing.

I hope they're all caught up on some conflagration of their own making and the world is rid of them.

Why are you so defensive about deadbeats; are you one?

[ElNono]

It was a tongue-in-cheek

I'll make sure not to take you seriously then.


And, no, I don't care to find out.

Should've started there...

[Yonivore]

I'll make sure not to take you seriously then.
Suit yourself.


Should've started there...
Because mocking an out-of-context statement is the only way to continue in your argument.

I don't care to find out if they're deadbeats because, more importantly, I cannot think of a legitimate reason for them to be doing what they're doing. So, in that regard, being called a deadbeat is really at the low end of scum scale for what they probably are.

I suspect many of them will become (and many already have become) criminals; rapists, murderers, arsonists, thieves, vandals, etc...

Take your pick; deadbeats is tame compared to what they've become over the past couple of days.

[ElNono]

Because mocking an out-of-context statement is the only way to continue in your argument.

I'll make that decision...

There's nothing to discuss since you're not interested in discussing it.

[Yonivore]

I'll make that decision...

There's nothing to discuss since you're not interested in discussing it.
What's to discuss? Criminals are laying waste to England. Whether or not they're deadbeats seems, to me, a minor point.

But, for grins and giggles, this excerpt from a BBC dispatch caught my eye...


Two girls who took part in Monday night's riots in Croydon have boasted that they were showing police and "the rich" that "we can do what we want".
I wonder if it occurs to them that "the rich" will not be much affected by the riots or the damage. That's what insurance is for.

Now, the working class employed by "the rich" who will be out of jobs due to -- well -- there not being a place of employment standing; they're another matter. I suspect many of the hooligans (is that a better term than deadbeats) will realize that, like a hangover, when the breadwinners of their families join the ranks of the unemployed because their employers building was burned to the ground.

[ElNono]

What's to discuss? Criminals are laying waste to England. Whether or not they're deadbeats seems, to me, a minor point.


Europe has finally run out of other people's money and the deadbeats to whom they were redistributing it are throwing a temper tantrum.

Looks like it isn't a minor point to you...

[ElNono]

And the UK hooligans I was mentioning before were breadwinners themselves... nothing to do with deadbeats...

Just unruly sports fans in that case. They destroyed because they could get away with it. Criminal mind of the mob... whatever you want to call it.
Eventually the UK police got it under control.

[Yonivore]

Looks like it isn't a minor point to you...
It's what I think.

The larger issue, however, is that people -- whatever their motivation (and you've yet to counter with anything) -- are fucking up Europe. That I believe it's because severe austerity measures are driving deadbeats to convulse, is my opinion.

Telling me I'm wrong and demanding that I support the premise is not a refutation.

Besides, I have precedence on my side. Same thing happened in Greece.

So, what's your theory?

[Yonivore]

And the UK hooligans I was mentioning before were breadwinners themselves... nothing to do with deadbeats...

Just unruly sports fans in that case.
Did you mention hooligans earlier? A coincidence, I assure you.

[ElNono]

It's what I think.

So it isn't a minor issue... okay.


The larger issue, however, is that people -- whatever their motivation (and you've yet to counter with anything) -- are fucking up Europe. That I believe it's because severe austerity measures are driving deadbeats to convulse, is my opinion.

I could explain that Europe is made up of 50 countries, that the UK situation is nothing like Greece, etc but you don't care to discuss this, so why should I care?

[ElNono]

Did you mention hooligans earlier? A coincidence, I assure you.

I wasn't sure :toast

[Proxy]

Regardless of whether these people are deadbeats by choice, the message behind the riots makes no sense. If they're mad at the government, small businesses are the last thing needs burning.

But then, you could turn around blame the education system for keeping the lower/minority classes 'where they belong.'

[ElNono]

Spain had their rioters too (mostly university students) then they went away too...

Looks like the current fad, as stupid as that sounds...

[Yonivore]

So it isn't a minor issue... okay.
Well, it's certainly more minor than what they're doing.


I could explain that Europe is made up of 50 countries, that the UK situation is nothing like Greece, etc but you don't care to discuss this, so why should I care?
So you deny the UK is engaging in the imposition of austerity measures?

I could explain the European Union and how this has fucked up everyone's economy over there and is a large reason why many of them are experience unrest but, you're too busy defending deadbeats.

Seriously, do you identify with them? Is that why you are so adamant about defending them against being called deadbeats?

[ChumpDumper]

Okay



How do you know they're getting any handouts? Link please.


I don't. But, until we know why they chose to burn down London, I'm standing by my assumption they're deadbeat who are pissed because austerity measures are fucking up their lifestyle.

Your links to the contrary?


I didn't think you did. You probably didn't read one article linked to this thread either. I provided a link. Did you read it?


Nope. Why should I?...

....If it's some other reason, I'm open to hearing it.No you aren't, you fucking idiot.

[ElNono]

So you deny the UK is engaging in the imposition of austerity measures?

Nope. Link where I denied that?

[Proxy]

Seriously, do you identify with them? Is that why you are so adamant about defending them against being called deadbeats?

*attempts to pettifog obvious evidence of lack of empathy through selfishness and ignorance to the lives of others outside the white man*

[ElNono]

I could explain the European Union and how this has fucked up everyone's economy over

Nope, you couldn't explain this either.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

jesus christ, came into this thread to get some decent POV's and it becomes a fucking YONI thread

gmafb

[boutons_deux]

British Riots: Elites "Shocked" The Poor Are Rising Up Against Brutal Austerity Measures

the social unrest searing through the poorest boroughs in the country was "utterly unacceptable." The violence on the streets is being dismissed as ‘pure criminality,’ as the work of a ‘violent minority’, as ‘opportunism.’ This is madly insufficient. It is no way to talk about viral civil unrest. Angry young people with nothing to do and little to lose are turning on their own communities, and they cannot be stopped, and they know it. In one of the greatest cities in the world, society is ripping itself apart.

Violence is rarely mindless.

"Yes," said the young man. "You wouldn't be talking to me now if we didn't riot, would you?"

"Two months ago we marched to Scotland Yard, more than 2,000 of us, all blacks, and it was peaceful and calm and you know what? Not a word in the press. Last night a bit of rioting and looting and look around you."

Eavesdropping from among the onlookers, I looked around. A dozen TV crews and newspaper reporters interviewing the young men everywhere ‘’’

It has become clear to the disenfranchised young people of Britain, who feel that they have no stake in society and nothing to lose, that they can do what they like, and the police are utterly unable to stop them. That is what riots are all about.

http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/151952

======

The Largest Street Carnival Festival in Europe going back decades is scheduled for end of August. Several 100K people in the streets for a couple days.

http://www.thenottinghillcarnival.com/images/home/00.jpg

http://www.thenottinghillcarnival.com/2011.html

I wonder if it will be cancelled? If it proceeds, it will no doubt have 10Ks of police.

[RandomGuy]

I don't. But, until we know why they chose to burn down London, I'm standing by my assumption they're deadbeat who are pissed because austerity measures are fucking up their lifestyle.

Your links to the contrary?

Your statement, your burden of proof.

Trying to shift it to someone else to prove the opposite is the epitome of weaseldom.

"I assume Yonivore has sex with goats."

"Oh yeah, what is your proof?"

"Until you can prove he DOESN'T have sex with goats, I will stand by my assumption.

See how that works?

[Winehole23]

A smattering (http://andrewsullivan.thedailybeast.com/2011/08/london-riot-reax-the-uk-press.html) of reactions @ Andrew Sullivan.

[Winehole23]

Recent disorders (http://news.sky.com/home/uk-news/article/16047536).

[TDMVPDPOY]

looks like a bunch of bums and hoodrats doing the trouble making to me...yes blame the society when ur life fails cause you didnt stay in school to get urself ahead of not working up the chain

[Agloco]

Wayne Rooney trade rumors tbh.

[DarrinS]

We've all met overly coddling parents who spoil their kids and provide no discipline. Their kids are spoiled brats that walk all over them. Same can be said for an overly coddling secular nanny state. Pathetic.

[ElNono]

One surprise was the presence of young men and women with regular jobs among the riot suspects lined up in police wagons outside courthouses in London and other cities. That raised questions about why they had been caught up in the kind of mayhem that has traditionally drawn on an underclass of alienated young people, with no jobs and few prospects.

Many of those who were remanded for trial appeared to come from just those kinds of backgrounds — evidence, as some commentators saw it, that the root causes of the disorders lay in social deprivation and despair. But those who stood before the courts for bail hearings in London, many of them still in their jeans and hooded sweatshirts, included a graphic designer, a postal employee, a dental assistant, a teaching aide, a forklift driver and a youth worker.

One 19-year-old woman was listed on court documents as living in a converted farmhouse in a leafy, upmarket area of rural Kent that is part of what Londoners call the stockbroker belt. A 22-year-old woman gave her address as an upscale block of flats in a gentrified neighborhood of Hackney, one of the worst-hit riot areas in London. Local residents said that many of the residents of the apartments, which are valued at about $500,000, belonged to a community of affluent, middle-class people with jobs in London’s news media and art world.

link (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/11/world/europe/11britain.html?hp)

Don't think a 'overly coddling secular nanny state' had anything to do with those folks...

[ElNono]

What I find disgusting is politicians like Cameron talking about ethics and morals, tbh... like they're not sending the wrong message.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

If the austerity trend continues with the lowest corporate and higher income tax rates in US history while cutting social services to the poor you can bet your ass that you will see this in major US urban areas as well.

We are entering a new epoch of world history and it ain't going to be pretty. Just sucks that shit has to go to hell to create real change. Current leadership isn't getting it done.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

One surprise was the presence of young men and women with regular jobs among the riot suspects lined up in police wagons outside courthouses in London and other cities. That raised questions about why they had been caught up in the kind of mayhem that has traditionally drawn on an underclass of alienated young people, with no jobs and few prospects.

Many of those who were remanded for trial appeared to come from just those kinds of backgrounds — evidence, as some commentators saw it, that the root causes of the disorders lay in social deprivation and despair. But those who stood before the courts for bail hearings in London, many of them still in their jeans and hooded sweatshirts, included a graphic designer, a postal employee, a dental assistant, a teaching aide, a forklift driver and a youth worker.

One 19-year-old woman was listed on court documents as living in a converted farmhouse in a leafy, upmarket area of rural Kent that is part of what Londoners call the stockbroker belt. A 22-year-old woman gave her address as an upscale block of flats in a gentrified neighborhood of Hackney, one of the worst-hit riot areas in London. Local residents said that many of the residents of the apartments, which are valued at about $500,000, belonged to a community of affluent, middle-class people with jobs in London’s news media and art world.

link (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/11/world/europe/11britain.html?hp)

Don't think a 'overly coddling secular nanny state' had anything to do with those folks...

The incredible shrinking middle class sees the writing on the wall.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

We've all met overly coddling parents who spoil their kids and provide no discipline. Their kids are spoiled brats that walk all over them. Same can be said for an overly coddling secular nanny state. Pathetic.

Either that or its a population that is tired of seeing the only entitlements that are not cut being that of the so called elites. Tired of the supply side lie of the last 40 years.

Thanks for the ignorant sociological lesson, btw. You don't know shit about child rearing and even less about that subject so just stop.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

looks like a bunch of bums and hoodrats doing the trouble making to me...yes blame the society when ur life fails cause you didnt stay in school to get urself ahead of not working up the chain

This sounds remarkably like what al-Assad is saying whats going on in Syria.

[boutons_deux]

"you can bet your ass that you will see this in major US urban areas as well."

I wouldn't bet anybody's ass. Americans are too TV-dumbed-down, "cowed sheeple", fat, diseased, conformist, scared to be different or think independent thoughts.

Red, poor, rural America, a Repug heartland, gets screwed by the Repug debt deal, and will get screwed more by every new Repug cut, but will keep voting for the Repugs to keep screwing them, because the Repugs say they are "good Christian, God-fearin', Baby-Jesus-lovin', born-again, prayin' people".

[boutons_deux]

Here's persistent VRWC/stink tank "cottage industry" agitating against any "community organizing", which certainly include political demonstrations, even peaceful ones, against the VRWC screwing the lower 95% and "death panelling" the poorest.

All Alinsky, All The Time

http://mediamatters.org/print/blog/201108100006

And we know America's Mayer Guiliani had his "America's cops" spread out all over USA to spy on anti-war, anti-Repug demonstrators that might show up at the 2004 Repug nominating convention.

USA is too much of a high-tech, organized, connected, militarized police state, supported by VRWC and UCA, to allow any kind of political uprising or even peaceful political demonstrations. Any such groups are infiltrated by spies and moles and agitators.

The pro-corporate tea baggers/BecKKK have a demonstration, it makes the corporate news. Anti-corporate libs/progressives have a demonstration, it's nowhere in the corporate news.

America is so fucked it doesn't even realize it, which is exactly how the UCA/capitalists want it. dumbed down, complacent sheeple voting against their own best interests (ie, for the Repugs and Blue Dogs).

[boutons_deux]

But the UCA knows it's fucking people hard and deep, and sorta kinda expects to be attacked, so is hiring protection (lots of ex-military love to kill Americans as much as they love killin sand niggas), but I really expect having having security guards is simply a demonstration of wealth and power (like Lewis Black's "private ball washer") rather than real fear:

Rich Executives Spend Millions For Bodyguards To Guard Them From Populist Anger

http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/151946

[boutons_deux]

Sums up the positions here:

Could the London Riots Happen in the US?

Writing in the Guardian, Aditya Chakrabortty says that analysis of the political reaction to the riots suggests that it is “simplistic and partisan”:

If you’re a left-winger, the causes of the violence and looting are straight-forward: they’re the result of monstrous inequality and historic spending cuts; while the youth running amok through branches of JD Sports are what happens when you offer a generation plastic consumerism rather than meaningful jobs.

For the right, explaining the violence is even simpler – because any attempt at understanding is tantamount to condoning it. Better by far to talk of a society with a sense of over-entitlement; or to do what the prime minister did yesterday and simply dismiss “pockets of our society that are not just broken but, frankly, sick”.

Read more: http://www.care2.com/causes/could-the-london-riots-happen-in-the-us.html#ixzz1UifRvGv0

[boutons_deux]

Coulter Suggests Mass Murder As A Way To "Save England From Itself"

A few well-placed rifle rounds, and the rioting would end in an instant. A more sustained attack on the rampaging mob might save England from itself, finally removing shaved-head, drunken parasites from the benefits rolls that Britain can't find the will to abolish on moral or utilitarian grounds. We can be sure there's no danger of killing off the next Winston Churchill or Edmund Burke in these crowds.

http://mediamatters.org/blog/201108100038?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+MediaMattersForAmerica-CountyFair+%28Media+Matters+for+America+-+County+Fair%29

[DarrinS]

I think this girl explains it best

IjdhEvosC3I

[ElNono]

No way that shit happens in the US. Besides of the militarized police here, the first night that happens those guys get rounded up and sent to Gitmo after being charged with terror crimes.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I emphatically beg to differ with you.

[boutons_deux]

40+ years ago, National Guardsman machine gunned Watts women, cutting off their legs at the knees, for making of with TVs and stuff.

[Winehole23]

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/274070/let-britain-burn-john-derbyshire#

[CosmicCowboy]

Coulter is right. This isn't political, it's a bunch of punkass bitches rioting and looting because they can get away with it. They need to just announce that the rioting ends TODAY and if you come back tomorrow we will shoot you down in the streets like the mad dogs you are.

[CosmicCowboy]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/8692429/London-riots-Bleeding-I-called-999.-A-tired-man-told-me-to-go-home.html

London riots: 'Bleeding, I called 999. A tired man told me to go home'
Andrew Gilligan reports on his own experiences of the lawlessness that swept across much of London and elsewhere.


By Andrew Gilligan7:30AM BST 10 Aug 2011679 Comments
It was one of those microseconds when you know exactly what is about to happen, without the slightest chance of stopping it.
The big black boy rode his bike straight at me, crashing me off my own and leaving us both tangled up on the ground. Then four more of them were racing towards me, clawing at my legs to get them off my bike, kicking me in the head as I tried to hold on. Two minutes later, it was all over. Ten minutes later, no doubt, it was being used to loot a newsagent’s.
Bleeding a little, I thought I might as well call 999. It was a recorded message. After four and a half minutes, a tired man answered. “There’s nothing we can do,” he said. “You know what’s going on. We have to give priority to saving people’s lives. I suggest you just go home.”
He was right, of course. I was in Hackney - which, that evening at least, was a law-free zone. That’s the worst thing about riots. Across much of London on Monday night, if someone had decided to break down your door and rape your daughter, there would have been nothing to stop them. There would have been no one to call.
When I was mugged, I was on my way home from a day in Tottenham, listening to the stories of the people who had lost far more and been at far greater risk than me, burned out of their homes at 30 seconds’ notice.

They called 999 too, frantically, desperately, as the riot moved closer. There were 100 police just up the road. The emergency operator could do nothing but listen to their terror.
I finished my journey in a cab. Three or four times, we had to stop and skirt round hooded boys spilling into the road, our windows closed and the door lock on. If they had fancied my taxi, there would have been nothing I or the driver could have done about that, either.
Even on Monday, the victims of Tottenham, black and white, were already tired of outsiders blaming racism, police brutality, or cuts. (What were they rioting about in prosperous, suburban Enfield – rising season-ticket prices?) The real reason for the rioters’ behaviour is much simpler: because they can.
Forget BlackBerry Messenger. After seeing — on television — how much leeway the looters of Tottenham were allowed, every criminal and every excitement-seeking child in London took note.
By the next day, critical mass had been achieved. Disorder had erupted on a scale much more difficult to suppress than the original outbreak.
There are, and always have been, plenty of people keen to break the law. On my taxi ride, I saw many other youngsters in twos and threes, hoods up, looking for the next crowd to join.
These are sights, with variations, that I have seen in foreign conflict zones: the loss of state authority and the loss of individual inhibition from being in a big group. But in London, the geography of fear is particularly potent.
Unlike Los Angeles or Paris, the riots are not happening in ghettos where nobody goes. They are happening amid the organic gastropubs and latte bars. Alongside poverty, inner London is full of the sort of middle-class progressives who agree with Ken Livingstone that the rioters “feel no one at the top of society, in government or City Hall, cares about them or speaks for them”.
I predict a lot of those people, as they cower behind their sash windows, are revising their views tonight. The hardening of liberal opinion in London is palpable, and is taking even the likes of Boris Johnson by surprise.
In my neighbourhood, Greenwich, they boarded up the shops at noon. God knows how much damage this is doing to the economy. It’s a beautiful, sunny evening. But our area is empty, like so much of inner London, as we wait in our homes with the TVs on to discover if they will be coming for us tonight.

[boutons_deux]

"This isn't political,"

:lol

UK Riots Reflect a Society Run on Greed and Looting

It is essential for those in power in Britain that the riots now sweeping the country can have no cause beyond feral wickedness. This is nothing but "criminality, pure and simple", David Cameron declared after cutting short his holiday in Tuscany. The London mayor and fellow former Bullingdon Club member Boris Johnson, heckled by hostile Londoners in Clapham Junction, warned that rioters must stop hearing "economic and sociological justifications" (though who was offering them he never explained) for what they were doing.

If these riots have no social or political causes, then clearly no one in authority can be held responsible. What's more, with many people terrified by the mayhem and angry at the failure of the police to halt its spread, it offers the government a chance to get back on the front foot and regain its seriously damaged credibility as a force for social order.

But it's also a nonsensical position. If this week's eruption is an expression of pure criminality and has nothing to do with police harassment or youth unemployment or rampant inequality or deepening economic crisis, why is it happening now and not a decade ago? The criminal classes, as the Victorians branded those at the margins of society, are always with us, after all. And if it has no connection with Britain's savage social divide and ghettoes of deprivation, why did it kick off in Haringey and not Henley?

To accuse those who make those obvious links of being apologists or "making excuses" for attacks on firefighters or robbing small shopkeepers is equally fatuous. To refuse to recognise the causes of the unrest is to make it more likely to recur – and ministers themselves certainly won't be making that mistake behind closed doors if they care about their own political futures.

It was the same when riots erupted in London and Liverpool 30 years ago, also triggered by confrontation between the police and black community, when another Conservative government was driving through cuts during a recession. The people of Brixton and Toxteth were denounced as criminals and thugs, but within weeks Michael Heseltine was writing a private memo to the cabinet, beginning with "it took a riot", and setting out the urgent necessity to take action over urban deprivation.

This time, the multi-ethnic unrest has spread far further and faster. It's been less politicised and there's been far more looting, to the point where in many areas grabbing "free stuff" has been the main action. But there's no mystery as to where the upheaval came from. It was triggered by the police killing a young black man in a country where black people are 26 times more likely to be stopped and searched by police than their white counterparts. The riot that exploded in Tottenham in response at the weekend took place in an area with the highest unemployment in London, whose youth clubs have been closed to meet a 75% cut in its youth services budget.

While bankers have publicly looted the country's wealth and got away with it, it's not hard to see why those who are locked out of the gravy train might think they were entitled to help themselves to a mobile phone. Some of the rioters make the connection explicitly. "The politicians say that we loot and rob, they are the original gangsters," one told a reporter. Another explained to the BBC: "We're showing the rich people we can do what we want."

the reflection of a society run on greed – and a poisonous failure of politics and social solidarity. There is now a danger that rioting might feed into ethnic conflict. Meanwhile, the latest phase of the economic crisis lurching back and forth between the United States and Europe risks tipping austerity Britain into slump or prolonged stagnation. We're starting to see the devastating costs of refusing to change course.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/aug/10/riots-reflect-society-run-greed-looting/print

==============

The Banskters loot and pillage, and dump the penalty for their crimes on the poor and disenfranchised.

[cheguevara]

No way that shit happens in the US. Besides of the militarized police here, the first night that happens those guys get rounded up and sent to Gitmo after being charged with terror crimes.

US goverment is not nearly as oppresive to minorities as British goverment so I doubt anything like that happens.

But if somehow that were to happen here. I disagree on the consequences. The TV, Internet, cell phones would prevent extreme violence on the ppl. And no, this is not Argentina or chile. They would not get rounded up. :lol google up LA riots.

[DarkReign]

US goverment is not nearly as oppresive to minorities as British goverment so I doubt anything like that happens.

But if somehow that were to happen here. I disagree on the consequences. The TV, Internet, cell phones would prevent extreme violence on the ppl. And no, this is not Argentina or chile. They would not get rounded up. :lol google up LA riots.

Forced to agree, If its just riots (like in London) and not a revolt, then it would be a quick little affair with much news coverage.

If its revolt...well...militarized police or not, the government would have to call in the national guard like they did in Detroit 1967.

Difference between Britain and USA, Americans have lots of guns.

[clambake]

Forced to agree, If its just riots (like in London) and not a revolt, then it would be a quick little affair with much news coverage.

If its revolt...well...militarized police or not, the government would have to call in the national guard like they did in Detroit 1967.

Difference between Britain and USA, Americans have lots of guns.

yep, thats what black talons are for.

[cheguevara]

they did call the national guard in the LA riots. But after the 3rd night.

It really can't get worse than the LA riots. it happened and it easily can happen again.

[cheguevara]

what really would fuck shit up is if multiple riots like LA riots happen in dozens of cities at the same time. Like an all out race war or something. then, shit would hit the fan.

[DarkReign]

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/274070/let-britain-burn-john-derbyshire#

Ha, at least here in the States we can blame uneducated Bubbas down south of being overtly racist pigs.

In Britain, apparently, even the educated are racist pigs.

Europe is no example to follow, at all. Everything was peachy keen when everyone was caucasian, prayed to the same God and spoke the same monetary language of business.

Enter the brown people.

London burns and every journalist in sight is either an overt xenophobe or an apologist with hopes of Utopia.

Comical, really.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

I emphatically beg to differ with you.

[DarkReign]

they did call the national guard in the LA riots. But after the 3rd night.

It really can't get worse than the LA riots. it happened and it easily can happen again.


what really would fuck shit up is if multiple riots like LA riots happen in dozens of cities at the same time. Like an all out race war or something. then, shit would hit the fan.

Agreed.

I am not a well-traveled person, even in my own country, so I have no real perspective of other cities and their problems.

But I do know this; Detroit beats them all in the fucked up department.

If there were a place for something like LA 1991 (or was it 93?) to happen again it would be here in Detroit.

But, in contrast to that statement, there is one over-arching problem with that possibility. Anglo people dont live in Detroit city proper, nor does Anglo business (exceptions to every rule, but you get the point). If the minorities there decided to burn and loot, they would be burning and looting from themselves...which btw, aint shit.

I dont know what that means, just me meandering through likely US cities to succumb to the violence.

[Winehole23]

http://stratrisks.com/geostrat/618

[DarkReign]

The Brits seem to want to be pushed around by the thugs and scum of the world. As long as that is true, the most expedient thing to do would be to let it burn.

However, at some point, they may find some vestigal remnants of spines and they will go straight to real bullets. (If they were going to use plastic bullets, that should have been in the first hour.) For now all Brits know there is no protection of private property or of the peaceful citizen, two of the fundamental properties of government in civilization.

It's just wishful thinking. Brits especially need to be taught every so often that weakness asks for violence and attack. They just seem to fall back on apeasement, then take in the teeth over and over again.

One of the comments from WC's article.

lol Chamberlain

[ElNono]

US goverment is not nearly as oppresive to minorities as British goverment so I doubt anything like that happens.

But if somehow that were to happen here. I disagree on the consequences. The TV, Internet, cell phones would prevent extreme violence on the ppl. And no, this is not Argentina or chile. They would not get rounded up. :lol google up LA riots.

This is what came up when I googled it :lol

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/1st_Marine_Division_along_Crenshaw.jpg

The US has increasingly turned into a surveillance state. I would be surprised if you could even organize anything like that without the FBI, NSA, etc learning about it.

While I'm at it, let me send props to the agents reading this! :tu

[DarrinS]

http://www.aim.org/guest-column/the-mob-tears-at-the-foundations-of-civilization-in-london-and-america/

[ElNono]

http://www.aim.org/guest-column/the-mob-tears-at-the-foundations-of-civilization-in-london-and-america/

Really? The race card? smh

[ChumpDumper]

Darrin pounces on the opportunity to bitch about black people. :tu

[ChumpDumper]

The Justice Department under Eric Holder has little interest in bringing hate crimes charges to protect white victims. The corrupt dismissal of the New Black Panther voter intimidation case, which I brought, made that plain.Since he brought the suit, he should know that the Bush administration refused to bring criminal charges in the NBBP affair, but I guess that doesn't fit his agenda so it's easier to lie.

Poor whitey.

lol accuracy in media

[cheguevara]

This is what came up when I googled it :lol

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1a/1st_Marine_Division_along_Crenshaw.jpg

The US has increasingly turned into a surveillance state. I would be surprised if you could even organize anything like that without the FBI, NSA, etc learning about it.

While I'm at it, let me send props to the agents reading this! :tu

not the point. they are not going to send in the military after 1 or 2 days of rioting. protocols must be followed. It's a huge decision to send in military.

and you gotta be kidding if you believe everything on the internet is read by a live person in the USA. maybe 1% of what goes on in the internet is monitored by a live human.

that is why twitter/facebook are so dangerous to goverments. Someone can organize thousands within minutes. I'm sure goverments are scrambling to take measures about that.

[DarrinS]

Darrin pounces on the opportunity to bitch about black people. :tu

Second person interviewed is wise.

r7dMmpwDKJo

[ChumpDumper]

Darrin continues to bitch about black people. :tu

[ElNono]

and you gotta be kidding if you believe everything on the internet is read by a live person in the USA. maybe 1% of what goes on in the internet is monitored by a live human.

Uh? Why have humans do what machines do much better?

Humans just get the compendium and follow up on it.

[ElNono]

Since he brought the suit, he should know that the Bush administration refused to bring criminal charges in the NBBP affair, but I guess that doesn't fit his agenda so it's easier to lie.

Poor whitey.

lol accuracy in media

If you he had to write it, those rioters in Spain or Greece were largely black too... :rolleyes

[cheguevara]

Uh? Why have humans do what machines do much better?

Humans just get the compendium and follow up on it.

point is if machines are monitoring it will take a while for alarms to traverse up all the way to a human if at all. By then it is too late and the riot/demonstration has already happened when it comes to twitter/facebook.

[ElNono]

point is if machines are monitoring it will take a while for alarms to traverse up all the way to a human if at all. By then it is too late and the riot/demonstration has already happened when it comes to twitter/facebook.

Some of these UK riots were organized with hours of anticipation. Mostly using BB messenger, more than twitter/facebook, from what I read.

And frankly, you would be surprised at the level of monitoring taking place this side of the Atlantic (some would say rightly so after 9/11). Hardware wise, they had state of the art deep packet inspection in near real time about 3 years ago. Even if you could pull it off one night, not going to fly with 3 nights in a row like in the UK.

[cheguevara]

again, it's not a readiness issue. It's the protocols that are in place. In the USA you cannot just have the army show up in neighborhoods in 1 night for merely civil unrest.

[DarrinS]

Darrin continues to bitch about black people. :tu

Go back to sleep.

[ChumpDumper]

Go back to sleep.Go bitch about black people. :tu

[DarkReign]

again, it's not a readiness issue. It's the protocols that are in place. In the USA you cannot just have the army show up in neighborhoods in 1 night for merely civil unrest.

True, but 3?

[Viva Las Espuelas]

again, it's not a readiness issue. It's the protocols that are in place. In the USA you cannot just have the army show up in neighborhoods in 1 night for merely civil unrest.

I think in the span of the last 3 years the "U"SA is capable of just about anything.

[ElNono]

again, it's not a readiness issue. It's the protocols that are in place. In the USA you cannot just have the army show up in neighborhoods in 1 night for merely civil unrest.

I'm talking about the police/FBI, not the army. It's not like police don't go around with high powered rifles, full body armor or machine guns (http://www.nj1015.com/Heavily-Armed-Police-Patrolling-NJ-Transit-Train-S/10437724) these days.

[ElNono]

This is America's 'rebellious' youth... (http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/08/jetblue_passenger_arrested_aft.html)

[ElNono]

This is America's 'rebellious' youth... (http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/08/jetblue_passenger_arrested_aft.html)

[ChumpDumper]

This is America's 'rebellious' youth... (http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/08/jetblue_passenger_arrested_aft.html)
R. Kelly peed on girls, and he's black!

[ElNono]

BART San Francisco cut cell services to avert protest (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/blogpost/post/bart-san-francisco-cut-cell-services-to-avert-protest/2011/08/12/gIQAfLCgBJ_blog.html)

[Winehole23]

The relevant shootings were brutal and shocking. I would imagine people will still manage in some way to lodge their dissatisfaction with BART, if any.

[Winehole23]

Organizers planning to disrupt BART service on August 11, 2011 stated they would use mobile devices to coordinate their disruptive activities and communicate about the location and number of BART Police.Why? Did they want to lose?

[Winehole23]

This is America's 'rebellious' youth... (http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/08/jetblue_passenger_arrested_aft.html)If only.

The police/mob action cluster may be fateful for a people whose liberty is already a cut coin.

[Winehole23]

The fluid militarization of police/public relations, has been striking.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Saw this guy and immediately thought of our resident racists here. this guy is for you, Darrin and partschanger!

gU5TcTSa9kk

[boutons_deux]

After British Riots, Conflicting Answers as to ‘Why’

“Why?”

That question has been at the heart of a fraught national debate as Britons puzzle over what drove even some previously law-abiding people to steal, sometimes risking arrest for nothing more than bottles of water. The debate has often divided people into predictable camps.

The Conservative prime minister, David Cameron, stood up in Parliament as Britain smoldered around him on Thursday and railed against “mindless violence and thuggery.” His critics on the left blame deep mistrust of the police in poor communities, and income inequality they say will worsen as his government pursues sweeping cuts in spending and social welfare.

Some commentators have blamed modern society at large. The Daily Telegraph struck a popular chord when it blamed a “culture of greed and impunity” that it said extended to corporate boardrooms and the government itself. Many politicians, meanwhile, have lashed out at technology — including the instant messaging that encouraged looting — for whipping up the crowds.

But as more details of the crimes emerge, the picture has become infinitely more complicated, and confusing. In some of the more shocking cases, the crimes seemed to be rooted in nothing more than split-second decisions made by normally orderly people seduced by the disorder around them.

At several of the riots last week, those perpetrating the violence had no ready explanation for their behavior.

Even some Londoners who had initially condemned the riotous behavior joined in. Bystanders had watched in shock as rioters lined up against police officers on Tottenham’s main street last weekend, setting fires and looting. The mood shifted dramatically, though, after officers moved in, dogs barking and horses charging.

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/08/14/world/europe/14looters.html?_r=1&partner=rss&emc=rss&pagewanted=print

[ElNono]

Essex Police Arrest Man Over Blackberry Water Fight Plan

"Under the banner headline 'Police reassure residents they are working to keep county safe,' Essex police proudly proclaimed that they arrested a 20-year-old man from Colchester who 'allegedly sent messages from a Blackberry encouraging people to join in a water fight.' (http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2011/aug/15/essex-water-fight-blackberry-messenger) Having also made a number of arrests of people sitting at home on Facebook (http://yro.slashdot.org/story/11/08/11/1937221/UK-Police-Arrest-12-Over-Facebook-Use-Inciting-Riots), Acting Assistant Chief Constable Mason wrote: 'Police will continue to monitor social networking sites for unlawful activity.'"

[Wild Cobra]

Saw this guy and immediately thought of our resident racists here. this guy is for you, Darrin and partschanger!

gU5TcTSa9kk
Let me get this strait.

Because we are neither politically correct, or believe blacks are inferior, we are racists?

[Slomo]

Let me get this strait.

Because we are neither politically correct, or believe blacks are inferior, we are racists?


I believe that is in fact the definition of racism. With a nice touch of Supremacism thrown in...

[ElNono]

:lmao

[Wild Cobra]

I believe that is in fact the definition of racism. With a nice touch of Supremacism thrown in...
I could have reversed it.


Because we neither believe blacks are inferior, or we are politically correct, we are racists?

It means the same thing either way.

I have repeatedly in the past said it is those who are politically correct to the point of believing in quota systems who are the racists, because they believe blacks are inferior, and need that help.

[vander]

Years of liberal dogma have spawned a generation of amoral, uneducated, welfare dependent, brutalised youngsters (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2024284/UK-riots-2011-Liberal-dogma-spawned-generation-brutalised-youths.html)


...

So there we have it: a large, amoral, brutalised sub-culture of young British people who lack education because they have no will to learn, and skills which might make them employable. They are too idle to accept work waitressing or doing domestic labour, which is why almost all such jobs are filled by immigrants.

They have no code of values to dissuade them from behaving anti-socially or, indeed, criminally, and small chance of being punished if they do so.

They have no sense of responsibility for themselves, far less towards others, and look to no future beyond the next meal, sexual encounter or TV football game.

They are an absolute deadweight upon society, because they contribute nothing yet cost the taxpayer billions.

...

coming soon to Socialist America, when passive destruction of society just isn't enough

[cheguevara]

"So there we have it: a large, amoral, brutalised sub-culture of young British people who lack education because they have no will to learn, and skills which might make them employable. They are too idle to accept work waitressing or doing domestic labour, which is why almost all such jobs are filled by immigrants.

They have no code of values to dissuade them from behaving anti-socially or, indeed, criminally, and small chance of being punished if they do so.

They have no sense of responsibility for themselves, far less towards others, and look to no future beyond the next meal, sexual encounter or TV football game.

They are an absolute deadweight upon society, because they contribute nothing yet cost the taxpayer billions."

this pretty much defines american kids tbh

[ElNono]

Maybe they realize that social mobility is only going down, and the big gamble they had to make taking out a loan to pay for ever rising tuition prices isn't going to pay off for them, seeing the unemployment lines.

As somebody else said a while ago, not everybody can be at the top. Just don't expect those that cannot make it to put their heads down and walk quietly into the night.

[DarkReign]

Way it goes.

The have-nots want the luxury of the haves.

Its been this way forever. The only difference is, expectations of what constitutes being a "have" has changed dramatically. Before it was food, shelter, freedom and ownership.

Now its money, phones and undeserved respect.

Some people thinking being born is some kind of accomplishment and deserve some level of respect for it.

When in fact, most every person is a piss-ant not worth the air they breathe. The sooner they get to killing each other, the better.

[ElNono]

Way it goes.

The have-nots want the luxury of the haves.

Its been this way forever. The only difference is, expectations of what constitutes being a "have" has changed dramatically. Before it was food, shelter, freedom and ownership.

Now its money, phones and undeserved respect.

Some people thinking being born is some kind of accomplishment and deserve some level of respect for it.

When in fact, most every person is a piss-ant not worth the air they breathe. The sooner they get to killing each other, the better.

Don't necessarily disagree that this is sometimes the case.

But it's also undeniable that the gap between the have and have-nots has grown. I don't justify the bullshit these people do by it, but if we're looking at the why, then you can't overlook it either.

Obviously, this gets magnified when the recession hits.

[DarkReign]

Don't necessarily disagree that this is sometimes the case.

But it's also undeniable that the gap between the have and have-nots has grown. I don't justify the bullshit these people do by it, but if we're looking at the why, then you can't overlook it either.

Obviously, this gets magnified when the recession hits.

Oh no, please do not misunderstand me.

The gap had widened considerably, to unsustainable levels. But the middle class will either do what Americans are doing (nothing at all) or do what the Middle East countries have been doing (revolution).

Running around stealing things and burning buildings/cars isnt a sign of civil unrest or even an indicator of civil order. To me, its backlash for the sake of it.

Which I am not against, tbqh, so long as they are aware that the people theyre stealing from have a right to protect their property (in America anyway). As long as both sides have that clear understanding, I say roll with it.

[ElNono]

Oh no, please do not misunderstand me.

The gap had widened considerably, to unsustainable levels. But the middle class will either do what Americans are doing (nothing at all) or do what the Middle East countries have been doing (revolution).

Running around stealing things and burning buildings/cars isnt a sign of civil unrest or even an indicator of civil order. To me, its backlash for the sake of it.

Which I am not against, tbqh, so long as they are aware that the people theyre stealing from have a right to protect their property (in America anyway). As long as both sides have that clear understanding, I say roll with it.

Agreed

[Agloco]

Way it goes.

The have-nots want the luxury of the haves.

Its been this way forever. The only difference is, expectations of what constitutes being a "have" has changed dramatically. Before it was food, shelter, freedom and ownership.

Now its money, phones and undeserved respect.

Some people thinking being born is some kind of accomplishment and deserve some level of respect for it.

When in fact, most every person is a piss-ant not worth the air they breathe. The sooner they get to killing each other, the better.


Oh no, please do not misunderstand me.

The gap had widened considerably, to unsustainable levels. But the middle class will either do what Americans are doing (nothing at all) or do what the Middle East countries have been doing (revolution).

Running around stealing things and burning buildings/cars isnt a sign of civil unrest or even an indicator of civil order. To me, its backlash for the sake of it.

Which I am not against, tbqh, so long as they are aware that the people theyre stealing from have a right to protect their property (in America anyway). As long as both sides have that clear understanding, I say roll with it.

:tu

DR's got it straight here.

Agree 100%