What Duncan Would Look Like Without Manu and Parker

[Koolaid_Man]

He would only have the * 99 ring of which Phil Jackson already is on record as saying is a fluke.

Let me put this in context for you...we like to say Kobe 5 and Duncan 4 and it's true. However, Duncan won his titles playing with 3 players that were great at their positions. Namely - Robinson, Parker, Manu.... Kobe's won with different teams with 1 player great ( Shaq) at his position and 1 player good (Pau) at his position.

If you take Manu and Parker away from Shimmy and Take Snaq away from Kobe...Leave them both with a good big man. Shimmy keeps Robinson and Kobe keeps Pau then no matter how you slice it...it's still

Kobe 2
Duncan 1


enjoy your weekend fellas. :toast

[lefty]

lol Kobe 0 ithout Shaq and Pau


Jordan didn't need all-star bigs


Magic and Kobe :lmao

[Koolaid_Man]

lol Kobe 0 ithout Shaq and Pau


Jordan didn't need all-star bigs


Magic and Kobe :lmao


but he needed the same thing that Duncan needed. all-star guards...

lest I remind you:

Jordan without Pippen (5 seasons):

.430 win %
0 Titles
0 MVPs
0 Finals MVP
0 Finals appearances
0 Playoff series wins
1-9 playoff record
0 NBA All Defense Team
0 NBA Defensive Player of the year




Kobe without Snaq (6 seasons):

.611 win %
3 Finals appearances
2 Championships
1 MVP (Reg season)
2 MVP (Finals)
5 NBA All Defense 1st Team
81 points in 1 game
62 points in 3 quarters (outscored Mavs all by himself)
4 straight 50+ pt games
30 straight 40+ games averaged 40 for a month



Kobe 3 Seasons without Shaq or Gasol:
.492 win %
0 Titles
1 Regular Season MVP
0 Finals MVP
0 Finals appearances
0 Playoff series wins
4-8 playoff record
3 NBA All Defense Team
0 NBA Defensive Player of the year

[Giuseppe]

Jordan without Pippen (5 seasons):

.430 win %
0 Titles
0 MVPs
0 Finals MVP
0 Finals appearances
0 Playoff series wins
1-9 playoff record
0 NBA All Defense Team
0 NBA Defensive Player of the year

Pippen

[lefty]

but he needed the same thing that Duncan needed. all-star guards...

lest I remind you:

Jordan without Pippen (5 seasons):

.430 win %
0 Titles
0 MVPs
0 Finals MVP
0 Finals appearances
0 Playoff series wins
1-9 playoff record
0 NBA All Defense Team
0 NBA Defensive Player of the year




Kobe without Snaq (6 seasons):

.611 win %
3 Finals appearances
2 Championships
1 MVP (Reg season)
2 MVP (Finals)
5 NBA All Defense 1st Team
81 points in 1 game
62 points in 3 quarters (outscored Mavs all by himself)
4 straight 50+ pt games
30 straight 40+ games averaged 40 for a month



Kobe 3 Seasons without Shaq or Gasol:
.492 win %
0 Titles
1 Regular Season MVP
0 Finals MVP
0 Finals appearances
0 Playoff series wins
4-8 playoff record
3 NBA All Defense Team
0 NBA Defensive Player of the year


Still, he didnt have dominating bigs

ANd he beat teams that had centers, Ewing, Alonzo, Shaq

[ElNono]

lol not mentioning how many seasons without Shaq - Gasol
lol having to reach for Jordan's Wizards days
lol suggesting TD > Jordan
lol Kevin

[Giuseppe]

...though Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game until Kobe took him in and Kobe won 2 without Daddy.

[ElNono]

...though Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game until Kobe took him in and Kobe won 2 without Daddy.

Though Kobe couldn't get out of the 1st round until Gasol took him in and Pau won 2...

[Giuseppe]

Though Kobe couldn't get out of the 1st round until Gasol took him in and Pau won 2...

Though Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game till Kobe took him in & Kobe won 2 without Daddy.

[ElNono]

Though Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game till Kobe took him in & Kobe won 2 without Daddy.

Though Kobe was given the keys to the franchise and couldn't get out of the 1st round until Pau took him and won 2

[Giuseppe]

Though Kobe was given the keys to the franchise and couldn't get out of the 1st round until Pau took him and won 2

Though Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game till Kobe took him in and Kobe won two without Daddy. & Daddy only won 1 without Kobe, &:::

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

[ElNono]

Though Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game till Kobe took him in and Kobe won two without Daddy. & Daddy only won 1 without Kobe, &:::

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

Though Kobe was given the keys to the franchise and couldn't get out of the 1st round until Pau took him and won 2

Boiled down:::

Duncan 4

Daddy 4

Pau 2

[lefty]

Kobe: 0
Shaq: 3
Pau: 2


Tee, Hee

[Giuseppe]

Kobe: 5

tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

:lmao 2003. made the lakers cry like bitches on tv & won a championship with manu who was a bench warmer, parker who lost his spot to speedy claxton, & robinsons who could barley manage 20 mins a game.

:lmaokobes 1st round exit to nash and the "defensive minded" suns without amare.

:lmaoKobe on a team that spent over 100 mil just so he could get bukkaked by an old man, midget, & a turtle.

[Leetonidas]

http://defaultprime.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/KoolAidMan.gif

[Giuseppe]

:lmao 2003. made the lakers cry like bitches on tv & won a championship with manu who was a bench warmer, parker who lost his spot to speedy claxton, & robinsons who could barley manage 20 mins a game.

:lmaokobes 1st round exit to nash and the "defensive minded" suns without amare.

:lmaoKobe on a team that spent over 100 mil just so he could get bukkaked by an old man, midget, & a turtle.

Still & all, Kobe handed the tired old shit bag Duncan the shitty end of the 5-4 stick and Duncan had no other choice but, to take hold. It's topsy-turvy now. Kobe is topsy. the tired old shit bag Duncan is turvy.

It happens.

the shit bag should take heart though. At least Kobe didn't retire him holding that shitty end of the 5-4 stick like he did Daddy. Daddy has to hold it for eternity.

Oh, me.

[Leetonidas]

Switching Manu and Parker with Shaq and how many titles would we have?

Kobe: 2
Timmy: 10

[Giuseppe]

Switching Manu and Parker with Shaq and how many titles would we have?

Kobe: 2
Timmy: 10

That's pie in the sky.

Timmy is down 5-4 and his shit bag is draggin'.

It happens.

[Barfunk]

Kobe never rang, made it out of the first round, and missed the playoffs altogether without Shaq until Pau Gasol came along.

[Ashy Larry]

Kobe never rang, made it out of the first round, and missed the playoffs altogether without Shaq until Pau Gasol came along.


you can also say Duncan never defended his title ......

back-to-backs

Bryant: 3
Duncan: 0

:toast

[cheguevara]

tbh, Kobe would have zero if not for Fisher

[Giuseppe]

tbh, Kobe would have zero if not for Fisher

"would have" has Duncan, tired & old, totin' his shit bag around, holding the dirty end of the 5-4 stick.

[Giuseppe]

Kobe never rang, made it out of the first round, and missed the playoffs altogether without Shaq until Pau Gasol came along.

& Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game till Kobe took him in. & Kobe sent Daddy into eternity down 5-4.

Duncan & his requisite tired old shit bag better get on the ball, or, he'll end up in the same place as Daddy...SOL.

It happens. It happened to Daddy. Timmy ain't immune.

[Ashy Larry]

man, can you imagine this room if Kobe or Duncan rings atleast once more ?????

damn, thats gonna be some funny shit ........

[Giuseppe]

^Kobe gettin' his 5th was almost the end. We could stand Duncan gettin' one, but, if Kobe gets another and ties MJ on the raw count, it'll be a catastrophic event.

[Ashy Larry]

Even if they were tied at 6 apiece, I'd still give the nod to Jordan, but Bryant would definitely move up in the top standings ........

[stxspurs]

Life must suck when u have to think of kobe v Duncan threads

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

^Kobe gettin' his 5th was almost the end. We could stand Duncan gettin' one, but, if Kobe gets another and ties MJ on the raw count, it'll be a catastrophic event.
he would be a legit scotty pippen clone. got to give it to kobe. not easy becomeing the 2nd best 2nd banana in NBA history.

heres to kobe.:toast a Truely great 2nd option.
























:p:

[Ashy Larry]

he would be a legit scotty pippen clone. got to give it to kobe. not easy becomeing the 2nd best 2nd banana in NBA history.

heres to kobe.:toast a Truely great 2nd option.



:p:


So the spurs got their asses reamed by a second option in 2001,2002 and 2008 ???

:toast

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

So the spurs got their asses reamed by a second option in 2001,2002 and 2008 ???

:toast
cant worry about a 2nd option when u have a 7'2 monster in the paint and 2 more allstar 7 footer in the post.

none the less. kobe you truley are great at playing robin.:toast

[Barfunk]

you can also say Duncan never defended his title ......

back-to-backs

Bryant: 3
Duncan: 0

:toast

No argument here. Duncan never went back to back.

[Giuseppe]

he would be a legit scotty pippen clone. got to give it to kobe. not easy becomeing the 2nd best 2nd banana in NBA history.

heres to kobe.:toast a Truely great 2nd option.

Hell, MJ is a Pippen clone. He couldn't do squat until Pippen helped him.

Kobe rang twice without Daddy.

[Barfunk]

& Gasol couldn't win a single playoff game till Kobe took him in. & Kobe sent Daddy into eternity down 5-4.

Duncan & his requisite tired old shit bag better get on the ball, or, he'll end up in the same place as Daddy...SOL.

It happens. It happened to Daddy. Timmy ain't immune.

Kobe gave some a little scare in 2006, but he blew it. With a chance to move on to, at the very least, the second round as an undisputed 1st banana against a very stacked/one of the best offensive teams of the last 10-15 years, he q***t. Got dammit Kobe.

[Ashy Larry]

cant worry about a 2nd option when u have a 7'2 monster in the paint and 2 more allstar 7 footer in the post.

none the less. kobe you truley are great at playing robin.:toast


well, you should have paid more attention to that 2nd option, especially after he made Bowen's and Duncan's assholes skeet :toast

[Giuseppe]

Kobe gave some a little scare in 2006, but he blew it. With a chance to move on to, at the very least, the second round as an undisputed 1st banana against a very stacked/one of the best offensive teams of the last 10-15 years, he q***t. Got dammit Kobe.

Kobe quit. I don't dispute it. Your Rodman quit too in the playoffs. MJ quit as well. Pippen too.

It happens.

[Ashy Larry]

Kobe gave some a little scare in 2006, but he blew it. With a chance to move on to, at the very least, the second round as an undisputed 1st banana against a very stacked/one of the best offensive teams of the last 10-15 years, he q***t. Got dammit Kobe.

it's debatable but he was very brutal ..... if they didn't take the Suns out while up 3-1, they weren't gonna win that series. But what he did in Game 7 was what he did in the other games they had won. He dished the rock and the other just didn't make shots. You can literally say he checked out. With that said, if you're gonna go out, you go out shooting.

When Bryant is eliminated, his squads usually lose big ........

see 2003 Spurs
2004 Pistons
2006 Suns
2008 C's
2011 Mavs

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

well, you should have paid more attention to that 2nd option, especially after he made Bowen's and Duncan's assholes skeet :toast
just too damn hard to watch robin in the back when batmans or should i say superman is kicking ass up front.

none the less kobe was great at playing robin. he should be proud that the only player better at playing 2nd banana than him is pippen. heres to kobe.:toast

[Giuseppe]

it's debatable but he was very brutal ..... if they didn't take the Suns out while up 3-1, they weren't gonna win that series. But what he did in Game 7 was what he did in the other games they had won. He dished the rock and the other just didn't make shots. You can literally say he checked out. With that said, if you're gonna go out, you go out shooting.

When Bryant is eliminated, his squads usually lose big ........

see 2003 Spurs
2004 Pistons
2006 Suns
2008 C's
2011 Mavs

Even at 3-1 I fuckin' knew it. Like the Yankees up 3-0 on Boston that one year. It didn't feel right & correct. Same thing with that Phoenix series. That ball fuckin' bounces around until that idiot forward for the Suns got it and launched. Thomas.

Fuck me. '84 & '06. I'll take those to the grave.

[Ashy Larry]

just too damn hard to watch robin in the back when batmans or should i say superman is kicking ass up front.

none the less kobe was great at playing robin. he should be proud that the only player better at playing 2nd banana than him is pippen. heres to kobe.:toast


here's to Bryant :toast

[Ashy Larry]

Even at 3-1 I fuckin' knew it. Like the Yankees up 3-0 on Boston that one year. It didn't feel right & correct. Same thing with that Phoenix series. That ball fuckin' bounces around until that idiot forward for the Suns got it and launched. Thomas.

Fuck me. '84 & '06. I'll take those to the grave.

2006 would have been nice to have a second round matchup with the Clippers but I doubt they'd get by the Mavs ........ so I can stomach that one.

1984 will always be with me until the end of time.

bad pass overshadows 22 point performance by J Dub and up 5 and possession of the ball with 59 ticks on the clock ......

total meltdown. Even if they would have gotten one of those brutal losses, they would have won in 6.

[Giuseppe]

1984 will always be with me until the end of time.

bad pass overshadows 22 point performance by J Dub and up 5 and possession of the ball with 59 ticks on the clock ......

total meltdown. Even if they would have gotten one of those brutal losses, they would have won in 6.

I cried like a baby. Watchin' those fuckers make fun of us at Boston Garden with their towels. It was a living nightmare. They were pantomining Magic's NBA commercial where he passed to Jabbar and then posed at mid court and pointed his finger.

Remember they turned up the heat in the Gardne before the game. We never stood a chance and they knew it. That is when they, & frankly me believed they'd destroyed Magic, broke him and would never have to deal with him again.

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

here's to Bryant :toast
yep heres to Robin. :toast

[Ashy Larry]

those were tough times .... I think they would pull the fire alarms at the Lakers' hotel in the middle of the night so they kept having to get up and evacuating the building ..... but for everyone the Lakers should have had, they could easily have one taken away - 2000 vs the blazers and 2002 vs. the Kings

[Ashy Larry]

yep heres to Robin. :toast

And since Duncan like to swim, that would make him Aquaman. Everyone shits on Aquaman, even Robin

:toast here's to Aquaman

[joshdaboss]

Better thread: Who is better: Scottie Pippen or Kome Cryant?

[Nathan89]

it's debatable but he was very brutal ..... if they didn't take the Suns out while up 3-1, they weren't gonna win that series. But what he did in Game 7 was what he did in the other games they had won. He dished the rock and the other just didn't make shots. You can literally say he checked out. With that said, if you're gonna go out, you go out shooting.

When Bryant is eliminated, his squads usually lose big ........

see 2003 Spurs
2004 Pistons
2006 Suns
2008 C's
2011 Mavs

Which is sad considering how much talent he always has(besides 2006).

[Giuseppe]

those were tough times .... I think they would pull the fire alarms at the Lakers' hotel in the middle of the night so they kept having to get up and evacuating the building ..... but for everyone the Lakers should have had, they could easily have one taken away - 2000 vs the blazers and 2002 vs. the Kings

Yep. 2000 could very easily been the end before it ever really got started.

I get nervous just thinking about that game with Portland.

[Nathan89]

Even if they were tied at 6 apiece, I'd still give the nod to Jordan, but Bryant would definitely move up in the top standings ........

Like it's even close.

[ElNono]

Kobe quit. I don't dispute it. Your Rodman quit too in the playoffs. MJ quit as well. Pippen too.

It happens.

Kobe quit in the Finals. None of the other guys did.

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

And since Duncan like to swim, that would make him Aquaman. Everyone shits on Aquaman, even Robin

:toast here's to Aquaman
I see we can go by what they do off court.

srry cant think of any heros who rape hotel maids or assult people at church.

so yea heres to aquaman. :toast

good of you to honor a true nba great. dont know why we where toasting to a 2nd banana.

[MR.SILVER&BLack]

Better thread: Who is better: Scottie Pippen or Kome Cryant?
pippen: 6
old shit bag rapist: 5

cue cullby

[Giuseppe]

Kobe quit in the Finals. None of the other guys did.

Jordan quit 3/4 of a season and then tried to sneak back in and steal one. Uh, uh. Your Rodman quit in the playoffs. Pippen quit right in the timeout huddle.

[Ashy Larry]

Which is sad considering how much talent he always has(besides 2006).


2003 - front office made zero moves and the league caught up with them. Didn't help that "Batman", the supposed team leader, got surgery on his own time. They expended too much energy in trying to reach that 4 seed.

2004 - Scott Williams and Malone's playoff injury. Slava/Walton combo on Sheed = death. And the fact that "Batman" was out rebounded by a smaller Ben Wallace. That should never happen. Bryant was awful in that series as well. Compton's finest, Tayshawn Prince, always gives Bryant problem and he shots the Lakers out of a couple games; also saved their asses in game 2.

2008 - 24 point blown lead came back and bit them but the C's were clearly better. Yeah, Bryant had nice talent but no one other than he and Fish had really been on that stage; and it showed. People wanna say Bryant was second fiddle to Pau, look at that series. Dude crumbled like a bitch at times and got in the fetal position. The next time they played with a ring under his belt, he played like a man.

2011 - Just the Mavs year. Matchup problems everywhere and Dirk clearly destroyed, as you guys call him, the team leader. Little JJ killed our point guards and lived in the paint. Lotta talent but Dallas was clearly hungrier and better.

[Nathan89]

those were tough times .... I think they would pull the fire alarms at the Lakers' hotel in the middle of the night so they kept having to get up and evacuating the building ..... but for everyone the Lakers should have had, they could easily have one taken away - 2000 vs the blazers and 2002 vs. the Kings

Yep. 2002 when the refs had to cheat to get a team with two so called top ten all-time players.

[Giuseppe]

Yep. 2002 when the refs had to cheat to get a team with two so called top ten all-time players.

& CWEBB got happy, turned his back on Horry and headed on back up the lane.

tee, hee.

[Ashy Larry]

Yep. 2000 could very easily been the end before it ever really got started.

I get nervous just thinking about that game with Portland.


that lob from Bean to Shaquille ... once that went down, I ran down the street in my drawls ........ just a tremendous play. Nice crossover and finish. If Shaquille had the work ethic of that 2000 season every year, he'd easily be top 3 ......

[ElNono]

Jordan quit 3/4 of a season and then tried to sneak back in and steal one. Uh, uh. Your Rodman quit in the playoffs. Pippen quit right in the timeout huddle.

None in the Finals... except the snitch.

[Nathan89]

2003 - front office made zero moves and the league caught up with them. Didn't help that "Batman", the supposed team leader, got surgery on his own time. They expended too much energy in trying to reach that 4 seed.

2004 - Scott Williams and Malone's playoff injury. Slava/Walton combo on Sheed = death. And the fact that "Batman" was out rebounded by a smaller Ben Wallace. That should never happen. Bryant was awful in that series as well. Compton's finest, Tayshawn Prince, always gives Bryant problem and he shots the Lakers out of a couple games; also saved their asses in game 2.

2008 - 24 point blown lead came back and bit them but the C's were clearly better. Yeah, Bryant had nice talent but no one other than he and Fish had really been on that stage; and it showed. People wanna say Bryant was second fiddle to Pau, look at that series. Dude crumbled like a bitch at times and got in the fetal position. The next time they played with a ring under his belt, he played like a man.

2011 - Just the Mavs year. Matchup problems everywhere and Dirk clearly destroyed, as you guys call him, the team leader. Little JJ killed our point guards and lived in the paint. Lotta talent but Dallas was clearly hungrier and better.

It's sadPERIOD

[Ashy Larry]

Yep. 2002 when the refs had to cheat to get a team with two so called top ten all-time players.

didnt have to cheat to beat the spurs though ..... they curbstomped those fucks :toast

[Giuseppe]

None in the Finals... except the snitch.

But, each one quit nonetheless.

[Nathan89]

& CWEBB got happy, turned his back on Horry and headed on back up the lane.

tee, hee.

That was after the refs.

[ElNono]

But, each one quit nonetheless.

None in the Finals, nonetheless.

[Giuseppe]

That was after the refs.

& after Adelman told him not to.

[Nathan89]

didnt have to cheat to beat the spurs though ..... they curbstomped those fucks :toast

Yes, the Spurs can't afford the talent the Lakers can.

If they could Duncan would have won in 2004 and 2006.

[Ashy Larry]

& CWEBB got happy, turned his back on Horry and headed on back up the lane.

tee, hee.


Game 6 was obvious .........

Game 5 could easily be the same. Kings tap the ball out of bounds and get the ball. Pick on Fish, IMO, was clean. No gripe there. But Shaquille and Bryant have 11 fouls total, the Kings entire roster had 20 and known hack Scott Pollard, has not one personal foul guarding Shaquille??? LOL ......

But even with that said. Game seven in the toughest arena to play in and they choked.

here's to the Heimlich :toast

[Ashy Larry]

Yes, the Spurs can't afford the talent the Lakers can.

If they could Duncan would have won in 2004 and 2006.


translation:

back-to-backs

Duncan: 0
Bryant: 3

O'Neal: 2
Bryant: 3

:toast

[Nathan89]

translation:


:toast

actual meaning:

If Duncan's team was handicapped by the checkbook his ring total would shit all over Kobe and Shaq. He would be a top 5 player all-time.

[Ashy Larry]

actual meaning:

If Duncan's team was handicapped by the checkbook his ring total would shit all over Kobe and Shaq. He would be a top 5 player all-time.

Now you're making it sound like he had shit around him ..... they had the number one seeded team in the league in 2004 against a Lakers squad with an 80-85% Malone, if that.

And 2006: they finished once again with the best record in the league and gagged at home.

I wouldn't blame the money. I blame would blame the city. And that doesn't erase the fact that the Spurs had four chances to repeat and went 0-4 and a few of those teams that didn't were considered the best in the west when the playoffs started.

[Giuseppe]

translation:

back-to-backs

Duncan: 0
Bryant: 3

O'Neal: 2
Bryant: 3

:toast

Said "out loud" like this it's quite impressive.

Ashy

[Giuseppe]

If

:lmao

[Giuseppe]

Game 6 was obvious .........

Game 5 could easily be the same. Kings tap the ball out of bounds and get the ball. Pick on Fish, IMO, was clean. No gripe there. But Shaquille and Bryant have 11 fouls total, the Kings entire roster had 20 and known hack Scott Pollard, has not one personal foul guarding Shaquille??? LOL ......

But even with that said. Game seven in the toughest arena to play in and they choked.

here's to the Heimlich :toast

Exactly. The Kings were searching high & low for a way to lose.

Ashy

[LkrFan]

Still, he didnt have dominating bigs

ANd he beat teams that had centers, Ewing, Alonzo, Shaq

He had dominant versatile defenders though

Grant (ask TD :lol) - could defend centers and PFs
Rodman - could defend all 5 positions
Pippen - could defend every position but center

There are others, but between these 3 versatile defenders and offensive specialists (I.e. Kukoc, Kerr, Paxson), MJ's teams were stacked.

And who said MJ didn't have legit bigs? The Worm is in the HOF and so is Pippen. I laugh when people say MJ did it without good bigs. He had them. If they were playing the likes of Shaq, Ewing, Daughterty, Dream, or Zo, Phil Jackson employed centers/PFs by committee to supply likke 18-24 timely fouls per game to slow him down and shut EVERYBODY else down. Cartwright, Wennington, Luc Longly, Bison Dele, etc., were all ready to give timely fouls. They all were effective offensively.

You don't win 6 rings without legit bigs. MJ didn't have 20/10 bigs because he didn't need them with how their rosters were constructed.

[dbreiden83080]

He would only have the * 99 ring of which Phil Jackson already is on record as saying is a fluke.


What does Phil Jackson say about the 2004 neutering the Pistons gave his Lakers?

[LkrFan]

What does Phil Jackson say about the 2004 neutering the Pistons gave his Lakers?

:lol

[Giuseppe]

Really? I just had no trust in Shaq. He feared the clutch moments. Not just as a Laker, but even going all the way back to his LSU days.

^It's moments like this (off the cuff) that make Luva a livin' fuckin' legend.

[namlook]

Jordan without Pippen (5 seasons):

.430 win %
0 Titles
0 MVPs
0 Finals MVP
0 Finals appearances
0 Playoff series wins
1-9 playoff record
0 NBA All Defense Team
0 NBA Defensive Player of the year



Kobe didn't need Pippen to win. :rollin

[namlook]

What does Phil Jackson say about the 2004 neutering the Pistons gave his Lakers?

Jordan and Pippen lost to the Pistons in the playoffs three years in a row. That's gotta hurt when a team owns you year in and year out like that.

[Sean Cagney]

What would anyone look like without some help? Great thread you idiot. Kobe without Shaq 3 less titles, it's clear you need quality help to win a title.