Feds order pot shops to close within 45 days

[JoeChalupa]

http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=news/state&id=8381783

SAN FRANCISCO -- Federal officials are warning California medical marijuana dispensaries they must shut down within 45 days or face criminal prosecution and having their property confiscated.

The state's four U.S. attorneys sent letters Wednesday and Thursday notifying at least 16 pot shops or their landlords that they are violating federal drug laws, even though medical marijuana is legal in California. The attorneys are to announce their coordinated crackdown at a Friday news conference.

The move marks an escalation of the conflict between the government and the medical marijuana industry.

The Associated Press obtained copies of the letters that a prosecutor sent to 12 of San Diego's dispensaries. They state that federal law "takes precedence over state law and applies regardless of the particular uses for which a dispensary is selling pot.


What a buzz kill.

[CosmicCowboy]

no kidding. I know it's trite, but really...don't they have better things to do?

[Wild Cobra]

no kidding. I know it's trite, but really...don't they have better things to do?
No they don't. They just don't want to pay for their marijuana, and want to take it from others.

[Yonivore]

no kidding. I know it's trite, but really...don't they have better things to do?
Obviously, the pot shops were encroaching on their relationship with the narco-terrorists running guns in exchange for Mexican pot and criminals.

Something had to be done.

[Wild Cobra]

Obviously, the pot shops were encroaching on their relationship with the narco-terrorists running guns in exchange for Mexican pot and criminals.

Something had to be done.

I can see Oregon, California, and other states getting together and taking this to the Supreme Court, in an argument that state commerce is not constitutionally controllable by the commerce clause.

[coyotes_geek]

A ridiculous and pointless move by our government.

[Wild Cobra]

A ridiculous and pointless move by our government.
It has seemed for years that our politicians and the directions they send down to the entities they controls, are hellbent on destroying this nation.

Some states have instituted a measured approach to legitimate usage of marijuana. Yes, illegitimate usage will also happen, but who are we to figure where to draw the line on a drug less harmful than alcohol?

Anyway, I see this clearly as a states rights issue. Fuck the federal government over their meddling on this.

[baseline bum]

A ridiculous and pointless move by our government.

This is Obama in 100% campaign mode as opposed to the typical 75% campaign mode we have seen through most of his presidency. It's stupid as hell though; he was already going to be spun as soft on drugs for not prosecuting these shops previously, and now he's anti-civil liberties so he can alienate everyone.

[boutons_deux]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/06/cook-county-spent-78-mill_n_998615.html

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/09/23/ray-kelly-orders-nypd-to-_n_978619.html

http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/newsandviews/675759

http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/152487

Busting marijuana users is a huge business, silly make work for the police who rack up arrests to make quota.

I figure once BigPharma muscles in, mj will become legal, licensed, even more expensive, and controlled by BigPharma.

btw, annual accidental deaths from prescription drugs now surpass annual deaths from car accidents. Around 35K/year.

how many mj users die per year from mj?

and of course, illegal sales of prescription drugs is huge, eg:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/04/us-drugbust-boeing-idUSTRE7937CB20111004?feedType=RSS&feedName=domesticNews

but there's no move to make prescription drugs Schedule I.

[LnGrrrR]

Didn't Obama say that they were going to stop prosecuting these cases? Nice to see he's still being a fuckwad when it comes to civil liberties.

[Yonivore]

Didn't Obama say that they were going to stop prosecuting these cases? Nice to see he's still being a fuckwad when it comes to civil liberties.
Oh, he's always been a fuckwad.

[boutons_deux]

yeah, another Obama screw up.

The law is the law, and as top policeman, he's obligated to enforce it. Can't see how he could ever see it any differently.

mj as Schedule I controlled substance? That's a bad law or rule.

The Repugs and "Christians" will NEVER permit it to be changed.

Just another phony war on whatever that the US is botching and losing, while screwing up its citizens' lives. But! Drug Warriors love the job security and pay, PIC loves the incarcerations, south-of-the-border drug lords love the $Bs.

[Cheeto]

As a person with a "recommendation" from my Dr, this makes me a bit nervous. I use medical mj for pain & muscle spasms. It's also helped with my depression. And no I'm not stoned all the time either. I use it when I have pain from physical activities from work & what not.

Big Pharma doesn't want it legalized when they know that their pain pills are addictive & are making them bank.

http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/311488_160155804075293_100002426234045_322753_2104 927362_n.jpg

[Yonivore]

Big Pharma doesn't want it legalized when they know that their pain pills are addictive & are making them bank.
Nah, if that were the case, they'd just provide the pot pharmacies with their weed.

[MannyIsGod]

Nah, if that were the case, they'd just provide the pot pharmacies with their weed.

You don't think they prefer something they can charge a whole hell of a lot more for?

Also, I didn't see you being critical of Bush when he did this. Why not? Its definitely a bad move on the part of this administration and an utter waste of resources but I find it interesting that you didn't see that until Obama was in office.

[ElNono]

Next up ordering to shut down state illegal immigration enforcement?

[ElNono]

Nah, if that were the case, they'd just provide the pot pharmacies with their weed.

Weed is cheap. Pills under a patent on the other hand...

[BlackSwordsMan]

Government must be hard pressed for cash if they're taking weed from stoners and re-selling it.

[Yonivore]

You don't think they prefer something they can charge a whole hell of a lot more for?
What makes you think they wouldn't?


Also, I didn't see you being critical of Bush when he did this. Why not? Its definitely a bad move on the part of this administration and an utter waste of resources but I find it interesting that you didn't see that until Obama was in office.
Then you weren't paying attention.

The silly and destructive "War on Drugs," and his signing the TARP legislation are two of his policies with which I vehemently disagreed and still do.

[MannyIsGod]

What makes you think they wouldn't?


Then you weren't paying attention.

The silly and destructive "War on Drugs," and his signing the TARP legislation are two of his policies with which I vehemently disagreed and still do.

Fair enough on the 2nd and I don't understand what you're saying in the first part. You're saying they'd charge more for the weed? Yeah that wouldn't work because people would get it cheaper. Or are you saying that they would prefer to sell a more expensive drug? Because if thats the case then you have the reason why they fight against legalization.

[mouse]

Many gang members and drug dealers will benefit from this. I wonder how long before crime rate doubles as everyone tries to replace this market.

[Yonivore]

Fair enough on the 2nd and I don't understand what you're saying in the first part. You're saying they'd charge more for the weed? Yeah that wouldn't work because people would get it cheaper.
They wouldn't get it cheaper, legally.

What would the drug companies care? Buy my expensive marijuana or buy my expensive pill...or, break the law, and go see mouse.

[ElNono]

Ofcourse you'll get it cheaper legally. You can't patent mj, and 'generics' on unpatented medicine are legal. They just can't make a buck on it like they do on patented pills. Not to mention the amount of $$$ they'll lose on other patented painkillers.

[mouse]

How ignorant are Americans?

http://www.legendsofamerica.com/photos-americanhistory/ProhibitionPoster.jpg

http://www.vintageperiods.com/_files/Image/5%20Prohibition%20Disposal%289%29.jpg

[Wild Cobra]

Next up ordering to shut down state illegal immigration enforcement?
Different argument.

Immigration is a job put into congress' lap to make laws and enforce, by constitution. The interstate commerce clause is illegally applied when the commerce is not across state lines. This is how they say they have the right to trump states rights... The use the [interstate] commerce clause.

[coyotes_geek]

Anyway, I see this clearly as a states rights issue. Fuck the federal government over their meddling on this.

Agreed. It should be a states rights issue, and I'd be encouraging my state to quit wasting the taxpayers money trying to lock up stoners.

[boutons_deux]

mj is transported across states lines and it's a FEDERAL Schedule I controlled substance, so it's a federal/ICC jurisdiction.

[MannyIsGod]

They wouldn't get it cheaper, legally.

What would the drug companies care? Buy my expensive marijuana or buy my expensive pill...or, break the law, and go see mouse.

Of course they would get it cheaper. Whats your logic around a cheap drug that anyone could cultivate being expensive?

[Yonivore]

Of course they would get it cheaper. Whats your logic around a cheap drug that anyone could cultivate being expensive?
Well, Manny, cheap and illegal vs. expensive and legal?

Many marijuana users will not violate the law for weed but, they will pay exorbitant prices for drugs.

[CosmicCowboy]

Of course they would get it cheaper. Whats your logic around a cheap drug that anyone could cultivate being expensive?

The problem with cultivating is that it's practically an automatic felony if you get busted. They weigh roots, stems, leaves etc. which puts you immediately into the "dealer" quantity according to the law.

[DarkReign]

I did not read the link, but Michigan also passed a Medical Marijuana law some years back.

Dispensaries are being shutdown but the "caregivers" are not.

You can still use marijuana, you can still possess it (with a card of course), you can still procure it from your caregiver for money.

What the state and Federal law is doing, here, is shutting down dispensaries.

Not that I care for the technicality, should be legal, but just a little perspective on it.

[MannyIsGod]

Well, Manny, cheap and illegal vs. expensive and legal?

Many marijuana users will not violate the law for weed but, they will pay exorbitant prices for drugs.

I have no idea why you think all legal pot would be expensive. Its not currently.

[ElNono]

Different argument.

Not really. This isn't about the commerce clause. This is about federal drug enforcement laws trumping state laws. Exactly what happens with Immigration enforcement.

[Yonivore]

I have no idea why you think all legal pot would be expensive. Its not currently.
If Big Pharma owned the rights to be the sole distributor, do you think it would remain cheap?

That was the point.

[MannyIsGod]

If Big Pharma owned the rights to be the sole distributor, do you think it would remain cheap?

That was the point.

Well now you just added a whole new variable. Unless they can find a way to patent Pot, why would they be the sole distribute? The very fact that they could not be the sole distributor and thus enjoy a huge profit margin is at the very core of why they fight legalization.

[Yonivore]

Well now you just added a whole new variable. Unless they can find a way to patent Pot, why would they be the sole distribute? The very fact that they could not be the sole distributor and thus enjoy a huge profit margin is at the very core of why they fight legalization.
Moonshining is still illegal yet, Distillers can sell distilled spirits.

Marijuana could remain illegal while Big Pharma figured out a way to legalize it for medicinal uses.

[ChumpDumper]

Why is yoni so hot for big pharma?

[CosmicCowboy]

WTF? ATF says medical mj users can't buy guns?

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/oct/6/medical-pot-users-fuming-over-atfs-gun-sale-ban/

DENVER — You can have your gun, or you can have your medical marijuana. But the Obama administration now says you can’t have both.

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives is in the crosshairs for a recent memo prohibiting gun merchants from selling firearms to anyone who uses marijuana, including those with state-issued medical-marijuana cards.

An open letter dated Sept. 21 from Arthur Herbert, ATF assistant director for Enforcement Programs and Services, said that, “any person who uses or is addicted to marijuana, regardless of whether his or her State has passed legislation authorizing marijuana use for medicinal purposes, is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance, and is prohibited by Federal law from possessing firearms or ammunition.”

That didn’t sit well with Montana Attorney General Steve Bullock, who fired off a letter this week to Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr. saying that the policy raises “serious legal issues under the Second Amendment, and the Equal Protection and Due Process clauses of the Fifth Amendment.”

The conflict illustrates the contradictory state of affairs between the states and federal government on the subject of medical marijuana. Sixteen states and the District of Columbia have passed medical-marijuana laws, a situation the Justice Department has agreed to tolerate despite continuing to enforce federal laws banning marijuana use.

Where the agency draws the line is often a source of confusion. The Sept. 21 letter was issued in response to gun sellers who asked the agency for guidance because buyers were showing them medical-marijuana cards as identification.

Mr. Bullock blasted the ATF for failing to consult with state officials before issuing the directive, saying a cooperative approach “would be much better than the type of unilateral proclamation represented by the ATF letter.”

Critics contend that the law unfairly discriminates against marijuana users because patients who take other controlled substances, such as OxyContin, have no such restrictions. In his letter, Mr. Bullock pointed out federal law allows those who are prescribed controlled substances by a physician to possess or buy firearms and ammunition.

“The ATF letter does not take this into account,” said Mr. Bullock, who called on the department to work with the states in “exploring a reasonable solution to the problems created by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives letter.”

Mr. Herbert states in his letter that marijuana, as a Schedule 1 controlled substance, cannot be prescribed under federal law, “even if such use is sanctioned by state law.”

The policy puts gun dealers in a difficult position, say critics.

Potential gun buyers must state on an ATF form whether they use marijuana at the time of sale. If they answer “yes,” they are denied the purchase, but even if they answer “no,” the seller cannot complete the sale if there is “‘reasonable cause to believe’ that the person is an unlawful user of or addicted to a controlled substance,” according to the directive.

“The dealers have no way of knowing whether someone smokes pot unless they come in toking,” said Gun Owners of America executive director Larry Pratt. “It’s just one more way to aggravate the dealers and play ‘gotcha’ with the dealers. They [the ATF] are totally out of control.”

In an editorial this week, the Denver Post blasted the directive, calling it an “assault on constitutional rights.” Colorado voters legalized medical marijuana in 2000.

“[U]sers of medical marijuana are faced with two choices: pass on gun ownership or illegally lie about their use of marijuana,” the Post said. “Unbelievable.”

[ChumpDumper]

lol addicted to marijuana

[MannyIsGod]

Moonshining is still illegal yet, Distillers can sell distilled spirits.

Marijuana could remain illegal while Big Pharma figured out a way to legalize it for medicinal uses.

Um, think about the example you just used. Liquor isn't exactly an expensive commodity.

Why is that? How many distillers are there?

[ElNono]

:lol @ that quick goalposts move...

[Yonivore]

Um, think about the example you just used. Liquor isn't exactly an expensive commodity.
I'm pretty sure if Big Pharma monopolized the legal distribution of marijuana, it would be expensive.


Why is that? How many distillers are there?
I really don't know why we're beating this dead horse. I was merely suggesting part of Big Pharma's opposition to medical marijuana was that they could position it to exploit a monopoly on the drug.

But, fine, have it your way, business would never do that.

[ChumpDumper]

Um, think about the example you just used. Liquor isn't exactly an expensive commodity.

Why is that? How many distillers are there?Right.

Was liquor more or less expensive during Prohibition?

Did violent outlaws profit from liquor during Prohibition? Did they continue to profit at the same rate from liquor after the end of Prohibition?

[ChumpDumper]

I'm pretty sure if Big Pharma monopolized the legal distribution of marijuana, it would be expensive.What makes you think they could?



I really don't know why we're beating this dead horse. I was merely suggesting part of Big Pharma's opposition to medical marijuana was that they could position it to exploit a monopoly on the drug.

But, fine, have it your way, business would never do that.Ir's precisely because they can't establish a monopoly on marijuana that they oppose its legalization.

[Cheeto]

Weed is cheap. Pills under a patent on the other hand...


Weed is not cheap!

Having been to dispensaries around WA State & having access to price lists from all over. Prices depend on quality of the bud too.

Typical prices
Lower grade $10 per gram
Mid grade - $12
High grade - $15

So it's like $250 - $360 an ounce.

When I lived in SA I used to buy ounces for $50-$70. But the quality is nowhere what I can get now. 1 hit & your very well stoned.

[MannyIsGod]

I'm pretty sure if Big Pharma monopolized the legal distribution of marijuana, it would be expensive.


I really don't know why we're beating this dead horse. I was merely suggesting part of Big Pharma's opposition to medical marijuana was that they could position it to exploit a monopoly on the drug.

But, fine, have it your way, business would never do that.

Well yeah - but there's no basis for them to have a monopoly while these IS a basis for them to keep it illegal.

[ElNono]

Weed is not cheap!

Having been to dispensaries around WA State & having access to price lists from all over. Prices depend on quality of the bud too.

Typical prices
Lower grade $10 per gram
Mid grade - $12
High grade - $15

So it's like $250 - $360 an ounce.

When I lived in SA I used to buy ounces for $50-$70. But the quality is nowhere what I can get now. 1 hit & your very well stoned.

Check out prices for Copaxone (http://legalmedsdirect.com/buy-COPAXONE-online), patented, multiple-sclerosis drug (not even close to the most expensive, but treats something mj would be used for).

[Yonivore]

Well yeah - but there's no basis for them to have a monopoly while these IS a basis for them to keep it illegal.
Never mind.

[baseline bum]

Weed is not cheap!

Having been to dispensaries around WA State & having access to price lists from all over. Prices depend on quality of the bud too.

Typical prices
Lower grade $10 per gram
Mid grade - $12
High grade - $15

So it's like $250 - $360 an ounce.

When I lived in SA I used to buy ounces for $50-$70. But the quality is nowhere what I can get now. 1 hit & your very well stoned.

When I moved to California I found the chronic and Humboldt County shit to be far superior than the crap from Mexico that we had in SA, so I can understand the price difference. The Pacific NW climate is perfect for growing really potent shit.

[CuckingFunt]

Big Pharma doesn't want it legalized when they know that their pain pills are addictive & are making them bank.

Growers don't particularly want it legal, either. I knew several when I lived in Humboldt who were quite happy to keep it illegal and expensive. Find a big patch of land surrounded/sheltered by huge trees, buy some camo netting, hire a couple rednecks to walk around with shotguns, and you're realistically looking at a little more risk for a LOT more profit.

[Wild Cobra]

mj is transported across states lines and it's a FEDERAL Schedule I controlled substance, so it's a federal/ICC jurisdiction.
Then bust the operations that cross state lines.

[Wild Cobra]

I have no idea why you think all legal pot would be expensive. Its not currently.
It's way more expensive than inflation allows for. It's gone up something like 1500% over the last 30 years.

[Wild Cobra]

The Pacific NW climate is perfect for growing really potent shit.
Yes it is, and 30 years ago, the real potent homegrown was about $20/oz. It's funny because the less potent import stuff was more money.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

It's way more expensive than inflation allows for. It's gone up something like 1500% over the last 30 years.

You are out of the loop then.

I can buy schwag for the same price I did or cheaper than a decade ago and dank goes for about the same as well. I would gouge you on prices too tbh.

[ChumpDumper]

It's way more expensive than inflation allows for. It's gone up something like 1500% over the last 30 years.It's almost as if something has artificially driven up the cost of marijuana over the past 30 years.

[Yonivore]

PU274uGEEpM
Will be cross-posted in the OWS thread because, this guy hits both subjects in one succinct video.

Greg, put down the pipe and go see a doctor about that cough.

[ChuckD]

They wouldn't get it cheaper, legally.

What would the drug companies care? Buy my expensive marijuana or buy my expensive pill...or, break the law, and go see mouse.

People can grow their own pot. They generally have a tougher time with pharmaceuticals.

[DMC]

It's overbearing. The feds don't want to give ground on the "War on Drugs" even though they've never gained any.

[DMC]

You are out of the loop then.

I can buy schwag for the same price I did or cheaper than a decade ago and dank goes for about the same as well. I would gouge you on prices too tbh.
What about spoof and groze? How much are you paying for schmack and stack?

You hard core druggie you.

[Nbadan]

Lamar Smith has got to go.....away....far, far away


The House Judiciary Committee passed a bill yesterday that would make it a federal crime for U.S. residents to discuss or plan activities on foreign soil that, if carried out in the U.S., would violate the Controlled Substances Act (CSA) -- even if the planned activities are legal in the countries where they're carried out. The new law, sponsored by Judiciary Committee Chairman Rep. Lamar Smith (R-Texas) allows prosecutors to bring conspiracy charges against anyone who discusses, plans or advises someone else to engage in any activity that violates the CSA, the massive federal law that prohibits drugs like marijuana and strictly regulates prescription medication.

"Under this bill, if a young couple plans a wedding in Amsterdam, and as part of the wedding, they plan to buy the bridal party some marijuana, they would be subject to prosecution," said Bill Piper, director of national affairs for the Drug Policy Alliance, which advocates for reforming the country's drug laws. "The strange thing is that the purchase of and smoking the marijuana while you're there wouldn't be illegal. But this law would make planning the wedding from the U.S. a federal crime."

The law could also potentially affect academics and medical professionals. For example, a U.S. doctor who works with overseas doctors or government officials on needle exchange programs could be subject to criminal prosecution. A U.S. resident who advises someone in another country on how to grow marijuana or how to run a medical marijuana dispensary would also be in violation of the new law, even if medical marijuana is legal in the country where the recipient of the advice resides. If interpreted broadly enough, a prosecutor could possibly even charge doctors, academics and policymakers from contributing their expertise to additional experiments like the drug decriminalization project Portugal, which has successfully reduced drug crime, addiction and overdose deaths.

The Controlled Substances Act also regulates the distribution of prescription drugs, so something as simple as emailing a friend vacationing in Tijuana some suggestions on where to buy prescription medication over the counter could subject a U.S. resident to criminal prosecution. "It could even be something like advising them where to buy cold medicine overseas that they'd have to show I.D. to get here in the U.S.," Piper says.

Huff (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/06/us-drug-policy-war-congress_n_998993.html)

[mouse]

All of you next payday take 40 dollars and walk down any collage district with bars and night clubs on a Staurday night and tell me what is harder to get.......


This?


http://www.amsterdammarijuanaseedbank.com/Growguides/images/cannabis-marijuana-bag.jpg


or This?



http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-9BY1MPJIGXI/TlIE0H49USI/AAAAAAAABRo/RODGUUkF_rw/s1600/ZELBORAF_logo.jpg

[boutons_deux]

Lamar Smith has got to go.....away....far, far away

Huff (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/10/06/us-drug-policy-war-congress_n_998993.html)

Lamar Smith is inherited Old Alamo Heights Money, white Christian wealth, the "1%" in Congress.

"Lamar Seeligson Smith (born November 19, 1947) ... Smith was born in San Antonio, Texas. He graduated from T.M.I.: The Episcopal School of Texas, Yale University and Southern Methodist University Law School. He briefly
practiced law as an attorney before entering politics"

Ending Federal Marijuana Prohibition Act of 2011

On June 23, 2011, H.R. 2306 was introduced to Congress by Barney Frank and co-signer Ron Paul.[7] The intent of the bill was to end the Federal prohibition on Cannabis, turning over the regulation of marijuana to states (similar to alcohol). The bill was the first of its kind since prohibition began. H.R. 2306 would limit federal powers to interstate transfer; while laws for cultivation, sales, use, and taxation would be determined by each state. This bill was well received by the public, especially medical marijuana patients and activists.

Lamar Smith informed reporters that he had no intention of considering the bill or providing it with a hearing. With Smith's position as chairman of the House Committee on the Judiciary, he has great influence on what bills will be considered.

Smith stated that "Marijuana use and distribution is prohibited under federal law because it has a high potential for abuse and does not have an accepted medical use in the U.S., The Food and Drug Administration has not approved smoked marijuana for any condition or disease."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamar_S._Smith

You can be damn sure his law isn't going after Alamo Heights CSA/mj users. :lol

(hmm, that Jewish middle name "Seeligson" is probably from some inter-breeding with the Old Jewish Texas money, more inherited wealth, going back to 19th century)

[Yonivore]

What about spoof and groze? How much are you paying for schmack and stack?

You hard core druggie you.
:lmao