Ben The Flopper

[TheTruth]

I think Big Ben is a great player and he had a great game tonight. BUT I can't help but laugh when Tony Parker is able "knock" him over.

People complain about Manu being a flopper (and he does exaggerate sometimes), but Ben is just as bad, if not worse.

[ca®lo]

ben = divac

am talking about the flops k.

[atlfan25]

http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=18522

[GoSpurs21]

most of the pistons are floppers (see rip, prince, both wallaces) in all three games, but the national media is afraid to call them out

I am just happy that Joey Crawford, Bob Delaney , and Bennett Salvatore all Spurs haters are not going to be around for the next couple of games

Bring it next game pistons cause Manu and Timmy sure will

[Wallace ²]

To me, there are 2 kinds of flops. One where it is exaggerated way too much, and one that is timely. If the defender gets bumbed semi-hard in the post and just stumble backward, it will never be called a charge. If the defender falls, not flops, but falls backwards, then they make the ref make a decision. Other times, when the defender flops and kicks his feet wildly in the air, then I hate it when the second type get the call.

[SouthernFried]

Ben's been flopping this whole series. Seems he can't keep his feet at all. Parker been knocking him down, Ginobili been knocking him down, Duncan been knocking him down.

He may have a lotta musles, and that mean face...but, he's so weak...Parker just leveled him!

Poor Ben.

[ginobme]

yeah, but after the way the game was called in game 2, you had to see this coming. Detroit got every single call, every tip, every bounce.

[TheTruth]

yeah, but after the way the game was called in game 2, you had to see this coming. Detroit got every single call, every tip, every bounce.
They showed more hustle. They earned everything last night. BUT I was getting pissed that the refs weren't calling the moving screens. I HATE THAT!!

[WayDowntownBang]

I find it interesting that this was the complaint about Ginobili Games 1 and 2, and now is the complaint about Ben Wallace in Game 3.

Nothing changed, except for the victory margin. Interesting.

[TheTruth]

ACTUALLY, we have been complaining about Ben flopping since game one, when he tried to flop on the manu play but was instead called for the foul. Scroll through the old Threads.

[Fouled Out]

Yeah, he let his hair loose to get calls as well. :fro Hair or no hair the Spurs we not getting their shots down and got lazy on the defense. It will not happen again Piston fan. They always come back stronger the next game.

[RIP_MVP]

If flopping could make you lose a series, Indy would have taken Detroit out in round 2. It's all part of the game, along with the bad calls. Everything evens out in the end. :fro Go Ben!! :fro

[TheTruth]

If flopping could make you lose a series, Indy would have taken Detroit out in round 2. It's all part of the game, along with the bad calls. Everything evens out in the end. :fro Go Ben!! :fro
I agree with you. It's just so damn funny how Big Ben looks getting bowled over by The Tiny Frenchman.

[ambchang]

I was just disappointed that a main weapon in a 3-time DPoY's arsenal is the flop and he actually go bananas when he didn't get the call. Sure, Ginobili flops, but when he doesn't get the call, he just suck it up and keep playing.

[SouthernFried]

I don't care if Ben flops. I'd rather seem him on the ground, and out of the play...than standing and blocking shots :)

And any Detroit fans who say anything about Manu's flopping...should :stfu

[SWC Bonfire]

I agree with you. It's just so damn funny how Big Ben looks getting bowled over by The Tiny Frenchman.

Hey! Pound per pound, he's the strongest man in basketball. :lol

[dn0]

I agree with you. It's just so damn funny how Big Ben looks getting bowled over by The Tiny Frenchman.
Yes big men flopping is really sad.

[MainEvent]

I thought Ben's flop on Duncan was pretty bad. He's taken a few flops this series that he normally doesn't. Maybe he's making up for having to take Shaq's elbow to his grill for 7 straight games without a whistle to be heard.

[nkdlunch]

Up to this point Ben is getting the finals MVF trophy, most valuable flopper.

[MainEvent]

And as soon as they start calling Duncan for using his off arm every time he shoots a jump hook, I might feel bad about it.

[Marklar MM]

And as soon as they start calling Duncan for using his off arm every time he shoots a jump hook, I might feel bad about it.


No where near Shaq. They should call a foul on Shaq every time he gets the ball.

[Experiment2100]

And as soon as they start calling Duncan for using his off arm every time he shoots a jump hook, I might feel bad about it.


Is that before or after they call Billups for pushing off on Parker before he puts something up.

[GrandeDavid]

Ben is a flopper with an afro.

[SWC Bonfire]

Ben is a flopper with an afro.

Cushions his fall!

j/k, flopping talk is weak. I like Ben falling to the ground, keeps him from blocking shots.

[MainEvent]

Is that before or after they call Billups for pushing off on Parker before he puts something up.

It's right after Bowen grabs Rip when he's about to run off a screen. :angel


In reality, I don't mind letting the teams play like this. Sure, Ben's flopped on a couple of plays. But when you've got an All-NBA flopper like Manu on your team, I don't see how you can complain too much. Both teams have been whistled for offensive calls that maybe shouldn't have been. Duncan uses his off arm when shooting his jump hook. Fine, just don't call McDyess for a foul when Timmy throws his elbow into his chest (and Rasheed should start doing the same thing at the other end). And like I said in another post, Bowen and Rip both do a lot of clutching, grabbing, bumping and pushing off when they are going at it. Just call it fair across the board and I don't have a problem with letting them play.

[WayDowntownBang]

These are all parts of the game. I don't know why people want to use flopping as an excuse. Ben flops, but guess what? It's part of the game. Ginobili the same thing. And, the clearouts with the arm by Duncan and Shaq. All parts of the game.

I said after Game 1 and 2 that I thought there were some things happening that were frustrating the Pistons: flopping, bad officiating, etc. I also said that those are PART OF THE GAME, and that if you want to win a championship, you have to get over those things.

I stick to that. Some Spurs fans seem to not be able to see that.

And SouthernFried.. "And any Detroit fans who say anything about Manu's flopping...should "STFU"

Great post. /rolls eyes.

[Experiment2100]

It's right after Bowen grabs Rip when he's about to run off a screen. :angel


.

But before Rasheed pulls of a well thought out moving screen. That's gotta be the way it's written up in the time out.

[stonic youth]

Yes he's exaggerated some contact, but no way is he in Manu's league. The commentary from the Spur's opponents during previous playoff rounds compared to the Piston's about Manu and Ben's respective embellishment overwhelmingly point to Ginobili. Keep in mind, for a man of Bens size to move his feet fast enough to consistently draw charges on players as quick as Parker and Ginobili doesn't exactly lend itself to rock solid balance. If a player is moving laterally with his feet side by side and perpindicular to the offensive players intended path it doesn't take nearly the force to knock him over per usual, this axiom is often referred to in boxing regarding proper posture.

[MainEvent]

But before Rasheed pulls of a well thought out moving screen. That's gotta be the way it's written up in the time out.

Seriously, we can do this all day. Did you even bother to read the rest of that post?

[Experiment2100]

Seriously, we can do this all day. Did you even bother to read the rest of that post?


Yes, you didn't bring up Sheed's screens

[MainEvent]

Well, if you want to talk moving screens, Nazr appears to be an expert.

[Experiment2100]

Well, if you want to talk moving screens, Nazr appears to be an expert.


We can go around all day about this flopper crap. Let's just agree that we wouldn't be bitching if they were on our team.

[MainEvent]

And can we agree that neither is on Iverson's level as well?

[TwoHandJam]

Is that before or after they call Billups for pushing off on Parker before he puts something up.
No no.. you've got it mixed up. It comes after Rasheed's moving screens to free up Rip. Man I thought they were never going to call that. Thankfully they did at least once.

[WayDowntownBang]

My bottle of whine is better than your bottle of whine.

They're both WHINE. Let them play already.

[whottt]

And can we agree that neither is on Iverson's level as well?


I disagree...I think Wallace is the best flopper in the NBA...the only guys that might be better are Fisher or Divac...and Divac's best flops are behind him.

[BigDaddyMatty]

Yes he's exaggerated some contact, but no way is he in Manu's league. The commentary from the Spur's opponents during previous playoff rounds compared to the Piston's about Manu and Ben's respective embellishment overwhelmingly point to Ginobili. Keep in mind, for a man of Bens size to move his feet fast enough to consistently draw charges on players as quick as Parker and Ginobili doesn't exactly lend itself to rock solid balance. If a player is moving laterally with his feet side by side and perpindicular to the offensive players intended path it doesn't take nearly the force to knock him over per usual, this axiom is often referred to in boxing regarding proper posture.
I agree that it is impressive that a MAN the size of Ben is always in good positon to flop, but I don't agree that Manu is a more blatant flopper. The reason every other team complained about Manu's flopping is that they had no other way of stopping him. I watched the Indiani series, and that was some of the best flopping I have ever heard. Ben, you are the man.

[MainEvent]

I agree that it is impressive that a MAN the size of Ben is always in good positon to flop, but I don't agree that Manu is a more blatant flopper. The reason every other team complained about Manu's flopping is that they had no other way of stopping him. I watched the Indiani series, and that was some of the best flopping I have ever heard. Ben, you are the man.

So somebody says it about Manu, it's just hatin'; but you say it about Ben makes it the truth? Ok, then.

[nkdlunch]

Manu flops, yes. Ben flops, yes. Ben looks funnier flopping because he's a huge monster and he flops even with Parker :lol

noone is complaining. It's part of the game.

[2centsworth]

Ben is one Flopping MOFO. Still I'd take him on my team any day.

[TheTruth]

My bottle of whine is better than your bottle of whine.

They're both WHINE. Let them play already.
Yeah, but what kind of cheese do you eat with it? I had me a little bree last night.

[WayDowntownBang]

I had stacks of cheese for those two games in San Antonio. There was more Whine in Detroit than I've seen in a long time. I could go another day without more Whine.

[TheTruth]

So somebody says it about Manu, it's just hatin'; but you say it about Ben makes it the truth? Ok, then.
What do the two great floppers of the series have in common? :fro
Thats right! Its all about the hair baby.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

I had stacks of cheese for those two games in San Antonio. There was more Whine in Detroit than I've seen in a long time. I could go another day without more Whine.


For a few days here, I thought it was football season. :lol

[ambchang]

Yes he's exaggerated some contact, but no way is he in Manu's league. The commentary from the Spur's opponents during previous playoff rounds compared to the Piston's about Manu and Ben's respective embellishment overwhelmingly point to Ginobili. Keep in mind, for a man of Bens size to move his feet fast enough to consistently draw charges on players as quick as Parker and Ginobili doesn't exactly lend itself to rock solid balance. If a player is moving laterally with his feet side by side and perpindicular to the offensive players intended path it doesn't take nearly the force to knock him over per usual, this axiom is often referred to in boxing regarding proper posture.


Ginobili falls, Ben Wallace jumps back, and jumping back is not losing balance. You can argue what you want, but it would be very hard to convince me that a guy losing balance would actually jump up about 2 feet and land on his back like some bad dude in a Jet Li movie. And given how whiny the Spurs past opponents are (Allen, George Karl, Anthony), I wouldn't use their testimony as proof.

[MajicMan]

Ben is NBA defensive flopper of the year hahaha. Something wrong with a big dude falling all over the place like Ben does. Manu's flopping is annoying as hell but dude actually gets hacked sometimes so he takes his lumps.

[MainEvent]

Uh huh, and Ben Wallace never gets run over or elbowed in the grill by the likes of Shaq and Duncan.

I love the "yeah Manu flops, but he's small and he gets hit so he deserves to flop" mentality. As if he's the only player that takes hits during the game.

[Wallace ²]

Ginobili falls, Ben Wallace jumps back, and jumping back is not losing balance.

What about game 1 when Lindsey got the charge on Manu, and Manu flew from the free throw line all the way to the end line. That was a pretty far "Fall". Fact is, the both flop a lot, a good strategic move, so what is everybody complaining about.

[PM5K]

I don't mind floppers, if you can make a small ammount of contact into a foul with good acting then more power to you.

What I hate is when announcers make it seem like it really was a foul, call it what is it, a flop, plain and simple.

I want to hear announcers say, what a beautiful flop by Manu, or Ben, etc....

They just kept calling those flops fouls last night and I didn't care for it...

[whottt]

What about game 1 when Lindsey got the charge on Manu, and Manu flew from the free throw line all the way to the end line. That was a pretty far "Fall". Fact is, the both flop a lot, a good strategic move, so what is everybody complaining about.


Because you were more effective at it last night than we were...every body screwing with Manu has hurt his flopping game and he's to intimidated to flop now.

[ALVAREZ6]

I want to hear announcers say, what a beautiful flop by Manu, or Ben, etc....

:lol :lmao :lol :lmao

I wouldn't count on them saying that though....would be pretty funny.

[ambchang]

I don't mind floppers, if you can make a small ammount of contact into a foul with good acting then more power to you.

What I hate is when announcers make it seem like it really was a foul, call it what is it, a flop, plain and simple.

I want to hear announcers say, what a beautiful flop by Manu, or Ben, etc....

They just kept calling those flops fouls last night and I didn't care for it...


This is exactly what I was thinking, thanking for putting my feelings into words.