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Hook Dem
09-19-2004, 12:09 PM
Bush's drills with the Alabama Guard confirmed



By Rowan Scarborough

THE WASHINGTON TIMES



The White House yesterday released military records that it said demonstrate conclusively that President Bush completed the required drills leading to an honorable discharge from the Texas Air National Guard in 1973.

"These documents clearly show that the president fulfilled his duties," said White House spokesman Scott McClellan as he waved copies of smudgy, 31-year-old pay and accreditation records stored on microfilm in a U.S. government military archives in Colorado.

The president had been dogged by accusations that he did not fulfill make-up requirements for missed Guard drills, and an officer of the Alabama Air National Guard, where the make-up drills were scheduled, said he did not remember Mr. Bush.

But further confirmation was supplied yesterday by a woman who dated the young George W. Bush in 1972 who says she distinctly remembers the young pilot visiting Montgomery that year to fulfill his Air National Guard commitment.

Emily Marks Curtis told The Times that she and Mr. Bush met in the summer of 1972 when he went to Montgomery from Texas to work in the U.S. Senate campaign of Winton Blount, a Bush family friend. She said the two became good friends.

After that election, she said, Mr. Bush returned to Texas. A few weeks later, he telephoned to say he was returning to Montgomery to complete drilling days at an Alabama squadron to which he had been transferred that year.

It has been standard procedure for many years for National Guard units to excuse members from scheduled drills for employment reasons, with the stipulation that missed drill time be made up.

"He called to tell me he was coming back to finish up his National Guard duty," said Mrs. Curtis, who now lives in New Orleans. "I can say categorically he was there, and that's why he came back."

She said that he rented an apartment for a two-week stay and that she met him for dinner several times.

"I didn't see him go to work. I didn't see him come home from work," she said. "He told me that was why he was in Montgomery. There is no other reason why he would come back to Montgomery."

At the White House yesterday, Mr. McClellan criticized Democrats who have raised an issue that the president thought was settled during his days as Texas governor and in the 2000 presidential race.

"There are some out there that were making outrageous, baseless accusations," the press secretary said. "It was a shame that they brought it up four years ago. It was a shame that they brought it up again this year."

When a television reporter accused Mr. McClellan of not answering his questions, the usually stoic Mr. McClellan responded tartly: "I'm sorry, John, but, you know, this is an important issue that some chose to raise in the context of an election year. And the facts are important for people to know. And if you don't want to know the facts, that's fine, but I want to share the facts with you."

The records show that Mr. Bush earned sufficient drilling points to earn an honorable discharge. They also show he drilled two days in October 1972 and four days in November 1972 when he had transferred to the Alabama Guard unit.

Mr. Bush's Air National Guard record resurfaced as a campaign issues after Democratic National Committee Chairman Terry McAullife accused the president of "being AWOL" during the Vietnam War.

Mr. McAullife, 47, was too young to be drafted when mandatory service was abolished in 1974, has not served in the military.

Republicans accuse Mr. McAullife of raising the issue now to contrast Mr. Bush's Guard service with Sen. John Kerry's service as a Navy lieutenant in Vietnam. Mr. Kerry, the Democratic presidential front-runner, has made his military service a prime theme in his stump speeches and TV ads.

Mr. McAullife kept up the attack yesterday, saying questions remain.

"We also still do not know why the president's superiors filed a report saying they were unable to evaluate his performance for that year because he had not been present to be evaluated," he said. "That report was filed on the very day these documents allege he was reporting for duty."

Mr. Bush's former commander, now dead, wrote that he could not judge the pilot's performance for 1972 and 1973. However, others who served with Mr. Bush remember him as "one of our best pilots."

In the 1992 campaign, Mr. Kerry, who has equated Mr. Bush's National Guard service to running away to Canada, took to the Senate floor to denounce Republicans who questioned candidate Bill Clinton's draft record. Mr. Kerry said it was time to stop re-examining how people did or did not serve during the Vietnam War. Mr. Clinton has never served in the military. As a university student, Mr. Clinton wrote a letter to the commander of the Reserve Officers Training Corps at the University of Arkansas, expressing a "loathing" for the military.

Mr. Bush joined the Texas Air National Guard in May 1968 after graduating from Yale. He went through initial flight training and then qualified on the F-102, an aging jet fighter interceptor, regarded as a particularly difficult plane to fly that would be phased out in the coming years.

He drilled at the 111th Fighter Interceptor Squadron, Texas Air National Guard, based at Ellington Air Force Base near Houston, accumulating scores of flying hours as his unit practiced intercepting Russian jets over the Gulf of Mexico.

William Campenni, a retired Guard pilot, served with Mr. Bush in the 111th. He remembers a training flight over the Gulf during which the future president mimicked a Soviet bomber.

"We crashed a couple of guys while George was down there," said Mr. Campenni, who now runs an engineering consulting business in Herndon. "In those days, we were using obsolete airplanes in the Guard. That was hazardous work. We were losing people."

In 1972, Mr. Bush left Texas to work on the Senate campaign and transferred to a squadron in the 187th Tactical Reconnaissance Wing in Montgomery. He apparently missed drills during the election campaign, and that is why he returned later in November.

He would have held a desk job at the 187th because he was not qualified on the wing's reconnaissance jets. "It's quite common for a pilot and other Guard members to go to another unit in another state," Mr. Campenni said. "We can 'pull drills' there and get credit for your duty in your state."

Mr. Bush left the Guard six months early to attend Harvard business school and was honorably discharged in October 1973.

Many pilots resigned from the Guard before completing their enlistment term in those years. President Nixon was withdrawing thousands of troops from Vietnam, delivering a surplus of pilots to the active Air Force and the Air Guard.

IcemanCometh
09-19-2004, 12:19 PM
Duffman says alot of things

SpursWoman
09-19-2004, 12:26 PM
In the 1992 campaign, Mr. Kerry, who has equated Mr. Bush's National Guard service to running away to Canada, took to the Senate floor to denounce Republicans who questioned candidate Bill Clinton's draft record. Mr. Kerry said it was time to stop re-examining how people did or did not serve during the Vietnam War. Mr. Clinton has never served in the military. As a university student, Mr. Clinton wrote a letter to the commander of the Reserve Officers Training Corps at the University of Arkansas, expressing a "loathing" for the military.


Irony abounds.... :fro

Yonivore
09-19-2004, 12:28 PM
Kerry might as well have said, "Guardsmen are wusses."

There are a whole hell of a lot of people that serve in the Guard.

exstatic
09-19-2004, 02:31 PM
"I didn't see him go to work. I didn't see him come home from work," she said.

Yonivore
09-19-2004, 02:47 PM
But, she saw him there and pay records support that he went to work.

All she admitted was that she's not a stalker.

SpursWoman
09-19-2004, 03:38 PM
I'm sorry....I thought it said that they'd dated. Did I miss the "they were shacking up" part?


:wtf

DeSPURado
09-19-2004, 06:47 PM
This is old news. It doesn't prove attendance anymore than what we already have. The ARF summary of points as well as the Payroll releases already show he may have attended one or two meetings. It still wan't enough to cover the year, if you give him the benefit of the doubt.

I would like to see the link to when this was published. Because I have heard about this Emily statement before. It came up at least 6 months ago, and I want to know if there are actually new documents that have been released.

SpursWoman
09-19-2004, 06:54 PM
if you give him the benefit of the doubt.


Which the liberals do not. I don't think this will ever be dropped until someone produces film of every fucking step he took during those 6 years.

Oh, wait. The first 4 where he clearly went above and beyond his required duty either aren't important or they don't count. So I guess he'd only need the last 2 years, and even then ya'll would be finding something to criticize about that.

Because God knows how important this is in regard to the next 4 years.

DeSPURado
09-19-2004, 06:57 PM
Spurswoman believe me or not this is important to me. It goes to the man's character. If he's not honest about this, and I don't believe he is being, he's dishonoring anyone who did serve in Vietnam. I lost my father to that war. And it would piss me off.

Can you please post the date or the link to that article?

SpursWoman
09-19-2004, 07:06 PM
How in the world is he dishonoring anyone who served in Vietnam?? So now Bush is responsible for what happened to your dad?

At the time in question, Nixon was already pulling thousands of troops out of Vietnam, creating the need to find places for those pilots on active duty, much less the reserves.

How incredibly ironic that you would say that about Bush, and still support Kerry, who basically accused your dad of being a criminal.

Yonivore
09-19-2004, 07:09 PM
So, what's the Demoncratic argument now? Did he show up only a couple of times but not enough to get credit or is there absolutely no proof he ever showed up in Alabama?

I've heard both from you DeSPURate.

DeSPURado
09-19-2004, 07:13 PM
Kerry said the same things my father said. The war was fucked up. I have pages of journal entries talking about the very atrocities Kerry testified about. The men who commited those atrocites were the bad guys, not Kerry for revealing the truth.


I believe I covered enough about why its important to me. You can call me a liar or a hypocrite all you want. I have told you how I feel about what it means when Bush says he served honorably. Notice its about what he is saying about it now that pisses me off, not what he really did then. I don't approve of what he did then, but his honesty about it now is the only issue of relevance.

Yonivore
09-19-2004, 07:17 PM
It's not you that's the liar and hypocrite, it's Kerry. You're just another useful Demoncratic idiot.

Tommy Duncan
09-19-2004, 10:12 PM
Your father died in 1980?

DeSPURado
09-19-2004, 10:22 PM
Later than that. But as I have already explained he died of a complication from a wound he recieved. But whatever.

I'd have to go back and look at everything if you want the technical explanation. His lung was severely damaged. And his heart had to over compensate because of that. Thats how it was explained to me when I was six.

Tommy Duncan
09-19-2004, 10:41 PM
OK sorry to hear that. Never saw that description.

DeSPURado
09-19-2004, 10:45 PM
Np I really need to be more clear about it. I need to be careful not to mislead anyone. Its just clear in my mind so I don't always remember to offer the details.

Hook Dem
09-19-2004, 11:20 PM
"If he's not honest about this, and I don't believe he is being, he's dishonoring anyone who did serve in Vietnam. I lost my father to that war. And it would piss me off." ...........And Kerry's actions after he came back didn't dishonor those who served in Vietnam????. Please!!!!! Give me a break! I mean no disrespect for your father but Kerry even dishonored him.

Nbadan
09-20-2004, 02:34 AM
How incredibly ironic that you would say that about Bush, and still support Kerry, who basically accused your dad of being a criminal.

Does anyone else cringe when they read the word basically?

To me it seems like DeSpurado's dad was the real hero for willing to admit that autrocities did happen in Vietnam, and like the Abu Gharib prison torture, the alleged war-crimes where systematic. I know it's not easy for Vietnam Veterans to relive the war, but if we are ever to put this matter to rest it is the Veterans who are going to have to do so.

Tommy Duncan
09-20-2004, 02:44 AM
Again no one has suggested that war crimes did not happen in Vietnam. The real question is whether or not it was like Kerry said it was.

After about the 50th time I would think you would be able to actually understand the issue.

Nbadan
09-20-2004, 03:19 AM
..and I would hope that you would understand that if there was even one war autrocity, that was one autrocity to many.

Tommy Duncan
09-20-2004, 03:30 AM
Cute attempt, unfortunately for you that's not the issue.

Nbadan
09-20-2004, 04:38 AM
The point is there is no issue here just a smear campaign by the Swift boat liars and another distraction to keep voters from talking about real issues. Which is were Kerry has been trying to steer the campaigns for the last week, and the * administration has failed to adjust its tired attack strategy of catchy rhetoric with no real answers.

Yonivore
09-20-2004, 11:16 AM
Excuse me and, no offense to the memory of DeSPURate's father, but, he's as dead as Killian and DeSPURate is as much a partisan as Ben Barnes.

Let's move on.

Tommy Duncan
09-20-2004, 11:21 AM
The point is there is no issue here just a smear campaign by the Swift boat liars and another distraction to keep voters from talking about real issues.

Kinda like the Bush National Guard 'issue'?

Nice move to try to change the subject. Too bad anyone who actually feels like reading this thread won't be fooled by your BS.




Which is were Kerry has been trying to steer the campaigns for the last week, and the * administration has failed to adjust its tired attack strategy of catchy rhetoric with no real answers.

You might want to take a look back at what the DNC has been doing.

Joe Chalupa
09-20-2004, 01:05 PM
So Dubya was showing some babe his cockpit and love missile?

Well, that's good enough for me.

Yonivore
09-20-2004, 01:08 PM
The Alabama campaign he went to assist with was over. Other than making up his Guard duty, what other reason would he have been there for?

Not just nookie.

Joe Chalupa
09-20-2004, 01:14 PM
Happy Hour? :drunk