Is Ron Paul right?

[cheguevara]

Is Ron Paul right?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/compost/post/is-ron-paul-right/2012/01/11/gIQAWgnTtP_blog.html
By Alexandra Petri

He’s got a point. (Richard Ellis - GETTY IMAGES) If someone were visiting from outer space and got wind of the Republican primary and caucus results, he might be a tad bewildered by the coverage. “This is clearly a two-man race now,” he'd say, waving a tentacle significantly. “There's only one candidate capable of a respectable showing on two separate occasions when everyone else but Mitt Romney struggled. Both times, he drew strong, passionate support, and landed in the top tier — a feat no one beside the front-runner could pull off. It's a two-man race now.”

We earthlings would try to explain. “Ah,” we’d say, “but — gee, look, uh, this — you’re talking about Ron Paul.”

“Why is the Mainstream Media not giving the man his due?” the alien would say, sounding a bit more like a Paul supporter every second. “Especially when polls indicate that if he ran as a third-party candidate, he'd pull in about 20 percent of the vote and change the game entirely.”

On Wednesday Paul’s campaign suggested that if you discovered that you were running for the Republican nomination and were neither Ron Paul nor Mitt Romney, the only polite thing to do would be to drop out. Paul is, they point out, the last best non-Romney hope, the only candidate whose results in both New Hampshire and Iowa were nothing to sneeze at, unless you sneeze at pretty decent polling results.

“Besides,” the alien says, “ever since Rick Perry showed up at debates and wandered around saying that he’d like to beat up Ben Bernanke, Paul started to sound like a rational choice.”

There's something about Paul, the contrarian libertarian with fans so devoted you worry they might have tattoos of his wrinkled visage in critical areas. Paul has been fighting the good fight for years, voting no on every unconstitutional bill that crosses his path, after lovingly tucking a few earmarks into it.

He brings out the youth. He brings out the People Who Leave Irate Online Comments. He brings out the People Who Believe Cannibal Giants Left Their Bones In The Earth. But nobody’s perfect. Rick Perry doesn’t bring out anybody at all. If you’re angry at President Obama, he’s your guy. If you were angry at George W. Bush, he was also your guy. If you’re angry in general, he’s probably your guy — unless you’ve been intrigued by Newt Gingrich’s recent behavior. You wouldn’t expect Occupants of Wall Street to support any of the other possible Republicans. Thanks to this wildly diverse base of support, he has placed respectable seconds in states where anyone besides Mitt Romney faltered.

“Please, drop out,” he says. “I am doing better than any of you, and I am Ron Paul. Clearly, the voter does not want what you are selling.”

It is difficult to argue with that sort of iron-plated logic.

Besides, after all these years of arguing that Ron Paul is going to be stuck forever with about 25 percent of the vote, now’s the time to disprove that old chestnut.

What does the field have to lose?

Rick Perry is slipping below the threshold of debate eligibility. Possibly voters are just trying to be nice to him. “I’d vote for you,” they murmur, “but then you’d have to show up at another debate.” Jon Huntsman has less support than Stephen Colbert, who is actually trying to be a joke candidate. That leaves Rick “Santorum” Santorum and Gingrich, a man who just compared super PACs to praying mantises and whom Rush Limbaugh is urging to tone down his rhetoric.

Why not abandon ship now?

Ron Paul may be the actual best hope. His demographics are the thing that demographers swoon over late at night. Young people! People from across party lines! Conservatives! Moderates! Those hip, smoking youngsters!

Why can't it work?

Well, someone points out, “He's Ron Paul.”

But besides that.

[boutons_deux]

Ron Paul would be a fucking disaster, if his libertarian fantasies ever became reality (even if Pres, he couldn't write the legislation (but he could screw up the Exec branch, like dubya).

[mavs>spurs]

^you're an idiot. he would go down as one of the greatest leaders in american history since the revolutionary days. he wants to do things such as, you know, restore freedom and liberty back to this country and balance the budget. crazy huh.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

And stop spending trillions on an overseas military presence. Another Ron Paul idea people for whatever reason view as crazy :lol

[boutons_deux]

^you're an idiot. he would go down as one of the greatest leaders in american history since the revolutionary days. he wants to do things such as, you know, restore freedom and liberty back to this country and balance the budget. crazy huh.

repeat:

"even if Pres, he couldn't write the legislation (but he could screw up the Exec branch, like dubya)"

UCA and MIC and wealthy would NEVER let their Congressional whores allow his fantasies up for legislative vote, never mind be passed.

iow

"Out, out, brief candle!

Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player that struts and frets his hour upon the stage and then is heard no more: it is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury, signifying nothing."

Macbeth Quote (Act V, Scene V).

[CosmicCowboy]

LOL

I never thought I'd agree with boutons on anything but agree that Ron Paul would have a hard time implementing his agenda with the existing congress...

[boutons_deux]

hard?

impossible.

[boutons_deux]

Grow up, Ron Paul

In Ron Paul's ideal America, safety regulations imposed on employers by the Occupational Safety and Health Administration would be a thing of the past. Clean air and water regulations imposed by the Environmental Protection Agency would be no more. Taxpayers would save money since Ron Paul would abolish the Department of Education and cut the Food & Drug Administration budget by 40%. Employers would save money by paying workers as little as they wish, since Ron Paul would abolish the Davis-Bacon Act. Corporate giants would be free to monopolize markets, since Ron Paul opposes federal antitrust legislation. And employees would no longer be required to pay into Social Security.

So what would this libertarian utopia look like, if Ron Paul were elected and followed through on his campaign promises?

-Families grieving for loved ones lost due to Massey Energy's negligence in the Upper Big Branch coal mine explosion would have to accept that their relatives were casualties of the invisible hand of the unfettered free market. And Massey would've gotten off scot-free for polluting Martin County, Kentucky's drinking water supply with 300 million gallons of coal slurry.

-Millions of college students dependent on Pell grants would be forced to move back home and work minimum-wage jobs, no longer financially able to further their education. Oh wait-- what minimum wage?

-Food recalls would be a regular occurrence when tainted meat and vegetables hit supermarket shelves and cause record outbreaks of e-coli. And risky new drugs will avoid FDA tests and hit the express lane to the pharmacy, endangering the health of millions.

-Too-big-to-fail banks like Wells Fargo, Citi, Chase and Bank of America would be allowed to merge and/or buy out their competitors, as would oil giants like ExxonMobil, and Chevron, as would cell service providers like AT&T and Verizon.

-The Social Security trust fund would become insolvent, making retirement that much harder for those who paid into it all their lives.

Ron Paul and his right-libertarian ideology does espouse a new kind of freedom, just as rebellious children who fantasize about running away from home dream of a new kind of freedom. But as much as we may have rebelled against our parents as little kids, we eventually matured and realized that the rules and regulations our parents imposed on us were meant so we'd grow up to be responsible, functioning adults in society.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carl-gibson/grow-up-ron-paul_b_1195191.html?view=print

[TDMVPDPOY]

even if ron gets the presidency, he still needs approval from the senate, this is where i see could be the problem just like obama...

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Grow up, Ron Paul

In Ron Paul's ideal America, safety regulations imposed on employers by the Occupational Safety and Health Administration would be a thing of the past. Clean air and water regulations imposed by the Environmental Protection Agency would be no more. Taxpayers would save money since Ron Paul would abolish the Department of Education and cut the Food & Drug Administration budget by 40%. Employers would save money by paying workers as little as they wish, since Ron Paul would abolish the Davis-Bacon Act. Corporate giants would be free to monopolize markets, since Ron Paul opposes federal antitrust legislation. And employees would no longer be required to pay into Social Security.

So what would this libertarian utopia look like, if Ron Paul were elected and followed through on his campaign promises?

-Families grieving for loved ones lost due to Massey Energy's negligence in the Upper Big Branch coal mine explosion would have to accept that their relatives were casualties of the invisible hand of the unfettered free market. And Massey would've gotten off scot-free for polluting Martin County, Kentucky's drinking water supply with 300 million gallons of coal slurry.

-Millions of college students dependent on Pell grants would be forced to move back home and work minimum-wage jobs, no longer financially able to further their education. Oh wait-- what minimum wage?

-Food recalls would be a regular occurrence when tainted meat and vegetables hit supermarket shelves and cause record outbreaks of e-coli. And risky new drugs will avoid FDA tests and hit the express lane to the pharmacy, endangering the health of millions.

-Too-big-to-fail banks like Wells Fargo, Citi, Chase and Bank of America would be allowed to merge and/or buy out their competitors, as would oil giants like ExxonMobil, and Chevron, as would cell service providers like AT&T and Verizon.

-The Social Security trust fund would become insolvent, making retirement that much harder for those who paid into it all their lives.

Ron Paul and his right-libertarian ideology does espouse a new kind of freedom, just as rebellious children who fantasize about running away from home dream of a new kind of freedom. But as much as we may have rebelled against our parents as little kids, we eventually matured and realized that the rules and regulations our parents imposed on us were meant so we'd grow up to be responsible, functioning adults in society.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carl-gibson/grow-up-ron-paul_b_1195191.html?view=print
It's a shame Paul has stupid views on things like these, because he's right about tons of other stuff.

[CosmicCowboy]

hard?

impossible.

I'm sure out of all his agenda items he could get a few passed.

[boutons_deux]

"could get a few passed."

The items above are already on the Repug agenda, without Ron Paul.

[byrontx]

We could change the Seal of the U. S. from E pluribus unum to "Will work for Food."

[Bill_Brasky]

Grow up, Ron Paul

In Ron Paul's ideal America, safety regulations imposed on employers by the Occupational Safety and Health Administration would be a thing of the past. Clean air and water regulations imposed by the Environmental Protection Agency would be no more. Taxpayers would save money since Ron Paul would abolish the Department of Education and cut the Food & Drug Administration budget by 40%. Employers would save money by paying workers as little as they wish, since Ron Paul would abolish the Davis-Bacon Act. Corporate giants would be free to monopolize markets, since Ron Paul opposes federal antitrust legislation. And employees would no longer be required to pay into Social Security.

So what would this libertarian utopia look like, if Ron Paul were elected and followed through on his campaign promises?

-Families grieving for loved ones lost due to Massey Energy's negligence in the Upper Big Branch coal mine explosion would have to accept that their relatives were casualties of the invisible hand of the unfettered free market. And Massey would've gotten off scot-free for polluting Martin County, Kentucky's drinking water supply with 300 million gallons of coal slurry.

-Millions of college students dependent on Pell grants would be forced to move back home and work minimum-wage jobs, no longer financially able to further their education. Oh wait-- what minimum wage?

-Food recalls would be a regular occurrence when tainted meat and vegetables hit supermarket shelves and cause record outbreaks of e-coli. And risky new drugs will avoid FDA tests and hit the express lane to the pharmacy, endangering the health of millions.

-Too-big-to-fail banks like Wells Fargo, Citi, Chase and Bank of America would be allowed to merge and/or buy out their competitors, as would oil giants like ExxonMobil, and Chevron, as would cell service providers like AT&T and Verizon.

-The Social Security trust fund would become insolvent, making retirement that much harder for those who paid into it all their lives.

Ron Paul and his right-libertarian ideology does espouse a new kind of freedom, just as rebellious children who fantasize about running away from home dream of a new kind of freedom. But as much as we may have rebelled against our parents as little kids, we eventually matured and realized that the rules and regulations our parents imposed on us were meant so we'd grow up to be responsible, functioning adults in society.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/carl-gibson/grow-up-ron-paul_b_1195191.html?view=print

If he really wants all this then why the fuck are corporations so against him?

[cheguevara]

right because Obama has passed so many laws through the houses :lol

[boutons_deux]

If he really wants all this then why the fuck are corporations so against him?

are they against him? RP wants to hand them much more unregulated, unchallenged power than they have now.

[cheguevara]

If he really wants all this then why the fuck are corporations so against him?

how dare you use logic in the RP argument?

[cheguevara]

are they against him? RP wants to had them much more unregulated, unchallenged power than they have now.



Ron Paul 2012: Wall Street Won’t Give me Money
http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/279783/20120110/ron-paul-2012-wall-street-federal-reserve.htm

At the end of 2011, Paul raised over $25 million. No major Wall Street firm*, however, gave him more than $6,000 at the end of the third quarter, according to OpenSecrets.org.

This may be surprising because Wall Street is generally a big spender on the political campaigns of both Democrats and Republicans.

In 2008, Barack Obama received the second most contributions from Goldman Sachs, Democratic rival Hillary Clinton received the third most contributions from JPMorgan Chase and Republican rival John McCain received the most contributions from Merrill Lynch.

In 2012, Romney is the big Wall Street candidate with Goldman Sachs as his top donor. Rick Perry and Newt Gingrich managed to scrape some money from Wall Street.

Paul, contrastingly, cannot seem to get anything from them; his top three contributors are the U.S. Army, U.S. Air Force and U.S. Navy.

One possible explanation for Wall Street's stinginess towards him is his staunch stance against the Federal Reserve, which lent $7.77 trillion to troubled banks from 2008 to 2009 and kept interest ultra-low to give Wall Street a highly-profitable risk-free carry trade in 2009.

Another possible reason is that Paul was strongly against the $700 billion TARP bailout for Wall Street in 2008.

In the 2012 presidential race, no viable candidate (President Obama included) holds similar views as him on these issues.

Still, Paul, despite no money from Wall Street, likely raised the second most money in 2011 after Romney largely because of his strong grassroots network of devoted supporters.


boom roasted

[boutons_deux]

Wall St estimates, accurately, that RP doesn't have a chance.

Wall St is pouring money into both Barry and Willard Gecko, since one them will be Pres, not RP.

[cheguevara]

Wall St estimates, accurately, that RP doesn't have a chance.

Wall St is pouring money into both Barry and Willard Gecko, since one them will be Pres, not RP.

El Che would normally agree with this reasoning, except, Rick Perry got money. Rick fucking Perry :lmao

try again.

[boutons_deux]

The Youthful Magic of Ron Paul

By Robert Reich, Robert Reich's Blog

12 January 12



outh Carolina Republican Senator Jim DeMint, the darling of the Tea Party wing nuts of the GOP, is urging Republican candidates to listen to Ron Paul. "One of the things that's hurt the so-called conservative alternative is saying negative things about Ron Paul," DeMint told conservative radio host Laura Ingraham. "I'd like to see a Republican Party that embraces a lot of the libertarian ideas."

Why the sudden enthusiasm of Republican leaders for Ron Paul? Credit his surprisingly strong showing in New Hampshire, where 47 percent of primary voters between the ages of 18 and 29 voted for him.

No other Republican candidate has come nearly as close to winning over young voters - and the GOP desperately needs young voters. The median age of registered Republicans is rising faster than the median age of America.

The Republican right thinks Paul's views on the economy are responsible for this fire among the young. Yesterday evening, on Larry Kudlow's CNBC program, I squared off with Larry and the Wall Street Journal's Steve Moore. Both are convinced young people are attracted by Paul's strict adherence to the views of Austrian economist Ludwig von Mises, and Paul's desire to move America back to the gold standard.

Baloney. The young are flocking to Ron Paul because he wants to slice military spending, bring our troops home, stop government from spying on American citizens, and legalize pot.

So do I, but I somehow doubt Jim DeMint would advise Republican candidates to listen to me, even if I were a Republican candidate for President.

Paul is attractive to younger voters precisely because of positions he takes that are anathema to the vast majority of the Republican base, including almost all Tea Party Republicans.

If other Republican candidates want to cozy up to him, fine. But if they do, they'll have a lot of explaining to do in Bluffton, South Carolina.

On the other hand, if Republicans - or Democrats, for that matter - want to win over much of the nation's young next November, they'd do well to listen carefully to Paul's positions on national defense and civil liberties.

www.readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/9398-focus-the-youthful-magic-of-ron-paul

[Wild Cobra]

^you're an idiot. he would go down as one of the greatest leaders in american history since the revolutionary days. he wants to do things such as, you know, restore freedom and liberty back to this country and balance the budget. crazy huh.
Boutons doesn't know what freedom is. he only believe what hos progressive handlers tells him.

[Wild Cobra]

LOL

I never thought I'd agree with boutons on anything but agree that Ron Paul would have a hard time implementing his agenda with the existing congress...
Sure, he would have a hard time getting things done unless he can rally the public to put pressure on then. Still, he has the veto power to stop authoritarian encroachment.

[cheguevara]

Wild Cobra with the motherfucking goods

[boutons_deux]

WC was perfectly OK with retroactive immunity for telcos that sucked in warrantless TB of customer data fed to dubya's Exec.

The argument here was "If you have nothing to hide, don't worry"

And of course, UCA knowing essentially everything about their customers, and selling it everywhere, is perfectly OK. Only the govt is guilty "unreasonable search" of private data.

[SnakeBoy]

Sure, he would have a hard time getting things done unless he can rally the public to put pressure on then. Still, he has the veto power to stop authoritarian encroachment.

A "hard time" is the understatement of the year. Paul has demonstrated that he can't even manage a newsletter. He has zero executive skills.

[cheguevara]

you seriously think Romney|Obama would be any better at managing a newsletter?? :wow

let me remind your Romney can't even manage taking his dog on a trip, he carried his doggy on a kennel on top of his car on a cross country trip. yup, the dog's shit was running on the back of the car

Obama can't even decorate the white house without the permission of his wife.

:lol yeah, that's some real winners right there :lol

[InRareForm]

Managing a newsletter -> President Capabilities

Sounds about right :bang

:rollin:rollin

[cheguevara]

Young voters propelling Ron Paul's campaign

A 76-year-old great-grandfather who gives eye-glazing speeches on monetary policy, displays a crotchety streak and disappears from the Republican campaign trail for days at a time to rest is captivating young voters.

Texas Rep. Ron Paul's libertarian message of less government, personal liberty and ending U.S. military involvement overseas clicks with young people, who are supplying zest for his stronger-than-expected presidential campaign. Nearly half of all voters under 30 went for Paul in the first two states to vote, helping to propel him to a second-place finish in the New Hampshire primary and third place in Iowa's leadoff caucuses.

Why would young people gravitate to the oldest guy in the field?
"Freedom is a young idea," says Eddie Clearwater, a 22-year-old Des Moines photographer who attended a Ron Paul party in Ankeny, Iowa, earlier this month. "All of his policies are such a good, radical change. It's what we need."
Paul's campaign events are charged with an energy that any politician would love, attracting an eclectic band of youthful activists ranging from preppy college students to blue collar workers to artists sporting piercings and dreadlocks. At his party after the New Hampshire primary, there were spontaneous chants of "Ron Paul Revolution! Give us back our Constitution" and "President Paul! President Paul!"

A tickled Paul told the cheering crowd: "Freedom is a wonderful idea, and that's why I get so excited. But I really get excited when I see young people saying it."

"We are dangerous to the status quo of this country," said Paul, who seems to relish making political mischief and has taken on the role of a feisty attacker in some of the GOP debates.

While Paul is unlikely to win the GOP nomination and young voters make up a relatively small slice of the electorate _ 12 percent in the New Hampshire primary and 15 percent in the Iowa caucuses _ their lopsided support has made Paul a force to be reckoned with in the 2012 campaign. And it could prompt a more serious consideration of his views by Republicans and Democrats alike.

"Ron Paul is bringing unorthodox ideas to the marketplace that don't fit with the conventional pillars of either political party," said Matthew Segal of OurTime.org, a nonpartisan group that promotes political participation among young people. "And because young people today are a uniquely independent-minded generation, he's resonating with them."

According to polling-place interviews conducted for The Associated Press and the television networks, 53 percent of under-30 voters in New Hampshire and 35 percent in Iowa identified as independents or something else. They are not establishment Republicans, and not as supportive of the tea party movement as their elders.

Paul's critics sometimes poke fun at his popularity with that age group, suggesting they are mainly attracted to his anti-war message and support for liberalizing drug laws, which are both far outside the Republican mainstream.
But the stereotypes belie the reality facing young people.

Polling-place interviews in New Hampshire and Iowa found younger voters in both states were just as likely as older voters to cite the economy as their top concern. Paul won among younger voters who said the economy is the most important issue. Overall, he drew 46 percent of under-30 voters in New Hampshire, beating front-runner Mitt Romney by a full 20 percentage points in that age group. In Iowa, he got 48 percent of the youth vote, 12 points higher than top-two-finishers Romney and Rick Santorum combined.

In interviews, Paul's young supporters say they fear a bleak future of joblessness, steep college loan payments, pandering politicians and a government made sluggish by debt. Paul's pledge to adhere to the Constitution and shrink government appeals to many young voters looking to get back to basics, as does his promise to focus on problems at home.
"We're in such a crisis right now we should focus on us, not choose which country we aid and which country we invade next," said Nick Wright, a 23-year old volunteer at a Paul campaign event in Meredith, N.H.
Jeff Popek, of Meredith, said he believes Paul's plan to slash taxes would spur job creation.

"A lot of us are graduating with a lot of college debt and we can't pay for it unless we get jobs," the 18-year old said.

Many of Paul's younger supporters say they believe the government is overly intrusive and encroaching on civil liberties. They like his pledge to overturn the Patriot Act, which Congress passed in the wake of the Sept. 11, 2001, terror attacks to allow law enforcement greater access to people's email, telephone and other records.

The heavily wired generation of younger voters also responds to Paul's warning that the federal government is poised to limit Internet privacy. He often rails against a bill pending in Congress called SOPA, the Stop Online Privacy Act, that Paul insists would allow the government to snoop on people's Internet searches.

"They want to take over the Internet," Paul said to boos at a campaign stop in Iowa. "Can you imagine how much we're going to be curtailed in the spreading of our information if we lose the Internet?

Paul does part ways with younger voters on some issues. He opposes abortion rights, even as polls show that a majority of young people support a woman's right to have an abortion. He says the subject of gay marriage should be left to the states. Polls show young people strongly support same sex marriage, much more so than older voters.

While he might not share their views on these issues, his libertarianism means he's not trying to outlaw them.

After the presidential race shifted to South Carolina this week, Paul decamped to Texas for a few days of rest. His young supporters say age matters little to them. His message, they say, is what matters.

President Barack Obama "should be the poster child for why you shouldn't vote for someone for their age or because they look presidential," said Anthony Mazaka, a 27-year-old architect who voted for Paul in New Hampshire. "People have to realize Obama isn't the president he said he was going to be."

Obama won 66 percent of young voters in 2008 and is working hard to reclaim them. But Obama's popularity has dipped with young voters, as it has with many other groups amid a weak economy and persistent high unemployment.
Paul's young supporters may choose not to back either Obama or the Republican primary victor. And Paul hasn't ruled out a third party candidacy, which could keep many young voters in his camp.

"Any political operative in either party would be stupid to ignore Ron Paul's appeal," Segal said.

Read more: http://chippewa.com/news/national/govt-and-politics/young-voters-propelling-ron-paul-s-campaign/article_447b2bad-de84-59a2-82fd-35dd9f0ee1b0.html?mode=story#ixzz1jIbzv3oy

[boutons_deux]

El Che would normally agree with this reasoning, except, Rick Perry got money. Rick fucking Perry :lmao

try again.

Like Noot, JimmyRicky got $Ms from TX asshole who financed the swiftboat slandering of Kerry, not broad-based, and not from Wall St. Probably some "payback" from the TX oil/gascos. JimmyRicky does't play well outside of TX.

[Jacob1983]

So nation building is what America needs right now? Why is it crazy to oppose shit like that?
What's wrong with making cuts? Why is always about spending?

[boutons_deux]

"What's wrong with making cuts"

because the spending cuts always fall only on the poor, sick, old, young, 99% while the tax cuts always fall on the wealth and corps, 1%.

[SnakeBoy]

:lol yeah, that's some real winners right there :lol

Well obviously Obama is a winner. Romney is about to become a primary winner with a legit shot at becoming the next POTUS.

Paul is about to become a three time loser.

[Jacob1983]

At least Ron Paul sticks to his guns and isn't a flip flopper.