Trade Target: Ersan Ilyasova

[mountainballer]

http://i.cdn.turner.com/nba/nba/media/act_ersan_ilyasova.jpg

http://www.nba.com/playerfile/ersan_ilyasova/index.html?nav=page

Born: May 15, 1987
Height: 6-10 / 2.08
Weight: 235 lbs. / 106.6 kg.
From: Eskisehir, Turkey
Years Pro: 3

Current contract:
2011-12: $ 2,541,000

[8FOR!3]

dude's fucking awful. Maybe in 2k

[elemento]

The Bucks wanted any 1st round pick, even late ones, for him before the start of the season. If the Spurs really wanted him and saw him as our starting PF, he would be here by now.
I doubt he stays in the NBA after his contract expires

[objective]

Hard to match salaries.

[mountainballer]

I think he does have some upside left and could be a pretty decent 3rd or 4th man in a big rotation. I like him since his Barca days.
he isn't starter material, but in the Bonner role he could deliver a lot more than Matt does IMO. at least he is the much better rebounder.
anyway, the numbers game is somehow tricky, unless the Bucks take Bonner (what they won't do).

[Darkwaters]

Hes an unrestricted free agent this offseason. If we want him we can probably sign him on the cheap at that time. Giving up any real assets (to include a future 1st) is probably silly.

Now, if we could dump an undesirable for him (say, Matty Bonner) then maybe. But I'd say the chances of that are about as likely as me being the Euroleague MVP this season.

[8FOR!3]

Hes an unrestricted free agent this offseason. If we want him we can probably sign him on the cheap at that time. Giving up any real assets (to include a future 1st) is probably silly.

Now, if we could dump an undesirable for him (say, Matty Bonner) then maybe. But I'd say the chances of that are about as likely as me being the Euroleague MVP this season.

idk, is your name Tango Splinter?

[mountainballer]

Hes an unrestricted free agent this offseason. If we want him we can probably sign him on the cheap at that time. Giving up any real assets (to include a future 1st) is probably silly.


yes, that will be the more realistic scenario.

btw. Ilyasova had 19 rebounds last night in the Bucks win over the Rockets. just saying. (he averages 13.2 rebounds per 40 minutes this season)
makes 37% of his 3s.

[Bruno]

Ilyasova for Anderson and Blair works salary wise.

Spurs might do it if they think Ilyasova is better than Blair.
Bucks might do it because Blair has a better contract.

[jesterbobman]

Definitely an option. Solves any floor spacing issues of a Tiago Blair Combo, and would probably ensure Tim or Tiago on the court at all times(Even Pop can't opt for that much floor spacing)

[ace3g]

If Spurs wanted to get both SJAX and Ilyasova:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6ow8z3h or

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=7cf78l6

and unless something changes, just a matter of time before SJAX is traded because he hasn't played 3 out of the past 4 games.

[Mal]

Bucks aint taking Jefferson back.

[TDMVPDPOY]

this guy game is fkn good, he plays like dirk shooting wise...good cog within a system...

take him over blair, rj, bonner, anderson

[Mel_13]

At least the guy is honest. No BS about wanting to play for a winner:

“When I look at it I have to remember that it’s a business,” said Ilyasova. “Some teams overseas wanted to buyout my contract but I wanted to finish this season in the NBA. This is where I want to be right now, but we will see what happens in the future. Financially, whoever pays me more will be the team that I decide to sign with.”

http://www.hoopsworld.com/ersan-ilyasova%E2%80%99s-european-demand?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=ersan-%20ilyasova%25e2%2580%2599s-european-demand

[mountainballer]

ist's not that he didn't offer something in return.
last night 17 points, 16 rebounds.
I think one team will pay him the full MLE and that number might be enough, to keep him in the NBA.

[Mel_13]

ist's not that he didn't offer something in return.
last night 17 points, 16 rebounds.
I think one team will pay him the full MLE and that number might be enough, to keep him in the NBA.

He offers plenty in return and I have no doubt that he will receive full MLE offers and maybe more.

Just pointing out that he's honest about the following the money. So many players go through this emo BS about other factors and then ST posters delude themselves that these decisions are about anything other than the money.

[DPG21920]

His numbers are inflated some with Bogut out. I like him but I dont think he's as good as people are making him out to be. I would be surprised, even with how bigs are overpayed, if he gets more than 1 full MLE offer.

Drew Gooden is constantly putting up 15-17 points & 7-12 rebs in that system right now.

[Mel_13]

His numbers are inflated some with Bogut out. I like him but I dont think he's as good as people are making him out to be. I would be surprised, even with how bigs are overpayed, if he gets more than 1 full MLE offer.

Drew Gooden is constantly putting up 15-17 points & 7-12 rebs in that system right now.

And got the full MLE when it was 5/32. Ilyasova will get multiple offers at 4/21.

[DPG21920]

But Drew is doing it consistently, Ersan is not. He hasn't made any significant jumps since he signed his 3 year, 7M (last year is only 400K guaranteed) deal in my opinion.

[Mel_13]

But Drew is doing it consistently, Ersan is not. He hasn't made any significant jumps since he signed his 3 year, 7M (last year is only 400K guaranteed) deal in my opinion.

There's a difference between "deserving" the offers and getting the offers. Most of those RFA bigs are going to be seen as unobtainable by teams that only have the MLE. Ilyasova will become an available, obtainable target. Supply and demand.

[DPG21920]

Maybe, which is why I didn't say it won't happen, I said I would be surprised if it did. I guess we'll find out. I think with how things are changing due to the CBA, you will see less of what you describe (it won't be cut out completely obviously). He will be an attainable target only because he won't command the full MLE in my opinion and he's a decent bench big. It wouldn't be a shocker if he gets a full MLE offer because of what you say, but I just don't see it.

Bigs are always valuable and overpaid (see Petro) and Ersan still only commanded a 3 year/7M deal. For him to jump from that to 4/21 would be huge for no real improvement.

[Mel_13]

Maybe, which is why I didn't say it won't happen, I said I would be surprised if it did. I guess we'll find out. I think with how things are changing due to the CBA, you will see less of what you describe (it won't be cut out completely obviously). He will be an attainable target only because he won't command the full MLE in my opinion and he's a decent bench big. It wouldn't be a shocker if he gets a full MLE offer because of what you say, but I just don't see it.

Bigs are always valuable and overpaid (see Petro) and Ersan still only commanded a 3 year/7M deal. For him to jump from that to 4/21 would be huge for no real improvement.

If NBA economics were rational, that would be true. Last week, Jeremy Lin was one day from going back to the D-League and a D-League salary. If he was on the market today who knows what he could get.

Ilyasova, IMO, will command the full MLE even if his production remains exactly what it is right now, but we'll see.

[acoelho1]

If Spurs wanted to get both SJAX and Ilyasova:

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=6ow8z3h



Initially, I wouldn't think that the Bucks would take Jefferson's contract but now, they are desperate to get rid of Sjax so it may be workable. First, Jefferson, whatever you may think of him, is a character guy and second, it provides the bucks with a better shooter. The Bucks don't have many trade avenues for Sjax so this may be the best deal they could get in the open market.

For us, it would bring added toughness to the team and since Sjax once played under Pop, he knows what's expected. Ilyasova is a prototypical Spurs player, smart and tough. Also, as an added bonus, we get rid of the 2 players that Spurs fans detest the most with RJ and Blair.

[Darkwaters]

The more I think about this the more I'm intrigued. I'm not sure I even want to consider the Stephen Jackson angle...but a trade purely for Ersan might be a nice darkhorse move.

Do you think the Bucks would take Blair/Anderson for Ilyasova? Obviously the "our first for your second" concept sweetens the pot a decent amount, but you'd like to preserve that pick if possible.

[yavozerb]

The more I think about this the more I'm intrigued. I'm not sure I even want to consider the Stephen Jackson angle...but a trade purely for Ersan might be a nice darkhorse move.

Do you think the Bucks would take Blair/Anderson for Ilyasova? Obviously the "our first for your second" concept sweetens the pot a decent amount, but you'd like to preserve that pick if possible.

I just cannot see the Bucks dealing one of there best young assets for chump change..They have plenty of cap room next season to sign Ilysova and to also start woking on a contract for Jennings. Jennings and Illysova are 2 pretty solid players and I just cannot see them moving either one.

[acoelho1]

Well.. they want to get rid of Sjax at all cost so they maybe forced to throw in Ilyasova into the deal. To be honest, I would trade RJ for Sjax straight up. I think in our system, Sjax would be a perfect fit.

[yavozerb]

Well.. they want to get rid of Sjax at all cost so they maybe forced to throw in Ilyasova into the deal. To be honest, I would trade RJ for Sjax straight up. I think in our system, Sjax would be a perfect fit.

Of course you would...I do not think the Bucks want an extra 10 mil to pay for RJ..Sjax contract is for only 2 more years and RJ's is 3.

[acoelho1]

It would not be their ideal trade scenario but they don't have many options. So, unless they plan to amnesty Sjax, this may be the best trade they can do on the open market. Sjax will not be a Buck one way or another by the trade deadline or over the summer.

[yavozerb]

It would not be their ideal trade scenario but they don't have many options. So, unless they plan to amnesty Sjax, this may be the best trade they can do on the open market. Sjax will not be a Buck one way or another by the trade deadline or over the summer.

Thats my point though, Sjax only has 1 more year left on his contract after this season..I believe they would buy out or amnesty Sjax before giving away a young prospect for mediocre players in return..

[ace3g]

Well if he is available, Spurs should move in now...

[ace3g]

He had 29 pts and 25 boards tonight against the Nets

[DPG21920]

Huge game from him. All of his talents on display

[Bruno]

He is playing so well that his market value is likely now too high for Spurs.

[mountainballer]

yes, the window to trade for him has likely closed 2 weeks ago.
we knew he was on the block for a 1st rounder in the off season and likely that asking price was still on the table in January. after his Kevin Love impersonations this February the Bucks will ask for more.
(Blair, Anderson plus the 1st rounder might still not be enough)

[yavozerb]

:deadhorse, time to let it go guys and move onto more realistic trade ideas..

[hater]

I'd take him over Blair/Bonner anyday. :tu

maybe coming back to earth at the right time?

"Kris Humphries, who posted a career-high 31 points and was one rebound shy of his personal best with 18. Humphries also neutralized Ersan Ilyasova(four points, three rebounds)"

[yavozerb]

I'd take him over Blair/Bonner anyday. :tu

maybe coming back to earth at the right time?

"Kris Humphries, who posted a career-high 31 points and was one rebound shy of his personal best with 18. Humphries also neutralized Ersan Ilyasova(four points, three rebounds)"

:lol, gonna take alot more than a couple of bad games for the spurs to get involved..:rolleyes

[DesignatedT]

Not happening. He's playing way to well as of late.

[Chinook]

Just thought I'd update this thread since Ersan has been one of my top-three trade targets over the years.

Ilyasova managed to pull out of the tailspin he was in earlier in the year. He ended up averaging 20/10/2 per 36 after the All-Star break. He did so despite shooting only .250 from three, which means he's not just a stretch-four. His 125 ORtg was fantastic considering how hard it was for Bucks to score, but his 115 DRtg leaves a lot to be desired, even less so because of his fine rebounding numbers.

I think he would have been a great buy-low candidate for the Spurs. If his 3P% could have increased in Pop's system, we'd be talking about a player with top-10-pick trade value in 2015.

[Cklbmk]

Just thought I'd update this thread since Ersan has been one of my top-three trade targets over the years.

Ilyasova managed to pull out of the tailspin he was in earlier in the year. He ended up averaging 20/10/2 per 36 after the All-Star break. He did so despite shooting only .250 from three, which means he's not just a stretch-four. His 125 ORtg was fantastic considering how hard it was for Bucks to score, but his 115 DRtg leaves a lot to be desired, even less so because of his fine rebounding numbers.

I think he would have been a great buy-low candidate for the Spurs. If his 3P% could have increased in Pop's system, we'd be talking about a player with top-10-pick trade value in 2015.


Ya he's a tricky one.. he seems to always suck the first half of the year then turn it on the 2nd half. He'd be a good Bonner replacement at the very least in our system.

[exstatic]

Ya he's a tricky one.. he seems to always suck the first half of the year then turn it on the 2nd half. He'd be a good Bonner replacement at the very least in our system.

People bitch about Bonner's $3.9M. They're going to lose their minds over 'Sova making more than twice that. I doubt the front office wants any part of that deal.

[Chinook]

People bitch about Bonner's $3.9M. They're going to lose their minds over 'Sova making more than twice that. I doubt the front office wants any part of that deal.

I mean, if Bonner was putting up 20/10 per-36 numbers, I don't think anyone would care if he made twice as much as he does now.

[exstatic]

I mean, if Bonner was putting up 20/10 per-36 numbers, I don't think anyone would care if he made twice as much as he does now.

'Sova won't do that on this team. Too many players play rotation minutes.

[Chinook]

'Sova won't do that on this team. Too many players play rotation minutes.

That doesn't make sense. His rate stats would almost certainly increase with the Spurs.

[exstatic]

That doesn't make sense. His rate stats would almost certainly increase with the Spurs.

If you witness Kawhi's struggle to get touches and scores in this offense, you'll see that maybe I have a point. I mean, they're ACTIVELY trying to feed him and encouraging him to find his offense as the future of the franchise, and his per 36 numbers, if you round up, are 16/8. I'll stand by my assertion.

[Chinook]

If you witness Kawhi's struggle to get touches and scores in this offense, you'll see that maybe I have a point. I mean, they're ACTIVELY trying to feed him and encouraging him to find his offense as the future of the franchise, and his per 36 numbers, if you round up, are 16/8. I'll stand by my assertion.

You must have missed my bump where I was referring to his numbers after the All-Star break. Of course, his raw scoring may decrease, but few players see a true decrease in their rate stats on the Spurs. He'd almost certainly be more efficient. Also remember that he'd be a target largely for the post-Duncan era. He, Tony and Kawhi would probably be able to get plenty of touches.

[exstatic]

You must have missed my bump where I was referring to his numbers after the All-Star break. Of course, his raw scoring may decrease, but few players see a true decrease in their rate stats on the Spurs. He'd almost certainly be more efficient. Also remember that he'd be a target largely for the post-Duncan era. He, Tony and Kawhi would probably be able to get plenty of touches.

Ah, well, as a Post Duncan piece, he might make sense. If you were to subtract one of the Big Three, shots/touches would open up.

One note, though: Patty Mills, who only shoots when he's awake, still falls a bit short(19.5) of 20 points per 36.

[Seventyniner]

488851285123141635

May as well throw this one in here. Chinook, you're up.

Not that the Spurs have enough salary they're willing to trade away to get him, though.

[Chinook]

488851285123141635

May as well throw this one in here. Chinook, you're up.

Not that the Spurs have enough salary they're willing to trade away to get him, though.

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=n44awp8

:flag:

[Baam]

He's said to have serious ankle issues since last season but I'd still do it in an heartbeat...

[Seventyniner]

http://espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=n44awp8

:flag:

I'm just glad the majority of ST doesn't read this forum. Just the idea of that trade would spawn 50 pages easy.

[Chinook]

I'm just glad the majority of ST doesn't read this forum. Just the idea of that trade would spawn 50 pages easy.

Inb4 the inevitable TSpence tweet.

[Raven]

Beli ayres and money for him ? I doubt it would be legal though...

[Darkwaters]

That would be a great trade for both parties concerned honestly. The Spurs would get a player they like (well, that we like) and discard only pieces that aren't that enticing anyways. The Bucks would be able to trim significant salary since all of the inbound players are on expiring deals.

Why are they wanting to dump Ersan so much?

[Kineto]

High risk / Low reward trade in my opinion, because get him will kill the spurs cap space for 2015.

Even if he bounce back and play to his former level, i don't think he will be really better than Duncan, Splitter and Diaw, who are those who play in the PO when it really matter.

[Chinook]

That would be a great trade for both parties concerned honestly. The Spurs would get a player they like (well, that we like) and discard only pieces that aren't that enticing anyways. The Bucks would be able to trim significant salary since all of the inbound players are on expiring deals.

Why are they wanting to dump Ersan so much?

Parker plays the same position, and Ersan has been really inconsistent over the past few years. Baam asserts Ilyasova has some worrying injuries.

[Chinook]

High risk / Low reward trade in my opinion, because get him will kill the spurs cap space for 2015.

Even if he bounce back and play to his former level, i don't think he will be really better than Duncan, Splitter and Diaw, who are those who play in the PO when it really matter.

Pop's going to play four bigs as much as he can. If Ilyasova gets his shot back, he'll be a much better stretch:four than Bonner or Diaw 1.0. As far as cap space goes, re-signing Mills pretty much killed that idea. Also, if Duncan comes back, there won't even be token space available.

[Kineto]

Pop's going to play four bigs as much as he can. If Ilyasova gets his shot back, he'll be a much better stretch:four than Bonner or Diaw 1.0. As far as cap space goes, re-signing Mills pretty much killed that idea. Also, if Duncan comes back, there won't even be token space available.


splitter : 8,5M
diaw : 7,5M
Mills : 3,6M
Leonard (QO) : 4M
Anderson : 1,1M

total 24,7M ;
with a salary cap around 66,5M, and minus roster spots and one or two 1st pick garantie money (2016 1st if not stash, LJC if he come), it can let a little less than 40M to re-sign parker (12-15M ?), a good FA (15-20M ?) and maybe some of green/beli/Joseph if everybody is not too greedy.

It's indeed assuming Duncan and Ginobilli are not coming back (or agreeing to come back for the min), but at this point of their career, it should be considered every year.

[Chinook]

splitter : 8,5M
diaw : 7,5M
Mills : 3,6M
Leonard (QO) : 4M
Anderson : 1,1M

total 24,7M ;
with a salary cap around 66,5M, and minus roster spots and one or two 1st pick garantie money (2016 1st if not stash, LJC if he come), it can let a little less than 40M to re-sign parker (12-15M ?), a good FA (15-20M ?) and maybe some of green/beli/Joseph if everybody is not too greedy.

It's indeed assuming Duncan and Ginobilli are not coming back (or agreeing to come back for the min), but at this point of their career, it should be considered every year.

No offense, but there are a ton of reasons why that's wrong. You can look at the stickied salary thread for more accurate accounts.

[Kineto]

No offense, but there are a ton of reasons why that's wrong. You can look at the stickied salary thread for more accurate accounts.

no offense taken, I'm not pretending to be a salary cap guru :)

But i don't see where are my mistakes.

Where is the flaw in this scenario ?

re-sign parker for 4y/60M (starting at 13,5M with 7,5% raise)
re-sign Green for 4y/29M (starting at 6,5M with 7,5% raise)
give QO to Leonard (4M)
sign LJC on rookie contract (1.1M)
keep 2015 1st unsigned (<1M)
renonce everyone else.

You have
Parker 13.5M
Splitter 8.5M
Diaw 7.5M
Green 6.5M
Leonard 4M (Q.O.) (*)
Mills 3,6M
Anderson 1.1M
LJC 1.1M
2015 1st pick cap hold 1M
3 empty roster spot cap hold 1,5M

(*) As long as Leonard don't sign an offer sheet, his cap hold is still equal to the QO, correct ?


It make 48,3M, and with a 66.5M salary cap, you can propose a first year at 17,7M (4yrs/79M with 7.5% raise (not sure if it's 4,5 or 7,5 here ?))
(and even more if they let green walk)

Then you could try to sign your big name FA (gasol, Love, Aldridge...)
then sign a vet or one of our eurostash with room exception (or part of it).
sign 2016 1st round pick

And finally, give Leonard his extension and complete roster with vet min contract and/or 2nd round draft pick at min. salary.


What's wrong in this scenario ?
I'm not saying that's the best thing to do, but it doesn't seem so unlikely ?

(sorry for the off-topic)

[Chinook]

no offense taken, I'm not pretending to be a salary cap guru :)

But i don't see where are my mistakes.

Where is the flaw in this scenario ?

re-sign parker for 4y/60M (starting at 13,5M with 7,5% raise)
re-sign Green for 4y/29M (starting at 6,5M with 7,5% raise)
give QO to Leonard (4M)
sign LJC on rookie contract (1.1M)
keep 2015 1st unsigned (<1M)
renonce everyone else.

You have
Parker 13.5M
Splitter 8.5M
Diaw 7.5M
Green 6.5M
Leonard 4M (Q.O.) (*)
Mills 3,6M
Anderson 1.1M
LJC 1.1M
2015 1st pick cap hold 1M
3 empty roster spot cap hold 1,5M

(*) As long as Leonard don't sign an offer sheet, his cap hold is still equal to the QO, correct ?


It make 48,3M, and with a 66.5M salary cap, you can propose a first year at 17,7M (4yrs/79M with 7.5% raise (not sure if it's 4,5 or 7,5 here ?))
(and even more if they let green walk)

Then you could try to sign your big name FA (gasol, Love, Aldridge...)
then sign a vet or one of our eurostash with room exception (or part of it).
sign 2016 1st round pick

And finally, give Leonard his extension and complete roster with vet min contract and/or 2nd round draft pick at min. salary.


What's wrong in this scenario ?
I'm not saying that's the best thing to do, but it doesn't seem so unlikely ?

(sorry for the off-topic)

The most fundamental issue is that Leonard's hold is actually twice the size of his QO ($7.9 Million). That cuts cap space down to $13 Million. Then, there are a couple of little things with rounding that drop the cap room a another couple million. Then, you have to factor in the fact that Ilyasova/Young and the MLE and LLE might give the Spurs more leeway than just the cap space, especially since they'd keep Duncan and Manu's Bird rights.

[Kineto]

The most fundamental issue is that Leonard's hold is actually twice the size of his QO ($7.9 Million). That cuts cap space down to $13 Million. Then, there are a couple of little things with rounding that drop the cap room a another couple million. Then, you have to factor in the fact that Ilyasova/Young and the MLE and LLE might give the Spurs more leeway than just the cap space, especially since they'd keep Duncan and Manu's Bird rights.

here http://data.shamsports.com/content/pages/data/salaries/spurs.jsp, i got a $7,2 M cap hold for KL (250% of his previous salary).
Boris salary can also be a little less than 7,5M (depending on how it is structured)
We can also stash or trade 2015 1st pick, stash Livio another year...

And above all, if renouncing Green, spurs can certainly be around 20M cap space.

If a player like love is OK to come to SA, for me it can worth it.

basically, it's quite the same as a Love for Green-Belinelli-Joseph trade, minus the fact that spurs can't used their MLE and BAE that year (but they still have room exception).

Maybe not a option immediatly as efficient the very first year, but with the MLE and BAE the next years, a Parker/Leonard/Love core, with diaw, splitter, mills, anderson, ljc, bertrans, that can be a solid contender for 4-5 years.

And this scenario is of course only in case where Duncan and Ginobilli end their career at the end of the year. If they agree to come back for an other run, it's a no brainer to re-sign them.


There's a lot of "if", of course, but imho, it's maybe a more ambitious plan than go after 2nd string player like Young or Ilyasova.

[Mel_13]

489267128647049216

[Shastafarian]

489267128647049216

Strong > Hard

[Seventyniner]

489267128647049216

Doesn't that completely contradict the previous statement?

[Mel_13]

Strong > Hard


Doesn't that completely contradict the previous statement?

Sports journalism delivered 140 characters at a time.

[Chinook]

Doesn't that completely contradict the previous statement?

Not necessarily. Rather, it implies discord within the organization. The team wants/wanted to shop him, but some in the organization really want to keep him. From what we've heard previously, Kidd likes Ilyasova and wants to keep him. I think, then, that the Bucks' GM is the one who wants to move him.

Just power-play number 2 by Kidd since coming to Milwaukee. I can't believe they traded picks for that poison.