Grades: Spurs @ Pistons - Feb. 14

[timvp]

After coughing up command of the ballgame, the Spurs were able to make enough big plays late to escape Detroit with a 99-95 victory. The win was San Antonio's eighth in a row and they're now 4-0 on the Rodeo Road Trip.

Give the Pistons a lot of credit for fighting back. The Spurs had a 15-point lead with 10:44 remaining. But then, fueled by great play on both ends by future Hall of Famer Ben Wallace, the Pistons went on a 14-0 run in the next three minutes to erase the lead. (In hindsight, it was a bad sign for the Spurs when Wallace calmly drained a three-pointer in the midst of the run; he's hit only one other three-pointer in the last six seasons.)

The Pistons actually led 86-83 with 4:26 left in the fourth but thanks to a few timely hoops and Pop using Hack-a-Ben to slow Detroit's momentum, the Spurs eventually regained the upper hand and avoided what would have been a demoralizing loss.

http://oi39.tinypic.com/2rd7ptd.jpg

http://oi39.tinypic.com/20k7hfn.jpg

Tim Duncan A-
School was in session for Greg Monroe and Tim Duncan was the professor. Monroe, who entered the game with the highest PER (24.27) of any center in the NBA, was simply annihilated by Duncan. On defense, Duncan protected the rim with enthusiasm and was especially stingy in one-on-one situations. He also was strong on the boards, which led to his fifth straight double-double. Offensively, Duncan wasn't quite as good -- particularly when Ben Wallace had a chance to gain position on him. But Duncan scored four key points late to halt a Pistons run and get the Spurs back on track.

Manu Ginobili B
The bad: Manu Ginobili didn't make a basket -- and wasn't very close on any of his attempts. Defensively, he had trouble keeping up with anybody. By the end of the game, he was obviously running on fumes. The good: He's Manu Ginobili. He just found ways to help push the Spurs to victory. On defense, he drew a pair of offensive fouls, including a huge one with 1:24 remaining in a tie game. Offensively, though he had only one point, he finished with seven assists and only one turnover; three of his assists were in the final quarter. Ginobili's plus/minus of +17 -- more than double of any player on the team -- is just impossible to ignore. Overall, he has a lot of room for improvement but tonight was further evidence of Ginobili's legendary will to win.

Tony Parker C+
Honestly, I thought Tony Parker was asleep for most of the evening. Since Ginobili's return, it's as if Parker has taken his foot of the gas and has started to coast a little bit. Thankfully, Parker shifted into gear before it was too late. With the game tied 90-90 with with 2:16 remaining, the All-Star point guard scored scored eight straight points to finally put the Pistons away. Considering he had only six points up until that explosion, Parker's late-game heroics were a bit surprising. In the first three quarters, he had some good possessions in the playmaking department but his defense was iffy. Along with the scoring binge late, Parker's defensive intensity was also much better in the final handful of minutes.

Richard Jefferson B-
I don't even know what to think of Richard Jefferson's performance. On one hand, he was brutal defensively. Tayshaun Prince was getting open however and whenever he wanted when Jefferson was supposed to be guarding him. His transition defense was also really, really bad. But on the other hand, he did some things we hadn't seen much of recently. He attacked the basket and earned free throws. He had a key offensive rebound and putback in the fourth quarter. Jefferson also nailed the biggest shot of the game: a three-pointer with 2:20 remaining that put the Spurs up by a point. On top of those two plays, it should be noted that he dove on the court a few times going after loose balls. All in all, I guess the positives outweighed the negatives … but it was close.

DeJuan Blair B-
It looks like DeJuan Blair is finally breaking out of his slump. He scored in double-figures for the second straight outing, the first time he's done that since Jan. 17. Blair also did good work on the defensive glass. That said, it was still unsightly to witness. He's forcing shots and is caught out of position too often on defense. His physicality was better tonight but it wasn't always well-timed. The return of Ginobili seems to have helped; let's hope he can keep progressing in the right direction.

Danny Green B
Danny Green's athleticism appears to have returned. He was once again very good on the glass and swiped three clean steals. Green also made a couple really good passes. Unfortunately, it wasn't all positive. He remains a bit hesitant on the offensive end and was too over-aggressive at times on defense. He almost fouled a three-point shooter late in a play that could have been disastrous. It'll be interesting to see how long Green keeps the starting shooting guard gig now that Ginobili is healthy again.

Tiago Splitter B+
It was another highly productive outing for Tiago Splitter. Playing 13 straight minutes in the first half and then nine straight minutes in the second half, Splitter was always in the middle of the action. Offensively, he was again a constant threat in the pick-and-roll sets and mixed in a few post-ups. He didn't finish as well as he usually does but he made up for it with a season-high in free throw attempts. Defensively, while he wasn't very good on the boards, he played solid positional defense and rotated quickly when needed.

Matt Bonner C+
Matt Bonner drained his first four field goal attempts from the floor and was playing really good pick-and-roll defense. That was the good news. The bad news was everything else. In a game in which the Spurs were struggling to corral defensive boards, Bonner was held without a rebound. To make matters worse, he wasn't playing tough enough when the Pistons upped their level of aggression in the fourth. On offense, he missed an open three-pointer late -- but the true choke came at the free throw line. He was 14-for-16 (87.5%) at the charity stripe on the season when he stepped to the line with the Spurs up by one point with a minute to go. Bonner, in what hopefully isn't a preview of the playoffs, promptly missed both freebies to give the Pistons additional life. To say it very nicely: Matt Bonner's intestinal fortitude isn't a strength.

Kawhi Leonard B
Looking much more relaxed from the beyond the arc, Kawhi Leonard hit his first two three-pointers before missing his final three on a heave at the end of the shot clock. Before that miss, Leonard had connected on seven of his previous eight attempts from long distance. He's now shooting a very respectable 37.8% from three-point range on the season. Defensively, he was really good against the Pistons -- especially when compared to Jefferson. His length and relentlessness resulted in numerous positive plays. Leonard also boarded well due to impeccable timing. Turnovers, though, were an issue for the typically mistake-free player. In the first six games of the month, Leonard had only two turnovers. His three TOs tonight matched the amount he had in his previous 161 minutes.

Gary Neal C
Just when it looked like Gary Neal rediscovered his stroke, he had another clunker. While he's probably always going to be streaky to a degree, it'd be nice if he could become more dependable as the season wears on. Defensively, he also wasn't very good versus Detroit. Playmaking-wise, though, Neal was a bright spot once again. In the second half, Neal appeared to twist his ankle and he limped off the court. Thankfully, he later returned to action. However, that's something to keep an eye on.

Pop A
I liked a lot of what Pop did tonight. He played Duncan and Splitter together more than usual. I agreed with him when he kept the cold-shooting Ginobili in the game. Pop gave Parker adequate rest, which aided his fourth quarter charge. I thought he was playing Jefferson too much but RJ responded with some big plays late, so Pop made the right call there. And the decision to go Hack-a-Ben, though risky, turned out to absolutely be the correct decision. It stalled Detroit's momentum, allowed the Spurs to gather their thoughts and muddied the game enough to allow San Antonio to sneak away with a W.

[timvp]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.

[timtonymanu]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.

[Leetonidas]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

I prefer this version since I miss games sometimes like tonight for V-Day because it gives me a more in depth look at what happened rather than just looking at a box score

[jestersmash]

You know I wouldn't be opposed to a shorter, less in-depth version of grades with something like the following format -

Player X <grade>
The good: (bullet points)
The bad: (bullet points)
Maybe a one or two sentence summary

I say this because timvp tends to engage in the discussion after the grades anyway.

The advantages of having a shorter, less in-depth version of grades are two-fold:

1) I'm sure it'll be easier on timvp (hell, he's basically having to write the equivalent of an entire article right after the game. It's not easy)

and

2) We'll get a nice postgame discussion going immediately after the game when thoughts are still fresh.

Don't get me wrong, I love the comprehensive takes, but I certainly wouldn't mind if we saw a shorter version in the future.

[Fireball]

Keep this format TIMVP

Just saw the game on replay and just cringed as Matt Bonner showed his un-clutchness again by bricking two improtant FTs ...

[TE]

Comprehensive coverage. You do a great job at making points about each player's performance and is unreal at being accurate. Keep doing your thing man.

[Robz4000]

Another great write-up, timvp. It's really shocking when you look at the box score; Duncan's the only guy to leave no zero's (other than 3PAs lol). That alone should warrant an A+. If not for Tim this game is a big damn L. After a few weeks of solid to great play, Bonner looked like crap (albeit he did his damn job early). Jefferson surprised the hell out of me tonight: he was aggressive and didn't choke when it mattered. Give him his B+/A-.

Pop should've gotten a C at best (only because the team won), plain and simple. He killed the momentum and gave Detroit it's confidence when he went small. Should've also started Leonard on Prince; if he doesn't go off early the Spurs win by 20+. Lastly, when Bonner was playing as bad as he was (and when he had 0 rebounds by the 4th Q) he needed to stick with Splitter.

Parker and Manu were solid, but it's evident that Ginobili is needed at 100% for this team to keep winning. Che-ago got his extended playing time, alongside Duncan nonetheless, and showed he deserved it. Neal was playing pretty good before the sprain, but I agree with the grade. Green is looking great again, hope he keeps it up. Leonard with another great night on both ends; love when he's aggressive.

I'd like you to keep with the in-depth reports, always enjoy reading them after the game's result has had time to sink in.

[BoricuaCJA]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.
This is my vote. As long as you don't mind doing that, we would prefer more comprehensive coverage. Sometimes I work late so I'm not able to watch the games live.

[letmk]

To me, considering the momentum change at the end of the game, that Tony scoring 8 points in the last 2 minutes gives him a B+. All in all, he won the game for us, at least on the offensive side.

Also, LJ, do we look too greedy of asking you to put out two versions of grades, one shorter and less in-depth and one longer and more detailed?

[Kewni Leonard]

Something I took away that was interesting during the game that the cameras might not have caught: The Spurs had to shoot a tech and the entire team was looking to Manu to shoot it, he waved them off and said he couldn't. That isn't a good sign.

[Yorae]

I vote for a comprehensive coverage that would be posted quicker following games......

[timvp]

Stat of the game:

In the 24:48 Manu Ginobili played, the Spurs outscored the Pistons 59-43.

In the 23:12 Manu Ginobili was on the bench, the Pistons outscored the Spurs 52-40.







P.S.

I know the official stats show Ginobili with a plus/minus of +17 but I counted twice and came up with +16 both times. Perhaps I'm missing something . . .

[jason1301]

I like just the way it is, I am truly enjoying your threads timvp :)

Good to see RJ has stepped up his game, I think he is feeling Kawhi's breath over his shoulder. Well there is also the Manu effect, ask Blar hehehehe..

[jestersmash]

What do you guys think of this idea -

From now on after a game, timvp can make a "Grades" thread with a placeholder as the first post (with something like "Grades coming..."). This way, spurstalk can immediately start posting/replying in the thread as a hub for postgame discussion before timvp is done with grades.

Once timvp finishes his grades, he can simply edit his first post and the discussion can continue. This will at least solve #2 in my list.

[TE]

One problem I do have though is your grade on Pop... An A? I think the decision to play Bonner when he was literally playing like a pussy in the fourth quarter (almost the entire fourth quarter) was questionable. But what the heck, we know Pop is gonna keep ol' ginger out there when it counts. I'm just saying...

[Paranoid Pop]

You know I wouldn't be opposed to a shorter, less in-depth version of grades with something like the following format -

Player X <grade>
The good: (bullet points)
The bad: (bullet points)
Maybe a one or two sentence summary

I say this because timvp tends to engage in the discussion after the grades anyway.

The advantages of having a shorter, less in-depth version of grades are two-fold:

1) I'm sure it'll be easier on timvp (hell, he's basically having to write the equivalent of an entire article right after the game. It's not easy)

and

2) We'll get a nice postgame discussion going immediately after the game when thoughts are still fresh.

Don't get me wrong, I love the comprehensive takes, but I certainly wouldn't mind if we saw a shorter version in the future.

I agree with this, quicker shorter grades would spark more discussion I think but great job anyway. If Manu gets a B for that outing then the expectations don't match the "best player of the team" title.

[jestersmash]

I vote for a comprehensive coverage that would be posted quicker following games......

"Make quality posts but do it quicker"

:lol

I'm pretty amazed at how quickly he gets these grades up to begin with. You know timvp would like to enjoy watching the games as well right :lol.

[ElNono]

Maybe the technical foul at the end?

I also prefer the longer breakdown. Thanks again for a fantastic writeup! :toast

[Manu-of-steel]

Thanks for the write ups, timvp. I vote for a comprehensive coverage.

[Manu-of-steel]

Danny Green B
Danny Green's athleticism appears to have returned. He was once again very good on the glass and swiped three clean steals. Green also made a couple really good passes. Unfortunately, it wasn't all positive. He remains a bit hesitant on the offensive end and was too over-aggressive at times on defense. He almost fouled a three-point shooter late in a play that could have been disastrous. It'll be interesting to see how long Green keeps the starting shooting guard gig now that Ginobili is healthy again.
IMHO. it was a foul that was not called by the refs.

[TJastal]

Something I took away that was interesting during the game that the cameras might not have caught: The Spurs had to shoot a tech and the entire team was looking to Manu to shoot it, he waved them off and said he couldn't. That isn't a good sign.

Screw that! We need to rush him back to the starting lineup ASAP, so he can resume being the MVP of the team!

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

comprehensive


Is this the real Leonard we are seeing regarding his 3's? Or is he just a raw, streaky shooter who just happens to be hot


37% on the year is freaking good for a player like him

[Yorae]

"Make quality posts but do it quicker"

:lol

I'm pretty amazed at how quickly he gets these grades up to begin with. You know timvp would like to enjoy watching the games as well right :lol.

To be fair, I have very low standards...:lol

[dbreiden83080]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

Keep the in depth versions if you have the time.. They are amazing.. :toast

[Darkwaters]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

Don't change how you're doing it LJ. I like you just the way you are :toast

[Spur|n|Austin]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup
The comprehensive is great, thanks! GSG

[jestersmash]

Something I took away that was interesting during the game that the cameras might not have caught: The Spurs had to shoot a tech and the entire team was looking to Manu to shoot it, he waved them off and said he couldn't. That isn't a good sign.

You know in gameblog I was probably starting to get a little anxious about this, but I realized I'm probably overreacting.

Manu took 4 shots this entire game. One of them was a legitimate 3 point attempt that he missed - fine. Another one was a crazy behind the back dribble off balance chucker (2 point shot) near the end of a shot clock off a mangled play. 0-2, but I can't really blame him for that one. He had a little floater that he missed, and I don't remember the final shot attempt, but he still only took 4 attempts.

And, regarding his free throws - yeah, he wasn't confident with taking the technical free throw, but of the two free throw attempts he did take, while one of them clanked off the rim, he showed perfect form and swished the second attempt.

Granted, I haven't really seen Manu take enough shots to be able to properly judge his form (despite being 4-7 last game, a handful of them were just straight up layups and at least one was a floater - I don't think I saw a single jump shot go in), but I'm hoping this is all just a function of rust and lack of conditioning and not a function of his shot fundamentally thrown off kilter from his injury.

[BanditHiro]

comprehensive and fast would be great.

[UnWantedTheory]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.

[siraulo23]

Thanks for the write-up, great read as always

timvp is 29/29 on team grades so far this season if im not mistaken:wow

Can he go the whole season without missing a grade write-up? :lol

[TJastal]

One problem I do have though is your grade on Pop... An A? I think the decision to play Bonner when he was literally playing like a pussy in the fourth quarter (almost the entire fourth quarter) was questionable. But what the heck, we know Pop is gonna keep ol' ginger out there when it counts. I'm just saying...

+1



Typical Pop 'n Bonner lovefest. If this is a preview of how intelligently Pop will use Bonner in the playoffs it could be another quick exit.

[ego]

Ok TP was asleep for most part of the game but Spurs (and TP) need some gaz tomorrow but finally Spurs was +15 at the beginning of last quarter.

You give A+ at TD with an horrible end of game, B at Manu with 0pt and C+ at TP who was the clutch player. Without TP, the game was lost, how can he have the worst grade of the evening ?

For me the big three need a B.

[Sean Cagney]

What caught my eye early is future hall of famer Ben Wallace? that there is just strange to see lol. He did play his butt off though, as if it were 05 at times and he saw a title.

[FvckMavs]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.

[Darkwaters]

I just started watching the game and the first 3 minutes have been the Danny Green show. Hes taken 3 shots (missed the first two, fouled on the last and sent to the line), gotten three boards, made several nice passes (including a pinpoint assist to Duncan), gotten two clean strips and played suffocating defense on at least one break-away by Brandon Knight.

Too bad I don't think he kept it up all game. He had a great start.

[therealtruth]

+1



Typical Pop 'n Bonner lovefest. If this is a preview of how intelligently Pop will use Bonner in the playoffs it could be another quick exit.

Bonner is Pop's Achilles heal. I'm sure his coaching would be better without Bonner. Pop just falls in love with certain players to the team's detriment like Finley.

[jestersmash]

Ok TP was asleep for most part of the game but Spurs (and TP) need some gaz tomorrow but finally Spurs was +15 at the beginning of last quarter.

You give A+ at TD with an horrible end of game, B at Manu with 0pt and C+ at TP who was the clutch player. Without TP, the game was lost, how can he have the worst grade of the evening ?

For me the big three need a B.

Take the C+ for Parker as a compliment. (if you're a Parker homer..err, I mean fan). All it means is that we've come to expect and depend on TP to produce all star caliber numbers night in and night out. This is the same guy who dropped 42 and 37 on competent defensive clubs like OKC and Philadelphia.

[MB3//]

Comprehensive coverage for sure.
I enjoy the read more than immediate discussion.
Also, with having to take night classes this semester and no DVR, timvp's coverage is what I rely on!

[angelbelow]

Was disappointed to see the pistons come back like that. A win is a win, but ideally we wanted to close that game out and rest for tomorrows game.

-Given that the Pistons have no effective Iso players, I was really surprised they kept up offensively. Part of it was the refs gifting them fouls but still..

-Was kind of falling for Bonner's magic trick again. Really started thinking what if Bonner was effective in the playoffs this year and proves everyone wrong? While its still possible he certainly choked tonight.

[Sean Cagney]

Was disappointed to see the pistons come back like that. A win is a win, but ideally we wanted to close that game out and rest for tomorrows game.

-Given that the Pistons have no effective Iso players, I was really surprised they kept up offensively. Part of it was the refs gifting them fouls but still..

-Was kind of falling for Bonner's magic trick again. Really started thinking what if Bonner was effective in the playoffs this year and proves everyone wrong? While its still possible he certainly choked tonight.

Get real it's Bonner man, no clue why heads buy into that sh*t every year. He showed signs of his choking in Dallas last time at the end as well! He fukked up in the end there and tonight some as well. If it gets real he is not going to help, trust me he has shown it from time to time.

[jjktkk]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

Thanks Tim for posting your grades. I prefer the comprehensive grades, but would take the less in-depth version, if your pressed for time.

[baseline bum]

Comprehensive > speed

[biba]

I love to read your Grades. Thanks TiMVP.

I prefer the comprehensive coverage. But it4s up to you.



Parker saved the day. He got a B.

[BanditHiro]

Comprehensive > speed

comprehensive and speed > Comprehensive > speed

[angelbelow]

Get real it's Bonner man, no clue why heads buy into that sh*t every year. He showed signs of his choking in Dallas last time at the end as well! He fukked up in the end there and tonight some as well. If it gets real he is not going to help, trust me he has shown it from time to time.

Yeah, that's why I called him a magic trick, a disappearing act to be specific.

[spurs10]

Really enjoy the insight and appreciate your efforts. Quick only trumps substance in a foot race..........."that's what she said"....sorry....

[Slomo]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.

For completely selfish reasons.

[maverick1948]

how many of you actually watch the game? We led by 14 when the 4th quarter began. Bonner was on the court in the 4th for the first 2:45. He went to the bench we led by 7. When he came back at the 5:28 mark we trailed by 1. How in the hell did he give away the lead all by himself when half of it was lost with him on the bench? After he came back, he must have been doing something right or we would have lost by having only 4 on 5. Most of you only watch the game and the ball. Try watching who blocks out on the rebounds. Try watching who give help D sometime. Instead of blaming Bonner for the lost lead, blame it on the TEAM effort. One player doesnt lose games. Every player who has every set foot on the NBA floor has made mistakes. Maybe Bonner is not the most effiecent defensive player on the Spurs but he plays hard when he is on the court. You want to point a finger at a single player for losing the lead? Try pointing at Leonard, he was on the court from the beginning of the 4th quarter until all the lead was gone. Did he lose the lead all by himself? Not NO but Hell no. The entire team quit for 6 1/2 minutes.

[Manufan909]

Keep the in depth versions if you have the time.. They are amazing.. :toast

Indeed. :tu

[SpurNation]

Love the in depth. But jestersmash had a good idea if it makes it easier on you. Either way...it'll be good without one being better than the other. So if I were you I would make it easier on myself being the end result would appropriately be the same.

Regarding the game itself...the old saying of "there'll be games like these" could not have been more adaptive. Fortunately the Spurs walk out with the win with Tony Parker proving to be all star worthy once again at the end.

[Manufan909]

how many of you actually watch the game? We led by 14 when the 4th quarter began. Bonner was on the court in the 4th for the first 2:45. He went to the bench we led by 7. When he came back at the 5:28 mark we trailed by 1. How in the hell did he give away the lead all by himself when half of it was lost with him on the bench? After he came back, he must have been doing something right or we would have lost by having only 4 on 5. Most of you only watch the game and the ball. Try watching who blocks out on the rebounds. Try watching who give help D sometime. Instead of blaming Bonner for the lost lead, blame it on the TEAM effort. One player doesnt lose games. Every player who has every set foot on the NBA floor has made mistakes. Maybe Bonner is not the most effiecent defensive player on the Spurs but he plays hard when he is on the court. You want to point a finger at a single player for losing the lead? Try pointing at Leonard, he was on the court from the beginning of the 4th quarter until all the lead was gone. Did he lose the lead all by himself? Not NO but Hell no. The entire team quit for 6 1/2 minutes.

This. And I hate the fact that Splitter didn't even play 5 min in the 4th, but Bonner isn't ALWAYS a negative... just usually.:lol

[SpurNation]

I just started watching the game and the first 3 minutes have been the Danny Green show. Hes taken 3 shots (missed the first two, fouled on the last and sent to the line), gotten three boards, made several nice passes (including a pinpoint assist to Duncan), gotten two clean strips and played suffocating defense on at least one break-away by Brandon Knight.

Too bad I don't think he kept it up all game. He had a great start.

Green has been "quietly not so quietly" one of the best team players on the squad. http://basketballvalue.com/player.php?year=2011-2012&id=813

And though getting notoriety for his rookie play...Leonard "quietly not so loudly" has been one of the worst. http://basketballvalue.com/player.php?year=2011-2012&id=1003

For those who think Kawhi should start...the numbers show he plays best not as a starter per say but more so if he pairs up with Green.

[pookenstein]

Manu Ginobili B
On defense, he drew a pair of offensive fouls, including a huge one with 1:24 remaining in a tie game.

I think everybody knew what wass about to happen as soon as Prince tried to post up Manu at that possesion. My first thought was "Tayshaun, you're about to be fucked very soon.":lol


Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

Keep it the way it is now. A great read every time. :toast

[Obstructed_View]

Green has been "quietly not so quietly" one of the best team players on the squad. http://basketballvalue.com/player.php?year=2011-2012&id=813

And though getting notoriety for his rookie play...Leonard "quietly not so loudly" has been one of the worst. http://basketballvalue.com/player.php?year=2011-2012&id=1003

For those who think Kawhi should start...the numbers show he plays best not as a starter per say but more so if he pairs up with Green.

Leonard's given minutes against superstar players on the other team under 6'10", and usually his starting gig depends on whether the opponent has said player on the roster.

[Fireball]

I think once we saw the lineup of TP, Manu, Kawhi, Splitter and Duncan ... I want to see more of that one

[Darkwaters]

Green has been "quietly not so quietly" one of the best team players on the squad. http://basketballvalue.com/player.php?year=2011-2012&id=813

And though getting notoriety for his rookie play...Leonard "quietly not so loudly" has been one of the worst. http://basketballvalue.com/player.php?year=2011-2012&id=1003

For those who think Kawhi should start...the numbers show he plays best not as a starter per say but more so if he pairs up with Green.

I'm a card-carrying member of the Danny Green club. Sure, hes got some things he needs to reel in and work on in his game, and sometimes his decision-making if iffy, but for a scrap heap player playing his first consistent minutes in the NBA (despite being a "3rd year player") I'm pretty sold on his potential. He'll get better as he finds his niche.

Sure hes streaky as a shooter. But he always brings solid effort, even if the shots aren't falling. And sometimes he can go 6-7 from 3 and/or just drop 24 on you. He can't be a focal point, but hes a nice piece to have around. Not sure I like him as a starter, but for a while he can fill in.

[will_spurs]

Tim Duncan A-
School was in session for Greg Monroe and Tim Duncan was the professor.

Sadly the school was also in session for Blair with Monroe as a professor. Blair is just never going to score any points going 1-on-1 with Monroe.


Manu Ginobili B
The bad: Manu Ginobili didn't make a basket -- and wasn't very close on any of his attempts. Defensively, he had trouble keeping up with anybody. [...] Overall, he has a lot of room for improvement but tonight was further evidence of Ginobili's legendary will to win.

Is that based on expectations for a recovering Manu? Otherwise it's a C at best. It's ok to admit that Manu is playing subpar right now, he has a legitimate excuse.


Tony Parker C+
Thankfully, Parker shifted into gear before it was too late. With the game tied 90-90 with with 2:16 remaining, the All-Star point guard scored scored eight straight points to finally put the Pistons away.

So Parker being clutch is further evidence of Manu's legendary will to win. Ok, get it :lol

BTW I couldn't help but notice that Parker's FG% has been going down a lot in the last couple of games, so I looked up this stat:
- FG% with Manu = 38.82%
- FG% w/o Manu = 47.08%

It looks like Parker isn't sure what his role is any more with Manu back in the mix.

Which brings me to...


Pop A
I liked a lot of what Pop did tonight.

It looks like everything is too easy for Pop, so his modus operandi right now seems to be first to dig himself into a hole, and second to see if he can manage to get out of it. The funny part being that we could have been afraid that Manu coming back might affect KL or Green's game, but it apparently seems to affect Parker the most.

As the technical FT incident showed, this team defers to Manu way too much. Much like Spurs fans, actually :lol

[Pauleta14]

Take the C+ for Parker as a compliment. (if you're a Parker homer..err, I mean fan). All it means is that we've come to expect and depend on TP to produce all star caliber numbers night in and night out. This is the same guy who dropped 42 and 37 on competent defensive clubs like OKC and Philadelphia.


TP is doing what Pop is asking him...

The fact that TP seemed "asleep" as Timvp said only means to me that with Manu in, he had the ball less in his hands and didn't have to be the go to guy.

I'm not saying he deserves an A, but come on C+? really?

That means you expect all star performances every single game from him?

That's crazy, you know Pop is the puppet master and you know that the veteran Tony is has to anticipate the long term and save his energy for the PO.

A game like last night showed me 2 things, first that WHEN/IF NEEDED, Tony can step up and second that he is damn clutch in the 4th...

When Manu sucks for 3 quarters and finaly is a hero in the clutch everybody is amazed/in love... when it's Tony, it's "WTF where you doing for 3 quarters???...)

Call me homer if you want, but these are objective facts...

[rmt]

Loved seeing TD and Tiago playing together. Hated seeing Bonner closing the game. That's Pop's crunch time line-up - TD, Manu, TP, RJ and Bonner? Spurs not going to last long in the playoffs. What is Pop's love affair with Bonner - he just can't play under pressure - missing a wide open 3 and 2 free throws.

[RodNIc91]

I prefere the longer writeup. Thanks for the grades. They are specially insightful when you don't get to watch the game.

BTW do you think the team can improve more defensivly? What's the defensive ceiling of this team?

[Maddog]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.

[ManuTastic]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?


I love the in-depth analysis. I don't mind waiting a bit, though it seems these are up pretty fast anyway. Some of my favorite morning reading!

Agreed that Parker is less aggressive. Not sure that's a bad thing, as long as the Ws keep coming. While I personally love seeing Parker going full out, a la the OKC game, maybe he'd be better served picking and choosing his spots so as to avoid exhaustion in this compressed season. If that's his strategy, last night it seemed to work. He coasted until the end when he wrapped it up for the team. Perhaps that's just the right amount of energy to expend against a Detroit.

Just win, baby.

[TDMVPDPOY]

Kawhi Leonard, you guys still buyin the hype???

whatever happened to his college offensive game, why we turning him into a jumpshooter...he should be driving it more into the lane, his playing against shit players at his position who are scrubs on defense...

[Silverheart80]

I vote for comprehensive.

It's easy for us out here to say that. We're not the ones putting in the time. I don't post that often but I still check your post after every game, either same night or next morning.

If anyone were to expect the same quality but faster, they need to get a life. I appreciate the swiftness of your posts as it is. I think they're extremely timely (and excellent), all things considered.

[Kewni Leonard]

Kawhi Leonard, you guys still buyin the hype???

whatever happened to his college offensive game, why we turning him into a jumpshooter...he should be driving it more into the lane, his playing against shit players at his position who are scrubs on defense...

Because Popobitch is the most overrated coach in NBA history, has been carried by Tim Duncan his entire career and has no ability to adapt his system to fit players of different skillsets; he tries to force players out of their comfort zones and ruin their confidence.

A few quick examples of his brilliance: Finley at PF in Mavs playoff series for the first time the entire season, 2006. Turning Richard Jefferson into purely a spot-up shooter. Ditto Hedo Turkoglu. Playing Beno Udrih behind Jacque Vaughn. Pinning the best player in Europe to the bench all of last season; we are lucky McDyess retired or he would still be glued there, he surely would have been ruining Splitter's career just like he did Udrih's.

[Brazil]

I have no issue with Parker C+ tbh it just shows at what level of expectations we can have after the beginning of the year. I'm pretty sure timvp would have given a B+ after the three first weeks of the season. Tonight it's a C+ thats a compliment.

Now I disagree with Pop having a A. Pop is IMO responsible for the pistons run during the fourth. When Ben started to play physically and jerebko made some good plays, he should have changed the lineup. I understand why he stayed with Tim (on Ben) and Matt (on Jerebko) but that was a bad decision IMO. Ben was eating Tim, Tiago deserved a shot on him. I would have paired Tiago with Tim and let Leonard chasing jerebko. We need physical intensity on the floor at that moment. Instead of doing Pop used the hack a ben.... ok it worked but I'm sorry I don't like it.

The team needs to show they can respond to a physical challenge... this is what we are going to face in the PO, we are not going to save the day with a hack a stuff every time.

[urunobili]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

This version rocks! :tu

I dont feel like reading anything else on any news place after reading your thoughts TBH :wakeup

[SpursNW]

[I prefer this version since I miss games sometimes like tonight for V-Day because it gives me a more in depth look at what happened rather than just looking at a box score]


Ditto above - still trying to get Spurs games televised in the NW!

TimVP,

I really apprecate the time you put into your analysis -I read this after every game.

[will_spurs]

I also prefer the long version, mostly because I fear a shorter one who be linked too much to the box score. It takes time and space to explain the discrepancies between the box score and what actually happened on the court.

[timvp]

Something I took away that was interesting during the game that the cameras might not have caught: The Spurs had to shoot a tech and the entire team was looking to Manu to shoot it, he waved them off and said he couldn't. That isn't a good sign.Interesting. I was wondering why TP shot the technical and not Manu.

I'm guessing the soonest Manu will get his legs back will be after the All-Star break. Thankfully, he can help in the meantime.


Is this the real Leonard we are seeing regarding his 3's? Or is he just a raw, streaky shooter who just happens to be hotIt's probably just a hot streak but he seems to have changed his shot a bit. He's taking his time and is getting a little bit more arc on the ball. The deliberate windup he's using now kinda reminds me of Horry. . .


37% on the year is freaking good for a player like himMy hope for him was he could one day shoot 35% on three-pointers. Anything higher than that is gravy.

Going seven for his last night is pretty ridiculous, especially considering he was 7-for-28 prior to that.

[Muser]

Lets say Leonard keeps up his hot shooting and can stay around the 35% mark, surely that would be enough to warrant a starting role over RJ?

[NASpurs]

Pop knows what he has when it comes to RJ, Bonner and Blair. He knows he has weak minded individuals who would fold up and wither away if he ever benched them (RJ and Blair). So he would rather stroke their egos a bit instead of forcing tough love on them like he does with other players on the team.

I understand it but it also ticks me off. Psychology plays a big part in being a coach I guess.

[DMC]

I normally scan down the grades. I trust your grading system and only have disagreed with a couple since the start of the season, but then only by a small margin.

I wouldn't be opposed to either style, which ever is easier for you.

[CGD]

Sadly, I am unable to watch many games so I vote for the longer version please. I've seen the shorter version at other sites, and it just doesn't capture what went on.

[timvp]

When Manu sucks for 3 quarters and finaly is a hero in the clutch everybody is amazed/in love... when it's Tony, it's "WTF where you doing for 3 quarters???...)

I actually agree with that. However, it's mostly due to positions. An asleep shooting guard doesn't really hurt anything, especially if others are playing well. But a point guard who isn't being aggressive, especially one like Parker who the Spurs depend on so much to break down the defense, simply can't blend into the background. When Parker lets up even a little bit, it becomes obvious quickly.

I wanted to give Parker a better grade but considering that he had six points on 3-for-11 shooting in the game's first 46 minutes against the team in the NBA who is the worst at defending opposing point guards, I just couldn't.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

In depth coverage is awesome. I'd rather wait a bit and get extra juicy info as it is always worth the wait :toast

I was incredibly annoyed with Pop's coaching in the fourth (too much Bonner and Jefferson) but with about 2 minutes left he righted the ship.

timvp, while it may be tough enough just to get Pop to play more Duncan/Tiago together, do you think playing them at the same time to close out a tough game is tyoo risky at this point? I hated Bonner closing out the game but I also figured it wasn't a good time for Pop to push the Tiago/Duncan experiment when the Spurs just needed to escape with the win.

[Muser]

Pop knows what he has when it comes to RJ, Bonner and Blair. He knows he has weak minded individuals who would fold up and wither away if he ever benched them (RJ and Blair). So he would rather stroke their egos a bit instead of forcing tough love on them like he does with other players on the team.

I understand it but it also ticks me off. Psychology plays a big part in being a coach I guess.

Good point, people complain about Pop but for the most part he's a damn elite coach.

[timvp]

Alright, I'll keep the comprehensive version. I didn't know whether or not SpursTalk just wanted a watered down version that could be written faster ... but it looks like I got the answer. Thanks :tu

[timvp]

timvp, while it may be tough enough just to get Pop to play more Duncan/Tiago together, do you think playing them at the same time to close out a tough game is tyoo risky at this point? I hated Bonner closing out the game but I also figured it wasn't a good time for Pop to push the Tiago/Duncan experiment when the Spurs just needed to escape with the win.

Tbh, as much of a known choker Bonner is and as soft as he was playing, I agreed with Pop going with Bonner in that situation. The Spurs were desperate to stop the bleeding and going with a group that has a ton of experience together (Duncan, Bonner, Jefferson, Ginobili and Parker) was a good way to limit mistakes. While I almost always prefer Bonner and RJ on the bench, in this particular situation I thought limiting mistakes was very important -- and for all of Bonner and RJ's faults, they don't make many mistakes.

With the Pistons one big play away from really taking control of the game, it wasn't a good time for experimentation.









That said, if Pop had previously built up the chemistry of Splitter with the starting unit, it wouldn't be an experiment. But that's a rant for another day . . .

[GSH]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup


I prefer the comprehensive grades. Of course, I also prefer to drive a Ferrari - but the cost is a bit high. You usually throw in some nuggets like this being the first time since January 17 that Blair has scored in double figures two games in a row. Those things add a lot to the commentary, but they are also time consuming as hell to dig out. Like I said, I prefer the comprehensive grades. But I'm not the one doing the work after every game.

I will say that, as far as I am aware, this is the only place that fans of any team can find something like this after every game. And it shows in the number of people who wait for it before going to bed. We're spoiled. And I'm pretty sure that even the people who say that they don't mind a shortened format will feel a little withdrawal if you go that route.

[timvp]

Is that based on expectations for a recovering Manu?

Yes, obviously. Manu wasn't really in shape to begin the season ... so add in the time off from the broken hand and it's understandable that he wouldn't be 100% in his second game back. He's probably not even 50% right now.

But for barely being able to move, he was pretty damn helpful.

[Old School 44]

Nice post as always! I like your posts just the way they are!

As others have pointed out, I thought Tony should have at least got a B for his clutch play in the fourth. I like that he took it strong to the basket vs. shooting jumpers.

Is it true Manu still has screws in his hand? If so, do they stay in the rest of the season or do they come out before? If they come out before, does he miss any additional games?

[timvp]

Is it true Manu still has screws in his hand? If so, do they stay in the rest of the season or do they come out before? If they come out before, does he miss any additional games?

He has four screws in his hand and they stay there the rest of his life.

[said7]

How stupid is Ben Gordon. His teammate is writhing in pain on the floor and instead of calling timeout he fires a 3. Not to mention his late technical. Guy is a chucker scrub.

[Pauleta14]

I actually agree with that. However, it's mostly due to positions. An asleep shooting guard doesn't really hurt anything, especially if others are playing well. But a point guard who isn't being aggressive, especially one like Parker who the Spurs depend on so much to break down the defense, simply can't blend into the background. When Parker lets up even a little bit, it becomes obvious quickly.

I wanted to give Parker a better grade but considering that he had six points on 3-for-11 shooting in the game's first 46 minutes against the team in the NBA who is the worst at defending opposing point guards, I just couldn't.


It's fine, I wasn't "mad" or anything, just didn't get why so much was expected from him FOR THIS GAME especialy , considering Manu was back and I expected Tony to be less agressive or at least not one of the "focal point"...

The reason you gave me is very interesting in the sense that you admit that Tony's role/involvement in much more important during THE WHOLE game than it is for Manu or any other player.
So if Tony has the toughest job in the team, he should be graded taking that factor into acount, not only "what he is capable of"...

I hope I'm clear, I just mean that you should take into acount what's REALLY needed by Tony for games like that, don't tell me you expected him to give his best on the first game of a btob, against a bad team, with Manu returning...

Anyway, thanks again for the great job you do on this forum, always interesting and entertaining! :toast

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Something I took away that was interesting during the game that the cameras might not have caught: The Spurs had to shoot a tech and the entire team was looking to Manu to shoot it, he waved them off and said he couldn't. That isn't a good sign.

Does everyone realizehow screwed the team and manu's career are if Manu has lost shooting ability with than pin in his hand

[EVAY]

Is that based on expectations for a recovering Manu? Otherwise it's a C at best. It's ok to admit that Manu is playing subpar right now, he has a legitimate excuse.



So Parker being clutch is further evidence of Manu's legendary will to win. Ok, get it :lol

BTW I couldn't help but notice that Parker's FG% has been going down a lot in the last couple of games, so I looked up this stat:
- FG% with Manu = 38.82%
- FG% w/o Manu = 47.08%

It looks like Parker isn't sure what his role is any more with Manu back in the mix.

Which brings me to...



It looks like everything is too easy for Pop, so his modus operandi right now seems to be first to dig himself into a hole, and second to see if he can manage to get out of it. The funny part being that we could have been afraid that Manu coming back might affect KL or Green's game, but it apparently seems to affect Parker the most.




This. Thank you.

[bus driver]

i like these reports
but the past few games you have been hard on green with something like a C-, C. Glad to see he got a B today. i think he deserves at least a B for the past few weeks just on his hustle. that is my 2 cents

[Mal]

This is how Manu is valueable. He didn`t provide points, but he managed to help his team with every other aspect of the game.

He still needs some time, to get in his game rythm. But it is always better to have him not scoring, than him not playing at all.

[Mal]

BTW I couldn't help but notice that Parker's FG% has been going down a lot in the last couple of games, so I looked up this stat:
- FG% with Manu = 38.82%
- FG% w/o Manu = 47.08%

It looks like Parker isn't sure what his role is any more with Manu back in the mix.
l

Maybe that`s why Pop decide to put Manu back to bench ? So Parker could run offense in his style for a while. Guess Spurs will benefit more with Manu and Parker playing less together than it is necessary.

[Blake]

I don't give the Pistons credit for making a comeback when one of their big baskets was a stupid Ben Wallace 3 pointer.

The Spurs took their foot (feet) off the gas and got away from what got them the big lead against a very inferior Detroit team.

Should have been an easy 20 point win.

[Cane]

Oh man, looking at the few Pistons fans that are left and their emotional posts about last night's game is pretty funny. Spurs have caused some butthurt to other fanbases and this wasn't even Detroit's game thread http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1161086 This shouldn't be entertaining, but somehow it is

Anyway as for the grades, I don't care if they're comprehensive or not as long as they're there, and as long as timvp is around to reply.

As for the game, damn Pistons vs Spurs is never pretty, but that was some uggglly ass basketball in the end. I still can't believe that Wallace not only hit a 3, but that they left him on the court during crunch time. The Pistons basically wanted to lose by doing that, and with Gordon's untimely clutch technical, it really seemed like they were tanking the game even though they were still kind of competing at the same time

[spurspokesman]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

Comprehensive. Keep up the swell work.

[spurspokesman]

Question: Does the SpursTalk populace prefer comprehensive grades like the above post that takes longer to put together ... or would do you prefer a less in-depth version that would be posted quicker following games?

Thank you in advance for your input :wakeup

Comprehensive. Keep up the swell work. Always good to see a person back up there sentiments.

[GSH]

Before you go into too much detail about who screwed up last night, consider this. The Spurs lost that lead in just 3 minutes of play. The lineups on the floor when it happened were Parker, Green, Leonard, Bonner, Splitter and Neal, Green, Jefferson, Bonner, Duncan. So you can't blame it all on one group of players.

It's pretty simple. The Pistons dialed up their defensive effort, a few calls went against the Spurs, and for just those few minutes, the Pistons scored at a 220-point game pace. Also during that time, the Spurs offense went totally stagnant. They wound up taking mostly taking desperation shots, late in the shot clock. To be more specific, their shots were put up at 26, 21, 24, 19, and 23 seconds into the clock. (The one non-desperation shot at 19 seconds was where Duncan got his arms almost ripped off by Wallace, and then got elbowed in the eye.)

We're talking 3 minutes, from 10:44 to 7:47. During that time, Detroit got 2 and-1's plus two 3-pointers from guys who aren't good 3-point shooters. There was also a jump ball that Jefferson "won" but hit out of bounds. And there was a possession where Tiago blocked a shot by Ben Gordon, 22 seconds into the shot clock - but the ball went out of bounds and back to Detroit, and Ben Freaking Wallace hit his 7th career 3-pointer. That was a very good defensive possession, ending in disaster.

In short, it was something of a perfect storm - for 3 whole minutes. Before that, the Spurs kicked Detroits collective asses. After that, even though the Pistons had confidence, you didn't really have the sense that they were going to be able to win the game.

So how did the Pistons defense get the best of the Spurs for those 3 minutes? My opinion is that it came down to two things.
1. The Spurs quit moving without the ball.
2. The Pistons were doing something that has been making me crazy this year, all over the NBA. (Not just against the Spurs.) They were "hedging" out around the 3P line. Only the hedges consist of actually putting a body on the ball-handler and physically shoving him toward mid-court. And at the same time, they were getting into the passing lanes to the guys sitting still in the corners.

I don't blame the Pistons for doing it. But I do blame the NBA for letting the practice get out of hand this year. A hedge is a hedge - but a shove, even if done with the body, is still a shove. But I blame the Spurs players the most, for sitting on their asses and not doing anything to help out the ball-handlers.

[EVAY]

Before you go into too much detail about who screwed up last night, consider this. The Spurs lost that lead in just 3 minutes of play. The lineups on the floor when it happened were Parker, Green, Leonard, Bonner, Splitter and Neal, Green, Jefferson, Bonner, Duncan. So you can't blame it all on one group of players.

It's pretty simple. The Pistons dialed up their defensive effort, a few calls went against the Spurs, and for just those few minutes, the Pistons scored at a 220-point game pace. Also during that time, the Spurs offense went totally stagnant. They wound up taking mostly taking desperation shots, late in the shot clock. To be more specific, their shots were put up at 26, 21, 24, 19, and 23 seconds into the clock. (The one non-desperation shot at 19 seconds was where Duncan got his arms almost ripped off by Wallace, and then got elbowed in the eye.)

We're talking 3 minutes, from 10:44 to 7:47. During that time, Detroit got 2 and-1's plus two 3-pointers from guys who aren't good 3-point shooters. There was also a jump ball that Jefferson "won" but hit out of bounds. And there was a possession where Tiago blocked a shot by Ben Gordon, 22 seconds into the shot clock - but the ball went out of bounds and back to Detroit, and Ben Freaking Wallace hit his 7th career 3-pointer. That was a very good defensive possession, ending in disaster.

In short, it was something of a perfect storm - for 3 whole minutes. Before that, the Spurs kicked Detroits collective asses. After that, even though the Pistons had confidence, you didn't really have the sense that they were going to be able to win the game.

So how did the Pistons defense get the best of the Spurs for those 3 minutes? My opinion is that it came down to two things.
1. The Spurs quit moving without the ball.
2. The Pistons were doing something that has been making me crazy this year, all over the NBA. (Not just against the Spurs.) They were "hedging" out around the 3P line. Only the hedges consist of actually putting a body on the ball-handler and physically shoving him toward mid-court. And at the same time, they were getting into the passing lanes to the guys sitting still in the corners.

I don't blame the Pistons for doing it. But I do blame the NBA for letting the practice get out of hand this year. A hedge is a hedge - but a shove, even if done with the body, is still a shove. But I blame the Spurs players the most, for sitting on their asses and not doing anything to help out the ball-handlers.

Well said. All of it. Great observations.

[GSH]

One more thing - I really like the fact that you gave Pop an "A" for the night. The decision to go to "Hack-A-Wallace" is unpopular as hell, even among a lot of Spurs fans. But it was absolutely demoralizing to Detroit to see it happening, and knowing that there was nothing they could do to stop it. It also destroyed the rhythm they had gotten into, and eventually caused some players to lose their composure.

For those who say the NBA should do something to stop the practice - there are already two rules to keep it from happening. One is that they allow the player to stand up and shoot two uncontested shots. The other is that when one player commits too many fouls, he gets put on the bench for the rest of the game. It's no different than the intentional walk in baseball, where the batter gets to get on base for free. The object of the game is to put the little ball through the ring. If Ben Wallace can't do that, f'him. The Pistons can always take him off the floor if he's too much of a liability. There are lots of guys in the D-League because they can't shoot worth a damn.

[DBMethos]

Oh man, looking at the few Pistons fans that are left and their emotional posts about last night's game is pretty funny. Spurs have caused some butthurt to other fanbases and this wasn't even Detroit's game thread http://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1161086 This shouldn't be entertaining, but somehow it is

Anyway as for the grades, I don't care if they're comprehensive or not as long as they're there, and as long as timvp is around to reply.

As for the game, damn Pistons vs Spurs is never pretty, but that was some uggglly ass basketball in the end. I still can't believe that Wallace not only hit a 3, but that they left him on the court during crunch time. The Pistons basically wanted to lose by doing that, and with Gordon's untimely clutch technical, it really seemed like they were tanking the game even though they were still kind of competing at the same time

LMAO @ the butthurt in that thread...I don't miss RealGM at all.

[Horse]

I'm glad the game went like it did, now there's no excuse to lay an egg tonight. And plenty of stuff for Pop to break balls about. I give the pistons credit for playing hard allnight but in truth that fourth quarter they just got every bounce and I don't care what you say any and i mean ANY ben wallace jumper that goes in is luck. If we are all the way healthy for the playoffs anything can happen, just ask the fagericks. It showed incredible depth when Manu, Kawi and Tiago all came off the bench together. Now imagine when we close games with Tony, Manu, Kawi, Tiago and Timmy.

[Paranoid Pop]

One more thing - I really like the fact that you gave Pop an "A" for the night. The decision to go to "Hack-A-Wallace" is unpopular as hell, even among a lot of Spurs fans. But it was absolutely demoralizing to Detroit to see it happening, and knowing that there was nothing they could do to stop it. It also destroyed the rhythm they had gotten into, and eventually caused some players to lose their composure.

So demoralizing to watch Ben Wallace make one and to get an extra possession on the second while Bonner miss both, they couldn't have lost because of anything else really :rolleyes.

[DAF86]

I would give Pop a much lower grade for the simple fact of not going with Splitter and Duncan at the end of the game when they were playing so well individually and toghether. I would have also liked to see Leonard in there instead of RJ, no matter that clutch 3 that RJ hit.

[Keepin' it real]

So demoralizing to watch Ben Wallace make one and to get an extra possession on the second while Bonner miss both, they couldn't have lost because of anything else really :rolleyes.

I'm sure we were all shocked to see Bonner miss those two FTs in the clutch. As we realists know, that was just a sneak preview of what's to come in the playoffs if (when) Bonner gets crunch-time minutes.

[Sean Cagney]

I'm sure we were all shocked to see Bonner miss those two FTs in the clutch. As we realists know, that was just a sneak preview of what's to come in the playoffs if (when) Bonner gets crunch-time minutes.

If people expect any different they are fooling themselves! It showed earlier against Dallas as well with that missed three and that last possession he nearly turned it over only to get saved by Green. He is the anti clutch.

[ffadicted]

Definitely comprehensive.

Or if you just want to post quick grades right away and then edit in the comprehensive descriptions, that would be the best of both worlds

[wildbill2u]

Here's a good reason to stay with the comprehensive longer version. It makes you think harder and consider the graded performance with more depth. On a close call, you might give someone a B in a hurry up grade where after due time to contemplate the whole game it might go to a B Minus or a B Plus.

Take your time. It willl be worth it.

[anonoftheinternets]

what would be cool is if you averaged out the grades at the end of the year :).

[Blake]

what would be cool is if you averaged out the grades at the end of the year :).

I like this, tbh.

Instead of B+, give a number grade, imo.

[anonoftheinternets]

I like this, tbh.

Instead of B+, give a number grade, imo.

Well the grades can have implicit numbers. Similar to how a GPA is calculated. Doesnt need to be an explicit number grade. Then average it out and translate back to an alphabetical grade. :)

[GSH]

So demoralizing to watch Ben Wallace make one and to get an extra possession on the second while Bonner miss both, they couldn't have lost because of anything else really :rolleyes.

Heh. The Pistons' shooters were hot, and they weren't missing anything. Below is what happened to their offense after the Spurs went to the Hack-A-Wallace. (I left out all those cool Spurs possessions, where the Pistons' misses led to points on the other end. ;) ) You're probably right. I bet it wasn't getting out of rhythm, or frustration that made their shooters start missing everything. I've heard that a lot of losers have selective memories... maybe that's got something to do with it?

02:31
Wallace Free Throw 1 of 2 (7 PTS)
Wallace Free Throw 2 of 2 Missed
Team Rebound (Spurs)
02:17 Parker Foul: Personal (1 PF)
Wallace Free Throw 1 of 2 Missed
Wallace Free Throw 2 of 2 (8 PTS)
02:06
Bonner Foul: Personal (1 PF)
Wallace Free Throw 1 of 2 (9 PTS)
Wallace Free Throw 2 of 2 Missed
Knight Rebound (Off:1 Def:2)
Prince Turnaround Jump Shot: Missed
01:38 Wallace Rebound (Off:3 Def:2)
Prince Turnover : Foul
Stuckey Free Throw 1 of 2
Stuckey Free Throw 2 of 2 Missed
Stuckey Running Jump Shot: Missed
Gordon 3pt Shot: Missed
Knight Foul: Personal
Gordon Technical


Edit:
Here... before you fire back and look even more ridiculous. These are the possessions before the Hack-A-Wallace.

Stuckey Running Bank shot: Made
Stuckey Free Throw 1 of 1 (19 PTS)
Jerebko 3pt Shot: Made (7 PTS) Assist: Stuckey (7 AST)
Gordon Jump Shot: Made
Gordon Layup Shot: Missed Block: Leonard (1 BLK)
Stuckey Running Jump Shot: Made
Knight Jump Shot: Made
Knight Free Throw 1 of 1
Gordon 3pt Shot: Missed
Stuckey Free Throw 1 of 2 Missed
Stuckey Free Throw 2 of 2 (22 PTS)
Prince Jump Shot: Made (18 PTS)

[Morg1411]

My vote is for the more comprehensive coverage.

This.

[TMTTRIO]

Something I took away that was interesting during the game that the cameras might not have caught: The Spurs had to shoot a tech and the entire team was looking to Manu to shoot it, he waved them off and said he couldn't. That isn't a good sign

I was wondering why did Pop even have Manu out there in clutch time when Manu looks like he's not even close to ready to come back?

[Paranoid Pop]

Heh. The Pistons' shooters were hot, and they weren't missing anything. Below is what happened to their offense after the Spurs went to the Hack-A-Wallace. (I left out all those cool Spurs possessions, where the Pistons' misses led to points on the other end. ;) ) You're probably right. I bet it wasn't getting out of rhythm, or frustration that made their shooters start missing everything. I've heard that a lot of losers have selective memories... maybe that's got something to do with it?

02:31
Wallace Free Throw 1 of 2 (7 PTS)
Wallace Free Throw 2 of 2 Missed
Team Rebound (Spurs)
02:17 Parker Foul: Personal (1 PF)
Wallace Free Throw 1 of 2 Missed
Wallace Free Throw 2 of 2 (8 PTS)
02:06
Bonner Foul: Personal (1 PF)
Wallace Free Throw 1 of 2 (9 PTS)
Wallace Free Throw 2 of 2 Missed
Knight Rebound (Off:1 Def:2)
Prince Turnaround Jump Shot: Missed
01:38 Wallace Rebound (Off:3 Def:2)
Prince Turnover : Foul
Stuckey Free Throw 1 of 2
Stuckey Free Throw 2 of 2 Missed
Stuckey Running Jump Shot: Missed
Gordon 3pt Shot: Missed
Knight Foul: Personal
Gordon Technical


Edit:
Here... before you fire back and look even more ridiculous. These are the possessions before the Hack-A-Wallace.

Stuckey Running Bank shot: Made
Stuckey Free Throw 1 of 1 (19 PTS)
Jerebko 3pt Shot: Made (7 PTS) Assist: Stuckey (7 AST)
Gordon Jump Shot: Made
Gordon Layup Shot: Missed Block: Leonard (1 BLK)
Stuckey Running Jump Shot: Made
Knight Jump Shot: Made
Knight Free Throw 1 of 1
Gordon 3pt Shot: Missed
Stuckey Free Throw 1 of 2 Missed
Stuckey Free Throw 2 of 2 (22 PTS)
Prince Jump Shot: Made (18 PTS)

The only one who should feel ridiculous is Pop, having his favorite 3pt shooter miss both FTs when Wallace got one out of 2 each time + an extra possession. The momentum switch had way more to do with Manu's flops and TP taking over than anything else.

[adonis827]

timvp-

I vote to have both- a quick post while you make the more comprehensive one :D

[adonis827]

timvp-

I vote to have both- a quick post while you make the more comprehensive one :D