Defense wins championship

[Mal]

Way too many teams can just put 100+ on Spurs, these days.

And it is obvious that Spurs cant rely on hitting 3`s and putting 105+ points in playoffs.

Start defending and win games , when there are not 200+ points scored

[antarescrane]

I would not actually say that the spurs are actually awful at team defense. I have not watched as many games this season as in past seasons, but I would say that players like matt bonner, dejuan blair, and gary neal are the reason the spurs are so bad at getting stops. They bring many good things on the offensive end, but well...

[xellos88330]

I would not actually say that the spurs are actually awful at team defense. I have not watched as many games this season as in past seasons, but I would say that players like matt bonner, dejuan blair, and gary neal are the reason the spurs are so bad at getting stops. They bring many good things on the offensive end, but well...

I agree.

The Spurs sag way to deep and don't have the footspeed to close out on shooters.

[daslicer]

Honestly the last 2 years I haven't really focused on this team winning a championship. A lot will have to go right for it to happen. For me as a fan I just enjoy watching the games the spurs are an exciting team to watch you guys might as well enjoy it because in a year or two that will all be gone.

[TDMVPDPOY]

the defense showed tonight when chasing down the open player after a double team, maybe players are gambling to much with too much spacing given and not bodying up with active hands...

[DMC]

We lost for one reason: we missed our free throws. We made the same number of 3pt shots, we shot about the same percentage from the floor, they had more FT attempts and made more FTs, but we lost by one less that we missed at the line.

All else is just game play. Freethrow shooting has to improve.

[Sean Cagney]

Fuk yo defense clown

We get it Jax said fuck yo fantasy team clown to some kid, now you go off on a tirade tonight in here with the same response :lol:lol

[Gutter92]

We get it Jax said fuck yo fantasy team clown to some kid, now you go off on a tirade tonight in here with the same response :lol:lol


cause he only has 2 shticks, tbh...

semen shield and parrot

[TE]

I agree, Defense win's championships... and the Spurs currently lack that "defense".

[ElNono]

I like the personnel better, with Bonner/Blair/Neal being the obvious exceptions. We only have a 2 game sample though.

[Bruno]

To be a great defensive team, you need great defensive players. Spurs don't have these players and that's the main reason why they aren't a true contender. It's as simple as that.

Spurs could indeed do a better defensive job than what they did against Mavs but the margin of progression is somewhat limited.

[Nathan89]

Manu needs to be added to the list of poor defenders. At least for now... Hopefully he improves.

Splitter is a really good defender but Pop doesn't like playing him enough.

Sjax seems to be a positive addition on defense.

[therealtruth]

To be a great defensive team, you need great defensive players. Spurs don't have these players and that's the main reason why they aren't a true contender. It's as simple as that.

Spurs could indeed do a better defensive job than what they did against Mavs but the margin of progression is somewhat limited.

That and the coach has to play the best defensive players the most minutes. When Manu's healthy that will probably be TP,Manu,KL,TD, and TS. As a unit they should have the ability to lock teams up.

[Hoops Czar]

I like the personnel better, with Bonner/Blair/Neal being the obvious exceptions. We only have a 2 game sample though.

What personnel changes would that be? Other than S-Jax, everything was the same. I mean you can sit and deny the ugly truth, but the Spurs can't stop anybody. Team defense won't improve unless they get front court help and Pop is still gonna play Bonner, Blair and neal.

[ElNono]

What personnel changes would that be? Other than S-Jax

You answered yourself...

[Hoops Czar]

You answered yourself...

Then it's a one game sample.

[SenorSpur]

To be a great defensive team, you need great defensive players. Spurs don't have these players and that's the main reason why they aren't a true contender. It's as simple as that.

Spurs could indeed do a better defensive job than what they did against Mavs but the margin of progression is somewhat limited.

There it is - in a nutshell. It's a damn shame too, as deep as this roster is. In trying to keep up with league trends, Pop has evolved away his defensive priniciples. In other words, he sold his soul for more offense. The result is what we're seeing today.

Who would've ever thunk that the Mavs and Spurs would undergo a role reversal. The Mavs would have a roll out length and size along the frontline, along with a seemingly stout defense, and the Spurs would evolve into the offensive juggernaut.

[Spurs da champs]

To be a great defensive team, you need great defensive players. Spurs don't have these players and that's the main reason why they aren't a true contender. It's as simple as that.


The Mavs didn't have great defenders when they one last year, they had a really good team defense, the Spurs communication on defense is really bad.

[DeadlyDynasty]

The Mavs didn't have great defenders when they one last year

lolwut?

[midnightpulp]

To have a great defensive team that is a legitimate championship contender, you also need to have an above-average interior post offense. With an aging Duncan, that's obviously no longer the case.

[Spurs da champs]

lolwut?

You consider Marion a great defender?
Chandler?
J-Kidd was a great defender like 10 years ago.
Chandler was a great leader on defense tho, he started the communication which helped make the Mavericks a great team defense.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Tyson Chandler is a great defender.
Kidd is an above-average defender (at least was last year against the like of Kobe, etal)
Lincoln is known primarily for his defense
Marion was a beast defender during that 2011 run
Dirk was the only starter not defensive-first

[midnightpulp]

Tyson Chandler is a great defender.
Kidd is an above-average defender (at least was last year against the like of Kobe, etal)
Lincoln is known primarily for his defense
Marion was a beast defender during that 2011 run
Dirk was the only starter not defensive-first

And Dirk's defense was highly underrated during last year's run.

[Spurs da champs]

And Dirk's defense was highly underrated during last year's run.

Thank the Zone for that.

[therealtruth]

Thank the Zone for that.

Maybe the Spurs need to start using more zone because their team defense isn't good enough. In fact it might have made sense against the Grizzlies last year.

[urunobili]

Diaw will make them better defensively? :rolleyes

[100%duncan]

we now have more hope at least with jack's showing

[Redshadows]

Sign D.Robinson and bench Bonner, then we are a better defensive team.

[GSH]

Defense wins championships.

I don't like thinking about this - so I'm not going to.

[acoelho1]

Another shot blocker would greatly improve our defense and so would starting Splitter over Blair. However, I think we have enough defensive pieces in place (short of another big per buyout) to compete on that side of the ball. Also, I think Leonard and Green will improve enough by the time playoffs roll around to be solid defenders and don't forget Sjax.

[DPG21920]

Start Tiago. Live with Blair/Bonner.

[MaNu4Tres]

Start Tiago. Live with Blair/Bonner.

There's creative ways Pop can start Tiago and still avoid Blair/Bonner playing together.

Why Pop doesn't try this? My guess is because of Pop's fear of Blair mentally checking out if he gets demoted in the rotation-- which I brought up earlier this season.




(IMO)The first reason why Splitter isn't getting significant minutes right now is because Pop doesn't want to lose a big man in the rotation. Being thin at the position, Pop knows the Spurs can't afford to lose Blair from a spiritual and mental standpoint. To explain, if Pop ships 10-12 minutes of Blair's to Tiago, (which all of us are crying for; including myself), then Pop will inevitably lose Blair because of the fragile make-up of his mentality. This became apparent to me many times before when his minutes have decreased in the past and the relatively recent game in New Orleans clarified my opinion of his mental make-up. If anyone has NBA League Pass Broadband or has the game on DVR please go re-watch the closing minutes and watch Blair's actions at the end of the game whenever Tim and Tiago closed it out (from start of mid-way of 4th til whenever the players congratulate each other at the end). Blair just has a selfish and ego driven mindset (IMO). All in all, Pop knows Spurs can't afford to lose him from a spiritual and mental standpoint.

[GSH]

There's creative ways Pop can start Tiago and still avoid Blair/Bonner playing together.

Why Pop doesn't try this? My guess is because of Pop's fear of Blair mentally checking out if he gets demoted in the rotation-- which I brought up earlier this season.


Some people act like these guys are robots, without personalities. Like it or not, that's one of the things that Phil Jackson did well - keep all the little egos intact. Could Blair check out (again) if he's demoted? Damn betcha. I didn't see your earlier post, but I would have agreed with it then, too.

Even in Pop's rest-heavy system, Blair is getting really short minutes for a starter. The Spurs are so short on bigs, that they need him to be in the game. The only place they can hide him is with Timmy. And if they demote him, he gets even worse. Sounds to me like good reason to have him in at the start.

Of course, I'm still not sure what the deal is with Splitter's lack of minutes. But maybe we saw it when he came up lame after playing more.

[Fabbs]

Way too many teams can just put 100+ on Spurs, these days.

And it is obvious that Spurs cant rely on hitting 3`s and putting 105+ points in playoffs.

Start defending and win games , when there are not 200+ points scored
Got to have a defensive minded coach and I'm not sure Don Nelson is ever going to change.

[ElNono]

Then it's a one game sample.

Without RJ, it's a 2 game sample... whether Kawhi or Jack get his minutes, it's already a plus. It can't be understated how much we sucked defensively at the wings with that bitch getting 30+ mins a game.

[DPG21920]

Spurs still suck defensively. Tiago has to play more minutes period if they want a shot at being above average defensively.

[ElNono]

There's creative ways Pop can start Tiago and still avoid Blair/Bonner playing together.

Why Pop doesn't try this? My guess is because of Pop's fear of Blair mentally checking out if he gets demoted in the rotation-- which I brought up earlier this season.

He already checked out last season. Maybe it's time to stop relying on guys that mentally check out and start trying something else (ie: Tiago).

[therealtruth]

People have been screaming for more low post scoring and defense with Tiago and Tim since last year. It hasn't happened and I doubt it happens as long as Pop is coach. He was swearing last summer he wanted to go back to defense first but continues to trot Bonner out there for major minutes. Somebody needs to ask him how not playing his best defensive players improves the defense?

[timvp]

Speaking of defense, SJax gave me some hope last night. His individual defense was really good and his help defense was miles better than anything we ever saw out of RJ. I know it's an extremely small sample size but the Mavs only scored at a rate of 78 points per 48 minutes while SJax was in the game.

When SJax wasn't in the game, the Mavs scored at a rate of 121 points per 48 minutes.

Fluke? Yeah probably but it's some hope that there may be better defense in the future.

[DPG21920]

Timvp, does Pop care enough about defense to start limiting Blair and Bonner?

[timvp]

Timvp, does Pop care enough about defense to start limiting Blair and Bonner?

I don't think him playing Blair and Bonner is about him not caring about defense. IMO, he just doesn't think Duncan and Splitter can coexist.

[ElNono]

Speaking of defense, SJax gave me some hope last night. His individual defense was really good and his help defense was miles better than anything we ever saw out of RJ. I know it's an extremely small sample size but the Mavs only scored at a rate of 78 points per 48 minutes while SJax was in the game.

When SJax wasn't in the game, the Mavs scored at a rate of 121 points per 48 minutes.

Fluke? Yeah probably but it's some hope that there may be better defense in the future.

And Kawhi had a great game against Durant Friday night. You know RJ was getting some of those minutes if he was still around.

Out with the soft is always an upgrade, IMO.

[DPG21920]

I don't think him playing Blair and Bonner is about him not caring about defense. IMO, he just doesn't think Duncan and Splitter can coexist.

Then why was RJ playing so many minutes over Green and Kawhi?

Also, why would he think they can't coexist?

[Fabbs]

I don't think him playing Blair and Bonner is about him not caring about defense. IMO, he just doesn't think Duncan and Splitter can coexist.
But he does think Duncan and Bonner can coexist.

A playoff opponents dream come true coach.

[DPG21920]

Also is there not a way to increase Tiagos minutes while still limiting Blair/Bonner? I guess it would take Splitter getting more mins than "Pop can currently give him" since Tiago is getting as many minutes as pop can get him.

[timvp]

Then why was RJ playing so many minutes over Green and Kawhi? High salaried player playing more than their current talent calls for = The storyline for every team in every sport, tbh.

Plus, perhaps Pop wanted to keep RJ's trade value high enough to trade him away. If that's the case, Pop was a genius. (Probably just an accident, though.)


Also, why would he think they can't coexist?He views them both as strictly centers.

[Fabbs]

He views them both as strictly centers.
In spite of Duncs alongside:
DRob
Man From Nazr
Oberto (to a lesser extent)
Rasho-Elson for small but decent role minutes.
:lobt: :lobt: :lobt:

[therealtruth]

I don't think him playing Blair and Bonner is about him not caring about defense. IMO, he just doesn't think Duncan and Splitter can coexist.

We know that can't be true because he played Oberto and Duncan and won in '07. Tiago is more skilled Oberto. If Blair can coexist with TD Splitter can.

[therealtruth]

He already checked out last season. Maybe it's time to stop relying on guys that mentally check out and start trying something else (ie: Tiago).

Why rely on mental midgets when you can rely on Spanish League MVP's.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

With Splitter and Duncan at C and PF there are several lineups could be elite defensively with Parker, Leonard, Jackson, Green, and Ginobili in the mix for the other two spots.

We get a full dose of Bonner instead.

We also have the makings of an elite smallball defensive lineup.

Only thing that i can think of is that Splitter doesn't know how to play sets where he is not the primary bigman but how fucking hard can it be to stand outside the piant under the basket? I wish he would at least allow Splitter to try and defend people on the perimeter. He has Blair do it.

[TD 21]

He views them both as strictly centers.

I agree, but it's nonsense. As I've explained many a time, if one of the bigs can defend power forwards (Splitter), shoot from mid range (Duncan) and pass (Duncan and Splitter), then you can absolutely play two centers together. Also, if the players are high IQ types (which both are), then that makes it all the more likely that it'll work.

I'm not suggesting Duncan and Splitter are Duncan and Robinson or Gasol and Bynum, but those were/are the same scenario and those duos thrived, for the reasons I stated. Lesser skilled bigs, such as Mohammed and Oberto, also worked with Duncan, but apparently that's been forgotten.

Unfortunately, no one that covers the team has the balls to ask him these questions. It's probably going to be the single biggest reason for their demise at some point, outside of maybe health. Splitter is the fourth best player on the team and by far the second best big, yet he plays only 20 mpg and rarely with the best big. It defies logic.

[therealtruth]

With Splitter and Duncan at C and PF there are several lineups could be elite defensively with Parker, Leonard, Jackson, Green, and Ginobili in the mix for the other two spots.

We get a full dose of Bonner instead.

We also have the makings of an elite smallball defensive lineup.

Only thing that i can think of is that Splitter doesn't know how to play sets where he is not the primary bigman but how fucking hard can it be to stand outside the piant under the basket? I wish he would at least allow Splitter to try and defend people on the perimeter. He has Blair do it.

It doesn't make sense. Splitter is quick on his feet. There's no reason he can't defend on the perimeter. TD/Robinson used to play against small ball lineups. Splitter's quicker than Bonner and because of his length doesn't have to play that close to the other player to bother their shot.

[ElNono]

IIRC, 75% of TD's points this season come from jumpers... I mean, it's obviously OK to give him his time on the low block. But nowadays, there should be no issue for Tiago playing the post and Tim drilling the jumpers...

[Cow Eye]

IIRC, 75% of TD's points this season come from jumpers... I mean, it's obviously OK to give him his time on the low block. But nowadays, there should be no issue for Tiago playing the post and Tim drilling the jumpers...

If anything, that would be preferred. Considering banging on the low block night in and night out would just put even more strain on TD's already weakening knees.

[TJastal]

But he does think Duncan and Bonner can coexist.

A playoff opponents dream come true coach.

:lol

Now that the cat is out of the bag thanks to Hollins, should be interesting to see the frenzy of jockeying to see who can secure the seed that plays against the Pop coached team in the 1st round.