3 Years in the NCAA Before NBA?

[DMC]

http://espn.go.com/dallas/nba/story/_/id/7778070/dallas-mavericks-mark-cuban-make-players-stay-3-years-ncaa

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/photo/2010/0101/dal_g_cuban1_sw_65.jpg



"I just think there's a lot more kids that get ruined coming out early or going to school trying to be developed to come out early than actually make it.”

-- Mark Cuban


If a person can get a high paying job in accounting in their third year in college, wouldn't anyone here think that person should take that position and finish their education later?

It's all about raising the level of college play. Fuck them. People should have the right to get paid while they are healthy. Fucking nanny attitudes.

Easy as hell for a billionaire to say a poor kid should tough it out to increase his viewing pleasure and help him get better talent so he makes more money.

And fuck John C.

[baseline bum]

:cry :cry :cry But college is about the experience; it's not for job preparation. :cry :cry :cry

[LkrFan]

There would be no LBJ if this happened 8 years ago. No way his dumbass makes it through 3 years of college. :lol

...and I agree with Pubes here. Too many kids come in on hype because they can dunk only to fizzle in the NBA. LeHype is one of the rare exceptions. :downspin:

The NFL does it and has done it for years. Look at their product. NFL >>>>>> NBA and it ain't even close tbh.

[DMC]

:cry :cry :cry But college is about the experience; it's not for job preparation. :cry :cry :cry

How many of these kids could finish college on a degree program that actually pays a wage that would sustain any semblance of a decent lifestyle vs RTF and other bullshit degrees?

One year in the pros, even as a low level earner, would pay for your college many times over. Get a 3 year deal and you can retire if you're frugal enough. That's how fucking great it is to be in the NBA vs "that guy could have made it in his freshman year, but he blew his knees out the following year and now he drives a UPS truck".

[DMC]

There would be no LBJ if this happened 8 years ago. No way his dumbass makes it through 3 years of college. :lol

...and I agree with Pubes here. Too many kids come in on hype because they can dunk only to fizzle in the NBA. LeHype is one of the rare exceptions. :downspin:

The NFL does it and has done it for years. Look at their product. NFL >>>>>> NBA and it ain't even close tbh.
So? Fuck, let me fizzle for a few hundred K vs the sandwich shop job while studying for my degree in psychology.

[DMC]

I think Cuban may just be annoyed at potentially having to draft, stash and maybe lose a promising 18 year old rather than getting to pick from 21 year olds who may be more likely to play right away
Which means he's saying fuck the kids, I want proven employees so make it mandatory. I understand the business decision, but every team still has the right to not sign these guys. Why take away their right to apply?

I think it's the NCAA in bed with the NBA trying to generate the most revenue.

[russellgoat]

There would be no LBJ if this happened 8 years ago. No way his dumbass makes it through 3 years of college. :lol

...and I agree with Pubes here. Too many kids come in on hype because they can dunk only to fizzle in the NBA. LeHype is one of the rare exceptions. :downspin:

The NFL does it and has done it for years. Look at their product. NFL >>>>>> NBA and it ain't even close tbh.

Do you think the rapist would have done any better in college?

[jag]

I'm sure all these kids were bound to have promising careers as doctors, engineers and investment bankers. Once they bomb out at 21 years old they'll never be able to reach all that potential they had outside of basketball. Oh wait, they can still go back to school. Oh wait, a lot of these kids aren't the cream of the intellectual crop.

The smart and dedicated players will go on and do just fine no matter what happens with their basketball careers. The others never had a chance outside of basketball anyway.

Let them leave school whenever they want.

[DMC]

I think Cuban's looking out for Cuban, trying to eliminate uncertainty in his business decisions.

I also think the NCAA is in bed with the NBA trying to generate the most revenue for both orgs.

Players/employees come last, except of course for the customers/fans
And if you consider that the NBA would still have these guys only later down the road and with more hype surrounding them, you can see that it would be a great business move for both organizations, only the NCAA should be more concerned with job placement for their students than indentured servitude by them.

[LkrFan]

So? Fuck, let me fizzle for a few hundred K vs the sandwich shop job while studying for my degree in psychology.

Wrong. Think about it. When all these "diaper dandies" start flooding the NBA, the overall product began to suck major ass. Case in point, in the '80s, the only prep to pros player (that I recall) was Moses Malone - who legitimatley should have been there tbh. Everybody else got a college education. The '80s era saved basketball (with Showtime as the headliner :toast). Competition and quality teams were way better than it is right now.

That's why I give MJ no props. He got sent to the tree of woe on many occasions until the true great teams got old (Pisstons, Celtics, Lakers) and the league got watered down with these expansion teams coming in with these SportsCenter highlight worthy kids. Before that, he didn't win shit and liked it.

NBA should retract the cellar perrennial cellar dwellers (except for 8 :lol) and raise the age limit. It's good for the future of the NBA.

[LkrFan]

Do you think the rapist would have done any better in college?

Yes. He cut the requisite SAT scores to play for Coach K. He would have fucked shit up no doubt.

[DMC]

Wrong. Think about it. When all these "diaper dandies" start flooding the NBA, the overall product began to suck major ass. Case in point, in the '80s, the only prep to pros player (that I recall) was Moses Malone - who legitimatley should have been there tbh. Everybody else got a college education. The '80s era saved basketball (with Showtime as the headliner :toast). Competition and quality teams were way better than it is right now.

That's why I give MJ no props. He got sent to the tree of woe on many occasions until the true great teams got old (Pisstons, Celtics, Lakers) and the league got watered down with these expansion teams coming in with these SportsCenter highlight worthy kids. Before that, he didn't win shit and liked it.

NBA should retract the cellar perrennial cellar dwellers (except for 8 :lol) and raise the age limit. It's good for the future of the NBA.

Even though almost all of that was pure bullshit, you're addressing the NBA's interest and each franchise has the right to not sign a player.

You haven't illustrated why a player should not be allowed to apply, and the contraction issue is for another thread.

[jag]

Yes. He cut the requisite SAT scores to play for Coach K. He would have fucked shit up no doubt.

Kobe is a lot of things. Stupid isn't one of them.

[LkrFan]

Kobe is a lot of things. Stupid isn't one of them.

Fucked shit up is slang for he would have kicked ass. Point taken though...:downspin:

[LkrFan]

Even though almost all of that was pure bullshit, you're addressing the NBA's interest and each franchise has the right to not sign a player.

You haven't illustrated why a player should not be allowed to apply, and the contraction issue is for another thread.

:downspin:

[Giuseppe]

That's why I give MJ no props. He got sent to the tree of woe on many occasions until the true great teams got old (Pisstons, Celtics, Lakers) and the league got watered down with these expansion teams coming in with these SportsCenter highlight worthy kids. Before that, he didn't win shit and liked it.

As fresh as the Ellis girl visiting the last two days.

[mingus]

Good business strategy.

[Giuseppe]

Good business strategy.

Please. They got some fuckin' nerve telling these kids what to do whatsoever. How the fuck it's never gotten into the courts is beyond me.

Nobody, but, nobody should ever give away their talent. Ever.

[Seventyniner]

If the NBA were really out for its own bottom line, they should give the middle finger to the NCAA: raise D-League salaries drastically to siphon off the best talent, get more of those teams in big markets and on TV (with the season during the NBA's offseason) and require players to be 2 or 3 years out of high school to make the NBA.

[Giuseppe]

If the NBA were really out for its own bottom line, they should give the middle finger to the NCAA: raise D-League salaries drastically to siphon off the best talent, get more of those teams in big markets and on TV (with the season during the NBA's offseason) and require players to be 2 or 3 years out of high school to make the NBA.

But, they'd have to first get out of that cozy bed there in with the NCAA.

[Latarian Milton]

college just like a theme park imho, u payin for it and you aint gettin no reward from it

shit just a waste of time & money tbh :cry

[Giuseppe]

The practical downside is 18 year old kids not interested in free college poon, going over to Europe/Asia to make some Scratch and scratch some free Eur/asian poon.

There is nothin' like strange wool.

[lefty]

With that 3 year plan, Kobe wouldnt have airballed the Lakers out of the playoffs in 97 vs Utah

[Goran Dragic]

They should have the option to go to the NBA straight out of high school, the change should be that all the ones who chose college have to stay for 3 years. I think people who try to act like the life of a college athlete is some hardship they shouldn't have to go through are dumb, but making a kid go to college for a year when he has no interest in being a student is dumb and it's a stupid waste of a scholarship that could be used on someone who actually wants to utilize the education. The current 1 year rule isn't working though. It's cost players like Andre Drummond and DeAndre Jordan millions.

[Giuseppe]

With that 3 year plan, Kobe wouldnt have airballed the Lakers out of the playoffs in 97 vs Utah

& he wouldn't be hunting Jabbar and Jordan in the bargain.

[lefty]

& he wouldn't be hunting Jabbar and Jordan in the bargain.

Pipe dream

[Giuseppe]

^Bend over. I'll show ya a fuckin pipe dream.

[lefty]

^Bend over. I'll show ya a fuckin pipe dream.

Get a pipe first

[Giuseppe]

Get a pipe first

Use your head, man, (that's) the fuckin' dream. The (pipe).

[lefty]

Use your head, man, (that's) the fuckin' dream. The (pipe).

I've lost interest

[NewcastleKEG]

What is the deal with America & college sports? Would these schools like Kentucky be struggling financially if not for the sports. Who is pocketing most of this athletic money?

Watching what is happening to College Basketball & the level of play decline & I can't but wonder....why are these kids being forced to waste $$$ & once in a lifetime opportunity education that someone else could be benefiting from?

[pass1st]

Colleges crying out that they want to exploit their NBA-level stars for another two years.

[mercos]

I'm not really a big fan of college basketball, but I think the age requirement should be increased to 20 years old. As an NBA fan, I don't think most high schoolers are ready to make the jump to the NBA. There are exceptions (Lebron, Kobe) but they are just that, exceptions. Before the rule was instated far to many high school stars were making the jump and I think it was hurting the league. A lot of these guys that jumped straight to the pros and did not make it could have potentially developed into better players in college. The product was getting watered down.

The NBA is well within their rights to institute an age limit. Hell, the could require a college degree if they wanted to as many other professions do. The kids who can't get through college or simply do not want to go can go play in other leagues across the globe. If the Chinese Basketball Association is good enough for Stephon Marbury, it is good enough for a kid coming right out of high school.

[NewcastleKEG]

I'm not really a big fan of college basketball, but I think the age requirement should be increased to 20 years old. As an NBA fan, I don't think most high schoolers are ready to make the jump to the NBA. There are exceptions (Lebron, Kobe) but they are just that, exceptions. Before the rule was instated far to many high school stars were making the jump and I think it was hurting the league. A lot of these guys that jumped straight to the pros and did not make it could have potentially developed into better players in college. The product was getting watered down.

The NBA is well within their rights to institute an age limit. Hell, the could require a college degree if they wanted to as many other professions do. The kids who can't get through college or simply do not want to go can go play in other leagues across the globe. If the Chinese Basketball Association is good enough for Stephon Marbury, it is good enough for a kid coming right out of high school.
Agreed all around. 2 years outta HS is fair, whether that's college or overseas.

[Giuseppe]

Agreed all around. 2 years outta HS is fair, whether that's college or overseas.

Nobody, but, nobody should ever give their talent away.

Ever.

[Venti Quattro]

How many of these college basketball players really study anyway? :lol

[DMC]

How many of these college basketball players really study anyway? :lol
1. Matt Bonner and he's a hell of an NBA player.

[DMC]

I'm not really a big fan of college basketball, but I think the age requirement should be increased to 20 years old. As an NBA fan, I don't think most high schoolers are ready to make the jump to the NBA. There are exceptions (Lebron, Kobe) but they are just that, exceptions. Before the rule was instated far to many high school stars were making the jump and I think it was hurting the league. A lot of these guys that jumped straight to the pros and did not make it could have potentially developed into better players in college. The product was getting watered down.

The NBA is well within their rights to institute an age limit. Hell, the could require a college degree if they wanted to as many other professions do. The kids who can't get through college or simply do not want to go can go play in other leagues across the globe. If the Chinese Basketball Association is good enough for Stephon Marbury, it is good enough for a kid coming right out of high school.

OK, then the age for military draft or enlistment should jump, because if they aren't ready for the NBA, they sure as hell aren't ready for war.

And :lol at the NBA being something you need to be "ready" for. How much readiness will they get by waiting 2 years, fucking off around town? It's real hard running an NBA pick and roll, or just passing to Kobe and moving back.

If they make it, they must be ready. What you're actually saying is they aren't ready to be rich. Well tough shit.

[NewcastleKEG]

OK, then the age for military draft or enlistment should jump, because if they aren't ready for the NBA, they sure as hell aren't ready for war.
If the Military felt their product was declining then they would. NBA changed the original rule because teams were flushing money down the toilet drafting 17 year olds based on potential & what they accomplished schooling local gyms.

[DMC]

If the Military felt their product was declining then they would. NBA changed the original rule because teams were flushing money down the toilet drafting 17 year olds based on potential & what they accomplished schooling local gyms.

They did it to keep thugs out of the NBA, black thugs to be precise. Without college refinement, they get young thugs who cannot string together a coherent sentence without using the word "fuck" a few times.

That's where it's up to the franchises to say they don't want them. If they are going that route, stop the bullshit about how it's better for the kids.

Sure the NBA has the right to decide, but when they team up with colleges to do that so both entities make more, they are actually fucking the players and eventually the fans.

If Stern thought it was a good idea, it probably wasn't. Of course, high schools and colleges will milk the fuck out of these kids for millions while they are being "prepped" for the NBA.

What a fucking sham.

Also, so they go to college, big deal. There are plenty of college grads who were drafted pretty high that didn't do shit, and probably more non college grads and 1st year or even HS players who basically own the NBA.

[NewcastleKEG]

They did it to keep thugs out of the NBA, black thugs to be precise. Without college refinement, they get young thugs who cannot string together a coherent sentence without using the word "fuck" a few times.

That's where it's up to the franchises to say they don't want them. If they are going that route, stop the bullshit about how it's better for the kids.

Sure the NBA has the right to decide, but when they team up with colleges to do that so both entities make more, they are actually fucking the players and eventually the fans.

If Stern thought it was a good idea, it probably wasn't. Of course, high schools and colleges will milk the fuck out of these kids for millions while they are being "prepped" for the NBA.

What a fucking sham.

Also, so they go to college, big deal. There are plenty of college grads who were drafted pretty high that didn't do shit, and probably more non college grads and 1st year or even HS players who basically own the NBA.
That's not correct

- College has no role in the rule. The rule is you must be a certain amount of time outta high school. AKA Playing overseas
- What difference does 1-year make in college when they aren't attending class AND taking cake classes anyway. Remember Kemba Walker admitting he had read one single book his entire life & he attended 3 years at a respectable University Institution.

How is this bad for the fans? I want a high level of play not teams forced to play overwhelmed players because they were a high draft pick/make a lot of money

[baseline bum]

A 20 year age limit fucks the players over since they are paid below market value for their first 4 NBA years already, not even counting the year they're essentially volunteers in the NCAA scam. Now they need to be dicked for a sixth year?

[DMC]

That's not correct

- College has no role in the rule. The rule is you must be a certain amount of time outta high school. AKA Playing overseas

Which means if you are in college, you must wait until your 3rd year.

So sure, NCAA has a lot to do with it. You're a fool if you don't see that.


- What difference does 1-year make in college when they aren't attending class AND taking cake classes anyway. Remember Kemba Walker admitting he had read one single book his entire life & he attended 3 years at a respectable University Institution.
If it doesn't make a difference, why institute it?


How is this bad for the fans? I want a high level of play not teams forced to play overwhelmed players because they were a high draft pick/make a lot of moneyWho do you watch now?

Kobe
Lebron
Bynum
Garnett
Howard
Tyson Chandler
DeShawn Stevenson
Amare

Really shitty talent there. The NBA is diluted with all that HS crap.


How it's bad for fans: Any system that keeps the best talent out of the game is bad for fans. When a college player could beat the best pros, but he cannot play, that's bad for fans. Seems simple.

The real deal is that the NCAA wants to be the conduit to the NBA so they can make money off the players. They give free educations to these guys and these guys bail, but these guys made them enough money in that one year to pay for their own education.

Hell, make them pay it back once they get into the NBA. Whatever works.

[NewcastleKEG]

- No one is forcing guys to go to college. They are forcing them to mature & work on their game (Play overseas)

- Like most people stated at the time, make the rule 2-years or don't do it at all

- And I could just as quickly post a list of Elite players that didn't jump straight to the Pros. Or a Brenden Jennings who took the overseas path

- The rule was originally made because sacrificing a handful of players improved the overall play of the NBA

Like I posted before. I don't understand Americas fascination with College sports. It's a waste of time & money plus takes away an education for a child that actually wants it. I believe Major League Baseball has a deal with College baseball where you either declare Pro & go straight to the minors OR go to college but you must remain atleast 2 years

[sprrs]

If a person can get a high paying job in accounting in their third year in college, wouldn't anyone here think that person should take that position and finish their education later?

It's all about raising the level of college play. Fuck them. People should have the right to get paid while they are healthy. Fucking nanny attitudes.

Easy as hell for a billionaire to say a poor kid should tough it out to increase his viewing pleasure and help him get better talent so he makes more money.

And fuck John C.

You're under the assumption that athletes have a right to a career. Not true. The NBA is a business. They have the right to determine the criteria which they think will give them the most return.

[NewcastleKEG]

You're under the assumption that athletes have a right to a career. Not true. The NBA is a business. They have the right to determine the criteria which they think will give them the most return.
This is a great point. To use an earlier example of his: NBA is just a branch of the military as there are other branches (Marines, Navy, etc) just like there are other leagues for basketball. There are plenty of examples where the Marines will turn down an individual but the Army is more than pleased to accept them

[Giuseppe]

It's ludicrous to loot another person's God given talents. It's criminal is what it really is.

[NewcastleKEG]

It's ludicrous to loot another person's God given talents. It's criminal is what it really is.
Oh come on let's be honest. If not for the NBA, most of these guys in the NBA would be laying in a grave or rotting in jail

[mingus]

Please. They got some fuckin' nerve telling these kids what to do whatsoever. How the fuck it's never gotten into the courts is beyond me.

Nobody, but, nobody should ever give away their talent. Ever.

Takes a lot of nerve to do good business.

And NBA players haven't exactly helped make their case that they shouldn't get more education.

[TDMVPDPOY]

declaring early is up to the player,

its not like they put a gun to the team to draft them, you can always not draft them

[Giuseppe]

Oh come on let's be honest. If not for the NBA, most of these guys in the NBA would be laying in a grave or rotting in jail

It's embarrassing to make these kids give it away in college for even one year because the NCAA & NBA have this sweetheart deal and Media won't carry the kids' water and/or blow the whistle because they removed the pea eons ago. It's like you being an absolute total genius with an IQ in the stratosphere, but IBM telling you to work for them for nothing until at such time they start paying you. In the meantime though they'll give you room & board, but, if you slip on an onion skin by the typing pool, hit your head and knock your IQ in the regular region you can go fly a kite.

[Venti Quattro]

3 years is too much wait IMO. Two years would be good.

[mercos]

OK, then the age for military draft or enlistment should jump, because if they aren't ready for the NBA, they sure as hell aren't ready for war.

And :lol at the NBA being something you need to be "ready" for. How much readiness will they get by waiting 2 years, fucking off around town? It's real hard running an NBA pick and roll, or just passing to Kobe and moving back.

If they make it, they must be ready. What you're actually saying is they aren't ready to be rich. Well tough shit.


Players do not get ready by "fucking off around town" they get ready by playing tougher competition, either in college or over seas, and playing more complicated basketball than they experienced in high school. And there is a little more to playing basketball than just passing the ball to Kobe and getting out of the way. If that is all you want to watch, then sure, let them go pro right out of high school. Just because a player is picked high does not mean he was ready for the pros. Does Kwame Brown ring a bell? I am of the belief that he would have had a better chance at a good career if he had taken a slower progression such as going from high school to college or an over seas league.

I do not deny anyone the opportunity to make money. I specifically said playing over seas was a viable option. I believe getting some college education wouldn't hurt some of these players, specifically helping them get some business sense to be able to handle their money, but college is definitely not for everyone. I am also of the opinion that these kids should get paid at least something for their services, as their skills brings more money to the universities than their education is worth.

[baseline bum]

Not following; so if colleges should pay them, what's the difference between that and going pro?

[mercos]

College basketball is a smaller step up in competition and allows them to develop their game and become better players. Same with over seas leagues. Like I'v said, I have no problem with these kids making money. I just don't think high school basketball is enough experience for most of them.

[DMC]

Players do not get ready by "fucking off around town" they get ready by playing tougher competition, either in college or over seas, and playing more complicated basketball than they experienced in high school. And there is a little more to playing basketball than just passing the ball to Kobe and getting out of the way. If that is all you want to watch, then sure, let them go pro right out of high school. Just because a player is picked high does not mean he was ready for the pros. Does Kwame Brown ring a bell? I am of the belief that he would have had a better chance at a good career if he had taken a slower progression such as going from high school to college or an over seas league.

I do not deny anyone the opportunity to make money. I specifically said playing over seas was a viable option. I believe getting some college education wouldn't hurt some of these players, specifically helping them get some business sense to be able to handle their money, but college is definitely not for everyone. I am also of the opinion that these kids should get paid at least something for their services, as their skills brings more money to the universities than their education is worth.
What you are saying makes no sense in the light of reality, which is that teams actively scout these guys and hire them. If they needed more training, teams would pass on them.

You act as if it's being done for the sake of the product, to make it better, but then the product is being bought at a premium now while there's college level players who go undrafted.

How does better competition make you a worse player? I cannot. It's a game, not brain surgery. If they are good at it and people will pay to see it, let it be.

[DMC]

College basketball is a smaller step up in competition and allows them to develop their game and become better players. Same with over seas leagues. Like I'v said, I have no problem with these kids making money. I just don't think high school basketball is enough experience for most of them.
It's not enough for most of them. Most of them will never see the NBA from the inside.

When someone like Lebron James can dominate the league right out of high school, that should tell you enough. College play is not like NBA play. Sure they learn how to not choke a coach out (maybe not) or how to not punch a fan (maybe not) but they don't learn NBA style play.

If I was giving advice to a young baller, I would say go for it. You can get your education whenever you want, but you got one chance to make it big and this is it.

[DMC]

Oh come on let's be honest. If not for the NBA, most of these guys in the NBA would be laying in a grave or rotting in jail
If not for something else, so would you.

We all have our vices.

[Wild Cobra Kai]

I'm not for three years, but I am for a baseball type draft. You can come out of HS, but if you don't, you can't sign or be drafted for two more years. The reality is that if you aren't NBA ready, you won't be that much more so after one year of NCAA ball. The few that are one and dones who ARE ready would likely have made it out of HS. A lot of players are ruined by coming out on hype.

The NBA isn't good at development. There just isn't enough time for practice.

[Spurtacus]

Pay NCAA players. Full ride and weekly game checks. Problem solved. If coached like Mack Brown can get paid millions per year why can't those who play to fill the seats get paid?