Michele Bachmann Says 'Tar Baby' Comment Was Not Intended To Be Racial

[fraga]

Either this bitch is straight up racist...or straight up stupid for not realizing that's a racist term...either way...that bitch is dumb...

W7abLGn7zUM

[DMX7]

She's racist and stupid tbh.

[Stringer_Bell]

Lovin' how she's always so proud of herself when she says crazy shit. Would mouth-blast her all day with greater anger, tbh.

[Wild Cobra]

I love how the reverse racist people make anything they can into a racist comment.

Tar baby was never intended to be.

If someone wants to contend it as such, please show the history to back it up.

[admiralsnackbar]

I love how the reverse racist people make anything they can into a racist comment.

Tar baby was never intended to be.

If someone wants to contend it as such, please show the history to back it up.
Please supply backgrounds and justifications in the 3000+ threads where they've been asked of you before making such demands :toast

[Wild Cobra's Surgeon]

I love how the reverse racist people make anything they can into a racist comment.

Tar baby was never intended to be.

I don't think I'm comfortable around you anymore.

[baseline bum]

I liked the part where she bitched about gas being high on Catalina Island, a tiny population 25 miles off the mainland. :lol

[spursncowboys]

She definitely isn't dumb. Since she has raised black children I would also say she isn't racist.

I think people have blurred what exactly racist is.
Take my dad for example. He has black family members that he loves. He hires blacks. However he is pretty insensitive to others cultures, including black culture.

[Yonivore]

Apparently this argument has already been had...

Why "Tar Baby" Is Such a Sticky Phrase (http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1221764,00.html)

I report, you decide.

[spursncowboys]

Every thing she said makes perfect sense.

What do you think she meant when she said "waving a tar baby in the air"?

[Wild Cobra]

I don't think I'm comfortable around you anymore.
Good.

I always found you to be a nuisance.

You are free to go away.

[Wild Cobra]

Apparently this argument has already been had...

Why "Tar Baby" Is Such a Sticky Phrase (http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1221764,00.html)

I report, you decide.

"The tar baby is a form of a character widespread in African folklore. In various folktales, gum, wax or other sticky material is used to trap a person."

To trap a person...

To trap a person, or to trap a "black" person?

A term coined by blacks is a prejudiced remark against blacks?

You guys already color me dumb, but please... explain this to me.

[spursncowboys]

nigga you crazy.

[DarrinS]

I have never heard that term used in a racial context. Fake outrage of the day.

[boutons_deux]

Racist interpretation

Although the term's provenance rests in African folklore (i.e., the gum doll Anansi created to trap Mmoatia, the dwarf), some Americans consider "tar baby" to be a pejorative term for African Americans.[6] The Oxford English Dictionary defines "tar baby" as "a difficult problem which is only aggravated by attempts to solve it".[7] Several United States politicians — including presidential candidates John McCain, John Kerry, Michele Bachmann, and Mitt Romney — have been criticized by civil rights leaders, the media, and fellow politicians for using the "tar baby" metaphor.[8][9][10][11][12][13][14][15][16][17][18][19] An article in The New Republic argued that people are "unaware that some consider it to have a second meaning as a slur" and it "is an obscure slur, not even known to be so by a substantial proportion of the population." It continued that, "those who feel that tar baby's status as a slur is patently obvious are judging from the fact that it sounds like a racial slur" (italics in original text).[20]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tar_baby

I bet 99% of racist bubbas like Darrin don't know where tar baby originates.

[George Gervin's Afro]

I have never heard that term used in a racial context. Fake outrage of the day.

:lmao

[Yonivore]

I have never heard that term used in a racial context. Fake outrage of the day.
That you haven't doesn't mean it can't be. I just don't think it was used in a racial context by Michelle Bauchmann.

[Yonivore]

she's more anti-gay than racist, imho
Why not just Pro-heterosexual?

[Vici]

LOL at the "My dad isn't racist, he hires black people". Obviously out of context but golden.

[CuckingFunt]

That you haven't doesn't mean it can't be. I just don't think it was used in a racial context by Michelle Bauchmann.

I don't think anyone thinks it was used in a racial context by Michelle Bachmann. I haven't followed the story very closely because, really, who gives a fuck? But it seems the "outrage" is that she would be dumb enough to casually use a racially charged term. Not that she is herself racist for having used it.

But that's harder to rally behind than perceived race baiting and unfair accusations from the lefties.

[spursncowboys]

LOL at the "My dad isn't racist, he hires black people". Obviously out of context but golden.

"I'm not racist, I've had four black people in my house. If you know how many black people you've had in your house you're racist as a mothafckr. One, two, three, four-ok hold it this ain't harlem"

[spursncowboys]

she's more anti-gay than racist, imho
how is she anti-gay? what does that even mean?

[Yonivore]

I don't think anyone thinks it was used in a racial context by Michelle Bachmann. I haven't followed the story very closely because, really, who gives a fuck? But it seems the "outrage" is that she would be dumb enough to casually use a racially charged term. Not that she is herself racist for having used it.

But that's harder to rally behind than perceived race baiting and unfair accusations from the lefties.
Why is it racially charged?

Yes, it can be used in a racist context but, fuck, you know it when it's in that context.

How many words are going to be off the table because of racial sensitivities?

Remember when that DC accountant used the word "niggardly" and damn near lost his job because a black employee at the meeting didn't know the definition or origin of the word?

[Winehole23]

Here Uncle Remus paused, and drew a two-pound yam out of the ashes.


"Did the fox eat the rabbit?" asked the little boy to whom the story had been told.


"Dat's all de fur de tale goes," replied the old man. "He mout, an den agin he moutent. Some say Judge B'ar come 'long en loosed 'im - some say he didn't. I hear Miss Sally callin'. You better run 'long." http://xroads.virginia.edu/~ug97/remus/tar-baby.html

[Winehole23]

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0038969/

[Wild Cobra]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tar_baby

I bet 99% of racist bubbas like Darrin don't know where tar baby originates.
According to your link, it's to trap dwarves.

[Wild Cobra]

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0038969/
There is a post someplace where I linked the movie via YouTube.

[Yonivore]

I bet 99% of racist bubbas like Darrin don't know where tar baby originates.
Think about that. It kind of defies logic to claim a racist isn't familiar with the origins of a racist pejorative term.

Perhaps people understand the origins, and of it being a sticky trap not a person, and use it in that context.

[Bill_Brasky]

:lol this thread turning into a circle jerk with the shittiest partisan posters on the site reassuring themselves that a woman they really shouldn't be giving a fuck about isn't racist or stupid.

Of course if a lefty politician did something similar, this would be an outrage.

[Winehole23]

There is a post someplace where I linked the movie via YouTube.Takin on Disney? Stones...

[Winehole23]

Boasting about it publicly? Stones for brains...

[spursncowboys]

:lol this thread turning into a circle jerk with the shittiest partisan posters on the site reassuring themselves that a woman they really shouldn't be giving a fuck about isn't racist or stupid.

Of course if a lefty politician did something similar, this would be an outrage.

You're here, and the circle is complete.

[CuckingFunt]

Why is it racially charged?

The term is racially charged because, despite its origin or the speaker's intent, "tar baby" was quite commonly used as a racial epithet. And because its most popular/well known context, the Uncle Remus stories, are themselves an example of the incredibly problematic depiction of black people in post-Reconstruction South.


Yes, it can be used in a racist context but, fuck, you know it when it's in that context.

How many words are going to be off the table because of racial sensitivities?

It's not a matter of certain words or phrases being off limits due to an overly PC concern about racial sensitivities.

Whether or not you, or anyone else, wants to personally acknowledge it, there are a lot of words and phrases whose use is linked to our pretty fucked up racial history. Its an association that doesn't go away. A political figure who casually uses those phrases in doing so admits to being either too ignorant to understand their history, or too insensitive to give a fuck about it.

Either of those things deserve to be called out. Neither of those things, on their own, should be used as evidence that the speaker is necessarily racist or evil.

[Wild Cobra]

Well, as long as a group of people are too sensitive to live in society, there will never be a true sense of equality. For others to have to bend to their demands is ridiculous. I say get over it. Stop this petty squabbling, turning the meaning of things people say upside-down.

How are good people suppose to respect those who constantly call them racists? I am personally sick and tired of this. I have lost my patience with these race baiters. I say fuck you all who want to be offended instead of getting along.

[spursncowboys]

Great point WC, but she is a politician. You can't really say that kind of thing if you are trying to maintain peoples' votes. She knows she messed up.

[Yonivore]

A political figure who casually uses those phrases in doing so admits to being either too ignorant to understand their history, or too insensitive to give a fuck about it.
Or, they're ignorant of the sensitivities of others over a word or phrase that's not necessarily a racist term.

As an example; growing up through the 60's and 70' and up to the present, I've witnessed African-Americans (the current self-identification of race) change what they want to be called from Negro [The United Negro College Fund still exists today but I can't call an African-American a Negro] to Colored [The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People but I can't call an African-American a Colored Person] to Black and, now, interchangeable used with African-American. Some African-Americans don't like the term and call themselves Black; some Blacks insist on being called African-American.

Non-Blacks, if they get it wrong, are subjected to ridicule or worse.

It gets pretty fucking old not getting the memos and being expected to know what's politically correct with a certain race. That's all I'm saying...

And, it doesn't help when popular culture embraces a music style -- enjoyed by all races -- in which African-American or Blacks (your preference) refer to themselves and each other as Nigga.

I'd say it's the African-Americans turn to quit being so fucking sensitive and start accepting they've made certain areas of their culture into tar babies from which the rest of us cannot hope to free ourselves.

[Wild Cobra]

Or, they're ignorant of the sensitivities of others over a word or phrase that's not necessarily a racist term.

As an example; growing up through the 60's and 70' and up to the present, I've witnessed African-Americans (the current self-identification of race) change what they want to be called from Negro [The United Negro College Fund still exists today but I can't call an African-American a Negro] to Colored [The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People but I can't call an African-American a Colored Person] to Black and, now, interchangeable used with African-American. Some African-Americans don't like the term and call themselves Black; some Blacks insist on being called African-American.

Non-Blacks, if they get it wrong, are subjected to ridicule or worse.

It gets pretty fucking old not getting the memos and being expected to know what's politically correct with a certain race. That's all I'm saying...

And, it doesn't help when popular culture embraces a music style -- enjoyed by all races -- in which African-American or Blacks (your preference) refer to themselves and each other as Nigga.

I'd say it's the African-Americans turn to quit being so fucking sensitive and start accepting they've made certain areas of their culture into tar babies from which the rest of us cannot hope to free ourselves.
Is it possible they do it purposely to have reason to hate us?

[CuckingFunt]

Well, as long as a group of people are too sensitive to live in society, there will never be a true sense of equality. For others to have to bend to their demands is ridiculous. I say get over it. Stop this petty squabbling, turning the meaning of things people say upside-down.

How are good people suppose to respect those who constantly call them racists? I am personally sick and tired of this. I have lost my patience with these race baiters. I say fuck you all who want to be offended instead of getting along.

You're right. The people who have been unfairly accused of racism are far more worthy of our collective sensitivity and deference than the people who for generations have been made inferior through the use of stereotyped language and images.

Sure, we've called them spooks, and pickaninnies, and tar babies, and slopes, and beaners, and gooks, and kikes, and so forth, for, like, ever, but... we said we don't mean it that way anymore. And we were being super serious. Everyone should just get over it.

[Yonivore]

Is it possible they do it purposely to have reason to hate us?
I think it's possible Affrican-Americans are indifferent to the problems their self-defined sensitivities create.

[Wild Cobra]

Sure, we've called them spooks, and pickaninnies, and tar babies, and slopes, and beaners, and gooks, and kikes, and so forth, for, like, ever, but... we said we don't mean it that way anymore. And we were being super serious. Everyone should just get over it.
Speak for yourself.

[spursncowboys]

You're right. The people who have been unfairly accused of racism are far more worthy of our collective sensitivity and deference than the people who for generations have been made inferior through the use of stereotyped language and images.



Don't forget welfare.

[CuckingFunt]

Or, they're ignorant of the sensitivities of others over a word or phrase that's not necessarily a racist term.

As an example; growing up through the 60's and 70' and up to the present, I've witnessed African-Americans (the current self-identification of race) change what they want to be called from Negro [The United Negro College Fund still exists today but I can't call an African-American a Negro] to Colored [The National Association for the Advancement of Colored People but I can't call an African-American a Colored Person] to Black and, now, interchangeable used with African-American. Some African-Americans don't like the term and call themselves Black; some Blacks insist on being called African-American.

Non-Blacks, if they get it wrong, are subjected to ridicule or worse.

It gets pretty fucking old not getting the memos and being expected to know what's politically correct with a certain race. That's all I'm saying...

And, it doesn't help when popular culture embraces a music style -- enjoyed by all races -- in which African-American or Blacks (your preference) refer to themselves and each other as Nigga.

I'd say it's the African-Americans turn to quit being so fucking sensitive and start accepting they've made certain areas of their culture into tar babies from which the rest of us cannot hope to free ourselves.

Has "tar baby" ever been positively embraced by black culture in America?

Has "tar baby" ever been positively embraced by any culture other than white America circa 1881-1940s?


Is it possible they do it purposely to have reason to hate us?

No.

[Wild Cobra]

I think it's possible Affrican-Americans are indifferent to the problems their self-defined sensitivities create.

Yes, I do.

The more and more I think about it, I think those who push such rhetoric about whites being insensitive, I think they are the racists. I think they are the ones who wish to have a reason to hate, without appearing racist, but project the racism on us. I don't believe they are stupid, but know how to play people's emotions.

It is pretty maddening to be called a racist when I am not. Look at all the reasons people here have fabricated to call me that.

[Wild Cobra]

Has "tar baby" ever been positively embraced by black culture in America?

Has "tar baby" ever been positively embraced by any culture other than white America circa 1881-1940s?



No.
Not my bad that people get it wrong. Bachmann used it as a reference as something sticky to catch something. that wasn't racist. If you think it was, you are part of the problem.

Isn't this pipeline coming from a "tar" oil source?

[Bill_Brasky]

You're here, and the circle is complete.

I identify as a conservative.

Now I can say anything I please, and you'll always back me up no matter what!

[CuckingFunt]

Not my bad that people get it wrong. Bachmann used it as a reference as something sticky to catch something. that wasn't racist. If you think it was, you are part of the problem.

I specifically said Bachmann's use of "tar baby" shouldn't be used to accuse her of holding racist views.

[boutons_deux]

she's more anti-gay than racist, imho

Here hubby is still screwing up gays by "curing them", and taking tax dollars for doing it. :lol

[spursncowboys]

I identify as a conservative.

Now I can say anything I please, and you'll always back me up no matter what!

You bet your ass, David Brooks.

[Yonivore]

You're right. The people who have been unfairly accused of racism are far more worthy of our collective sensitivity and deference than the people who for generations have been made inferior through the use of stereotyped language and images.
I know this was sarcastic but, if George Zimmerman has, in fact, been "unfairly accused of racism" then, I would say having a bounty placed on your head by the racist New Black Panther Party, having Al Sharpton call you everything but human and foment unrest in your name, and having the Nation of Islam inciting a race war over something you did, is just a bit more significant than the "collective sensitivities" of black people

Sorry. It just is.

You don't see the overkill?

How about a more minor incident where that Washington bean counter was damn near run out of town on a rail because an African-American in his audience didn't know what the fuck niggardly meant.

A cynic might think the group with the "collective sensitivity" is just looking for trouble.at.every.opportunity.


Sure, we've called them spooks, and pickaninnies, and tar babies, and slopes, and beaners, and gooks, and kikes, and so forth, for, like, ever, but... we said we don't mean it that way anymore. And we were being super serious. Everyone should just get over it.
Don't forget Mick. My ancestors were called Micks. We got over it.

[Yonivore]

Has "tar baby" ever been positively embraced by black culture in America?

Has "tar baby" ever been positively embraced by any culture other than white America circa 1881-1940s?
I have no clue. I'd bet neither does Michelle Bachmann. Maybe you should write an encyclopedia of all the words and phrases non-blacks are prohibited from saying so they won't get their feelings hurt and start a race war.

[Yonivore]

Yes, I do.

The more and more I think about it, I think those who push such rhetoric about whites being insensitive, I think they are the racists. I think they are the ones who wish to have a reason to hate, without appearing racist, but project the racism on us. I don't believe they are stupid, but know how to play people's emotions.

It is pretty maddening to be called a racist when I am not. Look at all the reasons people here have fabricated to call me that.
You THINK they're racists.

I know Al Sharpton, Malik Shabazz, and Louis Farrakhan are racists. They make absolutely no bones about hating white people simply because they're white.

[Yonivore]

I specifically said Bachmann's use of "tar baby" shouldn't be used to accuse her of holding racist views.
You also said it made her either insensitive or ignorant.

I'd suggest sophisticated people can discern between the use of words in different contexts.

Non-Blacks cannot be expected to know what is going to bother Black people. Particularly when Black people aren't all bothered by the same thing.

Are you Black? Or, African-American? Can I call you Negro or Colored?

Does any of this make sense?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Surprising the same white martyrs whining about their lot in life. Its amazing how you guys complain about an action and then in the same breath do the same shit yourselves.

You only have to look at congressional redistricting to see racist policy making.

[TheSkeptic]

She definitely isn't dumb. Since she has raised black children I would also say she isn't racist.

I think people have blurred what exactly racist is.
Take my dad for example. He has black family members that he loves. He hires blacks. However he is pretty insensitive to others cultures, including black culture.

You've hit on an interesting point.

According to dictionary.com racism is defined as:

"a belief or doctrine that inherent differences among the various human races determine cultural or individual achievement, usually involving the idea that one's own race is superior and has the right to rule others."

While not a desirable trait, being insensitive and by extension usually ignorant of other cultures isn't quite the same thing as racism although in a way it is assuming that your culture is inherently better than all the others. It's definitely possible that Bachmann falls under this category.


Well, as long as a group of people are too sensitive to live in society, there will never be a true sense of equality. For others to have to bend to their demands is ridiculous. I say get over it. Stop this petty squabbling, turning the meaning of things people say upside-down.

How are good people suppose to respect those who constantly call them racists? I am personally sick and tired of this. I have lost my patience with these race baiters. I say fuck you all who want to be offended instead of getting along.

Yes and no. I could be wrong but it sounds like you're phrasing this as someone who's never had to live as a minority. Weren't people still contending with the KKK as recently as the 60s? I'm not African American so it's not an experience I can relate to either age-wise or ancestry-wise, but that would mean that there's people still alive today who can remember those times.

I agree with you that people can and do take things too far and that there's way too much PC-ness in society today. That being said, I don't think race relations are where they should be. A large part of "getting along" is showing common decency to other people and walking a mile in their shoes.

It honestly sounds to me like you're going based off of what you've seen of the more militant do-gooder types as opposed to the real people who have lived through these things.



I think it's possible Affrican-Americans are indifferent to the problems their self-defined sensitivities create.


There are self-absorbed and limited people of all races. What's your point?


You THINK they're racists.

I know Al Sharpton, Malik Shabazz, and Louis Farrakhan are racists. They make absolutely no bones about hating white people simply because they're white.

Why would you use people like that as your example though? They may get media attention but it's probably not correct for you to be holding up those guys as an offhand litmus test of how most black people feel about whites and race relations as a whole. You'll find gullible followers in all ethnic groups so please don't use the rallies and meetings to prove your point.

Sure there are some people who hate white people because they're white, but a lot of that is due to a lack of exposure more than anything else. Similar to how there are plenty who look down on black people consciously/subconsciously because they haven't really been around too many of them but are constantly seeing negative messages concerning them.


Surprising the same white martyrs whining about their lot in life. Its amazing how you guys complain about an action and then in the same breath do the same shit yourselves.

You only have to look at congressional redistricting to see racist policy making.

No kidding. I'm as conservative as they come so I should have more in common with these guys but the underlying mentalities I'm seeing here are *really* disturbing. I'm not sure why I keep getting into these threads though. It's such a draining proposition.

[Drachen]

I'll be quite honest, I have never heard this term and would have never known it to be racist without this thread.

[boutons_deux]

Drachen, ever heard of "jungle bunnies"?

[ChumpDumper]

You also said it made her either insensitive or ignorant.

I'd suggest sophisticated people can discern between the use of words in different contexts. I'd suggest that she is not sophisticated if she doesn't know what a bad idea using that phrase is, and neither is anyone trying to defend its use.

[boutons_deux]

Bachmann knows her extreme right wing "Christian", aka racist, supporters well, and knew exactly (she's (guvmint) lawyer), what the racist connotations of her tar baby dog-whistle are.

[2centsworth]

The only context I've ever heard the term Tar Baby used was to describe the State of US before the '08 election. For instance, the Republicans wanted to pass the Tar Baby to Obama to look good in '12.

[rjv]

You also said it made her either insensitive or ignorant.

I'd suggest sophisticated people can discern between the use of words in different contexts.

Non-Blacks cannot be expected to know what is going to bother Black people. Particularly when Black people aren't all bothered by the same thing.

Are you Black? Or, African-American? Can I call you Negro or Colored?

Does any of this make sense?


good points, cracker.

[spursncowboys]

- a tar baby is a phrase that continues to refer to problems of an intractable nature worsened by intervention. from a poster
http://www.startribune.com/politics/blogs/148148675.html

[ChumpDumper]

Her use of the term "tar baby" has become a tar baby for Bachmann.

Your intervention is worsening it.

[Drachen]

Drachen, ever heard of "jungle bunnies"?

I have heard of "Jungle Boogie". :lol


I'd suggest that she is not sophisticated if she doesn't know what a bad idea using that phrase is, and neither is anyone trying to defend its use.

I may have missed something, but did she say that she used that phrase knowing it was a racist phrase? Or are you saying that she is unsophisticated because she is unaware of all of the racist phrases in existence?

[ChumpDumper]

I may have missed something, but did she say that she used that phrase knowing it was a racist phrase? Or are you saying that she is unsophisticated because she is unaware of all of the racist phrases in existence?The latter.

"Tar baby" is a pretty easy one to figure out.

[Drachen]

well I would say that it is decidedly sophisticated to be unaware of all of the racial slurs and their variants. Ignorant? yes. unsophisticated? no.

On a side not, I hate that I feel like I am defending MB.

[2centsworth]

well I would say that it is decidedly sophisticated to be unaware of all of the racial slurs and their variants. Ignorant? yes. unsophisticated? no.

On a side not, I hate that I feel like I am defending MB.

don't apologize for using your brain.

[Wild Cobra]

from a poster
http://www.startribune.com/politics/blogs/148148675.html

LOL...

That post is good:

Hey every idiot out there that is up in arms about the "disgracefulness" of Bachmann's comments, why don't you actually try to correctly interpret that to which she was referring. In circles of educated people that have in fact read at least one book within their lifetimes, as well as in every other region of the world, a tar baby is a phrase that continues to refer to problems of an intractable nature worsened by intervention. It is unmistakably obvious that for those of you who are convinced of tar baby's status as a slur, you are only arriving at that conclusion through your myopic belief that it SOUNDS like a racial slur - to which you are ultimately the racist by bridging the properties of tar to the color of one's skin and its associated ethnicity.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

http://www.oldtimecollectibles.com/tarbaby.jpg
http://withfriendship.com/images/i/44319/big-dig-as-a-quottar-baby.jpg

[LnGrrrR]

Well, as long as a group of people are too sensitive to live in society, there will never be a true sense of equality. For others to have to bend to their demands is ridiculous. I say get over it. Stop this petty squabbling, turning the meaning of things people say upside-down.

How are good people suppose to respect those who constantly call them racists? I am personally sick and tired of this. I have lost my patience with these race baiters. I say fuck you all who want to be offended instead of getting along.

Says the person who is constantly claiming he's misunderstood.

[Wild Cobra]

Says the person who is constantly claiming he's misunderstood.LOL....

This has some truth to it, but at least I'm not crying racism.

[LnGrrrR]

LOL....

This has some truth to it, but at least I'm not crying racism.

You constantly call out other posters on this board for deliberately misunderstanding you. Is that not the other side of the coin?

Using your logic, if other posters AREN'T deliberately trying to misunderstand you, they should be offended. In fact, if that happened multiple times, they would be justified in deliberately misunderstanding you in the future.

[Wild Cobra]

You constantly call out other posters on this board for deliberately misunderstanding you. Is that not the other side of the coin?
Sorry, I don't see it as the same thing.

Using your logic, if other posters AREN'T deliberately trying to misunderstand you, they should be offended. In fact, if that happened multiple times, they would be justified in deliberately misunderstanding you in the future.


Huh?

Maybe I had too much to drink already, but I think I failed to follow that paragraph.

If you mean the times I have said someone is either intentionally misunderstanding me, or stupid, yes. I have said such things. But only after a few attempts of getting my point across, and after they reply with a misrepresentation of what I said.

[Wild Cobra]

LnGrrrR...

Would you agree that part of a civil debate would be to attempt for clarification of what someone means when they indicate they are being misunderstood? Shouldn't the conversation be questions in an attempt to have proper communications, instead of constantly attacking a point that is said not to be represented correctly?

[LnGrrrR]

LnGrrrR...

Would you agree that part of a civil debate would be to attempt for clarification of what someone means when they indicate they are being misunderstood? Shouldn't the conversation be questions in an attempt to have proper communications, instead of constantly attacking a point that is said not to be represented correctly?

Agreed, but you often accuse the people you debate with of arguing in bad faith.


How are good people suppose to respect those who constantly call them racists?

By contrast, how are we supposed to react when you constantly think that those who debate with you are arguing in bad faith?

[Wild Cobra]

Agreed, but you often accuse the people you debate with of arguing in bad faith.



By contrast, how are we supposed to react when you constantly think that those who debate with you are arguing in bad faith?
I disagree, or at least you are using a bad example. I have numerous times been called a racist, have repeatedly explained my point of view, and keep getting called a racist. From personal experience, I can see so many others being as sick and tired of this shit as I am.

Have a better example?

[ChumpDumper]

well I would say that it is decidedly sophisticated to be unaware of all of the racial slurs and their variants. Ignorant? yes. unsophisticated? no.

On a side not, I hate that I feel like I am defending MB.altered by education, experience, etc., so as to be worldly-wise; not naive

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sophisticated

Her use of the phrase shows a decided lack of sophistication.

[Wild Cobra]

altered by education, experience, etc., so as to be worldly-wise; not naive

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sophisticated

Her use of the phrase shows a decided lack of sophistication.
Chump, I don't know about you, but I have so many better things to do than to keep up with what others find offensive. If that's your thing, then fine. I have a feeling Bachmann is more concerned about more important things as well.

[TeyshaBlue]

I don't think anyone thinks it was used in a racial context by Michelle Bachmann. I haven't followed the story very closely because, really, who gives a fuck? But it seems the "outrage" is that she would be dumb enough to casually use a racially charged term. Not that she is herself racist for having used it.

But that's harder to rally behind than perceived race baiting and unfair accusations from the lefties.

Bachman should be a bit more niggardly with her opinions.

[Drachen]

altered by education, experience, etc., so as to be worldly-wise; not naive

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/sophisticated

Her use of the phrase shows a decided lack of sophistication.

yeah, I looked it up too and the example it gives is "a sophisticated young socialite; the sophisticated eye of a journalist." Those two phrases really evoke the image of someone who can toss out obscure racial slurs left and right.

Most of the other definitions also mention the word "refined".

[ChumpDumper]

Chump, I don't know about you, but I have so many better things to do than to keep up with what others find offensive. If that's your thing, then fine. I have a feeling Bachmann is more concerned about more important things as well.I have a feeling you would make any excuse you could for her no matter what she said because she is a Republican. Being a public figure and politician means limiting the stupid shit you might say.

She never could, but for Republicans stupidity is now a virtue.

[Cue Biden examples as an attempt to minimize. Sorry, he has also hit his ceiling because he says stupid things.]

[ChumpDumper]

yeah, I looked it up too and the example it gives is "a sophisticated young socialite; the sophisticated eye of a journalist." Those two phrases really evoke the image of someone who can toss out obscure racial slurs left and right.

Most of the other definitions also mention the word "refined".It's not my fault if you are unable to apply the actual definition to this situation.

And again, it's simply not that obscure.

[George Gervin's Afro]

Bachman should be a bit more niggardly with her opinions.

:lmao

[Drachen]

It's not my fault if you are unable to apply the actual definition to this situation.

And again, it's simply not that obscure.

I know this is antecdotal, so I guess take it for whatever you want, but I asked two coworkers, one is a black man and the other married to a black man and neither had ever heard of the term.

[TheSkeptic]

I know this is antecdotal, so I guess take it for whatever you want, but I asked two coworkers, one is a black man and the other married to a black man and neither had ever heard of the term.

I hear you on this one. I hadn't heard of this term either until I got to the thread. On the actual topic being discussed here I'm more inclined to think that Bachmann didn't know what she was saying -as opposed to unleashing her closet racism and whatever else she's being accused of.

[ChumpDumper]

I'm more inclined to think that Bachmann didn't know what she was sayingAs am I.

She is an idiot, after all.

[DarrinS]

This thread is a tar baby

[Drachen]

As am I.

She is an idiot, after all.

I agree she is an idiot, I don't agree that this is proof. It is, however, obvious that you and I will disagree on this point.

[ChumpDumper]

I agree she is an idiot, I don't agree that this is proof. It is, however, obvious that you and I will disagree on this point.Eh, maybe I'm just older and more familiar with the term. Who knows?

I think enough people are familiar with the term that its use is unwise.

[RandomGuy]

Either this bitch is straight up racist...or straight up stupid for not realizing that's a racist term...either way...that bitch is dumb...

W7abLGn7zUM

Racist? No.

Straight up stupid? I wish I could completely agree. Getting through law school generally requires something upstairs.

Ignorant? yup.

A bit of a nutter? yup.

[boutons_deux]

"Getting through law school generally requires something upstairs."

uh:

"She enrolled at Coburn School of Law, an affiliate of Oral Roberts University. Bachmann chose to attend Coburn’s unaccredited law school because it was built in accord with “God’s commission to Oral Roberts”, a televangelist."

[CuckingFunt]

I hear you on this one. I hadn't heard of this term either until I got to the thread. On the actual topic being discussed here I'm more inclined to think that Bachmann didn't know what she was saying -as opposed to unleashing her closet racism and whatever else she's being accused of.

And, as I suggested with my first post in this thread, I don't think much of anyone is accusing Bachmann of unleashing her closet racism or anything else. My understanding is that people are more concerned about the fact that a) she didn't know what she was saying, and b) a well known political figure whose career choice demands frequent public speaking SHOULD know what they're saying.

[boutons_deux]

She knows she's dog whistling to the racists.

With Repug/"Christian" extremists like this asshole, assume the worst and be right 99% of the time.

600K words in English language, and millions of phrases. this ain't no ignorant "oops!"

[TheSkeptic]

And, as I suggested with my first post in this thread, I don't think much of anyone is accusing Bachmann of unleashing her closet racism or anything else. My understanding is that people are more concerned about the fact that a) she didn't know what she was saying, and b) a well known political figure whose career choice demands frequent public speaking SHOULD know what they're saying.

Ah. You're right.

Those are worthwhile concerns I suppose. I personally never took her seriously as a candidate though so maybe that's why I'm not too surprised. Just looking at her background and the like I think she lives in a bit of an echo chamber with respect to things like this. She seems like a decent person in general though.

As an aside, what I've never understood about Bachmann is why she didn't run for congress or something. That would fit her abilities a little bit better than the presidency in my opinion.

[Wild Cobra]

Again people:


Isn't this pipeline coming from a "tar" oil source?
Isn't this the obvious reason she used the term?