milkyway21
06-23-2005, 02:50 AM
Why Duncan is the NBA's best forward ever
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Elliott Kalb / Special to FOXSports.com
Posted: 1 day ago
I wanted to rush to judgment after the 1998 NBA season, but of course, it was way too early.
It was too early following the 1999 season, when Tim Duncan won his first NBA championship.
It was premature even after the 2003 season, one in which Duncan won the MVP and his second NBA title.
But I'm not sure that I'm not jumping the gun now, with Duncan one win away from his third championship.
Tim Duncan is the greatest forward of all time.
When my book, Who's Better, Who's Best in Basketball? was published in the fall of 2003, the most difficult ranking concerned the Duncan. The last revision I made was to jump Duncan over Bob Pettit and Karl Malone into the top 10 players of all time.
Tim Duncan on the verge of his third NBA championship. (Andrew D. Bernstein / Getty Images)
It was difficult to put Duncan (after only six seasons) ahead of the Mailman, but now, it is time. And it's also time to acknowledge Duncan as the greatest forward of all time, edging past Larry Bird.
Bird won three MVP awards (consecutively, in his fifth, sixth, and seventh seasons.)
Duncan has won two MVP awards (consecutively, in his fifth and sixth seasons).
Bird not only won those three MVPs, but he was in the top three in voting in each of his first eight seasons.
Duncan has played eight seasons in the NBA, and has never finished lower than fifth.
Bird won three NBA championships.
Duncan has won two NBA championships, and is on the verge of his third.
Bird was first team All-NBA for nine consecutive seasons, beginning in 1980.
Duncan was first team All-NBA for eight consecutive seasons, beginning in 1998.
In his first eight seasons, Bird's teams were 20-5 in playoff series, losing twice to powerhouse Lakers teams.
In his first eight seasons, Duncan's teams are 16-4 in playoff series, losing three times to powerhouse Lakers teams.
And Duncan's humility is unquestioned.
"He's amazingly unaffected," said longtime hoops writer Peter Vecsey. "Of all the superstars in the history of the game, he's the No. 1 teammate in terms of ability, personality, quality of person, work ethic, likeability ... he's No. 1. Not even close."
In every season that Duncan plays, his team rates among the top teams in defensive rankings for fewest points allowed and opponent field-goal percentage.
Duncan is always on the first or second all-defensive teams. Now, Bird was one of the greatest free-throw shooters of all time. I'm sure he never had playoff games where he missed 9 out of 12 free throws, as Duncan has done. And Bird was a better passer, who often led his team in points, rebounds, assists, and steals.
Bird did most of his damage in the first eight years of his career. Duncan — especially if he wins his third NBA title this season — has virtually matched him.
Duncan has shown some vulnerability to injuries the last two seasons, and his career has probably peaked.
However, if the Spurs win the NBA championship, it is my contention that Duncan should be considered the greatest forward of all time. Either way, it is a wonderful debate: The perfect Celtic, against the man (Duncan) who was favored to be a Celtic, until the ping-pong balls went the wrong way for Boston.
There are only four other men on the planet who deserve to be in the same solar system as Bird and Duncan.
Their names are Elgin Baylor, Karl Malone, Bob Pettit, and Julius Erving.
And all that said, here is my ranking of the NBA's greatest forwards:
1. Duncan
Almost from his first week in camp, he was the best player on the Spurs. He's won a title with David Robinson playing Robin to his Batman. He's won a title with Tony Parker playing that role. And he might win this year with Manu Ginobili playing second fiddle.
Duncan missed the 2000 postseason with a torn left lateral meniscus. If he wasn't hurt, the Spurs might have won another title.
2. Bird
Larry Bird and Dr. J., two of the top 10, go head to head. (Jerry Wachter / Getty Images)
In an era of great players, he was first or second in MVP voting for six consecutive seasons. He didn't have the athleticism that many of the other great forwards had. In fact, Bill Walton says that Bird was an unbelievable rebounder who knew where the ball was going before the ball knew. And he "did all this without being able to jump over two pieces of paper."
3. Bob Pettit
It's hard to jump Duncan over Pettit, who played between 1954 and 1965. In that time, Pettit won two MVPs, an NBA championship, and was first team All-NBA 10 times. When he retired, he did so as the league's all-time leading scorer. In other words, he did everything Karl Malone did — and a little more.
4. Elgin Baylor
He put up incredible numbers for the Lakers in the 1960s, until knee injuries caught up to him. He scored 40-plus points in a game 87 times, and only Chamberlain and Jordan bettered that.
"Baylor revolutionized the game, taking a mostly horizontal game and making it diagonal," Bob Ryan of the Boston Globe says. "He brought in all the reverse layups, the double fakes. And he was a great rebounder despite his 6-foot-5 size."
5. Julius Erving
You can't judge him by his 11 NBA seasons. You have to take into account his five ABA seasons, when he was at his best. He probably deferred to teammates too much in his first few NBA seasons, as well.
6. Karl Malone
He had a peak (two MVP awards, sandwiched around a second-place finish in 1998 to Jordan), and a consistent career value which is hard to overlook. He led the Western Conference in scoring seven times, and was second four other seasons. But like Baylor, the Mailman didn't deliver in his championship appearances.
7. Charles Barkley
For five seasons he was a first-team All-NBA pick. For five other years he was a second-team pick. He was MVP in 1993, and deserved it in 1990. He didn't have the talent around him in his peak years, as the six forwards ahead of him had.
8. Rick Barry
He did everything Bird did, but was intensely disliked by many. He carried NBA teams and ABA teams to championships, and like Duncan and Bird, he took a bad team and made them contenders almost immediately.
9. Scottie Pippen
Six NBA titles can't be ignored. They make up for the lack of MVPs, appearances on All-NBA teams, etc. Pippen was a great defender. His teams won 137 playoff games. Oh, by the way. Michael Jordan played five seasons without Pippen as his teammate. He won exactly one playoff game (compiling a 1-9 postseason record) without him. Scottie, on the other hand, was 13-17 in the postseason without Jordan, and came within a furious rally by the Lakers of leading the Blazers into the NBA Finals.
10. A toss-up
This is the toughest choice of all. Dolph Schayes was the best player in the league in the mid-50s. John Havlicek won eight NBA championships, and was the Celtics' leading scorer in four of those seasons. He was a great big-game player, as well. Dennis Rodman was the greatest defensive forward of all time. And Kevin Garnett has done everything but lead his team into the NBA Finals.
I'll choose Schayes. Why? Late NBA writer and historian Leonard Koppett told me that Schayes was even better than Bob Pettit.
And in this case, I'll defer to Koppett.
:angel
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/3653506
Story Tools: Print Email
Elliott Kalb / Special to FOXSports.com
Posted: 1 day ago
I wanted to rush to judgment after the 1998 NBA season, but of course, it was way too early.
It was too early following the 1999 season, when Tim Duncan won his first NBA championship.
It was premature even after the 2003 season, one in which Duncan won the MVP and his second NBA title.
But I'm not sure that I'm not jumping the gun now, with Duncan one win away from his third championship.
Tim Duncan is the greatest forward of all time.
When my book, Who's Better, Who's Best in Basketball? was published in the fall of 2003, the most difficult ranking concerned the Duncan. The last revision I made was to jump Duncan over Bob Pettit and Karl Malone into the top 10 players of all time.
Tim Duncan on the verge of his third NBA championship. (Andrew D. Bernstein / Getty Images)
It was difficult to put Duncan (after only six seasons) ahead of the Mailman, but now, it is time. And it's also time to acknowledge Duncan as the greatest forward of all time, edging past Larry Bird.
Bird won three MVP awards (consecutively, in his fifth, sixth, and seventh seasons.)
Duncan has won two MVP awards (consecutively, in his fifth and sixth seasons).
Bird not only won those three MVPs, but he was in the top three in voting in each of his first eight seasons.
Duncan has played eight seasons in the NBA, and has never finished lower than fifth.
Bird won three NBA championships.
Duncan has won two NBA championships, and is on the verge of his third.
Bird was first team All-NBA for nine consecutive seasons, beginning in 1980.
Duncan was first team All-NBA for eight consecutive seasons, beginning in 1998.
In his first eight seasons, Bird's teams were 20-5 in playoff series, losing twice to powerhouse Lakers teams.
In his first eight seasons, Duncan's teams are 16-4 in playoff series, losing three times to powerhouse Lakers teams.
And Duncan's humility is unquestioned.
"He's amazingly unaffected," said longtime hoops writer Peter Vecsey. "Of all the superstars in the history of the game, he's the No. 1 teammate in terms of ability, personality, quality of person, work ethic, likeability ... he's No. 1. Not even close."
In every season that Duncan plays, his team rates among the top teams in defensive rankings for fewest points allowed and opponent field-goal percentage.
Duncan is always on the first or second all-defensive teams. Now, Bird was one of the greatest free-throw shooters of all time. I'm sure he never had playoff games where he missed 9 out of 12 free throws, as Duncan has done. And Bird was a better passer, who often led his team in points, rebounds, assists, and steals.
Bird did most of his damage in the first eight years of his career. Duncan — especially if he wins his third NBA title this season — has virtually matched him.
Duncan has shown some vulnerability to injuries the last two seasons, and his career has probably peaked.
However, if the Spurs win the NBA championship, it is my contention that Duncan should be considered the greatest forward of all time. Either way, it is a wonderful debate: The perfect Celtic, against the man (Duncan) who was favored to be a Celtic, until the ping-pong balls went the wrong way for Boston.
There are only four other men on the planet who deserve to be in the same solar system as Bird and Duncan.
Their names are Elgin Baylor, Karl Malone, Bob Pettit, and Julius Erving.
And all that said, here is my ranking of the NBA's greatest forwards:
1. Duncan
Almost from his first week in camp, he was the best player on the Spurs. He's won a title with David Robinson playing Robin to his Batman. He's won a title with Tony Parker playing that role. And he might win this year with Manu Ginobili playing second fiddle.
Duncan missed the 2000 postseason with a torn left lateral meniscus. If he wasn't hurt, the Spurs might have won another title.
2. Bird
Larry Bird and Dr. J., two of the top 10, go head to head. (Jerry Wachter / Getty Images)
In an era of great players, he was first or second in MVP voting for six consecutive seasons. He didn't have the athleticism that many of the other great forwards had. In fact, Bill Walton says that Bird was an unbelievable rebounder who knew where the ball was going before the ball knew. And he "did all this without being able to jump over two pieces of paper."
3. Bob Pettit
It's hard to jump Duncan over Pettit, who played between 1954 and 1965. In that time, Pettit won two MVPs, an NBA championship, and was first team All-NBA 10 times. When he retired, he did so as the league's all-time leading scorer. In other words, he did everything Karl Malone did — and a little more.
4. Elgin Baylor
He put up incredible numbers for the Lakers in the 1960s, until knee injuries caught up to him. He scored 40-plus points in a game 87 times, and only Chamberlain and Jordan bettered that.
"Baylor revolutionized the game, taking a mostly horizontal game and making it diagonal," Bob Ryan of the Boston Globe says. "He brought in all the reverse layups, the double fakes. And he was a great rebounder despite his 6-foot-5 size."
5. Julius Erving
You can't judge him by his 11 NBA seasons. You have to take into account his five ABA seasons, when he was at his best. He probably deferred to teammates too much in his first few NBA seasons, as well.
6. Karl Malone
He had a peak (two MVP awards, sandwiched around a second-place finish in 1998 to Jordan), and a consistent career value which is hard to overlook. He led the Western Conference in scoring seven times, and was second four other seasons. But like Baylor, the Mailman didn't deliver in his championship appearances.
7. Charles Barkley
For five seasons he was a first-team All-NBA pick. For five other years he was a second-team pick. He was MVP in 1993, and deserved it in 1990. He didn't have the talent around him in his peak years, as the six forwards ahead of him had.
8. Rick Barry
He did everything Bird did, but was intensely disliked by many. He carried NBA teams and ABA teams to championships, and like Duncan and Bird, he took a bad team and made them contenders almost immediately.
9. Scottie Pippen
Six NBA titles can't be ignored. They make up for the lack of MVPs, appearances on All-NBA teams, etc. Pippen was a great defender. His teams won 137 playoff games. Oh, by the way. Michael Jordan played five seasons without Pippen as his teammate. He won exactly one playoff game (compiling a 1-9 postseason record) without him. Scottie, on the other hand, was 13-17 in the postseason without Jordan, and came within a furious rally by the Lakers of leading the Blazers into the NBA Finals.
10. A toss-up
This is the toughest choice of all. Dolph Schayes was the best player in the league in the mid-50s. John Havlicek won eight NBA championships, and was the Celtics' leading scorer in four of those seasons. He was a great big-game player, as well. Dennis Rodman was the greatest defensive forward of all time. And Kevin Garnett has done everything but lead his team into the NBA Finals.
I'll choose Schayes. Why? Late NBA writer and historian Leonard Koppett told me that Schayes was even better than Bob Pettit.
And in this case, I'll defer to Koppett.
:angel
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/3653506