Path to Citizenship program?

[LnGrrrR]

An interesting idea here:

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/15/13297578-young-illegal-immigrants-line-up-for-chance-to-legally-stay-work-in-us-under-new-deferral-program?lite

I'm for it. If they came as children, then it's not really their fault. And kicking them out after they've been here for years, making connections with friends, their location, etc etc. Plus, it gets around the complaint about opening up amnesty to people who will be collecting Medicare/Medicaid within a decade.

[clambake]

its a sting operation.


gonna round'em up and shoot'em at the border.

[Trainwreck2100]

more like path the more democrats amiriteeverybody

[mavs>spurs]

illegal is illegal is illegal. shameful day in our country.

[Wild Cobra]

An interesting idea here:

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2012/08/15/13297578-young-illegal-immigrants-line-up-for-chance-to-legally-stay-work-in-us-under-new-deferral-program?lite

I'm for it. If they came as children, then it's not really their fault. And kicking them out after they've been here for years, making connections with friends, their location, etc etc. Plus, it gets around the complaint about opening up amnesty to people who will be collecting Medicare/Medicaid within a decade.


its a sting operation.

No...

I wish it was a sting operation.

We cannot do this. It will create a reason for more people to bring their children over for the good of their children. Those who circumvent the legal immigration system should not be rewarded by giving their children a better future.

Rewarding bad behavior will result in more bad behavior.

[FkLA]

Great day for the USA and really epitomizes what this country is all about tbh. :tu

[mavs>spurs]

Explain to me how rewarding bad behavior and having rampant border hopping is a good thing?

This country was founded on hard work and honor. Having no honor in breaking the law and floundering around for years and years without working or being able to do anything, simply waiting for the day Obama gives you a freebie is un-American.

[FkLA]

You really think these people were in hiding and providing nothing to society up until today ?

[LnGrrrR]

No...

I wish it was a sting operation.

We cannot do this. It will create a reason for more people to bring their children over for the good of their children. Those who circumvent the legal immigration system should not be rewarded by giving their children a better future.

Rewarding bad behavior will result in more bad behavior.

So... in your eyes, instead of just punishing the people responsible, you're also willing to punish the innocent, who came not of their own free will. Kids that may have been in this country since they were infants, and therefore identify as Americans. Those are the kinds of people you want to deport?

I understand that there's certainly moral hazard introduced, but I don't think punishing those who are innocent of wrong-doing is the proper way to go about it.

[mavs>spurs]

i know plenty of em personally, yeah they couldn't work and went to school on the tax payers back. i know about 6 or 7 with degrees who have just been chilling waiting to use them. living with mommeh and daddeh and having babies. its sick.

[mavs>spurs]

So... in your eyes, instead of just punishing the people responsible, you're also willing to punish the innocent, who came not of their own free will. Kids that may have been in this country since they were infants, and therefore identify as Americans. Those are the kinds of people you want to deport?

I understand that there's certainly moral hazard introduced, but I don't think punishing those who are innocent of wrong-doing is the proper way to go about it.

have you read the rules? people who came here before 16. not infants.

just because your wife is hispanic doesn't mean we want to be overrun by wetbacks who don't respect our country dude.

[mavs>spurs]

i've lived in a highly hispanic part of the country dude. i've seen the way they've destroyed ft worth and the healthcare system here. i've heard the horror stories from my doctor and medical professionals. i've seen how illegals i know get caught driving without a license and don't get in trouble, like they're above the fucking law. i've seen the lists of DWI offenders posted publically in the paper each month, and how they're all gutierrez and ramirez. there's a thread in the club right now where a wetback is asking for help getting out of his DWI. fuck that shit dude, our white ancestors built this shit there ain't gonna be no reconquesta.

[FkLA]

i know plenty of em personally, yeah they couldn't work and went to school on the tax payers back. i know about 6 or 7 with degrees who have just been chilling waiting to use them. living with mommeh and daddeh and having babies. its sick.

No, you dont. :lol

I do and I can tell you theres tons of ways around it. Get a fake social security number or one that belongs to deceased person+a fake green card and most employers are either too stupid to realize the difference or just turn a blind eye. Look up how much 'unknown' money is collected by Social Security yearly. Thats coming from illegals who work, get paychecks and get deductions just like you or me. Only difference is they wont ever be able to reap the benefits of such programs. Or atleast those under 31 wouldnt have been able to prior to today, the ones over the age limit are still fucked.

[mavs>spurs]

^all that shit is fraud and it's highly illegal. and yes i fucking do know people who have been pulled over without a license and nothing happens. yes i do know people with degrees who can't use them. you can't get away with that fraud shit in a white collar job. you just admitted that your people are law breakers and deserve nothing but deportation.

[Wild Cobra]

So... in your eyes, instead of just punishing the people responsible, you're also willing to punish the innocent, who came not of their own free will. Kids that may have been in this country since they were infants, and therefore identify as Americans. Those are the kinds of people you want to deport?

I understand that there's certainly moral hazard introduced, but I don't think punishing those who are innocent of wrong-doing is the proper way to go about it.
At least it's not abortion.

[FkLA]

^all that shit is fraud and it's highly illegal. and yes i fucking do know people who have been pulled over without a license and nothing happens. yes i do know people with degrees who can't use them. you can't get away with that fraud shit in a white collar job. you just admitted that your people are law breakers and deserve nothing but deportation.

It is fraud but its not shameless fraud. At the end of the day its a mutualistic relationship between illegals and the USA. The US government knows the types of jobs/places illegals frequent and would get rid of them if it wasnt. The notion that illegals piggyback on peoples taxes is ignorant.

[mavs>spurs]

You imbecile, the reason they want them here is to blur the lines between borders and get Americans used to living with brown people so that they can eventually usher in a north american union like they did in europe. that means no more USA, no more MEXICO. do you really want to lose the country you're so proud of? i know damn sure I won't lose mine, GIVE ME LIBERTY OR GIVE ME DEATH.

6Y30k3nkk54

[FkLA]

Is that you with the Xbox headset asking the question ?

[mavs>spurs]

_wCdULj6fOQ

[FkLA]

Also why the hate for the EU ?

[mavs>spurs]

Because this used to be the greatest country on earth. My ancestors fought for this shit, and America really stood out from the rest for 200 years. The EU may be an appropriate decision for the europeans, but it's not the right one for us here who love America and value our sovereignty. If you're catholic, read revelation and read about the one world government that will come in the end times. This is bad stuff. I love my liberties and I'm not willing to give them up to power hungry globalists who want to oppress. I'm not throwing out my constitution and country in exchange for a north american union and a new constitution. It's not going to happen without a fight and I don't want to live in a world dominated by sadistic control freaks. I want to be free.

[LnGrrrR]

have you read the rules? people who came here before 16. not infants.

just because your wife is hispanic doesn't mean we want to be overrun by wetbacks who don't respect our country dude.

Infants are usually considered to be under the age of 16.

[FkLA]

People residing in EU countries have liberties and freedom. The idea behind the EU itself wasnt a bad thing bruh. This aint happening here though, especially with all the shits thats going on down in Mexico.

[LnGrrrR]

At least it's not abortion.

Way to dodge the question WC.

Why not just say you're fine with punishing the innocent if it prevents other illegals from bringing their children over in hopes of amnesty?

[mavs>spurs]

Infants are usually considered to be under the age of 16.

you said infants in an attempt to make it more innocent than it really is but it's not just people who came here as infants dude it's 16 year olds too.

[LnGrrrR]

you said infants in an attempt to make it more innocent than it really is but it's not just people who came here as infants dude it's 16 year olds too.

Yes, it can be those who came at 16 or under. Those are usually considered minors, and so I don't see why you'd have a problem with that. They don't get treated as adults in most cases in our justice system.

The program can cover anyone from 16 and below. So if you came to this country as a 1 month old 15 years ago, you can apply. And if you don't think there are children who fall into these categories that are applying, then you just have blinders on.

[mavs>spurs]

People residing in EU countries have liberties and freedom. The idea behind the EU itself wasnt a bad thing bruh. This aint happening here though, especially with all the shits thats going on down in Mexico.

Europe is ok but it ain't the US. Those people can't even own guns and are at their governments mercy. You know what happened to the UK when they took away civilian gun ownership? Muggings and violent crime went through the roof and they now have 4 times the violent crime rate we have here in gun owning US.

Wake up, there is a real threat going on here. Maybe if the people in mexico were armed with guns and a set of nuts they wouldn't be terrorized by drug cartels and living in a 3rd world shit hole.

Fact check. Mexico has (approximately, at least last i checked but i could be off by a spot or two) the 12th biggest economy in the world but it's all in the hands of a few assholes and the average person has nothing. They have resources. You know what's missing in mexico though? Liberties. The constitution. These people have no place to call home and nothing to be proud of because of their own incompetence. I'll keep my gun rights and I'll keep my constitution, because it's worked so much better than all those other models. I don't want to become mexico. I don't want to be combined with canada. I want to be American.

[mavs>spurs]

Yes, it can be those who came at 16 or under. Those are usually considered minors, and so I don't see why you'd have a problem with that. They don't get treated as adults in most cases in our justice system.

The program can cover anyone from 16 and below. So if you came to this country as a 1 month old 15 years ago, you can apply. And if you don't think there are children who fall into these categories that are applying, then you just have blinders on.

Their parents knew they were committing a crime.

[LnGrrrR]

Their parents knew they were committing a crime.

So you're cool with the sins of the parents being passed on to the children then?

[mavs>spurs]

So you're cool with the sins of the parents being passed on to the children then?

I'm responsible for choices my parents made 20+ years ago, we all are. Fact of life.

[LnGrrrR]

I'm responsible for choices my parents made 20+ years ago, we all are. Fact of life.

Not to go all Chumpdumper on you, but which choices? And would any of those choices possibly lead to your deportation?

And how exactly are you responsible for those choices, if your parents made them? You might be living with the consequences, but that doesn't make you responsible.

[FkLA]

Europe is ok but it ain't the US. Those people can't even own guns and are at their governments mercy. You know what happened to the UK when they took away civilian gun ownership? Muggings and violent crime went through the roof and they now have 4 times the violent crime rate we have here in gun owning US.

Wake up, there is a real threat going on here. Maybe if the people in mexico were armed with guns and a set of nuts they wouldn't be terrorized by drug cartels and living in a 3rd world shit hole.

Fact check. Mexico has (approximately, at least last i checked but i could be off by a spot or two) the 12th biggest economy in the world but it's all in the hands of a few assholes and the average person has nothing. They have resources. You know what's missing in mexico though? Liberties. The constitution. These people have no place to call home and nothing to be proud of because of their own incompetence. I'll keep my gun rights and I'll keep my constitution, because it's worked so much better than all those other models. I don't want to become mexico. I don't want to be combined with canada. I want to be American.

The EU has its flaws obviously but the main goal behind it was to prevent shit like WWII from happening again. Which it has done. Besides the US of A has fallen off on its own without the help of Mexico or Canada, youre acting like a union would ruin Americas run as the greatest country in the world. When in reality it can be argued that as it stands now the US of A aint #1 anymore. Why in the world would union like this happen though considering the state Mexico is in ?

[mavs>spurs]

In my relatively short 2 decades in this country, I've watched it in constant state of deterioration for much of the latter part. I've gone from seeing a country full of proud, english speaking people to the arrival of millions of foreigners, many of them spanish speaking. I've seen fort worth deteriorate, and the school systems which are now 99% hispanic fail. I remember when there were no spanish menus and advertisements. I remember when a young white american could get a job as a cashier at lowes or as a bank teller without being bilingual. I remember the days before affirmative action ran wild, when the postal service and government programs didn't hire mostly hispanics and 10% whites. I remember when this country was strong, and there were family values. I don't recognize this world i walk out into when I step outside my house. I'm angered that spanish speaking students go to school for free while i'm forced to pay for their education. Angered that my government has failed me and forgotten about me in order to pursue the interests of a few wealthy elite.

My ancestors fought and died for this place dude. Real blood, sweat, and tears. Now days the american dream has been reduced to border hopping for entitlements. Over 50% of immigrants, both legal and illegal, end up on welfare I just saw in the news according to the latest study. That is appalling. Whatever happened to coming here, respecting this country, working hard, and most of all being PROUD to be an American? You can continue to give your country away to the Mexicans dude. Continue fighting in the military not to defend this country, but to go on the offensive and pursue the interests of a few wealthy elite.

That's not american dude. With or without people like you, I'll always be an American to my core. I'll exercise my 2nd and 4th amendments. I'll know how to skin a buck and run a trotline, I'll keep going to the local shooting range and bearing arms. I'll continue to speak out for what I believe in without intimidation. I'll continue to have to biggest damn set of balls you've ever seen. It's in my blood dude, pumping through my veins until the day I die. And I'm going to continue campaigning for what's right and helping out in any little way I can. And be damned, if they want to give this country away me and every real American will be there to oppose it by any means necessary. Who's side are you on? There will come a time when you'll have to choose. Will it be these globalist wolves in sheeps clothing, or will you finally wake up and join your American born brothers? The american people are waking up. According to the polls, over 70% of americans know 9/11 was an inside job. We know we've been sold out by our elected officials. We know the DHS just bought a couple billions of rounds of ammunition to use against the American people. We know there are plans for military intervention to quell the coming civil unrest. But you're pretty tough to beat when you're right, and over half the military is awake. Ron paul gets the vast majority of all military contributions, we're all tired of the 2 party corrupted system. Cmon lngrrr, you're a better man than that somewhere deep down.

[mavs>spurs]

The EU has its flaws obviously but the main goal behind it was to prevent shit like WWII from happening again. Which it has done. Besides the US of A has fallen off on its own without the help of Mexico or Canada, youre acting like a union would ruin Americas run as the greatest country in the world. When in reality it can be argued that as it stands now the US of A aint #1 anymore. Why in the world would union like this happen though considering the state Mexico is in ?

That's the thing dude, america is being destroyed by design from within. We were bought off by the bankers around a century ago. They manufactured the depression. They funded hitler on record as well as the other side and started WWII. Guess what rose up out of the ashes? The United Nations. Now they're the ones allowing the illegals to pour into our country in hopes of furthering the agenda with a North American Union. It's all about moving away from sovereign nations and towards international government. Wake up people, we're all being had. Obama doesn't care about you, he doesnt care about me, he doesn't care about brown people, white people, he's only a puppet furthering the agenda. It's all biblical if you're religious, and if you're not then the proof is in the documents. All the information is out there if you look for it. Whenever america falls and the economy collapses BY THEIR HAND, they will pose as the savior with their "solution" of a north american union.

[FkLA]

Come on, man..

[mavs>spurs]

And dude, in case you haven't noticed, the EU isn't doing much to stop WW3. It's approaching quickly. Once Israel attacks Iran, it's on and poppin. The Russians have made it clear Iran is their ally and they will go to war to defend them. China is their ally, and I'm not so sure who's side India is on. This thing could quickly escalate into something like we've never seen.

While you all were celebrating fourth of July not paying attention, Russian warplanes entered US airspace twice. Russia is in the process of moving nukes into Cuba. Just the other day, a russian nuclear sub was able to enter the Gulf of Mexico completely UNDETECTED. This isn't fun and games anymore people.

[Wild Cobra]

Way to dodge the question WC.

Why not just say you're fine with punishing the innocent if it prevents other illegals from bringing their children over in hopes of amnesty?
Why is it our burden to excuse them of their parents responsibility.

You bleeding heart liberals are amazingly short sighted at times. Such policies will increase illegal immigration. If you can convince me this policy will not increase the illegal immigration problem, then I'm OK with it. Problem is, there is not way this will not make illegal immigration worse than it other=wsie would be. They come here for opportunity for them and their children. Make it an automatic OK for their children, and my god... watch out...

[Sense]

:lol ignorant idiots are still mad at this.

BTW there's a thread on this already, you know when Obama said he was going to do it.. and the same idiots crying over it are on this one aswell. I suggest you get on that thread and revisit their stupidity and dumb arguments. I for one am not going to bother.

[SnakeBoy]

Great day for the USA and really epitomizes what this country is all about tbh. :tu

Bypassing the rule of law and the will of the people is what this country is all about?

[Winehole23]

illegal is illegal is illegal. shameful day in our country.it's not a crime to be an undocumented alien. it's an administrative violation, that is, a violation of administrative law, not criminal law.

not all illegality was created equal.

[Winehole23]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/we-see-all-immigrants-as-legal-or-illegal-big-mistake/2012/07/13/gJQAKzogiW_story_1.html

[Winehole23]

free marketeers apparently do not believe in the free movement of labor.

[mercos]

I'm all for the Dream Act, and Obama's executive order that mirrors its provisions, but I do believe we should secure the border if we are going to implement it. I don't want the Dream Act and its ilk to become a reason for a flood of new illegal immigrants to come to the country. Right now we have healthy population growth, but we don't want it to get out of control. Its good that we have growth, as some first world countries like Japan and Russia are facing declining populations.

[LnGrrrR]

Why is it our burden to excuse them of their parents responsibility.

That's the thing though, I see this program as a way to partially relieve that burden in an effective manner. It targets those who came as children, and so they shouldn't be held accountable. It targets young people who want to be Americans, who would earn it through holdin down jobs. And it does all of this without spending thousands/millions to root them out of hiding and forcibly deport them.

Young children who want to become Americans and want to work... Boy, that usually sounds like the type of person that conservatives are clamoron that we need more of.


You bleeding heart liberals are amazingly short sighted at times. Such policies will increase illegal immigration. If you can convince me this policy will not increase the illegal immigration problem, then I'm OK with it. Problem is, there is not way this will not make illegal immigration worse than it other=wsie would be. They come here for opportunity for them and their children. Make it an automatic OK for their children, and my god... watch out...

Except it's not automatic obviously. They can't have any arrests/trouble, they have to follow the program etc etc

Why are you finding it do hard to just admit you're ok with deporting children that didn't do anything wrong?

[LnGrrrR]

Bypassing the rule of law and the will of the people is what this country is all about?

I wasn't aware that Obama was illegally instituting this program. Do you have some evidence to back this up?