WWIII Fantasy teams

[cantthinkofanything]

So far, it looks like the major players are:

Good Guys:
USA
EU
Japan
S. Korea
Israel

Bad Guys:
Russia
China
N. Korea
Iran
Venezuela?

Do the good guys end up with India or any South American countries?
Does Australia get pulled in with the Good Guys?
Is Cuba important?
Are Japan and S. Korea immediately nuked by the bad guys?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/6a/1984_fictitious_world_map_v2_quad.svg/500px-1984_fictitious_world_map_v2_quad.svg.png

[mavs>spurs]

india is going with their regional neighbors in the rest of the east. they play neutral for the common benefit but if the lines were ever drawn and they had to choose it'd be stupid to think they're our friends. we'd lose that war tbh. China would kick Japans ass all over the pacific, north korea and south korea would destroy eachother, the EU is pussy as fuck and wouldn't matter and the US/israel would get overwhelmed just by the sheer numbers of the Russians, the Chinese, India, Iran/Hezbollah and every other jihadi all over the middle east and north africa.

[CosmicCowboy]

Non-nuclear? China and Russia would both sweep west. Russia would get Europe, China would get Middle East, North Africa and exterminate the Muslims. Just wipe em out. US would fuck around and hope they don't launch nukes (they would threaten if we got involved) because to retaliate we would have to blow the fuck out of the rest of the world practically and destroy the planet with nuclear winter.

[symple19]

lol thinking there wouldn't be an important economic component to this.

War is so much more than just numbers (men/materiel)

this whole scenario depends on whether it's nuclear/non-nuclear

Also, there are some sizable armies in Southeast asia that can't be forgotten

[DarrinS]

A lot of people on this board would dispute Irael on the "good guys" list. The same people would probably not put the USA on the "good guys" list.

[Trainwreck2100]

This would go nuclear whoever loses would say fuck it you lose too

[CosmicCowboy]

A lot of people on this board would dispute Irael on the "good guys" list. The same people would probably not put the USA on the "good guys" list.

China might do a deal with the US on Israel. We will leave them alone if you leave us alone to wipe out these fucking Muslims. Problem solved. US sits on the sidelines.

[mavs>spurs]

lol, what makes you think china has any interest in committing genocide against the muslims? if anything, they would team up and use them to take us down. americans don't seem to get that we are not very much liked after years of bullying and world policing.

[CosmicCowboy]

lol, what makes you think china has any interest in committing genocide against the muslims? if anything, they would team up and use them to take us down. americans don't seem to get that we are not very much liked after years of bullying and world policing.

LOL China and religious tolerance. They know how fucked up the muslims are. Besides there has to be an after war end game. We are still China's biggest customer.

[mavs>spurs]

lol bro the chinese are not our friends that is just disillusioned thinking. they seek to become what we are..and the only way to achieve that is by going through us.

[CosmicCowboy]

China wants and needs the oil. Unlike us, when they take a country they will keep it. They won't want a bunch of ignorant religious fanatics setting IED's and blowing up pipelines. They will clean house. They have a few billion chinese they can relocate.

[CosmicCowboy]

lol bro the chinese are not our friends that is just disillusioned thinking. they seek to become what we are..and the only way to achieve that is by going through us.

They are the oldest continuous civilization on earth because they knew when to say when.

[CosmicCowboy]

LOL @ China wanting to be us. They already think they are superior to us.

[Drachen]

LOL China and religious tolerance. They know how fucked up the muslims are. Besides there has to be an after war end game. We are still China's biggest customer.

yeah, they actively oppress the muslims in their nation. pretty blantant about it.

[symple19]

LOL China and religious tolerance. They know how fucked up the muslims are. Besides there has to be an after war end game. We are still China's biggest customer.

The Russians know, too






And India allying with the Pakistanis is loltastic

[CosmicCowboy]

The Russians know, too






And India allying with the Pakistanis is loltastic

Yeah, I LOL'd at that too. India would play semi-neutral but give China Free passage to the middle east in exchange for sweeping Pakistan up on the way.

[mavs>spurs]

The Russians know, too

crofl they know so much that they are allied with iran and drew a red line on us attacking them, saying it would be an attack against russia.

[symple19]

Another factor is that the Chinese Navy is woefully inadequate to do any kind of major amphibious operation (Japan)

We would crush their (chinese) Navy relatively quickly, imo. Japan would be safe and free to mobilize their industry/manpower to thwart anything the chinese might do in the pacific. Then, they could go on the offensive with our help

Meanwhile, the Russians wouldn't be nearly as scary on the offensive as they would be on the defensive. I think NATO could hold them long enough to bring the Germans to bear once they've mobilized their economy/industry/manpower toward a full-on war effort.

This is all assuming a non-nuclear scenario, of course.

If you want a case study of what an undermanned but highly motivated opponent can do to a much larger army, look at the Chinese invasion of Vietnam in 79' or the Finnish resistance to the Russian invasion in 39'...Or any of the Israeli wars against the Arab states for that matter.

I love these what-if scenarios

[mavs>spurs]

china doesn't have a navy because they have a huge submarine fleet and a new torpedo that we can't do anything to stop. pretty much makes our navy obsolete if they were to fight.

[MannyIsGod]

china doesn't have a navy because they have a huge submarine fleet and a new torpedo that we can't do anything to stop. pretty much makes our navy obsolete if they were to fight.

:lol ????

You have to be close enough to fire that torpedo to use it and China's subs would get no where near our fleet before they got sunk. The US navy is the best in the world and no one else is even close.

[MannyIsGod]

Non-nuclear? China and Russia would both sweep west. Russia would get Europe, China would get Middle East, North Africa and exterminate the Muslims. Just wipe em out. US would fuck around and hope they don't launch nukes (they would threaten if we got involved) because to retaliate we would have to blow the fuck out of the rest of the world practically and destroy the planet with nuclear winter.

Nope. Numbers don't mean nearly as much on the modern battlefield because the US and Europe would both have far better C3. There's just no real scenario where in a non nuclear way Russia or China (or anyone not the US really) can exert much pressure outside of their immediate region.

[symple19]

crofl they know so much that they are allied with iran and drew a red line on us attacking them, saying it would be an attack against russia.

You've heard of Chechnya, right? Afghanistan? lol Russians helping muslims expand their territory along their own southern borders.

The only reason the Russians are "allied" with the Iranians is for economic reasons, not ideological. True, neither of them like us, but to the point that Russian blood would be spilled to further the Iranian cause I find completely unlikely and basically laughable.

[symple19]

china doesn't have a navy because they have a huge submarine fleet and a new torpedo that we can't do anything to stop. pretty much makes our navy obsolete if they were to fight.

IIRC, the majority of the Chinese Naval fleet is still diesel powered and the nuclear subs they have are several generations behind ours...

Another case study for you is the German Navy (heavy on U-boats) against the Allied Navies in WW2. We all know how that turned out

[mavs>spurs]

Our aircraft carriers are vulnerable guys..our navy won't be enough to guide us to victory in such a conflict.

http://www.defensereview.com/us-aircraft-carriers-vulnerable-to-attack-the-ticking-time-bomb/

[symple19]

Our aircraft carriers are vulnerable guys..our navy won't be enough to guide us to victory in such a conflict.

http://www.defensereview.com/us-aircraft-carriers-vulnerable-to-attack-the-ticking-time-bomb/

Never said they weren't vulnerable. Yes, the Chinese (and others) have cutting edge missile tech. But very little in the way of projecting any of that beyond their immediate shorelines.

Read this for a more realistic view on Chinese naval/air-force capabilities, and what their ultimate goals are

http://www.nbr.org/research/activity.aspx?id=272

[angrydude]

lol fear mongering china.

because if they aint us, they obviously want to kill us

[Latarian Milton]

yeah, they actively oppress the muslims in their nation. pretty blantant about it.

enemy's enemy naturally becomes your friend imho, they're gonna have a common goal in facefucking the US but you know they ain't never gonna succeed. the world war will probably result in a one-nation world at the end of day and you'll see the star-spangled banner in every cranny and nook all over the world

[angrydude]

China would be happy if it could get rid of its god damn civil unrest

[TDMVPDPOY]

when u say EU, u mean mainly britain and its commonwealth right?

we all know italy, france are going side with axis of evil....cause they have a history of switchin sides and doing shit all in wars...

[Latarian Milton]

Another factor is that the Chinese Navy is woefully inadequate to do any kind of major amphibious operation (Japan)

We would crush their (chinese) Navy relatively quickly, imo. Japan would be safe and free to mobilize their industry/manpower to thwart anything the chinese might do in the pacific. Then, they could go on the offensive with our help

Meanwhile, the Russians wouldn't be nearly as scary on the offensive as they would be on the defensive. I think NATO could hold them long enough to bring the Germans to bear once they've mobilized their economy/industry/manpower toward a full-on war effort.

This is all assuming a non-nuclear scenario, of course.

If you want a case study of what an undermanned but highly motivated opponent can do to a much larger army, look at the Chinese invasion of Vietnam in 79' or the Finnish resistance to the Russian invasion in 39'...Or any of the Israeli wars against the Arab states for that matter.

I love these what-if scenarios
u might be underestimating china's naval force i think, though it's very true there rather weak in air which must count against their strength in the sea. their military spending has been world's 2nd highest for years, behind only the US and they haven't fought any significant wars in many years.

[SnakeBoy]

Non nuclear, the USA in no holds barred conventional warfare kicks the shit out of the bad guys listed. It's not even close.

[cheguevara]

the need for military bases overseas was history when carriers were invented. The US can have an army within hours in any place in the planet. These bullshit bases, overseas pressence and nation building is nothing more than waste of american's money to fill the pockets of the military industrial complex. Now we have citizens being sodomized daily at airports and they seem to like it.

My point is the banking/military complex has the world by the utter balls and it won't let some stupid WWIII fuck it up. And personalities that don't fall in order will be quickly eliminated (Saddam/Ghadafi/etc)

There could be regional wars like Japas/Korea/China. India/Pakistan. Iran. But that's about it, and those will mostly be money making bonanzas for them.

so no WWIII anytime soon. of course unless the inevitable financial collapse starts early.

[AussieFanKurt]

aussies = good guys

[Edward]

That war would pretty much be the end of the world. There wouldn't be any winner or loser. Idk how the "non-nuclear" hypothetical is relevant because that war would undoubtedly lead to nuclear holocaust.

[MannyIsGod]

Non nuclear, the USA in no holds barred conventional warfare kicks the shit out of the bad guys listed. It's not even close.

Yup. We're the only country able to really project so much power around the world through the use of carriers but we're also the largest naval power and have the largest airlift capacity by far. Other nations can't even come close to matching that.

Plus, and likely just as important, we've got the best command and control. There are other countries who are good at it as well but they're all in NATO or our allies. China and Russia don't have anywhere near the AWACS or command and control that the US and NATO have.

The bottom line is I don't care how awesome your ammunition is when you can't find what you're supposed to aim it at.

[symple19]

u might be underestimating china's naval force i think, though it's very true there rather weak in air which must count against their strength in the sea. their military spending has been world's 2nd highest for years, behind only the US and they haven't fought any significant wars in many years.

Chinese Navy


63 Submarines
1 Aircraft Carrier
25 Destroyers
47 Frigates
138 Total Major Combat Vessels

US Navy

286 Total Major Combat Vessels
11 Aircraft Carriers
22 cruisers
61 destroyers
26 frigates
71 submarines



:lmao

The Chinese only have 10 nuke subs while every single one of ours is nuclear

They have no cruisers

They have no real ability to invade or project power beyond their own immediate area

Practically every single one of our ships is several generations more advanced....at minimum

Literally every single aircraft we put in the air is more advanced...plus we have more of them..... 800 vs 3700!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Manny brought up another crucial point, which is Command and Control/Communication. Not even close

In reality, one or two of our Carrier groups is more powerful than most of the Chinese navy combined

We are so much more powerful that their doctrine is to simply slow us down from getting close to their shores (in a Taiwanese conflict scenario, for example)

[cantthinkofanything]

We'd be in trouble though if China said "fuck it" and started putting highly infectious pathogens in some of the stuff they send over here.

[AussieFanKurt]

We'd be in trouble though if China said "fuck it" and started putting highly infectious pathogens in some of the stuff they send over here.

Yeah let's be honest it would just turn into chemical warfare

[SnakeBoy]

Manny brought up another crucial point, which is Command and Control/Communication. Not even close


Same goes for Russia. McCains stupid comment of "We are all Georgians today" dominated the headlines but the real news was the russian military is in shambles...


In Georgia, Russia saw its Army's shortcomings
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Europe/2008/1010/p01s01-woeu.html

[Latarian Milton]

Chinese Navy


63 Submarines
1 Aircraft Carrier
25 Destroyers
47 Frigates
138 Total Major Combat Vessels

US Navy

286 Total Major Combat Vessels
11 Aircraft Carriers
22 cruisers
61 destroyers
26 frigates
71 submarines



:lmao

The Chinese only have 10 nuke subs while every single one of ours is nuclear

They have no cruisers

They have no real ability to invade or project power beyond their own immediate area

Practically every single one of our ships is several generations more advanced....at minimum

Literally every single aircraft we put in the air is more advanced...plus we have more of them..... 800 vs 3700!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Manny brought up another crucial point, which is Command and Control/Communication. Not even close

In reality, one or two of our Carrier groups is more powerful than most of the Chinese navy combined

We are so much more powerful that their doctrine is to simply slow us down from getting close to their shores (in a Taiwanese conflict scenario, for example)
no one beats us one on one but terrorists & most 3rd world counties would stand on their side almost certainly, and the russians wouldn't stay inactive if they see american warships in the east china sea imho.

another factor that counts against the US is you have no secret in your military/naval strength as well as you tactics in military actions, while china may probably come out as a darkhorse and cause the upset. it'd be something like a company of cops vs. john rambo

also you seemed to have neglected the missile boats, its very hard to hunt them down and they carry torpedoes which can be serious threats to the major battleships imho

[symple19]

no one beats us one on one but terrorists & most 3rd world counties would stand on their side almost certainly, and the russians wouldn't stay inactive if they see american warships in the east china sea imho.

another factor that counts against the US is you have no secret in your military/naval strength as well as you tactics in military actions, while china may probably come out as a darkhorse and cause the upset. it'd be something like a company of cops vs. john rambo

also you seemed to have neglected the missile boats, its very hard to hunt them down and they carry torpedoes which can be serious threats to the major battleships imho

I agree with most of that...The other thing about the Chinese is their land based ASM's, which are probably as good as anyone else has out there

Knowing how secretive the (US) military is, I wouldn't doubt that we have a few tricks up our sleeves as well.

I know I wouldn't want to be on a ship that traveled anywhere near Chinese waters in time of war. I'm guessing our leaders understand that and would instead rely on sending stealth aircraft/drones and cruise missiles while staying well away from the near/on shore capabilities of the Chinese Navy

[symple19]

Same goes for Russia. McCains stupid comment of "We are all Georgians today" dominated the headlines but the real news was the russian military is in shambles...

Putin recently announced a major push to modernize their military. Will be interesting to see how he plans to pay for that

Russians are very good at some things and awful at others..C3 being one they suck at.

Missiles and building aircraft, though, they excel in.

Oh, and defending in winter :lol

[TDMVPDPOY]

these chinese air craft carrier, is ex russian bullshit, hence they dont even know its even serviceable...they tried building there own, so far so bullshit...

[Latarian Milton]

these chinese air craft carrier, is ex russian bullshit, hence they dont even know its even serviceable...they tried building there own, so far so bullshit...

agree, what's the point in building an aircraft-carrier when you don't have any legit fighting jets for it to carry? :lol building a carrier ain't like just building a big ship imho, its more like making a mobile airport. many complex techniques are to be applied and it's beyond a 3rd world country's brain to handle all these tbh

[CosmicCowboy]

Chinese wouldn't hesitate to use EMP to counter all our smart weapons.