Spurfan who do you think is the 4th best player on the team?

[Floyd Pacquiao]

vote and discuss

[timtonymanu]

I say Leonard.

[Floyd Pacquiao]

gotta say kawhi imho he's good on D, shoots the corner 3 well, good mid-range Jumper, athletic...to take the next step he needs to improve his 1 on 1 game and make better decisions in the fastbreak imo tbh fwiw Lamborghini mercy

[Mel_13]

Why isn't Tony one of the choices?




Why isn't Manu one of the choices?

[Em-City]

jackson

[timtonymanu]

Scoring: Gary Neal
Experience: Jackson
Overall Talent: Leonard

[SpursRock20]

Jackson, just barely over Leonard. His D is still good although his foot speed has decreased as he has aged (still can give fits to opposing players bigger than him). More clutch than Kawhi and a better finisher at the rim.

[hater]

where the fuck is Ginobili?
big 3:
1. Duncan
2. Parker
3. Kawhi

[Splits]

http://nbcprobasketballtalk.files.wordpress.com/2012/05/yltajl7gtx5ggd1j2l7coe5e3cmysp__ylux3odmtfocm9hzxb 0bg1pdancbg9niejvzhkecg9zaziec2vja01lzglhqmxvz0jvz hluzw1wqxnzzw1ibhk-_ylgx3odmtm2b3npzgi4bgludgwddxmebgfuzwnlbi11cwrwc3 rhawqdytqw.jpeg?w=320

[mexpurs21]

Right now Manu tbh

[justinandimcool]

safe answer, Kawhi

who do I trust in a big game? Jack, with Kawhi a close 5th, Neal a close 6th.

if we can get Celtics/Wizards game Splitter every night, he wins this easily.

[Malik Hairston]

Splitter is the 4th best from a peak perspective IMO..when he's playing a tough brand of basketball, he provides an elite pick and roll game with solid defense..

Kawhi is the 4th best overall, though..his all-around game is solid, although he is also inconsistent..

[HI-FI]

good discussion...

I went with my nig Kawhi. I really debated Neal, just because his shooting can be lights out and often.

I went with Kawhi though because he has a presence that I feel like we are only scratching the surface of. Even when his shooting is off (as it has this season) he seems to come up with big steals or rebounds. Damn I hope his knees are totally healed up and good to g.o.

[Russo21]

Diaw could be. Diaw should be. But he's too soft, too much of a pansy. So you can say Jackson, Leonard, Green or Splitter and not be wrong. It's a pretty good problem to have when the roster is so deep and talented that we can't agree on who the 4th best/4th most important player is.

[ElNono]

Why isn't Tony one of the choices?

tbh, it says 4th best player on the team, not 6th...

[ElNono]

IMO, Jack... Leonard and/or Splitter can surpass him, but they're both in the "potential" category, as HH points out.

[spurraider21]

As much as I REALLY want the answer to be Kawhi, he hasn't proven it just yet. It's between Diaw, Splitter, and Jax. Jax is the most consistent of the three. He's got a good outside shot and I love when he gets to the rim and uses his length to finish. Also plays solid defense and is a willing passer.

For those saying Kawhi, who would you rather have on the court in a close game with 5 minutes left...

[TDMVPDPOY]

no option to vote parker? gtfo

[timtonymanu]

As much as I REALLY want the answer to be Kawhi, he hasn't proven it just yet. It's between Diaw, Splitter, and Jax. Jax is the most consistent of the three. He's got a good outside shot and I love when he gets to the rim and uses his length to finish. Also plays solid defense and is a willing passer.

For those saying Kawhi, who would you rather have on the court in a close game with 5 minutes left...

Diaw isn't even close. He plays too passive most of the time. Splitter is hit or miss, but when he's on, he's easily the 4th best player on the team. That stretch at the beginning of last season was the best of Splitter I've seen.

With 5 minutes left, I want Neal on the floor. His ability to take over games should put him up there. Same with Jack. But based on talent alone, Kawhi is #4. He was one of the few consistent role players in the playoffs last season for us.

[100%duncan]

To all who said, Manu, just..... fuck you.

[DapDaGenius]

Kawhi....although I'd rather put him as 3rd. But of course Kawhi is going to get the most votes, he is this teams baby.

[therealtruth]

The problem is consistency. On the one hand it can seem good. The defense never knows who will step up. But on the other hand it can be bad if no one decides to step up. In all reality even 1-3 needs to be more consistent.

[jestersmash]

The problem is consistency. On the one hand it can seem good. The defense never knows who will step up. But on the other hand it can be bad if no one decides to step up. In all reality even 1-3 needs to be more consistent.

Tim has been the model of consistency this season.

Tony started off slow and passive, but he's been consistently superb for the last handful of games.

Manu's the only one of the Big 3 who's been wildly inconsistent, tbh. 6-9 from 3 point land one night, 1-7 the next. He'll attack the basket relentlessly one game and hover too much around the perimeter with minimal effective penetration another.

He'll be a fiend on defense with 6 steals and 2 blocks, but only when he's shooting poorly from the field and he feels he needs to "make up" for his poor offensive performance by turning it up on the defensive end.

His free throw shooting has been unusually inconsistent (for Manu, at least). When Manu's feeling confident, he has the potential to be an 85-90% free throw shooter in any given season.

He's been around 87-90% for the past 6 seasons at the free throw line. He's at 78.7% this season so far.

[romain.star]

1. TD/TP
3. KL/Manu
5. Splitter/Diaw
7. Jax
8. Green

[spurraider21]

Diaw isn't even close. He plays too passive most of the time. Splitter is hit or miss, but when he's on, he's easily the 4th best player on the team. That stretch at the beginning of last season was the best of Splitter I've seen.

With 5 minutes left, I want Neal on the floor. His ability to take over games should put him up there. Same with Jack. But based on talent alone, Kawhi is #4. He was one of the few consistent role players in the playoffs last season for us.

Yeah Diaw is on the bottom of the list of players I mentioned. I do like his versatility. He guards Gasol against the Lakers, and did a solid job against LeBron against Miami.

[minuzzo21]

Leonard..Potentially he can become the best defensive player of the league..

[temujin]

Jack.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Right now Jax - he adds the toughness, grit, streak shooting and in-your-face D that can swing a game, and he changes the complexion of this team which can sometimes get a bit soft.

Leonard is the better player, and his potential is huge, but Jax is the 4th guy that most regularly swings games our way at this point.

Good bloody question though - on a given night it could be any of the guys in the poll.

[Drz]

I give this to Tiago. It's a mildly frustrating choice because talent-wise he isn't as good as the others, but from a pure value perspective, he's easily the most efficient player and blows away the others offensively (even relative to his position). And his defense ain't bad either.

A 7-foot tall Kawhi Leonard would be slightly superior. In the same way Scarlett Johansson is slightly superior to Sarah Jessica Parker.

[Captivus]

Neal. There are moments in game that it seems he is the only one who can score, specially with the 2nd unit. And his 3point shooting with 20 seconds in the clock are amazing, its like he stabs the other team every time he scores that way. PAM!!!

[silverblackfan]

I think Leonard will be the 4th best, probably by the end of the year, but right now it is Jackson, Diaw, or Splitter. I went with Diaw, the underdog, for his BB IQ and how well he gets the entire team going when he is on the floor. Could be more aggressive, but is damn valuable plug in most positions.

[elemento]

In terms of talent it's Diaw. Too bad he is way too passive. In terms of actual production it's Kawhi. He has the 2nd biggest defensive impact on the team after Timmy and even though he is struggling a bit with his shot this season he is still damn efficient.

[Brazil]

1. tim
2. tp
3. leonard
4. splitter
5. manu
6. jax

when healthy and it happens sometimes

1. tim
2. tp
3. manu
4. leonard
5. splitter
6. jax

[JRHernandez88]

RS: Kawhi

Lots of energy on Defense, minimal mistakes, takes good shots for the most part.




Playoff atmosphere: Jack

You can call his number to D up anyone besides a quick guard & we already know what he does to pressure...

[Gagnrath]

I give this to Tiago. It's a mildly frustrating choice because talent-wise he isn't as good as the others, but from a pure value perspective, he's easily the most efficient player and blows away the others offensively (even relative to his position). And his defense ain't bad either.

A 7-foot tall Kawhi Leonard would be slightly superior. In the same way Scarlett Johansson is slightly superior to Sarah Jessica Parker.


DRZ what have you been smoking Scarlett is superior in every conceivable way to the horse from Nelsonville. She was somewhat acceptable as a child in an educational show in 3-2-1 contact, and maybe Footloose was a decent '80s chickflik she didn't ruin in a supporting role but other than that she has essentially played a herself as a snobbish narcissistic social climber/socialite with hints of self doubt/loathing who has a decent body, but isn't nearly as pretty as she thinks she is but no one is quite rude or mean enough to tell her.


Neal. There are moments in game that it seems he is the only one who can score, specially with the 2nd unit. And his 3point shooting with 20 seconds in the clock are amazing, its like he stabs the other team every time he scores that way. PAM!!!

[Gagnrath]

not sure how captivus got quoted on my previous reply.

As for 4th best I am torn between a potential and a talent standpoint.

From a talent stand point I think that currently that is Diaw, though he plays no where close to his potential.

From a Potential standpoint it is very close between Splitter and Leonard. I am going to give the nod to Leonard thoug his offense is currently very raw and his defense still needs some polishing.

[Paranoid Pop]

In terms of talent it's Diaw. Too bad he is way too passive. In terms of actual production it's Kawhi. He has the 2nd biggest defensive impact on the team after Timmy and even though he is struggling a bit with his shot this season he is still damn efficient.

I agree, voted Boris but could as well have gone for KY. Boris can pass the ball as well as Manu, shoot as well as anybody on the team, defend multiple positions, he can do everything great except maybe rebound in his current shape. I think he's the 4th best and I think it's up to Pop to use him in the best way. Making him a shooter at the 3 is brilliant imo. I think Sjax should play PF and Boris SF, or better get another PF, play both of them SF and play KY SG.

[Gagnrath]

I agree, voted Boris but could as well have gone for KY. Boris can pass the ball as well as Manu, shoot as well as anybody on the team, defend multiple positions, he can do everything great except maybe rebound in his current shape. I think he's the 4th best and I think it's up to Pop to use him in the best way. Making him a shooter at the 3 is brilliant imo. I think Sjax should play PF and Boris SF, or better get another PF, play both of them SF and play KY SG.

3 questions, If the other team has a faster SF, and Diaw is in the shape he has been for the last 4/5 years can he keep up for more than about 1/4 a game on defense and still be halfway effective on offense? How does playing Diaw at SF help with developing Kawhi Leonard, or the logjam at SG? Finally and most importantly how does Pop get Diaw to be aggressive and self confident?

[Paranoid Pop]

3 questions, If the other team has a faster SF, and Diaw is in the shape he has been for the last 4/5 years can he keep up for more than about 1/4 a game on defense and still be halfway effective on offense? How does playing Diaw at SF help with developing Kawhi Leonard, or the logjam at SG? Finally and most importantly how does Pop get Diaw to be aggressive and self confident?

What logjam at SG, if Green can start at SG then we have plenty of room for improvement at the position imo. I like Kahwi defending SGs better anyway, Lebron, Durant and maybe even Carmelo are too big for him imo, he looks much better defending someone like Kobe. Besides SJax's expiring contract may be traded, but yes Boris is a tad slow, wish they could send him roid 15 days in Germany or something tbh. The big Jazz lineup was dynamite last year, I think Boris at SF could be a real game changer.

[Boomersgold]

As of right now (in terms of how useful the player is when he's on the court)
1. Tim Duncan
2. Tony Parker
3. Kawhi Leonard
4. Tiago Splitter
5. Manu Ginobili

[G-Dawgg]

I think Jackson at this point is the 4th best player overall on the team. Kawhi is good, but isn't really proven. I think Neal is easily a better scorer than Jackson or Kawhi.

[mookie2001]

Is broke down south American guard having a good season? I wasn't aware

[baseline bum]

Probably Ginobili

[spurs10]

If it's all on the line...Jack.

[TD 21]

Splitter is the 4th best from a peak perspective IMO..when he's playing a tough brand of basketball, he provides an elite pick and roll game with solid defense..

Kawhi is the 4th best overall, though..his all-around game is solid, although he is also inconsistent..

This.

[TMTTRIO]

at this point, Manu's not even in he top five. I would say Diaw or at least until SJax gets back.

[Gagnrath]

What logjam at SG, if Green can start at SG then we have plenty of room for improvement at the position imo. I like Kahwi defending SGs better anyway, Lebron, Durant and maybe even Carmelo are too big for him imo, he looks much better defending someone like Kobe. Besides SJax's expiring contract may be traded, but yes Boris is a tad slow, wish they could send him roid 15 days in Germany or something tbh. The big Jazz lineup was dynamite last year, I think Boris at SF could be a real game changer.


At Shooting Guard the spurs have Manu, Green, Neal, and to some extent Leonard, De Colo, and Mills. In total 6 players who would all be reasonably competing for minutes in one slot. Admittedly due to size and speed issues Mills and Leonard are playing somewhat out of position. What other position on the Spurs has more players who can conceivably fill it?

[SCdac]

I wish I could say Splitter without hesitation.

Ideally, the Spurs would be great(er) if Splitter was a 16-18 ppg player - like his per-36 minutes per game averages are.

But, he doesn't play 36 minutes a game nor does he score that much...

So I have to go with Kawhi.

[timvp]

Tough call if you're judging just on this season. Kawhi has missed a lot of games and he originally hurt his knee in the third game of the season ... so there's not a whole lot to go on with him. But if the Spurs are going to have a successful run in the playoffs, the answer has to be Kawhi. He fits a role next to the Big 3 that is desperately needed. If he can rebound, play D and score ~16 points per 40 minutes, that'd make him the fourth best player on the team.

If we're just talking about this season to date, Green has to be in the discussion. I know no one wants to admit he could be that high but he has played so many minutes that he can't help to but up there depending on how you judge "best".

Splitter definitely has the potential to be the fourth best. However, he'd have to start playing on a consistent level plus get more minutes. He can only control half of that equation, tbh.

Diaw has a case if we're talking straight up talent ........ but he's never going to maximize his talent due to his passiveness so that is only a theoretically observation.

I love what Jack brings to the team but I don't see the argument of him being the team's fourth best player. He doesn't really have a big enough role on either end to qualify. I think he's a very good role player and a vital piece to the puzzle ... but fourth best player on the team? If that's true, the Spurs are in trouble.

Neal? No, not enough dimensions to his game. That said, he's the only player outside of the Big Three that can somewhat consistently create for himself ... which definitely has some value.

[HI-FI]

Tough call if you're judging just on this season. Kawhi has missed a lot of games and he originally hurt his knee in the third game of the season ... so there's not a whole lot to go on with him.

i've been wondering where it started. did Kawhi land awkwardly or is that where the problems first started and didn't go away because of all the games? I've never heard a definitive reason on why the tendonitis occurred.

[ffadicted]

Should be Leonard, but Neal's god mode he goes on sometimes makes a strong case for him.
Still voted Leonard though

[Juanobili]

Tough call if you're judging just on this season. Kawhi has missed a lot of games and he originally hurt his knee in the third game of the season ... so there's not a whole lot to go on with him. But if the Spurs are going to have a successful run in the playoffs, the answer has to be Kawhi. He fits a role next to the Big 3 that is desperately needed. If he can rebound, play D and score ~16 points per 40 minutes, that'd make him the fourth best player on the team.

If we're just talking about this season to date, Green has to be in the discussion. I know no one wants to admit he could be that high but he has played so many minutes that he can't help to but up there depending on how you judge "best".

Splitter definitely has the potential to be the fourth best. However, he'd have to start playing on a consistent level plus get more minutes. He can only control half of that equation, tbh.

Diaw has a case if we're talking straight up talent ........ but he's never going to maximize his talent due to his passiveness so that is only a theoretically observation.

I love what Jack brings to the team but I don't see the argument of him being the team's fourth best player. He doesn't really have a big enough role on either end to qualify. I think he's a very good role player and a vital piece to the puzzle ... but fourth best player on the team? If that's true, the Spurs are in trouble.

Neal? No, not enough dimensions to his game. That said, he's the only player outside of the Big Three that can somewhat consistently create for himself ... which definitely has some value.

I was one of the few to vote for Green. Glad to know timvp and I are on the same page lol

[TrainOfThought5]

If Green is our fourth best player we are in DEEP. DEEP. DEEP trouble. streaky shooting and Decent D wont save this team. streaky shooting and decent D that disappears in the throes of tough playoff moments? sounds like a certain red headed Canadian

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

The real answer here is that it's a false proposition - the 4th best player on the team changes from night to night amongst the guys in the poll, there is no one clear answer. This is an apt illustration of why depth is valuable. :hat

First rule of analysis - examine the framing of the question, and if it's no good, reject it. ;)

[Stabula]

Ginobili for sure.

[spursfan1000]

Captain jack is my vote,leonard is just too incosistant for it to be him. Jack being clutch also dosen't hurt!

[Brunodf]

Right now :
1- Timmy
2-Tony
3-Manu
4-Kawhi
5-Splitter