Abaka jumpers

[ElNono]

Are they sustainable, tbh? When you have KD on your team, I guess any long jumper Abaka takes is a shot the opposing team wants.

tbh, the next time he makes 3 in a row I'm gonna burn my TV set...

[Paranoid Pop]

Tiago was too slow to contest most of them.

[Mugen]

Over a 4-5 game stretch, yes and he buried the spurs. Over a 8-10 game stretch, no and they got buried by Miami.

[spurs1990]

If Obaka hits those again in another playoff series then the Spurs oughta shake hands and walk away. That's just being the better basketball player tbh.

[SpursRock20]

He's not a bad jump shooter, I don't know why a lot of us are so confused he's draining them when he is wide open.

[racm]

Doesn't he shoot more than 50% on long twos?

[thunderfan]

Ive said it 3 times today and I'll say it again. Ibaka is top 20 in the entire league in volume of shots from 16-23 feet and of those top 20 volume shooters, he's #2 in FG percentage. Basically, he's about as good as there is from this range. This is not a fluke. He does it game after game after game after game. Yes they are assisted, set shots for the most part. A result of defensive attention on KD and Westbrooks penetration and increasing desire to share the ball. I think there's a certain percentage of fans that still do not realize how good of a shooter is. They see him do it one game and think it's a fluke. He does it night in and night out.

[racm]

Ive said it 3 times today and I'll say it again. Ibaka is top 20 in the entire league in volume of shots from 16-23 feet and of those top 20 volume shooters, he's #2 in FG percentage. Basically, he's about as good as there is from this range. This is not a fluke. He does it game after game after game after game. Yes they are assisted, set shots for the most part. A result of defensive attention on KD and Westbrooks penetration and increasing desire to share the ball. I think there's a certain percentage of fans that still do not realize how good of a shooter is. They see him do it one game and think it's a fluke. He does it night in and night out.

If he can extend that range all the way to the 3 point line, then NBA = f:lolcked

[TheSkeptic]

Over a 4-5 game stretch, yes and he buried the spurs. Over a 8-10 game stretch, no and they got buried by Miami.

Miami was also playing much better perimeter defense than the Spurs were/are though. I'm wondering if Pop might have to consider having a wing come out on him like with Jax--> Dirk. If they can somehow disrupt Ibaka to the point where he either has to shoot from long distance or put the ball on the floor, the Spurs will be able to solve at least one of their defensive problems against the Thunder.

[thunderfan]

If he can extend that range all the way to the 3 point line, then NBA = f:lolcked
Don't see it happening honestly. Not in this offense. He will occassionally take a corner 3 but he's not shooting many and not hitting many either.

[Mugen]

Miami was also playing much better perimeter defense than the Spurs were/are though. I'm wondering if Pop might have to consider having a wing come out on him like with Jax--> Dirk. If they can somehow disrupt Ibaka to the point where he either has to shoot from long distance or put the ball on the floor, the Spurs will be able to solve at least one of their defensive problems against the Thunder.

Putting Jax on Serge is only a viable option if the Thunder stay big with Perk/Ibaka. Once the Thunder go small with KD at the 4, the Spurs literally have no way of guarding the pick n pop with Serge. Tim doesn't have the mobility to help on Westbrook/durant while still getting back to contest Ibaka regularly.

A Spurs/OKC series hinges on Ibaka hitting that jumper, ever more so now with Harden gone. Last season, he couldn't miss and there was literally nothing Pop could do to counter. The same holds true for this season I'm afraid but we'll see.

[Splits]

In the two Spurs wins in last year's playoffs, Abaka shot 4/14.
In the four Spurs losses, Abaka shot 24/34

[timvp]

Abaka shoots from that range about as well as Duncan. So, yeah, he's going to knock down his share. But shooting 80% or whatever he's shooting against the Spurs as of late on jumpers is fluke-ish. The Spurs can survive if he's knocking down those shots at 45-50%. It's when he starts off 5-for-5 or 6-for-6 on jumpers is when it becomes difficult to deal with.

[spurs1990]

Really is a complete team. Will be interesting to see if they can get to 70.

[racm]

Abaka shoots from that range about as well as Duncan. So, yeah, he's going to knock down his share. But shooting 80% or whatever he's shooting against the Spurs as of late on jumpers is fluke-ish. The Spurs can survive if he's knocking down those shots at 45-50%. It's when he starts off 5-for-5 or 6-for-6 on jumpers is when it becomes difficult to deal with.

The Spurs still left him wide open and he made them pay. SMH

[spursparker9]

Thunders are also blessed with no injuries.

[TheSkeptic]

Putting Jax on Serge is only a viable option if the Thunder stay big with Perk/Ibaka. Once the Thunder go small with KD at the 4, the Spurs literally have no way of guarding the pick n pop with Serge. Tim doesn't have the mobility to help on Westbrook/durant while still getting back to contest Ibaka regularly.

A Spurs/OKC series hinges on Ibaka hitting that jumper, ever more so now with Harden gone. Last season, he couldn't miss and there was literally nothing Pop could do to counter. The same holds true for this season I'm afraid but we'll see.

I may be misremembering but I do vaguely recall a very specific type of zone defense that could be used to counter that somewhat if the Spurs opted to stay big when OKC went small but I don't remember exactly what it's called. Basically the final effect of that particular zone was that it mitigated serious speed disadvantages, forced people out on the perimeter (no duh), and also made it easy for a team to utilize its size by crashing the boards (obviously because the bigs were still in).

Back when the Raptors had Jermaine O'Neal, they used it a few times when they ran line-ups that included Jermaine O'Neal, Chris Bosh, and Andrea Bargnani. Of course except for a few possessions, the Raptors would usually fail to execute it properly but in theory something like that might be Pop's best shot when the Thunder go small. The one thing I remember is that it was kinda complicated for players to learn on the fly. I'm sure guys like TD and Manu would be able to pick it up waaaaaay faster though.

Take it with a grain of salt because I'm probably remembering this wrong.

[Mugen]

I may be misremembering but I do vaguely recall a very specific type of zone defense that could be used to counter that somewhat if the Spurs opted to stay big when OKC went small but I don't remember exactly what it's called. Basically the final effect of that particular zone was that it mitigated serious speed disadvantages, forced people out on the perimeter (no duh), and also made it easy for a team to utilize its size by crashing the boards (obviously because the bigs were still in).

Back when the Raptors had Jermaine O'Neal, they used it a few times when they ran line-ups that included Jermaine O'Neal, Chris Bosh, and Andrea Bargnani. Of course except for a few possessions, the Raptors would usually fail to execute it properly but in theory something like that might be Pop's best shot when the Thunder go small. The one thing I remember is that it was kinda complicated for players to learn on the fly. I'm sure guys like TD and Manu would be able to pick it up waaaaaay faster though.

Take it with a grain of salt because I'm probably remembering this wrong.

Pop tinkered with a zone after Dallas rang but it just never really panned out. Zone would be tough against OKC as they have Westbrook who can penetrate and break down the D plus the Spurs would get murdered in the rebounding department as you alluded to. They can have one of the wings help on Serge but i doubt TP/Manu are gonna bother him much plus you leave Kmart/Thabo/Durant open from outside.

[JRHernandez88]

He had a monster game, have to give him his props. 20/17??

[TheSkeptic]

Pop tinkered with a zone after Dallas rang but it just never really panned out. Zone would be tough against OKC as they have Westbrook who can penetrate and break down the D plus the Spurs would get murdered in the rebounding department as you alluded to. They can have one of the wings help on Serge but i doubt TP/Manu are gonna bother him much plus you leave Kmart/Thabo/Durant open from outside.

I've never seen Pop run the type of zone I'm talking about -and he doesn't seem to run very much zone anyway. It had a very distinct name. My Google skills are non-existent but I'll see if I can find something...

Note: Still can't find the specific one. I have a memory of reading about how it was used most often in International ball but I guess I was dreaming. Lol. That said, a match-up zone that includes sending a wing out to deal with Ibaka where necessary isn't that bad of an idea. Odds are Westbrook may end up being a problem but he can at least be goaded into taking dumb shots on the perimeter. OKC is a favourite against the Spurs so at the very least it can't hurt to experiment with different ideas and then play it by ear. It would require some creativity though because the idea would be to force Ibaka out of where he's comfortable while giving up contested mid-range 2s against their actual shooters.

Seems like it would take faster perimeter players than the Spurs have though...I'll let Pop worry about it to be honest because Thabo on TP is another issue that needs to be addressed.

[FkLA]

Burning your TV set will NOT make Abaka miss any jumpers. Just stop it. It makes you look stupid as a poster and as a person.

[lefty]

He's not a bad jump shooter, I don't know why a lot of us are so confused he's draining them when he is wide open.

This

" Fluke jumpers "

Lol butthurt Spurs fan

[ElNono]

Burning your TV set will NOT make Abaka miss any jumpers. Just stop it. It makes you look stupid as a poster and as a person.

http://i46.tinypic.com/dekzlw.png

:lol:lol:lol

[FkLA]

You didnt own me, bro. But regardless that wasnt a serious shot at you, I was mocking another poster with that post tbh.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194237

[ElNono]

You didnt own me, bro. But regardless that wasnt a serious shot at you, I was mocking another poster with that post tbh.

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194237

I thought this was going to be another 30 page back and forth, but I'm glad it isn't coz I have to take a flight in 5 hours or so, tbh...

[HI-FI]

I thought this was going to be another 30 page back and forth, but I'm glad it isn't coz I have to take a flight in 5 hours or so, tbh...
it's probably best you guys don't go at it, ST can't survive 5+ pages of shemale porn again.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

Spurs barely guard Ibaka on jumpers, it's so frustrating. They do the same thing against Rondo.

Ibaka will continue to go off on the Spurs if they continue to give him so much space. Even Kevin Perkins looks like a competent offensive player against the Spurs

[ElNono]

it's probably best you guys don't go at it, ST can't survive 5+ pages of shemale porn again.

:lol sounds like it marked you for a lifetime, tbh

[FkLA]

it's probably best you guys don't go at it, ST can't survive 5+ pages of shemale porn again.

sup bro, who are you ?

[spurs10]

Well no one went off in Obaka's mouth apparently.....damn.

[crc21209]

Yeah watching this idiot drain open jumper after open jumper is frustrating as hell. But, he does seem to be pretty wide open for the most part every single time. The Spurs need to do a better job of sticking to this idiot. Just watch, next game he'll go 4/10 or something. He only seems to go into god mode against the Spurs...:td

[HI-FI]

sup bro, who are you ?
i'm no alternate account, i was a lurker who joined around the time of y'alls thread, so I'm still suffering PTSD.

[Floyd Pacquiao]

Jeff McDonald ‏@JMcDonald_SAEN (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN)
Tony Parker, on Ibaka's 7-for-7 start: "If Ibaka's going to knock down shots like that, there's nothing we can do."


Jeff McDonald ‏@JMcDonald_SAEN (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN)
Parker said, given OKC's arsenal, they'll take Ibaka shooting Js. "That's the shot we're going to give up."


Jeff McDonald ‏@JMcDonald_SAEN (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN)
More Parker: "We don't want Durant to have 40 or Westbrook going off. If Ibaka's going to have a game like that, we can't stop everything."

[spurs10]

Jeff McDonald ‏@JMcDonald_SAEN (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN)
Tony Parker, on Ibaka's 7-for-7 start: "If Ibaka's going to knock down shots like that, there's nothing we can do."


Jeff McDonald ‏@JMcDonald_SAEN (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN)
Parker said, given OKC's arsenal, they'll take Ibaka shooting Js. "That's the shot we're going to give up."


Jeff McDonald ‏@JMcDonald_SAEN (https://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN)
More Parker: "We don't want Durant to have 40 or Westbrook going off. If Ibaka's going to have a game like that, we can't stop everything."

Time to rethink this strategy ya think?

[FkLA]

i'm no alternate account, i was a lurker who joined around the time of y'alls thread, so I'm still suffering PTSD.

lols sorry bro

im probably done acting up on ST tho i was just going through a rebellious phase, the only guy i really still talk shit to is bene but im sure you can see why i do...the dude is probably the dumbest yet also pompous person on this site tbh. just a complete imbecile imo.

[Fireball]

Time to rethink this strategy ya think?

Tiago was always helping out on Durant or Westbrook ... then he was late to get back to Ibaka. If the strategy was to contain the first two, then it worked - overall it did not. If somebody is shooting that hot from distance one might realy change the strategy and see if Durant is that hot as well, i.e. not helping out.

[Kuestmaster]

I like how now we are calling him Abaka thanks to sjax :lol

[Slippy]

Parker said, given OKC's arsenal, they'll take Ibaka shooting Js. "That's the shot we're going to give up."

It was obvious Spurs were making it priority to stop Durant on the drive when running the P'n'R.

When Kawai gets back i hope spurs mix it up by switching off Durant onto Ibaka.

[Slippy]

Tiago was always helping out on Durant or Westbrook ... then he was late to get back to Ibaka. If the strategy was to contain the first two, then it worked - overall it did not. If somebody is shooting that hot from distance one might realy change the strategy and see if Durant is that hot as well, i.e. not helping out.

I tend to agree there but in this case helping out had to happen. Danny Green was getting beat easily and when theré's screen look-out. Green doesn't every try to fight through them like a jackson or a Manu.

[thunderfan]

Yeah watching this idiot drain open jumper after open jumper is frustrating as hell. But, he does seem to be pretty wide open for the most part every single time. The Spurs need to do a better job of sticking to this idiot. Just watch, next game he'll go 4/10 or something. He only seems to go into god mode against the Spurs...:td

Idiot??? Yeah..he speaks 5 languages.

[therealtruth]

Time to rethink this strategy ya think?

Exactly. You don't give open shots to a good shooter. I can understand if he wasn't a good shooter. Durant can't beat you by himself but letting Durant, Westbrook, and Ibaka get 20+ is a formula for losing.

[exstatic]

He's not a bad jump shooter, I don't know why a lot of us are so confused he's draining them when he is wide open.

"Not a bad jump shooter" means 45% on long twos. What he's done to us is freakish.

[will_spurs]

There's shooting % and shooting %. It's to be expected that a wide open, unpressured shooter will score a lot more often. Even Parker can hit a corner 3 when he gets 3 seconds to aim and everybody gives him 30ft of space.

[exstatic]

There's shooting % and shooting %. It's to be expected that a wide open, unpressured shooter will score a lot more often. Even Parker can hit a corner 3 when he gets 3 seconds to aim and everybody gives him 30ft of space.

Those averages include ALL shooting opportunities, covered and uncovered.

[will_spurs]

Those averages include ALL shooting opportunities, covered and uncovered.

Exactly my point. Ibaka wide open with no pressure is probably a 65% shooter. Therefore what he is doing to the Spurs is not freakish, it's to be expected. There are players a team can leave wide open and he won't make them pay, but Ibaka isn't one of them.

[rascal]

The Spurs are relying too much on older, slower players and will get destroyed in the playoffs by a younger more athletic team. The Spurs will rack up enough regular season wins to have a top seed only to give their fans false hope for a title but will flame out again in the playoffs. They brought back the same team as last year so don't expect anything more then how far the spurs got last year.

[Seventyniner]

It's a good idea to adjust to Ebaka jumpers, but the time to do it is early in a playoff series imo. Start closing out hard on and denying Ebaka on the perimeter and the Thunder would have to adjust in-game. Don't play all your cards during the regular season.

[024]

It was hilarious last season watching spurs fans' disbelief in Ibaka's "flukey" jump shot. :lol Ibaka has always had that shot, nothing flukey about it. Maybe the spurs should just play better defense.

[UZER]

If Pop really has a counter to what the thunder do to Parker and the ibaka jumper issue, and he's waiting to use it in the playoffs, then props for the strategy......but I highly doubt it. Pop does what Pop does.

[ManuTastic]

It's "Ibaka" with an "I" same as last year, according to the roster listing on espn.com. Has he changed the spelling?

[therealtruth]

Actually I remember Kenny Smith saying one time that good jump shooters can hit 80% of unguarded jumpers. It makes sense. Good free throw shooters can hit 80+%. If you're allowing a guy to catch the ball in rhythm and unguarded he's going to hit a much higher percentage than his season average.

[Seventyniner]

It's "Ibaka" with an "I" same as last year, according to the roster listing on espn.com. Has he changed the spelling?

We're just waiting for someone to call him Ubaka to complete the quintfecta.

[will_spurs]

It's "Ibaka" with an "I" same as last year, according to the roster listing on espn.com. Has he changed the spelling?

Search Abaka + Jackson on Google...

[Man In Black]

Didn't know if anyone saw this but I wonder if Ibaka's game has improved from last season.

Also, it would be cool if they did this for the Spurs.


http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2012/06/11/sports/basketball/nba-shot-analysis.html

[Sean Cagney]

The Spurs are relying too much on older, slower players and will get destroyed in the playoffs by a younger more athletic team. The Spurs will rack up enough regular season wins to have a top seed only to give their fans false hope for a title but will flame out again in the playoffs. They brought back the same team as last year so don't expect anything more then how far the spurs got last year.

Sadly it will probably turn out that way again. I would hope for different but you are right.

[daslicer]

The problem with Ibacka is that its all mental. I was watching a halftime special on the thunder network during the game in which he said on the special that when he plays the spurs that he feels like he's Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant. He will always play great against the spurs because he has extreme confidence. The spurs have to find away to destroy his confidence obviously that won't be easy.

[boutons_deux]

Search Abaka + Jackson on Google...

The jersey he wore in the Wolves game said "Ibaka". Maybe he has several jerseys with different spellings? :lol

[RD2191]

he's open most of the time he knocks them down, we need larry sanders so he can play him tough and maybe block some of his shots, that will mess with this head

[Dex]

I remember after Ibaka went 11-11 or whatever during last year's Game 5, an article came out with quotes from the OKC coaching staff that Ibaka can hit that mid-range jumper about as well as Durant can, and that he's even won mid-range shooting contests against Durant.

I know the primary focus playing OKC is Durant first, Westbrook second...but Ibaka has now proven twice that he is a threat that is worth paying attention to from that distance. I was okay with blowing it off the first time it happened, cool, whatever, shame on them...but after the second, shame on us....Spurs need to do something to figure that out.

[RD2191]

we have no one that can guard him, if timmy leaves his spot we have no interior defense and tiago isnt exactly a defensive force

[therealtruth]

I remember after Ibaka went 11-11 or whatever during last year's Game 5, an article came out with quotes from the OKC coaching staff that Ibaka can hit that mid-range jumper about as well as Durant can, and that he's even won mid-range shooting contests against Durant.

I know the primary focus playing OKC is Durant first, Westbrook second...but Ibaka has now proven twice that he is a threat that is worth paying attention to from that distance. I was okay with blowing it off the first time it happened, cool, whatever, shame on them...but after the second, shame on us....Spurs need to do something to figure that out.

That's the problem with relying too much on analytics. You can throw all the stats out once someone gets in a good rhythm or zone. In fact contesting shots doesn't matter that much at that point. The best way to avoid is to never let guys get a good rhythm. Basketball's a game of rhythm. You try to establish a good rhythm for your offense and making shots. You also try to prevent the other team from getting a good rhythm by being disruptive on defense. Till the Spurs apply that out they will keep loosing games where they think guys are making more shots than they think they should.