Will Manu go down as the most popular spur ever?

[shyne]

I believe he already has

[SequSpur]

Iceman's bitch forum

[smeagol]

I believe he already has
U cannot be serious.

[danyel]

hmmm.....DRob?

[ZStomp]

Is this a serious thread?

[word]

I believe he already has

The Spurs will always be The Admirals team ...like the Lakers are Jerry Wests team..like the Celtics are Bill Russels team...like the Bulls are Jordans team...
and on and on....pick your franchise. Malone and Utah...Barkley and Phoenix...Hakeem and Houston...Dr. J and Philly...Isiah Thomas and the Pistons...Walten and the Trailblazers...

I could go through 'em all...

That would be a good thread, actually. What player do you associate with a team over its history ?

Does that answer your question...?

[shyne]

D Rob will always be San Antonio's favorite son and will forever be loved, but Manu is the most popular because of the style he plays and he flat out wins. I will bet anyone on this forum that when Manus career is over poll the city and it might not even be close.

[spurschick]

Maybe ONE of the most popular Spurs, but not THE most popular.

[midgetonadonkey]

The Spurs will always be The Admirals team ...like the Lakers are Jerry Wests team..like the Celtics are Bill Russels team...like the Bulls are Jordans team...

Does that answer your question...?

Word!

[milkyway21]

I believe he already has:vomit :vomit :vomit :vomit

Please!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ENOUGH! :cuss

[shyne]

I know you guys are loyal to Big Dave and so am I, but what i'm saying isnt out of the ordinary. Dave will always be Mr. Spur, but most "popular" will be Manu when his career is over especially he keeps playing the way he has been.

[milkyway21]

I know you guys are loyal to Big Dave and so am I, but what i'm saying isnt out of the ordinary. Dave will always be Mr. Spur, but most "popular" will be Manu when his career is over especially he keeps playing the way he has been.let's just wait for the 2006 All-Star voting, shall we?

for the meantime.......... :stfu

[shyne]

WTF does the 2006 All-Star voting have to do with the people of San Antonio dumbass?

[Kori Ellis]

How could you ever measure something like that?

For example, at the AlamoDome celebration, Duncan got the most applause? So is he the most popular?

It's a weird thread.

[shyne]

There were 3 ladies sitting in front of me at the alamodome celebration and when Manu started speaking to the crowd in spanish the bursted out in tears in all my years as a spurs fan I have never seen that with any athlete.

[milkyway21]

WTF does the 2006 All-Star voting have to do with the people of San Antonio dumbass?let's see if he can beat Duncan in the number of votes, dumbass :cuss

[shyne]

Once again idiot i'm just talking about San Antonio, i'm not saying he is better than TD or 50 but he will be more popular with the people of SA once his career is over.

[word]

Yeah but....I think what he's saying is the # of votes in the all star voting is nationwide. You asked who was the most popular Spur so taking into account history and David Robinson can't GET a vote since .....


Ahh never mind....

I believe the question was 'most popular Spur EVER' and the all star voting doesn't take that into account much less the most popular player among the residents of SA.

Engrish rangruage most tricky...

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

That's quite an interesting thread, but really an impossible one to answer. On the one Manu can appeal the Spanish speaking population in a way that no Spur ever could, but I think that Manu is still looked at as an Argentine playing in SA. DRob is thought of practically as a native son. Hell, I don't even really remember where Robinson is originally from.

[word]

How could you ever measure something like that?

For example, at the AlamoDome celebration, Duncan got the most applause? So is he the most popular?

It's a weird thread.

20 years from now who will turn the SBC inside out with applause ?

David Robinson...as long as he's alive. He put the Spurs on the map and set the tone for the Spurs rep that they have today. Spurs are still the only X-ABA team to win 'A' title, much less three.

PERIOD !!!! End of STORY....

Thread OVER.

[shyne]

You guys all have your opinions and I have mine didnt mean to get all your panties in a wad. Once again though I believe David Robinson is the San Antonio Spurs, we wouldnt be here without him. I also believe Tim Duncan is the greatest player in Spurs History. But Manu Ginobili will go down as the greatest fan favorite in Spurs history in my OPINION, the way he hustles, his flare, and fire for the game makes him very appealing to the people of SA. If he plays a bigger role in coming years and we win more championships in which I think we will this is a very good argument.

[milkyway21]

Will Manu go down as the most popular spur ever?

I believe he already hasi didn't see San Antonio here......

being popular is not only for the Spurs fans, or community but including fans around the NBA or the world. And one way of measuring that players' popularity is voting him in the All-Star game.

Who knows he could be the next Yao Ming? Maybe being him the most
"popular he already has",your qoute, he should beat any other Spur in he roster in the votation to the All-Star.

if he can beat Duncan then, we'll see if he is by more popular than David.

let's start from there. for the meantime :stfu

[shyne]

Thats not a fair argument ASG voting because they play different postions, just as Tim was making the ASG every year and Big Dave wasen't doesnt mean that he was popular than Dave just the competition at the positons were different.

[Boo]

milky way you dont get it...

What Shyne is trying to say is POPULARITY not SKILL smartass..

Of course TD will get more All-Star votes than Manu, simply because TD is better than Manu!

Popularity and Skill is diff... geez people

[Trainwreck2100]

no, DRob always.

[shyne]

that cool its your opinion and I'm not gonna bash you for it.

[Jelly]

people who cry over sports stars are not normal. Those women in front of you were probably a little imbalanced and have some kind of obsession problem. There will always be a few crazies who idolize certain celebs and break down in their presence. It's an unhealthy obsession and I wouldn't include those people when trying to guage the opinion of the masses.

Overall, your question is rather silly - not to mention WAY too premature. Manu's popularity has only been extremely high for a few months now. Geez, David Robinson was the most popular guy in San Antonio for almost a decade!!! No comparison at this point.

[shyne]

These ladies in front of me were older prolly in their sixties maybe even seventies. I think it was the fact the he was speaking spanish that did it, I don't think there has ever been a spur thats done that before and thats very appealing to the hispanic community in SA, and really shows respect.

[Jelly]

I know you guys are loyal to Big Dave and so am I, but what i'm saying isnt out of the ordinary. Dave will always be Mr. Spur, but most "popular" will be Manu when his career is over especially he keeps playing the way he has been.

Your seeing Manu through rose-colored glasses. He doesn't always play that great. He had a couple of really bad games in the finals if you remember.

[TOP-CHERRY]

So, y'all think after Timmy retires, this will still be "DRob's team"? Or will it become "Timmy's team"?

[TOP-CHERRY]

These ladies in front of me were older prolly in their sixties maybe even seventies. I think it was the fact the he was speaking spanish that did it, I don't think there has ever been a spur thats done that before and thats very appealing to the hispanic community in SA, and really shows respect.
Nobody cried when Bowen talked spanish at the Alamodome celebration. How dare they not??!!!

;)

[Sec24Row7]

Lets see...

The loudest moment in the finals up to game 7 at the SBC center was when David Robinson was announced with the NBA legends.

David IS the Spurs.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

I think Manu will be the Spur with the largest fan base by the time his career is over. Its a given, he has an advantage over people because he has the latin vote, much like Yao does.

[word]

Lets see...

The loudest moment in the finals up to game 7 at the SBC center was when David Robinson was announced with the NBA legends.

David IS the Spurs.

EOS

PS. Could Russell have walked ANY slower.... LOL !!!

[Jelly]

These ladies in front of me were older prolly in their sixties maybe even seventies. I think it was the fact the he was speaking spanish that did it, I don't think there has ever been a spur thats done that before and thats very appealing to the hispanic community in SA, and really shows respect.

Old ladies can just as easily develop unhealthy obsessions over attractive young sports stars. Crying like that over a famous person isn't normal and I really wouldn't include people like that if I were taking a survey on whose the most popular Spur. I don't think respect (from Manu or the fans) is really a factor, this type of reaction from fans is just irrational idol worship.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Old ladies can just as easily develop unhealthy obsessions over attractive young sports stars. Crying like that over a famous person isn't normal and I really wouldn't include people like that if I were taking a survey on whose the most popular Spur. I don't think respect (from Manu or the fans) is really a factor, this type of reaction from fans is just irrational idol worship.
You really think if you're judging a popularity contest, they wouldn't count the people that cry over their idols?? you're not being realistic.

[shyne]

they werent screaming hysterically or going crazy just weeping a little bit.

[word]

The point IS..what player is associated with a team and THAT is what will tell you who is most 'popular' I guess. Are the Celtics Larry Birds team ? Nope. Because there were others before him in Boston. Is LA Shaq's or Magics team ? Nope. There were others before them.

For the last goddamn time, this is David Robinsons team and will always be that no matter what is done, or not done, after that.


Jebus....hunnert years from now...it will still be the admirals team...

[shyne]

Then I guess its George Gervin's team huh? I think he was before D Rob. You can't base it on that.

[TOP-CHERRY]

You really think if you're judging a popularity contest, they wouldn't count the people that cry over their idols?? you're not being realistic.
I'm sure there are fans who cry that histerically over Ashlee Simpson. Does that make her popular?

;)

[TOP-CHERRY]

Jebus....hunnert years from now...it will still be the admirals team...
:lol

[Jelly]

they werent screaming hysterically or going crazy just weeping a little bit.

It's still crazy to weep over a celebrity.
I adore Manu, but the sight of him would never make me weep. Seriously, that's way over the top. These ladies basically have a fixation/crush on him and they have gotten very carried away.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

The point IS..what player is associated with a team and THAT is what will tell you who is most 'popular' I guess. Are the Celtics Larry Birds team ? Nope. Because there were others before him in Boston. Is LA Shaq's or Magics team ? Nope. There were others before them.

For the last goddamn time, this is David Robinsons team and will always be that no matter what is done, or not done, after that.


Jebus....hunnert years from now...it will still be the admirals team...
For whom? for bandwagon fans in Latin America this is already Manu's team. So you see, if we're talking popularity as in world wide fans, I'm sorry but Manu wins by a landslide; now if we're talking about popularity among knowledgeable Spurs fans then I'd say David as well, although Tim and Manu are right there.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

It's still crazy to weep over a celebrity.
I adore Manu, but the sight of him would never make me weep. Seriously, that's way over the top. These ladies basically have a fixation/crush on him and they have gotten very carried away.
they are still fans Jelly

[TOP-CHERRY]

For whom? for bandwagon fans in Latin America this is already Manu's team. So you see, if we're talking popularity as in world wide fans, I'm sorry but Manu wins by a landslide; now if we're talking about popularity among knowledgeable Spurs fans then I'd say David as well, although Tim and Manu are right there.
Since when does Argentina represent the whole world? I don't think many of you realize how many fans around the world the Spurs already had way before Manu came in.

Around the world, I would say there are FAR more David Robinson, Ice, and Tim Duncan fans than there are Manu fans (not counting Argentina, ofcourse)

Maybe in a couple of years, as Manu is exposed in the NBA stage a little more, he will have lots of fans, but TODAY I wouldn't say he has more fans around the globe than other Spurs players.

[Jelly]

For whom? for bandwagon fans in Latin America this is already Manu's team. So you see, if we're talking popularity as in world wide fans, I'm sorry but Manu wins by a landslide; now if we're talking about popularity among knowledgeable Spurs fans then I'd say David as well, although Tim and Manu are right there.

No. It seems to me that Manu's popularity in much of Latin America is completely separate from the Spurs. He is a famous, good looking sports star that represents Argentina and Latin America. There are probably legions of fans down there that love him and don't even know or care that he's a Spur.
If the question is interpreted (as I intrepreted it ) "who is the most popular among Spurs fans", it doesn't matter what people who are strictly Manu fans (and not Spurs fans) think.

[TOP-CHERRY]

^ Word.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Since when does Argentina represent the whole world? I don't think many of you realize how many fans around the world the Spurs already had way before Manu came in.

Around the world, I would say there are FAR more David Robinson, Ice, and Tim Duncan fans than there are Manu fans (not counting Argentina, ofcourse)

Maybe in a couple of years, as Manu is exposed in the NBA stage a little more, he will have lots of fans, but TODAY I wouldn't say he has more fans around the globe than other Spurs players.
You are out of your mind! There are definatly more Manu fans! I mean since when does Timmy have bandwagon fans!?? Tim's fans are people that actually know basketball and understand what he brings to the game. Tim is not a flashy player, and that is the reason why he doesn't appeal to most casual basketball fans. I know you like Tim and David and Ice, but lets be real, there hasn't been a Spurs player with this kind of global impact before.

[TOP-CHERRY]

there hasn't been a Spurs player with this kind of global impact before.
A Latin American impact, yes.
A worldwide impact, not at this time.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

No. It seems to me that Manu's popularity in much of Latin America is completely separate from the Spurs. He is a famous, good looking sports star that represents Argentina and Latin America. There are probably legions of fans down there that love him and don't even know or care that he's a Spur.
If the question is interpreted (as I intrepreted it ) "who is the most popular among Spurs fans", it doesn't matter what people who are strictly Manu fans (and not Spurs fans) think.
hence why I said bandwagon Spurs fans, and the question in this thread is the most popular Spurs player ever, doesn't say anything about among "real fans". Face it, Manu has more fans world wide than any Spur in history. Again I'm not saying "real Spur fans", I'm not saying he's the best Spur, just the one with most fans.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

A Latin American impact, yes.
A worldwide impact, not at this time.
Really?? which Spurs has more worldwide impact than Manu???

[TOP-CHERRY]

Really?? which Spurs has more worldwide impact than Manu???
Prove that Manu has more worldwide fans (EXCLUDING Latin American fans) than DRob, Ice, Timmy, etc. ever had.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Prove that Manu has more worldwide fans (EXCLUDING Latin American fans) than DRob, Ice, Timmy, etc. ever had.
Jesus christ! Its obvious!!! When DRob and Ice were playing the Spurs weren't even global!!! Why would international fans watch them?? Huh? I'm talking bandwagon fans!! NOT REAL FANS!!! The NBA has gone global only in the past few years, before then the only NBA players that actually had a bandwagon following outside the US were Jordan, Magic, Bird and maybe Barkley. I know DRob played during the same period as Jordan but Jordan was flashier than David and hence got a hell of a lot more fans. I really don't understand how it is that difficult to comprehend why Manu has more fans outside of the US than any other Spur in history.

[shyne]

You guys act like we are ripping Tim and Dave we are not. Manu is more popular cause hes fun to watch hes shown that on every level. Hes more global than Tim and Dave cause the world saw what he did to everyone at the Olympics.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

You guys act like we are ripping Tim and Dave we are not. Manu is more popular cause hes fun to watch hes shown that on every level. Hes more global than Tim and Dave cause the world saw what he did to everyone at the Olympics.
No, he's more popular because he appeals to more masses, and also because he's a bit more fun to watch than Tim and David. Not more effective or better, just more fun.

[TheTruth]

Considering the fact that Manu has been a star proffessionaly on three different continents, I think it is safe to say he is the most globally popular Spur. Dave will always be the man in S.A. though.

[Banks91]

Manu is the more popular at the moment then tim or dave for spurs fans, and thats ok, as long as they dont forget y spurs have always been a good franchise, from drob in his prime to the duncan era. Fans can moon over any player, and drob and tim will be the first to acknowledge the hold manu has on fans right now

[TOP-CHERRY]

I'm talking bandwagon fans!! NOT REAL FANS!!!


I really don't understand how it is that difficult to comprehend why Manu has more fans outside of the US than any other Spur in history.
And I'm talking about fans outside of Latin America. How can you really prove he's the most popular?

I've read tons of articles in the past of fans worldwide of all those Spurs players I mentioned already, who've even traveled to SA just to watch a game and meet the players, then leave the next day. All the articles I've read about Manu's popularity have been about people in Argentina.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

And I'm talking about fans outside of Latin America. How can you really prove he's the most popular?

I've read tons of articles in the past of fans worldwide of all those Spurs players I mentioned already, who've even traveled to SA just to watch a game and meet the players, then leave the next day. All the articles I've read about Manu's popularity have been about people in Argentina.
Really?? what about all those articles from around the NBA? and if you want I can get you articles from Spain as well. I can't give a specific number of fans each player has, what you're asking me is ridiculous, but if you can't realize Manu's popularity goes beyond Latin America then you've been living in a bubble.

[TOP-CHERRY]

Alright. I quit.
Manu has more fans, even if they're not knowledgeable.

Truce? :D

[shyne]

Well globally the world saw him kick the shit out of Tim and Team USA so he automatically got credit from the rest of the world for slaying the dragon that is USA Basketball. Dam I hated Manu that game.

[TOP-CHERRY]

Really?? what about all those articles from around the NBA?
I should read more.

if you can't realize Manu's popularity goes beyond Latin America then you've been living in a bubble.
POP!!!

;)

[TOP-CHERRY]

Well globally the world saw him kick the shit out of Tim and Team USA so he automatically got credit from the rest of the world for slaying the dragon that is USA Basketball. Dam I hated Manu that game.
Nah... I never hated Manu. Just his teammates. :lol

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Besides you keep saying "only Latin America", well that's being global my friend. Global does not mean EVERY SINGLE CONTINENT (even though I do think Manu is popular in most continents) it just means in more than one. Let say DRob was more popular in the US than Manu, fine, but outside the states Manu has ALL of Latin America, Spain, Italy and maybe more. Do you honestly think DRob, Ice or even Timmy have more of the world covered than Manu has???

[Clandestino]

globally, manu is already more popular than drob... and you don't have people thinking they will be cured by touching drob like they did to manu in that hospital a few days ago..

[smeagol]

Since when does Argentina represent the whole world? I don't think many of you realize how many fans around the world the Spurs already had way before Manu came in.

Around the world, I would say there are FAR more David Robinson, Ice, and Tim Duncan fans than there are Manu fans (not counting Argentina, ofcourse)

Maybe in a couple of years, as Manu is exposed in the NBA stage a little more, he will have lots of fans, but TODAY I wouldn't say he has more fans around the globe than other Spurs players.
Go back and read what MaNuMaNiA said.

He specifically said Latin America, not Argentina.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Alright. I quit.
Manu has more fans, even if they're not knowledgeable.

Truce? :D
I'm not fighting you, really! I'm just having a discussion. If you thought I was angry I appologise, I wasn't

[smeagol]

Prove that Manu has more worldwide fans (EXCLUDING Latin American fans) than DRob, Ice, Timmy, etc. ever had.
The World has no fucking clue who Ice is/was or what he did for the Spurs or the NBA for that matter.

Get a clue.

[orhe]

hmmm
let me see
from my circle of friends
Manu is more popular... more guys like his style of play.
heck a lot of my friends thought Manu was "the man" in the finals... now they weren't spurs fans...

so im guessing (assuming) that if you weren't a spur fan and you saw the finals you'd like Manu's game than tims (specially on how disappointing TDs playoffs ((FINALS GAME 5 CHOKE JOB) were on 2 gimpy ankles).

if manu continues this level of play... he'll easily be worldwide the most popular spur player ever

[Clandestino]

The World has no fucking clue who Ice is/was or what he did for the Spurs or the NBA for that matter.

Get a clue.

true

[word]

Then I guess its George Gervin's team huh? I think he was before D Rob. You can't base it on that.

One prob with that counter logic there ....slick.

[ZStomp]

.

[Spursdaone]

Yes but that wouldn't be that hard because I don't remember too many exciting players that the spurs had. I only been watching basketball for 15 years so I can't remember anyone close. Duncan might be the most talented but Ginobili is not that far off from being the best shooting guard in the league. He needs to score more to be that though.

[shyne]

whats that problem?

[smeagol]

hmmm
let me see
from my circle of friends
Manu is more popular... more guys like his style of play.
heck a lot of my friends thought Manu was "the man" in the finals... now they weren't spurs fans...

so im guessing (assuming) that if you weren't a spur fan and you saw the finals you'd like Manu's game than tims (specially on how disappointing TDs playoffs ((FINALS GAME 5 CHOKE JOB) were on 2 gimpy ankles).

if manu continues this level of play... he'll easily be worldwide the most popular spur player ever
Looks like shyne might have a point after all . . .

[Jelly]

"I really don't understand how it is that difficult to comprehend why Manu has more fans outside of the US than any other Spur in history."

currently he does have a larger world-wide fan base then the other Spurs. But the question is "WILL MANU GO DOWN AS THE MOST POPULAR SPUR EVER". The question is not "who is the most popular now"!
A certain longevity test is required here. The thread starter is asking us to look into the future to answer this question and it is WAY to soon to even suggest that Manu, whose popularity has only soared in recent months, and who has only even been on the team for 2 years, would "go down" as the "most popular Spur ever". The question is simply ridiculous! David Robinson's entire career was with the Spurs. Manu is at the beginning of his NBA career. Manu has not passed the test of time. Whose to say that he won't start sucking in two years and then he'll be hated by everyone? Whose to say he will even be a Spur for more than another year? He may end up spending the bulk of his career with the Celtics for all we know, and if that happens, then twenty years from now, when we're debating who the most popular Spur was, Ginobili's name might not even enter the conversation!
David Robinson had a stellar career and was a Spur for 14 YEARS, maintaining enormous popularity through out!!!! To even attempt to draw a comparison between that and someone who is just very popular now is ridiculous.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

"I really don't understand how it is that difficult to comprehend why Manu has more fans outside of the US than any other Spur in history."

currently he does have a larger world-wide fan base then the other Spurs. But the question is "WILL MANU GO DOWN AS THE MOST POPULAR SPUR EVER". The question is not "who is the most popular now"!
A certain longevity test is required here. The thread starter is asking us to look into the future to answer this question and it is WAY to soon to even suggest that Manu, whose popularity has only soared in recent months, and who has only even been on the team for 2 years, would "go down" as the "most popular Spur ever". The question is simply ridiculous! David Robinson's entire career was with the Spurs. Manu is at the beginning of his NBA career. Manu has not passed the test of time. Whose to say that he won't start sucking in two years and then he'll be hated by everyone? Whose to say he will even be a Spur for more than another year? He may end up spending the bulk of his career with the Celtics for all we know, and if that happens, then twenty years from now, when we're debating who the most popular Spur was, Ginobili's name might not even enter the conversation!
David Robinson had a stellar career and was a Spur for 14 YEARS, maintaining enormous popularity through out!!!! To even attempt to draw a comparison between that and someone who is just very popular now is ridiculous.
You clearly did not get what the thread starter meant. He/She specifically stated that IF he kept playing like he'd been playing then he'd end up being the most popular spurs ever.


I know you guys are loyal to Big Dave and so am I, but what i'm saying isnt out of the ordinary. Dave will always be Mr. Spur, but most "popular" will be Manu when his career is over especially he keeps playing the way he has been.
Now I know these are just conjectures, and noone can really tell whats going to happen, but logically IF he remains a Spur, and IF he keeps playing like he's been playing he'll end up the most popular Spur in history.

[shyne]

If Manu gets traded Pop better hire an army cause this city will kill him.

[Jelly]

Also, what if Manu's performance doesn't hold up over time and the Argentine/Latin American fan base starts shifting its allegiance to another player like Delfino. What if, in two years or so, we have 10 more latin american players...all doing fairly well. You don't think Manu's fan base will dissipate a little...or even A LOT depending on how good the others are?

[Jelly]

If Manu gets traded Pop better hire an army cause this city will kill him.

fans are fickle, Shyne. If Manu does a bad job next year, they'll turn on him and find some other hero.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Now I know these are just conjectures, and noone can really tell whats going to happen, but logically IF he remains a Spur, and IF he keeps playing like he's been playing he'll end up the most popular Spur in history.

[smeagol]

shyne, you are not argie, are you?

[shyne]

naw i'm mexican

[MaNuMaNiAc]

fans are fickle, Shyne. If Manu does a bad job next year, they'll turn on him and find some other hero. Manu already has 2 championships Jelly, I know glory is fleeting but Manu is already the most accomplished international player in history wouldn't you say? I don't think a few bad seasons is going to do too much to detract from his fan base. Still, its all IF's.

[Jelly]

I have already made the point that Shyne (and you apparently) are seeing Manu through rose-colored glasses. He did not play that well in all the finals games. He had two very bad ones if I recall. So by "IF he keeps playing like he has been" do you mean "inconsistently"? Because THAT will not secure that "most popular ever" spot you seem to think he is all but guaranteed.

I think you are simply being pedantic and looking for an argument.

[Jelly]

Manu already has 2 championships Jelly, I know glory is fleeting but Manu is already the most accomplished international player in history wouldn't you say? I don't think a few bad seasons is going to do too much to detract from his fan base. Still, its all IF's.

That's a technicality. He has two rings. Manu has said himself that he did not contribute much to the first championship.

[shyne]

If I recall one of those games he was hurt. The other ya he sucked ass but he was playing a dam good defense. Tim didnt exactly light it up the whole series either

[MaNuMaNiAc]

I have already made the point that Shyne (and you apparently) are seeing Manu through rose-colored glasses. He did not play that well in all the finals games. He had two very bad ones if I recall. So by "IF he keeps playing like he has been" do you mean "inconsistently"? Because THAT will not secure that "most popular ever" spot you seem to think he is all but guaranteed.

I think you are simply being pedantic and looking for an argument.
Jesus Jelly, what's your problem? have you not read the other posts I've written?? Did I ever say he was BETTER than DRob or Timmy?? NO I even went to great lenghts to explain that Manu's popularity with bandwagon fans has more to do with where he comes from and how he plays than how good he is. Furthermore I agreed with you that IF he did not continue to play the way he's been playing (which I strongly disagree with you that he had a bad finals, and I think you're just trying to win the argument by saying anything that comes to your mind) that he would not be as famous. You can resite ALL the IFs you want sister ( if he dies in a car crash, if he gets cancer, if he gets shot, etc) but barring a horrible injury I think Manu is going to have a very illustrious career with the Spurs ending in him becoming the Spur with the most fans worldwide.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

That's a technicality. He has two rings. Manu has said himself that he did not contribute much to the first championship. Neither did David, but would you say David only had one championship?? Last time I checked the Spurs were a team, when the TEAM wins the championship, EVERYONE WINS THE CHAMPIONSHIP!

[milkyway21]

milky way you dont get it...

What Shyne is trying to say is POPULARITY not SKILL smartass..

Of course TD will get more All-Star votes than Manu, simply because TD is better than Manu!

Popularity and Skill is diff... geez peopleso how do we really MEASURE one's popularity, genious?

Because to me the All-Star votations is more of a popularity contest than a skill contest. Why do you think VC topped 3 yrs in a row yrs ago, is he more skilled than KG or TD?

enlighten me on this..will ya? :rolleyes

okay let's forget the All-Star for now.

[smeagol]

naw i'm mexican
Thank God.

Otherwise, we'd had Sparky here in no time claiming that Argies view Manu as the second comming, that he can beat Spiderman, the Fantastic 4, Bugs Bunny and Droopy with one hand tied behind his back, etc, etc, etc, blah, blah, blah

[shyne]

He can lol

[smeagol]

fans are fickle, Shyne. If Manu does a bad job next year, they'll turn on him and find some other hero.
Although you are right, fans are fickle, your assumption seems farfetched.

Manu is not 34 yrs old. He has shown improvement every year. If he is not injured, chances are he will have a good season.

[DieMrBond]

For someone living outside of America, David Robinson was the reason i became a Spurs Fan, and to me will always be the most popular.

However, it is all probably based on when you became a Spurs fan, or a fan in general. For people joining now, David Robinson would merely be a 'Huh, whos that?' - TD, TP and Manu would be the most popular. In 50 years time, it will most likely be someone else who is the most popular. Ice, DRob, TD, TP, Manu will probably be forgotten for this 'new stud player'... a case of 'what have you done for me lately'.

So, sure - now Manu might be the most popular (which is probably fine with Timmy, less focus on him) - but down the line... will he? Probably not.

[Jelly]

Jesus Jelly, what's your problem? have you not read the other posts I've written?? Did I ever say he was BETTER than DRob or Timmy?? NO I even went to great lenghts to explain that Manu's popularity with bandwagon fans has more to do with where he comes from and how he plays than how good he is. Furthermore I agreed with you that IF he did not continue to play the way he's been playing (which I strongly disagree with you that he had a bad finals, and I think you're just trying to win the argument by saying anything that comes to your mind) that he would not be as famous. You can resite ALL the IFs you want sister ( if he dies in a car crash, if he gets cancer, if he gets shot, etc) but barring a horrible injury I think Manu is going to have a very illustrious career with the Spurs ending in him becoming the Spur with the most fans worldwide.

first of all, I'm not your sister.
secondly, you're just looking for a fight and I'm not going in circles with you, especially since you have obviously not bothered to read my posts clearly. I maintain that the whole premise of this question- and your argument in particular- is ridiculous, for reasons I've already given.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

For someone living outside of America, David Robinson was the reason i became a Spurs Fan, and to me will always be the most popular.

However, it is all probably based on when you became a Spurs fan, or a fan in general. For people joining now, David Robinson would merely be a 'Huh, whos that?' - TD, TP and Manu would be the most popular. In 50 years time, it will most likely be someone else who is the most popular. Ice, DRob, TD, TP, Manu will probably be forgotten for this 'new stud player'... a case of 'what have you done for me lately'.

So, sure - now Manu might be the most popular (which is probably fine with Timmy, less focus on him) - but down the line... will he? Probably not.
I agree with you, Manu is not going to be the most popular FOREVER. Eventually someone is going to come along and dethrone him. Although I don't think DRob was ever as popular world wide as Manu is right now.

[shyne]

I love them all Tim, David , and Manu. But Manu makes me jump outta my seat, and every game I say wow like 10 times. He has that killer instinct that Jordan had and I love it!

[Jelly]

Neither did David, but would you say David only had one championship?? Last time I checked the Spurs were a team, when the TEAM wins the championship, EVERYONE WINS THE CHAMPIONSHIP!

I'LL REPEAT...DAVID HAS 14 F*CKING ILLUSTRIOUS YEARS WITH THE SPURS AND HE IS STILL AN IMPORTANT PART OF THE COMMUNITY.

[shyne]

Hes not bashing Dave dumbass, he knows dave was better than Manu so chill out.

[smeagol]

The NBA has never been this popular worldwide. Not even in the Jordan era in the mid to late 90s. Any player who is popular today (witht he exception of Jordan, Magic and Byrd -- and maybe Rodman for extracurricular reasons) will be more popular than guys like Drob. I know for Americans and for SpurFans is sopunds blasphemous. But its true.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

first of all, I'm not your sister.
secondly, you're just looking for a fight and I'm not going in circles with you, especially since you have obviously not bothered to read my posts clearly. I maintain that the whole premise of this question- and your argument in particular- is ridiculous, for reasons I've already given.
see, now you're getting all riled up. I'm not looking for a fight, and I did not call you sister to insult you, I was joking. I've read every post you've made very clearly and I still think you're wrong. You can maintain that what I'm saying is ridiculous all you want, that still doesn't change the fact that Manu is more popular than timmy or DRob ever were at the moment, and if things continue to follow their course he will always be. If you can't deal with that, then perhaps its not me who's looking at this from a biased point of view, its you.

[smeagol]

I'LL REPEAT...DAVID HAS 14 F*CKING ILLUSTRIOUS YEARS WITH THE SPURS AND HE IS STILL AN IMPORTANT PART OF THE COMMUNITY.
We are talking world wide, aren't we?

[MaNuMaNiAc]

I'LL REPEAT...DAVID HAS 14 F*CKING ILLUSTRIOUS YEARS WITH THE SPURS AND HE IS STILL AN IMPORTANT PART OF THE COMMUNITY.
I rest my case! :lmao now who's wearing the rose colored glasses?

[ICE3000]

I believe he already has


NO! When TD starts to fade a little and the team eventually is BOTH his an DUNCANS squad and he dosnt get the pass for bein merely mortal sometimes people will turn on him FAST especially if he keeps up wit the dumn turnovers and mistakes that hes always athreat to make

[smeagol]

Hey Fizzzar, hermano, how long since you've posted anything?

Join the discussion!

[Jelly]

I rest my case! :lmao now who's wearing the rose colored glasses?

You have no case to rest. I'm done with this, but not before highlighting a particularly ignorant comment you made:

"....Manu is already the most accomplished international player in history wouldn't you say?"

ummmm.......ever heard of Hakeem Olajuwon?? yeah, he was pretty good. Here's a bit of his bio for the ill informed (like yourself apparently)

Hakeem Olajuwon was arguably one of the best centers to ever play, alongside Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Shaquille O'Neal, Patrick Ewing and David Robinson as the best pivots in basketball history. He was affectionately called "Hakeem the Dream" for his grace on and off the court.
Olajuwan was the first overall pick by Houston Rockets in the 1984 NBA draft. He led the Houston Rockets to back-to-back NBA titles (1994-95), was the regular season MVP (1994), and a 2-time Finals MVP ('94-95). He is a 6-time All-NBA 1st team member (1987-89,93-95). He is the all-time NBA blocks leader. After 17 glorious seasons with Houston, he was traded to Toronto in the waning days of his career.* With a steal against Seattle on November 20, 1999, Hakeem became the first player in NBA history to accumulate both 2,000 blocked shots and 2,000 steals in a career.

While at the University of Houston, Olajuwan was selected as the Southwest Conference Player of the Decade (1980) by a panel of media and coaches. He is one of eight centers to have led his team to the NCAA Final Four in three straight seasons. The Cougars were 88-16 during Olajuwon's three magnificent seasons. He had career averages of 13.3 points, 10.7 rebounds, and 4.5 blocked shots. His number 34 jersey was retired by UH in February 1997. "Akeem," as he was known by back them, was part of "Phi Slama Jama" - the dunking fraternity of the University of Houston in the early 1980s. Phi Slamma Jamma was a brotherhood that included "Clyde the Glide" (Clyde Drexler) and "Mr. Mean" (Larry Micheaux). The name Phi Slama Jama came from then Houston Post columnist Thomas Bonk in January 1983. To this day, Phi Slamma Jamma is considered one of the greatest collegiate teams to play in the NCAA.


Manumania - perhaps you have something of a Latin bias when talking about the most successful international player ever?

[shyne]

They get mad at Tim because he plays like a pus sometimes I love Tim but its the truth. Manu plays balls out for the time hes in there always! I will never get mad at him for playing is hard as he does.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

You have no case to rest. I'm done with this, but not before highlighting a particularly ignorant comment you made:

"....Manu is already the most accomplished international player in history wouldn't you say?"

ummmm.......ever heard of Hakeem Olajuwon?? yeah, he was pretty good. Here's a bit of his bio for the ill informed (like yourself apparently)

Hakeem Olajuwon was arguably one of the best centers to ever play, alongside Bill Russell, Wilt Chamberlain, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, Shaquille O'Neal, Patrick Ewing and David Robinson as the best pivots in basketball history. He was affectionately called "Hakeem the Dream" for his grace on and off the court.
Olajuwan was the first overall pick by Houston Rockets in the 1984 NBA draft. He led the Houston Rockets to back-to-back NBA titles (1994-95), was the regular season MVP (1994), and a 2-time Finals MVP ('94-95). He is a 6-time All-NBA 1st team member (1987-89,93-95). He is the all-time NBA blocks leader. After 17 glorious seasons with Houston, he was traded to Toronto in the waning days of his career.* With a steal against Seattle on November 20, 1999, Hakeem became the first player in NBA history to accumulate both 2,000 blocked shots and 2,000 steals in a career.

While at the University of Houston, Olajuwan was selected as the Southwest Conference Player of the Decade (1980) by a panel of media and coaches. He is one of eight centers to have led his team to the NCAA Final Four in three straight seasons. The Cougars were 88-16 during Olajuwon's three magnificent seasons. He had career averages of 13.3 points, 10.7 rebounds, and 4.5 blocked shots. His number 34 jersey was retired by UH in February 1997. "Akeem," as he was known by back them, was part of "Phi Slama Jama" - the dunking fraternity of the University of Houston in the early 1980s. Phi Slamma Jamma was a brotherhood that included "Clyde the Glide" (Clyde Drexler) and "Mr. Mean" (Larry Micheaux). The name Phi Slama Jama came from then Houston Post columnist Thomas Bonk in January 1983. To this day, Phi Slamma Jamma is considered one of the greatest collegiate teams to play in the NCAA.


Manumania - perhaps you have something of a Latin bias when talking about the most successful international player ever? OH PLEASE!!! Olajuwon??? AN INTERNATIONAL PLAYER??? HE LEARNED HOW TO PLAY BASKETBALL IN THE US!!! AND FOR YOUR INFORMATION, NO I DON'T CONSIDER OLAJUWON A TRUE INTERNATIONAL PLAYER JUST BECAUSE HE WAS BORN OUTSIDE THE US! AND FOR YOUR INFORMATION NEITHER DO MOST KNOWLEDGEBLE BASKETBALL FANS! LAME ASS ARGUMENT

[smeagol]

Jelly, didn't Hakeem become an American citizen in 1993 and play for the American NT in 1996?

One could argue that disqualifies him as you stereotype "international player"

[MaNuMaNiAc]

For your information Jelly, Olajuwon only started playing basketball at the age of 15, that's ony 2 years before he enrolled in the University of Houston which is where he trully became the basketball player that he was. By no means can you classify him as an international player! HE NEVER PLAYED PROFESSIONAL BASKETBALL ANYWHERE BUT THE US!! Seriously, stop coming up with dumbass takes just because you want to have the last word.

[Jelly]

OH PLEASE!!! Olajuwon??? AN INTERNATIONAL PLAYER??? HE LEARNED HOW TO PLAY BASKETBALL IN THE US!!! AND FOR YOUR INFORMATION, NO I DON'T CONSIDER OLAJUWON A TRUE INTERNATIONAL PLAYER JUST BECAUSE HE WAS BORN OUTSIDE THE US! AND FOR YOUR INFORMATION NEITHER DO MOST KNOWLEDGEBLE BASKETBALL FANS! LAME ASS ARGUMENT

uh..not just born outside the U.S.. he was born AND RAISED in Nigeria !
He did not get U.S. citizenship til 93. HE WAS NIGERIAN!!! But good to know that you, in your wisdom, do not deem him to be a true international. I hope Hakeem won't be too hurt that he is not worthy of this designation by Your Greatness
:depressed

[MaNuMaNiAc]

uh..not just born outside the U.S.. he was born AND RAISED in Nigeria !
He did not get U.S. citizenship til 93. HE WAS NIGERIAN!!! But good to know that you, in your wisdom, do not deem him to be a true international. I hope Hakeem won't be too hurt that he is not worthy of this designation by Your Greatness
:depressed He moved to the US at the age of 17!! and became the basketball player he was in the US!! He never played outside the US!! HE PLAYED SOCCER UP UNTIL HE WAS 15 AND AT 17 HE MOVED TO THE US!!HOW ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH CAN YOU CONSIDER HIM AN "INTERNATIONAL" PLAYER????

[smeagol]

uh..not just born outside the U.S.. he was born AND RAISED in Nigeria !
He did not get U.S. citizenship til 93. HE WAS NIGERIAN!!! But good to know that you, in your wisdom, do not deem him to be a true international. I hope Hakeem won't be too hurt that he is not worthy of this designation by Your Greatness
:depressed
Jelly, you gotta admit that if a guy, born outside the US, plays in the NCAA (never plays B-ball under FIBA rules) and becomes a US citizen to play for the 96 Dream Team, he is not much of an International Player.

Actually most of his awards (regular season MVP and Finals MVP) he got when he was already an American.

Your argument seems to be pretty weak.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Jelly, you gotta admit that if a guy, born outside the US, plays in the NCAA (never plays B-ball under FIBA rules) and becomes a US citizen to play for the 96 Dream Team, he is not much of an International Player.

Actually most of his awards (regular season MVP and Finals MVP) he got when he was already an American.

Your argument seems to be pretty weak. it doesn't seem weak, IT IS!!! Geez! and she calls ME ignorant! :lmao thats a laugh!

[WalterBenitez]

There were 3 ladies sitting in front of me at the alamodome celebration and when Manu started speaking to the crowd in spanish the bursted out in tears.

They were GINOBILIZED :rolleyes

[Jelly]

For your information Jelly, Olajuwon only started playing basketball at the age of 15, that's ony 2 years before he enrolled in the University of Houston which is where he trully became the basketball player that he was. By no means can you classify him as an international player! HE NEVER PLAYED PROFESSIONAL BASKETBALL ANYWHERE BUT THE US!! Seriously, stop coming up with dumbass takes just because you want to have the last word.

Oh.My.God. You are a piece of work. Your first approach was to argue that he was merely "born" outside the U.S. (implying that he was essentially American...although now you will deny that you implied that, but it's there for all to see), and now your changing your little rules altogether and saying that by international you specifically mean a foreign player who has played at some point in his life for a league outside the U.S.?? Your just adjusting your argument to cover up for stupid things you say. And your calling ME a dumbass?? He was NOT AMERICAN, he was international and you know it, idiot!!! With all due respect, you can take your inane, circular, belligerent, arguing for the sake of arguing bullshit excuse for a debate and shove it up your ass. All you're doing on this thread (and countless others btw) is knocking yourself out looking for a fight!! You don't read half of what I write and then you respond back with half-baked, thick headed responses. Conversing with you is like herding chickens. You're all over the place.
Find someone else for this crap. I'm not interested.

[smeagol]

Oh.My.God. You are a piece of work. Your first approach was to argue that he was merely "born" outside the U.S. (implying that he was essentially American...although now you will deny that you implied that, but it's there for all to see), and now your changing your little rules altogether and saying that by international you specifically mean a foreign player who has played at some point in his life for a league outside the U.S.?? Your just adjusting your argument to cover up for stupid things you say. And your calling ME a dumbass?? He was NOT AMERICAN, he was international and you know it, idiot!!! With all due respect, you can take your inane, circular, belligerent, arguing for the sake of arguing bullshit excuse for a debate and shove it up your ass. All you're doing on this thread (and countless others btw) is knocking yourself out looking for a fight!! You don't read half of what I write and then you respond back with half-baked, thick headed responses. Conversing with you is like herding chickens. You're all over the place.
Find someone else for this crap. I'm not interested.
Sore loser :lol

[shyne]

Jelly was prolly one of those dumbasses that wanted to trade D Rob for Webber, and now feels he owes it to Dave to worship the ground he walk on.

[smeagol]

Seriuosly, Jelly, we were having an argument and you went crazy on us. Don't take it personally. People around here will get really mean if this is how you react when you argue on this board.

I still think your Hakeem arguments are weak.

As to the main topic of this thread, who knows if Manu will be or is the most popular Spurs player WORLDWIDE. Neither you, nor MaNuMANiA nor anybody else knows. The fact is he could be. And it has nothing to do with what DRob of Timmy did for this franchise, or what they mean to you and the other diehard Spurs fans. It has nothing to do with your love for them. It has nothing to do with MaNuMANiA or shyne's love for Manu. Its based on thier perception of reality and on their arguments to explain that reality. Nothing more, nothing less.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Oh.My.God. You are a piece of work. Your first approach was to argue that he was merely "born" outside the U.S. (implying that he was essentially American...although now you will deny that you implied that, but it's there for all to see), and now your changing your little rules altogether and saying that by international you specifically mean a foreign player who has played at some point in his life for a league outside the U.S.?? Your just adjusting your argument to cover up for stupid things you say. And your calling ME a dumbass?? He was NOT AMERICAN, he was international and you know it, idiot!!! With all due respect, you can take your inane, circular, belligerent, arguing for the sake of arguing bullshit excuse for a debate and shove it up your ass. All you're doing on this thread (and countless others btw) is knocking yourself out looking for a fight!! You don't read half of what I write and then you respond back with half-baked, thick headed responses. Conversing with you is like herding chickens. You're all over the place.
Find someone else for this crap. I'm not interested.
there you go, now you're showing your real colors. You're as thickheaded and as dumb as they come. I never said he was American, sweetheart, I said he "learned to play basketball" in the US. You want to think he was an international player, then by all means go ahead, but know that noone else does. Your stupidity is endless as your patience is thin. I suggest that if you feel the NEED to be right about anything, you start by making valid points and not go about insulting people just because you're too ignorant to argue sensibly. I'm sorry if you feel I was trying to belittle DRob's "illustrious career", or Timmy's quiet excellence by simply stating that the masses prefer flash over brilliance, but its a fact not an opinion, and its plain for everyone to see.


Oh.My.God. You are a piece of work. Your first approach was to argue that he was merely "born" outside the U.S. (implying that he was essentially American...although now you will deny that you implied that, but it's there for all to see), and now your changing your little rules altogether and saying that by international you specifically mean a foreign player who has played at some point in his life for a league outside the U.S.? It wasn't my FIRST approach, it was an incomplete one, which I clarified later on another post. If you choose to focus on semantics in order to avoid the actual argument then by all means I should assume you're too dense and obtuse to admit you're wrong. Either way, I'm done arguing with someone too stupid to understand they're being owned!

[shyne]

I'm gonna back my favorite player ever in Manu, and u have ur opinion on who u want its all good chill out man.

[puffytaco]

there you go, now you're showing your real colors. You're as thickheaded and as dumb as they come. I never said he was American, sweetheart, I said he "learned to play basketball" in the US. You want to think he was an international player, then by all means go ahead, but know that noone else does. Your stupidity is endless as your patience is thin. I suggest that if you feel the NEED to be right about anything, you start by making valid points and not go about insulting people just because you're too ignorant to argue sensibly. I'm sorry if you feel I was trying to belittle DRob's "illustrious career", or Timmy's quiet excellence by simply stating that the masses prefer flash over brilliance, but its a fact not an opinion, and its plain for everyone to see.

It wasn't my FIRST approach, it was an incomplete one, which I clarified later on another post. If you choose to focus on semantics in order to avoid the actual argument then by all means I should assume you're too dense and obtuse to admit you're wrong. Either way, I'm done arguing with someone too stupid to understand they're being owned!

[puffytaco]

"You want to think he was an international player, then by all means go ahead, but know that noone else does."

actually, the NBA does. Jelly is right. Research NBA articles and reports on Hakeem. He is most definitely classified as an international player according to the NBA.
By the way, I don't care who the most popular international player is, but in this thread, between you and Jelly, you were by far the most obnoxious poster and I don't blame him for finally blowing up at you. He's right, you were just looking for a a fight the whole time.

[JoePublic]

The impact David Robinson has had on the Spurs and the City of San Antonio leaves no doubt in my mind who the man is in SA.

[polandprzem]

Everyone knows who David Robinson was, everyone know who Tim Duncan is BUT DAMN THEY ARE CHEERING FOR MANU.

[B.AlMighty]

Didn't they cheer for David and Timmy? Sure sounds like that to me.

Popularity is in the moment.

[polandprzem]

Not much people cheer for people like TD or DR. Just the Spurs fans I think.
But for Manu right now? Much much more than just spurs fans.

[Horry For 3!]

Most popular Spur player ever = David Robinson

[polandprzem]

Look
There are team fans (they cheer for all players in the team with small exeptions)
but there are many players fans they go where player goes.
And there are neutrual fans bthat like what Manu has and Tim or David never had.

Dave's spurs?
Tim's spurs?
that's not in discussion everybody knows that. Popularity goes beyond the recognition

[puffytaco]

He moved to the US at the age of 17!! and became the basketball player he was in the US!! He never played outside the US!!

You are embarassing yourself. I just did some internet research. He played center for the Nigerian National team.

[smeagol]

actually, the NBA does.Jelly is right. Research NBA articles and reports on Hakeem. He is most definitely classified as an international player according to the NBA.

Doesn't the NBA report TD as an international player from the Virgin Islands?

[vanvannen]

This is lame.
David Robinson is BY FAR the most popular Spur ever. However, you could argue that in the years of Gervin the NBA was not as massive and international as it is now, so it is not really fair.
I guess Manu will never be as popular as David (or Tim probably) in the US. He could be more popular OUTSIDE the US, but you never know. He could have a lousy season and be traded, he could have a bad injury, who knows...
On the Hakeem/Manu argument, I would not call Hakeem an international player. YES, he was born in Nigeria, but I think what is now known as international player are all those who developed their games OUTSIDE the US, such as Dirk, Peja, Kukoc, Manu or Petrovic. They all played (correct me if I'm wrong) in some non american league, therefore, they DEVELOPED their game outside the US. Smeagol argument is right. According to the NBA, TD is listed as International Player. Now seariosly Jelly, do you REALLY consider Tim an International Player? Do you consider Steve Nash an international player? He played for Canada's national team...

[spurschick]

Why don't you guys Battle Blog this stuff?
http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15389

[MaNuMaNiAc]

You are embarassing yourself. I just did some internet research. He played center for the Nigerian National team.
When??? olympics?? international tournament?? you're talking out of your ass!

[MaNuMaNiAc]

"You want to think he was an international player, then by all means go ahead, but know that noone else does."

actually, the NBA does. Jelly is right. Research NBA articles and reports on Hakeem. He is most definitely classified as an international player according to the NBA.
By the way, I don't care who the most popular international player is, but in this thread, between you and Jelly, you were by far the most obnoxious poster and I don't blame him for finally blowing up at you. He's right, you were just looking for a a fight the whole time.
How was I looking for a fight?? what are you? Jelly's relative?? and for your information I think Jelly is a she

[TOP-CHERRY]

I'm done arguing with someone too stupid to understand they're being owned!
Funny how you came in here saying you weren't trying to be mean in any way. All this proves is how obnoxious and pedantic you really are. :rolleyes

[Dex]

http://home.nc.rr.com/inbedwithhomer/arguing_internet.jpg

Completely HAWTALTA, but it needed to be done.

And Cherry wins because she used to word pedantic. :tu

[TOP-CHERRY]

And Cherry wins because she used to word pedantic. :tu
Actually, I copied it off of someone who used it earlier in this thread. :D

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Funny how you came in here saying you weren't trying to be mean in any way. All this proves is how obnoxious and pedantic you really are. :rolleyes hey smartass, she blew up on me remember??! I don't take well to insults, do you?

[TOP-CHERRY]

Seriously, stop coming up with dumbass takes just because you want to have the last word.
First insult I saw.

And I don't see how arguing about Hakeem being international is having a "dumbass take". :rolleyes

[Dex]

For starters, Jelly was right. If a player is born outside of the contiguous United States, then they are considered an international player, period. This is why Tim is also considered international, despite the fact that he also learned to play here, played college ball here, and played for the American National Team. Anytime they talk about the internationals on the Spurs roster, Tim Duncan is included for his affilliations with the Virgin Islands.

The very same rule applies to Hakeem.

Secondly, ManuMania, you haven't really debated in this topic at all. All you've done is argued with people and then resorted to name calling. And yes, people aren't going to take you seriously if you call their takes 'dumb' and act like they don't deserve an opinion and you do.

Don't start flinging shit around, then act all surprised when it hits the fan.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

First insult I saw.

And I don't see how arguing about Hakeem being international is having a "dumbass take". :rolleyes
Go back and check the whole thread to see who attacked whom first

[TOP-CHERRY]

Go back and check the whole thread to see who attacked whom first
I did. ;)

[MaNuMaNiAc]

For starters, Jelly was right. If a player is born outside of the contiguous United States, then they are considered an international player, period. This is why Tim is also considered international, despite the fact that he also learned to play here, played college ball here, and played for the American National Team. Anytime they talk about the internationals on the Spurs roster, Tim Duncan is included for his affilliations with the Virgin Islands.

The very same rule applies to Hakeem.

Secondly, ManuMania, you haven't really debated in this topic at all. All you've done is argued with people and then resorted to name calling. And yes, people aren't going to take you seriously if you call their takes 'dumb' and act like they don't deserve an opinion and you do.

Don't start flinging shit around, then act all surprised when it hits the fan.
Oh this is classic! She calls my take ignorant first, and then I call her take a dumbass take and I get the heat? Either way I can see this shit going on and on and on, and I'm really not interested in continuing it.

[TOP-CHERRY]

For starters, Jelly was right. If a player is born outside of the contiguous United States, then they are considered an international player, period. This is why Tim is also considered international, despite the fact that he also learned to play here, played college ball here, and played for the American National Team. Anytime they talk about the internationals on the Spurs roster, Tim Duncan is included for his affilliations with the Virgin Islands.

The very same rule applies to Hakeem.
See, Manumania, it isn't too hard to fathom that maybe Manu isn't the second coming (;)) and that he's not the most accomplished international player. He's good, yeah. Just not that good to make such a bold statement.


Secondly, ManuMania, you haven't really debated in this topic at all. All you've done is argued with people and then resorted to name calling. And yes, people aren't going to take you seriously if you call their takes 'dumb' and act like they don't deserve an opinion and you do.

Don't start flinging shit around, then act all surprised when it hits the fan.
See? Not the only one who thinks that way.

[Dex]

Oh this is classic! She calls my take ignorant first, and then I call her take a dumbass take and I get the heat? Either way I can see this shit going on and on and on, and I'm really not interested in continuing it.

I don't want to, either. I'm not trying to argue or hate or anything.

Still, I went through the entire thread, and I think you took the offensive first. You started saying she was "out of her mind" just because she made a perfectly decent and valid point that, god forbid, didn't agree with your own.

Show me the quote where she called your take ignorant, and I'll admit you were somewhat justified. But from what I saw, she was simply debating, and you were the one who started taking things personally. Considering I don't know either of you, there is no reason for me to be biased here, so I'm simply going by what I read. No hard feelings, either way.

[batman2883]

I think Manu has a very big fan base because of the style he plays with. His reckless drives towards the rim and crazy finishes finally gives the Spurs that highlight reel making player. However when measuring him to the being the favorite of San Antonio, i'd have to say is a huge bias remark, i am a huge fan of Manu Ginobili huge, and i can say he's my favorite over David Robinson, however, that is just my opinion i wouldnt force that on anyone cause as long as some loved a spur its all good.

[ambchang]

I think Manu will be the Spur with the largest fan base by the time his career is over. Its a given, he has an advantage over people because he has the latin vote, much like Yao does.


The whole notion of people rooting for you strictly based on the fact that they are of the same race is silly. I am Chinese, never really rooted for Yao Ming, I mean, did you see people going nuts over Wang ZhiZhi and Menk Bateer? No. In fact, those all-star votes from China mostly voted for Shaq (when he was out West), not Yao. Strangly enough, it was the local American votes that went to Yao, perhaps people just hated Shaq's fat mouth.
Anyways, fact that only 2 or 3 in this thread picked Manu, and everyone else picked the Admiral would be telling enough as to who is most popular.

[ambchang]

Jesus christ! Its obvious!!! When DRob and Ice were playing the Spurs weren't even global!!! Why would international fans watch them?? Huh? I'm talking bandwagon fans!! NOT REAL FANS!!! The NBA has gone global only in the past few years, before then the only NBA players that actually had a bandwagon following outside the US were Jordan, Magic, Bird and maybe Barkley. I know DRob played during the same period as Jordan but Jordan was flashier than David and hence got a hell of a lot more fans. I really don't understand how it is that difficult to comprehend why Manu has more fans outside of the US than any other Spur in history.
Because this is untrue. I am from Hong Kong, and I was a David Robinson fan back there. You would be surprised how many games they televise worldwide.

[FoxMulder]

As argentinian I knew the Spurs were an NBA team because of David Robinson.
Plus I love them because of Manu.
I think we´re overreacting ...
Manu is really popular (a demi-god) here in Argentina and I guess is very popular in Italy but I don´t know if he is the most popular Spur ever. He can be in a near future. But now (in my humble opinion) he isn´t.
When you think Spurs you think in Gervin, Robinson, Duncan.
I hope in the future we'll thinking in Gervin, Robinson, Duncan and Ginobili.

[smeagol]

For starters, Jelly was right. If a player is born outside of the contiguous United States, then they are considered an international player, period. This is why Tim is also considered international, despite the fact that he also learned to play here, played college ball here, and played for the American National Team. Anytime they talk about the internationals on the Spurs roster, Tim Duncan is included for his affilliations with the Virgin Islands.
So you are saying TD is really and international player just because the NBA says so?

Then TD is the most successfull international player given that he has three rings and three MVP final awards.

Dosn't make much sense to me.

[ALVAREZ6]

Tim Duncan learned how to play basketball in the US, plays for the USA national team, but was born in the Virgin Islands...

They consider him international, but they also use him on thier national basketball roster, so I think that's pretty cheap! :smokin

[Dex]

I'm saying that Tim is an international player because he was born outside of the 50 United States of America.

That IS the requirement for being considered a international player, by the books.

I didn't write them, that's just how it is. The Spurs have said this a thousand times in the past, and nobody disputed their logic then.

And by those standards, yes, Tim is the most successful international player. However, he still doesn't have a gold medal to his name, so even that could be disputed by anybody who cared to do so.

I, however, don't.

[Rick Von Braun]

I would like to clarify something.

If a player is born outside the US, but s(he) spends her/his entire professional (and college) carrer in the US, then for professional and practical purposes, s(he) is not a pure international player. There are borderline cases, like a foreign player that played in the NCAA and the NBA, but also played for her/his national team (I am sure there are many of them, one future example might be Andrew Bogut). You could argue he is an international player because he plays for his national team, but even in this case it is debatable (from the professional point of view). I think a more accurate definition for a true international basketball player might be someone that has played in a professional league abroad, outside the US college and professional leagues.

Hakeem is a bad example of an international player, since he has only played in the US (and learnt the game here). Note that this definition is not restricted to foreign born players. Of our own former Spurs, I consider Mario Elie and Stephen Jackson true international players, since they both played in several leagues overseas. On the other hand, the fact that Steve Kerr was born in Lebanon, does not grant him the label of an international basketball player (despite what the NBA.com site says, considering Tim Duncan an international player is stupid).

On the subject at hand, I will make the following observation. Most of the international fans, from far away places like Phillipines, Argentina, Poland, Mexico, etc. agree that Manu may have more international recognition. I would weight their opinions a little more heavily in that regard. On the local scene, I would say that David Robinson is the most popular Spurs former or active player today. I know he is my favorite Spurs player ever.

[Banks91]

the only reason duncan plays for the US is cuz he played for them in college, so he has no choice, he can never play for another country again

[Banks91]

u can be like a dirk nowitzki, play in europe and learn there, but then play 1 season in college, then play for the states, and never play for any other country.
even though u got ur game from overseas

[TOP-CHERRY]

As argentinian I knew the Spurs were an NBA team because of David Robinson.
Plus I love them because of Manu.
I think we´re overreacting ...
Manu is really popular (a demi-god) here in Argentina and I guess is very popular in Italy but I don´t know if he is the most popular Spur ever. He can be in a near future. But now (in my humble opinion) he isn´t.
When you think Spurs you think in Gervin, Robinson, Duncan.
I hope in the future we'll thinking in Gervin, Robinson, Duncan and Ginobili.
This guy just made you guys look like chumps. :D

Thanks for your honesty and humbleness, FoxMulder. It's lacking a lot around these parts. ;)

[manubili]

This guy just made you guys look like chumps. :D

Thanks for your honesty and humbleness, FoxMulder. It's lacking a lot around these parts. ;)

I'm from argentina too, and I agree with Foxmulder. Our opinions are not facts. So, it's better to cool down and give nothing for granted unless we are completely sure we are talkin about real-tested facts.

Even nationality seems to be a matter of opinion!!!!

We can't measure with certainty Manu's popularity right now, it's too close to us. I think, IMO, that Manu is maybe the most famous spur player, outside US, but I can't be sure. I can't even start to talk about Manu's popularity in U.S or Sant Antonio City, because I don't live there.

Time will tell. Manu's career is far from its end, fortunately.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

This guy just made you guys look like chumps. :D

Thanks for your honesty and humbleness, FoxMulder. It's lacking a lot around these parts. ;)
Why?? because he happens to have an opinion that agrees with yours?? give me a break! I stand by what I've said in all my posts. If anything this guy made you look like a chump!


I would like to clarify something.

If a player is born outside the US, but s(he) spends her/his entire professional (and college) carrer in the US, then for professional and practical purposes, s(he) is not a pure international player. There are borderline cases, like a foreign player that played in the NCAA and the NBA, but also played for her/his national team (I am sure there are many of them, one future example might be Andrew Bogut). You could argue he is an international player because he plays for his national team, but even in this case it is debatable (from the professional point of view). I think a more accurate definition for a true international basketball player might be someone that has played in a professional league abroad, outside the US college and professional leagues.

Hakeem is a bad example of an international player, since he has only played in the US (and learnt the game here). Note that this definition is not restricted to foreign born players. Of our own former Spurs, I consider Mario Elie and Stephen Jackson true international players, since they both played in several leagues overseas. On the other hand, the fact that Steve Kerr was born in Lebanon, does not grant him the label of an international basketball player (despite what the NBA.com site says, considering Tim Duncan an international player is stupid).

On the subject at hand, I will make the following observation. Most of the international fans, from far away places like Phillipines, Argentina, Poland, Mexico, etc. agree that Manu may have more international recognition. I would weight their opinions a little more heavily in that regard. On the local scene, I would say that David Robinson is the most popular Spurs former or active player today. I know he is my favorite Spurs player ever.

[smeagol]

I would like to clarify something.

If a player is born outside the US, but s(he) spends her/his entire professional (and college) carrer in the US, then for professional and practical purposes, s(he) is not a pure international player. There are borderline cases, like a foreign player that played in the NCAA and the NBA, but also played for her/his national team (I am sure there are many of them, one future example might be Andrew Bogut). You could argue he is an international player because he plays for his national team, but even in this case it is debatable (from the professional point of view). I think a more accurate definition for a true international basketball player might be someone that has played in a professional league abroad, outside the US college and professional leagues.

Hakeem is a bad example of an international player, since he has only played in the US (and learnt the game here). Note that this definition is not restricted to foreign born players. Of our own former Spurs, I consider Mario Elie and Stephen Jackson true international players, since they both played in several leagues overseas. On the other hand, the fact that Steve Kerr was born in Lebanon, does not grant him the label of an international basketball player (despite what the NBA.com site says, considering Tim Duncan an international player is stupid).

On the subject at hand, I will make the following observation. Most of the international fans, from far away places like Phillipines, Argentina, Poland, Mexico, etc. agree that Manu may have more international recognition. I would weight their opinions a little more heavily in that regard. On the local scene, I would say that David Robinson is the most popular Spurs former or active player today. I know he is my favorite Spurs player ever.
RVM, the voice of reason

(as usual)

[puffytaco]

Manumania,
I just read thru this entire thread again and you really have been antagonistic. The high level of animosity on this thread is because of your arrogant and hostile attitude toward Jelly thru most of the debate. He/She has offered some smart and reasonable points to debate and you only came back with hostile rants and insults. Yes, he lost his cool and hurled some insults at you but only after putting up with your combativeness for several pages. Sorry dude, you're not looking too good right now.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

Manumania,
I just read thru this entire thread again and you really have been antagonistic. The high level of animosity on this thread is because of your arrogant and hostile attitude toward Jelly thru most of the debate. He/She has offered some smart and reasonable points to debate and you only came back with hostile rants and insults. Yes, he lost his cool and hurled some insults at you but only after putting up with your combativeness for several pages. Sorry dude, you're not looking too good right now.
what a laugh! I disagree, I don't think I was hostile, combative or had any animosity of any sort. You thinking I did doesn't make me look bad, you're entitled to think what you will. I take objection at your calling my arguments "hostile rants and insults"! I never insulted her before she insulted me, that doesn't change.

P.S. Jelly is a woman not a man (I think).

[smeagol]

Manumania,
I just read thru this entire thread again and you really have been antagonistic. The high level of animosity on this thread is because of your arrogant and hostile attitude toward Jelly thru most of the debate. He/She has offered some smart and reasonable points to debate and you only came back with hostile rants and insults. Yes, he lost his cool and hurled some insults at you but only after putting up with your combativeness for several pages. Sorry dude, you're not looking too good right now.
If you think MaNuMaNiA has been hostile and that there is animosity in this thread, wait until you read a Whottt vs chumpdumper thread. Shit flies everywhere when those two lock horns!

[MaNuMaNiAc]

If you think MaNuMaNiA has been hostile and that there is animosity in this thread, wait until you read a Whottt vs chumpdumper thread. Shit flies everywhere when those two lock horns!
:lmao :lmao :lmao

[Dex]

:lol

People are funny little things when left to their own devices.

And very good points made, RVB. You've managed to change my train of thought.

Now THAT is how you debate something.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

I don't want to, either. I'm not trying to argue or hate or anything.

Still, I went through the entire thread, and I think you took the offensive first. You started saying she was "out of her mind" just because she made a perfectly decent and valid point that, god forbid, didn't agree with your own.

Show me the quote where she called your take ignorant, and I'll admit you were somewhat justified. But from what I saw, she was simply debating, and you were the one who started taking things personally. Considering I don't know either of you, there is no reason for me to be biased here, so I'm simply going by what I read. No hard feelings, either way.
hey Dex, its al cool, seriously, I just wanted to clear this one up. I didn't tell Jelly she was out of her mind, I told Cherry that. Second, try and look closely at the post Jelly had, she did call my take ignorant. I seriously was not on the offensive, and I don't insult anyone before I feel insulted by them first.

[ALVAREZ6]

the only reason duncan plays for the US is cuz he played for them in college, so he has no choice, he can never play for another country again
Umm, I don't think so, I'm sure he can play for another country, and it's not because he played in college here, nothing to do...

MAYBE, maybe because the Virgin Islands only have like 20 total basketball players, so their isn't enough to pick from versus here in the states, we have millions.

[Trainwreck2100]

the only reason duncan plays for the US is cuz he played for them in college, so he has no choice, he can never play for another country again


He wasn't in college when he played in the qualifier, in 99 there was no VI team so he played for the US.

[Dex]

hey Dex, its al cool, seriously, I just wanted to clear this one up. I didn't tell Jelly she was out of her mind, I told Cherry that. Second, try and look closely at the post Jelly had, she did call my take ignorant. I seriously was not on the offensive, and I don't insult anyone before I feel insulted by them first.

Fair enough. I'm not tryin to start sheyitt either way. Just helping to keep the peace.

Like I said, no hard feelings.

:fro

NOW BEHAVE KIDS, OR I'LL TURN THIS DAMN CAR AROUND AND WE'LL GO STRAIGHT HOME!

[drivanroca]

Will Manu go down as the most popular spur ever?

and forget DROB???