Player reliance on Freebies Analysis

[ElNono]

We take the top 5 point scorers in the league:

1. Kevin Durant-OKC 1865
2. Kobe Bryant-LAL 1813
3. LeBron James-MIA 1700
4. James Harden-HOU 1689
5. Russell Westbrook-OKC 1532

Also the top 5 Free Throw made players in the league (which happen to be the same players):

1. Kevin Durant-OKC 561
2. James Harden-HOU 557
3. Kobe Bryant-LAL 415
4. Russell Westbrook-OKC 369
5. LeBron James-MIA 333

And we rank them based on how many of their points came from freebies:

1. James Harden-HOU 557 out of 1689 32.97%
2. Kevin Durant-OKC 561 out of 1865 30.00%
3. Russell Westbrook-OKC 369 out of 1532 24.08%
4. Kobe Bryant-LAL 415 out of 1813 22.89%
5. LeBron James-MIA 333 out of 1700 19.58%

Just facts here, numbers coming from basketball-reference.com (http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2013_leaders.html)

Some conclusions that can be drawn from this:
- The top 3 players being in OKC last season completely validates the perception that they were an incredibly protected team
- This season isn't much different, with Durant a close second to Harden, and Westbrook coming in at third
- Trading away Harden was a boneheaded move just by looking at how much protection and how effective he is getting calls
- Lebron and Kobe have to work much harder for their points than the top two

[Thread]

Jesus H. Christ, not this shit again.

[ElNono]

Jesus H. Christ, not this shit again.

Anything you disagree with?

[Thread]

I don't do that shit, El. You know that.

[spurraider21]

To be fair Harden attacks the rim like a ************* madman

[ElNono]

I don't do that shit, El. You know that.

This is actually a thread with basketball discussion in it. If you don't want to do that, you can just skip over it. Thanks!

[KaiRMD1]

Didn't Harden say he relies on the free throws to get himself going offensively? So the fact that he leads doesn't surprise me and especially that Kobe & Lebron work harder for their free throws, it's one of the highlights when you see them shoot with a guy all over them.

[LkrFan]

Now we talking ElNono. This is my kind of thread. :toast

Using your formula, I want to provide world class analysis on D-Whistle:

Total points: 1304
Free Throws Made: 274
Percentage of points from FTAs: 21% (274 divided by 1304)

I need to calculate to see if D-Whistle is still an elite player. Using my Hollingeresque formula:

21% of his points are FTAs. So, 21%*1304 points = 273.84.
Subtract FTA% points from total points (1304-273.84) = 1030.16
Take that total and divide by total games played to get true ppg (1030.16/60). I get 17.17 ppg (rounded up because I am a nice guy).

There you have it folks. Wade is really a 17.17 ppg scorer. Please not that these numbers would drop like a bad habit if he wasn't coat tailing LeBron and Bosh. Their mere presence makes it easier on D-Whistle to score. Case in point, if he were in Houston, he would not be the 21.7 ppg scorer that he appears to be. In other words, he's still a referee dependent superstar. But...without FTAs, he ain't shit.
Neal with it Ace. :downspin:

[Killakobe81]

We take the top 5 point scorers in the league:

1. Kevin Durant-OKC 1865
2. Kobe Bryant-LAL 1813
3. LeBron James-MIA 1700
4. James Harden-HOU 1689
5. Russell Westbrook-OKC 1532

Also the top 5 Free Throw made players in the league (which happen to be the same players):

1. Kevin Durant-OKC 561
2. James Harden-HOU 557
3. Kobe Bryant-LAL 415
4. Russell Westbrook-OKC 369
5. LeBron James-MIA 333

And we rank them based on how many of their points came from freebies:

1. James Harden-HOU 557 out of 1689 32.97%
2. Kevin Durant-OKC 561 out of 1865 30.00%
3. Russell Westbrook-OKC 369 out of 1532 24.08%
4. Kobe Bryant-LAL 415 out of 1813 22.89%
5. LeBron James-MIA 333 out of 1700 19.58%

Just facts here, numbers coming from basketball-reference.com (http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2013_leaders.html)

Some conclusions that can be drawn from this:
- The top 3 players being in OKC last season completely validates the perception that they were an incredibly protected team
- This season isn't much different, with Durant a close second to Harden, and Westbrook coming in at third
- Trading away Harden was a boneheaded move just by looking at how much protection and how effective he is getting calls- Lebron and Kobe have to work much harder for their points than the top two

I get why they did it, just should of asked for more in return ...a guy getting that many freebies worth more than what they got ...

[racm]

Now we talking ElNono. This is my kind of thread. :toast

Using your formula, I want to provide world class analysis on D-Whistle:

Total points: 1304
Free Throws Made: 274
Percentage of points from FTAs: 21% (274 divided by 1304)

I need to calculate to see if D-Whistle is still an elite player. Using my Hollingeresque formula:

21% of his points are FTAs. So, 21%*1304 points = 273.84.
Subtract FTA% points from total points (1304-273.84) = 1030.16
Take that total and divide by total games played to get true ppg (1030.16/60). I get 17.17 ppg (rounded up because I am a nice guy).

There you have it folks. Wade is really a 17.17 ppg scorer. Please not that these numbers would drop like a bad habit if he wasn't coat tailing LeBron and Bosh. Their mere presence makes it easier on D-Whistle to score. Case in point, if he were in Houston, he would not be the 21.7 ppg scorer that he appears to be. In other words, he's still a referee dependent superstar. But...without FTAs, he ain't shit.
Neal with it Ace. :downspin:

Wouldn't it be easier to just subtract points from FTs from total points then divide by games played?

Durant:
Total points: 1865
Points from FTs: 561

Net points: 1304

GP: 66 (since these stats are from before the Dallas game)

1304 / 66 = 19.76 PPG

That's a huge drop.

[HI-FI]

el Nono with the latin American number crunching goods.

I want to see the Thunderefs fans argue this, especially in light of that borderline buttfucking email between Bennett and Stern. there's no way Chimpbrook or Durant deserve more FTs than Lebron.

[whitemamba]

Now we talking ElNono. This is my kind of thread. :toast

Using your formula, I want to provide world class analysis on D-Whistle:

Total points: 1304
Free Throws Made: 274
Percentage of points from FTAs: 21% (274 divided by 1304)

I need to calculate to see if D-Whistle is still an elite player. Using my Hollingeresque formula:

21% of his points are FTAs. So, 21%*1304 points = 273.84.
Subtract FTA% points from total points (1304-273.84) = 1030.16
Take that total and divide by total games played to get true ppg (1030.16/60). I get 17.17 ppg (rounded up because I am a nice guy).

There you have it folks. Wade is really a 17.17 ppg scorer. Please not that these numbers would drop like a bad habit if he wasn't coat tailing LeBron and Bosh. Their mere presence makes it easier on D-Whistle to score. Case in point, if he were in Houston, he would not be the 21.7 ppg scorer that he appears to be. In other words, he's still a referee dependent superstar. But...without FTAs, he ain't shit.
Neal with it Ace. :downspin:


your mean :cry dont expose d-whis like that

[whitemamba]

good thread btw.. ElNono with the goods :toast

[LkrFan]

Wouldn't it be easier to just subtract points from FTs from total points then divide by games played?

Durant:
Total points: 1865
Points from FTs: 561

Net points: 1304

GP: 66 (since these stats are from before the Dallas game)

1304 / 66 = 19.76 PPG

That's a huge drop.
Either way is good. As long as the truth is told. :)

[LkrFan]

your mean :cry dont expose d-whis like that
:lol

[Pickle]

odd how lebron plays the most aggressive of anyone, scores more points than most everyone, but isn't at the very top in ft's. those other guys must be coddled and pussified by the refs, if it was equal treatment lebron would shoot twice as many ft's as kobe/durant.

[Latarian Milton]

funny thing is harden gets even more freebies after departing from OKC, which reflects that the rockets have been covertly receiving even more help from the refs than OKC have, and that's the main reason why they're in the playoff range now imho. take refs away from the game and the rockets (a borderline superstar plus a band of immature role players) are no better than what they were in the previous seasons tbh

[HI-FI]

Thunderfag and Thunder fans in general avoiding this thread like rehab tbh.

[thunderup]

We get calls because we have superstars and our owner is best friends with our good ole Jew Stern.

Anything to win, I'll take it. :)

[unforeseen]

If I did not know any better, I would think El is asian with the mathematical goods.

[OKC]

There is no player on the face of the planet equal to Kevin Durant in many aspects (no, I didn't just call him the best player on the planet - although honestly, he's #2). Basically you guys are pissed because he shoots 9 freebies a game, when he's basically (arguably) the most unguardable guy on the planet. I don't get it. Yeah he gets his superstar calls and in games where the refs are calling things too close, he gets too many touch fouls. I don't like tightly called games like that. Even aside from that though, KD is fouled - a lot. Westbrook goes to the foul line ONE MORE TIME PER GAME than Tony Parker. You wanna bitch about that? 1 trip to the line more for a guy whose offensive approach in the paint is FAR more aggressive than Parker's and for a guy who shoots, what, 4 more FGs a game than Parker. Whatever. Westbrook is an animal. He's dunking over 7 footers. Of course he's freaking fouled all the time. Open your eyes.

[OKC]

By the way, the conclusion that Lebron has to work much harder for his points is absurd. Lebron James could shoot 12 FTs a game, every game, if that's what he wanted to do. Lebron's a pass first player - a lot of times. Assists the ball much more than KD. Lebron will penetrate and kick much more than KD. Basically he's setting guys up more. I saw him last game against OKC penetrate, get in the air, coulda swore he was gonna go to the rim, dishes out to the corner 3 spot in mid-air not 3 feet from the basket. He could gone to the rim and probably got a foul call there. He chose the open 3. That's what the guy does.

[jag]

We take the top 5 point scorers in the league:

1. Kevin Durant-OKC 1865
2. Kobe Bryant-LAL 1813
3. LeBron James-MIA 1700
4. James Harden-HOU 1689
5. Russell Westbrook-OKC 1532

Also the top 5 Free Throw made players in the league (which happen to be the same players):

1. Kevin Durant-OKC 561
2. James Harden-HOU 557
3. Kobe Bryant-LAL 415
4. Russell Westbrook-OKC 369
5. LeBron James-MIA 333

And we rank them based on how many of their points came from freebies:

1. James Harden-HOU 557 out of 1689 32.97%
2. Kevin Durant-OKC 561 out of 1865 30.00%
3. Russell Westbrook-OKC 369 out of 1532 24.08%
4. Kobe Bryant-LAL 415 out of 1813 22.89%
5. LeBron James-MIA 333 out of 1700 19.58%

Just facts here, numbers coming from basketball-reference.com (http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2013_leaders.html)

Some conclusions that can be drawn from this:
- The top 3 players being in OKC last season completely validates the perception that they were an incredibly protected team
- This season isn't much different, with Durant a close second to Harden, and Westbrook coming in at third
- Trading away Harden was a boneheaded move just by looking at how much protection and how effective he is getting calls
- Lebron and Kobe have to work much harder for their points than the top two

The only way to solve this is to have the most objective poster on the NBA board go through each of Durant's foul calls (for maybe 15 games) on Synergy and determine if there was an actual foul.

15 isn't a huge sample size, but it will at least give us an idea. After recording the totals, you can use that to determine:

-Fouls received per game
-True Fouls received per game
-(True Fouls/Total Fouls) %
-Points received off True Fouls
-(Points received off all fouls) - (Points received off True Fouls) = X
-((All points) - X)/games played = legitimate PPG

After you do that, you'd have to do it for a 2-3 other players and compare to see if he's really being gifted calls. I'd love to see this done on Kevin Martin during his years with Houston. That dude could get calls out of no where. The trick is you have to be as objective as possible when determining if a call was deserved or not.

I vote Nono does it.

[Brazil]

Analysis would have been more explicit by putting the ranking of the players attempts at the rim.

And we have

1. Monroe 471 Attempts converting 61%
2. Westbrook 401 As converting 62%
3. Lebron 395 As converting 79% !!!
4. Lee 375 As converting 69%
5. Harden 369 converting 64%

Conclusions:
- Harden, West and Lebron are going at it at a high clip, quite normal they are gifted with some freebies.
- D whistle is 12th on this list, not bad for a tosb
- Bryant is 16th but second in FTs total Attempted and no he doesn't draw more FTs because Defenders are obliged to fool him to avoid automatic mid range, his FG% suck
- Kevin :lol Durant, I had to go deep in the list, he is 35th on the list ! dude needs to grow a pair he is a 7'0 SF, he should go to the hole but he is too much of a pussy for that

Conclusion of the conclusions: Refs love Durant and Bryant, they are bailing them out regularly.

[OKC]

Analysis would have been more explicit by putting the ranking of the players attempts at the rim.

And we have

1. Monroe 471 Attempts converting 61%
2. Westbrook 401 As converting 62%
3. Lebron 395 As converting 79% !!!
4. Lee 375 As converting 69%
5. Harden 369 converting 64%

Conclusions:
- Harden, West and Lebron are going at it at a high clip, quite normal they are gifted with some freebies.
- D whistle is 12th on this list, not bad for a tosb
- Bryant is 16th but second in FTs total Attempted and no he doesn't draw more FTs because Defenders are obliged to fool him to avoid automatic mid range, his FG% suck
- Kevin :lol Durant, I had to go deep in the list, he is 35th on the list ! dude needs to grow a pair he is a 7'0 SF, he should go to the hole but he is too much of a pussy for that

Conclusion of the conclusions: Refs love Durant and Bryant, they are bailing them out regularly.

Hey, at least you can recognize Westbrook's game. Ive defended Westbrook hard on here and his FT attempts. The dude is earning them - totally legit. Ive backed it up with very reasonable comparisons and stats with those of Tony Parkers. To be honest - yes it's more difficult to argue as hard for KD's FT #'s compared to Westbrook's.

[gaKNOW!blee]

There is no player on the face of the planet equal to Kevin Durant in many aspects (no, I didn't just call him the best player on the planet - although honestly, he's #2). Basically you guys are pissed because he shoots 9 freebies a game, when he's basically (arguably) the most unguardable guy on the planet. I don't get it. Yeah he gets his superstar calls and in games where the refs are calling things too close, he gets too many touch fouls. I don't like tightly called games like that. Even aside from that though, KD is fouled - a lot. Westbrook goes to the foul line ONE MORE TIME PER GAME than Tony Parker. You wanna bitch about that? 1 trip to the line more for a guy whose offensive approach in the paint is FAR more aggressive than Parker's and for a guy who shoots, what, 4 more FGs a game than Parker. Whatever. Westbrook is an animal. He's dunking over 7 footers. Of course he's freaking fouled all the time. Open your eyes.

FAR more aggressive? Parker is one of the leaders in points in the paint, and has only attempted 58 3's this year. Westbrook has attempted 247 3's and who knows how many retarded pull up jumpers in transition.

[OKC]

FAR more aggressive? Parker is one of the leaders in points in the paint, and has only attempted 58 3's this year. Westbrook has attempted 247 3's and who knows how many retarded pull up jumpers in transition.

More aggressive. Even if not FAR more aggressive, Westbrook is naturally going to draw more fouls. Like I said in another thread, Parker's much more likely to shoot the floater in the paint, he'll get defenders biting on pass fakes - he typically gets cleaner looks at the rim than Westbrook does. He's like a JJ Barea to me - Barea gets a remarkable amount of uncontested layups. Even Barea averages over 3 attempts at the rim a game, this is for a 5'8 guy not playing starter minutes. Parkers attack on the rim is similar to Bareas - very crafty, but a bit more averse to contact compared to a Westbrook. Westbrook dunks over big men in the league. He can and will attempt to go through and over front court players. Parker will not even attempt it because he lacks the physical capabilities of doing so. That's not to take away from how great Parker is in the paint, but the fact is he goes about it much differently than Westbrook. Certainly a guy like Westbrook being granted ONE additional trip to the line per game over a guy like Parker is completely reasonable.

[Brazil]

Hey, at least you can recognize Westbrook's game. Ive defended Westbrook hard on here and his FT attempts. The dude is earning them - totally legit. Ive backed it up with very reasonable comparisons and stats with those of Tony Parkers. To be honest - yes it's more difficult to argue as hard for KD's FT #'s compared to Westbrook's.

true dat tbh, I was surprised to see Westbrook that high in that list of players going at the rim, 401 attempts is quite amazing for a guard. Therefore there is nothing scandalous for me that he is getting some whistles, he is guarded most of the time by much less athletic guards and go inside. As you recognize KD treatment is much more doubtful even though guarding without fooling him is hard.

[Double-Up]

funny thing is harden gets even more freebies after departing from OKC, which reflects that the rockets have been covertly receiving even more help from the refs than OKC have, and that's the main reason why they're in the playoff range now imho. take refs away from the game and the rockets (a borderline superstar plus a band of immature role players) are no better than what they were in the previous seasons tbh

Do you ever contribute anything meaningful or just mindless drivel?

[OKC]

Yeah, not a real shocker that Harden now gets more freebies now since he's running the damn show and not playing in KD's shadow. You just have to understand some people are always the victims. When they see success they just grasp for things to bitch and moan about. Rather than recognize a player or team's success, they conjure up bizarre reasons for the success. Houston is only better this year than last year because of the REFS? That's about retarded.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Edit : whatever

[ElNono]

The only way to solve this is to have the most objective poster on the NBA board go through each of Durant's foul calls (for maybe 15 games) on Synergy and determine if there was an actual foul.

15 isn't a huge sample size, but it will at least give us an idea. After recording the totals, you can use that to determine:

-Fouls received per game
-True Fouls received per game
-(True Fouls/Total Fouls) %
-Points received off True Fouls
-(Points received off all fouls) - (Points received off True Fouls) = X
-((All points) - X)/games played = legitimate PPG

After you do that, you'd have to do it for a 2-3 other players and compare to see if he's really being gifted calls. I'd love to see this done on Kevin Martin during his years with Houston. That dude could get calls out of no where. The trick is you have to be as objective as possible when determining if a call was deserved or not.

I vote Nono does it.

I think Harlem has Synergy access. Shouldn't be too complicated if he wants to go ahead with it, IMO.

[pad300]

More aggressive. Even if not FAR more aggressive, Westbrook is naturally going to draw more fouls. ... He can and will attempt to go through and over front court players. Parker will not even attempt it because he lacks the physical capabilities of doing so ...

You are probably seeing a little cause/effect confusion here - Parker can go right at big men, and did when he was younger. However, when he got thumped on a shot attempt, he wouldn't get the call ( unlike Westbrook ) so Parker stopped doing it. If Westbrook was getting thumped without getting the call, he'd also likely develop a floater and be much more enthusiastic about avoiding contact.

[OKC]

You are probably seeing a little cause/effect confusion here - Parker can go right at big men, and did when he was younger. However, when he got thumped on a shot attempt, he wouldn't get the call ( unlike Westbrook ) so Parker stopped doing it. If Westbrook was getting thumped without getting the call, he'd also likely develop a floater and be much more enthusiastic about avoiding contact.

Westbrook is completely incapable of bringing himself to shooter floaters. We're talking hardheaded Westbrook here. He's gonna do what he's gonna do whether he gets the call or not. Ive never seen the guy shoot a floater.

[pad300]

I think Harlem has Synergy access. Shouldn't be too complicated if he wants to go ahead with it, IMO.

Actually, it would be quite a bit harder than you think. The key is not necessarily in the calls Durant gets - but rather the calls that other players don't get. As Jerry Sloan's Jazz teams occasionally demonstrated, referees can't/won't call all the fouls in a game - it gets too choppy. So you'd have to look at all of each player's time on the court (including time off the ball) to see if someone is drawing fouls at an unusual rate.

[ElNono]

Yeah, not a real shocker that Harden now gets more freebies now since he's running the damn show and not playing in KD's shadow. You just have to understand some people are always the victims. When they see success they just grasp for things to bitch and moan about. Rather than recognize a player or team's success, they conjure up bizarre reasons for the success. Houston is only better this year than last year because of the REFS? That's about retarded.

As Brazil cleverly pointed out, Harden is a player (along with Westbrook, Lebron, there goes your assist men theory) that attacks the rim consistently, thus it makes sense he'll get a bulk of his points from the freebie line. The real mystery is how Durant is even close to Harden at all in the freebie rankings.

[pad300]

Westbrook is completely incapable of bringing himself to shooter floaters. We're talking hardheaded Westbrook here. He's gonna do what he's gonna do whether he gets the call or not. Ive never seen the guy shoot a floater.

IF he'd spent his rookie season collecting bruises and floor burns without shooting a ton of free throws, his head might be a little softer...

[jag]

Actually, it would be quite a bit harder than you think. The key is not necessarily in the calls Durant gets - but rather the calls that other players don't get. As Jerry Sloan's Jazz teams occasionally demonstrated, referees can't/won't call all the fouls in a game - it gets too choppy. So you'd have to look at all of each player's time on the court (including time off the ball) to see if someone is drawing fouls at an unusual rate.

We have two different goals here.

I really don't care if Kyle Korver is getting cheated out of a foul call during a game against the Cavs in November. What I want to know is out of the top 5 players in the League to draw the most fouls, how many of the foul calls are legitimate fouls. Are the refs just gifting these guys an inordinate amount of calls, or are those dudes just good at getting the defender out of position and drawing contact? They're obviously good at drawing calls, but out of those calls, how many are really fouls?

It doesn't really matter to me if Boobie Gibson is getting the same calls or not.

[UNCLE-DREW]

Now we talking ElNono. This is my kind of thread. :toast

Using your formula, I want to provide world class analysis on D-Whistle:

Total points: 1304
Free Throws Made: 274
Percentage of points from FTAs: 21% (274 divided by 1304)

I need to calculate to see if D-Whistle is still an elite player. Using my Hollingeresque formula:

21% of his points are FTAs. So, 21%*1304 points = 273.84.
Subtract FTA% points from total points (1304-273.84) = 1030.16
Take that total and divide by total games played to get true ppg (1030.16/60). I get 17.17 ppg (rounded up because I am a nice guy).

There you have it folks. Wade is really a 17.17 ppg scorer. Please not that these numbers would drop like a bad habit if he wasn't coat tailing LeBron and Bosh. Their mere presence makes it easier on D-Whistle to score. Case in point, if he were in Houston, he would not be the 21.7 ppg scorer that he appears to be. In other words, he's still a referee dependent superstar. But...without FTAs, he ain't shit.
Neal with it Ace. :downspin:


987 FGA 0.524 FG% 16,2 FGA

1368 FGA 0.468 FG% 20,4 FGA

sup chucker

[OKC]

KD is a genius at drawing defenders in. YOu guys can't see this? He has a harder time baiting the Lebrons and Marions of the league because these guys are smart, but 8 out of 10 guys that defend Durant are setting themselves up for failure. In their mind, their goal is to smother Durant. Don't give him any space to work or force him to one side of the court. So they'll front him in one direction, all up in his business, and he recognizes this and baits them into the foul. Yeah he's initiating the contact. The defender isn't always swiping and fouling Durant, but the rules state that a defender cannot impede the forward motion of an offensive player with his arms. Durant sees the defender crowding and if the defenders arms are forward and down at all, he can drive right into him. It's a foul. You ever see a guy try and take a charge with his arms forward? No, because he'd be called for a block. Durant is just catching these guys sleeping and with his long stride and arms he's driving right into their arms. How is it not a foul? Fans see it and call BS because the defender isn't actually hacking at Durant, but its still a foul nonetheless.

[gaKNOW!blee]

KD is a genius at drawing defenders in. YOu guys can't see this? He has a harder time baiting the Lebrons and Marions of the league because these guys are smart, but 8 out of 10 guys that defend Durant are setting themselves up for failure. In their mind, their goal is to smother Durant. Don't give him any space to work or force him to one side of the court. So they'll front him in one direction, all up in his business, and he recognizes this and baits them into the foul. Yeah he's initiating the contact. The defender isn't always swiping and fouling Durant, but the rules state that a defender cannot impede the forward motion of an offensive player with his arms. Durant sees the defender crowding and if the defenders arms are forward and down at all, he can drive right into him. It's a foul. You ever see a guy try and take a charge with his arms forward? No, because he'd be called for a block. Durant is just catching these guys sleeping and with his long stride and arms he's driving right into their arms. How is it not a foul? Fans see it and call BS because the defender isn't actually hacking at Durant, but its still a foul nonetheless.

actually he's just a skinny little bitch who falls down anytime someone breathes on him. guys like Lebron aren't built like birds so the contact isn't as noticeable.

tbh.

[jag]

KD is a genius at drawing defenders in. YOu guys can't see this?

:lol of course, brah. He's good at drawing legitimate fouls. But he also gets some calls that seem ridiculous. I just want to know how many fouls he draws that are unwarranted.

[jag]

I might just go ahead and do it sometime this week when I have time. I could do all the games since the all-star break.

[Seventyniner]

I was curious about some of these stats so I used Hoopdata. I decided to sort players by FGA at rim per 40 minutes, only for players that play at least 25 MPG.
http://www.hoopdata.com/shotstats.aspx?team=%25&type=pm&posi=%25&yr=2013&gp2=0&mins=25

Kevin Durant ranks #72 out of 168 with 4.6 FGA at rim per 40 minutes. The fact that he is 2nd in the league in FTA/game (3rd in FTA/40 min) boggles the mind.
For comparison, Harden is #27, Bryant #46, LeBron #17, Westbrook #11, Parker #15.

For more perspective, the following players take more shots at the rim per 40 minutes than Kevin Durant while playing at least 25 MPG:
John Wall, Ty Lawson, Tony Allen (cause he can't shoot), Eric Gordon, Kemba Walker, Raymond Felton, Rudy Gay (surprised), Andre Miller, Chandler Parsons, Jeremy Lin, Shannon Brown, Brandon Knight, Jrue Holiday, Luol Deng, Rodney Stuckey, and in a virtual tie with KD....Matt B:lolrnes
I left out big men because they're expected to take a lot of shots at the rim.

[ElNono]

The 'KD is a savvy vet that knows how to draw fouls' angle :lol

He's defended by the same guys that guard Lebron but don't foul him anywhere near as much :lol

[Cry Havoc]

The 'KD is a savvy vet that knows how to draw fouls' angle :lol

He's defended by the same guys that guard Lebron but don't foul him anywhere near as much :lol

Clearly, he's just far more intelligent with his BBIQ than LeBron is. :lol :lol :lol

[OKC]

[QUOTE=ElNono;6425027]The 'KD is a savvy vet that knows how to draw fouls' angle :lol

It's a true statement. Whether or not you agree with every call made that results in KD shooting a free throw, he does draw a good number of legit fouls, many due to his intelligence in taking advantage of a defender's position.
Something else that's food for thought - why do you think KD doesn't take a lot of shots at the rim? Why does Chandler Parsons, Shannon Brown, all of these guys..why do they take more at the rim? Because the defense has bigger fish to concentrate on. KD is the main focus of the defense,night in and night out. It's constant pressure, double teams, weak side help. He can't get to the damn rim most of the time. He's fouled before he can even get there - truth. Again, not denying he gets a share of his borderline calls, but there's a legit reason for the low at rim attempts.

[OKC]

Clearly, he's just far more intelligent with his BBIQ than LeBron is. :lol :lol :lol

Actually, if you've read all of my posts today, you'll find I stated the opposite. Nice of you to put words in my mouth though.

[Seventyniner]

It's a true statement. Whether or not you agree with every call made that results in KD shooting a free throw, he does draw a good number of legit fouls, many due to his intelligence in taking advantage of a defender's position.
Something else that's food for thought - why do you think KD doesn't take a lot of shots at the rim? Why does Chandler Parsons, Shannon Brown, all of these guys..why do they take more at the rim? Because the defense has bigger fish to concentrate on. KD is the main focus of the defense,night in and night out. It's constant pressure, double teams, weak side help. He can't get to the damn rim most of the time. He's fouled before he can even get there - truth. Again, not denying he gets a share of his borderline calls, but there's a legit reason for the low at rim attempts.

Utter horseshit. Harden and Parker get to the rim plenty often while being the primary offensive option for their teams. Also, Durant has a teammate in Westbrook who draws more attention than any of Parker's or Harden's teammates.

As time goes on, Durant will find it harder and harder to make an impact in playoff games. Durant gets many of his FTA by taking advantage of the rules, and defenders can learn that game too. Put Durant in the hand-check era and he averages 22 PPG and is a borderline All-Star.

[OKC]

Utter horseshit. Harden and Parker get to the rim plenty often while being the primary offensive option for their teams. Also, Durant has a teammate in Westbrook who draws more attention than any of Parker's or Harden's teammates.

As time goes on, Durant will find it harder and harder to make an impact in playoff games. Durant gets many of his FTA by taking advantage of the rules, and defenders can learn that game too. Put Durant in the hand-check era and he averages 22 PPG and is a borderline All-Star.

Why are you comparing KD to point guards/shooting guards? Of course a PG is going to get in the paint a lot easier. KD is 6'10. It's physics. Why do you think JJ Barea can get in the paint at will against anyone in the league? Center of gravity. First step. In addition, the double teams and fact that KD catches the ball in isolation also impacts his ability to get to the rim.

[OKC]

Put Durant in the hand-check era and he averages 22 PPG and is a borderline All-Star.

That's absolutely absurd and you basically lost all credibility with that ridiculous statement.

[OKC]

I'm not gonna call anyone an idiot or anything for thinking KD gets some free calls, but when someone suggests KD is maybe not even an all-star caliber player without hand check calls from the refs, that's just complete horseshit.

[Cry Havoc]

Why are you comparing KD to point guards/shooting guards? Of course a PG is going to get in the paint a lot easier. KD is 6'10. It's physics. Why do you think JJ Barea can get in the paint at will against anyone in the league? Center of gravity. First step. In addition, the double teams and fact that KD catches the ball in isolation also impacts his ability to get to the rim.

Maybe because you didn't qualify your statement when you said that KD is the focus of the defense? So is Parker. So is LeBron. So are a ton of other guards and forwards that don't get nearly the freebies that Durant does.

[Cry Havoc]

I was curious about some of these stats so I used Hoopdata. I decided to sort players by FGA at rim per 40 minutes, only for players that play at least 25 MPG.
http://www.hoopdata.com/shotstats.aspx?team=%25&type=pm&posi=%25&yr=2013&gp2=0&mins=25

Kevin Durant ranks #72 out of 168 with 4.6 FGA at rim per 40 minutes. The fact that he is 2nd in the league in FTA/game (3rd in FTA/40 min) boggles the mind.
For comparison, Harden is #27, Bryant #46, LeBron #17, Westbrook #11, Parker #15.

For more perspective, the following players take more shots at the rim per 40 minutes than Kevin Durant while playing at least 25 MPG:
John Wall, Ty Lawson, Tony Allen (cause he can't shoot), Eric Gordon, Kemba Walker, Raymond Felton, Rudy Gay (surprised), Andre Miller, Chandler Parsons, Jeremy Lin, Shannon Brown, Brandon Knight, Jrue Holiday, Luol Deng, Rodney Stuckey, and in a virtual tie with KD....Matt B:lolrnes
I left out big men because they're expected to take a lot of shots at the rim.

This is pretty damning, tbh.

[Cry Havoc]

Actually, if you've read all of my posts today, you'll find I stated the opposite. Nice of you to put words in my mouth though.

You said KD gets fouled because of his intelligence at his position. That implies that LeBron does not have similar intelligence.

Nice try of you to backpedal without admitting anything though.

[OKC]

I get your point, but the fact is you'll see fewer at rim attempts from KD because the whistle is often blown before he can get there. Surely noone will argue that point. lol There's SOME truth to the fact that if KD does get a step or two on a guy, he's gonna get hacked. If you let KD get within 8 feet of the basket, it's an automatic 2. He's more automatic than anyone in the league if he gets that close.

[mercos]

To many fouls are called in the NBA period at this point. The most notorious in my opinion are the body contact fouls that lead to And 1s. These are usually caused by the offensive player initiating contact on the way to a layup or dunk. Superstars feast on these calls. Would love to see statistics on And 1s. I'm guessing a top ten list would be superstar heavy, with some random bigs possibly thrown in. Its very aggravating when someone gets a whistle on a virtually uncontested layup or dunk because they brushed against a defender. Its a fast moving game, there is going to be some contact.

[OKC]

You said KD gets fouled because of his intelligence at his position. That implies that LeBron does not have similar intelligence..



Tell me you aren't that stupid, please. I said KD gets fouled because he's an intelligent player and you automatically turn that into me implying Lebron is NOT intelligent? Do you always put words in people's mouths? The post in question is #47 in this thread. Go read it and tell me where I even indirectly implied a damn thing about Lebron James.

[OKC]

For the record - Lebron James, in my opinion, is the smartest player in the league.

[Cry Havoc]

Tell me you aren't that stupid, please. I said KD gets fouled because he's an intelligent player and you automatically turn that into me implying Lebron is NOT intelligent? Do you always put words in people's mouths? The post in question is #47 in this thread. Go read it and tell me where I even indirectly implied a damn thing about Lebron James.

You are stating that KD is smart and therefore knows how to draw fouls.

Why is it that LeBron is unable to draw fouls, then?


For the record - Lebron James, in my opinion, is the smartest player in the league.

But not smart enough to draw fouls?

By all means continue with the ad hominems. I'm just pointing out the flaw in your logic.

[OKC]

You are stating that KD is smart and therefore knows how to draw fouls.

Why is it that LeBron is unable to draw fouls, then?



But not smart enough to draw fouls?

By all means continue with the ad hominems. I'm just pointing out the flaw in your logic.

I've not even attempted to make an argument as to why KD shoots more free throws than Lebron. I simply stated some of the reasons KD draws a lot of fouls. You just seemed to make the assumption that I was trying to justify KD shooting 2.7 more FT a game. I don't have a problem admitting that I don't have anything specific as to exactly why that is (I don't watch Miami much), but I can say Lebron is more of a pass first oriented player. He assists the ball quite a bit more than KD, that is a fact. I'm not suggesting that accounts for the entire FT difference, but it is a factor.

[Cry Havoc]

I've not even attempted to make an argument as to why KD shoots more free throws than Lebron. I simply stated some of the reasons KD draws a lot of fouls. You just seemed to make the assumption that I was trying to justify KD shooting 2.7 more FT a game. I don't have a problem admitting that I don't have anything specific as to exactly why that is (I don't watch Miami much), but I can say Lebron is more of a pass first oriented player. He assists the ball quite a bit more than KD, that is a fact. I'm not suggesting that accounts for the entire FT difference, but it is a factor.

LeBron scores nearly as much as KD. His higher assist totals mean that he has the ball MORE.

So your position on this matter is that a player who scores 26.5 PPG on 55%+ shooting with a PER of 30+ is a "pass-first player"? Serious question. LeBron scores less than 2 PPG fewer than Durant.


You just seemed to make the assumption that I was trying to justify KD shooting 2.7 more FT a game

It's not an assumption when that's exactly what you're doing.

[DejuanorwhatDude]

KD is a genius at drawing defenders in. YOu guys can't see this? He has a harder time baiting the Lebrons and Marions of the league because these guys are smart, but 8 out of 10 guys that defend Durant are setting themselves up for failure. In their mind, their goal is to smother Durant. Don't give him any space to work or force him to one side of the court. So they'll front him in one direction, all up in his business, and he recognizes this and baits them into the foul. Yeah he's initiating the contact. The defender isn't always swiping and fouling Durant, but the rules state that a defender cannot impede the forward motion of an offensive player with his arms. Durant sees the defender crowding and if the defenders arms are forward and down at all, he can drive right into him. It's a foul. You ever see a guy try and take a charge with his arms forward? No, because he'd be called for a block. Durant is just catching these guys sleeping and with his long stride and arms he's driving right into their arms. How is it not a foul? Fans see it and call BS because the defender isn't actually hacking at Durant, but its still a foul nonetheless.

I think you're right but that still makes Durant a bitch. He uses his physical advantages(lankiness) against people that are trying to defend him and because he's also an amazing shooter/competent at driving to the hoop refs give him the benefit of the doubt. People complain about Ginobili or Blake Griffin being a flop artist but really the master in the game today is Durant. He does it so well that no one seems to notice.

[TDfan2007]

Hey, at least you can recognize Westbrook's game. Ive defended Westbrook hard on here and his FT attempts. The dude is earning them - totally legit. Ive backed it up with very reasonable comparisons and stats with those of Tony Parkers. To be honest - yes it's more difficult to argue as hard for KD's FT #'s compared to Westbrook's.

Westbrook earns just about every one of his FT attempts. He gets hit a lot going to the rim. Durant, on the other hand...some of the calls are just ridiculous. Defenders can't even body him up because it's an automatic foul, which makes him virtually impossible to guard. Anyone would tell you that the way to defend a shooter is to take away his air space, but if you can't do that, then guys like Durant will go wild.

Also, I have NEVER seen a player get more calls on east-west movement than Durant.

[da_suns_fan]

Anything you disagree with?

Yeah. Your conclusion that someone who shoots a lot of free throws is "protected".

James Harden takes more hard drives to the basket in one game than anyone on the Spurs does all season. The fact that he's number one despite not being on OKC anymore confirms that its not "the team" thats getting a lot of calls but the actual players, regardless of what team theyre on. You just proved that OKC wasnt "protected".

Good job.

[OKC]

LeBron scores nearly as much as KD. His higher assist totals mean that he has the ball MORE.

So your position on this matter is that a player who scores 26.5 PPG on 55%+ shooting with a PER of 30+ is a "pass-first player"? Serious question. LeBron scores less than 2 PPG fewer than Durant.


It's not an assumption when that's exactly what you're doing.

Well, he's not exactly Ricky Rubio. I do realize Lebron is a premiere scorer, but relative to some other big time scorers in the league, he does seem a bit more interested in assisting the ball.

No, it's not what I'm doing. You've just got it in your head that that's what I'm doing. I never made this a KD vs Lebron FT argument. I even admitted to KD getting his freebies. I cannot justify KD's 2.7 more FTs per game using stats and I do not watch Miami enough to really qualify as someone who knows the ins and outs of what Lebron does nightly.

[OKC]

Yeah. Your conclusion that someone who shoots a lot of free throws is "protected".

James Harden takes more hard drives to the basket in one game than anyone on the Spurs does all season. The fact that he's number one despite not being on OKC anymore confirms that its not "the team" thats getting a lot of calls but the actual players, regardless of what team theyre on. You just proved that OKC wasnt "protected".

Good job.

James Harden could've gone to Washington and he'd be shooting the same # of FTs and all of a sudden Washington would be Stern's favorite team or some BS. People hate Harden because he does that two handed low hold on the ball and baits people in. It's a foul, sorry. People need to quit hating a guy that knows how to bait defenders.

[phxspurfan]

Durant is impossible to guard. He's a 7 footer with quickness and a jumper. Dude is like 2008 Dirk but faster. Of course he's gonna get foul calls. He's better than almost 100% of the people he sees every night. He will outmaneuver whoever and get a bucket or get to the line.


That being said, that stupid swing your arms under the guy and get free throws is gay.

[HarlemHeat37]

Harden's fouls are legit, as are Westbrook's, but along with Durant, they are probably the cheapest players in NBA history, tbh..

I can't hate on them for legally exploiting the rules, but it's evident that all 3 guys struggle without the whistle, tbh..when the officials are calling a loose game and allowing both teams to play physical, their teams struggle to win..

[OKC]

Harden's fouls are legit, as are Westbrook's, but along with Durant, they are probably the cheapest players in NBA history, tbh..

I can't hate on them for legally exploiting the rules, but it's evident that all 3 guys struggle without the whistle, tbh..when the officials are calling a loose game and allowing both teams to play physical, their teams struggle to win..

OKC is 14-2 on the season in games where Kevin Durant shoots 6 or fewer free throws. Thanks.

[HarlemHeat37]

Show me their record without a significant FT advantage as a team, along with their opponents during the stretch, tbh..

If I'm wrong, I'll give you credit..

[whitemamba]

^

[FkLA]

Analysis would have been more explicit by putting the ranking of the players attempts at the rim.

And we have

1. Monroe 471 Attempts converting 61%
2. Westbrook 401 As converting 62%
3. Lebron 395 As converting 79% !!!
4. Lee 375 As converting 69%
5. Harden 369 converting 64%

Conclusions:
- Harden, West and Lebron are going at it at a high clip, quite normal they are gifted with some freebies.
- D whistle is 12th on this list, not bad for a tosb
- Bryant is 16th but second in FTs total Attempted and no he doesn't draw more FTs because Defenders are obliged to fool him to avoid automatic mid range, his FG% suck
- Kevin :lol Durant, I had to go deep in the list, he is 35th on the list ! dude needs to grow a pair he is a 7'0 SF, he should go to the hole but he is too much of a pussy for that

Conclusion of the conclusions: Refs love Durant and Bryant, they are bailing them out regularly.

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2306417/KawhiBehindTheBackSlam.gif

Brazil just went coast to coast tbh.

[ElNono]

Yeah. Your conclusion that someone who shoots a lot of free throws is "protected".

James Harden takes more hard drives to the basket in one game than anyone on the Spurs does all season. The fact that he's number one despite not being on OKC anymore confirms that its not "the team" thats getting a lot of calls but the actual players, regardless of what team theyre on. You just proved that OKC wasnt "protected".

Good job.

AFAIK, the argument has always been that certain "players" are protected. That 3 of them happened to play for OKC simply projected that into the team. I'm not sure how this is really a question. And while Harden surely goes to the rack a lot, he definitely doesn't do it twice as much as, say, Lebron. At least actual numbers don't support that contention.

[OKC]

Show me their record without a significant FT advantage as a team, along with their opponents during the stretch, tbh..

If I'm wrong, I'll give you credit..

Ok, this year OKC has played 35 games in which they did not hold a significant team FT advantage - for this purpose, I considered anything less than +5 as a team to be not significant - although let's call it +4 because there actually were no +5's.

Total wins - 25
Total losses - 9
Wins in games with a 0 or deficit in FTs for OKC - 13
Wins against "playoff teams" (including Utah since only a game back) - 12 (CHI, GS, HOU, LAL, ATL, HOU, DEN, LAC, GS, CHI, LAL, UTAH)

[Cry Havoc]

No, it's not what I'm doing. You've just got it in your head that that's what I'm doing. I never made this a KD vs Lebron FT argument. I even admitted to KD getting his freebies. I cannot justify KD's 2.7 more FTs per game using stats and I do not watch Miami enough to really qualify as someone who knows the ins and outs of what Lebron does nightly.

Well, thanks for that. So why are you arguing then? KD gets incredibly biased treatment from the refs. There. Debate over.


Ok, this year OKC has played 35 games in which they did not hold a significant team FT advantage - for this purpose, I considered anything less than +5 as a team to be not significant - although let's call it +4 because there actually were no +5's.

Total wins - 25
Total losses - 9
Wins in games with a 0 or deficit in FTs for OKC - 13
Wins against "playoff teams" (including Utah since only a game back) - 12 (CHI, GS, HOU, LAL, ATL, HOU, DEN, LAC, GS, CHI, LAL, UTAH)

And that's fine. I would have expected as much. The rub here is that OKC is a great team. Even with no officiating help at all they would be a really tough out for any team in the playoffs. Notice how neither SAS or Miami are listed in that rundown of teams they beat when calls were even? Yeah, there's a reason for that. I don't think even the most blind OKC hater would say that if officiating were exactly 100% accurate that there would be more than 3-4 teams in the entire NBA capable of beating them in 7. They're a great team that gets a ton of favorable calls, and that's why they're starting to lose the respect of a lot of fanbases, because whether it's true or not, it's giving the appearance of a team that is completely reliant on favorable officiating.

The fact alone that OKC plays 50%+ of it's games with a 5+ free throw advantage is pretty ludicrous. I'd be willing to bet that it's far ahead of every other team in the league, save maybe the Lakers because of the hack-a-Howard.

[Spursfanfromafar]

Kevin Durant is a great player. He is like neo-Nowitzki with an array of post, elbow moves, jumpers, etc. I am not surprised that his rim attempts per game are significantly lower in comparison with other "superstars"/ "heavy scorers". I suppose that is due to the nature of his game.

And yes, while he does get "superstar" calls, he also knows how to draw those fouls. An athletic, high shooting and scoring big man who has the ability of a guard should od that. I don't understand the fuss.

[Cry Havoc]

Kevin Durant is a great player. He is like neo-Nowitzki with an array of post, elbow moves, jumpers, etc. I am not surprised that his rim attempts per game are significantly lower in comparison with other "superstars"/ "heavy scorers". I suppose that is due to the nature of his game.

And yes, while he does get "superstar" calls, he also knows how to draw those fouls. An athletic, high shooting and scoring big man who has the ability of a guard should od that. I don't understand the fuss.

The fuss is the consistency. Remember how Bruce Bowen used to play defense? If the refs called fouls on him like they do for Durant, Bowen would have averaged 5 minutes per game for his career, because he'd pick up 4 fouls in the first 3 minutes of the game and foul out within the first 2 minutes of the second half. You HAVE to give defenders a certain amount of room and leverage to play defense, otherwise it would be absolutely impossible and we'd see games of 150+ points per team again. Durant is impossible not just because of his skillset, but because he has a halo around him that defenders are allowed to do nothing about. Can't touch him, can't be in his space, can't go near him without free throws.

kQl9hMQbFLY

While he might not get calls quite this egregious every game, this kind of phantom foul happens at least a couple of times per game, especially in OKC.

[OKC]

The fact alone that OKC plays 50%+ of it's games with a 5+ free throw advantage is pretty ludicrous. I'd be willing to bet that it's far ahead of every other team in the league, save maybe the Lakers because of the hack-a-Howard.

No, it's not 50% of games with a +5. They play over 50% with a MAX of a +4. +4 given OKC's style of play is insignificant. Only 6 of those games are a +4. Looks like 7 at +3. 1 game at a +2. Two +1's. One at 0. 18 games with a FT DEFICIT. To me, these stats speak to the fact that SOME people (not pointing at you) get a little ridiculous with their exaggerations. To them, honestly, OKC is a +15 nightly and if they're not a +15, they can't win, and without the refs, they're an average team. There's actually people on this board that think OKC is a 5 or 6 seed team without the refs, which is just laughable. I really have no idea why you find these numbers ludicrous. Over half their games they're no more than +4 in FTs!

[OKC]

I'll recount, but I counted the same games for SA - games where they were no more than a +4 in FT and I got 41. Really, is that all that different from OKC? No. 41 SA, 35 OKC. Fairly close.

[OKC]

What's interesting if you look at KD's game log is there's 26 games this season where he's shot double digit FTs in a game. There's a handful (8-9 games maybe) of crazy attempts like 16, 17, 18, 22, etc. Now 26 games is a lot, but given the fact the guy nearly AVERAGES double digit FTs in a game (he's at 9.4 now, I think was at 9.7 or something), you might expect more than 26 out of 67 games to be double digits in FTs. The 5, 6, 7 FT attempts in a game FAR outnumber anything else. I think there's definitely games where refs set a certain tone and set out to call a game a certain way in terms of what they'll allow defenders to do...will they let them "Play" or not? The games where the refs "aren't letting them play" I think KD is getting the stupid FT numbers. These anomaly type games, I think, are spiking KD's average by 1.5 FTs or so. I think these games are where fans get pissed and play the favoritism card. I can't say I blame them. As I've said before, I want the refs to let them play too.

[Cry Havoc]

No, it's not 50% of games with a +5. They play over 50% with a MAX of a +4. +4 given OKC's style of play is insignificant. Only 6 of those games are a +4. Looks like 7 at +3. 1 game at a +2. Two +1's. One at 0. 18 games with a FT DEFICIT. To me, these stats speak to the fact that SOME people (not pointing at you) get a little ridiculous with their exaggerations. To them, honestly, OKC is a +15 nightly and if they're not a +15, they can't win, and without the refs, they're an average team. There's actually people on this board that think OKC is a 5 or 6 seed team without the refs, which is just laughable. I really have no idea why you find these numbers ludicrous. Over half their games they're no more than +4 in FTs!

The fact that you think it's remarkable that in 18 of the 67 games the Thunder have played that they've shot fewer FTs than their opponent is proof of anything is absolutely ludicrous. 75% of the time you are being given more free throws than your opponent, in and many of those games it's a significant margin.

[OKC]

The fact that you think it's remarkable that in 18 of the 67 games the Thunder have played that they've shot fewer FTs than their opponent is proof of anything is absolutely ludicrous. 75% of the time you are being given more free throws than your opponent, in and many of those games it's a significant margin.

More than 50% of the games OKC plays, they have very little, if any, FT advantage. I don't know how else to put it to you. Over 50% their games, they have NO MORE THAN a +4 FT advantage. There you go again, putting words in my mouth. Where did I say it was "remarkable" that OKC was at a FT disadvantage in 18 of 67 games? I never even IMPLIED it was remarkable. I simply stated that those posters here who completely go overboard with their exaggerations on OKC's FT disparity would probably tone it down a bit if they found that out. Honestly, if you asked some of the posters on here at random how many games OKC is at a FT disparity they'd probably tell you 1 in 10. Just saying some people exaggerate what actually occurs. I'm not trying to paint a picture that OKC is in anyway not at an advantage in FT attempts. I'm well aware they are. I'm simply trying to point out to some posters that its not a nightly occurence. Yeah there's games where they're +10 and so on, but I guarantee you some posters here would NEVER guess OKC is at little, if any, FT advantage in over 50% of their games.

[Latarian Milton]

durant would be nothing more than a glorified novak w/o calls imho. dude is an elite shooter and happens to be gifted with good agility as well, but his fundamentals ain't all that good. dude has little-to-none low-post game despite being 6'10 something because he's thin as fuck, and if the refs allow defenders to get close to him i don't think it would be possible for a 6'10 guy to dribble past 6 footers.

[OKC]

durant would be nothing more than a glorified novak w/o calls imho. dude is an elite shooter and happens to be gifted with good agility as well, but his fundamentals ain't all that good. dude has little-to-none low-post game despite being 6'10 something because he's thin as fuck, and if the refs allow defenders to get close to him i don't think it would be possible for a 6'10 guy to dribble past 6 footers.

WOw. You're not any smarter than that? Really?

[gaKNOW!blee]

Lebron bumped every time he goes to the rim...but only 6 FTA tonight. If Durant played this exact same game he would have at the very least 12 FTA.