View Full Version : Law school going the way of Art majors?
ElNono
04-02-2013, 01:44 AM
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-law-grads-20130402,0,1312864.story
DUNCANownsKOBE
04-02-2013, 02:05 AM
Yeah if it's not from a top program law school is a giant waste of money. Same thing with MBAs tbh.
CosmicCowboy
04-02-2013, 06:49 AM
The first time my son told me he wanted to be an attorney I told him that if that was what he really wanted to do then he was gonna have to kick ass in undergrad and sculpt a resume that would get him into a top tier law school because I was already seeing the trend of broke ass starving lawyers coming out of the second tier schools like St. Marys.
symple19
04-02-2013, 08:29 AM
crofl
TDMVPDPOY
04-02-2013, 08:58 AM
The first time my son told me he wanted to be an attorney I told him that if that was what he really wanted to do then he was gonna have to kick ass in undergrad and sculpt a resume that would get him into a top tier law school because I was already seeing the trend of broke ass starving lawyers coming out of the second tier schools like St. Marys.
my brother did a GED justice program, he wants to do law school...being asian in anglo saxon country, i dont hear or see any succesful asian attorneys, all of them handle pussy cases...so i told him is it worth the money to study law and be unemployed cause ur just not good enough....
BradLohaus
04-02-2013, 09:30 AM
There's a saying that China produces 10 engineers for every lawyer, while the US produces 10 lawyers for every engineer. Probably not true, but still...
Blake
04-02-2013, 09:33 AM
I deserve respect and justice so I want someone who demands it.
DUNCANownsKOBE
04-02-2013, 09:39 AM
There's a saying that China produces 10 engineers for every lawyer, while the US produces 10 lawyers for every engineer. Probably not true, but still...
Probably truer than you'd think. The US doesn't produce any engineers anymore, largely cause the US doesn't make shit anymore.
Yeah if it's not from a top program law school is a giant waste of money. Same thing with MBAs tbh.
This. Although this Lieberman dude got straight fucked. I graduated in 2009 from UT. 50% of my class was unemployed because of the crash. Top tier firms (i.e., Skadden) deferred the incoming class for a year. Others straight up rescinded offers to graduates. All this is to say that homeboy might not be the best example. I've also heard that law school enrollment has gone done in the past few years because this message has gotten a lot of play. But that's just hearsay and I don't have actual numbers.
InRareForm
04-02-2013, 12:08 PM
There's associates degrees with starting salary of 50k to 80,000
You don't go to law school to make 50-80k
Wild Cobra
04-02-2013, 02:43 PM
You don't go to law school to make 50-80k
But if there is a supply and demand imbalance of lawyers, that could happen.
I believe in most states, you only need to pass the Bar Exam to practice. This might be the better way to start, and know if you can cut it or not. Someone who is a natural, will accel, even with limited schooling.
CosmicCowboy
04-02-2013, 03:09 PM
You don't go to law school to make 50-80k
There is a shitload of lawyers making less than that.
True. But I bet most, if not all, went to law school expecting to make double that.
CosmicCowboy
04-02-2013, 03:57 PM
True. But I bet most, if not all, went to law school expecting to make double that.
Yeah, my son broke 300K this year with bonus.
boutons_deux
04-02-2013, 04:07 PM
salary.com for "Attorney I", San Antonio, TX
http://swz.salary.com/SalaryWizard/Attorney-I-Salary-Details-San-Antonio-TX.aspx
Yeah, my son broke 300K this year with bonus.
That's pretty good. Depending on the city, it's not uncommon for partners at big firms to make between 600-1MM
SA has a godawful legal market. I'm not surprised at all the median is 78k
CosmicCowboy
04-02-2013, 04:30 PM
That's pretty good. Depending on the city, it's not uncommon for partners at big firms to make between 600-1MM
Yeah he was doing the partner track at a big firm and one of the big movie/entertainment studios in LA hired him away to oversee litigation.
CosmicCowboy
04-02-2013, 04:33 PM
SA has a godawful legal market. I'm not surprised at all the median is 78k
Yeah, and the sad part is they think they have to play the part of the "successful lawyer" with the expensive suits and the fancy cars. I love making twice what they do wearing jeans to work.
Yeah he was doing the partner track at a big firm and one of the big movie/entertainment studios in LA hired him away to oversee litigation.
That'll do it ... that sounds like a fucking awesome job.
Yeah, and the sad part is they think they have to play the part of the "successful lawyer" with the expensive suits and the fancy cars. I love making twice what they do wearing jeans to work.
If you're a lawyer in Texas and not in Houston, you're doing it wrong ...
InRareForm
04-02-2013, 05:31 PM
True. But I bet most, if not all, went to law school expecting to make double that.
A gambler also goes to the casino expecting to win
boutons_deux
04-02-2013, 05:38 PM
Does USA really need 95% of the planet`s lawyers? why?
I don't think it's fair to analogize a law school to a casino
boutons_deux
04-02-2013, 05:46 PM
...
FromWayDowntown
04-02-2013, 05:48 PM
No offense FWD
None taken. There are ways to make a good living as an attorney -- even in a recessed economy and even in a state that is legislating away civil litigation -- without living in Houston or Dallas. But I think you'd better be pretty good at what you do and very flexible about what you're willing to work on. I changed jobs right about the time the economy went into the crapper and have managed to make a living in SA even as the market for lawyers and the amount of litigation has diminished. But I know there are a lot of people out there who are hunting for work and willing to take just about anything. And whereas it seemed my lawyer friends were frequently changing jobs before 2008 or were staying in place only to try to gain a partnership, most are now staying put even if partnership isn't available to them.
Because this country was founded by lawyers who designed the country to be one of "laws not men"
TheProfessor
04-02-2013, 10:50 PM
You don't go to law school to make 50-80k
Eh, some of us knew we were public-sector destined. But if that was the case, it was best to get some sort of tuition assistance, look into loan forgiveness, etc.
Jacob1983
04-03-2013, 01:43 AM
I'd jizz my pants if I made 50k to 80k. Fuck, I'd probably fill up toilet full of jizz if I made that much.
Wild Cobra
04-03-2013, 02:32 AM
That's pretty good. Depending on the city, it's not uncommon for partners at big firms to make between 600-1MM
LOL...
I'll bet some of these same graduates expect to be a partner right out of school too...
Wild Cobra
04-03-2013, 02:32 AM
SA has a godawful legal market. I'm not surprised at all the median is 78k
Shit, I make more than that as a parts changer.
FromWayDowntown
04-03-2013, 08:08 AM
LOL...
I'll bet some of these same graduates expect to be a partner right out of school too...
Nobody expects to graduate and be made partner.
boutons_deux
04-03-2013, 01:36 PM
not just law or arts grads, it's damn near all grads
=========
the economic recovery is perpetuating the trend of college graduates turning to minimum wage jobs. Though there has been significant employment gains, many recent college graduates have been forced to resort to low-wage, low-skilled jobs. There are now 13.4 million college graduates working for hourly pay [4], up 19 percent since the start of the recession.
According to the Department of Labor, there are about 284,000 graduates [3] with at least a bachelor’s degree that were working minimum wage jobs in 2012.
"Lower-wage occupations were 21 percent of recession losses, but 58 percent of recovery growth.
Mid-wage occupations were 60 percent of recession losses, but only 22 percent of recovery growth."
http://www.alternet.org/print/education/economy-recovering-creating-more-low-wage-jobs-increasingly-filled-graduates
RandomGuy
04-09-2013, 11:38 AM
SA has a godawful legal market. I'm not surprised at all the median is 78k
Eyup. The glut here will spread elsewhere.
It has not gone unnoticed in the business press. Too many lawyers.
I considered going the law school route for about 10 minutes before I decided to do engineering. I had a really good Jewish friend (not sure why that matters but Jews have always given me good advice) who was a couple years older and I asked him for some advice about law school/engineering/med school. He told me that the difference between law school and med school is that there are no bad med schools. There are different tiers of course (Johns Hopkins, Mayo Clinic, Stanford) but there aren't any "bad" med schools. He ended up going to Memphis Medical (an "average" med school), graduated and got accepted into Brown Residency. Residency programs dont really care where you went to med school, they care more about how well the person performed in med school and how well they interview for the residency program. If you make it into med school and graduate, you're going to have options.
Law school is a different story. There are some straight up clown schools no better than your local community college. Law degrees have become like marketing degrees. There are so many of them that the degree isn't what's important anymore, it's all about where the degree came from. That's the true indicator of how much a person learned and how prepared that person is to contribute to a firm/company.
TDMVPDPOY
04-09-2013, 02:04 PM
I considered going the law school route for about 10 minutes before I decided to do engineering. I had a really good Jewish friend (not sure why that matters but Jews have always given me good advice) who was a couple years older and I asked him for some advice about law school/engineering/med school. He told me that the difference between law school and med school is that there are no bad med schools. There are different tiers of course (Johns Hopkins, Mayo Clinic, Stanford) but there aren't any "bad" med schools. He ended up going to Memphis Medical (an "average" med school), graduated and got accepted into Brown Residency. Residency programs dont really care where you went to med school, they care more about how well the person performed in med school and how well they interview for the residency program. If you make it into med school and graduate, you're going to have options.
Law school is a different story. There are some straight up clown schools no better than your local community college. Law degrees have become like marketing degrees. There are so many of them that the degree isn't what's important anymore, it's all about where the degree came from. That's the true indicator of how much a person learned and how prepared that person is to contribute to a firm/company.
med school and any course program you wish to take into all have curriculums that have to meet the standards for todays workforce, so it really doesnt matter the tier of the institutions cause it all comes down to funding and what they teach and what you learn....once u graduated its all about work experience and networking....but if you goto a country where there is a shortage of doctors in rural or country towns you can earn really big bucks
at the of the day its all about content how much u wanna earn and how much u love ur job you willing to sacrifice where you wanna be placed
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