Brown for Butler agreed in principle

[Spurologist]

Just heard on ESPN that the trade has been agreed by both parties in principle, which often means the deal is done and will happen.

[usckk]

Haha, you just beat me to it.

[1Parker1]

I haven't followed Brown...what's so great about him that make the Lakers want him? Can anyone shed light on this for me? :)

[Chris]

We're talking about Devin Brown?

[1Parker1]

We're talking about Devin Brown?
Kwame Brown...

[usckk]

No, Kwame Brown from Washington.

[constantstate]

Wizards to get Butler and Atkins or George (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2107572)

The Los Angeles Lakers plan to trade for Kwame Brown.

The Lakers have a deal to send Caron Butler and another player, likely Chucky Atkins, to the Wizards for the first pick in the 2001 draft, the Los Angeles Times reported in Thursday's editions.

Neither L.A. general manager Mitch Kupchak nor Washington president Ernie Grunfeld commented to the paper.

The Wizards could take Devean George instead of Atkins. Brown's stay in Washington has been checkered.

He averaged 7 points and 4.9 rebounds in 42 games last season, slightly below his four-year career averages of 7.7 points and 5.5 rebounds. He has yet to fulfill the potential that made him the first high school player to go first in an NBA draft.

He was suspended for most of the postseason after missing a practice and Game 4 of the Wizards' first-round playoff series against the Chicago Bulls.

[1Parker1]

He averaged 7 points and 4.9 rebounds in 42 games last season, slightly below his four-year career averages of 7.7 points and 5.5 rebounds. He has yet to fulfill the potential that made him the first high school player to go first in an NBA draft.

He was suspended for most of the postseason after missing a practice and Game 4 of the Wizards' first-round playoff series against the Chicago Bulls.

He was a first draft pick? And also, what was this guy's excuse to missing a playoff game? And how old is he?

[constantstate]

He's 23. A high schooler #1. Michael Jordan pet project gone wrong... especially since hes nowhere to be found anymore.

[spurjur]

Kobe better hope that Kwame plays up to his potential.

[pache100]

[B]And also, what was this guy's excuse to missing a playoff game? And how old is he?

He was suspended for missing the practice and a manadtory team meeting. The team suspended him and did not allow him to travel with them for the playoff game, so that's why he missed the game.

[nkdlunch]

Kobe better hope that Kwame plays up to his potential.

he won't :tu

I've seen him play all last season.

[jcrod]

They're giving up more than they're receiving, that's for sure. Unless he finally breaks through, but I doubt it.

[1Parker1]

How the hell is this kid worth Butler AND another player?

[Supergirl]

Haha this is a disaster for the Lakers. Good luck, Phil. Now you've got two overrated HS hotshots trying to compete for the ball. Kobe can teach Kwame how to waste perfectly good talent by being an ass.

[1Parker1]

Haha this is a disaster for the Lakers. Good luck, Phil. Now you've got two overrated HS hotshots trying to compete for the ball. Kobe can teach Kwame how to waste perfectly good talent by being an ass.

:lol

[tempest186]

I think the Lakers are banking on the idea that he needs a new situation. It worked for many players once they left Washington.

[WalterBenitez]

He was suspended for most of the postseason after missing a practice and Game 4 of the Wizards' first-round playoff series against the Chicago Bulls.

For your comments he'll be ok in Laker town!! :rolleyes

[Spurologist]

I've seen him play all last season.

I've seen him play all last season as well as I live in the DC area and I think you are highly under-rating his ability. His number 1 deficiency IMO was his work ethic and focus. When he came to play he played. When he came off the bench, he hustled, got rebounds, provided some good inside scoring. If I do remember correctly, the wizards constantly fed Brown when he was effective.

There might have been too much pressure on him as the number 1 pick out of high school. The wiz thought Brown would be a franchise type player and guide them to the playoffs. He wasn't exactly feeling too good when MJ and Doug Collins perpertually went at him when a made any mistake. THAT KILLED HIS CONFIDENCE.

MJ couldn't try to help him suceed and I am not sure if kobe can. But you can be sure that Brown will be motivated. With kobe doing most of the scoring and maybe daniels (if signed), Brown could creep up and surprise a lot of ppl. A solid 12 and 9 could boost the lakers into the playoffs.

This is a risk for the lakers, but don't under-rate this guy. This could be a complete bust and he could turn into shaun kemp or it could be a reminder of the Dale Davis and Jermaine O'neal trade. We all know how that worked out.

[xcoriate]

Now you've got two overrated HS hotshots

Which two? Theres Kobe, Bynum (next shaq :lmao) and Kwame "They're still talking about my potential" Brown.

[ChumpDumper]

How the hell is this kid worth Butler AND another player?He's large.

http://members.fortunecity.com/johnrobinson8/scansd/duvall/duvallshelly.jpg

[1Parker1]

He's large.

http://members.fortunecity.com/johnrobinson8/scansd/duvall/duvallshelly.jpg

:lol So if we trade T-Park to the Clippers forum, does that mean we'll get 2 people in return?







(Sorry T-Park, I don't even know you personally and I just made fun of you...it's all in good fun!! :))

[Spurologist]

He was a first draft pick?

MJ and Doug Collins liked him so they drafted him.......hmmmm yeah


And also, what was this guy's excuse to missing a playoff game?

He didn't like his playing time or lackthereof.


And how old is he?

I think he's 22 or 23. Dunno

[1Parker1]

hmm, interesting, thanks for the info :)

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

Well the Lakers managed to find a suiting replacement for Shaq in terms of drama-queening, but this whole thing has disaster written all over it. I guess Phil decided he needed more of a challenge. If you were strictly looking at physical stats, then sure the Lakers made the right move. They got killed in the paint last year. But bringing in a guy with enough problems to fill a phone book? He couldn't handle things in Washington and he's suddenly going to blossom under more scrutiny than ever, right?

Maybe Jordan got in Phil's ear on this one.

[1Parker1]

Jordan should think about becoming an assistant coach :) He could be one for the Lakers, work alongside Phil, and mentor Kobe and Kwame and knock some sense into them.

[Extra Stout]

I've seen him play all last season as well as I live in the DC area and I think you are highly under-rating his ability. His number 1 deficiency IMO was his work ethic and focus. When he came to play he played. When he came off the bench, he hustled, got rebounds, provided some good inside scoring. If I do remember correctly, the wizards constantly fed Brown when he was effective.

There might have been too much pressure on him as the number 1 pick out of high school. The wiz thought Brown would be a franchise type player and guide them to the playoffs. He wasn't exactly feeling too good when MJ and Doug Collins perpertually went at him when a made any mistake. THAT KILLED HIS CONFIDENCE.

MJ couldn't try to help him suceed and I am not sure if kobe can. But you can be sure that Brown will be motivated. With kobe doing most of the scoring and maybe daniels (if signed), Brown could creep up and surprise a lot of ppl. A solid 12 and 9 could boost the lakers into the playoffs.

This is a risk for the lakers, but don't under-rate this guy. This could be a complete bust and he could turn into shaun kemp or it could be a reminder of the Dale Davis and Jermaine O'neal trade. We all know how that worked out.MJ and Doug Collins have been gone for two years. Brown has been playing under Eddie Jordan and Ernie Grunfeld, and things haven't changed for Brown, even as the team around him improved into a solid playoff qualifier.

It's not the coaching or the management. It's that Brown has no maturity or motivation, and won't get any until he hits the skids.

[2Cleva]

Brown really started to come on in the second half of his third season, the first year after Jordan.

Last year he was doomed from the moment they got Jamison and got hurt. Jamison's best position is at the 4 and Wash had better fits at the 5 in Haywood and Thomas.

Brown was in the worse position possible and no chance to improve.

[DDS4]

Another Kupchak beauty. This will certainly put them over the top.

[Medvedenko]

http://www.realgm.com/src_goaltending/54/20050712/the_book_on_kwame_brown/

From about January on during the 03-04 season, Kwame averaged something like 15 and 8. He had Arenas and Hughes on and off returning from injury and some of the other guys were doing some scoring (and a lot of shooting and missing). He played 74 games that season. In the 25 games where he got ten or more shots in a game, his averages were:

16.72 ppg, 9.16 rpg, on 53% shooting from the floor.

Think about that; averaging ten shots a game, he’s posting about 17 ppg and nearly 10 rpg while shooting more efficiently than Tim Duncan usually does. This is before he really developed a jumper as well and before the refs started to give him a little respect on his spin move and while banging with his back to the basket.

In the six games he got twelve or more shots, he averaged:

20.2 ppg, 11 rpg, on 52.8% shooting. No real drop in efficiency and he became a 20/11 player. Now obviously six games is a rather limited sample but from the way he was playing, it was clear that he had the potential to be a perennial All-Star if put in the right situation.

For one thing, he has post game; he’s got a couple of hooks, a drop step and a spin move, as well as the power to just push many of his defenders out of the way. Beyond that, he can face up from all over the floor, put the ball on the hardwood and blow by his opponents. As a center, in the style of what Phoenix did with Amare Stoudemire, Kwame would dominate if he was allowed to mix up his back-to-the-basket game with face-up isolations from the wing. With the jumper he’s been developing the last year or two, he suddenly becomes an even more versatile offensive threat, especially since he can be integrated more readily into a pick-and-roll offense. All that’s only as a scorer. You have to recall that Kwame is also a brilliant post passer. He’d flourish in Sacramento in the 1-4 high sets that Rick Adelman runs.


Quote:
So now onto the basketball side of things. Kwame shows up and he’s instantly a candidate for second or third option. Lamar Odom isn’t a shooter and he isn’t a dedicated post scorer, so he could easily gravitate to the third option under Jackson. It’s also likely that he’ll spend more time handling the ball though and if that is the case you can expect him to be content with fewer shots. Kwame is a true low post threat but, like Tim Duncan and similar to Amare Stoudemire, he’s got quite a face-up game as well, as I mentioned. His versatility on offense could help the Lakers quite a bit if they use him enough. He draws fouls pretty well, was drawing double-teams when he posted 11 and 7 in his third year and he’ll be hitting cutters and open shooters with passes all night long.

It looks like it could be a really good situation for Kwame, as long as he can hold up his end of the deal with some speed. If he can post 15 and 8 for the Lakers in his first year, which is quite possible, then he’ll probably take off from there and be just fine. If he can’t, then he’s going to prove all the people who are calling him a bust right and won’t ever be anything except a marginally more talented version of DeSagana Diop, a second- or third-string player.

Let's see if this can work out....

[waly.mg]

Great trade for Washington

Butler must to be a good player, because he finished in the 222-2003 All Rookie first team when Manu finished in the second team

[mcornelio]

to tell you the truth i think this is a good trade for kwame, hes a great player hes just lazy and basketball IQ is literally on the floor , but with some good coaching and if he really feels like it he could put up some good numbers

NBA Comparison: Kevin Garnett

Strengths: Like Garnett, KB has freakish athleticism. Already bulkier than Garnett and could turn into more of a Webber type post player. Very graceful running the floor. Tremendous leaping aility. Passes and handles extraordinarily well for a 6-11 player. May still be growing. Touch on shots is excellent, and should only improve. Post game is solid. Very good shot blocker.

Weaknesses: Inconsistency. Like any 18 year old coming straight to the league will take his lumps and see plenty of pine. Some have questions about his competiveness.

[mcornelio]

you guys are really underratting the guy.. he could be great if he was a bit more mature

[ChumpDumper]

Already bulkier than Garnett and could turn into more of a Webber type post player.Webber is a post player?

[Spurologist]

MJ and Doug Collins have been gone for two years. Brown has been playing under Eddie Jordan and Ernie Grunfeld, and things haven't changed for Brown, even as the team around him improved into a solid playoff qualifier.

It's not the coaching or the management. It's that Brown has no maturity or motivation, and won't get any until he hits the skids.

I know he's been under EJ for the past couple of years. I was just merely trying to show how the start of his career was really the tell tale sign of things to come. The wiz were struggling and turned to an immature high school kid to be their savior. I mean some of the games were unbelievable. As soon as Brown turned the ball over, mj was on him on the next timeout about how things need to be done. The commentator would say something like "MJ is really helping this kid grow" Mj was rather creating more problems by killing his confidence. This is why I don't think mj could be a good coach. He said so himself.

The kid has to grow up and mature with time. This is how you become a very good quality player. The spurs are all about doing that (players stay overseas until they are ready. i.e ian mihinnmi). Ian would probably falter if he played in the nba next season IMO. Granted some players come in and become superstars right away but everyone isn't a Lebron or TD. Some are Eddy Curry, Jermaine O'neal.....etc.

In fact Curry is very comparable to Kwame. People were talking bust in early on. I know I was. He averaged 6.7pts and 3.8 rbs his first year and was just plain horrible. Now he is considered one of the good centers in the league scoring over 16 pts a game.

Kwame has just been lost in every season he has played. Pressure early on and then lost in the mix with upgraded talent in arenas, hughes and jameson.

The kid (don't know why I am saying kid b/c he about 5 years older than me but i like it :lol ) needs hits the gym and be willing to work.

Kupcakes can kiss his ass goodbye if this trade blows up in his face. :lol Kobe will be critisized for inability to be a leader (if he ever was one), Phil being exposed, and the lakers franchise crumbling (as if it wasn't already with the shaq trade) before our very eyes. WOW.

[nkdlunch]

I know he's been under EJ for the past couple of years. I was just merely trying to show how the start of his career was really the tell tale sign of things to come. The wiz were struggling and turned to an immature high school kid to be their savior. I mean some of the games were unbelievable. As soon as Brown turned the ball over, mj was on him on the next timeout about how things need to be done. The commentator would say something like "MJ is really helping this kid grow" Mj was rather creating more problems by killing his confidence. This is why I don't think mj could be a good coach. He said so himself.

The kid has to grow up and mature with time. This is how you become a very good quality player. The spurs are all about doing that (players stay overseas until they are ready. i.e ian mihinnmi). Ian would probably falter if he played in the nba next season IMO. Granted some players come in and become superstars right away but everyone isn't a Lebron or TD. Some are Eddy Curry, Jermaine O'neal.....etc.

In fact Curry is very comparable to Kwame. People were talking bust in early on. I know I was. He averaged 6.7pts and 3.8 rbs his first year and was just plain horrible. Now he is considered one of the good centers in the league scoring over 16 pts a game.

Kwame has just been lost in every season he has played. Pressure early on and then lost in the mix with upgraded talent in arenas, hughes and jameson.

The kid (don't know why I am saying kid b/c he about 5 years older than me but i like it :lol ) needs hits the gym and be willing to work.

Kupcakes can kiss ass goodbye if this trade blows up in his face. :lol Kobe will be critisized for inability to be a leader (if he ever was one), Phil being exposed, and the lakers franchise crumbling (as if it wasn't already with the shaq trade) before our very eyes. WOW.

I agree, but last season was the drop that overflowed the cup. Brown dissapointed everyone, the team had so much patience with him last season and that didn't work either. I hope he improves a little, because he has the body to be a superstar. But I am 99% sure he won't fulfill the expectations everyone, including the lakers have of him.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

god dammit of all the teams kwame could end up on and its the fucking lakers....arghhghg

[boutons]

washingtonpost.com

Wizards Deal Brown to Lakers

By Michael Lee
Washington Post Staff Writer
Thursday, July 14, 2005; 7:09 PM

The Washington Wizards and Los Angeles Lakers have completed a deal sending former No. 1 pick Kwame Brown to the Lakers in exchange for swingman Caron Butler and veteran point guard Chucky Atkins.

The deal was confirmed by Brown's agent, Arn Tellem, as well as a source connected with the Wizards. It began to take shape Tuesday and solidified Thursday once Tellem and the Lakers ironed out the details of a contract. Brown, who was a restricted free agent, will earn around $25 million over three seasons with the Lakers.

The 6-7, 235-pound Butler is entering the final season of a contract that will earn him $2.5 million. Butler was orginally drafted by the Miami Heat with the 10th overall pick of the 2002 draft out of Connecticut and was dealt to the Lakers in the blockbuster Shaquille O'Neal trade last July.

Butler, 25, who can play either shooting guard or small forward, averaged 15.5 points and 5.8 rebounds per game while shooting 44.5 percent from the floor last season. Atkins is entering his ninth NBA season and averaged 13.6 points and 4.4 assists per game last season while shooting 38.7 percent from three-point range.

Free agent deals cannot be finalized until July 22. For Brown, the trade represents a fresh start after a rocky four-year stint in Washington.

In 2001 Brown became the first high school player drafted with the top overall pick, but he has struggled to turn his potential into production for the Wizards. He had public battles with teammate Michael Jordan and former Coach Doug Collins in his first two seasons and although he displayed some promise in his third season, Brown never lived up to his billing.

The 7-foot, 270-pound Brown averaged just 7.7 points and 5.5 rebounds with the Wizards and is coming off a disappointing, injury-filled season in which he averaged just 7.0 points and 4.9 rebounds. He was suspended for one game in December, following a dispute with Coach Eddie Jordan. Then he was suspended for the final six games of the postseason, after his grousing over playing time led to a protest in which he claimed a stomach ailment and skipped a practice and a morning shootaround before Game 4 of the Wizards' playoff series against the Chicago Bulls. The Wizards beat the Bulls in six games -- the franchise's first playoff series win in 23 years -- without him.

Brown also had his off-court troubles as well, having been arrested for speeding in 2002, stopped for DUI a year later and breaking his foot in a pickup game last summer. Brown rejected a four-year, $30-million contract last summer.

In Los Angeles, Brown would play with all-star guard Kobe Bryant and for legendary Coach Phil Jackson, who was re-hired last month after he was fired a year before.

"Kwame is looking toward a fresh start," Tellem said. "We think it will be good for him."

With Larry Hughes jumping to the Cleveland Cavaliers last week, the Wizards needed to fill a gaping hole at shooting guard. Butler played shooting guard for the second-half of the season for the Lakers.

He spent his first two seasons with the Miami before being shipped, along with Brian Grant, Lamar Odom and a No. 1 pick, for O'Neal. Atkins has been with three teams the past two seasons.

[Sense]

I think Kwame sucks.

[clubalien]

man this thread needs to be renamed i thought DEVIN brown consdering this is a SURS section not a NBA section

[duncan_21]

Don't worry, kobe will teach their draft pick and kwame how to be a professional. He's one hell of a leader. This trade doesn't make sense.

Kwame missed practice because of an alleged stomach flu. This is the same guy that mj called a faggot in practice.

[Kaster]

Kwame missed practice because of an alleged stomach flu. This is the same guy that mj called a faggot in practice.

Er no, that was MJ that called him that. MJ destroyed the kid. Now it's up to Phil to put Tin man back together again.