We saw Duncan't biggest weakness last night

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

Let me start this off by saying that Duncan is my favorite person ever, he is a true legend and leader, and is our franchise player. Hell, he is the franchise! Duncan is San Antonio's greatest player of all time and he should always have every fan's support.

Before I point out Duncan's biggest weakness, I will point out Pop's, which we saw last night. Pop's biggest weakness is that he panics and tries to control the game way too much, and that he gets arrogant and thinks that he has a bigger impact on the game than he really does. Benching Duncan with 28 seconds left was beyond dumb. At this point, I could care less about matchups, in the final seconds of a closeout game, you stick with your franchise player no matter what! Sure, Diaw has had a nice series, but I never want to see Diaw ahead of Duncan in any situation in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals. Could you imagine Phil Jackson sitting Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals? How about Red Auerbach sitting Bill Russell in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals? Or Pat Riley sitting Magic Johnson or Kareem Abdul Jabar? Or Billy Cunningham sitting Julius Erving or Moses Malone in the final seconds of a closeout game of the NBA Finals? How about Rudy Tomjanovich benching Hakeem Olajuwan in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals? Could you see Chuck Daly benching Isiah Thomas in the final seconds of a closeout game in the Finals? How about K.C. Jones benching Larry Bird in the final seconds of a closeout game? You probably couldn't imagine Jerry Sloan taking Karl Malone out in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA finals, and you probably wouldn't even see Eric Spoelstra bench LeBron James or Scott Brooks bench Kevin Durant in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals. Yet, we can imagine Gregg Popovich benching Tim Duncan in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals, because it happened, and to me that is disgusting, that a player of Duncan's calibre wouldn't be trusted in this situation.

This brings me up to Duncan's weakness. Think of all the scenarios I just mentioned, now imagine one of those coaches actually trying to bench on of those players in that situation, how many of them would just go sit on the bench? I personally think none would. I understand Timmy is the perfect teammate and is as humble as they come, but to me, in this situation, Timmy should've refused to sit on the bench. He was the best player on the court that night, he should've realized along with Pop how much they needed him in there at that time. If Kobe wouldn't take crap like that from a coach, why should Duncan? I'm not saying Duncan should always disagree with Pop, but in this situation, he needs to realize he's bigger than a coach's adjustment or lineup at that moment. Timmy should've told Pop "No" and played in the final seconds last night. If he did that, we win.

Now let me repeat what I said above. I love Timmy, he's the San Antonio franchise. He's the reason for our 4 championships. Spurs fans should have nothing but gratitude and appreciation for Duncan. Tim Duncan is the biggest name in San Antonio history. No other name from San Antonio is even close to matching Tim Duncan's name, and that include George Gervin, David Robinson, Greg Popovich, Tony Parker, and Manu Ginobili. Tim Duncan is a true legend and only deserves the best from his teammates, coaches, and fans. But with that all said, I do think this is Tim Duncan's one weakness, but in no way will it stand out compared to everything else about him.

Any thoughts regarding this?

[RD2191]

I completely agree. I've even seen scrub players tell their coach that they are going to stay in the game.

[HemisfairArena]

Duncan's biggest weaknesses are that he has to play for Popovich and with Manu...and carry both of their sorry asses.

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

Duncan's biggest weaknesses are that he has to play for Popovich and with Manu...and carry both of their sorry asses.

Hah, valid point.

[TheGreatYacht]

Very nice thread. I was telling this to my brother last night. I said "Duncan and Parker should of demanded Pop to put them back in the game." The Spurs needed TP out there in the floor instead of Manu who helped the Heat go on a run. I've always wished the Spurs organization and its players were not too classy. They are too nice and I mean it in a bad way.

[dunkman]

It was Pop's job to say who plays and if Manu plays or not. That being said I'm completely surprised the Spurs are in the finals, and that they still play with the Heat - often looking better.

[m33p0]

chest bump! pump fist!

we've heard this before. if duncan was like that, the spurs won't be the spurs as we know them. heck, duncan won't be playing for the spurs. he'll be in los angeles or new york where the limelight is.

[midnightpulp]

Agree completely. Duncan is a team first player almost to a fault. It's his greatest strength but sometimes his greatest weakness.

[LakerLanny]

Before I point out Duncan's biggest weakness, I will point out Pop's, which we saw last night. Pop's biggest weakness is that he panics and tries to control the game way too much, and that he gets arrogant and thinks that he has a bigger impact on the game than he really does. Benching Duncan with 28 seconds left was beyond dumb. At this point, I could care less about matchups, in the final seconds of a closeout game, you stick with your franchise player no matter what! Sure, Diaw has had a nice series, but I never want to see Diaw ahead of Duncan in any situation in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals. Could you imagine Phil Jackson sitting Michael Jordan or Kobe Bryant in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals? How about Red Auerbach sitting Bill Russell in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals? Or Pat Riley sitting Magic Johnson or Kareem Abdul Jabar? Or Billy Cunningham sitting Julius Erving or Moses Malone in the final seconds of a closeout game of the NBA Finals? How about Rudy Tomjanovich benching Hakeem Olajuwan in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals? Could you see Chuck Daly benching Isiah Thomas in the final seconds of a closeout game in the Finals? How about K.C. Jones benching Larry Bird in the final seconds of a closeout game? You probably couldn't imagine Jerry Sloan taking Karl Malone out in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA finals, and you probably wouldn't even see Eric Spoelstra bench LeBron James or Scott Brooks bench Kevin Durant in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals. Yet, we can imagine Gregg Popovich benching Tim Duncan in the final seconds of a closeout game in the NBA Finals, because it happened, and to me that is disgusting, that a player of Duncan's calibre wouldn't be trusted in this situation.

I completely agree with you. Pop has fallen in love with himself, he thinks he is a brilliant coach when the reality is he has brilliant players who would win a lot of games even without a coach.

To not have Duncan (and Parker) on the floor at the end of regulation was criminal.

It was also obvious to the world that Manu was way off and killing the team. So you play him the bulk of the overtime? Horrible move, just atrocious.

His lineup to start the 4th quarter gave the Heat life, you do not need to go to regular rest periods in NBA Finals games. The TV timeouts are endless, that is all the rest anyone needs. A young buck like Kawhi could easily play the whole game if necessary with all the TV timeouts, Duncan should have been on the floor to start the 4th and absolutely on the floor at the end of regulation.

I won't even get into the fact that he obviously didn't tell them to look to foul if they gave up an offensive rebound up 3 with less than 10 seconds left in the game, NBA coaches (including Phil Jackson) simply refuse to do that and it burns them over and over again....much like football coaches going into the prevent defense late in games.

I posted in another thread that you could legitimately argue that Pop's Game 6 coaching performance was perhaps the worst in NBA history. It really was that bad on multiple levels and I don't think that is an overstatement. Bottom line, he botched the game and may have blown a sure championship....I will be rooting for you guys in Game 7.

[texmich]

Funny how TP and Duncan get benched but 8TO manu stays in, GTFOH POP! Yes Duncan is a class act and im gonna miss him when he retires, he is a True NBA Star!!

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

chest bump! pump fist!

we've heard this before. if duncan was like that, the spurs won't be the spurs as we know them. heck, duncan won't be playing for the spurs. he'll be in los angeles or new york where the limelight is.

I'm not saying that he be like that or be anything close to a primadonna, but him not being trusted in the final seconds of a closeout game of the NBA Finals is criminal! Duncan IMO shouldn't walk to the bench quietly in that situation.

[boutons_deux]

anybody remember Tim on the court in HOU when McGrady went crazy?

IIRC, Tim fouled Tracy on 3pt shot, which, IIRC, Tracy made, and sank the FT?

I did RC:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfurCV1FDpM

[Proxy]

I completely agree with you. Pop has fallen in love with himself, he thinks he is a brilliant coach when the reality is he has brilliant players who would win a lot of games even without a coach.

To not have Duncan (and Parker) on the floor at the end of regulation was criminal.

It was also obvious to the world that Manu was way off and killing the team. So you play him the bulk of the overtime? Horrible move, just atrocious.

His lineup to start the 4th quarter gave the Heat life, you do not need to go to regular rest periods in NBA Finals games. The TV timeouts are endless, that is all the rest anyone needs. A young buck like Kawhi could easily play the whole game if necessary with all the TV timeouts, Duncan should have been on the floor to start the 4th and absolutely on the floor at the end of regulation.

I won't even get into the fact that he obviously didn't tell them to look to foul if they gave up an offensive rebound up 3 with less than 10 seconds left in the game, NBA coaches (including Phil Jackson) simply refuse to do that and it burns them over and over again....much like football coaches going into the prevent defense late in games.

I posted in another thread that you could legitimately argue that Pop's Game 6 coaching performance was perhaps the worst in NBA history. It really was that bad on multiple levels and I don't think that is an overstatement. Bottom line, he botched the game and may have blown a sure championship....I will be rooting for you guys in Game 7.

Parker made sense, imo... Heat kept getting the switch from the defense. That move worked, seeing as how he missed two 3's and made the one off a rebound. Green, Manu, Leonard, Diaw, and Duncan seem to be the best defensive unit the spurs can put out there.

I don't disagree with the rest of your sentiment

[dbreiden83080]

His coach took a giant shit on him...

[TrainOfThought5]

Duncan's biggest weaknesses are that he has to play for Popovich and with Manu...and carry both of their sorry asses.

Thread summed up in a sentence FTW.

[Assman]

I thought you were going to say white women.

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

I thought you were going to say white women.

Really? Too soon.

[therealtruth]

I completely agree with you. Pop has fallen in love with himself, he thinks he is a brilliant coach when the reality is he has brilliant players who would win a lot of games even without a coach.

To not have Duncan (and Parker) on the floor at the end of regulation was criminal.

It was also obvious to the world that Manu was way off and killing the team. So you play him the bulk of the overtime? Horrible move, just atrocious.

His lineup to start the 4th quarter gave the Heat life, you do not need to go to regular rest periods in NBA Finals games. The TV timeouts are endless, that is all the rest anyone needs. A young buck like Kawhi could easily play the whole game if necessary with all the TV timeouts, Duncan should have been on the floor to start the 4th and absolutely on the floor at the end of regulation.

I won't even get into the fact that he obviously didn't tell them to look to foul if they gave up an offensive rebound up 3 with less than 10 seconds left in the game, NBA coaches (including Phil Jackson) simply refuse to do that and it burns them over and over again....much like football coaches going into the prevent defense late in games.

I posted in another thread that you could legitimately argue that Pop's Game 6 coaching performance was perhaps the worst in NBA history. It really was that bad on multiple levels and I don't think that is an overstatement. Bottom line, he botched the game and may have blown a sure championship....I will be rooting for you guys in Game 7.

Simulator crew mentality, tbh.

[Kidd K]

You know. . .you're right.

Duncan should've told Pop to eat a dick and that he was going to stay in the game to make sure the job got done.

[HarlemHeat37]

The OP is correct and I agree with mid that Duncan's biggest strength is his biggest weakness at times, but it's a fair trade, tbh..

Duncan is the most important component of an environment that has led to 4 titles and 5 Finals appearances in a small-market city that doesn't attract marquee names..when former players discuss the key to the Spurs success, they always begin by citing Duncan's ability to be coached and fit in with the rest of the players, tbh..

So while I do agree with OP, it's a fair trade IMO..

It feels good not having to deal with franchise players throwing their franchise under the bus and holding them hostage, or snitching on teammates..or raping a woman..or playing a part in the murder of your father due to your degenerate gambling, tbh..

[Dverde]

Truth. Even grat coaches need to be checked at times

[cutewizard]

We still have one game

Let us Hope against hope.....

In the Malazan series, the greatest fictional series ever, Tavore and company had no chance to win....they had zero chance to win in the endgame, "The Crippled God"

may the Spurs be like Tavore and company:

no chance and yet, and yet......................

[ElNono]

If there's something that's revered about the Spurs is the complete and absolute trust from top to bottom. That goes from management to coaches to players...

In hindsight we may or not agree with it, but it's undeniably one of the main reasons this franchise has been as successful as it has lately.

[DMC]

So Tim refuses to sit and James hits that three instead of missing or the ball still bounces to Ray and he still makes the jumper because someone was too slow to cover.

Now you're going into OT and the coach knows you're no longer with him. Great idea.

Win or lose, the Spurs are a team, and Tim gets shit on just as anyone else. If it wasn't like that, the Spurs would be the Knicks or some other self absorbed franchise where players kill coaches. If it were like that, players like Green and Neal would never find a home because players like Duncan would threaten to quit if they didn't get their friend from another team signed up. If it were like that the Spurs wouldn't be close to the Finals because they would always have better ideas than their coach has, and they would just go out there and leave a huge garbage ball turd on the floor like a lot of East coast teams do, or they would be the Lakers who have 10lbs of shit in a 5lb bag when it comes to talent but no direction because everyone on the team knows more than the coach and so they cannot be coached by their existing coach. (the 4th coach in 3 years btw).

Tim's apparent weakness is actually his strength, and it's that he doesn't give a shit what you think about him.

[skulls138]

I cant stand that Pops made that decision and got burned for it, but I don't think its any kind of weakness on Duncans part. If anything its that kind of thinking that got him and the Spurs all their success. Duncan sees the big picture and sees that he HAS to trust in his team and his coach, good or bad. He knows that you don't change that philosophy when the chips are down.

[dallasmaverickslose]

Duncan's biggest weaknesses are that he has to play for Popovich and with Manu...and carry both of their sorry asses.

You are a moron. I cannot believe someone that calls themselves a Spurs fan would actually say something that stupid. I will officially no longer take anything you say on this website seriously.

[Spurs21Fan4Ever]

I'm not saying that Duncan would've been better as a prima Donna or anything like that. I also agree that this is also a strength of Duncan, I believe though that Tuesday night was the first time ever that we unfortunately had the opportunity to see it a a weakness. However the blame mostly falls on Pop for benching Duncan there.

[Agloco]

So Tim refuses to sit and James hits that three instead of missing or the ball still bounces to Ray and he still makes the jumper because someone was too slow to cover.

Now you're going into OT and the coach knows you're no longer with him. Great idea.

Win or lose, the Spurs are a team, and Tim gets shit on just as anyone else. If it wasn't like that, the Spurs would be the Knicks or some other self absorbed franchise where players kill coaches. If it were like that, players like Green and Neal would never find a home because players like Duncan would threaten to quit if they didn't get their friend from another team signed up. If it were like that the Spurs wouldn't be close to the Finals because they would always have better ideas than their coach has, and they would just go out there and leave a huge garbage ball turd on the floor like a lot of East coast teams do, or they would be the Lakers who have 10lbs of shit in a 5lb bag when it comes to talent but no direction because everyone on the team knows more than the coach and so they cannot be coached by their existing coach. (the 4th coach in 3 years btw).

Tim's apparent weakness is actually his strength, and it's that he doesn't give a shit what you think about him.

This.

dmc ham tbh

[Brazil]

:lol so Pop is a genius when he benches Duncan for 6 minutes against GSW and now he is an arrogant prick for benching him 2 possessions to defend the 3. BTW Pop is doing that regularly. You can discuss his decision but saying Duncan bends over and Pop is arrogant is stupid.

[Brazil]

So Tim refuses to sit and James hits that three instead of missing or the ball still bounces to Ray and he still makes the jumper because someone was too slow to cover.

Now you're going into OT and the coach knows you're no longer with him. Great idea.

Win or lose, the Spurs are a team, and Tim gets shit on just as anyone else. If it wasn't like that, the Spurs would be the Knicks or some other self absorbed franchise where players kill coaches. If it were like that, players like Green and Neal would never find a home because players like Duncan would threaten to quit if they didn't get their friend from another team signed up. If it were like that the Spurs wouldn't be close to the Finals because they would always have better ideas than their coach has, and they would just go out there and leave a huge garbage ball turd on the floor like a lot of East coast teams do, or they would be the Lakers who have 10lbs of shit in a 5lb bag when it comes to talent but no direction because everyone on the team knows more than the coach and so they cannot be coached by their existing coach. (the 4th coach in 3 years btw).

Tim's apparent weakness is actually his strength, and it's that he doesn't give a shit what you think about him.

didn't see your post DMC before posting.
This 100%.

[AntiChrist]

Stupid thread, tbh

[mudyez]

The OP is correct and I agree with mid that Duncan's biggest strength is his biggest weakness at times, but it's a fair trade, tbh..

Duncan is the most important component of an environment that has led to 4 titles and 5 Finals appearances in a small-market city that doesn't attract marquee names..when former players discuss the key to the Spurs success, they always begin by citing Duncan's ability to be coached and fit in with the rest of the players, tbh..

So while I do agree with OP, it's a fair trade IMO..

It feels good not having to deal with franchise players throwing their franchise under the bus and holding them hostage, or snitching on teammates..or raping a woman..or playing a part in the murder of your father due to your degenerate gambling, tbh..

HH with the goods...Don't leave us if we lose!

[z0sa]

Only Tim Duncan's greatest weakness could also be his greatest strength.

[Spur|n|Austin]

Duncan's biggest weaknesses are that he has to play for Popovich and with Manu...and carry both of their sorry asses.

You're an idiot. I hope you have not been a fan since the days of your user name, because that would just be a disgrace.

[HemisfairArena]

You're an idiot. I hope you have not been a fan since the days of your user name, because that would just be a disgrace.

Then your out of luck.

[Fabbs]

:lol so Pop is a genius when he benches Duncan for 6 minutes against GSW and now he is an arrogant prick for benching him 2 possessions to defend the 3.
No. Pops an arrogant prick most all the time.
Duncans toleration of his arrogance is what has cost Championships.

Lets hope 2013 is not another squandered chance.

[Brazil]

No. Pops an arrogant prick most all the time.
Duncans toleration of his arrogance is what has cost Championships.

Lets hope 2013 is not another squandered chance.

:lol this post