Higher ceiling: Paul George of Kawhi Leonard?

[StrengthAndHonor]

Off Season talk tbh. Be objective.

[Killakobe81]

I say George but I love KL's defense. PG also can be a bit too passive at times, but KL has not been asked to be even a #3 option conistently while PG has flourished as feature star. I vote PG but KL may prove the better player when featured ...we shall see.

[StrengthAndHonor]

I say George but I love KL's defense. PG also can be a bit too passive at times, but KL has not been asked to be even a #3 option conistently while PG has flourished as feature star. I vote PG but KL may prove the better player when featured ...we shall see.


Good take. Exactly what I feel.

I think George has the higher ceiling. He could be a Super Star while Kawhi's ceiling is All Star Selection with 2nd All NBA Team selection. That said, I also believe something in George screams "choker" and/or "overpaid" while Kawhi IMO will be much more consistent but without the glamorous numbers which George can do.

[TDMVPDPOY]

the only thing i dont like about PG is his decision making shooting, dude just pulls the trigger when he feels like it, whether its a bad or good shot he still take it...

hence dude has the green light to chuck and play outside whatever PACERS system is, too many ISO for him

KL needs the green light to chuck, hence if he receive the same amount of touches of FGA as PG, you can see a better production from him offensively...

[Roger Freemason Jr.]

George is 6'9, but does that make him kind of a tweener? He plays the 2, but is that his true position being 6'9? Also, can he defend the 1, 2, and 3 half as well as Kawhi can? I wouldn't say PG has a higher ceiling, because Kawhi's offensive game is still somewhat raw and is constantly improving, and with his defensive mindset being his cornerstone, he can be the better player.

[Thread]

I still ain't convinced on George.

Leonard? I'm hoping that it's not real. That would be a problem. An injury would be welcome here. Something to slow him down, take the wind out of his sails. A stopper in the bottle, monkey in the wrench. You get the idea.

[Roger Freemason Jr.]

Don't worry, when he's leading the Spurs, they won't have a legendary big man to protect the rim, so the team ceiling would most likely be 2nd round (given we have a "decent" big man).

[StrengthAndHonor]

the only thing i dont like about PG is his decision making shooting, dude just pulls the trigger when he feels like it, whether its a bad or good shot he still take it...

hence dude has the green light to chuck and play outside whatever PACERS system is, too many ISO for him

KL needs the green light to chuck, hence if he receive the same amount of touches of FGA as PG, you can see a better production from him offensively...

Yeah, but can you blame PG? With Indiana's offense, he really is the perimeter offense. If anything, I thought in games 6 and 7, he was too passive when the pacers really needed offense. Lance Stephenson and George Hill were basically carrying him when it should be the other way around. He should chuck more with that lineup tbh since West disappeared.


We'll see how if he works in his game this season. he also need some more work with his body and conditioning. I understand no one can stop Lebron, but James was really and bullying him. I cound't say the same when Loenard guarded James on those few occassions.

[spurraider21]

Kawhi didn't have 1 game in his 7 game series with LeBron where he didn't show up. George went MIA quite a bit

[Leon Black]

George

[jimbo]

Kawhi didn't have 1 game in his 7 game series with LeBron where he didn't show up. George went MIA quite a bit

I'd agree that KL is more consistent than George.

I just don't know if when KL is inconsistent it's because it's not his team. Remember how hard it was for KL and TP to coexist and KL to still put up some good offense? I wasn't paying attention to this all too much but it didn't feel like he'd get plays called for him.

George's offense has shown to have a whole lot higher of a peak than KL's. He can shoot 3s and drive when he's on. KL has been a pretty bad 3 point shooter when he's not in the corner.


I'd say George for now

[AchillesHeel]

KL is more consistent than George and more efficient, his offense obviously isn't as good but his defense IMO is what makes him so great. PG is more all-around and can get you 7-8 assists next to 7-8 boards but will also shoot 3-10 and 6-20 in most games, not an efficient scorer with the amount of 3s he takes.

[Raven]

Game on tbh.

[Raven]

George is 6'9, but does that make him kind of a tweener? He plays the 2, but is that his true position being 6'9? Also, can he defend the 1, 2, and 3 half as well as Kawhi can? I wouldn't say PG has a higher ceiling, because Kawhi's offensive game is still somewhat raw and is constantly improving, and with his defensive mindset being his cornerstone, he can be the better player.

if you're fast and strong enough, being oversized is only an advantage, a tweener is basically one that is either too weak or small to guard bigger players and too slow to guard smaller players. George can guard the 2 pretty well.

[HarlemHeat37]

They have the same flaws as players, tbh, the difference being that George has had the luxury of improving his game as a top option on his team, while Pop admitted he doesn't even run plays for Leonard..

I've been saying all year that casual fans stupidly believe that Kawhi is a product of the Spurs system, when in reality, the system hinders his offense..he's not a great spot-up shooter, but that's the role he was forced to play most of the year when he's on the floor with Parker, tbh..

George has improved his ball-handling immensely, while it's still a flaw for Leonard..George is also a very good passer, which isn't a strength for Leonard..OTOH, despite being smaller, Kawhi's post game is already more advanced than George's..as somebody else already said, George seems to have soft tendencies, too, while Leonard has already shown that he doesn't back down from anybody, tbh..

George has a slightly higher ceiling IMO, but it's close..Leonard has the advantage of learning under Duncan, Manu and Parker, too, tbh..

[vato loco]

gonna go with the cali boy leonard

he's a bad boy, he's gonna be good real good

[Calispursfan11]

They have the same flaws as players, tbh, the difference being that George has had the luxury of improving his game as a top option on his team, while Pop admitted he doesn't even run plays for Leonard..

I've been saying all year that casual fans stupidly believe that Kawhi is a product of the Spurs system, when in reality, the system hinders his offense..he's not a great spot-up shooter, but that's the role he was forced to play most of the year when he's on the floor with Parker, tbh..

George has improved his ball-handling immensely, while it's still a flaw for Leonard..George is also a very good passer, which isn't a strength for Leonard..OTOH, despite being smaller, Kawhi's post game is already more advanced than George's..as somebody else already said, George seems to have soft tendencies, too, while Leonard has already shown that he doesn't back down from anybody, tbh..

George has a slightly higher ceiling IMO, but it's close..Leonard has the advantage of learning under Duncan, Manu and Parker, too, tbh..

http://www.gif-king.com/files/uSers/8bfa52531e190caaeb13411bc280eaea.gif

[LkrFan]

KL has a higher ceiling. He's a better defender already. Difference? PG is a 1st option - or close to it depending on their opponent. KL is like 3rd or 4th at best. He gets the scraps. Hopefully that changes next year. Pop should have him eat 2nd after TP. Then we'll see the legit triple threat player he can become.

They both played against LBJ. I think KL didn't back down once. PG did. KL showed us all that he belonged on the court with LBJ on the biggest stage. Pop needs to take the handcuffs off him next year if he is going to replace TD as the franchise player tbh. I love that kid's game.

[HarlemHeat37]

Leonard isn't a better defender, tbh, I'd have George as slightly better..

A player's defensive impact generally declines with more offensive responsibility, obviously..

[Agloco]

I still ain't convinced on George.

Leonard? I'm hoping that it's not real. That would be a problem. An injury would be welcome here. Something to slow him down, take the wind out of his sails. A stopper in the bottle, monkey in the wrench. You get the idea.

Tacit acknowledgement. We will take it. :lol

[whitemamba]

George TBH

[Captivus]

Player

Age

G
GS
MP
FG
FGA
FG%
3P
3PA
3P%
FT
FTA
FT%
ORB
DRB
TRB
AST
STL
BLK
TOV
PF
PTS


Paul George (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/g/georgpa01.html)

22
19
19
780
5.5
12.8
.430
1.6
4.8
.327
4.3
5.9
.727
0.7
5.8
6.5
4.4
1.2
0.4
3.5
3.3
16.8


Kawhi Leonard (http://www.basketball-reference.com/players/l/leonaka01.html)

21
21
21
775
5.3
9.8
.545
1.1
2.7
.390
1.4
2.3
.633
2.3
6.5
8.8
1.0
1.7
0.5
1.1
1.9
13.2



POs stats per 36, this season.

I would say PG... but Kiwi is 1 year younger and with 1 less season experience. I think next year is gonna be a better time for comparisons.

Kiwi will get more touches like PG does. He has a higher FG%, so if he takes 3 more shots a game (to match PG) he could tie the points stats. His 3P% is also higher with fewer attempts. IMO, ORB are very important and Kiwi had more than 2 a game. Paul has more ASS, thats the stats thats Kiwi doesnt have.


Kiwi's defense is great and will only improve and that doesn't show in the box score.
Paul had 7.3 rebounds in the RS and 6.5 in the POs.
Kiwi had 6.9 rebounds in the RS and 8.8 in the POs...mmm....
Almost all "important" advanced stats favor Kiwi, PER, EFG%, TOV%, Win Shares.

Conclusion, I want to wait 1 more year for my final opinion...

[Rogue]

I'll stick to my original assessment of this player, he's not gonna be better than the best of Smokey that we saw in the 05-07 era, and he's already playing close to his full potential. Leonard plays SF but has the wingspan of a center, which makes him a freak of his position and a matchup trouble to most small forwards in the league, but it doesn't mean he can handle things like a superstar does. He's only the 3rd or 4th option on the spurs, and I doubt he could be nearly as efficient as Paul George if the other teams start to treat him as a superstar, they way they do Paul George. Leonard is a good player, borderline all-star with the prime Smokey/G-force being his ceiling

[Spurs 4 The Win]

Ceiling: Superstar, a poor man's Lebron
Likely: Multiple All-star selections, face of the Spurs Franchise, Borderline Superstar

[Clipper Nation]

I like both players, but Leonard has the higher ceiling imho.... he was really impressive in the Finals, especially defensively, tbh.....

[Killakobe81]

Leonard isn't a better defender, tbh, I'd have George as slightly better..

A player's defensive impact generally declines with more offensive responsibility, obviously..

Great point, we will see how KL's defense holds up with more offensive responsibility.
But I still give KL a slight edge on defense right now ...

[noob cake]

George by far.

George is a second tier all-star. Kawhi is a deluxe role player.

[TDMVPDPOY]

George by far.

George is a second tier all-star. Kawhi is a deluxe role player.

allstar is misleading, when every man and his dog knows its nothing more than a popularity contest, same shit with the all nba/defensive teams...

[Spurs 4 The Win]

Everyone underestimating Kawhi.... Yall are gonna be shocked when this nalga is in the discussion for an all-time top 30-10 NBA player

[spurraider21]

I still ain't convinced on George.

Leonard? I'm hoping that it's not real. That would be a problem. An injury would be welcome here. Something to slow him down, take the wind out of his sails. A stopper in the bottle, monkey in the wrench. You get the idea.
i guess thats the best complement we could expect from you :lol

[rayjayjohnson]

George, because he doesn't play for a welshers team

[mercos]

Leonard by far. Kid just dropped 19 and 16 in game 7 of the NBA Finals at the age of 21 without having plays called for him. He was able to drive on Lebron whenever he wanted, and has shown a good pull up midrange jumper in the past. His post game looks solid as well.

[dg7md]

Leonard.

George is too inconsistent in what I have seen of him.

Both are similar molds but I believe Leonard's defense and rebounding is more valuable to a team than George's (slightly) better offense.

[MeloHype]

George's stats are gonna drop next season.

[TDMVPDPOY]

leonard without plays for him posting up them numbers, is like stephenson who was given free reigns without a defender bothering to defend him in the heat/pacers series,

not saying stephenson is on leonards level, but shit happens when teams dont play defense on you

[angelbelow]

Kawhi Leonard in the NBA finals averaged: 14 points, 11 rebounds, 2 steals, 51% FG.

[spurraider21]

if Kawhi had an offense running through him, i'm sure we would see those volume stats george has

[TDMVPDPOY]

if Kawhi had an offense running through him, i'm sure we would see those volume stats george has

PG has a good team around him he can fully utilize, dont like his decision making everytime he has the ball going downcourt he is always looking to score then finding another open man to help with the team offense production...

seems like every quarter you see him dribble down court chucks up a 3 cause he felt like it....whether his confident of his chucking, but damn is there really a need for him to go kobemode like that chucking

[Spursfanfromafar]

Paul George is more offensively rounded and is a great defensive player already.

Kawhi is terrific as a one-on-one defender, among the best in the league today and is getting better at team defense. His potential as a lock down defender is possibly the highest in the league for small forwards/ swingmen/ guards.

But Kawhi is still a ways to go before he attains George's offensive repertoire. He has to better his ball handling and passing. Plus the coaching staff has to develop his mid range, shot creating for self game as well. George has a one year edge over Kawhi too.

All in all, it is easy to say that George is slightly ahead in the overall game as of now, but Leonard has a slightly better ceiling. In 3-4 years time, these two could be among the best players in the league.

[TDMVPDPOY]

Paul George is more offensively rounded and is a great defensive player already.

Kawhi is terrific as a one-on-one defender, among the best in the league today and is getting better at team defense. His potential as a lock down defender is possibly the highest in the league for small forwards/ swingmen/ guards.

But Kawhi is still a ways to go before he attains George's offensive repertoire. He has to better his ball handling and passing. Plus the coaching staff has to develop his mid range, shot creating for self game as well. George has a one year edge over Kawhi too.

All in all, it is easy to say that George is slightly ahead in the overall game as of now, but Leonard has a slightly better ceiling. In 3-4 years time, these two could be among the best players in the league.

cant be the best if parker is still here

[Tuddy]

Leonard will be better cause he works harder than anyone in the league

[The Gemini Method]

This is a great question. I do wonder about PG's decision making but then again, he is only 22. Being that he is a 6'9 playing at the 2 when he'd probably do himself better if he bulked up a little and made the 3 his full-time position is undoubtedly the more talented of the two. Maybe not a huge gap between the two. With that being said, Kawhi proved his mettle in the Finals having to guard the best player on the planet and then providing 14 and 11 as a 2nd year player is in itself, a promising thing. I think if Pop is around a while longer, Leonard is going to be on the fringe of stardom but he could also be a viable 2nd or 3rd option as well. PG might not be in Indiana for his entire career, but at this point I would say PG but Kawhi is also a heady defender whereas George would make too many mistakes in the 7 game series.

[lefty]

:lol bump

[TDMVPDPOY]

that parker couldnt hold kawhi back this g ame even withthe hero ball antics

[RsxPiimp]

I think George has the higher ceiling. He could be a Super Star while Kawhi's ceiling is All Star Selection with 2nd All NBA Team selection. That said, I also believe something in George screams "choker" and/or "overpaid" while Kawhi IMO will be much more consistent but without the glamorous numbers which George can do.

Solid take bro :toast

[midnightpulp]

I still ain't convinced on George.

Leonard? I'm hoping that it's not real. That would be a problem. An injury would be welcome here. Something to slow him down, take the wind out of his sails. A stopper in the bottle, monkey in the wrench. You get the idea.

Called it, you glorious bastard.

How did you know?

[Clipper Nation]

I like both players, but Leonard has the higher ceiling imho.... he was really impressive in the Finals, especially defensively, tbh.....
The goods ^

[midnightpulp]

The goods ^

Nice.

How Durbeta getting all salty? He still ain't over Kawhi holding him to 6 points below his season average.

[hater]

George

:lmao

[cheguevara]

George by far.

George is a second tier all-star. Kawhi is a deluxe role player.

:D

[PingPong]

Well, at least it's ceiling and not grounding...

[maverick1948]

A month ago, I would have said Paul George, but after the injury, I have to say the Kawhi now has the more upside. Only time will tell about Paul George. He may return 100% but I doubt it. Breaking bones no matter which one changes a lot. If you a golfer, watch your back. If you play football, you have to protect head and legs. Even in baseball, injuries can be long term. Bowlers break you thumb on bowling hand and guess what it won't be the same.

Until George comes back, I am going with Kawhi.

[spurraider21]

Leonard? I'm hoping that it's not real. That would be a problem. An injury would be welcome here. Something to slow him down, take the wind out of his sails. A stopper in the bottle, monkey in the wrench. You get the idea.
:lol oh its real

its very real

[baseline bum]

http://s3.amazonaws.com/br-cdn/temp_images/2014/06/13/0bbd78012076a1eee2107e673af6265a.gif

[spurraider21]

he's like Groot :lol

[scanry]

Date stamp error tbh. Post No. 44 to 50 were posted before the thread was opened?

[spurraider21]

Date stamp error tbh. Post No. 44 to 50 were posted before the thread was opened?
i think ur just tripping out tbh... seems in order. look at the year of the dates

[scanry]

i think ur just tripping out tbh... seems in order. look at the year of the dates

My bad.

[spurraider21]

I still ain't convinced on George.

Leonard? I'm hoping that it's not real. That would be a problem. An injury would be welcome here. Something to slow him down, take the wind out of his sails. A stopper in the bottle, monkey in the wrench. You get the idea.

[Thread]

^Just think if I were mistaken. I'd still have:::

Kobe: 5

the tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

[Kool Bob Love]

^Just think if I were mistaken. I'd still have:::

Kobe: 5

the tired old shit bag Duncan: 4

Boil it down for your uncle cuddie.

[Clipper Nation]

I like both players, but Leonard has the higher ceiling imho.... he was really impressive in the Finals, especially defensively, tbh.....

I called it. Me.

[Thread]

I called it. Me.

I called it first. Me.

[Clipper Nation]

I called it first. Me.

Nuh uh. You chickenshitted by talking about how you hoped he wasn't real. I took a stand and said he was real.

I called it. Me.

[Thread]

Nuh uh. You chickenshitted by talking about how you hoped he wasn't real. I took a stand and said he was real.

I called it. Me.

I called it first. Me.

[Clipper Nation]

I'm hoping that it's not real.

Chickenshit.

[Thread]

Chickenshit.

Don't be jealous cuz I called the ball first.

ha, ha.

[Clipper Nation]

Don't be jealous cuz I called the ball first.

ha, ha.

You didn't call a damn thing. I said he was for real, you chickenshitted out.

I called it. Me.

[Thread]

You didn't call a damn thing. I said he was for real, you chickenshitted out.

I called it. Me.

No. I called it first.

Me.

[Clipper Nation]

Chickenshit: "I hope Leonard gets injured."

Clipperdamus: "Leonard has the higher ceiling."

Me

[FuzzyLumpkins]

smh

[Thread]

Chickenshit: "I hope Leonard gets injured."

Clipperdamus: "Leonard has the higher ceiling."

Me

I was first. Me.

[TDMVPDPOY]

dont compare them by age

lets compared them by yrs experience in the league

so far kawhi ascendant is greater then PG...he did something PG never will ever do, outplay or play lebron to a standstill...

[Thread]

^...Only because Amy retired.

[TDMVPDPOY]

^...Only because Amy retired.

how is that relevance to KL? this fkn clown wants a proper conversation yet talks out of his ass again

[m>s]

Culburn was right haha

[DMC]

I called it. Me.


I called it first. Me.
Let's not get all cock sucky on this Dale. You cannot give your own take a reach around.

[Thread]

Let's not get all cock sucky on this Dale. You cannot give your own take a reach around.

See, I called it first. Said he was going to be a problem. I'm still clear.

[DMC]

See, I called it first. Said he was going to be a problem. I'm still clear.


"He's gonna be a problem."

- Cully following the 2013 Finals.


Unfortunately I was correct.

You've tried to call both heads and tails and I came along checking assholes and there you were.

Let's try to maintain some integrity here, shall we? We have enough alt names running around hedging bets.

[Thread]

You've tried to call both heads and tails and I came along checking assholes and there you were.

Let's try to maintain some integrity here, shall we? We have enough alt names running around hedging bets.

Fuck, I knew you'd keep digging till you found something.

[DMC]

Fuck, I knew you'd keep digging till you found something.

Unlike the majority of the brainless mouthbreathing horde here, I actually keep up. I know what you said and when you said it, and what you meant by it. I made a similar statement before you did but I don't feel the need to banner it around like a city bus.

[Thread]

Unlike the majority of the brainless mouthbreathing horde here, I actually keep up. I know what you said and when you said it, and what you meant by it. I made a similar statement before you did but I don't feel the need to banner it around like a city bus.

But, you suck all the life & fun out of a situation like this, D. You're better and I see you trying, but, you still have a way to go.

It was a grand joke, but, you ended it prematurely by going into the stacks.

[DMC]

But, you suck all the life & fun out of a situation like this, D. You're better and I see you trying, but, you still have a way to go.

It was a grand joke, but, you ended it prematurely by going into the stacks.
No I called you out on it first and you didn't come clean. Your joke was over at that point, you forced me to open drawers and shuffle papers. Where's the joke where you don't come out looking like Knowstradamus?

[Infinite_limit]

http://images.onset.freedom.com/ocregister/nmf9aa-b88376529z.120150406224231000gis90t27.10.jpg

[Thread]

No I called you out on it first and you didn't come clean. Your joke was over at that point, you forced me to open drawers and shuffle papers. Where's the joke where you don't come out looking like Knowstradamus?

+ you're never wrong.

[DMC]

+ you're never wrong.

he says as he attempts to deflect shame from himself for being a bald face liar.

[spursistan]

bump..

4-18 against Lebron last night when Kiwi dropped his career high on him and came away with the W :lmao..

Only obtuse clowns and haters would deny the fact that Kawhi has passed him by a long time ago..Leonard is now more in KD and Lebron (average, human LBJ that is) league than belonging to Butler/PG13/Giannis tier..

[UZER]

bump..

4-18 against Lebron last night when Kiwi dropped his career high on him and came away with the W :lmao..

Only obtuse clowns and haters would deny the fact that Kawhi has passed him by a long time ago..Leonard is now more in KD and Lebron (average, human LBJ that is) league than belonging to Butler/PG13/Giannis tier..

PG is in the "inner circle". KL is not.

[spursistan]

bump..

4-18 against Lebron last night when Kiwi dropped his career high on him and came away with the W :lmao..

Only obtuse clowns and haters would deny the fact that Kawhi has passed him by a long time ago..Leonard is now more in KD and Lebron (average, human LBJ that is) league than belonging to Butler/PG13/Giannis tier..

https://d2s3dt9f4iyeup.cloudfront.net/images/resized_v1/a7fb75e0-a2e4-4e53-87f1-892ef976f2c2.jpg

[DAF86]

George by far.

George is a second tier all-star. Kawhi is a deluxe role player.

Rockets fans don't watch enough Spurs games apparently.

[Killakobe81]

Funny some iffy takes including PG as the better defender by one of my favorite posters ...:lol
It may have been closer back then ...but I could tell Kiwi was the better defender and even with increased offensive responsibilities that gap has only grown ...
Like Cully I hoped it was only a fluke but KL is a top 3-5 player and climbing

[StrengthAndHonor]

Good take. Exactly what I feel.

I think George has the higher ceiling. He could be a Super Star while Kawhi's ceiling is All Star Selection with 2nd All NBA Team selection. That said, I also believe something in George screams "choker" and/or "overpaid" while Kawhi IMO will be much more consistent but without the glamorous numbers which George can do.


Other than the 2nd All NBA team statement, I still think it's a fair take.

[Killakobe81]

Other than the 2nd All NBA team statement, I still think it's a fair take.

Like I have mentioned first team All NBA will be more interesting than mvp ...only 2 of Durant/kiwi/LeBron can make it ...a bunch of butt hurt across nba fan bases this May when they announce all the awards

[Killakobe81]

To be fair to all involved PG was pre injury and near his peak when the thread was created ...and Kiwi was just off a relatively strong Finals vs LeBron iirc ...
But you can tell which fans like myself that could see Kiwi's upside ...thing is KL has exceeded expectations of even the most homerific Spur fans tbh.

[StrengthAndHonor]

Like I have mentioned first team All NBA will be more interesting than mvp ...only 2 of Durant/kiwi/LeBron can make it ...a bunch of butt hurt across nba fan bases this May when they announce all the awards

I think the best player in the best team and the consensus best player in the league will both make it.

[apalisoc_9]

I think Durant and Bron are going to make it.

Which is criminal considering the star power those two play with while Leonard has 7 new players in the system, outscoring both of them and is a much better defender.

[apalisoc_9]

#narratives
#Popularity
#Poopgetsallthecredit

[Killakobe81]

I think the best player in the best team and the consensus best player in the league will both make it.:corn::corn:

[StrengthAndHonor]

Which is criminal considering the star power those two play with while Leonard has 7 new players in the system, outscoring both of them and is a much better defender.

I don't disagree. Personally, it should be Kawhi and Lebron but these media driven awards are unfortunately not necessarily bestowed on the best players in the league. The voting panel are no better than casual fans, tbh.

[Killakobe81]

Which is criminal considering the star power those two play with while Leonard has 7 new players in the system, outscoring both of them and is a much better defender.

True shooting % and pps favor The Servant
LeBron truly should be the odd man out if we are talking numbers for this season but hard to leave off the best player on the planet ...and last few years, post ASG is when James stops coasting plus with Love hurt expect Westbrook Harden numbers on the regular...

[Killakobe81]

I don't disagree. Personally, it should be Kawhi and Lebron but these media driven awards are unfortunately not necessarily bestowed on the best players in the league. The voting panel are no better than casual fans, tbh.

Disagree though LeBron is,the best of the 3 at mid-season Kiwi and Durant have had better years ...this season. LeBron has been coasting ...he is only 30th in off rating,

[StrengthAndHonor]

Disagree though LeBron is,the best of the 3 at mid-season Kiwi and Durant have had better years ...

Really? I think Leonard is no-brainer, a 2 way player with elite defense is automatic. Lebron is a catalyst and is the only reason the Cavs are not in the lottery and I mean that with no shades of exaggeration.


Warriors will not skip a beat without Durant.

[Killakobe81]

BTW Durant has a better drating as well ...
Personally I think drating is shit, but bitches on here that clung to it when Kiwi led Draymond last year in drating don't get to sweep it aside when Durant is posting a better number than KL ...

[140]

If Spurs are locked in that 2nd seed wouldn't be surprised to see Pop resting Kawhi in some of the big games down the stretch to make sure he doesn't get MVP/1st team award tbh

[Killakobe81]

Really? I think Leonard is no-brainer, a 2 way player with elite defense is automatic. Lebron is a catalyst and is the only reason the Cavs are not in the lottery and I mean that with no shades of exaggeration.


Warriors will not skip a beat without Durant.

I don't think first team All NBA factors that I think that is more of a mvp narrative...

[Killakobe81]

Really? I think Leonard is no-brainer, a 2 way player with elite defense is automatic. Lebron is a catalyst and is the only reason the Cavs are not in the lottery and I mean that with no shades of exaggeration.


Warriors will not skip a beat without Durant.

Like you said not sure how they leave off the best player and the best player off the best team. This is not a knock on Kiwi his,defense has slipped a bit from his goat level standards but his offense has increased more ... he is a bad ass.
No disgrace in being the third best in the league when Elway and Montana are ahead of you...

[StrengthAndHonor]

I don't think first team All NBA factors that I think that is more of a mvp narrative...

Which? That Lebron is essentially the Cleveland's first and only lifeline? If so, I think it's appalling to leave an MVP runner-up from All NBA selections.

[Joseph Kony]

Leonard isn't a better defender, tbh, I'd have George as slightly better..


:wow

[ambchang]

Surprising number of good takes in the thread. I honestly would have said George had the higher ceiling a few years back.

Hindsight is always 20-20 though.

[Killakobe81]

:wow

Bingo the post I was alluding to ...
Even with the slight dip in his, defense this year
Kiwi may be the best wing defender I have ever seen he does so many little things well and I saw that in his second Finals ...it's not just that he defends LeBron the best but he has great timing and smarts along with length and strength best defender since prime GP Pippen and Rodman when he is dialed in ..

[Thomas82]

I don't disagree. Personally, it should be Kawhi and Lebron but these media driven awards are unfortunately not necessarily bestowed on the best players in the league. The voting panel are no better than casual fans, tbh.

+1

[Clipper Nation]

I've always liked both players and I've always favored Kawhi's potential over George's. But when comparing the two, it's unfair to ignore that George has (understandably) never been quite the same since he broke his leg at the Olympics. I'd imagine the gap between them would be a lot closer right now if that never happened.

[HarlemHeat37]

Bingo the post I was alluding to ...
Even with the slight dip in his, defense this year
Kiwi may be the best wing defender I have ever seen he does so many little things well and I saw that in his second Finals ...it's not just that he defends LeBron the best but he has great timing and smarts along with length and strength best defender since prime GP Pippen and Rodman when he is dialed in ..

That was 4 years ago:lol Paul George was the best perimeter defender in the NBA and anchored(along with Hibbert) the best defense in the NBA, at the time..he was a metrics monster..

And I still think he had the higher ceiling..he has been blessed with a better body for basketball than Kawhi, with his height and athleticism..

[313]

Which is criminal considering the star power those two play with while Leonard has 7 new players in the system, outscoring both of them and is a much better defender.Kawhi and Bron both average 25.9 ppg, while Bron is averaging 9 apg to Kawhi's 3 apg :lol

[spursistan]

He follows up last night stinker vs Lebron with 6-19 game vs Otto Porter and the Pacers lose a 6 straight..Virtually all Top 10 SFs have owned H2H this year. :lol

I think he is mentally checked out and probably doesn't want to be in Indy anymore..

[HarlemHeat37]

^^He doesn't try on defense anymore, either:lol

It's obvious he has checked out..tough to blame him, he has the worst GM and coach combination in the NBA..who the fuck hires Nate McMillan in 2017?:lol

[z0sa]

Kawhi, its marginal athletically but the difference in teammates and organization in general stacks the deck insanely in the Claws favor tbh

[99 Problems]

Kawhi and Bron both average 25.9 ppg, while Bron is averaging 9 apg to Kawhi's 3 apg :lol

Yer well Bron runs the point with Kyrie as his back up now that King Delly has taken his talents elsewhere.

[313]

Yer well Bron runs the point with Kyrie as his back up now that King Delly has taken his talents elsewhere.
implying Kawhi could do what Bron dies for that cabs team :lol

[TDMVPDPOY]

pre injury, if pg is so great he would've had a winning h2h % against the top tier players at his position

hence so great cant even beat lebron in a series while kawhi has already won 1 and continues to win h2h games ever since...

this guy puts up empty stats man

[SpursIndonesia]

He follows up last night stinker vs Lebron with 6-19 game vs Otto Porter and the Pacers lose a 6 straight..Virtually all Top 10 SFs have owned H2H this year. :lol

I think he is mentally checked out and probably doesn't want to be in Indy anymore..


^^He doesn't try on defense anymore, either:lol

It's obvious he has checked out..tough to blame him, he has the worst GM and coach combination in the NBA..who the fuck hires Nate McMillan in 2017?:lol

Any hope he can land in SA to be Kawhi's best henchman ? :D

[TDMVPDPOY]

even though he has checked out, the player with potential on the pacers to rebuild around is that turner kid...his fkn good if he continues to improve his game

but wasn't the pacers breakup was pg own doing with the shenanigans off the court?

[spursistan]

832632203565690885

Go fuck yourself Bill :lol..Proof you don't watch NBA basketball anymore outside Celtics and TNT games....PG hasnt' even been a Top 5 SF this season.

832626560242814976

[spursistan]

^^He doesn't try on defense anymore, either:lol

It's obvious he has checked out..tough to blame him, he has the worst GM and coach combination in the NBA..who the fuck hires Nate McMillan in 2017?:lol

Jimmy Butler isn't in a better situation (arguably worse roster-wise), yet that didn't prevent him from taking another leap and perform like Top 10 player this year..Honestly, George has a lot of Melo in him: all that talent, but he craves the limelights a little more than winning (local media has started calling him out for his inconsistency and not wanting to play the 4)..

Deep down, he feels like he's outgrown Indy..My bet he is going to be the first star to turn down the new super max and bolt to LA in 2018..If I'm Indiana I would probably trade him to Boston this summer for the two Nets picks and start rebuilding in earnest....


832595877395042305

[HarlemHeat37]

I don't think he's that good anymore, though, tbh..I feel like he isn't giving effort, but I haven't actually been impressed by him in like 2 years, even in games where he's motivated..he has always been a chucker, too..kind of a waste of talent/athleticism..

Butler is easily better, overall..

[140]

Having PG over Giannis :lmao

Simm:lolns

[spursistan]

837151315696496641in his grill!

[StrengthAndHonor]

Dang. Kawhi for MVP tbh.