Knowing what is known now.

[thunderup]

Is the Harden trade the worst ever? Presti done fucked up our chances to win a title. If Kevin bolts out, I wouldn't be surprised. This is a truly sickening time for Thunder fans.

[Arnold Toht]

Not worried here.

[Clipper Nation]

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[spurraider21]

:lol meth

[Darius Bieber]

I don't think so. Martin wasn't a huge contributor to be honest. He can be replaced on the OKC bench. The real reason to be worried is if Durant/Westbrook will look to leave OKC because of the poor decisions by management.

[Michael Jordan.]

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2563035/hardenwalkinghisdog.gif

[lefty]

http://replygif.net/i/1049.gif

[InRareForm]

Kmart can replaced. Hot gaRbage for another hot garbage

[ElNono]

Could be worse, tbh.. Westbrook could have lost most of his athleticism from that knee surgery... hope it happens, IMO...

[spurraider21]

^brutal

[Clipper Nation]

People do realize that the fact K-Mart can easily be replaced just makes the Harden trade that much more retarded, right?

That so-called "genius" Presti managed to trade Harden for one mediocre season of Martin, a few young scrubs, and the opportunity to draft Steven Adams.... even Isiah, Kahn, Hammond, and Otis Smith laugh at that trade :lol

[Chinook]

Just amnesty Perkins and try to get something with the inevitable trade exception that will come from Martin. Just be done with the Harden trade and move on.

[Mugen]

:lol Choosing Perk and Spearchucker over owning the West for the next 5 years

[Leetonidas]

presti dun goofed

[HI-FI]

hard to believe OP has gone from "not worried here' to this.:lol good shit.

tbh, the Harden trade was a massive fail, but Presti is still a good GM. They built their team up through tanking for a few years, got some great pieces, but were forced to make a tough decision and Presti didn't know how to make it work. It happens. Spurs paid for the He Who Shall Not Be Named, we lost a couple years off contender status with that queer.

While I think Presti is overrated, he's not some genius, but he's good and still has work ahead of him. The real risk is Durant or Chimpbrook leaving. as a Spurs fan I hope it happens, but I would feel sorry for the non-obnoxious, non-meth fans of OKC.

[weebo]

Ranks right up there with one of the worse for sure. OKC had the makings of a dynasty with 3 legit superstars. Now, they'll be lucky to get back to the Finals.

[spurraider21]

:lol Choosing Perk and Spearchucker over owning the West for the next 5 years

:rollin

[HI-FI]

Thunderef fan should take comfort in the fact that even getting to the finals, being up 5 points with :28 seconds, isn't always good enough either. So just have to see how it shakes out. I don't give a shit about the Thunderefs but I would like to see the new CBA spread the talent around, make the game more exciting and unpredictable, less of a gay superteams getting together for cheap rings.

[Rogue]

the simple fact is that OKC could never afford four 10+ m/yr contracts on the same team. They were desperate to move him because they knew they would lose him for free once he became a FA. they got some picks and young prospects at least, little better than none imho. But I still believe that they should've moved Westchuck or Ibaka. Ibaka is overrated, westchuck is good but doesn't look like a good fit for Durant, and both guys had much bigger trading values than beard nigga at that time and either of them would've brought back more than what they got from Houston for Harden. They should've at least given harden a try in the starting lineups imho.

[slick'81]

Hey atleast u still have ibakkkka

[ElNono]

Hey atleast u still have ibakkkka

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2554079/ibakablowslayup.gif

[jeebus]

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2554079/ibakablowslayup.gif
I like how he tried to just tap it up with his right arm, as if he was back in his native Congo hunting wild boar. He has the spear in his right hand, as his left hand was recently stung by a Tsetse fly but saved from amputation by passing missionaries. He chucks the spear with great might only to come up short and hitting the side of a tree. You can tell that hunting moment was in his mind as he went for the tap, missing terribly.

[Bill_Brasky]

Literally the worst trade ever. After they lost the finals they should have traded abaka while his value was high and kept det beard tbh.

[ffadicted]

As much as I love to make fun of other teams and exagerate while I do, there is no hyberbole in saying that this decision as a whole and all parts that involved it and came from it are some of the worst basketball decisions I've ever seen. GG Thunder, you were supposed to be a dynasty but ya done fucked up

[Koolaid_Man]

Go head and send WestChuck home to LA

[DJR210]

Could be worse, tbh.. Westbrook could have lost most of his athleticism from that knee surgery... hope it happens, IMO...

:lol Mods trolling. :toast Spurstalk.

[TIMMYtoZO]

:lol Losing to Miami in the Finals was OKC's peak.

[Thread]

:lol Losing to Miami in the Finals was OKC's peak.

& that's just the way it is.

Durant just isn't it, much to the chagrin of NYC.

[Thread]

& that's just the way it is.

Durant just isn't it, much to the chagrin of NYC.

ADDENDUM:::He's got just a scent, the slightest whiff of Prince about him.

[Splits]

Shoulda built the bunkers in tornado alley. Will your politicians learn after Moore 2.0?

Oh wait, this was about trading Beard. Yeah, bad move.

[whitemamba]

:lol CN trolling himself.

[elmanutres]

durant gonna go what lebron went through in cleaveland, then he leaves for another team and the thunder become contenders to be moved back to seattle. but i doubt durant will leave oklahoma, he's too loyal

[Thread]

durant gonna go what lebron went through in cleaveland, then he leaves for another team and the thunder become contenders to be moved back to seattle. but i doubt durant will leave oklahoma, he's too loyal

& insecure. That's why he can't exercise his franchise:::he can't figure out how to do it, or, even if it's in him to be something more than a better Prince.

[spurraider21]

Durant is tailor made to be a Laker. he's a Beta perimeter player who needs a dominant big to win per par

[LkrFan]

Not worried here.
:lol

[KaiRMD1]

The Harden trade could truly be the undoing of the Thunder, sadly. Unless Reggie Jackson really blows up, this could be the beginning of the end. Luckily for them, the free agency period isn't over

[LkrFan]

:lol Choosing Perk and Spearchucker over owning the West for the next 5 years
WTF?! :rollin :lmao :rollin

[Clipper Nation]

Durant is tailor made to be a Laker. he's a Beta perimeter player who needs a dominant big to win per par

Nah, he's headed to his favorite team from childhood - the Raptors - to play with Wiggins, tbh :lol

[Stabula]

:lol Really thunderup? You just gave the forum a tramping grounds with which to shit all over your team

[Thebesteva]

Is the Harden trade the worst ever? Presti done fucked up our chances to win a title. If Kevin bolts out, I wouldn't be surprised. This is a truly sickening time for Thunder fans.

Durant is coming to LA...book it 2015

[AchillesHeel]

Lakers sure hate this trade if Dwight leaves for Houston to join Harden, tbh :lol

[Quadzilla99]

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2563035/hardenwalkinghisdog.gif


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[Spurs9]

They wouldn't have been able to afford all of them anyway.

[TrainOfThought5]

Not worried here.

Nagasaki.

[OKC]

Is the Harden trade the worst ever? Presti done fucked up our chances to win a title. If Kevin bolts out, I wouldn't be surprised. This is a truly sickening time for Thunder fans.

Hindsight is always 20/20. Quit being dramatic and just enjoy the game. After all, we did get Steven Adams out of this - who we all know will be the best center to ever play the game.

[LnGrrrR]

Eh, bad trade, but not the worst of all time. Presti had to choose between Ibaka or Harden IIRC. He chose the wrong one. Shit happens.

[Raven]

the simple fact is that OKC could never afford four 10+ m/yr contracts on the same team. They were desperate to move him because they knew they would lose him for free once he became a FA. they got some picks and young prospects at least, little better than none imho. But I still believe that they should've moved Westchuck or Ibaka. Ibaka is overrated, westchuck is good but doesn't look like a good fit for Durant, and both guys had much bigger trading values than beard nigga at that time and either of them would've brought back more than what they got from Houston for Harden. They should've at least given harden a try in the starting lineups imho.

the weird part is that if they could not afford it, than why they paid it anyway? their loss was when they didn't want to accept they were retarded to trade for perkins and traded harden instead. it's crazy to think they could have played
westchimp harden durant green ibaka while still having the likes of sefolosha on the team.. a small ball team for the ages that did not happen.

[Captivus]

The Thunder made a huge mistake, the make a decision under uncertainty, mainly:


How good are Jackson-Harden-Durant?
Is it better than West-XX-Durant?


They didn’t know, because they didn’t check.

If I had to say something, I would start talking about the Ibaka contract.

[whitemamba]

Eh, bad trade, but not the worst of all time. Presti had to choose between Ibaka or Harden IIRC. He chose the wrong one. Shit happens.

:lmao sig

[Phillip]

the simple fact is that OKC could never afford four 10+ m/yr contracts on the same team. They were desperate to move him because they knew they would lose him for free once he became a FA. they got some picks and young prospects at least, little better than none imho. But I still believe that they should've moved Westchuck or Ibaka. Ibaka is overrated, westchuck is good but doesn't look like a good fit for Durant, and both guys had much bigger trading values than beard nigga at that time and either of them would've brought back more than what they got from Houston for Harden. They should've at least given harden a try in the starting lineups imho.

This.

Harden/Durant > Westchuck/Durant

[Bill_Brasky]

I mean it really isn't hindsight being 20/20. At the time the trade went down we all called it retarded except thunderfans. You traded a max contract worthy player for Kevin Martin. LOL.

[dg7md]

How appropriate it is, but the Thunder are truly the Sonics of the '90s. They'll be a legit, amazing team, but will never bring home a championship.

Harden isn't that amazing of a talent, but he worked so perfectly in that system. They'll be hard-pressed to find another person who can fill in that role that led them to the Finals, which I still believe was a combination of us choking in addition to OKC outplaying us. Mostly us choking.

[OKC]

I mean it really isn't hindsight being 20/20. At the time the trade went down we all called it retarded except thunderfans. You traded a max contract worthy player for Kevin Martin. LOL.

Easy for an armchair fan to spend other people's money and make hindsight judgements. If any of us here think we have any idea what it's like to run an NBA franchise, I think we're fooling ourselves. The NBA is a business. Businesses make hit and miss decisions everyday. This was a miss. Presti didn't choose Ibaka over Harden. Presti had in his mind the dollar amount his business was willing to pay each player. He made those offers and let the chips fall.

[Thread]

Easy for an armchair fan to spend other people's money and make hindsight judgements. If any of us here think we have any idea what it's like to run an NBA franchise, I think we're fooling ourselves. The NBA is a business. Businesses make hit and miss decisions everyday. This was a miss. Presti didn't choose Ibaka over Harden. Presti had in his mind the dollar amount his business was willing to pay each player. He made those offers and let the chips fall.

Good stuff, O.

[OKC]

Those within the organization who actually have knowledge of the situation would tell you Ibaka was absolutely not a choice - he just inked a deal first. YOu have to understand Presti is very methodical in his approach, like it or not. He has a very methodical approach and sticks to it. However, the idea that he chose Ibaka over Harden is simply 100% inaccurate. He went into negotiations wanting both players, obviously. This was not a situation where he said..ok, I'm going to choose which player I value more, do whatever it takes to sign that guy, and deal with player #2 after that. That is an approach some GMs would take and that's just a difference in business practices. I truly believe Presti had a number on both guys, he was going to offer that figure to both players, timing being irrelevent, and see what happened. Call it stubborn if you will. That's just the way Presti is. He has financial considerations in running the franchise and I know it's easy for fans to scoff at a few million bucks and consider it insignificant to an NBA franchise, but he's a businessman and he puts pretty strict limitations on his contract negotiations. I understand the argument that Presti was $X away from inking Harden and it could've resulted in a much different outcome for OKC last year and the upcoming few years and that shipping Harden out to save this amount of money was stupid - I don't disagree with that. I do think it was a bad trade, but I do also have some respect for the way Presti operates, some sort of appreciation for the difficulty in juggling financial considerations which are much more complex than most of us realize, and sticking to his guns. I didn't like the outcome, but I can respect the way he operates.

[djohn2oo8]

Easy for an armchair fan to spend other people's money and make hindsight judgements. If any of us here think we have any idea what it's like to run an NBA franchise, I think we're fooling ourselves. The NBA is a business. Businesses make hit and miss decisions everyday. This was a miss. Presti didn't choose Ibaka over Harden. Presti had in his mind the dollar amount his business was willing to pay each player. He made those offers and let the chips fall.


Those within the organization who actually have knowledge of the situation would tell you Ibaka was absolutely not a choice - he just inked a deal first. YOu have to understand Presti is very methodical in his approach, like it or not. He has a very methodical approach and sticks to it. However, the idea that he chose Ibaka over Harden is simply 100% inaccurate. He went into negotiations wanting both players, obviously. This was not a situation where he said..ok, I'm going to choose which player I value more, do whatever it takes to sign that guy, and deal with player #2 after that. That is an approach some GMs would take and that's just a difference in business practices. I truly believe Presti had a number on both guys, he was going to offer that figure to both players, timing being irrelevent, and see what happened. Call it stubborn if you will. That's just the way Presti is. He has financial considerations in running the franchise and I know it's easy for fans to scoff at a few million bucks and consider it insignificant to an NBA franchise, but he's a businessman and he puts pretty strict limitations on his contract negotiations. I understand the argument that Presti was $X away from inking Harden and it could've resulted in a much different outcome for OKC last year and the upcoming few years and that shipping Harden out to save this amount of money was stupid - I don't disagree with that. I do think it was a bad trade, but I do also have some respect for the way Presti operates, some sort of appreciation for the difficulty in juggling financial considerations which are much more complex than most of us realize, and sticking to his guns. I didn't like the outcome, but I can respect the way he operates.
Presti is as overrated as they come. And no he didn't pick Ibaka over Harden, he chose PERKINS over Harden when all he had to do was amnesty him. Then the dumbass bought into his own hype by giving Harden only hours to decide if he wanted to sign. Just as he picked Jeff Green who had no use there because Durant is the SF.

[djohn2oo8]

How appropriate it is, but the Thunder are truly the Sonics of the '90s. They'll be a legit, amazing team, but will never bring home a championship.

Harden isn't that amazing of a talent, but he worked so perfectly in that system. They'll be hard-pressed to find another person who can fill in that role that led them to the Finals, which I still believe was a combination of us choking in addition to OKC outplaying us. Mostly us choking.

25/5/4 in his first season as a starter, with no training camp with the team, leading a McHale coached team to the playoffs. Yeah that's not that amazing.

[dg7md]

25/5/4 in his first season as a starter, with no training camp with the team, leading a McHale coached team to the playoffs. Yeah that's not that amazing.

What I'm trying to say is, he will never be the first option on a contending team. Harden is an ultimate companion player, but will never be considered more than a second or third option on a Finals winning team. He's too small, too streaky, and too inconsistent to be counted on for anything more than the sidekick role.

If the Rockets get a little more size they'll be taken more seriously in the west, but Harden is not that kind of player that can go into a system and become the leading option and find success.

[Thread]

^

[OKC]

Presti is as overrated as they come. And no he didn't pick Ibaka over Harden, he chose PERKINS over Harden when all he had to do was amnesty him. Then the dumbass bought into his own hype by giving Harden only hours to decide if he wanted to sign. Just as he picked Jeff Green who had no use there because Durant is the SF.

I'm not going to defend Perkins. Getting him when they got him made a bit of sense, but he's no longer a very valuable piece to the puzzle. In fact, he's almost a liability. As far as "only giving Harden hours to decide"....James Harden had MONTHS to decide. He knew negotiations were coming up months in advance. James Harden wanted to run a James Harden show, period. I don't blame him a bit for that. More power to him. He deserves to be the alpha dog on a team. But this BS that Harden was shocked when Presti sent him packing after "just a few hours to decide" is complete horseshit. James Harden knew what he wanted and he got it. LIke I said, more power to him.

[djohn2oo8]

What I'm trying to say is, he will never be the first option on a contending team. Harden is an ultimate companion player, but will never be considered more than a second or third option on a Finals winning team. He's too small, too streaky, and too inconsistent to be counted on for anything more than the sidekick role.

If the Rockets get a little more size they'll be taken more seriously in the west, but Harden is not that kind of player that can go into a system and become the leading option and find success.

1. :lol he's 6'5
2. 26/5/4 is pretty consistent
3. He found success this year as the leading option
4. You sound butthurt about the backdoor sweep

[djohn2oo8]

Thunder and Rockets executives give the same explanation for the timing of the trade four days prior to the Oct. 31 deadline for contract extensions: Houston needed a deal done on that Saturday, because Rockets officials felt that was the bare minimum to assure they could get their eventual five-year, $80 million deal with Harden into place.
Houston had been pressing hard to complete the trade on that Friday, but Thunder GM Sam Presti waited until Saturday to present his final offer with a 60-minute deadline to accept. Presti believed the Thunder would've lost leverage in potential trade packages if rivals weren't sure they could keep Harden off the restricted free-agent market next summer.

[djohn2oo8]

Thunder and Rockets executives give the same explanation for the timing of the trade four days prior to the Oct. 31 deadline for contract extensions: Houston needed a deal done on that Saturday, because Rockets officials felt that was the bare minimum to assure they could get their eventual five-year, $80 million deal with Harden into place.
Houston had been pressing hard to complete the trade on that Friday, but Thunder GM Sam Presti waited until Saturday to present his final offer with a 60-minute deadline to accept. Presti believed the Thunder would've lost leverage in potential trade packages if rivals weren't sure they could keep Harden off the restricted free-agent market next summer.




Presti could have just let him play out the year and be a restricted free agent and sign him to an extension this year. There was absolutely no reason to rush.

[OKC]

Presti could have just let him play out the year and be a restricted free agent and sign him to an extension this year. There was absolutely no reason to rush.

60 minute deadline...well yeah, but there was back and forth between Harden's agent and Presti for days. It's not like Presti out of the blue slapped a 60 minute offer on Harden's lap..not to mention Harden had months to ponder what he wanted. Come on. And yes..there was a rush. If you let Harden play the year out, maybe that's ok in that it gives the team much better odds at a title, but from a financial perspective, it's a bad idea. Why? Because Presti knew without a doubt Harden would get multiple max offer deals as a restricted free agent - deals that Presti could not and would not be able to match. If Presti couldn't sign an extension before the season started, Harden has no trade value whatsoever to OKC at the end of the season. He just walks and signs elsewhere.

[Mr.Bottomtooth]

I like how he tried to just tap it up with his right arm, as if he was back in his native Congo hunting wild boar. He has the spear in his right hand, as his left hand was recently stung by a Tsetse fly but saved from amputation by passing missionaries. He chucks the spear with great might only to come up short and hitting the side of a tree. You can tell that hunting moment was in his mind as he went for the tap, missing terribly.

:lmao

[MeloHype]

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[Kool Bob Love]

Is the Harden trade the worst ever? Presti done fucked up our chances to win a title. If Kevin bolts out, I wouldn't be surprised. This is a truly sickening time for Thunder fans.

:lmao