Better player all-time, Jason Kidd or Dwyane Wade?

[TheRealCB]

Sons?

[TheRealCB]

I got Kidd by the way.

[TDMVPDPOY]

one guy is interested in posting triple doubles that dont equate to wins, nothing but a stat padder

the other is flopper...

both are bad choices here...

[hyhy]

Not a fan of kidd

[z0sa]

Wade

[mudyez]

Kidd overall, Wade may have more importance, since there are fewer top level SG's (MJ, Kobe, West...but then?) than PG (Magic, Oscar, Stockton, Thomas,...) if you go through the books.

[ffadicted]

Lack of FMVP hurts Kidd, so tough question, I just went with muh gut

[Leetonidas]

Wade's got 3 rings and has one of the best Finals performances ever under his belt. Wade > Kidd

[Seefourdc]

Wade. Career stats that matter: Rings, MVP's...

















Everything else.

[StrengthAndHonor]

Wade's got 3 rings and has one of the best Finals performances ever under his belt. Wade > Kidd

Pretty much this. Wade all the way.

Playoff, regular season. Advance stats, raw numbers. Peak and prime Wade comes out on top. Wade has carried an NBA team to a championship too.


:lol

[Phillip]

Wade.

If it wasn't for some injuries, Wade probably would have been in the running for 2nd best SG of all time behind MJ, jostling for position with Kobe, and maybe even a top 15 all time spot.

[resistanze]

Wade.

If it wasn't for some injuries, Wade probably would have been in the running for 2nd best SG of all time behind MJ, jostling for position with Kobe, and maybe even a top 15 all time spot.

Yeah, even with 2-3 more productive seasons, he can sneak into the top 20. It's Wade quite easily, and I've always liked watching Kidd play.

[StrengthAndHonor]

Like I said, people have selective memories. Wade was an absolute beast. You can't be serious and rank Kidd over Wade.

[Clipper Nation]

I only voted for Kidd because I hate that faggot Wade :lol

[JamStone]

Probably Wade but I think it's actually pretty close. I think Wade was absolutely a beast for a handful of seasons. But even with great individual stats, I think maybe up to half of his NBA career has been just good but not great. And also remember a couple years after the 2006 title, Wade led the Heat to a 15-67 record. Granted, Shaq was traded midseason and Wade had some injury issues. But still, the Heat were still 10-41 with Wade in the line-up that season before Riley shut him down to tank for the draft. That was a 25-26 year old Wade. Even with the 3 titles and the FMVP, there are some serious blemishes on his career resume.

Kidd doesn't have the unbelievable peak Wade had early on in his career or the FMVP to perhaps be the difference. But his career achievements are no joke. 10 all star selections, 5 1st team all NBA, 9 1st or 2nd team all defense, led a team to back-to-back NBA Finals appearances, and turned around two franchises in Phoenix and New Jersey once he joined them.

I don't know that Wade's entire career beats out Kidd's, just based on the 2006 title and FMVP, though those two things carry a lot of weight obviously. There's no doubt I'd take a peak Wade over a peak Kidd, I just think it's a tougher call if you consider entire careers.

[scroteface]

lol i love it when people let their bias make them say absolutely retarded things and completely just make shit up. Wade didn't wasn't just a beast for "a handful of seasons," I'm looking at his career stats on basketball reference and outside of his rookie season, the next 7 season's stats were pretty much identical before his scoring has finally slowed down a little the past couple of seasons playing with lebron. Wade having an incredible peak couple of years and then just being "ok" is the funniest lie i've ever heard. dude gets injured for the past couple of seasons and people forget he was probably the 2nd best defensive 2 guard of all time behind MJ and light years ahead of kobe in that regard and one of the more efficient scorers we've ever seen on the perimeter with his fg% and getting to the line often. lol kobe slobber. lmfao jason fucking kidd equal to dwayne wade. you can't compare a #1 option to a guy who can't even score to save his life.

[JamStone]

Stats aren't everything, I'm told. When you put up very good individual stats but your team misses the playoffs or is a quick first round exit, how are those great individual stats perceived? How is T-Mac perceived? Dominique? Is it a matter of needing more help or a matter of the player stat padding because of that lack of help, but it also resulting in little team success? Wade has always put up really good numbers, but when I said I view maybe half of his career as just good, it has less to do with his individual stats and more to do with his ability to translate his individual stats into team success. In the four seasons following the 2006 title, missed the playoffs once, 3 first round exits, record of 149-179 (4-12 in the post seasons). No matter the individual stats or highlight reel plays, you're not going to be called a beast for those seasons, especially after the 2006 season.

Other superstar players would get criticized the same way. The 2006 title and FMVP doesn't shield Wade from getting that same criticism.

[scroteface]

lol oh, so now we're comparing wade to tmac. their stats absolutely are NOT comparable, wade's efficiency was through the roof while tmac did it shooting 39-42% from the fucking field. not to mention wade has 3 rings and mcgrady was a career loser. tmac was never in wade's league, little fanboys like you just bought into the flash and pretty shots. look at the rosters wade had on those teams, and the injuries he faced over that stretch, and it's totally plausible why those teams were so shitty. wade won a ring as the man, just as many as kobe has won as the man. difference is, wade wasn't a cancerous team destroying primaddona chucker to do it.

[ambchang]

Wade for peak. Kids had longevity and that counts for something.

If I want to win a ring, I draft wade. If I want tone competitive for a long period of time, I take Kidd.

Kidd has some serious flaws in his game, even during his prime. Wade during that title run had a season for the ages, and really is something you see once every 5 or 6 years.

[D-Wade]

Obviously Flash but I love J-Kidd's game, too. In his prime, the guy was the smartest defender at his position and clutch as hell. Just like Wade, neither is really a consistent jump shooter but they somehow catch fire from range when it matters most. Also guys like Kenyon Martin, Jefferson and even Vince Carter were all elevated by the Floor General that was Kidd.

One of his best games back in the 02 finals, game 3. I'm always amazed by the variety of ways he scored in this game, when you compare it to the one-dimensional way guys like Westbrook and even D-Rose score in today's game:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6j0aPBnnF9A

[namlook]

Wade. He has the rings.

[gaKNOW!blee]

Kidd is an all time great, but Dwayne Wade's prime was just too good. He's olny 6-4, doesn't really hit 3's (years with 88, 78, 63 and then never over 22) yet if he can get healthy will score 25k points while shooting close to 50% overall. Factor in his defensive stats, and I gotta go with Wade.

[hater]

LOL at the rings argument. Wade played next to Bosh and Lebron. Kidd played next to Camby and Dick Jefferson.


Wade has 1 legit ring, same as Kidd.

Kidd's career runs circles around wheelchair.

[namlook]

LOL at the rings argument. Wade played next to Bosh and Lebron. Kidd played next to Camby and Dick Jefferson.


Wade has 1 legit ring, same as Kidd.

Kidd's career runs circles around wheelchair.

Wade showed he could lead his team to a championship as the best player. Kidd has never done that. That's the difference.

[JamStone]

Wade showed he could lead his team to a championship as the best player. Kidd has never done that. That's the difference.

Better player all time, Chauncey Billups or Chris Paul?

[scroteface]

Better player all time, Chauncey Billups or Chris Paul?

Chauncey Billups never lead his team to a title, he played a supporting role along with the rest of the starting 5.

[JamStone]

Sure he did. He was the best player on Detroit in the Finals and won the FMVP. He was also the PG who controlled the tempo of the offense and also the closer for the team.

You can say that was a much more balanced team than other championship teams, but there was still a leader. As great as Ben Wallace was on defense, Billups was clearly the leader of the team. There isn't another player you would say on the Pistons who led that team. Every team has a leader. For that Pistons team, it was Billups. The fact he wasn't considered a superstar doesn't change that fact.

[scroteface]

chauncey billups did not "lead" a team to the title anymore than derek fisher lead the lakers to a title

[JamStone]

If you want to believe that, I'm sure I can't change your mind.

I simply disagree.

[hater]

Wade showed he could lead his team to a championship as the best player. Kidd has never done that. That's the difference.

Kidd had Dick Jefferson and I don't even remember who as coach.

Wade had Shaq and Pat Riley.

[JamStone]

I believe it was Byron Scott both Finals appearances.

And that's true about Wade as well. In all three of his championships, he played with a top 10 player all time. Shaq may have been past his prime and Wade the best player on that title team, but Wade doesn't get past the Pistons without Shaq.

[namlook]

Better player all time, Chauncey Billups or Chris Paul?

Start a thread if you seriously want to discuss that. This is a Kidd/Wade thread and Wade > Kidd in part because he led a team to a championship.