hitmantb
07-28-2013, 10:01 PM
Unfortunately for Duncan, people will only remember the hard stats. So Parker stealing finals MVP from him by padding stats against an over-matched Cleveland team even tho Duncan was the best Spur of 2007 will not be considered. So let's look at the simple formula:
Championship = You need a few of these to show you can take a team to the top
Finals MVP = Being the alpha dog will always be worth more than the side kick
MVP = We should not punish a player for weaker teammates if they were the best players in the league. Likewise, while being finals MVP is amazing, you also can not compare one series against an entire season, 2002 Duncan and Cleveland Lebron both get points because of this
These are also the first three stats that come up when you Google any player's WIKI page, and by far the most important ones. I also believe you must win at least one of each to get on this list. Otherwise players like Robert Horry and Steve Kerr would be way too high versus Kevin Garnett for example. I also don't consider Oscar Robinson anywhere near this list because anyone can pad stats when they are not playing against the best competitions, and he has only one ring and one MVP despite of his triple doubles. Those three categories are also great because they are are relative performance indicators. The older eras tend to favor scoring over defense, so no one today is putting up the same ridiculously high field goal percentages and points-per-game as the 60 and 70's. They are also not popularity contests like all-star appearance. They are the most objective measurement of a player's legacy!
Top 5:
1) Jordan: 6+6+5=17 points, it is MJ, enough said
2) Russell: 11+0+5=16 points, his era did not have finals MVP but then again, he also had the most stacked team versus competition, it would be like if Shaq/Duncan/LeBron/Kobe/ all played on the same team and one of them won most individual accolades, also this came pre-NBA/ABA merger and I would have no problem if he was bounced to the bottom of top 10
3) Kareem: 6+2+6=14 points, only player better than Duncan in longevity, but then again he also had a stacked team around him when he won finals MVP with the Lakers, can you imagine if Duncan had Magic/Worthy this year instead of Parker/Ginobili?
4) Magic: 5+3+3=11 points, just amazingly strong resume, even if he had a stacked team it is hard to rank anyone else ahead of him
5) Duncan: 4+3+2 = 9 points, this is where I feel he belongs today if you don't believe in the hype of Larry Bird, and realized he had a much more stacked team/market than Duncan yet racked up less titles and finals MVPs than Duncan did, unfortunately, the next player is poised to bounce Duncan off this chart. Most media will put Bird here but I strongly believe Duncan is better (and Lebron is a title+FMVP away from being better than both)
6-10:
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Lebron: 2+2+4=8 points, never before 28 seconds would change the historical standing of two players the way game 6 did. Duncan would be 11 points and Lebron would be 6 points with a real possibility of the Miami Heat breaking up, but now Lebron is 1 title + finals MVP away from getting in front of Duncan. I know we all love to blame him for leaving Cleveland but let's face it, other than Duncan, everyone on this list had a stacked to the max team to work with, Jordan did not win it alone until they got another all time great next to him plus additional all-star's
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Bird: 3+2+3 = 8 points, very overrated considered he had McHale, Walton and Pariah to play with, but ended up with less titles and final MVP's than Duncan, honestly I believe if he wasn't white there is no way he would be top 5 as what most media portrayed.
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Shaq: 4+3+1 = 8 points, in my opinion no way to separate him from Kobe, both have done great with and without each other
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Kobe: 5+2+1 = 8 points, in my opinion no way to separate him from Shaq, both have done great with and without each other
10) Wilt: 2+1+4=7 points, I know he put up huge individual numbers and some media will rank him at top 5 but using unbiased formula, it is hard to rank him ahead of the rest when he only won two rings
Honorable Mention:
Dr J: 3+2+4 = 9 points but 4 of those points came from ABA, hard to rank him higher than people above him as a result.
I know most media will not rely on facts and fair formulas to rank players and will rank Wilt/Bird ahead of Duncan instead, I know in our heart Duncan should be even higher as he has by far the worst teammates and smallest market of anyone on this list, but sad as it may be, game 6 opened the door for LeBron to bounce him off the top 5 list, outside of a divine intervention of major injuries in Miami.
Championship = You need a few of these to show you can take a team to the top
Finals MVP = Being the alpha dog will always be worth more than the side kick
MVP = We should not punish a player for weaker teammates if they were the best players in the league. Likewise, while being finals MVP is amazing, you also can not compare one series against an entire season, 2002 Duncan and Cleveland Lebron both get points because of this
These are also the first three stats that come up when you Google any player's WIKI page, and by far the most important ones. I also believe you must win at least one of each to get on this list. Otherwise players like Robert Horry and Steve Kerr would be way too high versus Kevin Garnett for example. I also don't consider Oscar Robinson anywhere near this list because anyone can pad stats when they are not playing against the best competitions, and he has only one ring and one MVP despite of his triple doubles. Those three categories are also great because they are are relative performance indicators. The older eras tend to favor scoring over defense, so no one today is putting up the same ridiculously high field goal percentages and points-per-game as the 60 and 70's. They are also not popularity contests like all-star appearance. They are the most objective measurement of a player's legacy!
Top 5:
1) Jordan: 6+6+5=17 points, it is MJ, enough said
2) Russell: 11+0+5=16 points, his era did not have finals MVP but then again, he also had the most stacked team versus competition, it would be like if Shaq/Duncan/LeBron/Kobe/ all played on the same team and one of them won most individual accolades, also this came pre-NBA/ABA merger and I would have no problem if he was bounced to the bottom of top 10
3) Kareem: 6+2+6=14 points, only player better than Duncan in longevity, but then again he also had a stacked team around him when he won finals MVP with the Lakers, can you imagine if Duncan had Magic/Worthy this year instead of Parker/Ginobili?
4) Magic: 5+3+3=11 points, just amazingly strong resume, even if he had a stacked team it is hard to rank anyone else ahead of him
5) Duncan: 4+3+2 = 9 points, this is where I feel he belongs today if you don't believe in the hype of Larry Bird, and realized he had a much more stacked team/market than Duncan yet racked up less titles and finals MVPs than Duncan did, unfortunately, the next player is poised to bounce Duncan off this chart. Most media will put Bird here but I strongly believe Duncan is better (and Lebron is a title+FMVP away from being better than both)
6-10:
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Lebron: 2+2+4=8 points, never before 28 seconds would change the historical standing of two players the way game 6 did. Duncan would be 11 points and Lebron would be 6 points with a real possibility of the Miami Heat breaking up, but now Lebron is 1 title + finals MVP away from getting in front of Duncan. I know we all love to blame him for leaving Cleveland but let's face it, other than Duncan, everyone on this list had a stacked to the max team to work with, Jordan did not win it alone until they got another all time great next to him plus additional all-star's
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Bird: 3+2+3 = 8 points, very overrated considered he had McHale, Walton and Pariah to play with, but ended up with less titles and final MVP's than Duncan, honestly I believe if he wasn't white there is no way he would be top 5 as what most media portrayed.
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Shaq: 4+3+1 = 8 points, in my opinion no way to separate him from Kobe, both have done great with and without each other
6, 7, 8, 9 tie) Kobe: 5+2+1 = 8 points, in my opinion no way to separate him from Shaq, both have done great with and without each other
10) Wilt: 2+1+4=7 points, I know he put up huge individual numbers and some media will rank him at top 5 but using unbiased formula, it is hard to rank him ahead of the rest when he only won two rings
Honorable Mention:
Dr J: 3+2+4 = 9 points but 4 of those points came from ABA, hard to rank him higher than people above him as a result.
I know most media will not rely on facts and fair formulas to rank players and will rank Wilt/Bird ahead of Duncan instead, I know in our heart Duncan should be even higher as he has by far the worst teammates and smallest market of anyone on this list, but sad as it may be, game 6 opened the door for LeBron to bounce him off the top 5 list, outside of a divine intervention of major injuries in Miami.