Ryan: Gov't shutdown not a good way to tackle Obamacare

[FuzzyLumpkins]

(CBS News) There are "more effective ways" of getting around to replacing "Obamacare" than threatening to shut down the government unless the administration defunds the president's signature healthcare law, House Budget Chairman Paul Ryan, R-Wis., said Sunday on "Face the Nation."

"Look - we all, Republicans, want to repeal and replace Obamacare," he said. "With the government shutdown, so to speak, we're talking about discretionary spending, government agency budgets, but it doesn't affect entitlements. Obamacare's an entitlement, you know, like Medicare and Social Security is. And so, the entitlement continues on, even under a government shutdown scenario. So it's just not that simple and easy.

"You know, rather than sort of swinging for the fences and trying to take this entire law out with discretionary spending, I think there are more effective ways of achieving that goal," Ryan said. "We think that we can do better by delaying this law. We've already had votes to delay other parts of it. Democrats have supported us in that."

An initiative spearheaded by Sen. Mike Lee, R-Utah, to block any government funding bill that includes money toward the implementation of Obamacare would presumably give conservatives leverage in an upcoming budget fight this fall. Congress must pass a funding bill by Sept. 30 or risk letting parts of the government shut down.

Though several conservatives have joined onto Lee's campaign, many other Republicans have dismissed it as a gimmick.

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-3460_162-57596911/ryan-more-effective-ways-to-repeal-obamacare-than-government-shutdown/

The Paul Cabal is already trying to hijack the midterm primaries. McConnell is under fire in his KY district.

[boutons_deux]

Ryan should talk to Cruz, Lee, etc, who have announced they intend to shut govt down if ACA not defunded.

Repugs are fucking nuts.

ACA is the law and all the Repugs can do, esp in Repug states, is fuck it up for their states.

[boutons_deux]

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=220853&p=6793527#post6793527

[boutons_deux]

Far Right-Wing Ted Cruz Does Not Care About Republican “Grown Ups”

Professional conservatives suddenly realize that a superstar senator doesn't want to help their movement.

A small contingent of the more Tea Party-ish Republican senators has decided to shut down the government unless “Obamacare” is “defunded.”

(Or, at least, they plan to threaten to shut down the government.) Defunding Obamacare is not really as simple as it sounds. The ACA involves a lot of “mandatory” as opposed to “discretionary” spending, so you can’t really effectively repeal the program through the Continuing Resolution. ( Here’s Karl Rove explaining the issue. (http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/07/26/republicans-must-resist-game-chicken-with-president-over-obamacare/#ixzz2aSIx0rPw)) The plan was Sen. Mike Lee’s (R-Utah) idea, but its current most vocal proponent is Ted Cruz, R-Texas, a very smart man who purposefully talks like a very crazy man (http://www.salon.com/2013/04/30/gop_creates_ted_cruz_now_thinks_hes_a_jerk/), because he understands how to become a celebrity in the modern conservative movement.

Cruz doesn’t care if the plan makes sense, either as policy or even as political tactics. If he cared about passing conservative legislation, he wouldn’t spend all of his time purposefully angering his Republican colleagues. If he cared about the Republican Party’s national image and reputation, as opposed to his own image within the conservative activist community, he would have offered rhetorical support for immigration reform, as Rand Paul did. Cruz is in it for himself and himself alone. A majority of Americans want the GOP to be more conciliatory and moderate. (http://www.gallup.com/poll/161573/americans-top-critique-gop-unwilling-compromise.aspx) A majority of Republicans strongly believe that the party must be even more conservative. (http://tv.msnbc.com/2013/07/31/republicans-have-a-plan-to-fix-their-party-move-further-right/)

So if all the “grown-ups” — the respectable, professional Republicans — tell Ted Cruz not to do something, he is going to be even more dedicated to doing that thing. This week, all the respectable, professional Republicans told Ted Cruz not to try to shut down the government over Obamacare.

http://www.alternet.org/tea-party-and-right/far-right-wing-ted-cruz-does-not-care-about-republican-grown-ups

:lol Boner, Repugs are so dominated and fucked by tea baggers and nutty assholes like Cruz, Lee, etc.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

your ability to determine subjects is awful. i am going to go out on a limb and say that you are not a librarian. that is obvious from your dependency on being spoonfed your viewpoint if not the former.

read the OP, dimwit, it's obvious that he was talking about the other branch of his party. your first post is not though out well at all. if you are going to clutter my threads then at least don't be a moron.

and just to beat you to the punch: GFY.

[boutons_deux]

the "other wing" of Ryan's party, the one he's talking about, the wing "swinging for the fences", is assholes Cruz, Lee, teabaggers, etc who are saying they will shutdown the govt unless ACA is defunded, or repealed. the "professional" Repug don't want to shutdown the govt. THAT's what Ryan is talking about. GFY

[boutons_deux]

Sen. Ted Cruz (R-TX) suggested (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/07/30/ted-cruz-why-is-president-obama-threatening-to-shut-down-the-federal-government/) that Obama and Democrats, not Republicans, would be to blame if the government was shut down.
“Under no circumstances will I support a continuing resolution that funds even one penny of Obamacare,” Cruz explained. “The next step will be that President Obama and [Senate Majority Leader] Harry Reid will scream and yell, ‘Why are those mean and nasty Republicans threatening to shut down the government over Obamacare?’”

“We’ve got to stand up and make the argument and win the argument that, ‘No, that’s not true. We have voted to fund the federal government. We want to fund the federal government. Why is President Obama threatening to shut down the federal government? Because he wants force Obamacare down people’s throats.’”


“This is a very destructive law that’s going to hurt our country, it’s going to hurt a lot of people,” DeMint insisted. “This may be the last opportunity to stop it. Now, there’s no Republican that I’m aware of that wants to shut the government down. The whole point is we need to fund the government, but we should not fund Obamacare.”

“I wouldn’t shut down the government, but if Obama would not accept a funding bill for the government, that fully funds the government, because it didn’t have his failed law in it then he would be shutting down the government,” DeMint opined. “And that’s the case we’re going to take to the American people in August.”

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/08/04/chris-wallace-calls-out-gop-on-govt-shutdown-are-you-prepared-to-shoot-the-hostage/

:lol

FL's thread, bitch-slapped (he thinks) :lol

[boutons_deux]

http://www.truthdig.com/images/made/images/cartoonuploads/stopobama_500_313.jpg

[boutons_deux]

http://www.truthdig.com/images/made/images/cartoonuploads/obammess_500_379.jpg

[scott]

I think there are more effective ways of achieving that goal

Like the legislative process?

[CosmicCowboy]

This whole thing is stupid. And Ted Cruz? LOL it's not like his vote in the senate is going to even count. He is just posturing.

[George Gervin's Afro]

The GOP Congress meeds to stop catering to the tea party likes. They need to show they are a better option which would in turn help themselves in 2016. The better option is not a far right agenda. They want to replace a 'far left' agenda with a farther right agenda. Until they realize the nation is not the tea party they are not going to gain ground. And before the resident idiots respond stupidly, I am not against cutting spending or reforming entitlement programs. Rather I believe that you can ahceive these goals in a gradual way and not in a drastic tea party way like......shutting the govt down.

[boutons_deux]

G.O.P. Governors Warn Party Members in Congress Not to Shut Government

Worried about the potential impact on the fragile economies in their states, Republican governors this weekend warned their counterparts in Congress not to shut down the federal government as part of an effort to block financing for President Obama’s health care law.

A range of Republican governors, including some who have refused to implement elements of the health initiative in their states, said in interviews that a standoff in Washington before the new fiscal year this fall could backfire on the party if it is seen as being responsible for bringing the government to a halt.

“I have made the case that Obamacare is not good for the economy, but I have some real concerns about potentially doing something that would have a negative impact on the economy just for the short term — I think there are other ways to pursue this,” said Gov. Scott Walker of Wisconsin, who hosted about half of the country’s governors here for the summer meeting of the National Governors Association.

Gov. Jack Dalrymple of North Dakota said a government shutdown would invariably be blamed on the legislative branch.

“I’ve never felt that shutting down government function is a wise thing to do politically because I think, whoever is involved in it, it’s the Congress, regardless of what party they’re affiliated with, that will be blamed by the public,” Mr. Dalrymple said. “And so, to me, I don’t see what it accomplishes.”

Asked if Republicans would pay a political price for a shutdown, Mr. Dalrymple said, “Yeah, well, you do.”

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2013/08/05/us/politics/gop-governors-warn-party-members-in-congress-not-to-shut-government.html

[boutons_deux]

GOP Congress meeds to stop catering to the tea party

catering? :lol

It's the tea bagger bullies and crazies abusing their negative power, catering to other Repugs by serving them negative, nihilistic shit.

"I am not against cutting spending or reforming entitlement programs. "

proving how truly stupid and conned you are.

[boutons_deux]

http://nationalmemo.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/ted-cruz-emerges.jpg

[boutons_deux]

Voters Confront Congressman For Trying To Repeal Obamacare: ‘We’ve Got To Have It’ (http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/08/08/2436291/constituents-confront-congressman-for-supporting-obamacare-repeal-weve-got-to-have-it/)


http://thinkprogress.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/091022_mchenry_392_regular-300x225.jpg

In Washington, D.C., Rep. Patrick McHenry (R-NC) issues countless (http://www.gop.gov/republicans/patrickmchenry/media/MnrLa4qa6rY) press (http://mchenry.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=301346) releases (http://mchenry.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=302769) boasting (http://mchenry.house.gov/blog/?postid=220597) about his votes (http://mchenry.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=220608) to repeal (http://mchenry.house.gov/blog/?postid=183578) the Affordable Care Act, insisting that his constituents in North Carolina are clamoring for relief (http://mchenry.house.gov/news/documentsingle.aspx?DocumentID=178108) from the law. But during a town hall in Swannanoa on Wednesday, voters confronted the five-term Congressman with an entirely different sentiment: they demanded to know why Republicans would take away the law’s protections for people with pre-existing conditions without offering any credible other alternative for reforming the health care system. One grieving mother, who spoke to reporters before the event (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hze2k6Q5yz0), said that her son was denied insurance because of a pre-existing health condition and eventually died of colon cancer.

These comments forced McHenry — who had repeatedly advocated for “full repeal (https://twitter.com/PatrickMcHenry/status/331795708409688065)” of Obamcare — to admit that he does support some of its most popular provisions:


[Skip] Edwards and his wife, both 63, had health insurance until he lost his job during the recession and the East Asheville couple found themselves in financial trouble despite staying relatively healthy.

Both had pre-existing conditions and were denied insurance, making them eligible for a state plan called Inclusive Health.

“It cost us $1,300 bucks a month — extremely expensive,” Edwards said. “It taps us out every month. But at our age and health, we’ve got to have it.”

McHenry, 37, has repeatedly voted against the Affordable Care Act, choosing to either defund, repeal or delay it. In defending his position, he said he did agree with some aspects of the act, including ending discrimination against pre-existing conditions and extending the age a children can stay on their parents’ health insurance. [...]

Edwards and others wondered why McHenry would vote against a plan they feel is better than nothing at all. He said he would not vote for something he feels is bad policy.

http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/08/08/2436291/constituents-confront-congressman-for-supporting-obamacare-repeal-weve-got-to-have-it/


fucking Repugs :lol even red-state Human-Americans battle their own corporate, ideological shills

[TeyshaBlue]

Imagine that. People have more than one opinion on the ACA. Must come as a total surprise to the moonbats at thinkprogress.:lol

[boutons_deux]

Imagine that. People have more than one opinion on the ACA. Must come as a total surprise to the moonbats at thinkprogress.:lol

yep, red-state victims of their politicians see how they are being screwed by those politicians. when they send their kids to Repug/"Christian" charter schools and see how shitty the results are.

heard a TX Repug lady yesterday saying she was so pissed at RickyBobby cutting aid to poor women that she was going to vote Dem for the first time in her life.

and of course "right to work" states are really "right to work for less" states.

[Th'Pusher]

Imagine that. People have more than one opinion on the ACA. Must come as a total surprise to the moonbats at thinkprogress.:lol

Yes. Republicans like all the 'good parts' but hate the mandate...which is how you pay for the 'good' parts.

[boutons_deux]

Imagine that. People have more than one opinion on the ACA. Must come as a total surprise to the moonbats at thinkprogress.:lol

People don't count. It's Repug federal and state politicians' votes and blocking that count. The absolutel brilliance of Repug politics is to get ignorant bubbas and "Christians" to vote against their best interests OVER AND OVER AND OVER.

[TeyshaBlue]

Yes. Republicans like all the 'good parts' but hate the mandate...which is how you pay for the 'good' parts.

Republicans are not alone here. ACA continues to poll, with the reputable poll sources like Pew and Kaiser, about 50/50, as it has for the last couple of years.

[Th'Pusher]

Republicans are not alone here. ACA continues to poll, with the reputable poll sources like Pew and Kaiser, about 50/50, as it has for the last couple of years.
I should have been more clear. I was referring to this specific us rep.

[boutons_deux]

Republicans are not alone here. ACA continues to poll, with the reputable poll sources like Pew and Kaiser, about 50/50, as it has for the last couple of years.

which is damn good after you subtract all the ignorant bubbas who will always be against anything Dem and/or black, plus all the slander and lies the Repug and Fox have been spreading non stop.

eg, Fox has relaunched CPAB = Palin's death panels this week, etc, etc, etc.

and its the poor, uninsured rural red staters who will benefit most. By 2016, they'll be tea bagging those posters with "No socialism, hands off my Obamacare!" :lol

[mingus]

I just don't get people like Cruz. Liberals got what they wanted, it's law there's no non-political sense in trying to overturn the whole thing at this stage. Just not going to happen. I'm for shoring up the act by ridding it of some of its beauracracy but at this point there's no non political sense in unilaterally trying to overturn it when the legislative numbers won't allow it. They lost that battle but there are plenty more to bring attention to and win.

[baseline bum]

I just don't get people like Cruz. Liberals got what they wanted, it's law there's no non-political sense in trying to overturn the whole thing at this stage. Just not going to happen. I'm for shoring up the act by ridding it of some of its beauracracy but at this point there's no non political sense in unilaterally trying to overturn it when the legislative numbers won't allow it. They lost that battle but there are plenty more to bring attention to and win.

LOL what? No one wanted the piece of shit blowjob to the insurance companies that Obama copied from Romney.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The only good part of Obamacare is that a similar healthcare plan was passed in Canada that ultimately led to Canada's current plan.

Thus, liberals like what the plan might lead to, not the shitty plan itself :lol

[mingus]

LOL what? No one wanted the piece of shit blowjob to the insurance companies that Obama copied from Romney.

In the context of the issue what i meant by "what" was the existence of universal healthcare in U.S. Far-right are trying overturn the whole thing, the principle of it. That's all I meant. Instead, they should try to shore it up because people in the U.S. want universal healthcare and the Supreme Court legitimized it.

[boutons_deux]

The only good part of Obamacare is that a similar healthcare plan was passed in Canada that ultimately led to Canada's current plan.

Thus, liberals like what the plan might lead to, not the shitty plan itself :lol

The shittiness was extorted into ACA by the health care industry, compounding the shittiness the Repugs handed the industry Medicare Part D (unfunded), Medicare Advantage (10%+ more expensive than Medicare), and forbidding price negotiation with BigPharma, so USA pays tons more for drugs sold a lot cheaper in other countries.

For-profit insurance companies absolutely forbid a no-profit public health insurance option.

And Repugs are working all out to make the implementation of ACA as shitty, as failure prone, as they can, even threatening pro ball leagues NOT to help roll it out.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The shittiness was extorted into ACA by the health care industry, compounding the shittiness the Repugs handed the industry Medicare Part D (unfunded), Medicare Advantage (10%+ more expensive than Medicare), and forbidding price negotiation with BigPharma, so USA pays tons more for drugs sold a lot cheaper in other countries.

For-profit insurance companies absolutely forbid a no-profit public health insurance option.

And Repugs are working all out to make the implementation of ACA as shitty, as failure prone, as they can, even threatening pro ball leagues NOT to help roll it out.
They're fighting tooth and nail to prevent a single payer system because once everyone in this country sees how much better it is that's the point of no return, they wouldn't be able to convince country to go back to private healthcare ever again :lol

[Th'Pusher]

They're fighting tooth and nail to prevent a single payer system because once everyone in this country sees how much better it is that's the point of no return, they wouldn't be able to convince country to go back to private healthcare ever again :lol
You obviously haven't seen the lines the Canadians and Brit's have to wait in for their universal healthcare. They're fucking unbearable. I'd prefer the federal govt subsidize my healthcare by 3x before I'd wait in those fucking lines :lol

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

You obviously haven't seen the lines the Canadians and Brit's have to wait in for their universal healthcare. They're fucking unbearable. I'd prefer the federal govt subsidize my healthcare by 3x before I'd wait in those fucking lines :lol
And they have :crydeath panels:cry

[baseline bum]

God damnit, an unborn fetus dies every time a government gets to negotiate a drug price.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

God damnit, an unborn fetus dies every time a government gets to negotiate a drug price.
Do I get to take it home, name it and play with it?

[boutons_deux]

The real reason for the GOP's all-out war on Obamacare (http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/08/11/1230529/-The-real-reason-for-the-GOP-s-all-out-war-on-Obamacare)

At its core, the Republicans' scorched-earth opposition to Obamacare has never been so much about "freedom" or "limited government" or any other right-wing ideological buzzword as it has been about political power, pure and simple. Now as for the past 20 years (http://www.perrspectives.com/blog/archives/002517.htm), Republicans have feared not that health care reform would fail the American people, but that it would succeed. Along with Social Security and Medicare, successful health care reform would provide the third and final pillar of Americans' social safety net, all brought you by the Democratic Party. To put it another way, the GOP was never really concerned about a "government takeover of health care", "rationing", "the doctor-patient relationship" or mythical "death panels," but that an American public grateful for access to health care could provide Democrats with an enduring majority for years to come

But what Utah Senator Orrin Hatch called a "holy war" (http://articles.latimes.com/2009/nov/19/nation/na-health-senate19) to block health care reform didn't start when Barack Obama took the oath of office in January 2009, but instead when Bill Clinton was inaugurated in 1993 (http://www.pbs.org/newshour/forum/may96/background/health_debate_page2.html). It was then that former Quayle chief of staff and Republican strategist William Kristol (http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/bill-kristols-1993-memo-calling-for-gop-to-block-health-care-reform/) warned his GOP allies that a Clinton victory on health care could guarantee Democratic majorities for the foreseeable future. "The Clinton proposal is also a serious political threat to the Republican Party," Kristol wrote in his infamous December 3, 1993 memo (http://delong.typepad.com/egregious_moderation/2009/03/william-kristol-defeating-president-clintons-health-care-proposal.html) titled "Defeating President Clinton's Health Care Proposal," adding:


"Its passage in the short run will do nothing to hurt (and everything to help) Democratic electoral prospects in 1996. But the long-term political effects of a successful Clinton health care bill will be even worse--much worse. It will relegitimize middle-class dependence for 'security' on government spending and regulation. It will revive the reputation of the party that spends and regulates, the Democrats, as the generous protector of middle-class interests. And it will at the same time strike a punishing blow against Republican claims to defend the middle class by restraining government."

And that, for Kristol, meant it had to be stopped at all costs:


"The first step in that process must be the unqualified political defeat of the Clinton health care proposal. Its rejection by Congress and the public would be a monumental setback for the president; and an incontestable piece of evidence that Democratic welfare-state liberalism remains firmly in retreat."

As the American Prospect (http://www.prospect.org/cs/articles?article=the_lessons_of_94) recalled, Kristol's war plan:


Darkly warned that a Democratic victory would save Clinton's political career, revive the politics of the welfare state, and ensure Democratic majorities far into the future. "Any Republican urge to negotiate a 'least bad' compromise with the Democrats, and thereby gain momentary public credit for helping the president 'do something' about health care, should be resisted," wrote Kristol. Republican pollster Bill McInturff advised Congressional Republicans that success in the 1994 midterm elections required "not having health care pass."

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2013/08/11/1230529/-The-real-reason-for-the-GOP-s-all-out-war-on-Obamacare?detail=email