If You Were To Build a Championship Contender, Who Would You Choose (Part II)

[ambchang]

TMac or Kobe.

Both were two time scoring leaders in their primes.

Both couldn't get past the first round in their primes.

Both missed the playoffs in their primes.

One quit and begged to be traded, the other just quit and left.

[spurraider21]

At least Kobe was able to successfully coattail a dominant big. Tmac almost did then 6 happened

[Katherine Robinson]

A valuable aspect of a player when building around him is versatility, which is why bigs are often preferred to build around. In this case, both are relatively similar scorers - but for different spans of time (Kobe having a longer span. A glaring difference is that Tracy was an inferior defender compared to Kobe Bryant, who was actually a very good defender for a time and when he tried.

McGrady could rebound better, Kobe could pass better. The glaring difference is that Kobe Bryant was simply more useful in the court.

Of course, Kobe Bryant raped and ran off Shaq so obviously Tracy Mcgrady is better because he is free of sin and will fellate Shaq at every turn.

[spurraider21]

Kobe's longevity crushes tmacs so it's a no brainer

[Arnold Toht]

The obsession over 5-4 continues.

[DMC]

The obsession over 5-4 continues.

"Kobe accomplished just as much with Pau as he did Shaq." -Laker fan

Ergo 1 more championship is "just as much" as 1 less championship.

[Katherine Robinson]

"Kobe accomplished just as much with Pau as he did Shaq." -Laker fan

Ergo 1 more championship is "just as much" as 1 less championship.

2000 was all Shaq so it is stricken out. 2001,2002,2009,2010 Kobe was the difference maker after Shaq and Pau contributed the bulk of the effort.

[BoricuaCJA]

Seriously, ya'll try to troll way too much. I would choose Kobe b/c he has the work ethic and longevity(especially this!). If I had to choose before 2006, I would choose Tmac though.

[Arnold Toht]

^ It's just sickening.

[RsxPiimp]

Seriously, ya'll try to troll way too much. I would choose Kobe b/c he has the work ethic and longevity(especially this!). If I had to choose before 2006, I would choose Tmac though.

im telling you, the board has gone worse since, its the same failed attempt at a troll, every damn time. i miss those days when trolls were original.

[Rogue]

both guys were world class talents. The prime Kobe and T-Mac were rather close in terms of basketball skills, but Kobe won by a mile in mental attributes. Kobe always has a leader's personality which T-Mac never seemed to have any, even though his ego might make negative impacts on his team sometimes.

[jacobdrj]

T-Mac was known as a defensive stopper in Toronto. He lived in the shadow of prime Vince Carter... When he moved to Orlando he was supposed to be 2nd fiddle to G-Hill (who would have been a GREAT #2 to T-Mac once he had proved his alpha-dog status). Remember, had 2003 had a 5 game series, he would have beaten the Pistons in the 1st round. In fact, had G-Hill's injury not been so catastrophic, and he had only been out for a year, it would have solidified the Magic as the best SG/SF tandem in the NBA for a few years, overtaking Paul Pierce (prime) and Antoine Walker (prime) of Boston. Fortune killed T-Mac's career with injuries to his surrounding talent and eventually wearing himself out. I am not convinced that Kobe would have been any better in that situation. Kobe probably would have thrown a tantrum, just like T-Mac did, and would have worn out much more quickly with much more regular season miles. And without a world class ego-management-1st coach like either P-Jax (or maybe Rick Adleman) I am not sure Kobe would have amounted to anything more than T-Mac or Paul Pierce post 1999.

With that said, I am partial to T-Mac. I think he did slightly more with less during the prime of their careers. But that is a subjective statement, based on the years when Kobe didn't have P-Jax...

[ezau]

^ It's just sickening.


I've had enough of this motherfucker making fun of Jerry's death. Jesus Christ! Kori or timvp, do your job and ban that POS. Remember when you banned multiple posters for messing with the child victims of the OKC tornado? WTF, children and elderly people are just as vulnerable in society. Do your fuckin' job!

Yeah, I noticed:lol

[ezau]

T-Mac was known as a defensive stopper in Toronto. He lived in the shadow of prime Vince Carter... When he moved to Orlando he was supposed to be 2nd fiddle to G-Hill (who would have been a GREAT #2 to T-Mac once he had proved his alpha-dog status). Remember, had 2003 had a 5 game series, he would have beaten the Pistons in the 1st round. In fact, had G-Hill's injury not been so catastrophic, and he had only been out for a year, it would have solidified the Magic as the best SG/SF tandem in the NBA for a few years, overtaking Paul Pierce (prime) and Antoine Walker (prime) of Boston. Fortune killed T-Mac's career with injuries to his surrounding talent and eventually wearing himself out. I am not convinced that Kobe would have been any better in that situation. Kobe probably would have thrown a tantrum, just like T-Mac did, and would have worn out much more quickly with much more regular season miles. And without a world class ego-management-1st coach like either P-Jax (or maybe Rick Adleman) I am not sure Kobe would have amounted to anything more than T-Mac or Paul Pierce post 1999.

Imagine if T-Mac didn't bolt out of Toronto, I'm pretty sure they would've beaten the 76ers in the 2001 ECF. Although they would be lucky to win two games against the Shaq-led Lakers team. If that T-Mac/Carter combo stayed together for a couple of years, those Raptors could have contended for a couple of ECF, and perhaps NBA titles.

[AchillesHeel]

Kirby all day. The faggots choosing T-Mac are a bunch of stupid fucks. Even if you hate Kirby, he has the longetivity and their primes are pretty much the same. While T-Mac is struggling to find playing time in the NBA, Kirby is still an all-star caliber player. I know it's not saying much, but it's a lot better than the issues T-Mac's been having. Despite the rapes and the chucking and quitting, Kirby for the past 17 season has always played at least 80-85% of the games. I'll take the player that will be consistently healthy throughout his career.

[DMC]

im telling you, the board has gone worse since, its the same failed attempt at a troll, every damn time. i miss those days when trolls were original.

Alt accounts are the catalyst for shitty thread starting. With original names, you have to plan your troll much more carefully and there's a risk for a shitty one. With the alts, you just sling as much stupid, obnoxious shit as you can at the forum and see how much kick back you get on it. Some alts are specific for just a troll, and that's at least interesting enough to let you avoid it if you want.

If you go back several years when almost every name was bolded, sure they went at each other and there was the occasional "suicide by mod" attempt, but these days it's a constant barrage of faggots with no accountability. They even try to troll each other through newer alt names. What usually gives them away is that they lack originality (which is why many of them had to resort to alt names in the first place). They get an alt name but use the same boring, repetitive approach.

Some here try too hard to keep it interesting though. They don't even link their shit together to form a point of some sort, it's just one faggot copying another faggot who's copying something they saw on another forum or stealing it from an original troll.

So yeah, there's a lot of dead water on these shorelines. There's still a good spot here and there but mostly it's dead water.

[RsxPiimp]

Alt accounts are the catalyst for shitty thread starting. With original names, you have to plan your troll much more carefully and there's a risk for a shitty one. With the alts, you just sling as much stupid, obnoxious shit as you can at the forum and see how much kick back you get on it. Some alts are specific for just a troll, and that's at least interesting enough to let you avoid it if you want.

If you go back several years when almost every name was bolded, sure they went at each other and there was the occasional "suicide by mod" attempt, but these days it's a constant barrage of faggots with no accountability. They even try to troll each other through newer alt names. What usually gives them away is that they lack originality (which is why many of them had to resort to alt names in the first place). They get an alt name but use the same boring, repetitive approach.

Some here try too hard to keep it interesting though. They don't even link their shit together to form a point of some sort, it's just one faggot copying another faggot who's copying something they saw on another forum or stealing it from an original troll.

So yeah, there's a lot of dead water on these shorelines. There's still a good spot here and there but mostly it's dead water.

you know DMC, this is why I've always respected your opinion on this board and i'm glad this came from a respected voice. you always bring effort in every post you make, not like it matters to you but you've always been one of the better posters in this thread ever since and Ive been here for almost 6 yrs.


a lot of the quality posters had either left or is not active anymore, just sad to see the state of the this forum going down the drain.

[AchillesHeel]

you know DMC, this is why I've always respected your opinion on this board and i'm glad this came from a respected voice. you always bring effort in every post you make, not like it matters to you but you've always been one of the better posters in this thread ever since and Ive been here for almost 6 yrs.


a lot of the quality posters had either left or is not active anymore, just sad to see the state of the this forum going down the drain.

lol DMC is a fucking pussy, predicted a backdoor sweep in the Finals and disappeared like a bitch would after Spurs lost in 7. I have 0 respect for fags that disappear when their team loses.

[Arnold Toht]

^ he couldn't take it.

[Clipper Nation]

^ Much like you couldn't take the reality about Jerry and Magic :lol

[RsxPiimp]

AchillesHeel, dmc's contribution overshadows that little stunt he did. i admit that he can be rude and condescending and people seem to either take him seriously or they simply don't have the aptitude to realize whats a a typical online banter, but honestly his solid take, humor makes him unique and interesting. i don't agree with him all the time and as a matter of fact we'll go at it anytime soon on a laker related topic but yeah, he's one of the OG in the forum and anyone whose been a member here before 2010 knows he brings real value in this forum.

[BoricuaCJA]

im telling you, the board has gone worse since, its the same failed attempt at a troll, every damn time. i miss those days when trolls were original.
You Laker fans are the worse at troll attempts and the board has gotten worse b/c of Laker fans TRYING to troll. lol Kool Aids being the guy who tries to hard to personify a great luxurious life but in reality, he has no life since he is always on here(even in the off season but not after a Laker loss) and posts old articles and talks about gay shit all the time. The boy has no life!

People give Kobe to much shit, he's a top 10 player of all time imo, a great player b/c of his longevity and work ethic. One of the most talented players ever(in the top 10)! I just don't like him much for his chucking, copying Jordan in everything, throwing teammates under the bus, quitting and overrated clutchness(teammates saved his ass a lot of times). He is clutch but not to the point that people make. Why you think he has some really bad NBA finals. lol He is lucky he threw a temper trantrum to be traded to LA b/c he would of won maybe 1 or 2 championships had he not been with LA and their big market.

[DMC]

lol DMC is a fucking pussy, predicted a backdoor sweep in the Finals and disappeared like a bitch would after Spurs lost in 7. I have 0 respect for fags that disappear when their team loses.

lol Calispursfan

[Rogue]

DMC is a mixture of angel and devil to me. Dude's full of truth and that's the exact type of person my goddess and I aspire to being, while he may also be the most annoying poster out there when he's in trolling mode. It's hard to tell which side of him prevails, but he's definitely not a bad thing for this forum when most good ones (like Findog, mid, my niggas m>s and shadow) are either inactive or completely gone.

[AchillesHeel]

lol Calispursfan

You're fucking stupid. I've said millions of times that this is not a troll account, you can ask Kori, this is my only account and it's a legit one. Now move along, kid.

[DMC]

lol so you became a Spurs fan right after Kobe tore his Achilles, but you happen to know the forum history. Got it.

[Arnold Toht]

Spurfan turning on each other due to game 7.

[AchillesHeel]

lol so you became a Spurs fan right after Kobe tore his Achilles, but you happen to know the forum history. Got it.

No, I came up with this usn after Kirby tore his achilles in April, you quit after the Finals in June. Anyways, Kori can confirm this is my only account. I admit I lurked ST since about the start of last season, I think I tried to register on here long time before but it took such a long ass time before accounts were accepted so I spent my time elsewhere until I came here during the Finals and noticed I could post. There was a period where anyone could make a new account and could quickly start posting During the Spurs playoff run, thanks to that I ended up posting here.

Anyways, DMC, I don't have any real hate against you, but I still can't fathom how a Spurfan could be such a pussy and not root for his team in the Finals, especially when they're up 3 - 2. You talked a lot of shit about your own team after 2 - 2 and predicted a backdoor sweep, typical pussy move so if you were wrong, people wouldn't hate on you as the Spurs win anyway. Typical Midnightpulp move there.

I love the game of basketball and I love a honest discussion, I just can't respect people that talk shit about their team when they're doing well. Now you can talk shit again because the Spurs gave away the title with 28 seconds left. Bravo. I hope you're happy.

[xellos88330]

Kobe without a second thought.

[Rogue]

DMC was being honest about the Prediction imho. The backdoor sweep didn't happen but he was right about the eventual result anyway. And I don't think DMC has ever talked "shit" about the franchise, seemed to me he just made a prediction from an objective perspective, which turned out half right. He's not remotely the same as that legendary mavs fan who once talked tons of trash against his own team, for he loved that team too much and was hurt too bad by the team's slack performances through those years before 2011. Nothing malicious, dude was just demonstrating his rage and dissatisfaction, which could only exist in those who loved the team to death...

DMC's totally different, he never talked that way in disapproval of his team, but I'm guessing if the spurs had won the 13' title in June, he wouldn't have been too jubilant either. Basketball is only a material for him to discuss during his coffee time, an escape from the gene biological stuffs he has to deal with all year around as a private contractor. He takes every disccusion as a platform to flaunt his intelligence and basketball discussion is just one of the platforms for him, and he doesn't need to be a fan of this game to do so. He's registered a spurs fan but it doesn't mean he really is, and he's probably not a basketball fan at all. Wealth is the only faith to those people, imho, they don't love nothing but the green pieces of paper they rake home every month and every year.

[spurraider21]

:lol at everybody saying :cryAsk Kori:cry knowing nobody will bother

[AchillesHeel]

:lol at everybody saying :cryAsk Kori:cry knowing nobody will bother

Ok, so who's alt am I? I must be a pretty dedicated "troll" as I post almost every day and have over 2k posts since the Finals.

[DMC]

No, I came up with this usn after Kirby tore his achilles in April, you quit after the Finals in June. Anyways, Kori can confirm this is my only account. I admit I lurked ST since about the start of last season, I think I tried to register on here long time before but it took such a long ass time before accounts were accepted so I spent my time elsewhere until I came here during the Finals and noticed I could post. There was a period where anyone could make a new account and could quickly start posting During the Spurs playoff run, thanks to that I ended up posting here.

Anyways, DMC, I don't have any real hate against you, but I still can't fathom how a Spurfan could be such a pussy and not root for his team in the Finals, especially when they're up 3 - 2. You talked a lot of shit about your own team after 2 - 2 and predicted a backdoor sweep, typical pussy move so if you were wrong, people wouldn't hate on you as the Spurs win anyway. Typical Midnightpulp move there.

I love the game of basketball and I love a honest discussion, I just can't respect people that talk shit about their team when they're doing well. Now you can talk shit again because the Spurs gave away the title with 28 seconds left. Bravo. I hope you're happy.

There's a difference between wanting a team to win and being queerly naive about it just to show team spirit. I call it like I see it. I want my stocks to do well, I don't pretend they will just to feel better about it. I've never been much of a cheerleader.

[DMC]

DMC was being honest about the Prediction imho. The backdoor sweep didn't happen but he was right about the eventual result anyway. And I don't think DMC has ever talked "shit" about the franchise, seemed to me he just made a prediction from an objective perspective, which turned out half right. He's not remotely the same as that legendary mavs fan who once talked tons of trash against his own team, for he loved that team too much and was hurt too bad by the team's slack performances through those years before 2011. Nothing malicious, dude was just demonstrating his rage and dissatisfaction, which could only exist in those who loved the team to death...

DMC's totally different, he never talked that way in disapproval of his team, but I'm guessing if the spurs had won the 13' title in June, he wouldn't have been too jubilant either. Basketball is only a material for him to discuss during his coffee time, an escape from the gene biological stuffs he has to deal with all year around as a private contractor. He takes every disccusion as a platform to flaunt his intelligence and basketball discussion is just one of the platforms for him, and he doesn't need to be a fan of this game to do so. He's registered a spurs fan but it doesn't mean he really is, and he's probably not a basketball fan at all. Wealth is the only faith to those people, imho, they don't love nothing but the green pieces of paper they rake home every month and every year.:lmao

[AchillesHeel]

There's a difference between wanting a team to win and being queerly naive about it just to show team spirit. I call it like I see it. I want my stocks to do well, I don't pretend they will just to feel better about it. I've never been much of a cheerleader.

Just admit it, your ass got lucky, Manu bailed you out.

[Phillip]

T-Mac had more natural talent and ability. If he had Kobe's work ethic, he may be the best basketball player of all time. His game looked so smooth and effortless. I may not have ever seen a player who looked as natural as T-Mac did when playing. When he actually tried, he looked like a man amongst boys, and was able to dominate games without needing to score the entire time, the way Kobe does. His vision and passing was fantastic, he utilized the baseline to his advantage more than any player I've ever seen, he could move off the ball and score effectively with cuts and spot up jumpers... lol he was such a waste of talent. Frustrating to see him waste all that ability away, when he had a chance to be so much better with even just a little more work and dedication.

[DMC]

Just admit it, your ass got lucky, Manu bailed you out.

I didn't gain anything from it. How did I get lucky? Does a meteorologist get lucky when he predicts the weather accurately? There's no luck in it, it's all about knowing the game of basketball. If you'd spit that homer dick out and pay attention to the game, you might catch on.

[AchillesHeel]

I didn't gain anything from it. How did I get lucky? Does a meteorologist get lucky when he predicts the weather accurately? There's no luck in it, it's all about knowing the game of basketball. If you'd spit that homer dick out and pay attention to the game, you might catch on.

Typical. Predict your team to lose so either way you wouldn't get hated for, if you were wrong, hell, the Spurs won it anyways. Who cares, right? And if the Spurs lost, you'd still be right. Such a badass.

[DMC]

Typical. Predict your team to lose so either way you wouldn't get hated for, if you were wrong, hell, the Spurs won it anyways. Who cares, right? And if the Spurs lost, you'd still be right. Such a badass.

SA was the underdog. Predicting a loss isn't a stretch. Only homers pretend to think otherwise. I'm not a homer.

[weebo]

What DMC did last June is nothing new. Its been done before a hundred times on this forum by a hundred different users. I've been here a while (check join date) and have seen a lot of great posters come and go. Nothing about what DMC does strikes me as thoughtful or original. He's a poor man's version of Tpark/EricB at best.

[Killakobe81]

TMAc was amazing offensively in Orlando and Houston a good defender in Toronto ...
But yet still he is not in kobe's class. Much like his cousin probably more talented than Kobe as a pure athlete ...but a case can be made that though his peak was never as goopd as Tmac's ...Pierce put up a better career than Mcgrady, much less even comparing him to KObe. AI is a better comparison yet he still did more than McGrady. Too bad his back went out so we could of seen him have a longer "prime" but either way I just felt he was missing something the truly greats have.

[ambchang]

I agree he was missing something, a dominant frontcourt.