Saints' surging defense is the truth

[BRHornet45]

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2013/0922/ny_g_jordan01jr_576x324.jpg

NEW ORLEANS -- At some point, we've got to stop asking whether or not what we're seeing from the New Orleans Saints' defense is for real.

The defense has been the driving force behind all three victories by the unbeaten Saints, including a dominant 31-7 win against the Arizona Cardinals on Sunday. New Orleans has already blown open a two-game lead in the NFC South.

How much more real does it have to get?

"It's nothing to get super excited about, other than the fact that we show a lot of promise, and that's what we've got to keep doing," cautioned defensive end Cameron Jordan, who has been the breakout individual player of the bunch with a team-high three sacks so far, including two on Sunday.

"You always want to have that hungry attitude of just straight grinding and building on each game," Jordan added. "I don't ever want to be like, 'This is the defense that we are.' I just want to keep going and keep getting better."

After a disastrous defensive performance last season, in which they set the NFL record for yards allowed in a season (7,042), the idea was that the Saints could get back to being playoff contenders if they could just find some way to get their defense back to being a "middle-of-the-pack" unit.

read more at -

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-orleans-saints/post/_/id/351/saints-surging-defense-is-the-truth

http://distilleryimage3.s3.amazonaws.com/d6234a1019b211e3894722000ae90157_7.jpg

[LkrFan]

Don't get your hopes up BR. Buddy Ryan Jr. fooled Dallas Cowboy fans last year too. You guys will be exposed by week 6.

[BRHornet45]

Don't get your hopes up BR. Buddy Ryan Jr. fooled Dallas Cowboy fans last year too. You guys will be exposed by week 6.

you forgot one important fact though ......



we have Drew Brees and you don't.

[LkrFan]

you forgot one important fact though ......



we have Drew Brees and you don't.
Doesn't matter. By week 6 you'll rue signing the guy.

[BRHornet45]

yes it does matter you stupid, front running bitch.

you black? lol Laker "fan" and Cowboy "fan" ... how convenient

[Chinook]

Rob Ryan is overrated. Good teams will be able to exploit his defense. It's not an accident that the man can't hold a job for more than a year or two.

Lucky for the Saints, outside of the Packers, almost no team in the NFC really has the quarterback to do so.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Rob Ryan did a good job with the Cowboys given the shitbag players he had after the injuries.

I thought he'd need a year to turn the Saints' defense around but it seems like he didn't even need that long.

[Pelicans78]

Ryan is doing it with some injuries as well. Kenyon Coleman, Victor Butler, Vilma, Will Smith, Bunkley, and Patrick Robinson are all out for awhile. Coleman, Butler, Smith and Robinson are out for the season. I don't think Smith is a big loss since he would have been a liability at times covering guys out of the OLB spot. Plus alot of the younger guys with more upside are stepping up like Cameron Jordan, John Jenkins, Tyrunn Walker, Glenn Foster, and Akiem Hicks from the d-line and Kenny Vaccaro from the secondary.

The key so far is the pass rush from the young d-line and OLBs. They're able to get pressure without blitzing too much. Plus Ryan is making alot more in game adjustments compared to Spags and is utilizing the guys to their strengths compared to what Spags did last season. He's been a big upgrade. Also it helps to have Payton back because he makes everyone more accountable whether its on offense or defense as well as the coaching staff.

[Pelicans78]

Rob Ryan is overrated. Good teams will be able to exploit his defense. It's not an accident that the man can't hold a job for more than a year or two.

Lucky for the Saints, outside of the Packers, almost no team in the NFC really has the quarterback to do so.

He hasn't coached with an elite HC and QB like Payton and Brees. That's a big difference. He was under bad organizations in Oakland and Cleveland plus he had a lot of injuries in Dallas and Garrett and Romo aren't anything special. He's not doing anything exotic with the Saints right now. Basically the front 7 are getting pressure and he mixes in the occasional blitz. He has some good young talent to work with on the d-line plus the secondary is playing solid. I don't think he's been tested much outside of the Falcons game, but he's definitely made a huge difference. Also, to say he's overrated is pretty dumb since no one thinks he's anything special in the first place.

[Darth_Pelican]

The Saints next 3 opponents (vs Miami, at Chicago, at NE) are a combined 9-0. While they should get past Miami at home on Monday night, I'm hoping for a split at Chicago and at NE for a 5-1 start.

[Bill_Brasky]

so many game winning drives given up....

[Chinook]

He hasn't coached with an elite HC and QB like Payton and Brees. That's a big difference. He was under bad organizations in Oakland and Cleveland plus he had a lot of injuries in Dallas and Garrett and Romo aren't anything special. He's not doing anything exotic with the Saints right now. Basically the front 7 are getting pressure and he mixes in the occasional blitz. He has some good young talent to work with on the d-line plus the secondary is playing solid. I don't think he's been tested much outside of the Falcons game, but he's definitely made a huge difference. Also, to say he's overrated is pretty dumb since no one thinks he's anything special in the first place.

Of course people think he's special. That's why he keeps getting jobs. And he always gets hyped up during broadcasts. More importantly, I've seen his (and Rex's) defenses totally break down in clutch moments. Even in the Tampa game, Freeman managed to drive down the field on them before that missed field goal. That's just the reality. Sure, he could be better with the Saints. But I won't believe that New Orleans has a playoff-caliber defense until they prove it.

[Pelicans78]

Of course people think he's special. That's why he keeps getting jobs. And he always gets hyped up during broadcasts. More importantly, I've seen his (and Rex's) defenses totally break down in clutch moments. Even in the Tampa game, Freeman managed to drive down the field on them before that missed field goal. That's just the reality. Sure, he could be better with the Saints. But I won't believe that New Orleans has a playoff-caliber defense until they prove it.

You're grasping at straws now. The defense kept the Saints in the Tampa game by only allowing 7 total points. The only reasons the Bucs were ahead was due to a Brees pick-six. The offense was terrible that game yet the defense kept them in the game. Even on the last drive they held the Bucs to a long FG attempt giving the offense the chance to win in the end. The defense has bailed them out in all 3 games so far. Besides, the Saints don't need a playoff caliber defense to make a run. They just need an average one. They've won 11-13 games with below average defenses.

[Chinook]

You're grasping at straws now. The defense kept the Saints in the Tampa game by only allowing 7 total points. The only reasons the Bucs were ahead was due to a Brees pick-six. The offense was terrible that game yet the defense kept them in the game. Even on the last drive they held the Bucs to a long FG attempt giving the offense the chance to win in the end. The defense has bailed them out in all 3 games so far. Besides, the Saints don't need a playoff caliber defense to make a run. They just need an average one. They've won 11-13 games with below average defenses.

I'm not grasping at straws. I said in clutch moments, his defense breaks down. That's exactly what happened in the Tampa game. That's what happened when he was with Dallas, Cleveland and Oakland. It's what happened with Rex in Baltimore, and it still happens to him in New York. It's just the way it is. The defense looks good but can be picked apart by good quarterbacks (and last-drive Freeman). In the playoffs, that type of defense ends up killing you. If I understand correctly, the champion Saints had a defense that could come up with clutch turnovers to help their offense out. It was pretty much the opposite of the Ryan defense.

As I said, time will bear it out. We'll see how many clutch defensive stands the Saints will make compared to how many end-of-game drives they give up. Right now, it's 1/1, and that stand came against Melted Ice Ryan.

[Pelicans78]

I'm not grasping at straws. I said in clutch moments, his defense breaks down. That's exactly what happened in the Tampa game. That's what happened when he was with Dallas, Cleveland and Oakland. It's what happened with Rex in Baltimore, and it still happens to him in New York. It's just the way it is. The defense looks good but can be picked apart by good quarterbacks (and last-drive Freeman). In the playoffs, that type of defense ends up killing you. If I understand correctly, the champion Saints had a defense that could come up with clutch turnovers to help their offense out. It was pretty much the opposite of the Ryan defense.

As I said, time will bear it out. We'll see how many clutch defensive stands the Saints will make compared to how many end-of-game drives they give up. Right now, it's 1/1, and that stand came against Melted Ice Ryan.

Well the same coordinator who's turnover machine defense helped the Saints win the Super Bowl also coordinated a defense that choked in back-to-back playoff games at Seattle and San Francisco. Its all about talent. The reason the 2009 defense created so many more turnovers was due to having playmakers in the secondary like Tracy Porter, Darren Sharper and Jabari Greer. Scheme had little to do with it. The reason why this defense is playing so much better is due to the front four generating pass rush. Plus, the defense has already generated 6 turnovers in the first 3 games. And one bad defensive series isn't going to take away what was a strong overall performance at Tampa. The defense kept the offense in the game to help them win late.

[Chinook]

Well the same coordinator who's turnover machine defense helped the Saints win the Super Bowl also coordinated a defense that choked in back-to-back playoff games at Seattle and San Francisco. Its all about talent. The reason the 2009 defense created so many more turnovers was due to having playmakers in the secondary like Tracy Porter, Darren Sharper and Jabari Greer. Scheme had little to do with it. The reason why this defense is playing so much better is due to the front four generating pass rush. Plus, the defense has already generated 6 turnovers in the first 3 games. And one bad defensive series isn't going to take away what was a strong overall performance at Tampa. The defense kept the offense in the game to help them win late.

Of course it can. It didn't in this case because Lindell missed, but that's incidental. It's like saying that a quarterback who puts up 400 yards and three touchdowns doesn't deserve criticism if he throws a pick-six to end the game. Being anti-clutch is an issue which can get overlooked in the regular season but often comes back to bite you in the playoffs.

Now, I'm not saying that having Brees isn't going to prevent Ryan from being in as many clutch situations and thusly raise the overall effectiveness of his defense. But when the chips are down, it's very likely that the Saints are going to have to win close games against good offenses in the post-season.

[Pelicans78]

Of course it can. It didn't in this case because Lindell missed, but that's incidental. It's like saying that a quarterback who puts up 400 yards and three touchdowns doesn't deserve criticism if he throws a pick-six to end the game. Being anti-clutch is an issue which can get overlooked in the regular season but often comes back to bite you in the playoffs.

Now, I'm not saying that having Brees isn't going to prevent Ryan from being in as many clutch situations and thusly raise the overall effectiveness of his defense. But when the chips are down, it's very likely that the Saints are going to have to win close games against good offenses in the post-season.

Still, the Saints personnel on defense isn't that great. They have some young guys with upside, but talent isn't on par with a San Francisco or Seattle, especially in the secondary which is where late defensive stands are key. He's obviously been a big upgrade over Spags who wasn't flexible at all and didn't adjust his scheme to the talent he had. You're still grasping at straws in your argument about the Tampa game.

[pawe]

All the other team's defense will look elite against the Cards and their Oline anyway.

[Chinook]

Still, the Saints personnel on defense isn't that great. They have some young guys with upside, but talent isn't on par with a San Francisco or Seattle, especially in the secondary which is where late defensive stands are key. He's obviously been a big upgrade over Spags who wasn't flexible at all and didn't adjust his scheme to the talent he had. You're still grasping at straws in your argument about the Tampa game.

It was weird to me that Spagnola failed as spectacularly as he did. He really seemed to have something going in New York. He's an advisor to Harbaugh in Baltimore right now, but I don't really know if he does anything.

Anyway, I don't get how the Tampa game is grasping at straws. Freeman looked bad the whole game (perhaps more than the Saints defense looked good), but when he needed a final drive to put the game way, he moved down the field with relative ease. Of course, Freeman is actually a very good quarterback in the clutch, but the point remains that Ryan has a history of letting teams beat his defense at the last minute. Freeman did it to him in 2010 as well.

EDIT: Actually, 2010 was a bad year for Ryan in general, as his defense gave up four end-of-game drives.

[spurraider21]

Chinook, you really need to let go of Freeman, tbh. He looked awful for much of the game, the season, and his career

[Chinook]

Chinook, you really need to let go of Freeman, tbh. He looked awful for much of the game, the season, and his career

I didn't credit Freeman. In fact, I said he sucked in that game, and the fact that he moved down the field easily on the Saints at the end of that game is indicative of the Saints defense looking bad in the clutch.


Freeman looked bad the whole game (perhaps more than the Saints defense looked good), but when he needed a final drive to put the game way, he moved down the field with relative ease.

Sure, you can say I support(ed) Freeman more than most, but this isn't really the thread to do it.

[spurraider21]

When he's the one example you bring in, then talk about how he's a very good quarterback in the clutch, it just seems like you are trying to find a way to make him sound good where you can :lol

[Chinook]

When he's the one example you bring in, then talk about how he's a very good quarterback in the clutch, it just seems like you are trying to find a way to make him sound good where you can :lol

He's not the only example I can bring up. He's the relevant one, since that game actually happened this season. Matt Cassell, David Garrard and Mark Sanchez were the other 2010 quarterbacks who led end-of-game drives against the Browns. Being in that company isn't really a compliment.

[Pelicans78]

I wasn't a huge fan of the Ryan hire since I was afraid he was going to be alot like Gregg Williams, but I can't complain about the results at this time. I'm hoping he doesn't do something stupid in the future like blitz and play man-to-man with 40 seconds left when the other team needs 70 yards for a TD, especially in a playoff game.

[spurraider21]

I can agree that Ryan is a flop. Believe me

[LkrFan]

yes it does matter you stupid, front running bitch.

you black? lol Laker "fan" and Cowboy "fan" ... how convenient
Was that necessary son? Because I disagree with you? :lolK

[LkrFan]

Rob Ryan is overrated. Good teams will be able to exploit his defense. It's not an accident that the man can't hold a job for more than a year or two.

Lucky for the Saints, outside of the Packers, almost no team in the NFC really has the quarterback to do so.
QFT. :tu

[Chinook]

:lol

[Clipper Nation]

:lol Rob Ryan

[BRHornet45]

yea because the defense was the problem. lol did you even watch the game?

NO defense is going to hold a team three times in a row in the final minutes. Sean Payton lost this game.

[Chinook]

:lol Repeating what Cowboys fans, Browns fans and Raiders fans said for years.

[Clipper Nation]

yea because the defense was the problem. lol did you even watch the game?

NO defense is going to hold a team three times in a row in the final minutes. Sean Payton lost this game.
Bottom line is that you lost two games because his defense choked at the last minute and another game because Seattle pushed his shit in, tbh....

[BRHornet45]

no the bottom line is that all of a sudden this season we don't know how to play the game of football on the road.

Saints went from being the top 2 best teams in the NFL on the road, to being a complete joke. I guess at this point the only hope is knowing that the Ravens lost 4 out of their final 5 games last year

[weebo]

Saint's D gave up 17 points, 10 first downs, and 222 total yards…more than enough to get you the victory.

[Trainwreck2100]

http://nesncom.files.wordpress.com/2013/10/robryansad.gif?w=440&h=248

[BRHornet45]

Saint's D gave up 17 points, 10 first downs, and 222 total yards…more than enough to get you the victory.

like I said ... Sean Payton lost this game when he chose to give up and run the ball every single play on three consecutive possessions at the end.

[Bill_Brasky]

Didn't watch the game but saw the final score just now. Did his defense play a really good game but then get vanilla at the end, allowing a GW drive? Saw that a lot with the cowboys.

[Raven]

no it's not.

[Pelicans78]

Didn't watch the game but saw the final score just now. Did his defense play a really good game but then get vanilla at the end, allowing a GW drive? Saw that a lot with the cowboys.

It wasn't a prevent defense, but it was a base defense with four rushers and 7 in coverage. Saints were getting pressure all game without blitzing and Cam was playing terrible before that. He just managed to make three good throws. The Saints did blitz on the touchdown play and the safety had a clear shot on Cam but whiffed.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

Saint's D gave up 17 points, 10 first downs, and 222 total yards…more than enough to get you the victory.

doesn't matter. they collapsed on the last drive. thats what separates an average defense from a great one

[BRHornet45]

doesn't matter. they collapsed on the last drive. thats what separates an average defense from a great one

it's obvious you're new to the NFL.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

it's obvious you're new to the NFL.

how am i wrong? please enlighten me..

[BRHornet45]

how am i wrong? please enlighten me..

son having a defense that has consistently been in the top 5 all year long and an offense that is in the top 5 as well is what matters.

even the sun shines on a dog's ass every now and then and that is exactly what happened to Carolina today. they got lucky plain and simple. your QB injured your best wide receiver because he can't throw the ball worth a shit. hell even the final touchdown pass was a hideous pass and excellent catch by the receiver. Carolina's defense will only carry them so far. at the end of the day gimmick QB's don't win Super Bowls.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

:cry :cry :cry :cry :cry

so you are basically going on and on .... and didn't answer how I was wrong... please go shut the fuck up and sit over with the rest of the wild card first round exits

[BRHornet45]

lol fluke 4 point win that was caused by Sean Payton and you think you won the damn Super Bowl.

my nigga my nigga my nigga

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

lol fluke

nope. your D just can't be asked to be clutch or play a QB that can read a zone.


4 point win that was caused by Sean Payton

nope. caused by your D.


and you think you won the damn Super Bowl.

my nigga my nigga my nigga

nope. just think i have a first round bye (barring the collapse) and beat a team that we're supposed to beat.

[BRHornet45]

son you know absolutely nothing about the game of football. your post history has proven that you are not only the most football ignorant poster in the history of Spurs Talk, but arguably in the history of Western Civilization as well. your gimmick QB can't read a children's book from cover to cover, much less a defense.

[JMarkJohns]

You fucking asshole douchebags losing to the Panthers in the last minute.

Unkindly go fuck yourselves.

Completely screwed over Arizona by letting Cum jizz all over your heavenly asses.

[BRHornet45]

son let's be real for a second okay....

the Cardinals wouldn't do anything in the playoffs anyways so just save yourself the heartache.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

You fucking asshole douchebags losing to the Panthers in the last minute.

Unkindly go fuck yourselves.

Completely screwed over Arizona by letting Cum jizz all over your heavenly asses.

impressive win @ seattle btw. you guys got the best of us back in the day... then again, that was before our team peaked.

gonna be a tough road for you guys to make the playoffs.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

son you know absolutely nothing about the game of football. your post history has proven that you are not only the most football ignorant poster in the history of Spurs Talk, but arguably in the history of Western Civilization as well. your gimmick QB can't read a children's book from cover to cover, much less a defense.

:lol meltdown

let me know how that first round goes for you guys.

[JMarkJohns]

impressive win @ seattle btw. you guys got the best of us back in the day... then again, that was before our team peaked.

gonna be a tough road for you guys to make the playoffs.

Thanks. It was before Cardinals peaked, too.

Utter bullshit that any of Cardinals, Panthers, Saints, 49ers fail to make playoffs but Eagles, Cowboys, Packers, Bears do. Don't give a shit about divisions. Best teams make playoffs, especially in a league where imbanced schedules and uneven divisional strengths dictate so much.

[BRHornet45]

son you clowns have to travel to Atlanta next week. don't get too cocky over this fluke win just yet.

[BRHornet45]

Utter bullshit that any of Cardinals, Panthers, Saints, 49ers fail to make playoffs but Eagles, Cowboys, Packers, Bears do. Don't give a shit about divisions. Best teams make playoffs, especially in a league where imbanced schedules and uneven divisional strengths dictate so much.

now this is 100% truth. hence why they need to get rid of divisions and strictly go by conference.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Thanks. It was before Cardinals peaked, too.

Utter bullshit that any of Cardinals, Panthers, Saints, 49ers fail to make playoffs but Eagles, Cowboys, Packers, Bears do. Don't give a shit about divisions. Best teams make playoffs, especially in a league where imbanced schedules and uneven divisional strengths dictate so much.

Not to mention all those shitty AFC teams (Miami, Pittsburgh, Baltimore, etc.) that still have a shot because of how shitty the AFC is :lol

[JMarkJohns]

Get rid of automatic divisional births
Expand to 7 teams making playoffs
First Round: #1 gets bye, 2V7, 3V6, 4V5

Puts emphasis on securing top overall seed and not gifting bullshit bye to second place, adds two additional playoff teams, secures seven best records in football from each conference.

If you can't secure a top-7 record in winning your division, GTFO...

This likely eliminates most final week resting of starters in last weeks, and in a league where half a dozen of the last 10 champs were wild card teams, it adds another horse to the race.

Best, it forces teams to make smart decisions because they aren't gifted anything anymore.

Sure, weaker divisions and imbalanced schedules factor in, but much less so.

Or, expand to 18 games, 6 vs. division, 12 vs. rest of affiliated Conference.

No bitching, every NFC team plays every other NFC team at least once, with top-7 seeds making playoffs.

[Pelicans78]

Cards deserve to make the playoffs if they beat San Fran next week. Honestly, I was rooting for them to beat Seattle today even though a loss would have meant the Saints clinching. They're a 10-11 win team with a retread like Carson Palmer starting.

[Pelicans78]

How about having 8 teams divisions with 2 divisions in each conference.

[Trainwreck2100]

Cards deserve to make the playoffs if they beat San Fran next week. Honestly, I was rooting for them to beat Seattle today even though a loss would have meant the Saints clinching. They're a 10-11 win team with a retread like Carson Palmer starting.

If ATL can pull off a miracle we'll have 3 play in games in the NFC

[Pelicans78]

If ATL can pull off a miracle we'll have 3 play in games in the NFC

So if the Niners lose tomorrow night, then the Saints are automatically in?

[BRHornet45]

Atlanta is going to be playing 100% too at home. it's not going to be an easy task for the pitiful offense from Carolina.

[Pelicans78]

Atlanta is going to be playing 100% too at home. it's not going to be an easy task for the pitiful offense from Carolina.

The Falcons last 4 games have been decided by 4 points or less even though its been against shitty teams except for us on the Thursday nighter.

[BRHornet45]

someone break down the scenarios .... I know if the Saints win and Panthers lose then the Saints win the division, but what about teams like Arizona?

[Trainwreck2100]

So if the Niners lose tomorrow night, then the Saints are automatically in?

no cause they are out if the Cardinals and 9ers tie and they lose, but that's the only way they don't get in

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

Atlanta is going to be playing 100% too at home. it's not going to be an easy task for the pitiful offense from Carolina.

you do realize we have the second highest point differential in the NFL right?

[BRHornet45]

Saints are 8-3 in the NFC, Arizona is 6-5 ... plus the Saints beat Arizona head to head. how would the Saints be out of the playoffs if they lose next week and Arizona wins? that would put the conference records at Saints 8-4, Arizona 7-5

[BRHornet45]

you do realize we have the second highest point differential in the NFL right?

and that has absolutely nothing to do with the offense. do I need to post the facts again?

[Darth_Pelican]

Saints are 8-3 in the NFC, Arizona is 6-5 ... plus the Saints beat Arizona head to head. how would the Saints be out of the playoffs if they lose next week and Arizona wins? that would put the conference records at Saints 8-4, Arizona 7-5

Because they would be 11-5 and we would be 10-6

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

and that has absolutely nothing to do with the offense. do I need to post the facts again?

you are stupid as fuck. i'm not sure that i've ever seen someone so salty.

how many games has carolina scored over 30 points this year? how many times have they put 20+ more points on the board?

[Pelicans78]

Saints are 8-3 in the NFC, Arizona is 6-5 ... plus the Saints beat Arizona head to head. how would the Saints be out of the playoffs if they lose next week and Arizona wins? that would put the conference records at Saints 8-4, Arizona 7-5

Because the Cards would be 11-5 while the Saints would be 10-6.

[BRHornet45]

such a disgrace that Chicago is sitting pretty at the #4 seed with their 8-7 record and epic 54-11 beat down tonight.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

"offense has nothing to do with having the second highest point differential" - BR

that has to be sigged :lmao :lmao

[Trainwreck2100]

Saints are 8-3 in the NFC, Arizona is 6-5 ... plus the Saints beat Arizona head to head. how would the Saints be out of the playoffs if they lose next week and Arizona wins? that would put the conference records at Saints 8-4, Arizona 7-5

Both the saints and cards are 10-5 so if saints lose and cards win tiebreaker doesn't apply

[BRHornet45]

you are stupid as fuck. i'm not sure that i've ever seen someone so salty.

how many games has carolina scored over 30 points this year? how many times have they put 20+ more points on the board?

again failing to acknowledge the FACTS. son it's not my opinion or anyone else trying to hate, it's called facts. the Panthers are a piss poor offense. the defense and their run game is the reason that team is having their fluke success.

ranked...

28th in passing yards
25th in total offense

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/total

[BRHornet45]

"offense has nothing to do with having the second highest point differential" - BR

that has to be sigged :lmao :lmao

stop making up lies. you said that. pay attention to the facts dumb dumb.

[JMarkJohns]

Saints are 8-3 in the NFC, Arizona is 6-5 ... plus the Saints beat Arizona head to head. how would the Saints be out of the playoffs if they lose next week and Arizona wins? that would put the conference records at Saints 8-4, Arizona 7-5

Exclude divisions.

Cardinals are 8-2 vs. @Saints, @ Eagles, Colts, Panthers, Lions, @Titans, Falcons, @Buccs, @ Jaguars, Texans...

Three of the five easy games were on the road in the Eastern time zone where Arizona historically struggles, and that schedule overall + two vs. Seattle, two vs. San Francisco, and two vs. St. Louis equals one of the toughest schedules in the League.

Arizona went 3-1 vs. your shitty division.
New Orleans went 2-2 vs. Arizona's.

Good thing you played Cardinals and 49ers at home.

[BRHornet45]

Exclude divisions.

Cardinals are 8-2 vs. @Saints, @ Eagles, Colts, Panthers, Lions, @Titans, Falcons, @Buccs, @ Jaguars, Texans...

Three of the five easy games were on the road in the Eastern time zone where Arizona historically struggles, and that schedule overall + two vs. Seattle, two vs. San Francisco, and two vs. St. Louis equals one of the toughest schedules in the League.

Arizona went 3-1 vs. your shitty division.
New Orleans went 2-2 vs. Arizona's.

Good thing you played Cardinals and 49ers at home.

see now son you're showing off your bias and ignorance. let's just be real for a minute ...

you claim that the Cardinals historically struggle on the road when playing on the east coast, well NEWS FLASH dumb shit ... Central and Eastern time zone teams historically struggle on the road when on the west coast as well. every team has to deal with it.

oh and btw ... the Saints have won 3 of the last 4 meetings vs Arizona .... and 9 out of the last 13 (and 4 of those wins were in Arizona). you don't want none of this.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

see now son you're showing off your bias and ignorance. let's just be real for a minute ...

you claim that the Cardinals historically struggle on the road when playing on the east coast, well NEWS FLASH dumb shit ... Central and Eastern time zone teams historically struggle on the road when on the west coast as well. every team has to deal with it.

oh and btw ... the Saints have won 3 of the last 4 meetings vs Arizona .... and 9 out of the last 13 (and 4 of those wins were in Arizona). you don't want none of this.

notice how saints fans only talk about the past... not what's going on RIGHT NOW

[BRHornet45]

notice how saints fans only talk about the past... not what's going on RIGHT NOW

lol idiot.

he is the one who brought up the past games so I fired right back with the facts, but oh wait that's right ... you again continue to ignore the facts and show your ignorance.

also LOL at you desperately trying to reach out to other fan bases on here for help.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

:cry :cry :cry

http://oi44.tinypic.com/2rxwp68.jpg

[Clipper Nation]

again failing to acknowledge the FACTS. son it's not my opinion or anyone else trying to hate, it's called facts. the Panthers are a piss poor offense. the defense and their run game is the reason that team is having their fluke success.

ranked...

28th in passing yards
25th in total offense

http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/team/_/stat/total

BR dropping truth bombs per the usual, tbh....

[JMarkJohns]

see now son you're showing off your bias and ignorance. let's just be real for a minute ...

you claim that the Cardinals historically struggle on the road when playing on the east coast, well NEWS FLASH dumb shit ... Central and Eastern time zone teams historically struggle on the road when on the west coast as well. every team has to deal with it.

oh and btw ... the Saints have won 3 of the last 4 meetings vs Arizona .... and 9 out of the last 13 (and 4 of those wins were in Arizona). you don't want none of this.

You didn't refute shit, and the Saints lost to the shitty Cardinals with undrafted rookie Max Hall as their QB when they played Arizona in Arizona in 2010.

Cardinals just beat a team in Seattle you got crushed by.

You ain't shit on defense, ain't shit on the road, and play in an average at-best division winning the same amount of games as Arizona despite an inferior schedule.

Worse, you just got prison raped by a career loser with under a minute left.

Arizona shut Cam the fuck down this year.

It shouldn't even matter. I'm not even mad at you so much as the system that will allow an 8-win NFC North winner in over: 10-win San Francisco, 10-win Saints, 10/11-win Cardinals.

That's right... The Cardinals can be 11-5 and not get in but the Bear or Packers will with 8 wins.

Bullshit.

Why bother playing if winning isn't rewarded.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

BR dropping truth bombs per the usual, tbh....

:lmao clipper nation sucking on that BR cock after he getting shit on by Cam today.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

Worse, you just got prison raped by a career loser with under a minute left.

Arizona shut Cam the fuck down this year.



Slow down there. You beat us before we were in our peak. Cam wasn't playing nearly as well as he is now. Not to mention you scored those touchdowns at the end of the game.

Cam has 5 game winning drives this year - far more than Carson has... well, probably ever. That includes over the 49ers, Patriots, and Saints.

[BRHornet45]

You didn't refute shit, and the Saints lost to the shitty Cardinals with undrafted rookie Max Hall as their QB when they played Arizona in Arizona in 2010.

Cardinals just beat a team in Seattle you got crushed by.

You ain't shit on defense, ain't shit on the road, and play in an average at-best division winning the same amount of games as Arizona despite an inferior schedule.

Worse, you just got prison raped by a career loser with under a minute left.

Arizona shut Cam the fuck down this year.

It shouldn't even matter. I'm not even mad at you so much as the system that will allow an 8-win NFC North winner in over: 10-win San Francisco, 10-win Saints, 10/11-win Cardinals.

That's right... The Cardinals can be 11-5 and not get in but the Bear or Packers will with 8 wins.

Bullshit.

Why bother playing if winning isn't rewarded.


umm okay? you do know this is the NFL where every team gets beat right? but hey I'll play your little game. did you know the Cardinals lost to ...

- those same "shitty" Rams

- got completely owned and anally raped by the Saints 31-7 ... (I know I know ... "but but that was earlier!")

- got curb stomped by the 49ers

- got face fucked by Seattle

- got nutted on by the Eagles

[JMarkJohns]

Slow down there. You beat us before we were in our peak. Cam wasn't playing nearly as well as he is now. Not to mention you scored those touchdowns at the end of the game.

Cam has 5 game winning drives this year - far more than Carson has... well, probably ever. That includes over the 49ers, Patriots, and Saints.

Don't be an idiot and asshat all at the same time.

If you can use "weren't peaking" Arizona certainly can.

And, counting today, Palmer has 23 game-winning drives for his career.

Panthers are good, but Cam is a career loser until this year, and he goddamn hog-tied the Saints colon with his deep shots up their middle.

Saints should truly be embarrassed.

Not for losing as much as how. Really? Gonna let Cam beat you passing... With just 55 seconds?!

And Arizona murder-boned the Panthers.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

Don't be an idiot and asshat all at the same time.

If you can use "weren't peaking" Arizona certainly can.

And, counting today, Palmer has 23 game-winning drives for his career.

Panthers are good, but Cam is a career loser until this year, and he goddamn hog-tied the Saints colon with his deep shots up their middle.

Saints should truly be embarrassed.

Not for losing as much as how. Really? Gonna let Cam beat you passing... With just 55 seconds?!

And Arizona murder-boned the Panthers.

There's a difference between peaking and going "so-so" and winning nine straight games and ten out of your last eleven.

Cam may have been a "career loser", but he also had the 30th and 28th ranked defense those past two years. Plus probably leading the Panthers to their first division title since 2008 should probably erase that thought. He broke the passing yards as a rookie, and has beaten good teams passing this year.

The Cardinals are good too, but I'd take Cam any day over Caron Pickmore.

[Clipper Nation]

:lmao clipper nation sucking on that BR cock after he getting shit on by Cam today.

Luke Kuechly, Ted Ginn, and Rob Ryan stepped up to deliver a clutch win for the Panthers, what can I say? :downspin:

[JMarkJohns]

umm okay? you do know this is the NFL where every team gets beat right? but hey I'll play your little game. did you know the Cardinals lost to ...

- those same "shitty" Rams

- got completely owned and anally raped by the Saints 31-7 ... (I know I know ... "but but that was earlier!")

- got curb stomped by the 49ers

- got face fucked by Seattle

- got nutted on by the Eagles

Sure... Point?

When you play good teams you're bound to lose a few.

Fact is you were running your mouth off about schedules. Arizona had a tougher one and has as many wins as you. Separate elements of schedule, Arizona has had the stronger, more impressive season in the tougher division...

Oh, and they weren't anal drained by Cam in record time.

[JMarkJohns]

There's a difference between peaking and going "so-so" and winning nine straight games and ten out of your last eleven.

Cam may have been a "career loser", but he also had the 30th and 28th ranked defense those past two years. Plus probably leading the Panthers to their first division title since 2008 should probably erase that thought. He broke the passing yards as a rookie, and has beaten good teams passing this year.

The Cardinals are good too, but I'd take Cam any day over Caron Pickmore.

What are you arguing? Certainly nothing I'm arguing.

Also, you lost to Arizona then won nine straight... So, you're saying either you were dogshit vs. Arizona and peaking a mere week later when starting the streak, or, I'd argue, always good, got beat, then beat everyone.

This isn't baseball or basketball. You don't just suck and then become awesome in one weeks time.

Congrats on Cam finally being worthy of #1 overall.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

What are you arguing? Certainly nothing I'm arguing.

Also, you lost to Arizona then won nine straight... So, you're saying either you were dogshit vs. Arizona and peaking a mere week later when starting the streak, or, I'd argue, always good, got beat, then beat everyone.

This isn't baseball or basketball. You don't just suck and then become awesome in one weeks time.

Congrats on Cam finally being worthy of #1 overall.

you're forgetting we had a bye week after we played you guys. our offense completely changed their schemes and playing style after that week. we stopped giving cam 50 attempts per game and realized that we have always been a running team

[JMarkJohns]

So that's the first bye in the history of byes that turned shit into gold?

You were always good. Lost a few. Got gifted a few. And, credit to ya, found a way to put yourself in position to win the division with a horrible offense.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

So that's the first bye in the history of byes that turned shit into gold?

You were always good. Lost a few. Got gifted a few. And, credit to ya, found a way to put yourself in position to win the division with a horrible offense.

You're talking a lot of shit about our offense for someone that may break the interception record this year. Especially considering our offense has had more 30 point games than Arizona or Seattle for that matter. That doesn't sound "horrible" to me.

[BRHornet45]

Sure... Point?

When you play good teams you're bound to lose a few.

Fact is you were running your mouth off about schedules. Arizona had a tougher one and has as many wins as you. Separate elements of schedule, Arizona has had the stronger, more impressive season in the tougher division...

Oh, and they weren't anal drained by Cam in record time.


son I didn't say anything about the schedules until you brought it up. now you're just making shit up or getting me mixed up with someone else.

[JMarkJohns]

You're talking a lot of shit about our offense for someone that may break the interception record this year. Especially considering our offense has had more 30 point games than Arizona or Seattle for that matter. That doesn't sound "horrible" to me.

Against whom?

NFC West is fuckin' stacked defensively.

Your defense barely registered a blip compared to what NFC West defenses do.

And it's not talking shit when it's truth.

The fact Arizona is at 10 wins vs. This schedule despite Palmer's inexplicable interceptions says much more about them than however many 30-point games says about Carolina.

You simply aren't supposed to be able to win in Seattle to this team when you throw four interceptions.

It's downright impossible to believe that it occurred.

But scoring 30 on the Vikings? It happened like 7 times... On the Giants? It happened like 6 times... On the Buccs? It happened like 4 times.

If you count scores like 27+, it happened like half the time for your bedpost notches.

The Seattle win is arguably the single most impressive victory of the season.

[JMarkJohns]

son I didn't say anything about the schedules until you brought it up. now you're just making shit up or getting me mixed up with someone else.

Hrmmmm....


Saints are 8-3 in the NFC, Arizona is 6-5 ... plus the Saints beat Arizona head to head. how would the Saints be out of the playoffs if they lose next week and Arizona wins? that would put the conference records at Saints 8-4, Arizona 7-5

Look familiar?

Don't bullshit a bullshitter...

[BRHornet45]

Hrmmmm....



Look familiar?

Don't bullshit a bullshitter...

oh please son that wasn't even posted in the same context as what you're trying to make it look like.

I was asking about the playoff outcomes of the schedules. stop trying to create bullshit.

[JMarkJohns]

Maybe not.

Still squabbled over records, though.

That said, perhaps I'm just pissed the Cardinals will likely be missing the playoffs and just want to vent?

I honestly had all faith that the Saints would win today. Ya really let me down and I watched it live. Then watched Arizona win maybe their most impressive feat since the Super Bowl run.

[BRHornet45]

Maybe not.

Still squabbled over records, though.

That said, perhaps I'm just pissed the Cardinals will likely be missing the playoffs and just want to vent?

I honestly had all faith that the Saints would win today. Ya really let me down and I watched it live. Then watched Arizona win maybe their most impressive feat since the Super Bowl run.

well reality check ... Arizona, just like Carolina ... doesn't have a legit QB. so neither teams would go far in the playoffs regardless.

Kurt Warner got you guys close and if not for the rigged officiating in the 2008-09 Super Bowl you guys would have won it all (and deserved it that year).

[JMarkJohns]

Cardinals defense this year deserves the opportunity. So does Carolina. Saints offense does as well.

Bullshit Eagles and Bears/Packers.

Motherfuckers

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

saintsfan in denial

getting shit on by the QB that "is a gimmick"

and yeah.. driving 65 yards in 30 seconds is shitting on

[BRHornet45]

saintsfan in denial

getting shit on by the QB that "is a gimmick"

and yeah.. driving 65 yards in 30 seconds is shitting on

son you should take notes from JMarkJohns.

please learn the game of football first, then post.

[Pelicans78]

Cardinals defense this year deserves the opportunity. So does Carolina. Saints offense does as well.

Bullshit Eagles and Bears/Packers.

Motherfuckers

Saints offense doesn't deserve anything. The defense has been better all season whether at home or on the road.

[spurraider21]

Thanks. It was before Cardinals peaked, too.

Utter bullshit that any of Cardinals, Panthers, Saints, 49ers fail to make playoffs but Eagles, Cowboys, Packers, Bears do. Don't give a shit about divisions. Best teams make playoffs, especially in a league where imbanced schedules and uneven divisional strengths dictate so much.
you had no problems with division imbalances when the rams and niners were shitty and the seahawks were meh

[spurraider21]

Rob Ryan gets jobs because of his last name. Teams always get excited when he joins at first, then he inevitably flames out.

[JMarkJohns]

you had no problems with division imbalances when the rams and niners were shitty and the seahawks were meh

Says who?

I'm on record here and in college arguing against unbalanced schedules.

If you're going to have shitty divisions and shitty division winners, they shouldn't be guaranteed anything.

[spurraider21]

Says who?

I'm on record here and in college arguing against unbalanced schedules.

If you're going to have shitty divisions and shitty division winners, they shouldn't be guaranteed anything.
if that's the case you might as well scrap divisions and kill off all those old division rivalries which are part of the game

[Chinook]

Rob Ryan gets jobs because of his last name. Teams always get excited when he joins at first, then he inevitably flames out.

Truth. Saints fans will realize it too eventually. Jerry Jones' endorsement shouldn't be seen as a good thing.

[TIMMYtoZO]

Cardinals defense this year deserves the opportunity. So does Carolina. Saints offense does as well.

Bullshit Eagles and Bears/Packers.

Motherfuckers

:lol Still thinking the Cards can go far without an elite QB. That D may be awesome, but it won't mean shit next month even if you had managed to make it. This isn't the early 2000's anymore.

[JMarkJohns]

Mark Sanchez made two AFC Title Games the last five years and Super Bowl winning Flacco is effectively a younger Palmer.

Don't be an idiot.

I know a Super Bowl run isn't likely, but they deserve it over The North and East winner.

[TIMMYtoZO]

Mark Sanchez made two AFC Title Games the last five years and Super Bowl winning Flacco is effectively a younger Palmer.

Don't be an idiot.

I know a Super Bowl run isn't likely, but they deserve it over The North and East winner.

:lol "Deserve". You either get in, or you don't. If you don't get in, try winning more games next time.

[spurraider21]

:lol "Deserve". You either get in, or you don't. If you don't get in, try winning more games next time.
They will likely end up with more wins than both of those division winners without the luxury of being able to play the giants and skins twice

[Chinook]

Mark Sanchez made two AFC Title Games the last five years and Super Bowl winning Flacco is effectively a younger Palmer.

Don't be an idiot.

I know a Super Bowl run isn't likely, but they deserve it over The North and East winner.

On quarterbacks, I agree. People need to quit with this elite crap. It seems every recent SB winner was a dark horse because they lacked a Brady or Manning and as soon as they won, their quarterbacks all of the sudden became elite. They're just chasing their own logic most of the time. You don't need an elite quarterback to win it all; you just need one who's playing well at the right time. If it were really that cut and dried, the consensus top four would have more than three rings in the last decade.

That said, the Cardinals should have won the NFCW if they wanted to complain about missing. It's rare that a team that finishes third in their division is really all that deserving.

[Lincoln]

as an outsider looking in, I want the most entertaining playoff bracket this year and unfortunately for everyone that isn't a cards fan, that team is boring as fuck to watch. Sure they are probably more deserving than the Bears/Packers but Rodgers was out since week 7 (?) and the run they made with shit like Wallace/Flynn/Tolzien at QB deserves some props. I can honestly see the Packers win a game now that Cobb and Rodgers are coming back. I can't say the same for Arizona.

Philly does deserve to get in as well despite being in a horrific division. This team won like 3 or 4 games last year and look much improved thanks to a new scheme and a QB that is on fire. After a slow ass start (weren't they like 3-5..?)they got their shit together and I can see them winning a game.

[spurraider21]

On quarterbacks, I agree. People need to quit with this elite crap. It seems every recent SB winner was a dark horse because they lacked a Brady or Manning and as soon as they won, their quarterbacks all of the sudden became elite. They're just chasing their own logic most of the time. You don't need an elite quarterback to win it all; you just need one who's playing well at the right time. If it were really that cut and dried, the consensus top four would have more than three rings in the last decade.

That said, the Cardinals should have won the NFCW if they wanted to complain about missing. It's rare that a team that finishes third in their division is really all that deserving.
Motherfuckin froof nuke

[Chinook]

:lol :lol

[spurraider21]

:lol rob ryan
:lol fat

[Chinook]

:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao :lmao:lmao

Which team will be the next to give Rob a job?

[Silver&Black]

https://s3.amazonaws.com/wp-ag/wp-content/uploads/sites/71/2015/06/he-gone.jpg

[spurraider21]

former raiders defensive coordinator Rob Ryan is fired, will be replaced by former raiders head coach Dennis Allen

[Chris]

Took the ego thing too far, only relevant because of his brother. Also fat :lol

[spurraider21]

Took the ego thing too far, only relevant because of his brother. Also fat :lol
and dad

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

:lol always knew BR was full of shit

Probably my biggest feud in my ST history, tbh..

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

it's obvious you're new to the NFL.

:lol and it's obvious "son", that Rob Ryan killed the Drew Brees era

[sasaint]

How on earth did Sean ever hire this guy after his stint in Dallas?!?! Cowgirls' D was abysmal under Ryan, but Sean thought he would be great in New Orleans?

[resistanze]

Wow, so this is how it is to fire a shitty DC for putting together a shitty defense. Interesting.

[Darth_Pelican]

He should have been fired at the end of last season when the Saints defense finished 31st and gave up the lead on the final drive of the game 3 times.

[HarlemHeat37]

:lol first team in NFL history to allow 3 straight games of 4 TDs vs. 0 INTs..2 of the 3 games were against Marcus Mariota and Kirk Cousins:lmao..

[Arcadian]

I picked up Cousins in fantasy just because he was playing NO. Got me 29 points.

[Chinook]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/15765351/rob-ryan-rips-new-orleans-saints-blames-new-scheme-recent-firing

Rob Ryan blames Saints' new scheme for firing: 'I know I am better than that'


"There are two years that don't have my signature on them, and it's the last two years in New Orleans. And that's just the truth," Ryan said during an interview with The MMQB (http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/05/26/rob-rex-ryan-buffalo-bills-interview-nfl).EDITOR'S PICKS

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/photo/2016/0110/r43016_576x324_16-9.jpg&w=130&h=130&scale=crop&location=center (http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/24860/rob-ryan-says-bills-are-going-to-beat-patriots)Rob Ryan says Bills '€˜are going to beat' Patriots (http://espn.go.com/blog/buffalo-bills/post/_/id/24860/rob-ryan-says-bills-are-going-to-beat-patriots)Bills assistant Rob Ryan believes he and his brother Rex will lead Buffalo past AFC East rival New England and Bill Belichick, a coach he admires.

Ryan, who was fired by the Saints last November, said his biggest regret was that he didn't speak up to coach Sean Payton when New Orleans changed its scheme after a successful 2013 season.
"I should have gone into Sean and talked to him. Sean is a good person. I didn't, and I just let it happen, so I deserve what I got," Ryan said. "Look, I have been fired before. But I get pissed in New Orleans because I know I am better than that. I am a way better coach than I was allowed to be, and that's just the truth.
"Oh, we are dead last in defense. Well, yeah, you are going to be dead last playing this bulls--- defense. But it is my fault because I didn't say anything. I never stood up and said, 'F you, I ain't coaching this.' I promise you I'd say it now."
Payton, who was asked about Ryan's comments during a Friday interview with PFT Live, said that "the idea that it wasn't his defense, or that he wasn't in charge of it, is silly."

Love this thread. Reminds me of how good the NFL Forum used to be.

[UNT Eagles 2016]

Wow, so this is how it is to fire a shitty DC for putting together a shitty defense. Interesting.
It's not Dom Capers' fault your team lives in a city of barely 20K residents and has to rely on independent stockholders to fund the players and staff. Hey, at least you have a great offense and a top 5 QB and plenty of young options to choose from even if it is a bottom half ranked defense