Is there a Bible/ New Testament expert in the house?

[Blake]

Just need help on a random question:

After the soldiers put a crown of thorns on Jesus' head, what color was the robe they put on next? Crimson or purple?

Thanks.

[The Reckoning]

iirc it was purple as a sign of royalty to mock Jesus. same with the crown of thorns.


idk CCD was a long ass time ago.

[JMarkJohns]

Trick question. Different books in the New Testament say both scarlet and purple, and still other translations say crimson in place of scarlet.

None of the colors changes the intent to denote royalty or special place as all three colors debated status, wealth, power, and/or royalty.

[JMarkJohns]

Matthew 27:28 = Scarlet
Mark 15:17 = Purple

I did have to google the references...

[clambake]

which color should avante be wearing?

[JMarkJohns]

Pink

[DMC]

Doesn't matter. Might as well be asking about Gandalf.

[Skull-1]

Just need help on a random question:

After the soldiers put a crown of thorns on Jesus' head, what color was the robe they put on next? Crimson or purple?

Thanks. Depends on the verse and the translation and is COMPLETELY irrelevant to the point being made.

[Leetonidas]

Paging Skull-1

[Skull-1]

Paging Skull-1 (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=44046) Beat ya to it, brah. LOL But thanks! HAHAHAHA :)

[Koolaid_Man]

who knows...I'm sure it's the same color the republicans are trying to paint the great Obama with it...and it's no surprise...Obama is being treated much like Jesus was and time will reveal (as in the case with Jesus) that Obama is was right (the answer)

[Skull-1]

If this douchebag wants to question scripture there are a lot of other gnats to sh*t out after swallowing the camel. In one of them I believe Mark said they traveled from A-B-C which makes no sense because they would have gone A-C-B. It is not relevant because it changes absolutely nothing about the spiritual point being made.

[Blake]

Depends on the verse and the translation and is COMPLETELY irrelevant to the point being made.

Next question:

How could Jesus allow for a simple mistake?

[Skull-1]

who knows...I'm sure it's the same color the republicans are trying to paint the great Obama with it...and it's no surprise...Obama is being treated much like Jesus was and time will reveal (as in the case with Jesus) that Obama is was right (the answer)
If Obama is right then I would LOVE to know the question. What a moron that guy is. Actually, no, he isn't so much a moron as he is a crafty wrecking ball. And when everyone is working part time with no health care he will STILL be getting love. Ridiculous.

[Blake]

If this douchebag wants to question scripture there are a lot of other gnats to sh*t out after swallowing the camel. In one of them I believe Mark said they traveled from A-B-C which makes no sense because they would have gone A-C-B. It is not relevant because it changes absolutely nothing about the spiritual point being made.

Why did God allow for such nonsense?

[Skull-1]

Next question:

How could Jesus allow for a simple mistake?
It isn't a "mistake" it is an "irrelevance." Purple, say some, is anything from violet to crimson/red/scarlet. We are getting caught in the weeds. God allows PLENTY of translation bias to corrupt scripture. That's why it now says stupid things like "Sexual Immorality" or "Marital Unfaithfulness" when the word means "premarital sex". The scriptures are VEILED and God uses many methods to ensure they remain that way. SOME find the truth, but they are few. And that's the way it is. Don't ask me why. Refer to the other thread where I showed you God's explanation.

[Skull-1]

Why did God allow for such nonsense? To trip up those planted in the rocky soil. To trip the many. The crowd. To make it where only a few find what is true.

[clambake]

uh oh

[Blake]

It isn't a "mistake" it is an "irrelevance." Purple, say some, is anything from violet to crimson/red/scarlet. We are getting caught in the weeds. God allows PLENTY of translation bias to corrupt scripture. That's why it now says stupid things like "Sexual Immorality" or "Marital Unfaithfulness" when the word means "premarital sex". The scriptures are VEILED and God uses many methods to ensure they remain that way. SOME find the truth, but they are few. And that's the way it is. Don't ask me why. Refer to the other thread where I showed you God's explanation.

Why would he take the time and effort to have it all written down if he's not going to do it correctly?

And why don't you want to ask why? Why would you believe in something that can't stand scrutiny?

[Blake]

To trip up those planted in the rocky soil. To trip the many. The crowd. To make it where only a few find what is true.

Then why not make just a few to begin with?

[DJR210]

Doesn't matter. Might as well be asking about Gandalf.

:lol

[Koolaid_Man]

If Obama is right then I would LOVE to know the question. What a moron that guy is. Actually, no, he isn't so much a moron as he is a crafty wrecking ball. And when everyone is working part time with no health care he will STILL be getting love. Ridiculous.

or when businesses start losing good people (affecting their bottom line) maybe they'll drop the selfish act...Obama thus far is on pace to be the greatest president in History. You tea party loons have no basis for saying health care is bad..you're just mad you fucking lost to a black guy not once but twice and he took a republican idea on "universal" healthcare and implemented it....yes him failing is extremely important to the conservative belief system that the perception of black failure must remain ingrained in the American psyche..success means the Dems will remain in power for the next 20 + yrs....

Your party has nothing but loons in its pipeline...starting with Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, and Marco Rubio :lol yea this guy:

pMH9dAG3PMg

[The Reckoning]

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcREbca4lrEtvmcyPVkJOxBb_b1v4cVUE 2rJCTsJ3Tu0PIi7Z6OMaw

[Skull-1]

Why would he take the time and effort to have it all written down if he's not going to do it correctly?

And why don't you want to ask why? Why would you believe in something that can't stand scrutiny? It is correct according to HIS purpose. And it does stand scrutiny because the gnats that you strain throw you off the path. That's what He says He does. Take it up with Him.

[Skull-1]

Then why not make just a few to begin with? The billion dollar question. He alludes as to why and much of it has to do with mercy and in giving a foil for the elect. It makes His prophecy come true.

[Skull-1]

or when businesses start losing good people (affecting their bottom line) maybe they'll drop the selfish act...Obama thus far is on pace to be the greatest president in History. You tea party loons have no basis for saying health care is bad..you're just mad you fucking lost to a black guy not once but twice and he took a republican idea on "universal" healthcare and implemented it....yes him failing is extremely important to the conservative belief system that the perception of black failure must remain ingrained in the American psyche..success means the Dems will remain in power for the next 20 + yrs....

Your party has nothing but loons in its pipeline...starting with Ted Cruz, Rand Paul, and Marco Rubio :lol yea this guy:

Epic troll. But I will take Ted Cruz. He understands that prosperity comes from free enterprise, not government. Republicanism is not constitutionalism. I am not a republican't. I am a conservative, classical liberal, constitutionalist....... Individual liberty. That is what our republic is supposed to do. It is not to provide "free" health care. It is not free. The only way it would be free is to enslave medical personnel. Let's just force into labor the people in white coats at the hospitals instead of chain ganged blacks in the cotton fields. Same thing. LABOR IS A PORTION OF A PERSON'S LIFE BE IT IN THE COCKPIT, THE FARM FIELD, OR A HOSPITAL. IT IS NOT FREE AND NOBODY HAS A "RIGHT" TO IT.

[Skull-1]

Why would he take the time and effort to have it all written down if he's not going to do it correctly?

And why don't you want to ask why? Why would you believe in something that can't stand scrutiny?It sure stands my scrutiny and I am far more versed in it than you are. Sorry for the pun. Any way, if "creating the universe", the Laws of Physics, and plotting the course of the universe before it even began wasn't a burden then writing a tiny little book shouldn't be much trouble.

[Blake]

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcREbca4lrEtvmcyPVkJOxBb_b1v4cVUE 2rJCTsJ3Tu0PIi7Z6OMaw

That's fascinating because if Jesus really had long hair like that then Paul is calling Jesus effeminate.

[Blake]

It is correct according to HIS purpose. And it does stand scrutiny because the gnats that you strain throw you off the path. That's what He says He does. Take it up with Him.

I don't think he's real. I believe you are, so I'm taking it up with you.

[Blake]

It sure stands my scrutiny and I am far more versed in it than you are. Sorry for the pun. Any way, if "creating the universe", the Laws of Physics, and plotting the course of the universe before it even began wasn't a burden then writing a tiny little book shouldn't be much trouble.

Exactly. Yet he couldn't get simple colors straight. Why?

[Proxy]

http://atheismandme.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/perspective.jpg

[Skull-1]

I don't think he's real. I believe you are, so I'm taking it up with you. He says it is to show His mercy in the end. Best answer I have.

[Skull-1]

DON'T MASTURBATE

Jesus drank and had a good time. That stupidity you are showing about jerking off is false gospel nonsense....evangelist christianity with a small c....Catholicism....also known as BS. It is NOT the Gospel of Christ. You are dealing in pop culture caricatures.... You can admire a hot woman, just don't try to steal her from her husband like that jerk in the pink tights did to Timmy. Geezus, people are so messed up in their views of everything. Conservatism, morality, freedom. We are so scewed as a life form....

[Koolaid_Man]

Epic troll. But I will take Ted Cruz. He understands that prosperity comes from free enterprise, not government. Republicanism is not constitutionalism. I am not a republican't. I am a conservative, classical liberal, constitutionalist....... Individual liberty. That is what our republic is supposed to do. It is not to provide "free" health care. It is not free. The only way it would be free is to enslave medical personnel. Let's just force into labor the people in white coats at the hospitals instead of chain ganged blacks in the cotton fields. Same thing. LABOR IS A PORTION OF A PERSON'S LIFE BE IT IN THE COCKPIT, THE FARM FIELD, OR A HOSPITAL. IT IS NOT FREE AND NOBODY HAS A "RIGHT" TO IT.

spoken like a typical Tea-liban talking loud but not making ANY sense. Thinking you're educated huh.... Listen Skull just because a cannibal eats with a fork doesn't make it progress...I'm going to attempt to educated you. Try to follow along please.

American Tea-liban's think one sided and therein lies the root of the problem... (Balance) Free enterprise should always be balanced by government.... In fact it has to or it cannot survive....If it tries to survive on its on without government interference then it will be forced into being a government in and of itself.

Why?

Because free enterprise ultimately means being beholden to your own personal success moderated in large part by your shareholders...For as wonderful a workplace as Google is touted to be do you think they're in the business of building general infrastructure to get them from point A to point Z and all the places in between that actually helps them to grow their business? Listen this Nation's history was born out of slavery and Poor whites (typically conservative) are always just footsteps away from being treated like shit by "free enterprise".

My point is what movement do you think led to basic rights in labor laws, (typically giving majority of workers sat and sun off or a flex work schedule) who do you think led the cause for workers comp when hurt on the job, or the Family Medical Leave Act (FMLA), or widening access to education (and not just for minorities). These are all democratic causes (and every civilized nation in the world recognized the benefit). Free enterprise always looks for ways to screw over the avg worker...and they operate in silo's...they're not going to provide protections or services for anyone outside of their enterprise..and when you leave that enterprise for the day you're on your own. They seem like they grant prosperity but we all know it's because of the government requirements placed on them for them to operate. They manipulate markets and typically discriminate from within. They don't want the government telling them they have to provide fair (and living ) wages or health insurance for their workers. If they could they'd operate similar to the sweat shops in many of the Asian countries. Unfortunately they prefer to operate in secrecy with no oversight and they rely heavily on emotional and uneducated voters such as yourself to be filled with fake pride towards their goals.

It's like Joe the Plumber. This guy was earning 40k a yr and had the nerve to think that as a plumber he'd earn more than 250k a yr. let's say he actually made it to the middle class..Redistribution of wealth under Obama actually helps this clown, and redistribution happens on a daily basis at every level. Obama just happened to state the obvious.

Now let me talk Doctors for a sec...I found your silly ALL CAPS view hilarious. :lol

The current issue are the rates paid to doctors working as part of hospital-owned clinics versus physicians working in their own, independent offices....Right now when a doctor works as part of a hospital owned practice, and bills Medicare, they're paid more than what they'd receive for providing the same services in their own independent practice. That’s because of a loopholes between Medicare’s inpatient and outpatient billing schemes...so the hospitals have started purchasing doctor practices allowing them to bill at higher rates for the same services because of these loopholes in system. I think it's called Part (A) and (B) - of this billing scheme. Doctors from the smaller practices (once bought by the hospitals) can now offset their losses by being part of this scheme. Keep in mind we're talking about system in place today well before "Obama care" is enacted.


Once Obama care is fully enacted these loop holes are closed and the doctors costs are again "normalized" They cannot start charging crazy prices for average services. So in this sense we cannot solely rely on "free market" enterprise or none us would be able to survive because they'd charge 1000.00 for a basic co-pay....why? because like everything else GREED....not even the doctors themselves would survive without these checks and balances. Unless they have a silent agreement to take care of their own...so I think free enterprise / capitalism should always be balanced by socialism and even lite communism as required.

now let me get back to my typical bullshit...:lol

[symple19]

http://static4.fjcdn.com/comments/Ok+I+know+not+all+christians+are+that+stupid+but+_ 8e5aff39455c0aa1b88dd7ff507bc92b.jpg

[symple19]

I typed "jeebotards" into google images and nothing but stuff from Spurstalk came up :lmao :lmao :lmao :lmao

First thing I noticed was one of Venti's Crytika's :lmao :lmao

[Clipper Nation]

:lol Skull-1
:lol Jeebotard
:lol Neocon

[symple19]

Jesus drank and had a good time. That stupidity you are showing about jerking off is false gospel nonsense....evangelist christianity with a small c....Catholicism....also known as BULLSH*T. It is NOT the Gospel of Christ. You are dealing in pop culture caricatures.... You can admire a hot woman, just don't try to steal her from her husband like that jerk in the pink tights did to Timmy. Geezus f**k, people are so screwed up in their views of everything. Conservatism, morality, freedom. We are so f***ed as a life form....

:lmao

:lmao

Filthy jeebotard. I hope your church burns down on Sunday...with everyone inside

[Koolaid_Man]

http://atheismandme.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/perspective.jpg

^ lol...that is awesome...you stuck the landing

[Skull-1]

spoken like a typical Tea-liban talking loud but not making ANY sense. Thinking you're educated huh.... Listen Skull just because a cannibal eats with a fork doesn't make it progress...I'm going to attempt to educated you. Try to follow along please.

American Tea-liban's think one sided and therein lies the root of the problem... (Balance) Free enterprise should always be balanced by government.... In fact it has to or it cannot survive....If it tries to survive on its on without government interference then it will be forced into being a government in and of itself.

Why?

Because free enterprise ultimately means being beholden to your own personal success moderated in large part by your shareholders...For as wonderful a workplace as Google is touted to be do you think they're in the business of building general infrastructure to get them from point A to point Z and all the places in between that actually helps them to grow their business? Listen this Nation's history was born out of slavery and Poor whites (typically conservative) are always just footsteps away from being treated like shit by "free enterprise".

...



Did not read. You lost me after the third sentence. CAPITALISM AND FREEDOM by Milton Friedman. Take a look.

We did just fine for LONG time without oppressive statists telling us we can't have a large soda. LIBERTY. LIBERTY. FREEDOM. PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHTS. The fact that you didn't even bother to cede the point about servitude means you are a clueless ideologue. You are vermin.

The health care system we have is the greatest on earth. Not perfect, but awesome. More innovation, longer life expectancy after catastrophic events, and better access in a shorter time period than anywhere!!

I fly Saudi PRINCES to the USA for treatment. They know where they will LIVE when they are treated--here. F*** you with your weak sauce bullsh*t. What is killing us is a GOVERNMENT IMPOSED LACK OF INTERSTATE COMPETITION. The MARKET will drive efficiency and quality NOT the government. Socialized medicine is a failure EVERYWHERE and is being abandoned. Yet here we go charging into it like the Light Brigade thinking we can defy the laws of nature. GTFO of here you loser.

Yeah, we lose more prenatals than any country because we happend to save more than the entire world put together!! JERKOFF MORON.

When I had no money I still got treatment in the USA back in 1993. My wife had a miscarriage when I was in flight school with no insurance. TREATED. We paid them back ten bucks a month. That is OVER now. Will NEVER happen again. You and your golden boy just wrecked it to CONTROL all of us. Well I guess I will just hope I don't get cancer....

When it all collapses you will still blame Bush. HOW ORIGINAL. MORON.

[Skull-1]

:lmao

:lmao

Filthy jeebotard. I hope your church burns down on Sunday...with everyone inside I don't attend church. They have no truth there. I got out of the false gospel old wine bullsh*t a looooooooooooong time ago.

[Skull-1]

^ lol...that is awesome...you stuck the landing He only stuck the landing for those who have no idea what Christ was about.

[Skull-1]

:lol Skull-1
:lol Jeebotard
:lol Neocon Neocon doesn't even apply, moron. Those people are idiots. I would agree with Pat Buchanan before those losers.

[Skull-1]

:lmao

:lmao

Filthy jeebotard. I hope your church burns down on Sunday...with everyone insideTruth be told, if every so-called CHRISTIAN church in the world burned down it would be a good start--similar to a thousand lawyers at the bottom of the ocean. You will not find any truth in those temples of satan. "I know where you dwell..." Jesus was pointing right at those churches.

[RD2191]

idc what any of you faggots say, skull 1 just took all you niggas to church.

[Skull-1]

idc what any of you faggots say, skull 1 just took all you niggas to church.Funny pun. Church just means "assembly". It is not what we make it with the giant pagan phallic steeples on them. Popular christianity is a joke and an embarrassment. It does not represent Christ at ALL. Give a guy a break. I have to argue with those OUTSIDE because of the stupidity of those INSIDE the faith. I can't win.

[symple19]

I don't attend church. They have no truth there. I got out of the false gospel old wine bullsh*t a looooooooooooong time ago.


Truth be told, if every so-called CHRISTIAN church in the world burned down it would be a good start--similar to a thousand lawyers at the bottom of the ocean. You will not find any truth in those temples of satan. "I know where you dwell..." Jesus was pointing right at those churches.

http://static.fjcdn.com/gifs/wtf_3b7f15_3047722.gif

[Koolaid_Man]

Did not read. You lost me after the third sentence. CAPITALISM AND FREEDOM by Milton Friedman. Take a look.

We did just fine for LONG time without oppressive statists telling us we can't have a large soda. LIBERTY. LIBERTY. FREEDOM. PRIVATE PROPERTY RIGHTS. The fact that you didn't even bother to cede the point about servitude means you are a clueless ideologue. You are vermin.

The health care system we have is the greatest on earth. Not perfect, but awesome. More innovation, longer life expectancy after catastrophic events, and better access in a shorter time period than anywhere!!

I fly Saudi PRINCES to the USA for treatment. They know where they will LIVE when they are treated--here. F*** you with your weak sauce bullsh*t. What is killing us is a GOVERNMENT IMPOSED LACK OF INTERSTATE COMPETITION. The MARKET will drive efficiency and quality NOT the government. Socialized medicine is a failure EVERYWHERE and is being abandoned. Yet here we go charging into it like the Light Brigade thinking we can defy the laws of nature. GTFO of here you loser.

Yeah, we lose more prenatals than any country because we happend to save more than the entire world put together!! JERKOFF MORON.

When I had no money I still got treatment in the USA back in 1993. My wife had a miscarriage when I was in flight school with no insurance. TREATED. We paid them back ten bucks a month. That is OVER now. Will NEVER happen again. You and your golden boy just wrecked it to CONTROL all of us. Well I guess I will just hope I don't get cancer....

When it all collapses you will still blame Bush. HOW ORIGINAL. MORON.

fair enough...with all this typing in caps like a uneducated imbecile you might actually be this guy:

bgec9WX21ik

[Blake]

Funny pun. Church just means "assembly". It is not what we make it with the giant pagan phallic steeples on them. Populra christianity is a joke and an embarrassment. It does not represent Christ at ALL. Give a guy a break. I have to argue with those OUTSIDE because of the stupidity of those INSIDE the faith. I can't win.

Right. the smart ones figured it out and got OUTSIDE.

I think adults should be embarrassed for believing in a fairy tale. Especially one that was handed down from zoroastrianism.

[Skull-1]

Not gonna do this anymore tonight. Gonna drink like Jesus did and enjoy the stars. Tomorrow or next week. Perhaps then I will again refute the stupidity here. The fairy tale take is right. That's what Paul called the Old Testament....

[Skull-1]

fair enough...with all this typing in caps like a uneducated imbecile you might actually be this guy:

Lmao. Not all caps! Loser! Double laugh at using A instead of AN when discussing the "uneducated". Epic fail!!! Bwahahahaha! Too rich. Total demonrat liberal.

[Leetonidas]

Not gonna do this anymore tonight. Gonna drink like Jesus did and enjoy the stars. Tomorrow or next week. Perhaps then I will again refute the stupidity here. The fairy tale take is right. That's what Paul called the Old Testament....
I swear you're batshit crazy man :lol

[Skull-1]

I swear you're batshit crazy man :lol Christ was crazy, too. I almost never speak about religion. Now leave me alone so I can get my buzz on will you? LOL

[Koolaid_Man]

Lmao. Not all caps! Loser! Double laugh at using A instead of AN when discussing the "uneducated". Epic fail!!! Bwahahahaha! Too rich. Total demonrat liberal.

I make mistakes (sometimes on purpose) I'm human...but far from uneducated like yourself......typical tea partier gets racked over a coal and try to find the one hanging chad to hang their hat on. pretty sad

[Leetonidas]

I bet Skull despises the Catholic church and all their idolatry

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

I think it's awesome the Westboro Baptists have discovered this site, tbh.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Jesus drank and had a good time. That stupidity you are showing about jerking off is false gospel nonsense....evangelist christianity with a small c....Catholicism....also known as BULLSH*T. It is NOT the Gospel of Christ. You are dealing in pop culture caricatures.... You can admire a hot woman, just don't try to steal her from her husband like that jerk in the pink tights did to Timmy. Geezus f**k, people are so screwed up in their views of everything. Conservatism, morality, freedom. We are so f***ed as a life form....

You are very un-christlike for a literalist. your deity's love apparently skipped you over as evidenced by your lack of grace.

[Skull-1]

I make mistakes (sometimes on purpose) I'm human...but far from uneducated like yourself......typical tea partier gets racked over a coal and try to find the one hanging chad to hang their hat on. pretty sad Yes.... Just like the OP who gets his short pee pee all hard over red vs purple. MORON. Listen dbag, if you are going to accuse someone of being STUPID at least get the rules of the language right FIRST. Geezus.

[Skull-1]

I bet Skull despises the Catholic church and all their idolatry Right on. I despise all idolatry. INCLUDING believing there is an eternal hell........................... That the parables in the OT are literal........... That reformation "doctrine" is superior to the DOCTRINE OF CHRIST. I DO NOT BLAME ANYONE for thinking Christianity is bullshit. The way it is presented (as opposed to what it really is) -- I THINK IT IS BULLSH*T, too. (I only sensor my language for self-protection. SH*T is just a word. There is no such thing as a "bad" word. It is a word or it is not. Period.)

[Skull-1]

I think it's awesome the Westboro Baptists have discovered this site, tbh.Really? You just said that??????????????

I think those Westboro people are detestable scum. If I could, I would beat them to a pulp with everything I have learned in 24 years of martial arts training, but not enough to kill them. Just enough to make them suffer in their blubbering nonsense so they can feel just a fraction of the pain they have inflicted on others. And after that I would burn them so nobody could even go to their graves.

I have nothing but CONTEMPT for those scumbags and their false gospel insanity. They are the Pharises that Jesus rebuked and they don't even know it... Absolute morons. Those people are the reason people hate Christ. He would "not know them." Get real.

Identifying me with them is a serious failure.

"Don't ever f*** another pilot's wife." That's pretty basic. I learned that from an atheist and it lines up pretty well with what Jesus taught. DUH.

[Skull-1]

You are very un-christlike for a literalist. your deity's love apparently skipped you over as evidenced by your lack of grace.
I am anything but a literalist and grace is MANIFOLD. That means it has MANY parts. A-HOLE. The primary of which is the POWER to OVERCOME *SIN*. It is not LICENSE to sin. Sh*thead. (And grace takes time to manifest itself. It is not an instantaneous thing.) My gawd, can anyone read these days?? WTF??? Obviously the "pastors" and "shepherds" can't. Idiots..........................

[The Reckoning]

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/1382861_539541162800258_252879299_n.jpg

[TDMVPDPOY]

why u clowns continue to read the fkn bible which changes verses/texts/words every year to over glorify this person?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I am anything but a literalist and grace is MANIFOLD. That means it has MANY parts. AS*HOLE. The primary of which is the POWER to OVERCOME *SIN*. It is not LICENSE to sin. Sh*thead. (And grace takes time to manifest itself. It is not an instantaneous thing.) My f**king gawd, can anyone read these days?? WTF??? Obviously the "pastors" and "shepherds" can't. Sonofab*tch................ Idiots..........................

Your argument about the absolute meaning of words as if they are certain speaks far different, porneia.

The state of grace is a state of being. You are far from it.

Your hubris masquerading as certainty is very unchristlike. Your need to lash out is very unchristlike. To pass judgment is not your place.

Hypocrisy goes by the name of Skull-1.

[Blake]

The fairy tale take is right. That's what Paul called the Old Testament....

Jesus didn't. Who are you going to believe?

[Proxy]

Jesus drank and had a good time. That stupidity you are showing about jerking off is false gospel nonsense....evangelist christianity with a small c....Catholicism....also known as BULLSH*T. It is NOT the Gospel of Christ. You are dealing in pop culture caricatures.... You can admire a hot woman, just don't try to steal her from her husband like that jerk in the pink tights did to Timmy. Geezus f**k, people are so screwed up in their views of everything. Conservatism, morality, freedom. We are so f***ed as a life form....

What keeps you believing in God when you know the size of the observable universe?

[DMC]

What keeps you believing in God when you know the size of the observable universe?

The conviction that a god exists (not belief) is brought on by exposure and meditation on the concept, and band-aided by apologetic exegesis and the ability to ignore contradictory evidence revealed through science. Eventually the discerning mind drifts away from the conviction, else it goes mad.

[m>s]

fair enough...with all this typing in caps like a uneducated imbecile you might actually be this guy:

bgec9WX21ik

that's a real ass dude thank you sincerely for posting that it got me pumped

DEATH TO COMMUNISTS

[m>s]

JewBenz appearance in a Christian thread

go to hell you fucking commie

[Lincoln]

JewBenz appearance in a Christian thread

go to hell you fucking commie

Sup bro

[Koolaid_Man]

that's a real ass dude thank you sincerely for posting that it got me pumped

DEATH TO COMMUNISTS

:lol he belongs in a straight jacket....so I can see how you relate...100% certifiable :lol

[Richard Simmons]

Matthew 27:28 = Scarlet
Mark 15:17 = Purple

I did have to google the references...

so one of those accounts is from a color blind man

[RichardSimmons]

so one of those accounts is from a color blind man
I got this?

[m>s]

:lol he belongs in a straight jacket....so I can see how you relate...100% certifiable :lol


it's all fun and games until SHTF and real ass dudes like myself and this guy in the militia start going around pulling kick door on known communists with the rope and duct tape...

[Koolaid_Man]

it's all fun and games until SHTF and real ass dudes like myself and this guy in the militia start going around pulling kick door on known communists with the rope and duct tape...

you and that dude bout as soft as cake....I personally believe some communism is good...

[Jesus]

why u clowns continue to read the fkn bible which changes verses/texts/words every year to over glorify this person?

People like you crack me up. I always get the last laugh.

[m>s]

you and that dude bout as soft as cake....I personally believe some communism is good...

i know you do you little son of a bitch, i see it in your shitty posts. btw winston churchill was a faggot who sucked off the biggest mass murdering psycho of all time and kissed his ass just to save his own butt...us Germans were rolling until the zionists turned the whole world against us.

[Blake]

People like you crack me up. I always get the last laugh.

http://hateandanger.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/thanks-jesus-for-this-food-de-nada.jpg?w=584

[silverblk mystix]

Hey Blake, if you are so butthurt by whatever - the church or its representatives did to you...obviously it was horrible because you are really carrying a huge torch and appear severely damaged....


then...why enroll your kid in their institution to do the same to your kid as was done to you?

Serious question and a lot more important question than the semantics you have raised in this thread.

[Blake]

Hey Blake, if you are so butthurt by whatever - the church or its representatives did to you...obviously it was horrible because you are really carrying a huge torch and appear severely damaged....


then...why enroll your kid in their institution to do the same to your kid as was done to you?

Serious question and a lot more important question than the semantics you have raised in this thread.

There's no butthurt. I just want to see our society move forward to a better place without the hatred and intolerance that christianity brings.

I put her in a private school because the discipline at public middle schools sucks. Sports participation and smaller class size are pluses.

Lesser of two evils I suppose. If she wants to go back to public school at high school, I'll leave the choice up to her.

[silverblk mystix]

There's no butthurt. I just want to see our society move forward to a better place without the hatred and intolerance that christianity brings.

I put her in a private school because the discipline at public middle schools sucks. Sports participation and smaller class size are pluses.

Lesser of two evils I suppose. If she wants to go back to public school at high school, I'll leave the choice up to her.


Fair enough.

But it begs the question - you are aware that you are attacking hatred & intolerance by using....hatred & intolerance - aren't you?

[cantthinkofanything]

Fair enough.

But it begs the question - you are aware that you are attacking hatred & intolerance by using....hatred & intolerance - aren't you?

I think putting a kid in a Christian shcool actually make them ask more questions about things and for the intelligent kids, probably even moves them away from believing in God.

[Blake]

Fair enough.

But it begs the question - you are aware that you are attacking hatred & intolerance by using....hatred & intolerance - aren't you?

Mine is a hatred and intolerance towards bigotry and close mindedness that potentially can filter down into public policy if Christian nuts have their ways.

How do you handle bigots? Do you love them or just run away?

[silverblk mystix]

Mine is a hatred and intolerance towards bigotry and close mindedness that potentially can filter down into public policy if Christian nuts have their ways.

How do you handle bigots? Do you love them or just run away?


I wouldn't even think it was my job to handle bigots - but - for the sake of argument - let's say this is what you wanted...

I would venture a guess that if I was carrying hatred and disdain for them - I probably failed before even starting.


Wouldn't you think it might be more effective - to understand them before approaching? - But maybe - even back up a little - wouldn't it be more effective to understand yourself first - before being able to understand them?

Then , maybe, approach them - once you got rid of all your upsets and all your hatred and disdain....

It does not mean that you would actually agree with them or even think any better of them - but at the very least - you would be approaching them with a clear perception of what you were trying to accomplish and you would also be more effective if you weren't just there to satisfy your emotional needs/issues/hate/disdain etc.

[cantthinkofanything]

I wouldn't even think it was my job to handle bigots - but - for the sake of argument - let's say this is what you wanted...

I would venture a guess that if I was carrying hatred and disdain for them - I probably failed before even starting.


Wouldn't you think it might be more effective - to understand them before approaching? - But maybe - even back up a little - wouldn't it be more effective to understand yourself first - before being able to understand them?

Then , maybe, approach them - once you got rid of all your upsets and all your hatred and disdain....

It does not mean that you would actually agree with them or even think any better of them - but at the very least - you would be approaching them with a clear perception of what you were trying to accomplish and you would also be more effective if you weren't just there to satisfy your emotional needs/issues/hate/disdain etc.

Really...the first step you should take is to stop sucking cocks.

[silverblk mystix]

Really...the first step you should take is to stop sucking cocks.


lol unoriginal troll is still unoriginal

[cantthinkofanything]

lol unoriginal troll is still unoriginal

oh snap...I didn't think I posted that

[Creepn]

Mine is a hatred and intolerance towards bigotry and close mindedness that potentially can filter down into public policy if Christian nuts have their ways.

How do you handle bigots? Do you love them or just run away?

Well, the pope did say to leave gays alone.

[GoodOdor]

The Skull "Breed" of christians crack me up - they hate the "church goin'" christians even more than they hate atheists or muslims:lol

If only Angel_Luv was still here...

[xmas1997]

At least Pope Francis walk's the talk, unlike some of the pseudo theologians on here.
And we all know who they are!

[Skull-1]

Your argument about the absolute meaning of words as if they are certain speaks far different, porneia.

The state of grace is a state of being. You are far from it.

Your hubris masquerading as certainty is very unchristlike. Your need to lash out is very unchristlike. To pass judgment is not your place.

Hypocrisy goes by the name of Skull-1.
You are an idiot. The certainy of the words like PORNEIA is based on their context, cross referenced in MULTIPLE parts of scripture, not just INTERNALLY within Matthew, but also the entirety of the Gospels and Epistles. And to pass judgment IS my place among believers. It is commanded. You, are a moron.

[Skull-1]

Jesus didn't. Who are you going to believe? Paul was taught everything by Jesus as direct revelation. Jesus called them "Testimony" (of Himself) and "Prophecy". AKA *NOT* LITERAL. Paul called them "Jewish Myths" and "Fables." Again, NOT LITERAL. So I will stand with Jesus not just once, but twice. As Himself in the flesh and again through Paul directly.

[DMC]

Fair enough.

But it begs the question - you are aware that you are attacking hatred & intolerance by using....hatred & intolerance - aren't you?

No it doesn't. Begging the question is circular reasoning. Blake's comment might lead you to that question, but it doesn't beg it. Stop misusing terms you don't understand.

Intolerance of the intolerant isn't the same as being the intolerant. If you had the ability to reason you'd not be poking assholes for a living.

[Skull-1]

What keeps you believing in God when you know the size of the observable universe? Because I subscribe to the Law of Entropy and thus find it rather ridiculous to think that the Universe went from disorder to order spontaneously on its own. I most certainly believe in science, I just happen to believe God invented that science. If I am wrong it won't matter any way.

[DMC]

Because I subscribe to the Law of Entropy and thus find it rather ridiculous to think that the Universe went from disorder to order spontaneously on its own. I most certainly believe in science, I just happen to believe God invented that science. If I am wrong it won't matter any way.

But you can believe God existed on it's on.

There's no order in the universe. There's only the universe. Our ability to map it doesn't make it ordered. The rest of your paragraph is just Pascal's Wager. If you're wrong, it will matter, unless you think living your life believing a lie doesn't matter.

Also, if it doesn't matter what you believe, why do you chose to believe that which makes less sense scientifically? Science isn't a belief, it's a method, a field of study. Using the tenets of science you cannot rationally conclude that a contingent being exists that fits the description of the Biblical God.

[Skull-1]

There's no butthurt. I just want to see our society move forward to a better place without the hatred and intolerance that christianity brings.

I put her in a private school because the discipline at public middle schools sucks. Sports participation and smaller class size are pluses.

Lesser of two evils I suppose. If she wants to go back to public school at high school, I'll leave the choice up to her. You are confusing evangelism with the gospel. Small c christianity is a plague. The truth of the Gospel is not what is taught in church every Sunday. Evangelists are the modern day Pharisees. They are fools.

[Skull-1]

But you can believe God existed on it's on.

There's no order in the universe. There's only the universe. Our ability to map it doesn't make it ordered.There has to be order for their to be something so advanced as a food chain or life cycle. And as the sun runs out of fuel it goes supernova and everything is gone. Order to disorder. A messy desk doesn't spontaneously clean itself up. A being has to do it.

[Skull-1]

Mine is a hatred and intolerance towards bigotry and close mindedness that potentially can filter down into public policy if Christian nuts have their ways.

How do you handle bigots? Do you love them or just run away?You don't need to worry about the "Christian nuts" you need to worry about the leftists. We have a constitution that is intended to protect liberty. That is being trampled and it isn't by Christian nuts. (Whom I have no use for either.)

[DMC]

There has to be order for their to be something so advanced as a food chain or life cycle.

Show precedence for that assertion. Where else has order and a food chain been made to exist that required order after all other measures failed?

And as the sun runs out of fuel is goes supernova and everything is gone. Order to disorder. A messy desk doesn't spontaneously clean itself up. A being has to do it.
"Gone" is a misnomer. The material that makes up the Sun has and will always exist in some shape or form. It's not gone. Even in entropy there will be near zero energy at any given point but the universal sum total energy will be the same as it was in the singularity. Energy conservation laws dictate that.

When a tree dies, it's gone after a while. Does that mean it goes from order to disorder? No. You need to define "order".

[Skull-1]

I wouldn't even think it was my job to handle bigots - but - for the sake of argument - let's say this is what you wanted...

I would venture a guess that if I was carrying hatred and disdain for them - I probably failed before even starting.


Wouldn't you think it might be more effective - to understand them before approaching? - But maybe - even back up a little - wouldn't it be more effective to understand yourself first - before being able to understand them?

Then , maybe, approach them - once you got rid of all your upsets and all your hatred and disdain....

It does not mean that you would actually agree with them or even think any better of them - but at the very least - you would be approaching them with a clear perception of what you were trying to accomplish and you would also be more effective if you weren't just there to satisfy your emotional needs/issues/hate/disdain etc.
I am not a bigot, but I will say this much: the guy isn't here to do anything but troll. I have answered his questions before in other threads. He just brings up the same stupid questions over and over and over for no purpose other than to say, "Gotcha! Look everyone!" And at some point I will grow tired of responding and he will feel he "won the argument". That's how it goes with a troll.

[Skull-1]

The Skull "Breed" of christians crack me up - they hate the "church goin'" christians even more than they hate atheists or muslims:lol

If only Angel_Luv was still here...I only have jurisdiction over those within my faith. I can't tell a Muslim, Jew, or atheist what to do because I am prohibited from it. They're God's responsibility, not mine. Those within my faith who have wrecked it (and many families) through lies, distortions, hypocrisy, and ignorance are the ones I oppose righteously. And just like was done to the prophets of old, none of them much listen to me either. So be it.

[Skull-1]

Show precedence for that assertion. Where else has order and a food chain been made to exist that required order after all other measures failed?

"Gone" is a misnomer. The material that makes up the Sun has and will always exist in some shape or form. It's not gone. Even in entropy there will be near zero energy at any given point but the universal sum total energy will be the same as it was in the singularity. Energy conservation laws dictate that.

When a tree dies, it's gone after a while. Does that mean it goes from order to disorder? No. You need to define "order".
I don't have to show precedence for that assertion. Go read a science book. THE SYSTEM IS GONE. " Matter is neither created nor destroyed." Yadda yadda yadda. I know second grade science. Order is a scale. A dead moon on one end for example, and a thriving planet with millions of species on the other. But even that microsystem decays. You can go down or up in size and find entropy. From a human body to a solar system to the universe....

[Skull-1]

At least Pope Francis walk's the talk, unlike some of the pseudo theologians on here.
And we all know who they are!
Pope Francis has about as much credibility as a Christian as Stalin.

[DMC]

I don't have to show precedence for that assertion. Go read a science book. THE SYSTEM IS GONE FOOL. " Matter is neither created nor destroyed." Yadda yadda yadda. I know second grade science.

Oh but you do. I don't need to go read a science book to know that assertions such as the one you made require a foundation.

Since you understand conservation principles, how can you say that, because the same matter and energy cover a larger spatial plane, it's in disorder? How does the proximity of matter to other matter make it more or less ordered?

Can you describe a disordered universe?

[The Reckoning]

but god said on the first day "let there be light" and since the speed of light is such an important component in matter and energy, everything was created.




MIND FUCK.

[Skull-1]

Oh but you do. I don't need to go read a science book to know that assertions such as the one you made require a foundation.

Since you understand conservation principles, how can you say that, because the same matter and energy cover a larger spatial plane, it's in disorder? How does the proximity of matter to other matter make it more or less ordered?Order and disorder start at the molecular level and go all he way up to the universe. A body. A planet. A solar system. *EVERYTHING* breaks down eventually.

I am not here to discuss science. I don't really care to get into it.

I was a sci-fi novelist for a time and delved quite deeply into the subject for a number of decades. I have friends with expertise in everything from orbital mechanics to nuclear physics. I am personal friends with men who walked on and/or orbited the moon. I know Stephen Hawking, who may or may not be considered brilliant by you. Matters not to me.

Science has never been a threat to my belief in God, but, rather, makes me laugh at anyone who thinks the Bible is a history book--while at the same time solidifying my faith in a Creator. And He didn't have to do it in any way that defies objective science. He wrote Bernoulli's Principle long before there was ever a single person alive by that name. I am content to leave it there.

[The Reckoning]

but science is god's fingerprints


and i knew Dumbledore before he was assassinated. such a travesty.

[Skull-1]

but science is god's fingerprints
My religion (the Gospel) can co-exist perfectly with science. Their religion (science) cannot seem to coexist with the Gospel. That's their issue not mine. And their choice. I DO NOT CARE.

[The Reckoning]

nothing wrong with deism tbh

[Proxy]

The conviction that a god exists (not belief) is brought on by exposure and meditation on the concept, and band-aided by apologetic exegesis and the ability to ignore contradictory evidence revealed through science. Eventually the discerning mind drifts away from the conviction, else it goes mad.

well said... looks like you've got this, so no reason for me to repeat similar sentiments in a less cultivated manner

[Skull-1]

well said... looks like you've got this, so no reason for me to repeat similar sentiments in a less cultivated mannerThere is no contradictory evidence "through science" unless you are a biblical literalist (which I am not). The Bible is NOT a science book nor a history book.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You are an idiot. The certainy of the words like PORNEIA is based on their context, cross referenced in MULTIPLE parts of scripture, not just INTERNALLY within Matthew, but also the entirety of the Gospels and Epistles. And to pass judgment IS my place among believers. It is commanded. You, are a moron.

They were written by multiple people and translated by multiple people. There is no template to crosscheck against. You can sit there and call me stupid all day long but we both know nobody buys that. OTOH, I can call you incredibly naive and people will buy that.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Paul was taught everything by Jesus as direct revelation. Jesus called them "Testimony" (of Himself) and "Prophecy". AKA *NOT* LITERAL. Paul called them "Jewish Myths" and "Fables." Again, NOT LITERAL. So I will stand with Jesus not just once, but twice. As Himself in the flesh and again through Paul directly.

Jesus was dead when Saul wrote all of his shit.

[silverblk mystix]

No it doesn't. Begging the question is circular reasoning. Blake's comment might lead you to that question, but it doesn't beg it. Stop misusing terms you don't understand.

Intolerance of the intolerant isn't the same as being the intolerant. If you had the ability to reason you'd not be poking assholes for a living.

So semantics is all you got?

Lol

Intolerance of the intolerant is most def the same fuckin thing as intolerance.

But let's go deeper than that - you don't even understand what intolerance is - and I wouldn't expect a Bigot to ever understand the true meaning of it - it is something you cannot understand.

So I won't waste my time.

[Blake]

I wouldn't even think it was my job to handle bigots - but - for the sake of argument - let's say this is what you wanted...

Of course you don't. I think you've made it clear on any number of occasions that you're a bigot yourself.



I would venture a guess that if I was carrying hatred and disdain for them - I probably failed before even starting.


Wouldn't you think it might be more effective - to understand them before approaching? - But maybe - even back up a little - wouldn't it be more effective to understand yourself first - before being able to understand them?

Then , maybe, approach them - once you got rid of all your upsets and all your hatred and disdain....

It does not mean that you would actually agree with them or even think any better of them - but at the very least - you would be approaching them with a clear perception of what you were trying to accomplish and you would also be more effective if you weren't just there to satisfy your emotional needs/issues/hate/disdain

I understand them just fine. There are three things that a number of prominent Christian leaders still try to push on political leaders:

1. All abortion is bad
2. Gays shouldn't marry
3. Creationism

I've done my homework on these three things. They all suck and keep our society from moving forward.

If you want to sit on the sidelines and allow bigotry to go on and science to be oppressed, no problem, it's your right to do so.

[Blake]

Well, the pope did say to leave gays alone.

Protestants don't

[Blake]

Paul was taught everything by Jesus as direct revelation. Jesus called them "Testimony" (of Himself) and "Prophecy". AKA *NOT* LITERAL. Paul called them "Jewish Myths" and "Fables." Again, NOT LITERAL. So I will stand with Jesus not just once, but twice. As Himself in the flesh and again through Paul directly.

wut.

Jesus made it pretty clear he believed in the OT and the OT prophecies. It's irrelevant in this case what you think Paul thinks since Jesus words trump Pauls.

[Blake]

You are confusing evangelism with the gospel. Small c christianity is a plague. The truth of the Gospel is not what is taught in church every Sunday. Evangelists are the modern day Pharisees. They are fools.

I'm not seeing anything useful coming from your brand of christianity either.

[Proxy]

There is no contradictory evidence "through science" unless you are a biblical literalist (which I am not). The Bible is NOT a science book nor a history book.

No worries. Didn't assume any of that.

doesn't make sense to add the event of an omnipotent thing existing when it falls outside the standard model (which does make it contradictory evidence). Big Bang occurred because change was needed. The catalyst for change doesn't need to be alive or conscious.

Religion is comforting to believe in though.

[silverblk mystix]

Of course you don't. I think you've made it clear on any number of occasions that you're a bigot yourself.

Think and judge to your hearts' content - it makes no difference.



I understand them just fine. There are three things that a number of prominent Christian leaders still try to push on political leaders:

1. All abortion is bad
2. Gays shouldn't marry
3. Creationism


Apparently - the only thing you seemed to understand was how to pre-judge them on what their beliefs appear to be. Which is basically looking at their surface and pre-judge them based on your programming and conditioning and likes/dislikes/preferences - and since theirs collide with yours- bingo - you have enemies!

I've done my homework on these three things. They all suck and keep our society from moving forward.

Homework? Seriously? You learned what formulas they use and concluded that your formulas were superior? Pretty much describes what every participant does in every conflict in every part of this sick society. My god is better than your god - so I will kill you - lol.

If you want to sit on the sidelines and allow bigotry to go on and science to be oppressed, no problem, it's your right to do so.



If changing the world is your destiny or your vocation in life - be my guest - but take the obstruction out of your eye before you go and make the problem worse - is all I am saying.
How can you go out to change problems you don't even understand? Or battle/fix/change/defeat people you cannot even see? All you see is your labels and pre-judgements of them and the formulas that they represent - but make no mistake - they are no worse - and just as blind as you are. If you enjoy pissing in the wind - go right ahead - because this is all you are doing by attacking what you don't understand and accusing those you do not understand and fixing a world you haven't yet really seen.

[Blake]

There has to be order for their to be something so advanced as a food chain or life cycle. And as the sun runs out of fuel is goes supernova and everything is gone. Order to disorder. A messy desk doesn't spontaneously clean itself up. A being has to do it.

Ah cool, the ol' "imagine if a print shop exploded and fell perfectly into a fully functioning set of encyclopedias! That's what evolutionists and atheists want you to believe happened!!!"

Good stuff. :tu

[xmas1997]

It is pointless to argue religion, or faith, or theology, or whatever you want to call it.
Why?
Because no one ever changes their opinions. Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one, and no one thinks theirs stink!
And also because it is just another useless exercise in trying to prove you are superior, so you can feel superior. When in actuality, we are all the same. Individually, we are different, but as a species, we are all the same.
That is why it is important to be tolerant of other people's beliefs.
And how you feel inside yourself, and what you believe to be true in your mind, is in fact, your own personal reality, it is FACT to you, even if the whole world sees things differently.
This is true no matter how many people disagree with you, or whether the facts contradict you or not.
So ........ it is what it is.
I am, That I Am.

[Blake]

If changing the world is your destiny or your vocation in life - be my guest - but take the obstruction out of your eye before you go and make the problem worse - is all I am saying.
How can you go out to change problems you don't even understand? Or battle/fix/change/defeat people you cannot even see? All you see is your labels and pre-judgements of them and the formulas that they represent - but make no mistake - they are no worse - and just as blind as you are. If you enjoy pissing in the wind - go right ahead - because this is all you are doing by attacking what you don't understand and accusing those you do not understand and fixing a world you haven't yet really seen.

nah, you don't understand me or christianity. You also have no clue what's going on in the world around you.

Don't pretend you do, hypocrite.

[Blake]

Pope Francis has about as much credibility as a Christian as Stalin.

You have even less

[Skull-1]

You have even less
Like I care what you think, troll. You are just a rabble rouser stirring things up to make a stink.

[Skull-1]

Ah cool, the ol' "imagine if a print shop exploded and fell perfectly into a fully functioning set of encyclopedias! That's what evolutionists and atheists want you to believe happened!!!"

Good stuff. :tu
In effect that's what science tells us. It just took billions of years to get there. The idiocy to think that someone as dumb as you happened purely by coincidence proves there is humor in science. It also proves a Creator.

[Blake]

I am not here to discuss science. I don't really care to get into it.

I was a sci-fi novelist for a time and delved quite deeply into the subject for a number of decades. I have friends with expertise in everything from orbital mechanics to nuclear physics. I am personal friends with men who walked on and/or orbited the moon. I know Stephen Hawking, who may or may not be considered brilliant by you. Matters not to me.

Why discuss science when you can just name drop instead?

lol "I know Stephen Hawking"

[Skull-1]

No worries. Didn't assume any of that.

doesn't make sense to add the event of an omnipotent thing existing when it falls outside the standard model (which does make it contradictory evidence). Big Bang occurred because change was needed. The catalyst for change doesn't need to be alive or conscious.

Religion is comforting to believe in though.Perhaps it doesn't need to, but I find the pure randomness of chance leading to all of this a far harder pill to swallow than a deity. That's just me. Cheerio.

[m>s]

grown men who sit around all day on spurstalk arguing about the dumbest most pointless subjects while neglecting their family duties are disgusting. it might be a little different if these were like intelligent, constructive arguments but it's always just troll baiting and snippy back and forth. your posts read like they were written like a woman dude, you and chump both have that prissy tone in your posts.

[Blake]

In effect that's what science tells us. It just took billions of years to get there. The idiocy to think that someone as dumb as you happened purely by coincidence proves there is humor in science. It also proves a Creator.

who created the creator?

Something so complex as an omnipotent creator couldn't have just suddenly appeared. It proves a creator created the creator!

[Skull-1]

Why discuss science when you can just name drop instead?

lol "I know Stephen Hawking" Have you ever asked any of these things to Hawking? I have. You infer me as ignorant and unenlightened when the opposite is indeed true.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>There is no need to discuss science and I will tell you why. The very things you will use to try and disprove God I will just reverse on you like Judo and say there is one. There is no proof either way. Thus it is faith.

Yes, even SCIENCE requires faith in the unseen and unknown, because even the tiniest photon fired through something to observe it CHANGES what we observe.

[xmas1997]

Pope Francis has about as much credibility as a Christian as Stalin.

That is merely your opinion.
Are you aware of that?
It is just as easy and credible for me to say that you have less credibility than Pope Francis, thus by your extension, less than Stalin.
Suffice it to say, it is one opinion against another.
And most probably the real Truth lies somewhere in between.
I will say this again:
Opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one. And everyone thinks theirs doesn't stink.
I Am That I Am.

[Blake]

grown men who sit around all day on spurstalk arguing about the dumbest most pointless subjects while neglecting their family duties are disgusting. it might be a little different if these were like intelligent, constructive arguments but it's always just troll baiting and snippy back and forth. your posts read like they were written like a woman dude, you and chump both have that prissy tone in your posts.

lmao family duties.

Go back to doing important things like attacking Zionists and making fun of Jews.

[Skull-1]

who created the creator?

Something so complex as an omnipotent creator couldn't have just suddenly appeared. It proves a creator created the creator!What came first, the chicken or the egg? The Creator will answer that in the next life or we will all be worm food and thus unaware.


You presume that the existence of God is limited by observable space, time, and the laws of science that we think we know. Man cannot even predict weather with any certainty yet is able to definitively say that this plane of existence is the only one? We have only just barely breached the solar system. I would say that egg needs more cooking...


I will tell you that our existence as we see it is very limited. SCIENCE and all its theoretical nonsense is extremely limiting if God is what I believe Him to be. There are certainly enough sign posts in Scripture to prove for me He exists. YMMV.

[Blake]

Have you ever asked any of these things to Hawking? I have. You infer me as ignorant and unenlightened when the opposite is indeed true. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>There is no need to discuss science and I will tell you why. The very things you will use to try and disprove God I will just reverse on you like Judo and say there is one. There is no proof either way. Thus it is faith. Yes, even SCIENCE requires faith in the unseen and unknown, because even the tiniest photon fired through something to observe it CHANGES what we observe.

I don't have to try to disprove God at all.

You're not good at this.

[silverblk mystix]

nah, you don't understand me or christianity. You also have no clue what's going on in the world around you.

Don't pretend you do, hypocrite.


This is a common symptom/example of true blindness - I see this and I just chuckle because I have been there before. I guess the only difference is that I wanted to see truth. I was prepared to have my beliefs/knowledge/conclusions/theories challenged. I was prepared to not run away when truth got too painful.

Most will never arrive - even at this - and I am still blinded - but I might have at least gotten a glimpse. Sadly - you won't even get a glimpse as long as you think you already know and others are inferior.

You would much rather hold on to your precious beliefs/education/knowledge/conclusions - because - after all - this is the only world you know - it is terrifying to think you might be wrong or partly blinded - you would much rather lash out and question my intelligence and label me with garbage judgements -

It is much, much easier to keep your eyes covered.

I understand because it is a condition of most of the planet. You want to change the world? You want to do some good?

How about understanding and seeing that the world is stricken with a serious condition called "blindness" - try to wake people up - but first you have to wake yourself up - and be questioned and ridiculed and judged - by people who "know better"

All the other garbage about politics, social evils, agendas, laws, is a waste of fuckin' time. The real enemy is sleeping programmed blind human beings who will walk/talk/breed children/work/fight/ in their sleep and go to their grave without ever waking up -

That is something that needs attention - not all this petty little political/religious and ideological differences....that is just "moving the furniture around"

In the end who gives a shit which formula was superior to other formulas? They were still formulas and nothing to do with reality.

You think you see the world and all you quarrel about is formulas and labels....

Chuckle-chuckle - the blind questioning others "sight"

[DMC]

So semantics is all you got?

Lol

Intolerance of the intolerant is most def the same fuckin thing as intolerance.

But let's go deeper than that - you don't even understand what intolerance is - and I wouldn't expect a Bigot to ever understand the true meaning of it - it is something you cannot understand.

So I won't waste my time.

You acting like misusing a term like "begging the question" is semantics = lol

So locking up someone in prison who locked up someone in their home, that's the same thing twice. Got it.

Sticking your finger up someone's ass for sexual reasons is the same as sticking your finger up someone's ass to search for contraband. Got it.

[Blake]

What came first, the chicken or the egg? The Creator will answer that in the next life

You could have copped out much sooner and saved yourself from the embarrassing name dropping.

[Skull-1]

They were written by multiple people and translated by multiple people. There is no template to crosscheck against. You can sit there and call me stupid all day long but we both know nobody buys that. OTOH, I can call you incredibly naive and people will buy that.Oh but we have thousands of codexes to cross reference and we can distill out much of the error. Not all of it, perhaps, especially the translation bias that comes up with "Marital unfaithfulness" or "sexual immorality" when that's not the word used. But there are enough failsafes in the scriptures for a spiritual man to find the truth. That's why FEW find it. God does it that way on purpose.

Rather than be offended, let me highlight your comment as it only proves what scripture teaches. And Paul said He learned everything directly from Christ through direct revelation. Jesus' physical condition is irrelevant.

[DMC]

What came first, the chicken or the egg? The Creator will answer that in the next life or we will all be worm food and thus unaware. I will tell you that our existence as we see it is very limited. SCIENCE and all its theoretical nonsense is extremely limiting if God is what I believe Him to be. There are certainly enough sign posts in Scripture to prove for me He exists. YMMV.

Mouse/Cosmored argument = invalid

[Skull-1]

Mouse/Cosmored argument = invalidYour opinion. I don't give a f... .

[Skull-1]

I don't have to try to disprove God at all.

You're not good at this.
Then what's the point? I say He exists. You say He doesn't. I use the foundation of scripture and some common sense (with science thrown in). You rely on a discipline you barely comprehend (and argue against a book you cannot understand). LMFAO. Speaking of not good at this..!!!

You are abjectly and absurdly ignorant so I would be careful with that self-righteous finger of yours. Get back to me when you have a serious question. Goodbye until then.

[silverblk mystix]

You acting like misusing a term like "begging the question" is semantics = lol

So locking up someone in prison who locked up someone in their home, that's the same thing twice. Got it.

Sticking your finger up someone's ass for sexual reasons is the same as sticking your finger up someone's ass to search for contraband. Got it.

First of all - you are a bigot who married someone who falls under the same label that you are bigoted against - so to speak.

You are pretty fuckin ridiculous to even waste any time on so I won't.

Bigot.

[Skull-1]

First of all - you are a bigot who married someone who falls under the same label that you are bigoted against - so to speak.

You are pretty fuckin ridiculous to even waste any time on so I won't.

Bigot.

[Skull-1]

So semantics is all you got?

Lol

Intolerance of the intolerant is most def the same fuckin thing as intolerance.

But let's go deeper than that - you don't even understand what intolerance is - and I wouldn't expect a Bigot to ever understand the true meaning of it - it is something you cannot understand.

So I won't waste my time. The guy is the worst of trolls. Time to just squelch his ignorance and enjoy the rest of your weekend. Cheers.

[silverblk mystix]

The guy is the worst of trolls. Time to just squelch his ignorance and enjoy the rest of your weekend. Cheers.


Good idea!

[Skull-1]

1. All abortion is bad
2. Gays shouldn't marry
3. Creationism

I've done my homework on these three things. They all suck and keep our society from moving forward.

If you want to sit on the sidelines and allow bigotry to go on and science to be oppressed, no problem, it's your right to do so.

LMFAO at the suggestion that abortion has advanced society. You would have looked good in a brown shirt. :lol


(Also, Creationism is stupid. I say that as a follower of Christ. As for gay marriage, the "Christian" hypocrisy on this issue is laughable. Christians let straight people swap spouses like socks and call it <re>marriage under the guises of mercy, grace, and redemption when Christ and Paul called it ADULTERY. Tell those supposed Christians to fix heterosexual marriage before they start going off about what gay people are doing. It was Luther's erroneous contention that the church had to follow what the State allowed regarding marriage and the church went right along with it--hello irreconcilable differences! The only proper role of the government in "marriage" is record keeping. Again, fix the Adultery Within The Church. That is a far bigger crisis than gays wanting to "marry".)

[Skull-1]

Good idea!:toast

[Skull-1]

Double post.

[DMC]

First of all - you are a bigot who married someone who falls under the same label that you are bigoted against - so to speak.

You are pretty fuckin ridiculous to even waste any time on so I won't.

Bigot.

I am sure you had no real shot at a decent rebuttal anyhow.

[Skull-1]

I am sure you had no real shot at a decent rebuttal anyhow.
He was giving your ass a good kicking, tbf.


We should move along. This thread has strayed. The OP had his question more than answered by me. Over. Done.

[Skull-1]

They were written by multiple people and translated by multiple people. There is no template to crosscheck against. You can sit there and call me stupid all day long but we both know nobody buys that. OTOH, I can call you incredibly naive and people will buy that.
The crowd is always wrong.

[Skull-1]

wut.

Jesus made it pretty clear he believed in the OT and the OT prophecies. It's irrelevant in this case what you think Paul thinks since Jesus words trump Pauls.
You are a bleeping moron. How many times do I have to quote the same scriptures before you get it?

Of course He believed in the OT prophecies. They were about HIM! Stupid blind fool. Prophecies not histories! Testimony! Not history! It is ALL about Christ.

I laid this out quite clearly before. The Son only does what He has seen the Father doing. Thus Christ spoke in parables because He saw His Father do the same. Major clue that the OT is parable. Jesus seals the deal when He addresses the scriptures directly.

Go back to the Duncan Union thread and read my posts containing the direct quotes of Christ where He explicitly calls the Scriptures (which to that time contained ONLY the Law and the Prophets): Prophecy until John came, and a TESTIMONY of Christ ("it is these that TESTIFY OF ME").

(This one slipped by me. I had to respond for those who didn't see my original reply in another thread Blake has attempted to pretend he didn't read, or is too stupid to comprehend if he did.)

[xmas1997]

Take the high road, people. Insults and accusations accomplish nothing except get you a foolish thread with your name in the title, take it from me and skull, I.e. Xmas skull feud. :lol
Although it may be somewhat more satisfactory and momentarily funny to sling insults around like so many arrows and barbs, especially when you are frustrated, it gains you nothing in the end except being regarded as foolish and shallow.
However, with that having been said, this is after all "downstairs" so ..............
Fire away! :lmao

[m>s]

lmao family duties.

Go back to doing important things like attacking Zionists and making fun of Jews.


Jews make fun of you, dipshit Goy.

It was also a Jew who sold you the idea of letting black men sleep with your wife. Lol McDonalds.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The crowd is always wrong.

More hubris. At best you are a hypocrite. If you are trying to minister the word, you are failing miserably.

And it's still multiple books written by who knows who and then translated from language to language to language. Then you have the historical situation that existed in the early church with leaders making fiefdoms out of city states and the various purges.

:lol cross-checking

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Have you ever asked any of these things to Hawking? I have. You infer me as ignorant and unenlightened when the opposite is indeed true.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>There is no need to discuss science and I will tell you why. The very things you will use to try and disprove God I will just reverse on you like Judo and say there is one. There is no proof either way. Thus it is faith.

Yes, even SCIENCE requires faith in the unseen and unknown, because even the tiniest photon fired through something to observe it CHANGES what we observe.


Order and disorder start at the molecular level and go all he way up to the universe. A body. A planet. A solar system. *EVERYTHING* breaks down eventually.

I am not here to discuss science. I don't really care to get into it.

I was a sci-fi novelist for a time and delved quite deeply into the subject for a number of decades. I have friends with expertise in everything from orbital mechanics to nuclear physics. I am personal friends with men who walked on and/or orbited the moon. I know Stephen Hawking, who may or may not be considered brilliant by you. Matters not to me.

Science has never been a threat to my belief in God, but, rather, makes me laugh at anyone who thinks the Bible is a history book--while at the same time solidifying my faith in a Creator. And He didn't have to do it in any way that defies objective science. He wrote Bernoulli's Principle long before there was ever a single person alive by that name. I am content to leave it there.

So just curious. Does anyone believe that anger management here speaks with Newton's chair and associates with astronauts? Or that he is a science fiction author?

And name dropping like the above because you know you have no credibility is just sad.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Have you ever asked any of these things to Hawking? I have. You infer me as ignorant and unenlightened when the opposite is indeed true.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>There is no need to discuss science and I will tell you why. The very things you will use to try and disprove God I will just reverse on you like Judo and say there is one. There is no proof either way. Thus it is faith.

Yes, even SCIENCE requires faith in the unseen and unknown, because even the tiniest photon fired through something to observe it CHANGES what we observe.


Oh but we have thousands of codexes to cross reference and we can distill out much of the error. Not all of it, perhaps, especially the translation bias that comes up with "Marital unfaithfulness" or "sexual immorality" when that's not the word used. But there are enough failsafes in the scriptures for a spiritual man to find the truth. That's why FEW find it. God does it that way on purpose.

Rather than be offended, let me highlight your comment as it only proves what scripture teaches. And Paul said He learned everything directly from Christ through direct revelation. Jesus' physical condition is irrelevant.

Paul said all manner of things. Jesus was still dead.

I call bullshit on "1000's of codex." You seem very long on assertion and very short on substance. Reference me 1000's of unique 'codex' that are related by author or purported book and translator. In order for a set to verify set there has to be a direct relationship somehow. You logic is just awful consistently but that is typical in faith based belief.

And I am not offended. You are an insecure, untrustworthy individual but that is typical amongst man.

[xmas1997]

Hate to be the one to tell you but Hawking is another media tool just like Einstein was, credited for theories he got from other more intelligent minds.
Now Tesla on the other hand ..............

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Yes, even SCIENCE requires faith in the unseen and unknown, because even the tiniest photon fired through something to observe it CHANGES what we observe.

This is horseshit of a very high order.

There is a difference between observing something over and over and over again and getting an independently verifiable result and still keeping skeptical mind versus blind faith on something not verifiable because of a book that comes in all manner of forms and a litany of proselytizers that have told you that it is true.

[Buddy Mignon]

Hate to be the one to tell you but Hawking is another media tool just like Einstein was, credited for theories he got from other more intelligent minds.

Do share...

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Hate to be the one to tell you but Hawking is another media tool just like Einstein was, credited for theories he got from other more intelligent minds.

Sorry but he is a bit more than that. Science today is all a collabortive effort especially when you start looking at what Hawkings does in cosmology. While I certainly agree that there are many others that deserve a lot more credit, the blanket dismissal is weak from any viewpoint.

[Skull-1]

More hubris. At best you are a hypocrite. If you are trying to minister the word, you are failing miserably.

And it's still multiple books written by who knows who and then translated from language to language to language. Then you have the historical situation that existed in the early church with leaders making fiefdoms out of city states and the various purges.

:lol cross-checking

Hubris my ass. I am right. You are wrong. That is just a fact.

All the rest is gnat straining. There are so many failsafes within scripture that a spiritual man can find the truth if God chooses Him. For idiots like you who can't even get kindergarten right (covenant of marriage) then of course cross checking is futile. You don't even know what words you are looking for.

Scripture is solid. It is you who is shaky.

As for ministry, I say what I say. Jesus was ignored, too, so I have no shame in being mocked by idiots like you and I know that few will listen. "That which has been is that which shall be."

[Skull-1]

This is horseshit of a very high order.

There is a difference between observing something over and over and over again and getting an independently verifiable result and still keeping skeptical mind versus blind faith on something not verifiable because of a book that comes in all manner of forms and a litany of proselytizers that have told you that it is true. okay genius. Whatever you say. We still can't fully explain lift, but airplanes fly. Laughing at "science".


Science is still barely in first grade. There is so much to be known and we have managed but a fraction, yet we can dismiss God just because we can't see Him. There's a WHOLE lot we can't see. And if the same scientists who foisted global warming on us a mere three decades after global cooling..... If these are the people I am to rely on to deny God's existence. Hahahaha. No thanks.

[xmas1997]

Do share...

This is a subject that takes a great deal of time to go into, not just another thread, but many threads.
But allow me to at least point you in the proper directions so you can google them for yourself if you are truly interested.
I certainly wouldn't want to sidetrack this thread.
Check out:
Lorentz covariance and the inertia of energy
Maxwell
Voigt
Hilbert
Poincare
Minkowski
De Pretto
Ernst Mach
Lewis and Tolman
Planck
Harry Bateman
That should be enough to get you going.
I won't go into Hawking yet, too much already there to go through first.
Good luck and good reading.
Now back to our regularly scheduled program. :lol

[xmas1997]

Sorry but he is a bit more than that. Science today is all a collabortive effort especially when you start looking at what Hawkings does in cosmology. While I certainly agree that there are many others that deserve a lot more credit, the blanket dismissal is weak from any viewpoint.

I was being facetious for the sake of brevity, certainly you are correct in your assertion.
Maybe media tool was a bad selection, but I was going to say media darling.
What I should have said was media focus point.

[Skull-1]

Paul said all manner of things. Jesus was still dead.

I call bullshit on "1000's of codex." You seem very long on assertion and very short on substance. Reference me 1000's of unique 'codex' that are related by author or purported book and translator. In order for a set to verify set there has to be a direct relationship somehow. You logic is just awful consistently but that is typical in faith based belief.

And I am not offended. You are an insecure, untrustworthy individual but that is typical amongst man.

I am anything but untrustworthy. That slander/libel will cost you one day, mark my words.


Insecure? My confidence, accomplishments, and position crush that notion.


Unique was not a word I used regarding codexes, though, truth be told, they are all unique being essentially handwritten.

You can call it anything you wish. I certainly know more about this topic from any and every angle than you.

Scribes made errors but we--not you--can spot these pretty easily knowing what to look for. Go ask Dr. Leslie McFall for example. He is as good at it as anyone.

The scriptures are consistent, even with errors that are found in the TRANSLATIONS mostly (scribes erred in the copies, but again, these can be collated out, making the Byzantine Majority Text the best extant--and remarkably consistent...amazingly). It takes some effort to trace down the mistakes we see in the strays, but they are not a problem--and resolvable--at least every supposed inconsistency I have found so far.


Keep laughing, bitch. It just proves the truth of prophecy. You exist only to show me I am on the right track, nothing more.

[DMC]

He was giving your ass a good kicking, tbf.

tbf... ?? To Be Fucking?


We should move along. This thread has strayed. The OP had his question more than answered by me. Over. Done.

Riiiiiiight

[Skull-1]

tbf... ?? To Be Fucking?


RiiiiiiightTo be frank, jerk. I don't use tbh because that is default.


Right? I didn't answer his stupid question about color? Lmao. Can't read?

[DMC]

To be frank, jerk. I don't use tbh because that is default.

So you're normally honest but not normally forthright?

Your default mode when encountering intelligent resistance is to verbally lose control. Did your god teach you that?

[xmas1997]

Microcosm is echoed in macrocosm and vice versa.

[Skull-1]

So you're normally honest but not normally forthright?

Your default mode when encountering intelligent resistance is to verbally lose control. Did your god teach you that?
Frank implies less than tactful (unreserved, you stupid clown--don't act like you didn't know what it meant and twisted it any way). Idiot.

I am in complete control. Every word has a purpose.

We are done here. When you have a serious question feel free to ask. Otherwise, gfy.

[DMC]

Microcosm is echoed in macrocosm and vice versa.

So what

[Skull-1]

Microcosm is echoed in macrocosm and vice versa.
Ignore the douchebag. And Blake. And Lumnuts. They swallow a camel to strain a gnat.

[DMC]

Ignore the douchebag. And Blake. And Lumnuts. They swallow a camel to strain a gnat.

That's not how the phrase goes. It's "ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat and swallow a camel". Same as penny wise and pound foolish.

[DMC]

Frank implies less than tactful (unreserved, you stupid clown--don't act like you didn't know what it meant and twisted it any way). Idiot.

frank 1 (frhttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/abreve.gifngk)adj. frank·er, frank·est 1. Open and sincere in expression; straightforward:



I am in complete control. Every word has a purpose.

As we can all see.


We are done here. When you have a serious question feel free to ask. Otherwise, gfy.
We've been done for how many posts now?

[Skull-1]

That's not how the phrase goes. It's "ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat and swallow a camel". Same as penny wise and pound foolish.
How do you physically/biologically strain before you eat something?

Swallow the bible to constipate the color of a robe. Or constipate the color of a robe and then swallow the scriptures. (There are other verses dealing with swallowing scripture...but too deep for your feeble mind.) This is why the scriptures are veiled.

Looking at it your way...

Block out a tiny gnat through a...strainer.....and then eat a camel....with all his fleas, etc. How filthy is that? (Do not heal a man's hand on the sabbath.)

INCONSISTENCY is what He is getting at here. The Pharises were good at that.

"My spouse cheated on me, so I will forget my family, vows, love, redemption, forgiveness, reconciliation, suffering for righteousness, etc. and twist porneia to suit my ends so I can marry someone else." Gnat. Camel. Camel. Gnat.

The robe was red. No. Purple.

Or tithe all the tiny leafy plants and miss the greater things.... The metaphor here....

Forget it......... The blind cannot see.

They strain out and dismiss the scriptures that are inconvenient to them. Or strain out the "gotcha" scriptures and use those against you.

[Skull-1]

frank 1 (frhttp://img.tfd.com/hm/GIF/abreve.gifngk)adj. frank·er, frank·est 1. Open and sincere in expression; straightforward:

Frank | Define Frank at Dictionary.com
dictionary.reference.com/browse/frank?s=ts
adjective 1. direct and unreserved in speech

As in not holding back or being tactful. Douche.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Hubris my ass. I am right. You are wrong. That is just a fact.

All the rest is gnat straining. There are so many failsafes within scripture that a spiritual man can find the truth if God chooses Him. For idiots like you who can't even get kindergarten right (covenant of marriage) then of course cross checking is futile. You don't even know what words you are looking for.

Scripture is solid. It is you who is shaky.

As for ministry, I say what I say. Jesus was ignored, too, so I have no shame in being mocked by idiots like you and I know that few will listen. "That which has been is that which shall be."

I really love how you are comparing your treatment to that of Jesus. You seem to have issues submitting to the will of god. Your god according to you is yourself.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I am anything but untrustworthy. That slander/libel will cost you one day, mark my words.


Insecure? My confidence, accomplishments, and position crush that notion.


Unique was not a word I used regarding codexes, though, truth be told, they are all unique being essentially handwritten.

You can call it anything you wish. I certainly know more about this topic from any and every angle than you.

Scribes made errors but we--not you--can spot these pretty easily knowing what to look for. Go ask Dr. Leslie McFall for example. He is as good at it as anyone.

The scriptures are consistent, even with errors that are found in the TRANSLATIONS mostly (scribes erred in the copies, but again, these can be collated out, making the Byzantine Majority Text the best extant--and remarkably consistent...amazingly). It takes some effort to trace down the mistakes we see in the strays, but they are not a problem--and resolvable--at least every supposed inconsistency I have found so far.


Keep laughing, bitch. It just proves the truth of prophecy. You exist only to show me I am on the right track, nothing more.

Again, there has been a whole lot of crazy shit that has gone on in the last two thousand years. I am very happy that you have some writings from Constantinople from some period but Constantinople was not even founded until the 3rd century. The events occurred within the Jews around Jerusalem and you have texts from Roman colonists on the Black Sea 300 or more years later.

There are all manner of ancient manuscripts that differ from the biblical account and not just the codified works that you chose or even better had someone else choose for you.

[DMC]

Frank | Define Frank at Dictionary.com
dictionary.reference.com/browse/frank?s=ts
adjective 1. direct and unreserved in speech

As in not holding back or being tactful. Douche.

forth·right [adj., n. fawrth-rahyt, fohrth-; adv. fawrth-rahyt, fohrth-, fawrth-rahyt, fohrth-] Show IPA
adjective 1. going straight to the point; frank; direct; outspoken: It's sometimes difficult to be forthright and not give offense.

[Blake]

....and I am still blinded....

I figured your post about everyone being blind was irrelevant. Thanks for confirming.

[Blake]

Then what's the point? I say He exists. You say He doesn't. I use the foundation of scripture and some common sense (with science thrown in). You rely on a discipline you barely comprehend (and argue against a book you cannot understand). LMFAO. Speaking of not good at this..!!!

You are abjectly and absurdly ignorant so I would be careful with that self-righteous finger of yours. Get back to me when you have a serious question. Goodbye until then.

The OP question was serious. You dismissed it as no big deal. I think it is a big deal.

If you're too ignorant to really answer it, then why come into this thread at all

[I. Hustle]

What are your daughter's school colors? Crimson or purple?

[Blake]

LMFAO at the suggestion that abortion has advanced society. You would have looked good in a brown shirt. :lol


(Also, Creationism is stupid. I say that as a follower of Christ. As for gay marriage, the "Christian" hypocrisy on this issue is laughable. Christians let straight people swap spouses like socks and call it <re>marriage under the guises of mercy, grace, and redemption when Christ and Paul called it ADULTERY. Tell those supposed Christians to fix heterosexual marriage before they start going off about what gay people are doing. It was Luther's erroneous contention that the church had to follow what the State allowed regarding marriage and the church went right along with it--hello irreconcilable differences! The only proper role of the government in "marriage" is record keeping. Again, fix the Adultery Within The Church. That is a far bigger crisis than gays wanting to "marry".)

Adultery isn't really an issue. That's something for you to gripe about at your local church.

[Skull-1]

Adultery isn't really an issue. That's something for you to gripe about at your local church. Obviously you didn't read what adultery tuly means and results in, particularly for children. It isn't just "having an affair". It is much deeper than that. Go "study" your issues some more. :blah

[Skull-1]

The OP question was serious. You dismissed it as no big deal. I think it is a big deal.

If you're too ignorant to really answer it, then why come into this thread at allBECAUSE IT IS NOT RELEVANT. Was it a cloak or a robe? Was it purple or red? The implication is identical no matter how you mix it up. It was not a serious question at all and you dismiss the obvious answer.

[Skull-1]

forth·right

[adj., n. fawrth-rahyt, fohrth-; adv. fawrth-rahyt, fohrth-, fawrth-rahyt, fohrth-] Show IPA
adjective 1. going straight to the point; frank; direct; outspoken: It's sometimes difficult to be forthright and not give offense.Frank | Define Frank at Dictionary.com
dictionary.reference.com/browse/frank?s=ts
adjective 1. direct and unreserved in speech
I repeat, UNRESERVED IN SPEECH .

[Skull-1]

Again, there has been a whole lot of crazy shit that has gone on in the last two thousand years. I am very happy that you have some writings from Constantinople from some period but Constantinople was not even founded until the 3rd century. The events occurred within the Jews around Jerusalem and you have texts from Roman colonists on the Black Sea 300 or more years later.

There are all manner of ancient manuscripts that differ from the biblical account and not just the codified works that you chose or even better had someone else choose for you.
We have older manuscripts, but these are rife with errors. That's why the BMT is better because even comparing it to the oldest texts extant they are more accurate. The scriptures are consistent. They came out by accident to just the right number as referenced. I doubt anything that "differs" as you say would change the truth of scripture an iota. It would just be more gnats for you to strain. Nothing more.

Age is also not to ever be confused with accuracy, no matter what the manuscript. Start here and work your way out. (Quoted without permission.)
---
"The Codex Sinaiticus has been corrected by so many hands that it affords a most interesting and intricate problem to the palaeographer who wishes to disentangle the various stages by which it has reached its present condition...." (Codex Sinaiticus - New Testament volume; page xvii of the introduction).

...(T)here is a scribal problem with this codex and it is a BIG problem. Tischendorf identified four different scribes who were involved writing the original text. However, as many as ten scribes tampered with the codex throughout the centuries. Tischendorf said he "counted 14,800 alterations and corrections in Sinaiticus." Alterations, more alterations, and more alterations were made, and in fact, most of them are believed to be made in the 6th and 7th centuries. "On nearly every page of the manuscript there are corrections and revisions, done by 10 different people." Tischendorf goes on to say,

"...the New Testament...is extremely unreliable...on many occasions 10, 20, 30, 40, words are dropped...letters, words even whole sentences are frequently written twice over, or begun and immediately canceled. That gross blunder, whereby a clause is omitted because it happens to end in the same word as the clause preceding, occurs no less than 115 times in the New Testament."
---
Older is not better.

I won't even bother to go into detail how screwed up MS69 is (which is one of Erasmus' sources for the Textus Receptus and eventually the KJV).

"A 15th Century manuscript, MS 69 was not very old (it is dated between 1465-1472) at the time of Erasmus and the margin corrections pre-dated the first edition of his Greek New Testament in 1516. It is also riddled with errors. According to F. H. A. Scrivener's, An Exact Transcription of Codex Augienses (1859) there are 74 omissions of various sorts along with numerous interrupted words."

Dr. Leslie McFall has a nice website also and explains this stuff a lot better than I can. Not that you care.

[Skull-1]

What are your daughter's school colors? Crimson or purple?:lmao

[Blake]

Obviously you didn't read what adultery tuly means and results in, particularly for children. It isn't just "having an affair". It is much deeper than that. Go "study" your issues some more. :blah

Neh. There is no persecution against adulterers, and I'd think we'd agree there should be no law against adultery, so it's relevant only to you.

[Blake]

What are your daughter's school colors? Crimson or purple?

Neither.

Great question. :tu

[Blake]

BECAUSE IT IS NOT RELEVANT. Was it a cloak or a robe? Was it purple or red? The implication is identical no matter how you mix it up. It was not a serious question at all and you dismiss the obvious answer.

It's relevant because the New Testament is supposed to be flawless.

Why believe in a flawed story that was ripped off from zoroastrianism?

[Skull-1]

Neh. There is no persecution against adulterers, and I'd think we'd agree there should be no law against adultery, so it's relevant only to you.
And it is destroying families along with society. You're not very bright and never without an inane retort.

[Skull-1]

It's relevant because the New Testament is supposed to be flawless.

Why believe in a flawed story that was ripped off from zoroastrianism?It is flawless. The spiritual principle remains unchanged regardless of the color or type of cloak. These are the gnats that cause the clueless to justify rejecting the truth, just the way God intended.

I am tired of explaining this to you over and over and over. I am done.

EDIT IN: My eyes do not see colors identically. The simple fact is that one person can see a hue differently than another. This explanation is NOT necessary because the scriptural principle being conveyed doesn't care if it is purple or red. I have seen a GREEN airplane look blue from one angle and in certain cloud or sun conditions. Blue can look purple. Red can seem orange, so can tan. IT STILL DOES NOT MATTER.


A friend of mine was kind enough to compile a little something and I thought I would share it for the openminded (that means Blake and Lumnuts aren't included in my target audience--feeble minds cannot grasp even the most basic premise so I am done dealing with them).

---------------

"Cloak or robe?

"Does it even matter?

"I say no because the implication is the same."

Right it doesn't matter but there are all sorts of logical explanations for the "differing" colors and I don't have time or desire to read them all but here are a few they can suck on:

What it boils down to is the common issue with English translations being inadequate because the Greek words can have a much broader meaning. The same Greek word translated purple can also mean any shade from violet to crimson, or any color between blue and red.

The word kokkinos, in the Greek, is the PRIMARY COLOR OF RED.

http://www.kypros.org/cgi-bin/lexicon

PORPHYRA is not exactly purple. It's purple-red.

Tyrian purple (Greek, πορφύρα, porphyra, Latin: purpura), also known as royal purple, imperial purple or imperial dye, is a purple-red natural dye, which is extracted from sea snails, and which was possibly first produced by the ancient Phoenicians.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyrian_purple

So, basically, it's as if you, for example, were describing a car as being red; and another person, describing the same car, decided to be more specific, and described the same car, as burgundy. Here is what comes up when you do a search to see what color porphyra is:

http://www.colourlovers.com/color/B95D7B/Porphyra

Matthew's scarlet is the Greek word κοκκινην (Strong's G2847 "kokkinos"); it means scarlet, just like the English text says. But it's the purple that's the clear identifier: John's purple πορφυρουν (Strong's G4210 "porphurous") is derived from the word Mark uses for purple πορφυραν (Strong's G4209 "porphura") which doesn't just mean any old purple, it means the purple associated with the murex. Murex is a "purple" shellfish, although the dye can come out from a bright blue to a scarlet.

So "Purple" meant it came from the "purple" dye, but it's color was scarlet. That same "purple" fish also made bright (near cobalt blue) color for the phylacteries of that age.

The blue, purple and scarlet were woven together for the priestly robes (Exodus 39:1), among other things in the tabernacle. http://www.biblegateway.com/keyword/?search=scarlet&version1=49&searchtype=all&spanbegin=1&spanend=73
-------------

So there you go. Scripture is inerrant. It is the translators and the interpretations that are in error. God does this on purpose to veil the truth for His reasons.

Again, it does not matter. The spiritual principle, the point being made, doesn't care if it is red or purple. He was being mocked and denigrated. He was being called a king in a demeaning fashion. There is more to it than this but I will leave it there. IT DOES NOT MATTER WHAT COLOR IT IS, THE IMPLICATION IS IDENTICAL EVEN WITHOUT THE NUMEROUS PLAUSIBLE EXPLANATIONS FOR THE MINOR DIFFERENCE. There are far larger gnats one can choose to strain before this one, I assure you (I have addressed a few of these in the other thread).

I don't give a rat's ass about pre- or post-Constantinople or any other stupid excuses that people come up with. The Gospel, the TRUE one, not the one preached at the bogus synagogue of satan down the street from your house that corrupts the truth of God and turns it into a lie. That all of this stuff lines up and correlates so well is indeed miraculous. But the blind will never see that. Frankly I don't care. My spiritual eyes see very clearly and I am blessed to have the clarity.

[Blake]

And it is destroying families along with society. You're not very bright and never without an inane retort.

Prove that adultery is destroying society. Then propose how we stop it.

[Blake]

It is flawless.

No it's not. That's the point.

you're picking and choosing which details to listen to and which to ignore.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

We have older manuscripts, but these are rife with errors. That's why the BMT is better because even comparing it to the oldest texts extant they are more accurate. The scriptures are consistent. They came out by accident to just the right number as referenced. I doubt anything that "differs" as you say would change the truth of scripture an iota. It would just be more gnats for you to strain. Nothing more.

Age is also not to ever be confused with accuracy, no matter what the manuscript. Start here and work your way out. (Quoted without permission.)
---
"The Codex Sinaiticus has been corrected by so many hands that it affords a most interesting and intricate problem to the palaeographer who wishes to disentangle the various stages by which it has reached its present condition...." (Codex Sinaiticus - New Testament volume; page xvii of the introduction).

...(T)here is a scribal problem with this codex and it is a BIG problem. Tischendorf identified four different scribes who were involved writing the original text. However, as many as ten scribes tampered with the codex throughout the centuries. Tischendorf said he "counted 14,800 alterations and corrections in Sinaiticus." Alterations, more alterations, and more alterations were made, and in fact, most of them are believed to be made in the 6th and 7th centuries. "On nearly every page of the manuscript there are corrections and revisions, done by 10 different people." Tischendorf goes on to say,

"...the New Testament...is extremely unreliable...on many occasions 10, 20, 30, 40, words are dropped...letters, words even whole sentences are frequently written twice over, or begun and immediately canceled. That gross blunder, whereby a clause is omitted because it happens to end in the same word as the clause preceding, occurs no less than 115 times in the New Testament."
---
Older is not better.

I won't even bother to go into detail how screwed up MS69 is (which is one of Erasmus' sources for the Textus Receptus and eventually the KJV).

"A 15th Century manuscript, MS 69 was not very old (it is dated between 1465-1472) at the time of Erasmus and the margin corrections pre-dated the first edition of his Greek New Testament in 1516. It is also riddled with errors. According to F. H. A. Scrivener's, An Exact Transcription of Codex Augienses (1859) there are 74 omissions of various sorts along with numerous interrupted words."

Dr. Leslie McFall has a nice website also and explains this stuff a lot better than I can. Not that you care.

You are ignorant of the history of the early church. They are consistent post Constantinople because of councils that pick and chose which text to go by. What you refuse to -or are emotionally incapable-- acknowledge is the treatment of the Gnostic and Arian sects or those that revered Mary as a chosen of God and god knows who else. Sure the various bishops of various Mediterranean city states came up with the current incarnation but the rooted out dissent with torch and sword, more than 300 years after the events in question. But hey you have your canned 'codex.'

You now think its valid because they have been diligent in replication since that time. As I said you are incredibly naive.

[silverblk mystix]

I figured your post about everyone being blind was irrelevant. Thanks for confirming.


No surprise here. You really didn't want to change anything. You really don't want to get out of your self-imposed prison.

[Blake]

No surprise here. You really didn't want to change anything. You really don't want to get out of your self-imposed prison.

Absolutely I do.
Just because I don't want to change it your way doesn't mean I don't want to change it.

Just stay on the sidelines, blind man.

[silverblk mystix]

Absolutely I do.
Just because I don't want to change it your way doesn't mean I don't want to change it.

Just stay on the sidelines, blind man.


lol

when you can take the pebbles from my hand - grasshoppa!

[Blake]

lol

when you can take the pebbles from my hand - grasshoppa!

why would i want to take pebbles from your hand, Ray Charles?

[Skull-1]

lol

when you can take the pebbles from my hand - grasshoppa!Ignore the twits, Silver. It ain't worth it brah. Put them on ignore and move along. Don't throw pearls after swine.

[Skull-1]

You are ignorant of the history of the early church. They are consistent post Constantinople because of councils that pick and chose which text to go by. What you refuse to -or are emotionally incapable-- acknowledge is the treatment of the Gnostic and Arian sects or those that revered Mary as a chosen of God and god knows who else. Sure the various bishops of various Mediterranean city states came up with the current incarnation but the rooted out dissent with torch and sword, more than 300 years after the events in question. But hey you have your canned 'codex.'

You now think its valid because they have been diligent in replication since that time. As I said you are incredibly naive.

It doesn't matter! The oldest texts contain a ton of error independent of anything done in the councils. They are FLAWED documents! This is clear on its face just looking at them.

I have quite an intimate knowledge of the early church and the early church fathers (Martyr, Origen, Clement, Jerome, etc. etc. etc. along with their writings) in the generations immediately following Paul and the Disciples. It is rather irrelevant to the discussion of the truth of the Gospel of Christ.

The Epistles, already effectively canonized shortly after their inception in a collected format--and circulated--line up fine with the Law and Prophets as well as the Gospels. (YES YES I KNOW, PAUL WAS A CON MAN WHO HIJACKED THE FAITH AND MADE UP A FALSE GOSPEL. WE HAVE BEEN LED ASTRAY!! LMAO!) Cry in your beer about Hammadian Gnosticism, Zorostrianism, et. al. (the Gospel of John is considered Gnostic so there's that...don't recall offhand anything Earth-stopping about the Arian sects but I guess I can refresh my memory later). Strain away bubba. Don't blow out an o-ring.


The OT is parable and prophecy that Christ and Paul embraced. Whether or not some gnostic queen saved Noah in the flood is rather irrelevant as it never happened any way. It is a parable and a prophecy of Christ. Would such a detail change the spiritual aspect of what is presented? I rather doubt it.


(You will never be convinced, and I clearly do not have any further interest in wasting my time on you with things I settled within myself twenty years ago and have brushed aside in the pursuit of other knowledge. I have heard it all. Read it all. I am perfectly satisfied with my position, and know for a fact you will not reveal anything to me I haven't already seen.)


This discussion is over. The OP has been corrected numerous times on his error and obstinance but refuses to listen. Therefore I bid this thread adieu.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I have quite an intimate knowledge of the early church and the early church fathers (Martyr, Origen, Clement, Jerome, etc. etc. etc. along with their writings) in the generations immediately following Paul and the Disciples. It is rather irrelevant to the discussion of the truth of the Gospel of Christ. The Epistles, already fairly canonized shortly after their inception in a collected format and circulated, line up fine with the Law and Prophets as well as the Gospels. (YES YES I KNOW, PAUL WAS A CON MAN WHO HIJACKED THE FAITH AND MADE UP A FALSE GOSPEL. WE HAVE BEEN LED ASTRAY!! LMAO!) Cry in your beer about Hammadian Gnosticism et. al. (the Gospel of John is considered Gnostic so there's that...don't recall offhand anything Earth-stopping about the Arian sects but I guess I can refresh my memory later). Strain away bubba. Don't blow out an o-ring.

(You will never be convinced, and I clearly do not have any further interest in wasting my time on you with things I settled within myself twenty years ago. I have heard it all. Read it all. I am perfectly satisfied with my position, and know for a fact you will not reveal anything to me I haven't already seen. This discussion is over. The OP has been corrected numerous times on his error but refuses to listen. Therefore I bid this thread adieu.)

:lol more name dropping without an iota of logic, reasoning, or proof.

Christianity has all manner of gnostic tenants but that is besides the point. You bid the thread adieu from an intellectual standpoint a long time ago. You keep throwing shit against the wall but have yet to make a case or even really a point. I'm not giving you the canned Paul is really Saul argument but you trot that out anyway. You go by the name popular technology as well?

I am not here to convince you. I am here to explain why I think you are wrong. There is a difference. The difference is that while I consider you part of my audience, you are not my audience. What you claim to know is irrelevant as are the names you drop and the like assertion that you spew instead of argument. If you could give me verifiable proof on God I would be convinced. You are convinced regardless of proof so there is no swaying you. Look at the view counts on this thread. That is my audience.

So far you are a science fiction author who is friends with Newton's chair and astronauts. When I call you on it you threaten with 'you will pay one day.' Your smarmy 'I know something you can never know' attitude is the same thing you find in Scientology 'clinics.' You even behave like Hoffman in the master does when he is questioned about his 'religion.' Your megalomania even extends to comparing your treatment to that of your god. Lies intended to generate credibility and authority poor out of you like shit from a horse. You absolutely reek of an axis-1 disorder.

Troll or not I like what you are doing here. You do a very good job of underscoring just how asinine and unfounded your position is.

[Skull-1]

That wasn't a threat. It was a promise. Cursing God's messengers comes with a price. I am not the one who cashes that check, therefore I am incapable of threatening anyone. And the scripture tells me that I must suffer like my Master to be His disciple. That is about as close to comparing myself to Jesus as I will get. I will leave it there. You obviously failed reading comprehension so it is futile to explain what that means. Whoosh. Right over your thick head is where it would go.

As for the rest, I don't have to prove God. He already did that. You believe what you wish, but your straw men don't alter my faith a bit. You have your god and I have mine.

Prove there is no God. You can't.

I have shredded you and your supposed arguments to bits. You just dismiss the point with weak insults, unfounded smears, and false characterizations. So be it. I do not care what some anonymous internet toughguy douchebag thinks. I truly don't.

See you in the Judgment (or not). It will be what it will be.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

This discussion is over. The OP has been corrected numerous times on his error and obstinance but refuses to listen. Therefore I bid this thread adieu.

Lack of self control noted.

You cannot prove a negative with an open ended or infinite set. You don't demonstrate anything with the 'prove he doesn't exist' blather.

I have never even contended that there is not a god anyway. Try and keep up.

Claiming that you have shredded my argument does not make it any more true than your name dropping. If you would like some help on how to form and present an argument then I will be more than happy to help. Here are some hints as to what arguments are not:

1) I know X and X is an expert.
2) X could explain it so go here.
3) I know X, Y, Z, A, B, and C. --no one gives a shit what you know. what matters is how it applies to the discussion at hand.--
4) I shredded X.

[Blake]

Ignore the twits, Silver. It ain't worth it brah. Put them on ignore and move along. Don't throw pearls after swine.

lol 72 posts in this thread

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I have shredded you and your supposed arguments to bits. You just dismiss the point with weak insults, unfounded smears, and false characterizations. So be it. I do not care what some anonymous internet toughguy douchebag thinks. I truly don't.

See you in the Judgment (or not). It will be what it will be.

What's unfounded is claiming to know Hawking and astronauts. Your response to my discussion of the time interval of the various councils and the events at hand were 'cry about it if you want' and 'I know x, Y, and Z.' At no point did you provide an reasoning or logic.


And my basis for an axis 1 disorder is compulsive lying to generate authority. An inability to see other's viewpoints. Harboring thoughts of an eventual demise of other's. And the self-assured smuugness that you hide behind in place of reason. It's typical. Your type stands out like a leper.


React to criticism with rage, shame, or humiliation
Take advantage of other people to achieve his or her own goals
Have excessive feelings of self-importance
Exaggerate achievements and talents
Be preoccupied with fantasies of success, power, beauty, intelligence, or ideal love
Have unreasonable expectations of favorable treatment
Need constant attention and admiration
Disregard the feelings of others, and have little ability to feel empathy
Have obsessive self-interest
Pursue mainly selfish goals

These are some of the traits I am talking about. Would you like to discuss specifically how they apply?

[Skull-1]

Lack of self control noted.

You cannot prove a negative with an open ended or infinite set. You don't demonstrate anything with the 'prove he doesn't exist' blather.

I have never even contended that there is not a god anyway. Try and keep up.

Claiming that you have shredded my argument does not make it any more true than your name dropping. If you would like some help on how to form and present an argument then I will be more than happy to help. Here are some hints as to what arguments are not:

1) I know X and X is an expert.
2) X could explain it so go here.
3) I know X, Y, Z, A, B, and C. --no one gives a shit what you know. what matters is how it applies to the discussion at hand.--
4) I shredded X.


Obviously missed the rhetorical statement/challenge. The question to the crowd. YOU keep up, clown.

1) I know what I know and know people who know it better than I do....and since I know it better than you do....so do they. Some I learned from them directly. My background, like the commandment, is exceedingly broad.

2) I don't care to waste my time explaining it so here are some resources to help you teach yourself. I have better things to do than waste time on the insincere.

3) I am not discussing it. I am telling you what I know which leads back to 1 so learn and catch up. Until then stfu.

4) I shredded you and Blake more than once and pointed to plenty of places you can fix your error. I don't care to waste my time on those who can't hear or see. If I thought you were sincere, I would perhaps engage. But I have better uses for my time as things stand.

The OP got his answer and rejected it. The rest is static.

[Skull-1]

What's unfounded is claiming to know Hawking and astronauts. Your response to my discussion of the time interval of the various councils and the events at hand were 'cry about it if you want' and 'I know x, Y, and Z.' At no point did you provide an reasoning or logic.


And my basis for an axis 1 disorder is compulsive lying to generate authority. An inability to see other's viewpoints. Harboring thoughts of an eventual demise of other's. And the self-assured smuugness that you hide behind in place of reason. It's typical. Your type stands out like a leper.



These are some of the traits I am talking about. Would you like to discuss specifically how they apply?


I explained that. The time interval isn't relevant because of many factors that long predate said councils. Study it yourself. I am not getting into it. I researched it extensively over many many years and am satisfied that it does not change anything regarding the Gospel unless you believe such conspiracies as "Paul hijacked the faith" and other such...

My authority comes from the scripture and my insight into it. It is not my doing and, simply, you are likely outside my authority. I am sure Blake is outside it.

I see other viewpoints--I have held quite a few of them indeed in my lifetime as my views have evolved--but when they are wrong I reject them.

Call it fatigue. I have battled people like you for decades. Insincere, lying, rabble rousing little sh--s who stir up needless controversies for kicks. Perhaps if I believed you were sincere the engagement would take a different form. But it seems evident you aren't and so I have no desire to waste hour upon hour explaining my position. Research it yourself.

Also, to be frank, subjects I mastered long ago have atrophied from disuse. I would rather focus on my current disciplines than in reinvigorating those I have moved beyond long ago. With age comes a lack of energy. I must conserve mine.

I am concerned with enforcing my faith. Those outside are not my concern or responsibility.

The robe is red or purple. Doesn't matter.

The principle is neither concerned with nor altered by color.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Obviously missed the rhetorical question. The question to the crowd. YOU keep up, clown.

1) I know what I know and know people who know it better than I do....and since I know it better than you do....so do they. Some I learned from them directly. My background, like the commandment, is exceedingly broad.

2) I don't care to waste my time explaining it so here are some resources to help you teach yourself. I have better things to do than waste time on the insincere.

3) I am not discussing it. I am telling you what I know which leads back to 1 so learn and catch up. Until then stfu.

4) I shredded you and Blake more than once and pointed to plenty of places you can fix your error. I don't care to waste my time on those who can't hear or see. If I thought you were sincere, I would perhaps engage. But I have better uses for my time as things stand.

The OP got his answer and rejected it. The rest is static.


React to criticism with rage, shame, or humiliation

check. the constant mindless jibes speak for themselves. It's reflexive. Your need to invoke others for authority speaks to lack of self confidence.


Take advantage of other people to achieve his or her own goals

Cannot really comment on this beyond the name dropping. Time has been short and no one is going to position themselves to be used by a weirdo such as yourself.


Have excessive feelings of self-importance

goes with


Exaggerate achievements and talents

I know that you claim to be an expert on everything possible and know everyone important in your litany of bullshit but it is what it is.


Be preoccupied with fantasies of success, power, beauty, intelligence, or ideal love

You are god's chosen one and made to suffer as does jesus. your need to conflate yourself with your deity has already been noted.


Have unreasonable expectations of favorable treatment

You suffer as has jesus you've told us.


Need constant attention and admiration

While it is clear you have no interest in admiration you do seem unable to stop yourself from responding to attention.


Disregard the feelings of others, and have little ability to feel empathy

You have straight out told us that you don't care what we have to say. That you know what you know and that your authority is unquestionable. You begin to see how these things inteerrelate. You 'suffer' others.


Have obsessive self-interest

For all of your talk on God there is a whole lot of you talking about what and who you know. About how you are going to judged come the rapture etc. What can your god do for you seems to be your motto. YOUR SPECIAL!


Pursue mainly selfish goals

I have no idea what you are trying to accomplish so I cannot speak to this.

[ismael-robert]

Skull I really wish you would conduct yourself differently...yes I know Jesus was harsh at time with the Pharisees and God was at times too but seriously bro nobody is going to listen to your knowledge the way you come across. Have you lead anyone to Christ this way? I am impressed with your knowledge, even though I don't always agree with you, but sometimes reading what you say is difficult due to the amount of harshness, not the level of which you write. I really wish you came across differently because then people might actually be led to Christ through you...by not only your knowledge but because you can express it with some semblance that you care about their eternal destinies. I, like God, wish for no one to perish. When I was converted I developed an unexplainable concern and caring for those I've never even met before. If anyone wants a real discussion without getting into meaningless details I'd love to have one...I may not know as much as Skull but think you'll find me easier to talk to...but the heart behind the discussion is important...the veil that skull references is that yall read the Bible...or websites referencing it...with a critical spirit just seeking to find contradictions or errors....if you sought out sources from a Christian website/perspective which show that Bible is error and contradiction free and you are reading because you are actually seeking to find God and purpose to life then you might actually find that ah ha moment and we might be able to have a real discussion.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I explained that. The time interval isn't relevant because of many factors that long predate said councils. Study it yourself. I am not getting into it. I researched it extensively over many many years and am satisfied that it does not change anything regarding the Gospel unless you believe such conspiracies as "Paul hijacked the faith" and other such...

Bullshit. I see you doing a lot of claiming that arguments have been made or that facts are known and very little in the way of arguments being made of facts being explained.

Now you talk of 'fatigue.' All you seem to be are cop outs and bullshit. If you want to believe what you want to believe its a free country but this type of shit is just stupid.

Over 3 centuries pass between Jesus death and your chosen texts. That is not irrelevant just because you say so.

[mouse]

you lost me at Blake

[ismael-robert]

Again not as technical as skull but here's some quick info...especially show that writings have been found less than 3 centuries separated:IS THE BIBLE RELIABLE?- Superior to any other Ancient Writing
The Bible is a historical document. Interestingly enough, if you subject it to the same tests that you subject other historical documents to, you’ll discover that the Bible proves itself to be far superior to any other ancient writing.

IS THE BIBLE RELIABLE?- The New Testament
First, let’s look at the New Testament which, incidentally, was originally written in the Greek language between 50 and 100 A.D. Although we don’t have the original autographs, there are presently some 5,000 Greek manuscripts in existence, with as many as 25,000 more copies. Just as amazing is the fact that the earliest manuscripts can be dated back as far as 120 A.D. This is tremendous when you consider that only seven of Plato’s manuscripts are in existence today — and there’s a 1,300-year gap which separates the earliest copy from the original writing!

IS THE BIBLE RELIABLE?- Unaltered!
Equally amazing is another fact; and that is, that the New Testament has been virtually unaltered. This has been demonstrated by scholars who have compared the earliest written manuscripts with manuscripts written centuries later. And remember, the accounts in the New Testament were recorded directly by eyewitnesses, (or by those who were associated with them) and in fact had close contact with the events themselves.

IS THE BIBLE RELIABLE?- The Old Testament
But what about the Old Testament? Let’s take a quick look at one of the most incredible finds of the century — the Dead Sea Scrolls. With the discovery of these manuscripts at Qumran in 1946, texts were found that were about 1,000 years older than any previously-known Old Testament manuscript. And when compared with the later texts, these writings proved to be virtually identical.

IS THE BIBLE RELIABLE?- Archaeology Verifies Scripture’s Trustworthiness
With every turn of the archaeologist’s spade, we see further evidence of Scripture’s trustworthiness. Such renowned and historical scholars as William Albright and Sir Frederick Kenyon have clearly testified that the findings of archaeology have served to underscore the authenticity of the Bible.

[ismael-robert]

If I'm not mistaken my limited research showed the Bible has more historical manuscripts written closer to the time the events actually happened than writings on Cesar, Homers writings and a few others that nobody takes up issue with...so basically if you throw out Bible's reliability there's many other historical writings we're going to have to toss out...here's another little blurb on the differences in the historical writings...you'll see the differences are not things that are significant enough to lose the actual meanings or disregard the book as a whole: In fact, interestingly enough when the Dead Sea Scrolls were discovered at Qumran, they predated the earliest extant text — the Masoretic text by almost one thousand years — yet in spite of this vast span of time, there was no substantive difference at all…..In fact, in looking at Isaiah 53 there were only 17 changes between the Masoretic text and those found at Qumran — 10 involved spelling, 4 style and 3 involved the Hebrew letters for the word light in verse 11. However, none of these differences were substantive — God has indeed preserved His Word

[Skull-1]

Skull I really wish you would conduct yourself differently...yes I know Jesus was harsh at time with the Pharisees and God was at times too but seriously bro nobody is going to listen to your knowledge the way you come across. Have you lead anyone to Christ this way?


I am impressed with your knowledge, even though I don't always agree with you, but sometimes reading what you say is difficult due to the amount of harshness, not the level of which you write. I really wish you came across differently because then people might actually be led to Christ through you...by not only your knowledge but because you can express it with some semblance that you care about their eternal destinies.

I, like God, wish for no one to perish. When I was converted I developed an unexplainable concern and caring for those I've never even met before.

If anyone wants a real discussion without getting into meaningless details I'd love to have one...I may not know as much as Skull but think you'll find me easier to talk to...but the heart behind the discussion is important...the veil that skull references is that yall read the Bible...or websites referencing it...with a critical spirit just seeking to find contradictions or errors....if you sought out sources from a Christian website/perspective which show that Bible is error and contradiction free and you are reading because you are actually seeking to find God and purpose to life then you might actually find that ah ha moment and we might be able to have a real discussion.

I lead a few. Very few. I tried the kind and patient route and it had the same abysmal success rate. I throw out the answers and the occasional person in the pile reaches out. I work with them in love and patience and a few have their eyes opened. The rest fall by the wayside.

You might be one of the few who stays the course. Maybe....

But it is painful. Irritating. Difficult. Idols indoctrinated since childhood have to be exposed and dismissed. Pulling out the tares is NOT FUN for anyone involved, but it is important.

Fuzzynuts and Flake are moronic douchebags. They don't desire the truth and I don't desire to waste my time on them.

They're not my problem.

All with a sincere desire to learn shall find me patient and kind. The rest will get the sword. I have an accurate Bullsh-t detector which is why lumpyfuzznuts and flake got skewered quickly. I persisted longer than I should for the sake of those reading. Perhaps someone will be led to truth by my persistence.

Those with ears let them hear.

[The Reckoning]

it's funny because if you used half the time you spend scrutinizing over details embodied in a cult document about a man who has no historical evidence of existing outside of religious institution in order to better yourself as a person, you'd realize that arguing on the internet is not the way to live the fulfilling life that the very document preaches.


Luke 18:9-14

[The Reckoning]

/thread


and yes Jesus still says OP is a faggot

[mouse]

about a man who has no historical evidence of existing .

You may hate the Bible trumpeters and not believe in a God it's your right, but keep in mind many Scientists and well respected Historians over the years admit the Bible is an still a credible source of records from the past.

[Skull-1]

it's funny because if you used half the time you spend scrutinizing over details embodied in a cult document about a man who has no historical evidence of existing outside of religious institution in order to better yourself as a person, you'd realize that arguing on the internet is not the way to live the fulfilling life that the very document preaches.


Luke 18:9-14





You miss the point of the parable. But a nice try. At least you made the effort which I applaud.


Exalting of self (which I do not do, crazy as that sounds to some) has quite a precise definition, but, again....the meaning of the parable is veiled.

Fulfilling life....that's suffering. Not prospering. Fulfillment is not what the world believes it to be.

I believe Jesus is referenced in non-biblical records but it has been awhile. History has been fairly consistent in its belief and consensus that He was indeed a real figure. The notion that He was not real as a person is not very widely held among secular historians so.....

[ismael-robert]

Non-biblical accounts of New Testament events and/or people





Following is a list of extra-biblical (outside of the Bible) references of biblical events, places, etc. The list is not exhaustive but is very representative of what is available.
1.Flavius Josephus (AD 37?-101?, a Jewish historian) mentions John the Baptist and Herod - Antiquities, Book 18, ch. 5, par. 2A."Now some of the Jews thought that the destruction of Herod's army came from God, and that very justly, as a punishment of what he did against John, that was called the Baptist: for Herod slew him, who was a good man, and commanded the Jews to exercise virtue, both as to righteousness towards one another, and piety towards God, and so to come to baptism; for that the washing [with water] would be acceptable to him, if they made use of it, not in order to the putting away [or the remission] of some sins [only], but for the purification of the body; supposing still that the soul was thoroughly purified beforehand by righteousness."

2.Flavius Josephus (AD 37?-101?) mentions Jesus - Antiquities, Book 18, ch. 3, par. 3.A.Now there was about this time Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man; for he was a doer of wonderful works, a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews and many of the Gentiles. He was [the] Christ. And when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, (9) those that loved him at the first did not forsake him; for he appeared to them alive again the third day; (10) as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him. And the tribe of Christians, so named from him, are not extinct at this day.i.There is debate among scholars as to the authenticity of this quote since it is so favorable to Jesus. For more information on this, please see Regarding the quotes from the historian Josephus about Jesus


3.Flavius Josephus (AD 37?-101?) mentions James, the brother of Jesus - Antiquities, Book 20, ch. 9.A."Festus was now dead, and Albinus was but upon the road; so he assembled the sanhedrim of judges, and brought before them the brother of Jesus, who was called Christ, whose name was James, and some others, [or, some of his companions]; and when he had formed an accusation against them as breakers of the law, he delivered them to be stoned: but as for those who seemed the most equitable of the citizens, and such as were the most uneasy at the breach of the laws, they disliked what was done."

4.Flavius Josephus (AD 37?-101?) mentions Ananias the High Priest who was mentioned in Acts 23:2A.Now as soon as Albinus was come to the city of Jerusalem, he used all his endeavors and care that the country might be kept in peace, and this by destroying many of the Sicarii. But as for the high priest, Ananias (25) he increased in glory every day, and this to a great degree, and had obtained the favor and esteem of the citizens in a signal manner; for he was a great hoarder up of money
B.Acts 23:2, "And the high priest Ananias commanded those standing beside him to strike him [Paul] on the mouth."

5.Tacitus (A.D. c.55-A.D. c.117, Roman historian) mentions "Christus" who is Jesus - Annals 15.44A."Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular."i.Ref. from http://classics.mit.edu/Tacitus/annals.mb.txt


6.Thallus (Circa AD 52, eclipse of the sun) Thallus wrote a history of the Eastern Mediterranean world from the Trojan War to his own time. His writings are only found as citations by others. Julius Africanus, who wrote about AD 221, mentioned Thallus' account of an eclipse of the sun.A."On the whole world there pressed a most fearful darkness; and the rocks were rent by an earthquake, and many places in Judea and other districts were thrown down. This darkness Thallus, in the third book of his History, calls, as appears to me without reason, an eclipse of the sun."i.Is this a reference to the eclipse at the crucifixion? Luke 23:44-45, "And it was now about the sixth hour, and darkness fell over the whole land until the ninth hour, 45 the sun being obscured; and the veil of the temple was torn in two."
ii.The oddity is that Jesus' crucifixion occurred at the Passover which was a full moon. It is not possible for a solar eclipse to occur at a full moon. Note that Julius Africanus draws the conclusion that Thallus' mentioning of the eclipse was describing the one at Jesus' crucifixion. It may not have been.
iii.Julius Africanus, Extant Writings, XVIII in the Ante Nicene Fathers, ed. by Alexander Roberts and James Donaldson (Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1973), vol. VI, p. 130. as cited in Habermas, Gary R., The Historical Jesus: Ancient Evidence for the Life of Christ, (Joplin, MO: College Press Publishing Company) 1996.


7.Pliny the Younger mentioned Christ. Pliny was governor of Bithynia in Asia Minor. Pliny wrote ten books. The tenth around AD 112.A."They (the Christians) were in the habit of meeting on a certain fixed day before it was light, when they sang in alternate verses a hymn to Christ, as to a god, and bound themselves by a solemn oath, not to any wicked deeds, but never to commit any fraud, theft or adultery, never to falsify their word, nor deny a trust when they should be called upon to deliver it up; after which it was their custom to separate, and then reassemble to partake of food but food of an ordinary and innocent kind."i.Pliny, Letters, transl. by William Melmoth, rev. by W.M.L. Hutchinson (Cambridge: Harvard Univ. Press, 1935), vol. II, X:96 as cited in Habermas, Gary R., The Historical Jesus: Ancient Evidence for the Life of Christ, (Joplin, MO: College Press Publishing Company) 1996.


8.The TalmudA."On the eve of the Passover Yeshu was hanged. For forty days before the execution took place, a herald went forth and cried, "He is going forth to be stoned because he has practiced sorcery and enticed Israel to apostasy. Any one who can say anything in his favor, let him come forward and plead on his behalf." But since nothing was brought forward in his favor he was hanged on the eve of the Passover!"i.Gal. 3:13, "Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree."
ii.Luke 22:1-2, "Now the Feast of Unleavened Bread, which is called the Passover, was approaching. 2And the chief priests and the scribes were seeking how they might put Him to death; for they were afraid of the people."
iii.This quotation was taken from the reading in The Babylonian Talmud, transl. by I. Epstein (London: Soncino, 1935), vol. III, Sanhedrin 43a, p. 281 as cited in Habermas, Gary R., The Historical Jesus: Ancient Evidence for the Life of Christ, (Joplin, MO: College Press Publishing Company) 1996.


9.Lucian (circa 120-after 180) mentions Jesus. Greek writer and rhetorician.A."The Christians, you know, worship a man to this day the distinguished personage who introduced their novel rites, and was crucified on that account. . . . You see, these misguided creatures start with the general conviction that they are immortal for all time, which explains the contempt of death and voluntary self-devotion which are so common among them; and then it was impressed on them by their original lawgiver that they are all brothers, from the moment that they are converted, and deny the gods of Greece, and worship the crucified sage, and live after his laws. All this they take quite on faith, with the result that they despise all worldly goods alike, regarding them merely as common property."i.Lucian, The Death of Peregrine, 1113, in The Works of Lucian of Samosata, transl. by H.W. Fowler and F.G. Fowler, 4 vols. (Oxford: Clarendon, 1949), vol. 4, as cited in Habermas, Gary R., The Historical Jesus: Ancient Evidence for the Life of Christ, (Joplin, MO: College Press Publishing Company) 1996.
ii.Though Lucian opposed Christianity, he acknowledges Jesus, that Jesus was crucified, that Christians worship him, and that this was done by faith.

[The Reckoning]

You miss the point of the parable. But a nice try. At least you made the effort which I applaud.


Exalting of self (which I do not do, crazy as that sounds to some) has quite a precise definition, but, again....the meaning of the parable is veiled.


because the 'correct' point of the parable is only correct in how you interpret it? you're exalting yourself by believing that only you have a connection to the word because you're so righteous. get over your holier than thou attitude, and maybe people will take you seriously.

[ismael-robert]

I humble myself to the point that I'm doing God's will and not my own...and that's to spread the Gospel...and let me tell you it has been more fulfilling than the life of sin I was living before

[The Reckoning]

i do find it interesting that there are no roman records, although the romans were very scrupulous record keepers, of Jesus. however, there are several of his pals. very very interesting.

[The Reckoning]

You may hate the Bible trumpeters and not believe in a God it's your right, but keep in mind many Scientists and well respected Historians over the years admit the Bible is an still a credible source of records from the past.


yes it is, and there have been many instances, particularly from the old testament that verify historical accuracies. it's an awesome document. the greatest book ever written and has shaped the very foundation of western society. however, sometimes it's better to take things as they're worth and not make connections that have yet to be proven.

[Blake]

you lost me at Blake

Saved yourself the trouble of getting lost later. :tu

[mouse]

however, sometimes it's better to take things as they're worth and not make connections that have yet to be proven.

Like the Science books do today?

[The Reckoning]

I humble myself to the point that I'm doing God's will and not my own...and that's to spread the Gospel...and let me tell you it has been more fulfilling than the life of sin I was living before


that's awesome and i'm happy you lead a life that makes you happy without doing harm to yourself and others.


the basic rule of interpretation is you need to know your constituents. the bible is a source of data that is meant to be interpreted and reinterpreted. yet its interpretation is only valuable to those who are looking for it. self exaltation on the internet is wasting time that some in here could be using on leading by example in person.

[mouse]

Saved yourself the trouble of getting lost later. :tu

Translation: I have yet to win a debate with mouse so I would toss in the towel now if I was you.

[Blake]

/thread


and yes Jesus still says OP is a faggot

Jesus wants to come inside you.

[Skull-1]

because the 'correct' point of the parable is only correct in how you interpret it? you're exalting yourself by believing that only you have a connection to the word because you're so righteous. get over your holier than thou attitude, and maybe people will take you seriously.

I am not the only one who knows the meaning (indeed I did not even myself claim to have it--you presumed it). I will state with certainty, however, that the meaning is veiled. That your implied definition of self-exaltation IS flawed, however, shows you don't know the meaning at all.

[ismael-robert]

You did see my extra-biblical evidence above too right

[Skull-1]

Translation: I have yet to win a debate with mouse so I would toss in the towel now if I was you.
Has flake ever won a debate? My sources say no.

[Blake]

Has he ever won a debate? My sources say no.

lol sources.

Did SBM send you a "hey bro" private message?

[mouse]

Jesus wants to come inside you.

You see why I learned years ago to refuse myself to lower the IQ bar when trying to debating Blake.

I would hope many would do the same but I can see from the numerous pages of this topic many of you share the same IQ as him so its business as usual here in the Club.

[Skull-1]

yes it is, and there have been many instances, particularly from the old testament that verify historical accuracies. it's an awesome document. the greatest book ever written and has shaped the very foundation of western society. however, sometimes it's better to take things as they're worth and not make connections that have yet to be proven.


Let us look back at a small town of 300 people 2000 years hence and see how much of the record exists.

Not exactly show stopping.

[Skull-1]

You see why I learned years ago to refuse myself to lower the IQ bar when trying to debating Blake.

I would hope many would do the same but I can see from the pages many share the same IQ. Associating fake with a debate compliments the little turd far too much. He doesn't debate. He sh-ts out his mouth.

[The Reckoning]

You did see my extra-biblical evidence above too right


yes and they all occurred after Jesus supposedly died. i'm looking for primary data during his lifetime. these guys were playing the telephone game back then - they wrote down whatever news they heard years after the fact.


anyway, im done here. Blake is starting with his sexual innuendos again.

[Blake]

Fuzzynuts and Flake are moronic douchebags. They don't desire the truth and I don't desire to waste my time on them.

how Christ like of you.



All with a sincere desire to learn shall find me patient and kind. The rest will get the sword. I have an accurate Bullsh-t detector which is why lumpyfuzznuts and flake got skewered quickly. I persisted longer than I should for the sake of those reading. Perhaps someone will be led to truth by my persistence.

Those with ears let them hear.

All anyone hears is butthurt and name calling.

What a spiritual weakling you are. I guarantee nobody finds you to be a credible Christian.

[mouse]

Has flake ever won a debate? My sources say no.

What do you consider a winner?

The person with the most meth who just happens to stay up late enough to be the last person to reply to a topic hes in , or the first person who finally realizes hes wasting his valuable time and research replying to an immature person online?

[mouse]

. Associating fake with a debate compliments the little turd far too much. He doesn't debate. He sh-ts out his mouth.

True.

But if hes still replying, and your still responding, then that makes him an active participant in the debate.

[Blake]

anyway, im done here. Blake is starting with his sexual innuendos again.

Oh, should I have waited for you to call me a faggot for a third time?

keep quoting the word of Jesus, young Christian. :tu

[mouse]

anyway, im done here. Blake is starting with his sexual innuendos again.

I look forward to reading your replies when you do return.

[mouse]

Oh, should I have waited for you to call me a faggot for a third time?

keep quoting the word of Jesus, young Christian. :tu

If this is True then BLAKE does have a point calling someone a "faggot" during a debate really downgrades your credibility.

Sorry I have to agree with Blake on this point.

[Blake]

Again not as technical as skull but here's some quick info...especially show that writings have been found less than 3 centuries separated:IS THE BIBLE RELIABLE?- Superior to any other Ancient Writing
The Bible is a historical document. Interestingly enough, if you subject it to the same tests that you subject other historical documents to, you’ll discover that the Bible proves itself to be far superior to any other ancient writing.


Well no, it's not reliable.

See: op.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Let us look back at a small town of 300 people 2000 years hence and see how much of the record exists.

Not exactly show stopping.

How about you look to the Roman seat of power in the region where a guy trashed the bankers kiosk at the religious center, the roman governor got involved because the bankers were pissed and executed the guy..

[mouse]

Well no, it's not reliable.

See: op.

Blake is actually making points.

Is this really due to some powerful weed and Rolling Rock beer or is it public knowledge? (remember the www and it's postings will be the Bible of 2116

and many posters will scoff at it.

[xmas1997]

What do you consider a winner?
The person with the most meth who just happens to stay up late enough to be the last person to reply to a topic hes in , or the first person who finally realizes hes wasting his valuable time and research replying to an immature person online?


Is this really due to some powerful weed and Rolling Rock beer or is it public knowledge? (remember the www and it's postings will be the Bible of 2116
and many posters will scoff at it.

:lmao