Defensive Woes Continue To Plague Spurs

[313]

http://blog.mysanantonio.com/spursnation/2014/01/03/defensive-woes-continue-to-plague-spurs/

Good read


SAN ANTONIO — The Spurs continued their defensive free fall on Thursday, yielding nine 3-pointers and a career-high 27 points to Iman Shumpert (previous season scoring average: 5.5) in a shocking home loss to the Knicks.

Head coach Gregg Popovich was none to pleased, discounting his team’s latest effort as “soft” while chalking up their early defensive success to a cupcake schedule. Having ranked second in defensive efficiency through their first 16 games, the Spurs are now fifth and dropping fast.


If they continue to play the same defense they have over their past 17 outings, there’s no telling where they’ll end up.


First 16 games (ave. opponent offensive ranking: 17)


92.8 points allowed per 100 possessions
42.7 field goal percent
33.9 3-point percent
16.4 free throws allowed
5.9 3s allowed
One game of 100 points or more


Past 17 games (ave. opponent offensive ranking: 13)


105.3 points/100 possessions
45.8 field goal percent
39.7 3-point percent
21.1 free throws allowed
8.5 3s allowed
13 games of 100 points or more


In addition to giving up roughly eight more points per game on 3s...(continue reading via link ITT)

[TheGreatYacht]

If by defensive woes you mean horrible coaching... I agree

[Budkin]

Seriously one of the worst defensive teams we've had in years.

[313]

If by defensive woes you mean horrible coaching... I agree
A little bit of both. 50/50

[TheGreatYacht]

A little bit of both. 50/50

Never understood why he plays Zone. Is he stuck in the 90's? This also goes on Parker/Green/Manu/Beli, WHY do they over help the bigs? Kawhi literally has to guard 3 open shooters

[apalisoc_9]

Seriously one of the worst defensive teams we've had in years.

Easily fixed with the proper rotation. Marco has been balling lately and last night he scored 30 but gave 30...

Pop seems to think Leonard and Green are total robots with no emotions. Leonard to be more specific needs to get touches to motivate him even more to play great defence. Green needs to start again ASAP...Sick and tired of how pop treats these two guys.

[polandprzem]

Easily fixed with the proper rotation. Marco has been balling lately and last night he scored 30 but gave 30...

Pop seems to think Leonard and Green are total robots with no emotions. Leonard to be more specific needs to get touches to motivate him even more to play great defence. Green needs to start again ASAP...Sick and tired of how pop treats these two guys.

Leonard not getting touches?
GMAB

[apalisoc_9]

Leonard not getting touches?
GMAB

I hope you're being sarcastic, cause if not..You're an idiot. srs

[polandprzem]

Srs I'm not

[TheGreatYacht]

Easily fixed with the proper rotation. Marco has been balling lately and last night he scored 30 but gave 30...

Pop seems to think Leonard and Green are total robots with no emotions. Leonard to be more specific needs to get touches to motivate him even more to play great defence. Green needs to start again ASAP...Sick and tired of how pop treats these two guys.

This. And the Luol Deng rumors don't help

[Hoops Czar]

Easily fixed with the proper rotation. Marco has been balling lately and last night he scored 30 but gave 30...

Pop seems to think Leonard and Green are total robots with no emotions. Leonard to be more specific needs to get touches to motivate him even more to play great defence. Green needs to start again ASAP...Sick and tired of how pop treats these two guys.

Yeah, it's Pops fault Leonard is a stiff on offense and Green can't knock down open jumpers. If players need to be motivated to play hard on defense, then maybe they shouldn't be in the rotation at all.That's some weak sauce right there.

[apalisoc_9]

Srs I'm not

In that case, you're the only I've seen in this boards who think Kawhi doesn't need touches..Care to explain why? Maybe everyone in here would understand why..since you know virutally 99% of posters here agree that he needs more touches.

[apalisoc_9]

Yeah, it's Pops fault Leonard is a stiff on offense and Green can't knock down open jumpers. That's some weak sauce right there.

Hey, dumbass..did you read the thread tittle?

[Hoops Czar]

Hey, dumbass..did you read the thread tittle?

DEFENSIVE WOES CONTINUE TO PLAGUE SPURS.... Is there some hidden coded message I'm missing because that seems pretty self exclamatory to me. While were speaking about dumbasses, remember when I pointed this out way back in November and HH37 came into the thread and quoted defensive efficiency and you sided with him? Or is your memory only in the short term? It's prety surreal that you're posting in this thread at all.

[apalisoc_9]

DEFENSIVE WOES CONTINUE TO PLAGUE SPURS.... Is there some hidden coded message I'm missing because that seems pretty self exclamatory to me. While were speaking about dumbasses, remember when I pointed this out way back in November and HH37 came into the thread and quoted defensive efficiency and you sided with him? Or is your memory only in the short term? It's prety surreal that you're posting in this thread at all.

Except danny green and Kawhi Leonard was starting back then, and defence wasn't exactly their main problem...Did I mention Marco?...

[lefty]

Tony Parker imo

[apalisoc_9]

Tony Parker imo

Tony Parker and Marco guarding 1 and 2's :lol
Manu having to defend any athletic guy :lol

Pop needs to go back to the Green and Leonard defensive duo tbh

[Hoops Czar]

Except danny green and Kawhi Leonard was starting back then, and defence wasn't exactly their main problem...Did I mention Marco?...

The defense was absolutely a problem. The only difference is the level of competition. Maybe Leonard, like many, many Spurs players before him, is vastly overrated. He'll, his defesnse this year isn't all that and if a player has to motivated to play defense, then, maybe he shouldn't be on the court at all. As for Danny Green, the stage coach has turned back into the pumkin. The guy is terrible at everything.

Btw, HH37 was wrong per par. As bad as Beli's defense was in the 4th quarter, shumpert didn't get all his points against Marco. He hit a three over Manu, a three over Green, hit another three over Kawhi and had a three point play over Tiago "Stop, or I'll foul you" Splitter.

You can't hide bad defenders. The Spurs chose offense over defense when they signed Belinelli and Ayres and slotted Mills in at the backup pg position.

[TheGoldStandard]

Tim looked very upset in the post game interview, frustrated with the play and taking these games serious. Seems like he took a jab at Pop for calling the team soft too.

Everyone is playing terrible defense and there isn't a fix by insert this guy here or play this guy more minutes. Can't win series if your bench is putting up more points than your starters. I have a feeling that we might see something we have never seen from a spurs team and that is inner turmoil between coaching and players.

Seems like there have been way too many roster changes maybe by request or maybe the chemistry is starting to fade.

[ThaBigFundamental21]

Green and Leonard works just fine. Pop is being an idiot and not using that combo. WTF is he doing this year??? I think everyone is really frustrated at this point......buy hey, we have by far the best Defensive big in the NBA, Tiago Splitter. Lol.

Pop will continue to under utilize Kawhi Leonard, won't call plays for him, keep his minutes low.

Put ridiculous lineups on the court.

Plus the Spurs won't make a trade that makes sense, given the number of players the Spurs have making peanuts and Bonner's expiring deal this would be the year to get better.

[ThaBigFundamental21]

Tim looked very upset in the post game interview, frustrated with the play and taking these games serious. Seems like he took a jab at Pop for calling the team soft too.

Everyone is playing terrible defense and there isn't a fix by insert this guy here or play this guy more minutes. Can't win series if your bench is putting up more points than your starters. I have a feeling that we might see something we have never seen from a spurs team and that is inner turmoil between coaching and players.

Seems like there have been way too many roster changes maybe by request or maybe the chemistry is starting to fade.

What did Timmy say? I missed it.

[jermaine]

Sounds like the Spurs need to get their thumbs out their asses an go trade someone. Malcolm Thomas, De Volo, an Baynes can get a decent back up wing player I know.

[TheGoldStandard]

What did Timmy say? I missed it.

To paraphrase he said that they were outplayed and that they had the plays in front of them to win even though they are "soft or whatever" asked if there was a lack of physicality he said no they're playing hard and then when prompted that this is what pop said he says you'll have to talk to pop about that.

Maybe not much there but clear frustration at a loss st home to the Knicks

[ThaBigFundamental21]

Just a random thought. I you have Leonard and Green on the perimeter, with Tim and Splitter inside, you would think the Spurs would have at least a decent Defense. I have a question. Do you guys think that perhaps Pop is testing this team? Specifically Leonard. I just keep thinking maybe he wants to see how much Leonard will take until he rips Pop a new one and demands the ball and more playing time? I mean it might be stupid but I just keep thinking over and over that Pop wants Leonard to approach him and demand the ball and more minutes because he is capable of so much more.

Also, a lot of comments in here are dogging Leonard. Maybe he isn't as good as we thought? Yeah maybe. Spurstalk was really quick to anoint him. BUT. We have seen him get to the rim at ease, he can score inside and slash awesomely. He is a solid Defender, maybe not as great as we hoped. But still good on D. He can do a LOT of really good things, he is better than he is starting to get credit for here on Spurstalk. For whatever reason he isn't getting the ball. Be it by design, or him being mentally weak and not assertive. But physically and skill wise he can be very good and do more. Don't short change him. I'm not saying he will ever be 25 and 8. But he can be a 17-19 ppg and average 7-8 rebounds. You don't think he can be a Shawn Marion??? Pop needs to recognize.

[tim_duncan_fan]

To paraphrase he said that they were outplayed and that they had the plays in front of them to win even though they are "soft or whatever" asked if there was a lack of physicality he said no they're playing hard and then when prompted that this is what pop said he says you'll have to talk to pop about that.

Maybe not much there but clear frustration at a loss st home to the Knicks

lol Tim should be the LAST to complain. He's supposed to be our leader and yet he's about as mentally fucked out there as everyone else. He hasn't been much of an offensive threat or a defensive deterrent, to be honest. He can be frustrated with others when he starts bringing an assertive mindset to the court.

His timidity is 60% of the reason we suck, if we're honest, and it doesn't have all that much to do with his age. His mentality is waaaay off right now, and frankly, I don't want to hear his mouth.

[polandprzem]

In that case, you're the only I've seen in this boards who think Kawhi doesn't need touches..Care to explain why? Maybe everyone in here would understand why..since you know virutally 99% of posters here agree that he needs more touches.

I didn't say he does not need touches.

You said he needs to get touches, IMO he is getting them and does nothing valuable with them

[TheGoldStandard]

Just a random thought. I you have Leonard and Green on the perimeter, with Tim and Splitter inside, you would think the Spurs would have at least a decent Defense. I have a question. Do you guys think that perhaps Pop is testing this team? Specifically Leonard. I just keep thinking maybe he wants to see how much Leonard will take until he rips Pop a new one and demands the ball and more playing time? I mean it might be stupid but I just keep thinking over and over that Pop wants Leonard to approach him and demand the ball and more minutes because he is capable of so much more.

Also, a lot of comments in here are dogging Leonard. Maybe he isn't as good as we thought? Yeah maybe. Spurstalk was really quick to anoint him. BUT. We have seen him get to the rim at ease, he can score inside and slash awesomely. He is a solid Defender, maybe not as great as we hoped. But still good on D. He can do a LOT of really good things, he is better than he is starting to get credit for here on Spurstalk. For whatever reason he isn't getting the ball. Be it by design, or him being mentally weak and not assertive. But physically and skill wise he can be very good and do more. Don't short change him. I'm not saying he will ever be 25 and 8. But he can be a 17-19 ppg and average 7-8 rebounds. You don't think he can be a Shawn Marion??? Pop needs to recognize.

Spurs defensive philosophy is old and is predicated on help defense. Green is always cought in no man's land because he's trying to help in the paint for whatever reason and his footwork is bad this year. He's always biting on pump fakes. Leonard is good but lacks the foot speed to keep anyone in front of him who has a quick first step and lacks the length to really be effective with guys who can pull up and shoot over him. His tenacity is what makes up for that lack of height, he bugs people into mistakes.

Parker looks dead tired and is getting out worked going over screens trying to funnel his man into Duncan or Tiago who are not fast enough to close out on offense. Tiago is useful for 15 minutes a game till the other team goes small which is practically the whole nba

[TheGoldStandard]

lol Tim should be the LAST to complain. He's supposed to be our leader and yet he's about as mentally fucked out there as everyone else. He hasn't been much of an offensive threat or a defensive deterrent, to be honest. He can be frustrated with others when he starts bringing an assertive mindset to the court.

His timidity is 60% of the reason we suck, if we're honest, and it doesn't have all that much to do with his age. His mentality is waaaay off right now, and frankly, I don't want to hear his mouth.

When you reach a certain age the body can't do what the mind wants it to do. Can't expect Tim to not he frustrated with what happened last year and how some of these games are playing out. Spurs dont have that one guy this season that they can lean on when everyone is struggling to lead the team.

[KaiRMD1]

They forgot to add the terrible rotations also. Right now, Pop is the main problem for the Spurs.

[wildchild]

I didn't say he does not need touches.
You said he needs to get touches, IMO he is getting them and does nothing valuable with them

IMO 6-7 touches per game doesn't enough if you try to improve offensive's young player.

Right now he has 4 offensive options before him (Tony, Tim, Manu and Marco) like other guys said before I'd prefer lose developing Kawhi's 15/20 points than rather lose with Marco's 32 points or Manu on All Star mode.

It's all about young player development and how the team fails to attempt.



You can't hide bad defenders. The Spurs chose offense over defense when they signed Belinelli and Ayres and slotted Mills in at the backup pg position.

If we see the pictures of article, it's all about Belli in the wrong place or with the wrong guy.

Marco's strong suit isn't one-on-one defense, even isn't a good overall defender.
He's a really good scorer, a clutch scorer, but if his guy wins the game with a tip bc Marco loses him and not boxouting, and Pop didn't put Green, Diaw, Tiago...well Spurs chose Offense over D.

[MVPCues]

Tim looked very upset in the post game interview, frustrated with the play and taking these games serious. Seems like he took a jab at Pop for calling the team soft too.

Everyone is playing terrible defense and there isn't a fix by insert this guy here or play this guy more minutes. Can't win series if your bench is putting up more points than your starters. I have a feeling that we might see something we have never seen from a spurs team and that is inner turmoil between coaching and players.

Seems like there have been way too many roster changes maybe by request or maybe the chemistry is starting to fade.

Huh. I watched it. I agreed with you that Timmy was irritated. He was probably irritated at both the loss and the "soft" questions. I doubt it will fester into anything significant, except possibly better play and coaching.

[rascal]

They are playing the same defense just the teams they are playing are better over the last 17 games.

[james evans]

i still don't know why popovich has them leaving 3 point shooters wide open to shut down the lane of teams with no big men. makes no sense to me especially when there are two 7 footers in the paint. but he's the genius coach, and i'm just a poster on a forum. he knows better than me.

[TheGoldStandard]

i still don't know why popovich has them leaving 3 point shooters wide open to shut down the lane of teams with no big men. makes no sense to me especially when there are two 7 footers in the paint. but he's the genius coach, and i'm just a poster on a forum. he knows better than me.

I question Pop with great ferver afterall he is the one giving Ayres minutes which is flat out stupid

[Seventyniner]

Um, the Spurs are #5 in defensive efficiency. Not great, but far from bad. The shocker to me is Golden State at #4.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2014.html
http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat/defensive-efficiency

[RD2191]

Those numbers don't tell the whole story. Inflated stats because of beating up on crap teams.

[TheGoldStandard]

Um, the Spurs are #5 in defensive efficiency. Not great, but far from bad. The shocker to me is Golden State at #4.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2014.html
http://www.teamrankings.com/nba/stat/defensive-efficiency

That stat alone should tell you it's a worthless stat.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

That stat alone should tell you it's a worthless stat.

Well your response tells me you are big on bias and little on league context.

[Chinook]

That stat alone should tell you it's a worthless stat.

Lol, no it's not. That's like saying points are a worthless stat. Golden State has three good perimeter defenders and two good defensive bigs. Their ranking is not really shocking.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Lol, no it's not. That's like saying points are a worthless stat. Golden State has three good perimeter defenders and two good defensive bigs. Their ranking is not really shocking.

Moreso the players buy into effort on the defensive end.

Looks like Malone's effect was overrated by some around here.

[tholdren]

Never understood why he plays Zone. Is he stuck in the 90's? This also goes on Parker/Green/Manu/Beli, WHY do they over help the bigs? Kawhi literally has to guard 3 open shooters


this is why tiago is not worth the $

[TheGoldStandard]

this is why tiago is not worth the $

He gets negated all the time with small ball

[313]

It’s impossible to play perfect defense on every possession. But far more often than not, the Spurs weren’t nearly focused enough to execute the trapping tactics they hoped would contain Anthony. Not only did the Knicks — not known for their offensive execution this season, particularly with their top two points guards out with injury — create a wealth of quality shots, Anthony still ended up with 27.These kind of breakdowns have become all too common over the past month. The personnel is there to fix it, and the Spurs will finally have the practice time after a hectic start to figure out how.
Unless they do, returning to the Finals will be all but impossible.

[KL2]

They can have the number 1 defense and it wouldn't mean shit, Spurs will never win a championship with their PG as their #1 option on offense, they need to fix that first. This team is fucked.

[Seventyniner]

Golden State has three good perimeter defenders and two good defensive bigs. Their ranking is not really shocking.

I know Iguodala is a great defender, but I didn't see them going from 14th last year to 4th this year. They obviously have the personnel; the coaching was the wild card to me.

Memphis's dropoff is also extreme: 2nd to 24th. Gasol being hurt is a more severe loss than I thought.

[Seventyniner]

They can have the number 1 defense and it wouldn't mean shit, Spurs will never win a championship with their PG as their #1 option on offense, they need to fix that first. This team is fucked.

Damon Stoudamire says hi.