For those of you who say Gary Neal is better than Marco Belinelli

[sexinthatsx]

I understand where you're coming from. Gary Neal has always been a player during his time with the Spurs as the guy who never met a shot he didn't like, but doesn't play a lick of defense. During the games that I have watched this season with Marco Belinelli, it's becoming more apparent that Gary Neal seems to be the better player to put the ball in the basket during pivotal moments, while Marco Belinelli's stigma is that every big game he's had with the Spurs have resulted in a loss, but plays way better defense (at least compared to Neal)

All in all, this thread is just to say that a lot of you guys are blaming the Spurs losses squarely on Belinelli that isn't warranted. That is all.

[Sean Cagney]

I understand where you're coming from. Gary Neal has always been a player during his time with the Spurs as the guy who never met a shot he didn't like, but doesn't play a lick of defense. During the games that I have watched this season with Marco Belinelli, it's becoming more apparent that Gary Neal seems to be the better player to put the ball in the basket during pivotal moments, while Marco Belinelli's stigma is that every big game he's had with the Spurs have resulted in a loss, but plays way better defense (at least compared to Neal)

All in all, this thread is just to say that a lot of you guys are blaming the Spurs losses squarely on Belinelli that isn't warranted. That is all.

The losses are mainly due to injuries right now, Belli is not the sole reason or near the reason they are losing right now. Neal would not help the cause right now either, period end of story.

[kobyz]

The point is that Gary is better player for specific role and for the spurs, Belli might be better passer and ball handler but his overall game still weak, in opposite to Gary, Belli while playing make the team worst and weaker, he complicate all because of his style, poor level of intense and softness...

[Hoops Czar]

Yeah, the OP's post couldn't have been thrown into the "I miss Gary Neal" thread. People won't get the full gist of how bad Belinelli is until they see him in the playoffs or until someone loses a shoe.

[sexinthatsx]

The losses are mainly due to injuries right now, Belli is not the sole reason or near the reason they are losing right now. Neal would not help the cause right now either, period end of story.

This. I'm sick of everybody saying that the reason Spurs are losing is because Belinelli is lacking intensity or defense on the floor. Half the time, Marco wasn't even playing in his natural position of shooting guard. Granted, the spurs were signing him with the intention of playing a lot of minutes in either the PG spot or SF spot when they decide to go small ball.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

The point is that Gary is better player for specific role and for the spurs, Belli might be better passer and ball handler but his overall game still weak, in opposite to Gary, Belli while playing make the team worst and weaker, he complicate all because of his style, poor level of intense and softness...

This has to be a lakersground troll.

[sexinthatsx]

Yeah, the OP's post couldn't have been thrown into the "I miss Gary Neal" thread. People won't get the full gist of how bad Belinelli is until they see him in the playoffs or until someone loses a shoe.

Hoops, I know what you mean by missing Gary Neal in the other thread though. I do remember him making some pretty amazing shots; only problem was that those shots weren't game winners or pressured for him to take it. Belinelli's a different story though, it almost seems as if the Spurs are spoon feeding him the ball during the last seconds of the game because he has the hot hand only to come up short but is not his fault.

[Raven]

ok if you say so than i'm definitely convinced.

[kobyz]

This has to be a lakersground troll.

You are so childish!!

[spurraider21]

kobyz has been one of the more obvious trolls :lol

[freetiago]

Belenelli has hit a ton of big shots in games that we just couldnt win
I remember games at Portland where he drained a bunch of huge shots in the 4th then Manu bricked the game-tying 3
or New York where he hits the 3 to tie the game when we were down 3 with less than 20 seconds on the shotclock

a big part of Marcos game though as a Spur is his ability to cut to the basket and get layups
vs good teams though they pretty much take away that aspect of the Spurs offense usually through elite shotblockers
Neal was way better at getting his own shot by just receiving a screen and knocking down a mid range
Marco can curl off the screens and knock down them but Neal is way better in getting his own shot in that aspect and it helps that the Spurs have elite screen setters

[monkeypunk]

It think Beli's real value is with the second unit murdering the opposing teams bench. He can't be expecting to guard starters on the regular or be guarded by starting caliber defenders. His numbers since starting have shown that.

On that note, Pop needs to insert DG back into the starters as soon as he is able. Danny's offense will come back if we actually run plays to get him open. DG can't score in a hero ball group but he can hit wide open shots created by smart offense which we haven't played in a good while.

[monkeypunk]

And I would say that Marco has an elite cutting ability but people other than Manu are not looking for him.

[heyheymymy]

would rather have marco but would rather have both. bucks should waive him so we can pick him back up. neal belinelli ginobili diaw splitter off the bench? manu bringing the ball up and gary and marco curling off screens from splitter or boris raining threes? haha 2k'd

[Chinook]

Beli's better than Neal, period. But his role, like Neal's before him, is really not that important in the post-season. The Spurs are losing because the New Two are out. Neal being in SA and starting would not make a difference.

The long and the short of it is that Beli in Neal's playoff role is an upgrade, buy Beli taking even a second away from Green and Leonard is a masive downgrade.

[Chinook]

Should have signed Webster or Brewer instead, though.

[Texas_Ranger]

Wouldnt mind having Neal on the team. At least he had balls.

[sexinthatsx]

Beli's better than Neal, period. But his role, like Neal's before him, is really not that important in the post-season. The Spurs are losing because the New Two are out. Neal being in SA and starting would not make a difference.

The long and the short of it is that Beli in Neal's playoff role is an upgrade, buy Beli taking even a second away from Green and Leonard is a masive downgrade.

I agree. It's hard to imagine that Pop would play Marco such heavy minutes during the post-season instead of Tony Parker, Danny Green, or Kawhi Leonard. However, his ability to hit big shots (those deep 3-point shots from near half-court as well) makes me tend to think he'll be needed during crunch time. Maybe Pop can go the route of getting a time-out to substitute defensive players to defense and getting a time-out to substitute Marco back in on offensive plays.

[N0 LyF3 ScRuB]

Bel is better (has a better overall game and a better shooter).. the system made Neal look good. But Neal is slightly more clutch (hes had more opportunities to be fair). If there was a white version of Neal, it's Bel.

[Chinook]

I agree. It's hard to imagine that Pop would play Marco such heavy minutes during the post-season instead of Tony Parker, Danny Green, or Kawhi Leonard. However, his ability to hit big shots (those deep 3-point shots from near half-court as well) makes me tend to think he'll be needed during crunch time. Maybe Pop can go the route of getting a time-out to substitute defensive players to defense and getting a time-out to substitute Marco back in on offensive plays.

The ability to hit clutch shots is overrated. Green and Leonard both his big shots last season, and obviously Parker and Ginobili need no further explanation. Beli will be in on some plays like Neal, but he's not a closer and shouldn't be confused with one.

[Hoops Czar]

Beli's better than Neal, period. But his role, like Neal's before him, is really not that important in the post-season. The Spurs are losing because the New Two are out. Neal being in SA and starting would not make a difference.

The long and the short of it is that Beli in Neal's playoff role is an upgrade, buy Beli taking even a second away from Green and Leonard is a masive downgrade.

This is where you're wrong Chinook. Neal's role was never as important to the Spurs as Belinelli's is. Mills has taken the place of Neal in the role Neal should have been playing while he was here. This is where the FO went bust. Instead of signing a Back up PG and limiting Ginobili's role and minutes so his chronically inflamed hamstring wouldn't act up, they did nothing. Mills is not a PG and he really can't play one effectively. But enough about Mills, lets bet back to Belinell. These two guys have very different roles of importance to the team . Belinelli's role is to keep the offense running smoothly whether it be with his passing, shooting or cutting to the basket. The problem is on the defensive end where he is every bit as bad as Neal. The only problem is with Neal, you could just sit him. With Belinelli, you have to play through it. That's not going to work in the playoffs. His offense has slowed considerably and he gives up points in bunches on the other end of the floor. If Green doesn't find his offense, Belinelli's workload will probaby stay the same which is bad news come playoff time.

[sexinthatsx]

This is where you're wrong Chinook. Neal's role was never as important to the Spurs as Belinelli's is. Mills has taken the place of Neal in the role Neal should have been playing while he was here. This is where the FO went bust. Instead of signing a Back up PG and limiting Ginobili's role and minutes so his chronically inflamed hamstring wouldn't act up, they did nothing. Mills is not a PG and he really can't play one effectively. But enough about Mills, lets bet back to Belinell. These two guys have very different roles of importance to the team . Belinelli's role is to keep the offense running smoothly whether it be with his passing, shooting or cutting to the basket. The problem is on the defensive end where he is every bit as bad as Neal. The only problem is with Neal, you could just sit him. With Belinelli, you have to play through it. That's not going to work in the playoffs. His offense has slowed considerably and he gives up points in bunches on the other end of the floor. If Green doesn't find his offense, Belinelli's workload will probaby stay the same which is bad news come playoff time.

Come on Hoops, Beli is NOWHERE NEAR as bad defensively as Gary Neal. Don't be a homer.

[sexinthatsx]

The reason Beli might be bad on defense is because he has tendencies to leak out towards mid court to get the fastbreak layup. Which to me is better than Neal, because when Neal is playing defense on the court, he was running red rover in circles not knowing where to go.

[Chinook]

This is where you're wrong Chinook. Neal's role was never as important to the Spurs as Belinelli's is. Mills has taken the place of Neal in the role Neal should have been playing while he was here. This is where the FO went bust. Instead of signing a Back up PG and limiting Ginobili's role and minutes so his chronically inflamed hamstring wouldn't act up, they did nothing. Mills is not a PG and he really can't play one effectively. But enough about Mills, lets bet back to Belinell. These two guys have very different roles of importance to the team . Belinelli's role is to keep the offense running smoothly whether it be with his passing, shooting or cutting to the basket. The problem is on the defensive end where he is every bit as bad as Neal. The only problem is with Neal, you could just sit him. With Belinelli, you have to play through it. That's not going to work in the playoffs. His offense has slowed considerably and he gives up points in bunches on the other end of the floor. If Green doesn't find his offense, Belinelli's workload will probaby stay the same which is bad news come playoff time.

In the playoffs, Mills or Beli will drop out of the rotation, essentially leaving a combo-guard spot open. That is what Neal did last season. So I'd say they are the same, or will be. The fact that Beli can pass makes him a better fit for that role, which confirms what I'm saying. Beli won't get any more time than Neal in a healthy rotation if Pop knows what he's doing.

[Hoops Czar]

In the playoffs, Mills or Beli will drop out of the rotation, essentially leaving a combo-guard spot open. That is what Neal did last season. So I'd say they are the same, or will be. The fact that Beli can pass makes him a better fit for that role, which confirms what I'm saying. Beli won't get any more time than Neal in a healthy rotation if Pop knows what he's doing.

He wasn't really a combo guard, he was just forced to play one. In the playoffs, just like last year, it will be Ginobili running the point for the second unit which is exactly what nobody wanted to see after last year's finals. I don't see Beli as anything more than a shooting guard with handles. The reasoning for bringing a guy like him in was to give Manu reduced minutes and helping him out in the post season where he really struggled. I don't see any of that happening and both Beli/Gino are bad/terrible defenders.

But I am curious as to who you think will take the open combo-guard spot if Mills or Belinelli drop out of the rotation ( most likely Mills)... De Colo? CoJo? Mighty Mouse? Peter Pan? The lack of depth is a real problem

[Chinook]

He wasn't really a combo guard, he was just forced to play one. In the playoffs, just like last year, it will be Ginobili running the point for the second unit which is exactly what nobody wanted to see after last year's finals. I don't see Beli as anything more than a shooting guard with handles. The reasoning for bringing a guy like him in was to give Manu reduced minutes and helping him out in the post season where he really struggled. I don't see any of that happening and both Beli/Gino are bad/terrible defenders.

But I am curious as to who you think will take the open combo-guard spot if Mills or Belinelli drop out of the rotation ( most likely Mills)... De Colo? CoJo? Mighty Mouse? Peter Pan? The lack of depth is a real problem

There won't be an open spot. One will drop out as Green and Leonard see more minutes. Essentially you're right that Beli and Mills are both filling Neal's role. So only one will get his minutes in a playoff rotation.

[TD 21]

There won't be an open spot. One will drop out as Green and Leonard see more minutes. Essentially you're right that Beli and Mills are both filling Neal's role. So only one will get his minutes in a playoff rotation.

No, they both will. There's no question, their minutes, particularly Belinelli's, will be slashed, but the spot that will be somewhere between utilized sparingly and eliminated altogether, is Ayres'/Bonner's. They'll play primarily a three big rotation, with a few fourth big minutes going to Leonard, if the match-ups allow for it.

[Chinook]

No, they both will. There's no question, their minutes, particularly Belinelli's, will be slashed, but the spot that will be somewhere between utilized sparingly and eliminated altogether, is Ayres'/Bonner's. They'll play primarily a three big rotation, with a few fourth big minutes going to Leonard, if the match-ups allow for it.

I think the rotation will look like the one they had against the Heat, but with more Splitter and less small ball. Ginobili and Beli splitting play-making in lieu of a point-guard with Green and Leonard playing the third perimeter position and guarding the opposing PG. Definitely three bigs, but also only five smalls. There's just no room for six while playing the Big Three and New Two as much as they need to for the Spurs to reach their peak.

[TD 21]

I think the rotation will look like the one they had against the Heat, but with more Splitter and less small ball. Ginobili and Beli splitting play-making in lieu of a point-guard with Green and Leonard playing the third perimeter position and guarding the opposing PG. Definitely three bigs, but also only five smalls. There's just no room for six while playing the Big Three and New Two as much as they need to for the Spurs to reach their peak.

They only went to that one because they couldn't afford to give any minutes to a fringe player, such as Joseph and they only (mostly) got away with it because neither of the Heat's PG's are threatening off the dribble types.

Leonard isn't laterally quick enough to defend PG's and though Green is, they'll generally need him to defend a wing.

Besides, nobody strictly plays 8 and goes 4 rounds and this team definitely doesn't have the legs for it, even if it were the way to go. They're going to need 9 and 1/2.

There's room for six perimeter players, because Leonard will play some minutes at PF when the match-up allows for it, Mills won't play more than roughly 10 mpg and Belinelli won't play much more.

[Chinook]

Disclaimer: I'm only talking about the second round and after. The first round is really an extension of the regular season.

An eight-man rotation still only means 30 MPG for each player. Leonard and Green will probably play 72 or so. Parker will get 38ish, and Ginobili will get around 30. That's 140 minutes with Beli and the bigs left. Assume 88 minutes for Duncan, Splitter and Diaw, and that leaves only 12 for Beli and Mills. Sure, Splitter and Manu may get a few less, but Leonard and Duncan are likely to get more. Of course there will be times others play, but there won't be dedicated minutes in the deep playoffs.

Leonard should be fine against backup PGs. Yes, Green will be needed on the wing, but even as a starter, he's going to get time with the "second unit". There is little difference between running with Neal as the backup point and putting Beli in that spot.

[barbacoataco]

Spurs need to make 3's to advance in the playoffs. They will need Belli unless Leonard and Green both come through.

[sexinthatsx]

Disclaimer: I'm only talking about the second round and after. The first round is really an extension of the regular season.

An eight-man rotation still only means 30 MPG for each player. Leonard and Green will probably play 72 or so. Parker will get 38ish, and Ginobili will get around 30. That's 140 minutes with Beli and the bigs left. Assume 88 minutes for Duncan, Splitter and Diaw, and that leaves only 12 for Beli and Mills. Sure, Splitter and Manu may get a few less, but Leonard and Duncan are likely to get more. Of course there will be times others play, but there won't be dedicated minutes in the deep playoffs.

Leonard should be fine against backup PGs. Yes, Green will be needed on the wing, but even as a starter, he's going to get time with the "second unit". There is little difference between running with Neal as the backup point and putting Beli in that spot.

Beli's been shown to get very streaky on shooting though, almost Danny Green like with the 3's. I wouldn't be surprised if Beli see's more than 20 minutes on any given night depending on his hot hand

[wildcardX]

Should there even be a comparison between Neal and Belinelli? I could be wrong but I thought Neal's role and minutes went to Mills. So wouldn't the comparison be between Neal's production and Mills?

[Hoops Czar]

What? No love for Nea...., I mean Belinelli? 3-10 fg, 2-7 3-fg, 1 assist/ 3 turnovers in 28 minutes? Geez, tough crowd!!!

[Raven]

honestly, after the Gay highlight from tonight, if anyone tries to argue that Belinelli is not the worst defender in the league, he should be checked out.

[TJastal]

honestly, after the Gay highlight from tonight, if anyone tries to argue that Belinelli is not the worst defender in the league, he should be checked out.

I think I'll trust the hard numbers that say otherwise over bitter irrational musings.

[superbigtime]

Beli is a mediocre defender but he's better than Neal. How many 3s got knocked over Neal running to close the gap, over and over again? Beli is a better ball handler and he can put it on the floor and finish at the rim. Neal couldn't do that. Beli is a more versatile player and overall more talented. It's obvious. Beli reminds me a good deal of Brent Barry and not just because he can tan.

[sexinthatsx]

Beli is a mediocre defender but he's better than Neal. How many 3s got knocked over Neal running to close the gap, over and over again? Beli is a better ball handler and he can put it on the floor and finish at the rim. Neal couldn't do that. Beli is a more versatile player and overall more talented. It's obvious. Beli reminds me a good deal of Brent Barry and not just because he can tan.

Yeah, I thought the same exact thing with the Brent Barry comparison

[sexinthatsx]

Should there even be a comparison between Neal and Belinelli? I could be wrong but I thought Neal's role and minutes went to Mills. So wouldn't the comparison be between Neal's production and Mills?

This was the point of the thread... the hate for Marco isn't fair lol

[sexinthatsx]

honestly, after the Gay highlight from tonight, if anyone tries to argue that Belinelli is not the worst defender in the league, he should be checked out.

I wasn't able to watch the game. But if you're talking about Rudy Gay's highlight dunk, then I would have to question you during which point in the game it was. Did the Spurs have a foul to give? Marco may have over-fronted Rudy Gay, but knew the dunk was coming so chose not to make contact. It was either going to be a foul with two shots on the line or you get posterized.

[TJastal]

I wasn't able to watch the game. But if you're talking about Rudy Gay's highlight dunk, then I would have to question you during which point in the game it was. Did the Spurs have a foul to give? Marco may have over-fronted Rudy Gay, but knew the dunk was coming so chose not to make contact. It was either going to be a foul with two shots on the line or you get posterized.

Doesn't matter that the spurs won the game. Marco gave up a dunk. He must be a horrendous defender.

[sexinthatsx]

Doesn't matter that the spurs won the game. Marco gave up a dunk. He must be a horrendous defender.

Good argument... by far the worst defender in the league like the other poster said! ...lol...

[Hoops Czar]

Should there even be a comparison between Neal and Belinelli? I could be wrong but I thought Neal's role and minutes went to Mills. So wouldn't the comparison be between Neal's production and Mills?

I already pointed that out earlier in the thread. The point is moot. Beli is not an average defender, nor is he a bad defender. He is a terrible defender. The fact that he's a better passer and ballhandler actually works to the Spur's disadvantage. It only means his role is much more important than Neal's ever was and they will be counting on him to deliver in the future. The unfortunate part is that he only plays on one end of the court which means when he's in the game, the Spurs can't stop Donkey doo on defense. IS THIS GETTING THROUGH??? When he's not hitting his shot, he is absoutely worthless to the team. Everybody is clamouring for Green's return but forget that Belinelli had actually replaced Green in the starting rotation BEFORE he got injured. I wonder if you've noticed how Belinelli's numbers are tanking in the wrong direction. He isn't scoring, not dishing assists, nor is he playing defense. He's a total detriment to the team when he's on the court and not playing alongside playmakers. He was not brought in to replace Neal but, to limit Manu's minutes and keep him refreshed for the playoffs. Too bad because when he's not playing alongside Ginobili, he's a total cyclopes out there.

Blind homers can use the Neal argument to make this signing look good but saying that he's better than Neal doesn't mean a damn shit. Neal is probably in the bottom 5% of the league right now eventhough hes been hampered by plantar faciitis the last two seasons. I almost wish Belinelli was playing injured because at least it would explain the trail of stink he's leaving behind. He's awful in almost every facet of the game. If he was such a hot commodity, he wouldn't have bounced around from team to team the way that he has over the last seven years.

He needs to play NO MORE than 15 minutes a game off the bench. I doubt that day will ever come

[Hoops Czar]

Doesn't matter that the spurs won the game. Marco gave up a dunk. He must be a horrendous defender.

Two point win against Sacramento at home feels like a loss or is this the new standard?

[Raven]

I wasn't able to watch the game. But if you're talking about Rudy Gay's highlight dunk, then I would have to question you during which point in the game it was. Did the Spurs have a foul to give? Marco may have over-fronted Rudy Gay, but knew the dunk was coming so chose not to make contact. It was either going to be a foul with two shots on the line or you get posterized.

http://www.nba.com/games/20140201/SACSAS/gameinfo.html

at 00:24

and i'll add this(from rotoworld, they rarely comment on defence):

Rudy Gay had 23 points, seven rebounds, six assists, five steals and a 3-pointer on 9-of-18 shooting in Saturday's tough loss to the Spurs.

Gay had his way against Marco Belinelli most of the night, but settled down late against Boris Diaw. Gay has been a beast since arriving in Sacramento and his Achilles injury is the only thing that has slowed him down since becoming a King. Isaiah Thomas added 26 points and five assists as the Kings anxiously await the return of DeMarcus Cousins, who missed his sixth straight game with a sprained ankle.

[TJastal]

I already pointed that out earlier in the thread. The point is moot. Beli is not an average defender, nor is he a bad defender. He is a terrible defender. The fact that he's a better passer and ballhandler actually works to the Spur's disadvantage. It only means his role is much more important than Neal's ever was and they will be counting on him to deliver in the future. The unfortunate part is that he only plays on one end of the court which means when he's in the game, the Spurs can't stop Donkey doo on defense. IS THIS GETTING THROUGH??? When he's not hitting his shot, he is absoutely worthless to the team. Everybody is clamouring for Green's return but forget that Belinelli had actually replaced Green in the starting rotation BEFORE he got injured. I wonder if you've noticed how Belinelli's numbers are tanking in the wrong direction. He isn't scoring, not dishing assists, nor is he playing defense. He's a total detriment to the team when he's on the court and not playing alongside playmakers. He was not brought in to replace Neal but, to limit Manu's minutes and keep him refreshed for the playoffs. Too bad because when he's not playing alongside Ginobili, he's a total cyclopes out there.

Blind homers can use the Neal argument to make this signing look good but saying that he's better than Neal doesn't mean a damn shit. Neal is probably in the bottom 5% of the league right now eventhough hes been hampered by plantar faciitis the last two seasons. I almost wish Belinelli was playing injured because at least it would explain the trail of stink he's leaving behind. He's awful in almost every facet of the game. If he was such a hot commodity, he wouldn't have bounced around from team to team the way that he has over the last seven years.

He needs to play NO MORE than 15 minutes a game off the bench. I doubt that day will ever come

Relax, dude. You've shit yourself and are flinging poo everywhere in this thread for no real good reason. Bellinelli is not as bad a defender as you're making him out to be. And calling him awful at every facet of the game when the man is #3 in the league in 3pt% is just plain stupid. Give him time to adjust to a new role with new guys in the starting lineup. Chemistry isn't developed overnight. If it's determined that his natural fit is coming off the bench then he'll probably go back there once Green returns (although it may take Pop awhile to do this).

[TJastal]

http://www.nba.com/games/20140201/SACSAS/gameinfo.html

at 00:24

and i'll add this(from rotoworld, they rarely comment on defence):

Rudy Gay had 23 points, seven rebounds, six assists, five steals and a 3-pointer on 9-of-18 shooting in Saturday's tough loss to the Spurs.

Gay had his way against Marco Belinelli most of the night, but settled down late against Boris Diaw. Gay has been a beast since arriving in Sacramento and his Achilles injury is the only thing that has slowed him down since becoming a King. Isaiah Thomas added 26 points and five assists as the Kings anxiously await the return of DeMarcus Cousins, who missed his sixth straight game with a sprained ankle.

So Rudy Gay had a nice game. Good on him. Wake me up when he actually helps a team get into the playoffs. Most teams he's been on in recent years actually got better once he left.

[Raven]

So Rudy Gay had a nice game. Good on him. Wake me up when he actually helps a team get into the playoffs. Most teams he's been on in recent years actually got better once he left.

yes i'm sure that makes belinelli a lot better.

[TJastal]

James Anderson had a real nice game a few months ago too. Had all the local fanbois all up in arms, too. Lamenting about unfair treatment. Was promoted into the starting lineup and hasn't done shit since. Cool story, though yo.

[Raven]

James Anderson had a real nice game a few months ago too. Had all the local fanbois all up in arms, too. Lamenting about unfair treatment. Was promoted into the starting lineup and hasn't done shit since. Cool story, though yo.

your point being :lol?

[Mikeanaro]

So Rudy Gay had a nice game. Good on him. Wake me up when he actually helps a team get into the playoffs. Most teams he's been on in recent years actually got better once he left.
But Gay had 23 points, thats godlike level...:p:
It only happens every 1000 years and so much scoring always makes you win games, solid fact!

[TJastal]

your point being :lol?

The point I am making is that you really have no point. You can't draw a conclusion off a guy going off in one game and getting dunked on. If the same thing happens in the next 20 games and Marco's overall numbers reflect these consistent failures then perhaps you'll actually have something worthy to discuss.

[Hoops Czar]

Relax, dude. You've shit yourself and are flinging poo everywhere in this thread for no real good reason. Bellinelli is not as bad a defender as you're making him out to be. And calling him awful at every facet of the game when the man is #3 in the league in 3pt% is just plain stupid. Give him time to adjust to a new role with new guys in the starting lineup. Chemistry isn't developed overnight. If it's determined that his natural fit is coming off the bench then he'll probably go back there once Green returns (although it may take Pop awhile to do this).

What do his numbers look like since Ginobili went down or since he was playing opposite Ginobili? You're Rudy Gay commet is surreal. Yeah, put up numbers and watch your team lose. Remind me again how many teams Belinelli took to the playoffs? He didn't lead Chicago to the playoffs if that's your aim. When Belinelli was puttng up gaudy numbers earlier in the season, how many of those games did the Spurs actually pull out? You're watching a live version of Rudy Gay in silver and black only the numbers have disappeared.

I'm not sure how much longer you'll be touting his 3pt FG% so it was good to use that while you still can. Props to you on that one.

[Mikeanaro]

What do his numbers look like since Ginobili went down or since he was playing opposite Ginobili? You're Rudy Gay commet is surreal. Yeah, put up numbers and watch your team lose. Remind me again how many teams Belinelli took to the playoffs? He didn't lead Chicago to the playoffs if that's your aim. When Belinelli was puttng up gaudy numbers earlier in the season, how many of those games did the Spurs actually pull out? You're watching a live version of Rudy Gay in silver and black only the numbers have disappeared.

I'm not sure how much longer you'll be tuting his 3pt FG% so it was good to use that while you still can. Props to you on that one.
The numbers have disappeared but Beli is 10 times cheaper and FO loves that.

[TJastal]

What do his numbers look like since Ginobili went down or since he was playing opposite Ginobili? You're Rudy Gay commet is surreal. Yeah, put up numbers and watch your team lose. Remind me again how many teams Belinelli took to the playoffs? He didn't lead Chicago to the playoffs if that's your aim. When Belinelli was puttng up gaudy numbers earlier in the season, how many of those games did the Spurs actually pull out? You're watching a live version of Rudy Gay in silver and black only the numbers have disappeared.

I'm not sure how much longer you'll be tuting his 3pt FG% so it was good to use that while you still can. Props to you on that one.

So what is your point here? Are you trying to downplay his 3pt% accuracy as meaningless? I suppose your one of those Anderson fanbois that prefers a guy who can put up 30% accuracy from long range.

[Mikeanaro]

Sometimes you have guys like Mike Miller or Shane Battier who plays like shit on any team, then those guys go to miami and gives you good solid playoff performance, I blame Pop and his shitty motivational tactics it seems like any player wearing silver and grey sucks.

[Hoops Czar]

So what is your point here? Are you trying to downplay his 3pt% accuracy as meaningless? I suppose your one of those Anderson fanbois that prefers a guy who can put up 30% accuracy from long range.

There's more to basketball than a 3 point shot. He was brought in to be a playmaker. 1 assist in 28 minutes against Sacramento is pathetic. He's not creating for himself nor is he creating for his teammates. His defense is worthless and I just hope someone loses a shoe so posters like you can see it for themselves. Too many one trick pony responses in here about shoeless Mike Miller not that Neal's giving him 5 inches.

[Chinook]

Too many one trick pony responses in here about shoeless Mike Miller not that Neal's giving him 5 inches.

Damned straight. Those are horrible arguments, along with, "Duncan would have gotten that rebound," and "Stephen Jackson would not have gone cold in the Finals."

[TJastal]

The numbers have disappeared but Beli is 10 times cheaper and FO loves that.

:lol

So ... "The numbers have disappeared" comment above referencing Hoops Czar ejection of fecal matter must refer to Marco's recent 4-5 game slump of poor 3pt shooting (3-17). Oh the horror. :lol

[TJastal]

There's more to basketball than a 3 point shot. He was brought in to be a playmaker. 1 assist in 28 minutes against Sacramento is pathetic. He's not creating for himself nor is he creating for his teammates. His defense is worthless and I just hope someone loses a shoe so posters like you can see it for themselves. Too many one trick pony responses in here about shoeless Mike Miller not that Neal's giving him 5 inches.

So again, you're drawing a conclusion off 1 game. The same thing Raven was doing. Let's just ignore the fact that he logged 2+ assists in the 7 games before that. Smh.

[Hoops Czar]

So again, you're drawing a conclusion off 1 game. The same thing Raven was doing. Let's just ignore the fact that he logged 2+ assists in the 7 games before that. Smh.

He's had more than 3 assists in just 3 of his last 15 games while logging nearly 30 minutes per game. That's your definition of being a playmaker? 5 assists and 7 TO's in 98 minutes since Ginobili's injury. Is that what you call stepping it up?

[Raven]

The point I am making is that you really have no point. You can't draw a conclusion off a guy going off in one game and getting dunked on. If the same thing happens in the next 20 games and Marco's overall numbers reflect these consistent failures then perhaps you'll actually have something worthy to discuss.
there is nothing wrong in Gay going off on belinelli, what is wrong is the movement he does in that exact action, you can't justify a defender going away from the rim when guarding the man with the ball in his hands, leaving him the clean road to the rim. You just can't.

[TJastal]

He's had more than 3 assists in just 3 of his last 15 games while logging nearly 30 minutes per game. That's your definition of being a playmaker? 5 assists and 7 TO's in 98 minutes since Ginobili's injury. Is that what you call stepping it up?

So now we're supppose to be freaking out about a small 2.5 games sample where a role player put up less than stellar numbers? :lol

And for what he's getting paid expecting him to put up Ginobili like numbers is completely absurd. His main role was to provide scoring along with a little ballhandling and playmaking while not completely shitting the bed defensively like Neal always did. And so far he's provided that and more.

[TJastal]

there is nothing wrong in Gay going off on belinelli, what is wrong is the movement he does in that exact action, you can't justify a defender going away from the rim when guarding the man with the ball in his hands, leaving him the clean road to the rim. You just can't.

So Pop reems him out at the next film session? Why freak out over one botched play, it makes no sense. It's not like it was a critical moment of an important game that was lost in the process. The spurs won the friggin' game. Get over it.

[Biernutz]

Looks like the Pilgrims have Marco lashed to a pole and they are piling wood around his feet.
If a fantasy basketball site gets down on you It's because you are not scoring enough points to keep
you in their line up....It's like fantasy football...cut throat.. Marco would not be guarding Gay if Danny and
Kawhi were in the line up. He was not having any luck that's why Boris had a go. The Spurs switch
off all the time....really they do!

[sexinthatsx]

What do his numbers look like since Ginobili went down or since he was playing opposite Ginobili? You're Rudy Gay commet is surreal. Yeah, put up numbers and watch your team lose. Remind me again how many teams Belinelli took to the playoffs? He didn't lead Chicago to the playoffs if that's your aim. When Belinelli was puttng up gaudy numbers earlier in the season, how many of those games did the Spurs actually pull out? You're watching a live version of Rudy Gay in silver and black only the numbers have disappeared.

I'm not sure how much longer you'll be touting his 3pt FG% so it was good to use that while you still can. Props to you on that one.


There's more to basketball than a 3 point shot. He was brought in to be a playmaker. 1 assist in 28 minutes against Sacramento is pathetic. He's not creating for himself nor is he creating for his teammates. His defense is worthless and I just hope someone loses a shoe so posters like you can see it for themselves. Too many one trick pony responses in here about shoeless Mike Miller not that Neal's giving him 5 inches.

Your posts are pretty unbearable to read. During the time Belinelli served as a primary PG and SG for the Chicago Bulls was when both Derrick Rose was out and Kirk Hinrich was out. Which means a large part of the scoring depended partially on both Nate Robinson and Marco Belinelli. Additionally, if you REALLY think a $2 million dollar a year player is brought into a team and expected to be a great awesome playmaker you expect him to be, you need to get your head out of your ass. Belinelli was signed to bring the ball up the court, and to space the floor with his better passing abilities. Your expectations of Marco is a slap in the face to all the PG's across the league if you really expect Belinelli to come to the Spurs and average even Ginobili's numbers for assists.

Hence the reason for this thread, dummies like you should manage your expectations accordingly.

[TD 21]

Disclaimer: I'm only talking about the second round and after. The first round is really an extension of the regular season.

An eight-man rotation still only means 30 MPG for each player. Leonard and Green will probably play 72 or so. Parker will get 38ish, and Ginobili will get around 30. That's 140 minutes with Beli and the bigs left. Assume 88 minutes for Duncan, Splitter and Diaw, and that leaves only 12 for Beli and Mills. Sure, Splitter and Manu may get a few less, but Leonard and Duncan are likely to get more. Of course there will be times others play, but there won't be dedicated minutes in the deep playoffs.

Leonard should be fine against backup PGs. Yes, Green will be needed on the wing, but even as a starter, he's going to get time with the "second unit". There is little difference between running with Neal as the backup point and putting Beli in that spot.

Fair enough.

Other than in a select few match-ups, I doubt Leonard and Green play that many combined minutes and the same goes for Ginobili.

Even if Leonard could guard PG's, this team is so thin at the forward spots, that they generally can't afford to have him do so.

The difference is, until Mills proves otherwise, they don't need to resort to that. They did last season out of necessity.

[Chinook]

Fair enough.

Other than in a select few match-ups, I doubt Leonard and Green play that many combined minutes and the same goes for Ginobili.

Even if Leonard could guard PG's, this team is so thin at the forward spots, that they generally can't afford to have him do so.

The difference is, until Mills proves otherwise, they don't need to resort to that. They did last season out of necessity.


The New Two combined for 69 minutes despite several blowouts anf the fact that they played two series against big teams with little perimeter scoring. Ginobili averaged 27 with the same caveats. Even still, that's only six extra minutes.

If the forward is the problem in the second unit (like against OKC) Leonard will guard them. If it's the PG, Ginobili will guard the three. Pop's not going to put Mills on Paul just so Leonard can check Dudley.

It's not about need. It's about getting the best players on the floor. It will be one or the other when the rotation tightens unless Pop has no faith in either.

[TD 21]

The New Two combined for 69 minutes despite several blowouts anf the fact that they played two series against big teams with little perimeter scoring. Ginobili averaged 27 with the same caveats. Even still, that's only six extra minutes.

If the forward is the problem in the second unit (like against OKC) Leonard will guard them. If it's the PG, Ginobili will guard the three. Pop's not going to put Mills on Paul just so Leonard can check Dudley.

It's not about need. It's about getting the best players on the floor. It will be one or the other when the rotation tightens unless Pop has no faith in either.

Again, that was due in large part to Ginobili and Neal not being physically right and in the case of Neal, being virtually unplayable the majority of the time.

If Mills proves to be a massive flop and Joseph inevitably proves to once again be in over his head and their backs are up against the wall, then all bets are off. But going in, not a chance they go backup PG less and with eight period. Nor is it necessary, with the way Mills has played thus far.

With the exception of the Thunder (where Leonard will need to play around 40 mpg), in a non small ball series, look for the wing minutes to be distributed as follows: Leonard: 32-36 mpg, Ginobili: 24-28 mpg, Green: 20-24 mpg, Belinelli 12-16 mpg.

[Chinook]

Again, that was due in large part to Ginobili and Neal not being physically right and in the case of Neal, being virtually unplayable the majority of the time.

If Mills proves to be a massive flop and Joseph inevitably proves to once again be in over his head and their backs are up against the wall, then all bets are off. But going in, not a chance they go backup PG less and with eight period. Nor is it necessary, with the way Mills has played thus far.

With the exception of the Thunder (where Leonard will need to play around 40 mpg), in a non small ball series, look for the wing minutes to be distributed as follows: Leonard: 32-36 mpg, Ginobili: 24-28 mpg, Green: 20-24 mpg, Belinelli 12-16 mpg.

The other members of the West's top four each have a star PG that Green will see heavy minutes defending. He's almost certain to see big minutes against Houston as well. I doubt he gets any fewer minutes than last year. He'll probably get more if the team plays Phoenix or Dallas in the first round. Pop's not going to play minus players significant minutes just to change it up, as his treatment of Neal indicated.

Now we don't really disagree. I think Pop will try to go 10 or even 10.5 if he can get away with it, especially early in the post-season. Ayres and Bonner will even see time. But in tight games when Parker needs a rest, either Mills or Beli will come in. He's not rolling with both. That's what I'm saying.

[TD 21]

The other members of the West's top four each have a star PG that Green will see heavy minutes defending. He's almost certain to see big minutes against Houston as well. I doubt he gets any fewer minutes than last year. He'll probably get more if the team plays Phoenix or Dallas in the first round. Pop's not going to play minus players significant minutes just to change it up, as his treatment of Neal indicated.

Now we don't really disagree. I think Pop will try to go 10 or even 10.5 if he can get away with it, especially early in the post-season. Ayres and Bonner will even see time. But in tight games when Parker needs a rest, either Mills or Beli will come in. He's not rolling with both. That's what I'm saying.

The only scenario is I could see him resorting to one in, is when their backs are up against the wall and he makes all the predictable moves, which include starting Ginobili, upping the big three's minutes and shortening the rotation.

[playblair]

neal >>>>>>>>>>>> beli.................