"MVP" Pau Gasol

[Arnold Toht]

A solid "DNP" in a 127-96 rout of a team fighting for their playoff lives.

[ambchang]

:lol All of a sudden team performance without an allstar is important.

Well, guess what, even in his old and frail state ...

Lakers with Gasol:
21-38 (36% winning %)

Lakers without Gasol:
3-8 (27%)

Lakers with Kobe:
2-4 (33%)

Lakers without Kobe:
22-42 (34%)

[Clipper Nation]

Kirby: a solid "DNP" all season.

The Quit

[Killakobe81]

:lol All of a sudden team performance without an allstar is important.

Well, guess what, even in his old and frail state ...

Lakers with Gasol:
21-38 (36% winning %)

Lakers without Gasol:
3-8 (27%)

Lakers with Kobe:
2-4 (33%)

Lakers without Kobe:
22-42 (34%)

Sample size importance to stats both op and your reply is silly

[Leetonidas]

Anal Tit with more shit takes and threads per par :tu

[Leetonidas]

LOL they were playing the fucking Knicks :lmao

GTFO faggot

[ambchang]

Sample size importance to stats both op and your reply is silly

Do you want I go over all the seasons where Kobe missed games?

And MVPau played and missed a decent amount of games this year. Seems like A fair sample.

[Thread]

The kicker:::SF's people wouldn't step off his throat long enough to spare him a V last Spring thus safely securing Pau's perfect playoff record sans Kobe.

tee, hee.

[Clipper Nation]

The kicker:::SF's people wouldn't step off his throat long enough to spare him a V last Spring thus safely securing Pau's perfect playoff record sans Kobe.

tee, hee.
You've nary room, the Spurs swept your Kirby out of the Great Western Forum. Christ!

[Thread]

You've nary room, the Spurs swept your Kirby out of the Great Western Forum. Christ!

Oh, that's right you guys have that thing.:rolleyes

[Arnold Toht]

LOL they were playing the fucking Knicks :lmao

GTFO faggot

8-2 in their last 10. Sit your fucking ass down.

[Clipper Nation]

Oh, that's right you guys have that thing.:rolleyes
The house that Wilt, Kareem & Magic built, & your Kirby allowed Duncan to take a wrecking ball to it. Christ!

[scanry]

8-2 in their last 10. Sit your fucking ass down.

Their last 10 games didn't feature one playoff team tbh.

[ambchang]

So KK81 wants a larger sample size, here it is. Year by year breakdown:

Young Buck Years:
96-97 - 48-23 w Kobe, 8-3 w/o (68% winning % vs. 73%)
97-98 - 58-21 (74%) vs. 3-0 (100%)
98-99 - Didn't miss any games
Overall - 137-63 (69%) vs. 11-3 (79%)

2nd banana to Shaq years:
99-00 - 55-11 (83%) vs. 12-4 (75%)
00-01 - 45-23 (66%) vs. 11-3 (79%)
01-02 - 56-24 (70%) vs. 2-0 (100%)
02-03 - Didn't miss any games
03-04 - 48-17 (74%) vs. 8-9 (47%) (Only season Kobe had a significant +ve impact, but Shaq missed a lot of those Kobe missed games as well)
Overall: 254-107 (70%) vs. 33-16 (67%)

Kobe as the lead years:
04-05 - 28-38 (42%) vs. 6-10 (38%)
05-06 - 45-35 (56%) vs. 0-2 (0%)
06-07 - 39-38 (51%) vs. 3-2 (60%)
Overall: 112-111 (50%) vs. 9-14 (39%)

MVPau years:
07-08 - Didn't miss any games
08-09 - Didn't miss any games
09-10 - 51-22 (70%) vs. 6-3 (67%)
10-11 - Didn't miss any games
11-12 - 36-22 (62%) vs. 5-3 (63%)
12-13 - 42-36 (54%) vs. 3-1 (75%)
Overall: 308-147 (68%) vs. 14-7 (67%)

Grand overall: 811-428 (65%) vs. 67-40 (63%)

Overall, Kobe had no effect in any stage of his career, except him being top dog and leading the Lakers to a missed playoffs and two first round exits, but even then, the Lakers were actually 6-8 in 04-05 without Kobe but with Odom, which is the same winning % as the Lakers with Kobe.

[Thread]

The house that Wilt, Kareem & Magic built, & your Kirby allowed Duncan to take a wrecking ball to it. Christ!

Fine. You take that one. Me? I'm stickin' with 6.

[Thread]

Their last 10 games didn't feature one playoff team tbh.

Didn't stop Media from climbing on that wagon once Phil was the teamster.

[Clipper Nation]

Fine. You take that one. Me? I'm stickin' with 6.
2004 trumps it.

[Thread]

2004 trumps it.

You're full of shit.

[Clipper Nation]

You're full of shit.
Dale, wavin' the white flag. :yield

[scanry]

The house that Wilt, Kareem & Magic built, & your Kirby allowed Duncan to take a wrecking ball to it. Christ!

That fell on Shaq tbh. I remember the Spurs would triple and quadruple team the fat bastard and their shooters (especially Glen Rice & Kobe) that year were building some great houses in South LA.

Tim had a monster series against the Lakers that year. There was a time when fans would travel all the way from St Croix to see Tim play. Did they run of money cause i haven't seen them since.

[scanry]

Didn't stop Media from climbing on that wagon once Phil was the teamster.

Can't blame them cause desperation & Brooklyn has caused Dolan to throw some serious money at Phil.

A 68 year old earning $12 mil/yr for the next 5 is :wow

[Thread]

That fell on Shaq tbh. I remember the Spurs would triple and quadruple team the fat bastard and their shooters (especially Glen Rice & Kobe) that year were building some great houses in South LA.

Tim had a monster series against the Lakers that year. There was a time when fans would travel all the way from St Croix to see Tim play. Did they run of money cause i haven't seen them since.

...6 put a damper on things.

tee, hee.

[Leetonidas]

8-2 in their last 10. Sit your fucking ass down.

And 24-46 overall. Now shut the fuck up bitch

[JohnnyMax]

Its no coincidence the Lakers declined in 2011 because Pau Gasol's play declined. Hes the real reason they won 2 championships.

[scanry]

...6 put a damper on things.

tee, hee.

6 also set the tone for Tim's continued drive this year. He'll surpass 2 pretty soon in the all time rankings now that Piano's been busy with his curricular activities while collecting his 30.5.

[Thread]

6 also set the tone for Tim's continued drive this year. He'll surpass 2 pretty soon in the all time rankings now that Piano's been busy with his curricular activities while collecting his 30.5.

I don't do rankings.

It's my religion.

[Clipper Nation]

...6 put a damper on things.

tee, hee.
Though 2004 trumps it.

[Michael Jordan.]

So KK81 wants a larger sample size, here it is. Year by year breakdown:

Young Buck Years:
96-97 - 48-23 w Kobe, 8-3 w/o (68% winning % vs. 73%)
97-98 - 58-21 (74%) vs. 3-0 (100%)
98-99 - Didn't miss any games
Overall - 137-63 (69%) vs. 11-3 (79%)

2nd banana to Shaq years:
99-00 - 55-11 (83%) vs. 12-4 (75%)
00-01 - 45-23 (66%) vs. 11-3 (79%)
01-02 - 56-24 (70%) vs. 2-0 (100%)
02-03 - Didn't miss any games
03-04 - 48-17 (74%) vs. 8-9 (47%) (Only season Kobe had a significant +ve impact, but Shaq missed a lot of those Kobe missed games as well)
Overall: 254-107 (70%) vs. 33-16 (67%)

Kobe as the lead years:
04-05 - 28-38 (42%) vs. 6-10 (38%)
05-06 - 45-35 (56%) vs. 0-2 (0%)
06-07 - 39-38 (51%) vs. 3-2 (60%)
Overall: 112-111 (50%) vs. 9-14 (39%)

MVPau years:
07-08 - Didn't miss any games
08-09 - Didn't miss any games
09-10 - 51-22 (70%) vs. 6-3 (67%)
10-11 - Didn't miss any games
11-12 - 36-22 (62%) vs. 5-3 (63%)
12-13 - 42-36 (54%) vs. 3-1 (75%)
Overall: 308-147 (68%) vs. 14-7 (67%)

Grand overall: 811-428 (65%) vs. 67-40 (63%)

Overall, Kobe had no effect in any stage of his career, except him being top dog and leading the Lakers to a missed playoffs and two first round exits, but even then, the Lakers were actually 6-8 in 04-05 without Kobe but with Odom, which is the same winning % as the Lakers with Kobe.
http://far-left.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/HardenCrossoverGif.gif

[Deuce Bigalow]

Lakers with Kobe: 813-432 (.653)
Lakers without Kobe: 89-82 (.520)

[ambchang]

Lakers with Kobe: 813-432 (.653)
Lakers without Kobe: 89-82 (.520)

:lol taking pride at the quit during the Lakers worst year, when the Lakers have pretty much the same record this year w vs. w/o Kobe.

[Deuce Bigalow]

:lol taking pride at the quit during the Lakers worst year, when the Lakers have pretty much the same record this year w vs. w/o Kobe.
Those are the facts, facts are stuff spurfan like to ignore.

Bonus facts:
Without Pau: 3 Championships, 4 Finals, 391-170 Regular season, 76-43 Playoffs
Without Shaq: 2 Championships, 3 Finals, 422-262 Regular season, 59-42 Playoffs

[Deuce Bigalow]

Playoffs

Lakers with Kobe: 135-85 (.614)
Lakers without Kobe: 2-5 (.286)

[Katherine Robinson]

Those are the facts, facts are stuff spurfan like to ignore.

Bonus facts:
Without Pau: 3 Championships, 4 Finals, 391-170 Regular season, 76-43 Playoffs
Without Shaq: 2 Championships, 3 Finals, 422-262 Regular season, 59-42 Playoffs

Where would you put Bryant if he won a 6th, Deuce?

[Deuce Bigalow]

Where would you put Bryant if he won a 6th, Deuce?
Depends how he wins it tbh

[Katherine Robinson]

Depends how he wins it tbh

The same way he won his last two

[Deuce Bigalow]

The same way he won his last two
5th behind mj, russ, kaj, magic.

[ambchang]

Those are the facts, facts are stuff spurfan like to ignore.

Bonus facts:
Without Pau: 3 Championships, 4 Finals, 391-170 Regular season, 76-43 Playoffs
Without Shaq: 2 Championships, 3 Finals, 422-262 Regular season, 59-42 Playoffs

:lol Taking the year where Kobe was "injured" and heavily weighing it in favour of Kobe.
:lol Not understanding that this year's team is different from the three peat Shaq led or repeat MVPau led teams
:lol Not understanding 2nd bananas can get lucky
:lol Same career success as Derek Fisher

Here is another Bonus fact:
Without best frontline in the league: 3 1st round exits, 2 non-playoff year (including this year)

[Deuce Bigalow]

:lol Taking the year where Kobe was "injured" and heavily weighing it in favour of Kobe.
:lol Not understanding that this year's team is different from the three peat Shaq led or repeat MVPau led teams
:lol Not understanding 2nd bananas can get lucky
:lol Same career success as Derek Fisher

Here is another Bonus fact:
Without best frontline in the league: 3 1st round exits, 2 non-playoff year (including this year)
Wrong

2008 Lakers made it to the NBA Finals without Kobe having the best front court or without a single all-star or all-nba teammate.

[ambchang]

Wrong

2008 Lakers made it to the NBA Finals without Kobe having the best front court or without a single all-star or all-nba teammate.

:lol continue to throw MVPau under the bus.
MVPau WS/48 in 2008 with the Lakers = .239
Kobe = .208
Bynum - .230

:lol ranking 3rd on the team in ws/48, and by a large margin at that.

[Deuce Bigalow]

:lol continue to throw MVPau under the bus.
MVPau WS/48 in 2008 with the Lakers = .239
Kobe = .208
Bynum - .230

:lol ranking 3rd on the team in ws/48, and by a large margin at that.
Well good job at disproving WS. Looks like you're starting to learn something.

Facts:
Kobe: MVP, all-star, all-nba first team, all-defensive first team, 2nd in scoring
All other Lakers: nothing

[Deuce Bigalow]

"MVP" Pau never received an MVP vote in his career. Not a single point.

[Arcadian]

What the fuck is up with all these bullshit Laker threads? You bitches are irrelevant. Let's keep the discussion to relevant teams now, please and thank you.

[Deuce Bigalow]

How did "MVP" Pau do in Memphis? He led his team to a 10-29 record in 07-08. MVPau doe. WS doe.

[Deuce Bigalow]

What the fuck is up with all these bullshit Laker threads? You bitches are irrelevant. Let's keep the discussion to relevant teams now, please and thank you.
Relevant enough to have 2 pics in your sig of your team playing an "irrelevant" Laker team.

:lol taking pride in beating the 13-14 Lakers

[Deuce Bigalow]

In honor of spurfan...

[Clipper Nation]

Man, MVPau has made Statfag real salty and mad over the years :lol

[ambchang]

Well good job at disproving WS. Looks like you're starting to learn something.

Facts:
Kobe: MVP, all-star, all-nba first team, all-defensive first team, 2nd in scoring
All other Lakers: nothing
Aren't those media awards that you Kobe fans scoff at?

Duncan: 2 MVPs
Kobe: 1 MVP

Duncan = twice as good as Kobe.

[Rogue]

Those are the facts, facts are stuff spurfan like to ignore.

Bonus facts:
Without Pau: 3 Championships, 4 Finals, 391-170 Regular season, 76-43 Playoffs
Without Shaq: 2 Championships, 3 Finals, 422-262 Regular season, 59-42 Playoffs
without either of them: 0 rings, 0 2nd round appearances... 1 lottery pick.

[Michael Jordan.]

Don't forget how good Odom was during the back to back.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Deuce is the worst Lakers sophist yet. I actually prefer the machismo trolling over the willful ignorance and grandstanding on minutiae.

I did love him using 9 years of Finals stat padding in losing efforts as the basis for saying Jerry West was a top 5 player.

[ElNono]

Kirbystans mad MVPau didn't quit :lol

[Rogue]

Don't forget how good Odom was during the back to back.
and D-Fish is still doing a job in OKC even at age 39.

[Deuce Bigalow]

without either of them: 0 rings, 0 2nd round appearances... 1 lottery pick.
Just take away 15/18 years of his career...

Facts are that he won at least back to back without Shaq and without Pau.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Deuce is the worst Lakers sophist yet. I actually prefer the machismo trolling over the willful ignorance and grandstanding on minutiae.

I did love him using 9 years of Finals stat padding in losing efforts as the basis for saying Jerry West was a top 5 player.
I put Jerry at #10 not top 5. Reason is because he was a top 10 playoff performer in NBA history and top 5 Finals performer in NBA history.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Aren't those media awards that you Kobe fans scoff at?

Duncan: 2 MVPs
Kobe: 1 MVP

Duncan = twice as good as Kobe.
They played on the same team from '08-'13 and Kobe was top 5 in MVP voting each time while Pau was top nothing.

[ambchang]

"MVP" Pau never received an MVP vote in his career. Not a single point.

:lol changing goal post. You opened a thread about the effects of Lakers without MVPau, and after getting hammered on it, is moving onto another topic of MVP votes.

Does it matter if he got an MVP vote? He is the MVP of the Lakers, and he consistently backed it up.


How did "MVP" Pau do in Memphis? He led his team to a 10-29 record in 07-08. MVPau doe. WS doe.

:lol Not knowing how to read. MVPau had those WS/48 on the Lakers, where he had a coach that knows how to use him, and supporting players like Kobe that magnifies his effectiveness.

And since you are talking about Memphis, they were 10-29 with him, and about the same winning percentage without him. The problem wasn't Gasol though, it's having Rudy Gay having a higher usage rate because the team was looking to trade MVPau the entire year, and looking to transition the team to Gay. It's a decision that cost the Grizzlies greatly. The Grizzlies were looking to tank and rebuild, and is taking the ball away from MVPau, and they paid dearly for it.

However, on a contending team, like the Lakers, let's see what his effects were:
Lakers without MVPau: 35-20 (64% winning %)
Lakers with MVPau: 22-5 (81%)

That's the difference between a 52 win pace season (7th seed in the west that year) vs. a 67 win pace season (1st seed, by a MILE, or one of the best teams ever).

I guess there isn't much of a WS fail right there.

[ambchang]

They played on the same team from '08-'13 and Kobe was top 5 in MVP voting each time while Pau was top nothing.

Thanks for telling me that Duncan is twice the player Kobe is.


Duncan: simply twice as good as Kobe.

[Deuce Bigalow]

"He [Gasol] is the MVP of the Lakers"
-ambchang

[Deuce Bigalow]

Thanks for telling me that Duncan is twice the player Kobe is.
Kobe and Duncan played on the same team? Christ!

[King Emmanuel]

:tu I agree... kobe bryant is the real mvp of those 2009-10 teams

[ambchang]

Kobe and Duncan played on the same team? Christ!

MVP votes is a league wide award. What does not playing on the same team have anything to do with it.

:lol avoiding the records with and without MVPau like a plague
:lol getting your head handed to you on a silver platter on your own thread
:lol thread backfired.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I put Jerry at #10 not top 5. Reason is because he was a top 10 playoff performer in NBA history and top 5 Finals performer in NBA history.

Lost 9 out of 9 Finals until Wilt was brought in to carry him to his only title. .336 winning % and 27 ppg makes you a stat padder else Kevin Love would be MVP.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Lost 9 out of 9 Finals until Wilt was brought in to carry him to his only title. .336 winning % and 27 ppg makes you a stat padder else Kevin Love would be MVP.
Are you retarded?

Wilt played with West in 4 of those 9 Finals, with 3 of the 4 being losses.

West CARRIED the Lakers in the 1969 Finals.

1969 NBA Finals
Game 1: 53 points, 3 rebounds, 10 assists, 21-41 FG, 11-13 FT
Summary:
53 points, 10 assists and a 4th quarter comeback engineered by West was the catalyst for Bill Russell to exclaim "I have never seen a better clutch player than Jerry West" immediately following the Celtics loss. After a back and forth first 3 quarters that saw 21 lead changes, Boston, on the back of Havlicek's relentless scoring, managed to eek ahead by 7 points with just 10 minutes remaining. It was West's seventeen 4th quarter points that brought the Lakers back into it, and they were just 1 point behind with around 2 minutes to go. West then put the finishing touches on his vituoso performance by making back to back elbow jumpers and burying 2 crucial free throws that put L.A up by 3 points with 4 seconds left.
Game 2: 41 points, 3 rebounds, 8 assists, 12-22 FG, 17-20 FT
Game 3: 24 points, 1 rebounds, 6 assists, 9-24 FG, 6-7 FT
Game 4: 40 points, 6 rebounds, 4 assists, 15-30 FG, 10-10 FT
Game 5: 39 points, 3 rebounds, 9 assists, 16-31 FG, 7-8 FT
Game 6: 26 points, 4 rebounds, 3 assists, 9-19 FG, 8-11 FT
Game 7: 42 points, 13 rebounds, 12 assists, 14-29 FG, 14-18 FT
Summary:
The season long fued between Wilt Chamberlain and Butch van Breda Kolff (Caused mostly by Wilt) finally came to a head. After jarring his knee with around 5 minutes left in the final period, Wilt wanted out of the game, which Breda Kolff duly granted. But when Wilt asked to come back in a couple of minutes later Breda Kolff ignored him before finally declaring "We're playing better without you" (To be fair, they were). Whilst all this was going on, West, still playing with a sore left hamstring, was single handily leading a furious Laker charge. Seemingly every trip down the court he was swishing mid range jumper after mid range jumper or getting to the line and making free throw after free throw (5/7 FGs & 7/9 FTs in the 4th), until, finally, running out of steam with around 3 minutes left. The Celtics, of course, ran away with it from there. West, who finished with a 42/13/12, deserved a little help.


Series average: 37.9 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 7.4 apg, 49.0 fg%, 83.9 ft%

[spurraider21]

Those are the facts, facts are stuff spurfan like to ignore.

Bonus facts:
Without Pau: 3 Championships, 4 Finals, 391-170 Regular season, 76-43 Playoffs
Without Shaq: 2 Championships, 3 Finals, 422-262 Regular season, 59-42 Playoffs
post the numbers without Shaq or Pau :lmao

[ElNono]

This will be a great game to lose. Get within 2 on the win column for the 3rd spot.

:lmao

[ambchang]

http://i.imgur.com/oEYfsKj.gif

kobestans running into facts.

[King Emmanuel]

Kobe bryant will return and be at about a 20/5/5 level

[Deuce Bigalow]

http://i.imgur.com/oEYfsKj.gif

kobestans running into facts.
You want facts?

Boiled down:
Kobe 5
Duncan 4

Finals:
Kobe 7
Duncan 5

Series with HCA:
Kobe 27-2
Duncan 26-6

Kobe's 06 and 07 seasons > any Duncan season

Kobe's 01, 08, 09, 10 postseasons were better than any Duncan postseasons besides 03

Kobe: 2 scoring titles, 3 playoff scoring titles
Duncan: never led the league in anything

Kobe > Duncan

Let us proceed

[whitemamba]

You want facts?

Boiled down:
Kobe 5
Duncan 4

Finals:
Kobe 7
Duncan 5

Series with HCA:
Kobe 27-2
Duncan 26-6

Kobe's 06 and 07 seasons > any Duncan season

Kobe's 01, 08, 09, 10 postseasons were better than any Duncan postseasons besides 03

Kobe: 2 scoring titles, 3 playoff scoring titles
Duncan: never led the league in anything

Kobe > Duncan

Let us proceed


relax, ambchang might kill himself.

[ambchang]

You want facts?

Boiled down:
Kobe 5
Duncan 4

Finals:
Kobe 7
Duncan 5

Series with HCA:
Kobe 27-2
Duncan 26-6

:lol Always defaults to team success to compare individuals.

Derek Fisher > Duncan.
Horry > Kobe.

MVPs:
Duncan 2, Kobe 1
Finals MVP
Duncan 3, Kobe 2 (one after shooting 6-24 :lol)


Kobe's 06 and 07 seasons > any Duncan season

In what capacity? Kobe's career high WS was 15.3 (.224 per 48 minutes). Duncan had 2 seasons of higher WS and 5 seasons of higher WS/48


Kobe's 01, 08, 09, 10 postseasons were better than any Duncan postseasons besides 03

Kobe's playoff high WS/48 was .260, Duncan a ws/48 of .279 in 02-03.


Kobe: 2 scoring titles, 3 playoff scoring titles
Duncan: never led the league in anything

:lol Duncan led the playoffs in:
ws twice
ws/48 once
defensive rating once
block % once
PER twice
blocks per game twice (but it's not scoring, so it's not anything)
total rebounds four times
total blocks three times.

In the regular season:
WS twice
DWS 5 times
OWS once
DRating four times


Kobe > Duncan

Let us proceed

:cry Don't want to talk about MVPau's impact on the Lakers anymore
:cry Don't want to talk about MVPs anymore
:cry Anything that is not scoring shouldn't count.

EDIT:
John Stockton led the league in assists 9 times, Magic "only" did it 4 times.

Stockton > Magic :lol

[Clipper Nation]

Statfag getting destroyed ITT by Amb :lol

[Deuce Bigalow]

Always defaults to team success to compare individuals.


Derek Fisher > Duncan.
Horry > Kobe.
Fisher and Horry were all-nba first teamers? Scoring champions? League MVPs? Finals MVPs? Were leading scorers in playoff series en route to championships?

MVPs:
Duncan 2, Kobe 1
Finals MVP
Duncan 3, Kobe 2 (one after shooting 6-24 )
As if I haven't destroyed this argument before.

Kobe's 06 season (35/5/5 on 56%TS) and Kobe's 07 season (32/6/5 on 58%TS) are years where Kobe did not win MVP but was better than Duncan ever was.

Kobe's '09 (30/5/6 on 56%TS) and '10 (29/6/6 on 57%TS) championship runs were beter than any playoff run that Duncan has had except for '03. Duncan also won a pathetic FMVP where Manu was the actual MVP of the 05 Finals. Manu was the leading scorer per minute (.520 vs .505) and shot a 63.7%TS compared to Duncan's horrific 47.1%TS. Duncan somehow won the award as a big man scoring 144 points on 129 shots :lol Manu was 131 points on 85 shots vs an elite defense and his great effenciency (56.5 eFG%) was the difference in a series of two great defenses. Manu also led the team in FG% besides Rasho who barely even played.

Kobe's '02 Finals where he didn't win FMVP (27/6/5 on 63%TS) is so much better than Duncan's 05 FMVP or I should say "FMVP".

BTW I see you brought up efficiency, Duncan shot 10/27 for 25 points in game 7, guess what the real MVP shot? 23 points on 8/13 FG, 2/2 3P, 5/5 FT, giving GINOBILILIIIIII! a TS of 75.7% in the game.

Also lets's compare Kobe's '10 FMVP efficency to Duncan's '05 "one".

TS%
.471
.528 (Kobe)

eFG%
.419
.451 (Kobe)

so laugh at 6/24 even though including that game which ruined Kobe's efficiency, his efficiency for the series was still better by a large margin despite the position difference :lol
And Kobe took 24 shots to score 23, Duncan took 27 shots to score 25...so was Duncan even more efficienct in that lone game comparison? :lol


In what capacity? Kobe's career high WS was 15.3 (.224 per 48 minutes). Duncan had 2 seasons of higher WS and 5 seasons of higher WS/48
Real stats please. What was the ppg, rpg, apg, ect? No one cares about WS/48 clown.

Kobe's playoff high WS/48 was .260, Duncan a ws/48 of .279 in 02-03.
I already gave you 03 postseason to duncan based on his real numbers of 25/15/5 with 4blk? and good efficiency, but Kobe has the next 4 best postseasons when you compare the stats.

Duncan led the playoffs in:
ws twice
ws/48 once
defensive rating once
block % once
PER twice
blocks per game twice (but it's not scoring, so it's not anything)
total rebounds four times
total blocks three times.

In the regular season:
WS twice
DWS 5 times
OWS once
DRating four times
so in other words he never led the league in anything :lol

ppg? No
rpg? No
apg? No
spg? No
bpg? No
fg% no
ft% no


Don't want to talk about MVPau's impact on the Lakers anymore
Don't want to talk about MVPs anymore
Anything that is not scoring shouldn't count.
Pau did make an impact and was the 2nd biggest reason why Kobe won #4 and 5.

[Deuce Bigalow]

Statfag getting destroyed ITT by Amb :lol
http://gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/Jennifer-Lawrence-ok-thumbs-up.gif

[Jodelo]

Statfag getting owned, per par.

[ambchang]

Fisher and Horry were all-nba first teamers? Scoring champions? League MVPs? Finals MVPs? Were leading scorers in playoff series en route to championships?

You are arguing in circles.

Duncan > Kobe: But Kobe 5, Duncan 4
Then Horry > Kobe: But League MVPs, Finals MVPs
Then Duncan > Kobe: But Kobe 5, Duncan 4.

This is as circular logic as you can get. You are contradicting yourself with your own "criteria"


As if I haven't destroyed this argument before.

Kobe's 06 season (35/5/5 on 56%TS) and Kobe's 07 season (32/6/5 on 58%TS) are years where Kobe did not win MVP but was better than Duncan ever was.

Kobe's '09 (30/5/6 on 56%TS) and '10 (29/6/6 on 57%TS) championship runs were beter than any playoff run that Duncan has had except for '03. Duncan also won a pathetic FMVP where Manu was the actual MVP of the 05 Finals. Manu was the leading scorer per minute (.520 vs .505) and shot a 63.7%TS compared to Duncan's horrific 47.1%TS. Duncan somehow won the award as a big man scoring 144 points on 129 shots :lol Manu was 131 points on 85 shots vs an elite defense and his great effenciency (56.5 eFG%) was the difference in a series of two great defenses. Manu also led the team in FG% besides Rasho who barely even played.

So wait, hold on a second. Your main argument through out has been saying Kobe had better stats than Duncan because he scored more points with a lower FG%. But now, Manu > Duncan because he scored less points but had a higher FG%? You schizophrenic or something?


Kobe's '02 Finals where he didn't win FMVP (27/6/5 on 63%TS) is so much better than Duncan's 05 FMVP or I should say "FMVP".

BTW I see you brought up efficiency, Duncan shot 10/27 for 25 points in game 7, guess what the real MVP shot? 23 points on 8/13 FG, 2/2 3P, 5/5 FT, giving GINOBILILIIIIII! a TS of 75.7% in the game.

Oh noes! Duncan shot 10/27, which is a, get this ..... 37% FG%. Not sure where you took math, but 37% is about 12 % > 25%. So are you saying Kobe didn't deserve the 10 "FMVP"?


Also lets's compare Kobe's '10 FMVP efficency to Duncan's '05 "one".

TS%
.471
.528 (Kobe)

eFG%
.419
.451 (Kobe)

so laugh at 6/24 even though including that game which ruined Kobe's efficiency, his efficiency for the series was still better by a large margin despite the position difference :lol
And Kobe took 24 shots to score 23, Duncan took 27 shots to score 25...so was Duncan even more efficienct in that lone game comparison? :lol

As if comparing TS% is not ridiculously biased because of 3pt shooting and FT shooting. You have been educated millions of times on this, and comparing TS% of a guard to a big man is like comparing rebounding between a PF and a G, it's stupid.


Real stats please. What was the ppg, rpg, apg, ect? No one cares about WS/48 clown.

Those are real stats, takes someone with an IQ >48 to understand, but given you can go on the internet, I assume you have an IQ>48.


I already gave you 03 postseason to duncan based on his real numbers of 25/15/5 with 4blk? and good efficiency, but Kobe has the next 4 best postseasons when you compare the stats.

So even in your extremely biased view, Duncan had the best postseason of the two, great! Never mind Spurs play in a MUCH lower paced game, and is much more emphasized on defense where low scoring games are the norm.


so in other words he never led the league in anything :lol

ppg? No
rpg? No
apg? No
spg? No
bpg? No
fg% no
ft% no


Pau did make an impact and was the 2nd biggest reason why Kobe won #4 and 5.

LOL, someone leading the league in FG% is better than someone who never lead the league in those 7 categories you listed? James Donaldson > Clyde Drexler, Dirk, and Pippen.

Just when I thought you can't put up dumber arguments, you come on as a full on retard. The IQ bar for a Kobestan is getting lower and lower.

[Jodelo]

Damn... Statfag just got destroyed!

http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121007165231/adventuretimewithfinnandjake/images/2/2b/Apply_cold_water_to_burned_area.jpeg