Northwestern ruling sends clear message: NCAA, it's time to negotiate

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Presented without bolding for your reading enjoyment:


Now, the schools -- which, let's face it, are the NCAA -- must choose. Do they make a deal with the athletes? Or do they risk any or all of the following?

• An ultimately unfavorable ruling in the O'Bannon case that would essentially make it illegal to televise a college football game without explicitly compensating the participants.

• An ultimately unfavorable NLRB ruling that would recognize players as employees. That would require schools to sink money into worker's compensation, but it also could have a much bigger impact. If football players are employees, then the schools are employers. From a legal standpoint, they would be very much in the football business. The football business is not part of a school's educational mission, and someone in Congress might look at all those cable-network dollars and decide it's time schools started paying taxes on that revenue.

• An ultimately unfavorable ruling in the case Kessler is bringing, which essentially would declare the entire business model for major college sports illegal.

The schools and NCAA could fight these cases, but there will only be more. The lawyers smell money, and they aren't going away until they get it. The players are compensated with tuition, room and board, but they haven't gotten a raise since the 1950s. Now, they're the stars of a wildly popular series of television shows. In a courtroom, outside the insular system that is college athletics, the NCAA's arguments sound ludicrous. In February, an attorney representing the NCAA tried to claim that television broadcasts are protected by the first amendment. You could test his claim by bringing a camera and streaming the Michigan-Ohio State game on the Internet, but ESPN -- which pays several million dollars to televise the game -- and the Big Ten would put the lie to it by burying you in cease-and-desist letters that threaten very costly legal action.

Unfortunately for the NCAA, that is its cornerstone argument in the O'Bannon case. Meanwhile, Northwestern faces an uphill climb on appeal. Graduation rates mean nothing to the NLRB. Neither does the argument that players get an exceptional educational opportunity. What matters is whether there is an exchange of compensation that provides a financial benefit to the employer. "This is not even close," said Ramogi Huma, the college sports reformer who helped the Northwestern players form the College Athletes Players Association. "It's not even a gray area. They lost every argument they made."

Jeffrey Kessler is an interesting guy. He has been hired by players unions multiple times to form the antitrust arguments. They always settle before review but he has been doing little else but trying to fuck sports trusts for decades.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20140327/ncaa-athletes-union-ruling-northwestern/

[DarrinS]

Anyone think this is a good thing?

[clambake]

there's no football without players.

[TeyshaBlue]

Anyone think this is a good thing?

Yes and no. I think we will likely substitute one set of problems for another. unquestionably the athletes create value for the NCAA system and the schools.
I would recommend some type of institutionalized trust system to shepherd the athletes income for them. Maybe pay a stipend from the salary with the balance paid to the athlete upon graduation.

[TeyshaBlue]

The old fart in me says hell no. Of course that idiot still thinks the Southwest Conference should still exist.:lol

[DarrinS]

It just seems to me that you already have a coddled group of "students" that are getting a free education -- and now they are going to get paid on top of that?



Why not use the windfall profits that football and basketball generate and do something for the other students? For example, lower tuition.

[TeyshaBlue]

Because the athletes are generating income far in excess of tuition/room and board.
I do like the idea of that income going to the general fund but if you have to start accounting for income and disbursements, that GL ledger will have to be maintained seperately as a independent profit center.

[baseline bum]

It just seems to me that you already have a coddled group of "students" that are getting a free education -- and now they are going to get paid on top of that?


The elite players basically major in football or basketball. I'd hardly call them coddled when they don't own the right to capitalize off their fame by doing paid endorsements, charging for autographs, etc without being booted from the second best professional league in the nation, when they are not allowed to enter the best one yet.




Why not use the windfall profits that football and basketball generate and do something for the other students? For example, lower tuition.

For the same reason we don't get lower ticket prices to Spurs games after the owners won shorter contracts and smaller raises in the last labor negotiation: because it has already been established what amount people will pay to attend Spurs games. Same shit with college.

[MannyIsGod]

http://www.phdcomics.com/comics/archive/phd102008s.gif

[DarrinS]

^That's a damn shame

[DarrinS]

I think the same applies to top-tier HS football coaches

[pgardn]

^That's a damn shame

The public likes their entertainment. They could give money to graduate programs or buy season tickets. Pretty obvious the choice they have made.

This looks like it will be very difficult. The stipend for a woman on the golf team... hmmm. They put in time practicing and traveling that takes away from their school work. If you give the highest revenue earners a larger stipend... Big fat legal mess imo.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

It just seems to me that you already have a coddled group of "students" that are getting a free education -- and now they are going to get paid on top of that?



Why not use the windfall profits that football and basketball generate and do something for the other students? For example, lower tuition.

We should cap your income arbitrarily because we can.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

It just seems to me that you already have a coddled group of "students" that are getting a free education -- and now they are going to get paid on top of that?



Why not use the windfall profits that football and basketball generate and do something for the other students? For example, lower tuition.

How do you think the NCAA pays for all the track and volleyball scholarships? Nice marxist sentiment nonetheless.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

The public likes their entertainment. They could give money to graduate programs or buy season tickets. Pretty obvious the choice they have made.

This looks like it will be very difficult. The stipend for a woman on the golf team... hmmm. They put in time practicing and traveling that takes away from their school work. If you give the highest revenue earners a larger stipend... Big fat legal mess imo.

Not really. There is a playbook in how this works out. The NCAA needs to recognize the students and negotiate a CBA or its equivalent amongst them. If they are smart they will get in front of this and mobilize the lesser sports who are also their employees and get them on the path to preserving the current communist system. If you read the article the NW football team isn't asking for a windfall either.

[Blake]

^That's a damn shame

College football is a for-profit business so if the coach is able to generate the revenue, I don't have a problem with the million dollar salaries.

[Blake]

Too many "now what will this actually mean for college sports" questions to even begin to form an opinion if this is ultimately good or bad.

What I do know is that it sucks that the NCAA makes billions off of college football players and only gives them peanuts in return. That's wrong.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Too many "now what will this actually mean for college sports" questions to even begin to form an opinion if this is ultimately good or bad.

What I do know is that it sucks that the NCAA makes billions off of college football players and only gives them peanuts in return. That's wrong.

Think about how much money Tebow made the NCAA. He didn't even finish his NFL rookie contract. I don't watch college sports. When kids get hurt it pisses me off.

[DarrinS]

Think about how much money Tebow made the NCAA. He didn't even finish his NFL rookie contract. I don't watch college sports. When kids get hurt it pisses me off.

:cry That's because you care so much :cry

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:cry That's because you care so much :cry

I control my emotions. That does not mean that I avoid feeling them. Stoics are cowards.

[TSA]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/check-out-the-terrible-paper-that-earned-a-player-an-a--at-north-carolina-151005969.html

[Blake]

Think about how much money Tebow made the NCAA. He didn't even finish his NFL rookie contract. I don't watch college sports. When kids get hurt it pisses me off.

The NCAA also was making money off of selling Manziel jerseys but they wouldn't let him sign autographs for a few bucks.

So many hypocritical things wrong with the NCAA.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The rule that college athletes can't get paid goes against every free market ideal imaginable, which makes it that much more hilarious seeing Republicans try to justify it :lmao

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

They either need to let football + basketball players get paid or, preferably, get rid of the bullshit rules that force kids to play college ball for free which any unbiased court would consider an anti-trust agreement. If the NFL and NBA didn't have college programs to help develop talent and had to create a minor league system like the MLB has, this wouldn't be an issue at all.

[pgardn]

You gotta wonder about a student who can get into a good school but can't afford the tuition because they don't entertain the masses. Gotta say it would piss me off. I guess being an alumna who contributes to society later is not entertainment.

Yes, I watch the stuff so I contribute. The commercials must seep into my head. It has always seemed like schools should be separated from sports in the modern world. You don't go get a bunch of guys randomly together and play for a school anymore.

So when does this invade HS sports?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/check-out-the-terrible-paper-that-earned-a-player-an-a--at-north-carolina-151005969.html

I don't see what the big deal is with that paper. It's a simple one paragraph narrative that included several quotations. The quotations were done correctly but for once which would explain the minus. Its an introductory writing class likely remedial. They offer that within the curriculum at all schools.

That is unless you want to get upset because he used the grammatically correct "white people" and the like as subjects. I have taught reading/writing and as shitty writing goes that is quite intelligible and uses higher level punctuation techniques correctly.

[boutons_deux]

Coaches Make $358,000 In Bonuses For Reaching NCAA Tournament Final Four (http://thinkprogress.org/sports/2014/04/01/3421357/coaches-make-358000-in-bonuses-for-reaching-ncaa-tournament-final-four/)

If you believe the NCAA, college athletics are predicated on the ideal of amateurism, and introducing money into the system would render it untenable economically and unappealing to the masses of fans who watch events like the NCAA Tournament every year. Thankfully for the four men who coach the teams that made the Final Four, those rules don’t apply to them. There may not be enough to pay the players, but there’s plenty to hand to coaches.

The four head coaches who will take their teams to Arlington, Texas for the Final Four next week will collect a total of $358,333 in bonuses (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/college/final-coaches-cash-ncaa-tournament-success-article-1.1740787) for getting there, as the New York Daily News noted Monday. But there’s more: counting other bonuses the coaches have already received, the tally rises to more than $500,000. And adding in the bonuses for assistants and athletic directors, the total could stretch past $1 million by the end of the tournament (and that doesn’t count the bonuses coaches from other schools collected for making the tournament and advancing).

Kentucky leads the way. John Calipari, whose annual base salary is roughly $5.4 million, will pocket $175,000 for taking the Wildcats to their third Final Four in four years, a a nice addition to the $200,000 in bonuses he’s already made this postseason.

As Deadspin’s Tom Ley found (http://deadspin.com/aaron-harrisons-game-winner-made-329-166-for-his-coac-1555196820), Kentucky guard Aaron Harrison’s game-winning shot over Michigan on Sunday night netted Calipari, Kentucky’s assistant coaches, and athletic director Mitch Barnhart a total of $330,000 in bonuses.

But he’s not alone. Florida’s Billy Donovan has already earned $187,500 in bonuses (http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/10622881/billy-donovan-reaping-financial-rewards-florida-gators-success) this postseason, including the $37,500 bonus he made for taking the Gators to the NCAA Tournament. That bonus increased to $75,000 when Florida made the Sweet 16 and $100,000 when the beat Dayton to reach the Final Four. If Donovan and Florida win the title, it’ll rise to $150,000. That’s on top of a $3.5 million base salary.

Wisconsin coach Bo Ryan earned $50,000 for making the Final Four; according to USA Today’s Steve Berkowitz (https://twitter.com/ByBerkowitz/status/446722515961139202), he had already collected $50,000 for making the tournament and $50,000 more for making the Sweet 16. Connecticut’s Kevin Ollie earned $33,333 for making the Final Four in just his second year at the helm. He’s now made $100,000 in bonuses (http://www.star-telegram.com/2014/03/30/5693516/dallas-born-kevin-ollie-a-rising.html) this postseason.

Calipari, though, could be the biggest winner. If Kentucky wins its ninth title on Monday night, the fifth-year coach will earn an additional $375,000 bonus.

http://thinkprogress.org/sports/2014/04/01/3421357/coaches-make-358000-in-bonuses-for-reaching-ncaa-tournament-final-four/

"Glory Road", indeed!

[TSA]

As a collegiate athlete I got to see first hand what some of these classes were like. I had some where I simply showed up and the teacher marked me present and I could leave, some would even just mark all the athletes present regardless if they showed up or not. Now I was only playing collegiate golf so I wasn't catered too like the athletes in the bigger programs but still, it's a joke.


I don't see what the big deal is with that paper. It's a simple one paragraph narrative that included several quotations. The quotations were done correctly but for once which would explain the minus. Its an introductory writing class likely remedial. They offer that within the curriculum at all schools.

That is unless you want to get upset because he used the grammatically correct "white people" and the like as subjects. I have taught reading/writing and as shitty writing goes that is quite intelligible and uses higher level punctuation techniques correctly.

"However, it is worth noting that the paper noted above is actually plagiarized almost word-for-word from the very first page of Parks' own autobiography. The fact that the student in question did not receive a failing grade in the class, as stipulated under UNC's honor code, is another mark against the school, regardless of Willingham's motives."

http://www.amazon.com/Rosa-Parks-My-Story/dp/0141301201/#reader_0141301201

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

As a collegiate athlete I got to see first hand what some of these classes were like. I had some where I simply showed up and the teacher marked me present and I could leave, some would even just mark all the athletes present regardless if they showed up or not. Now I was only playing collegiate golf so I wasn't catered too like the athletes in the bigger programs but still, it's a joke.



This is only proof the "student" part is a joke.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

As a collegiate athlete I got to see first hand what some of these classes were like. I had some where I simply showed up and the teacher marked me present and I could leave, some would even just mark all the athletes present regardless if they showed up or not. Now I was only playing collegiate golf so I wasn't catered too like the athletes in the bigger programs but still, it's a joke.



"However, it is worth noting that the paper noted above is actually plagiarized almost word-for-word from the very first page of Parks' own autobiography. The fact that the student in question did not receive a failing grade in the class, as stipulated under UNC's honor code, is another mark against the school, regardless of Willingham's motives."

http://www.amazon.com/Rosa-Parks-My-Story/dp/0141301201/#reader_0141301201

If it was plagiarized and the teacher didn't notice then it is what it is.

That being said you needing remedial classes does explain many things.

[TSA]

If it was plagiarized and the teacher didn't notice then it is what it is.

That being said you needing remedial classes does explain many things.

Unfortunately for me the only classes I got to do that in were some electives. I had friends playing football the got their degrees with 1/3 of the amount of effort the rest of us did. Were you in any athletics in college? Same experience for you?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Unfortunately for me the only classes I got to do that in were some electives. I had friends playing football the got their degrees with 1/3 of the amount of effort the rest of us did. Were you in any athletics in college? Same experience for you?

A degree in black history or what? I didn't play but I knew athletes from several sports. I helped a lot of people in school. I helped this one girl and she gave me a Thanksgiving picture book she had to write a report on. Nice girl who tried hard. She was never given any good schooling and her vernacular made it such that she could not write how she talked.

When you have someone like that you not only have to teach them but you have to get them to interpret what they already know into that. The paragraph in the OP was a string of 6 or so coherent sentences using quotations. It was about half of what I had my girl turn in.

I get the idea that athletics allows in some very hard working and underprivileged kids into college. They learn remedial bullshit. Hopefully by the end they can write a couple of papers and do some cheesey project which is what is required for most liberal arts degrees.

Your friends were not required to take those courses. If they did because they were easy then whatever but some kids need that shit and it is not easy for them.

[boutons_deux]

U.S. Labor Department Calls NFL Cheerleaders 'Seasonal Amusement' -- Says They Don't Deserve Minimum Wage
http://www.alternet.org/economy/us-labor-department-calls-nfl-cheerleaders-seasonal-amusement-says-they-dont-deserve-minimum?akid=11666.187590.YdsqKg&rd=1&src=newsletter977638&t=17&paging=off&current_page=1#bookmark

I figure most of them make incomes, cash!, lying on their backs, year round.

[Clipper Nation]

Tbh, the debate shouldn't be about paying players, it should be about which fairer system will be put in place when college sports as we know it inevitably collapses from paying players....