Race To The Extra Second Round Pick

[ABC]

This has been discussed a bit in various threads, but as it now seems like more than a remote possibility, I thought I'd start a thread to keep tabs on it.

If the Clippers finish with a top 5 record this year, the Spurs will receive their second round pick in the upcoming 2014 draft. The Spurs received the Clippers top-55 protected second round pick via New Orleans in exchange for Curtis Jerrells in 2010. If the Clippers finish outside of the top 5 this year, the "Clippers' obligation to San Antonio will be extinguished." If the Clippers tie for 5th best record, I believe there will be random drawing to determine draft position and, therefore, whether the Spurs receive the pick or the Clippers retain it.

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 62-18
Thunder 58-21
Clippers 55-24
Heat 54-25
Pacers 54-26
Rockets 52-27

The Clippers have 3 games left and their magic number to guarantee a top 5 record is currently 1 (although they have already clinched at worst a tie for 5th best record, which would necessitate a random draw for draft position).

[Prime Time]

This and that Theo Ratliff trade shall be our most underrated move(s) :stirpot:

[Chinook]

Awesome thread idea. This has been a thing I've harped on all season. The Clippers are currently tied with Miami in the loss column, so it's very possible that they have to stay in front of Houston at all costs. The 56/57 pick could be decent this year if enough prospects like Jaiteh (unlikely to stay in) and Antetokounmpo (likely) currently projected as late seconds.

[Hoops Czar]

If the Mavs finish in the top 10, OKC gets their first round pick.

[Aztecfan03]

If the Mavs finish in the top 10, OKC gets their first round pick.

So go Memphis and Phoenix.

[Chinook]

So go Memphis and Phoenix.

Rather, go Brooklyn, Toronto and Chicago.

[Aztecfan03]

Rather, go Brooklyn, Toronto and Chicago.
Right now Dallas is 11 so memphis and phoenix staying ahead will work. Toronto catching up those 2 games would help too.

[Chinook]

Right now Dallas is 11 so memphis and phoenix staying ahead will work. Toronto catching up those 2 games would help too.

Yeah, but that puts Dallas out of the playoffs. I still want them at eight, so someone else in the East has to pass them. Also, currently, Dallas is 17th, not 11th.

[Aztecfan03]

Yeah, but that puts Dallas out of the playoffs. I still want them at eight, so someone else in the East has to pass them. Also, currently, Dallas is 17th, not 11th.

Oh yeah. I don't care who we face in the first round and i'm not sure the 3-5 from the east can catch up to Dallas if Dallas plays well enough to get 8th spot

[cd021]

The Clippers have a good chance of catching OKC. Just 2 games back with a head to head matchup coming up in L.A. If they win that game, they would not only jump a game up in the standings, but win the season series 3-1. They also have a five game home stand where they spend 13 days in L.A. OKC has a tough road trip that includes Houston (that is the night after a home game against the Spurs but both Beverly and D12 will be out), Sac, LAC, & Phoenix

[ABC]

Awesome thread idea.

:toast

This and that Theo Ratliff trade shall be our most underrated move(s) :stirpot:

:tu

Just some tidbits: The Clippers record in 2010, the year they traded this pick, was 29-53. The idea of them being a top-5 team in 2014 seemed extremely remote.

As Prime Time noted, the Spurs also own Charlotte's 2016 2nd round pick, top-55 protected, obtained in exchange for Theo Ratliff, also in 2010. Charlotte was 44-38 in 2010. They are currently 35-38. Anything can happen in two years though.

[Chinook]

:toast


:tu

Just some tidbits: The Clippers record in 2010, the year they traded this pick, was 29-53. The idea of them being a top-5 team in 2014 seemed extremely remote.

As Prime Time noted, the Spurs also own Charlotte's 2016 2nd round pick, top-55 protected, obtained in exchange for Theo Ratliff, also in 2010. Charlotte was 44-38 in 2010. They are currently 35-38. Anything can happen in two years though.

Yeah, if Miami blows up their Big Three and the Pacers lose Stephenson in free agency, there will be a hole for East supremacy. Chicago and Toronto probably have the inside track at, but you never know.

[Cklbmk]

Awesome thread idea. This has been a thing I've harped on all season. The Clippers are currently tied with Miami in the loss column, so it's very possible that they have to stay in front of Houston at all costs. The 56/57 pick could be decent this year if enough prospects like Jaiteh (unlikely to stay in) and Antetokounmpo (likely) currently projected as late seconds.


I'm really confused what you're trying to say here.

You realize Antetokounmpo is a Buck and has been playing all season, right?

[exstatic]

I'm really confused what you're trying to say here.

You realize Antetokounmpo is a Buck and has been playing all season, right?

He has a brother playing in the d-league that is draft eligible. He's projected as a second rounder, mid to late.

[Chinook]

I'm really confused what you're trying to say here.

You realize Antetokounmpo is a Buck and has been playing all season, right?

What exstatic said.

[playblair]

playblairs top 5 choices for the 2 2nd round picks

Glenn Robinson SF
20 yrs; 6'6"; 210 lbs.

Isaiah Austin C
20 yrs; 7'1"; 220 lbs.

Patrick Young PF/C
22 yrs; 6'9"; 249 lbs.

Keith Appling PG
22 yrs; 6'2"; 170 lbs.

Shabazz Napier PG
22 yrs; 6'1"; 182 lbs.

[Cklbmk]

He has a brother playing in the d-league that is draft eligible. He's projected as a second rounder, mid to late.


Wow.. 2 antetokounmpos... lol

[ABC]

Wow.. 2 antetokounmpos... lol

"Giannis has two older brothers, named Francis and Thanasis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thanasis_Antetokounmpo), as well as two younger brothers, named Kostas and Alexis."

[Darkwaters]

So......go Clippers?

[eyeh8u]

I yearn for the day we can have an all Antetokounmpo starting lineup, just to listen to the commentators.

[KawhiLeonard]

Another stash pick tbh

[ABC]

So......go Clippers?

That's the short, short version :)

[ABC]

Another stash pick tbh

Seems like a good bet. There likely won't be many roster spots available next year. It'd be a waste to draft and cut.

[cd021]

I yearn for the day we can have an all Antetokounmpo starting lineup, just to listen to the commentators.

They'd be calling him "The Ant" :lol

[cd021]

Wow.. 2 antetokounmpos... lol

Its odd. Seems in the last 5 or 6 years there has been a ton of siblings in the NBA (Lopez's, Morris' Landry's, Curry's, Gasols Teagues, Plumlees and Zellers)or 2nd generation players (Curry, Thompson, Rice Jr. Hardaway Jr.)

[BatManu20]

playblairs top 5 choices for the 2 2nd round picks

Glenn Robinson SF
20 yrs; 6'6"; 210 lbs.

Isaiah Austin C
20 yrs; 7'1"; 220 lbs.

Patrick Young PF/C
22 yrs; 6'9"; 249 lbs.

Keith Appling PG
22 yrs; 6'2"; 170 lbs.

Shabazz Napier PG
22 yrs; 6'1"; 182 lbs.

Glenn Robinson Jr will be a 1st round pick.. Or very early 2nd at worst. That is if he comes out.

[Kool Bob Love]

http://youtu.be/tmOhk8Fv5ZE

[Captivus]

I'm really confused what you're trying to say here.

You realize Antetokounmpo is a Buck and has been playing all season, right?

Theres one thing I learned when posting in forums...never go against Chinook.
A quick mock draft search would have given you the answer.

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 58-16
Thunder 53-19
Clippers 53-22
Heat 51-22
Pacers 52-23
Rockets 49-23

Clippers magic number to stay in the top 5 records is currently 7.

[superbigtime]

Nice to have a pick, but if it is this low so are my expectations.

[ABC]

Nice to have a pick, but if it is this low so are my expectations.

Amir Johnson, 56, 2005
Isaiah Thomas, 60, 2011
Manu Ginobili, 57, 1999
Luis Scola, 55, 2002

Don't get your expectations up, get your hopes up :)

[Chinook]

Amir Johnson, 56, 2005
Isaiah Thomas, 60, 2011
Manu Ginobili, 57, 1999
Luis Scola, 55, 2002

Don't get your expectations up, get your hopes up :)

Don't forget Mills at 55 in 09. But even a prospect like Hanga, Thomas or Denmon is worth something. This is house money the team is playing with here.

[TheyCallMePro]

Nice and informative thread. Thanks. I'll keep an eye on the Clippers now and hope they stay in the top 5 record wise so we can get that extra second round pick.

Some late second round guys that will be available and which I'd really like the Spurs to get:

1) Luke Hancock - Louisville.
2) Ron Baker (if he comes out) - Wichita State
3) Ethan Wragge - Creighton
4) Langston Galloway - St Joe's.
5) Devin Oliver - Dayton
6) Joe Harris - Virginia
7) George Niang - Iowa State
8) Rondae-Hollis Jefferson - Arizona
9) Frank Kaminsky (will probably go higher now though) - Wisconsin
10) Cady Lalanne- Umass

[ThomasamohT]

For teams that make the playoffs, pick order is determined by how far you get in the playoffs and then by regular season winning percentage. In order for the clips to finish with one of the bottom 5 picks they will need to make it to the conference finals.

[Chinook]

For teams that make the playoffs, pick order is determined by how far you get in the playoffs and then by regular season winning percentage. In order for the clips to finish with one of the bottom 5 picks they will need to make it to the conference finals.

No. It's not. This isn't the NFL.

[Spursfanfromafar]

Amir Johnson, 56, 2005
Isaiah Thomas, 60, 2011
Manu Ginobili, 57, 1999
Luis Scola, 55, 2002

Don't get your expectations up, get your hopes up :)

Ramon Sessions, 56, 2007
Marcin Gortat, 57, 2005

Not bad picks at that late, either!

[99 Problems]

Nice to have a pick, but if it is this low so are my expectations.


I think some of the heat may have gone out of the top 10 but the talent overall deep into the 50s is exciting this year.

[Captivus]

For teams that make the playoffs, pick order is determined by how far you get in the playoffs and then by regular season winning percentage. In order for the clips to finish with one of the bottom 5 picks they will need to make it to the conference finals.

No. RS only.

[superbigtime]

I think some of the heat may have gone out of the top 10 but the talent overall deep into the 50s is exciting this year. True, true. Spurs have shown they can make things happen with lower picks, and I'm all for taking a pick which would otherwise be owned by the Clips.

[exstatic]

For teams that make the playoffs, pick order is determined by how far you get in the playoffs and then by regular season winning percentage. In order for the clips to finish with one of the bottom 5 picks they will need to make it to the conference finals.

Nope. Where on earth did you get that idea? If that were the case, we would have picked 29th last year, being the runner up in the Finals. We picked 28th.

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 58-16
Thunder 53-19
Clippers 53-22
Heat 51-22
Pacers 52-23
Rockets 49-24

The Clippers have 7 games left and their magic number to stay in the top 5 records is currently 6.

[ABC]

Manu Ginobili, 57, 1999
Luis Scola, 55, 2002
Amir Johnson, 56, 2005
Marcin Gortat, 57, 2005
Ramon Sessions, 56, 2007
Patty Mills, 55, 2009
Isaiah Thomas, 60, 2011

That's almost a quality NBA player in the bottom five picks of the second round every other year. :hungry:

[ElNono]

Can't wait to draft Kowalunga Finidi from the Republic of Congo...

[Drom John]

It's two bits worse than above.
Remove Scola and Mills, who weren't bottom five. 6th from the bottom is protected.

[Clipper Nation]

Spurfan begging for our pick :lol

[Dex]

Spurfan begging for our pick :lol

Ain't no begging about it. Sterling already sold you out for the corpse of Theo Ratliff.

[Chinook]

Ain't no begging about it. Sterling already sold you out for the corpse of Theo Ratliff.

Curtis Jerrells*

[Dex]

Oh yeah. That guy.

Time for more coffee. :wakeup

[tp2021]

Nice to have a pick, but if it is this low so are my expectations.

Having more assets can be conducive to a trade.

Trading for a big-name player this offseason, as opposed to trying to sign one after 2015, is discussed in this thread:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=230697

Shoutout to Chinook

[Budkin]

Nice to have a pick, but if it is this low so are my expectations.

This is where this FO excels.

[Chinook]

Having more assets can be conducive to a trade.

Trading for a big-name player this offseason, as opposed to trying to sign one after 2015, is discussed in this thread:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=230697

Shoutout to Chinook

Maybe Philly would be tempted to trade Thad Young for that extra second.

[Seventyniner]

Maybe Philly would be tempted to trade Thad Young for that extra second.

:lol

Clippers 2nd (#58?) + Spurs 2nd (#60) = anyone on the Sixers roster if the past is any guide.

[ABC]

It's two bits worse than above.
Remove Scola and Mills, who weren't bottom five. 6th from the bottom is protected.

:depressed

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 59-16
Thunder 54-19
Clippers 54-22
Heat 52-22
Pacers 53-23
Rockets 49-25

The Clippers have 6 games left and their magic number to stay in the top 5 records is currently 4.

[superbigtime]

Amir Johnson, 56, 2005
Isaiah Thomas, 60, 2011
Manu Ginobili, 57, 1999
Luis Scola, 55, 2002

Don't get your expectations up, get your hopes up :)

Ah yes. I absolutely hope for a great find in the 50s. But I won't be upset if it doesn't happen. If any FO can make lemonade it's the Spurs.

[ABC]

Ah yes. I absolutely hope for a great find in the 50s. But I won't be upset if it doesn't happen. If any FO can make lemonade it's the Spurs.

:tu

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 4th best record:

Spurs 59-17
Thunder 55-19
Heat 52-22
Clippers 54-23
Pacers 53-23
Rockets 49-25

The Clippers have 5 games left and their magic number to stay in the top 5 records is currently 4.

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 59-17
Thunder 55-20
Clippers 54-23
Heat 52-23
Pacers 53-24
Rockets 50-25

The Clippers have 5 games left and their magic number to stay in the top 5 records is currently 4.

[Captivus]

Looking at the schedule HOU has an easy one.
If LAC loses to OKC and POR then theres a big chance that the game they play against the Spurs could define this second round pick issue.

[Chinook]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 59-17
Thunder 55-20
Clippers 54-23
Heat 52-23
Pacers 53-24
Rockets 50-25

The Clippers have 5 games left and their magic number to stay in the top 5 records is currently 4.

Three. The Clippers have clinched all tie-breaks with Houston. If some combination of LAC wins and HOU losses equals three, then Los Angeles stays in the top five.

[cd021]

i really hope the Clippers catch Okc for the 2 seed. That would give them a decent chance to beat them in the 2nd round

[ABC]

Three. The Clippers have clinched all tie-breaks with Houston. If some combination of LAC wins and HOU losses equals three, then Los Angeles stays in the top five.

Not positive about this, but I thought that if the Clippers and Rockets finish with the same record, then the Clippers win the tie breaks for playoff placement, but draft position is determined by a coin flip.

[will_spurs]

Three. The Clippers have clinched all tie-breaks with Houston. If some combination of LAC wins and HOU losses equals three, then Los Angeles stays in the top five.

+ same with LAC vs Pacers and LAC vs Miami...

[ABC]

+ same with LAC vs Pacers and LAC vs Miami...

:tu

[BillMc]

i really hope the Clippers catch Okc for the 2 seed. That would give them a decent chance to beat them in the 2nd round

Completely agree though I think the odds are low they catch them. Hope I'm wrong though.

[Mel_13]

Thanks to ABC for this thread.

For those interested in this sort of stuff, this site may useful:

http://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Years/2014.htm

[ABC]

Thanks to ABC for this thread.

For those interested in this sort of stuff, this site may useful:

http://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Years/2014.htm

Thanks Mel :toast

[ABC]

Here's how the NBA handled ties last year:

"Four ties among teams that finished the 2012-13 NBA regular season with identical records were broken today through random drawings to help determine the order of selection for the 2013 NBA Draft (http://www.nba.com/draft), which will be held on Thursday, June 27."

http://www.nba.com/2013/news/04/19/draft-order-of-selection/

[Spursfanfromafar]

Thanks to ABC for this thread.

For those interested in this sort of stuff, this site may useful:

http://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Years/2014.htm

Thanks for the link.

I am confused though. The link suggests that the pick could transfer both to the Pelicans and the Spurs. How does it work?

[Mel_13]

Thanks for the link.

I am confused though. The link suggests that the pick could transfer both to the Pelicans and the Spurs. How does it work?

They're showing the history of the pick. It was first traded from the Clippers to the Pelicans and then to the Spurs. The last team to the right is the current owner.

[cd021]

Man the Suns have stockpiled picks. Phoenix has three 1st rounders (currently: 14th, 17th and 26th) along with Minnesota's top 12 pick and their own next season. Add that to Len (#3 pick in last years draft) and Goodwin (the Lakers pick from the Nash deal). Thats potentially 7 total 1st rounders from 2013-2015.

Not related but interesting.

[Spursfanfromafar]

They're showing the history of the pick. It was first traded from the Clippers to the Pelicans and then to the Spurs. The last team to the right is the current owner.

Thanks. Got it now.

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 60-17
Thunder 55-21
Clippers 55-23
Heat 53-23
Pacers 53-25
Rockets 51-25

The Clippers have 4 games left and their magic number to guarantee a top 5 record is currently 3 (although even 2 wins would clinch at worst a random draw for draft position).

[ducks]

Man the Suns have stockpiled picks. Phoenix has three 1st rounders (currently: 14th, 17th and 26th) along with Minnesota's top 12 pick and their own next season. Add that to Len (#3 pick in last years draft) and Goodwin (the Lakers pick from the Nash deal). Thats potentially 7 total 1st rounders from 2013-2015.

Not related but interesting.
suns are in great shape might make the playoff
suns need to get love though

su

[bluebellmaniac]

Not that much is expected of the pick, but it is nice to roll the dice with someone else's pick!

[bluebellmaniac]

What is the magic number for getting the Clips 2nd round pick?

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 60-18
Thunder 56-21
Clippers 55-23
Heat 53-24
Pacers 53-25
Rockets 52-25

The Clippers have 4 games left and their magic number to guarantee a top 5 record is currently 3 (although even 2 wins would clinch at worst a random draw for draft position).

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 60-18
Thunder 57-21
Clippers 55-24
Pacers 54-25
Heat 53-25
Rockets 52-26

The Clippers have 3 games left and their magic number to guarantee a top 5 record is currently 2 (although even 1 win would clinch at worst a random draw for draft position).

[bluebellmaniac]

What is the latest with this?

[Assman]

Seriously?

[ABC]

What is the latest with this?

Nothing has changed because none of the teams who really matter for this played tonight. To determine the Clippers' magic number to stay in the top 5 you take the total number of games in the season (82), add 1, subtract the Clippers' wins (55) and subtract the sixth place teams' (currently the Rockets) losses (26).

82+1-55-26=2

The Clippers and the Rockets didn't play, so the magic number is unaffected.

[ABC]

I guess there was a bit of news on this front. If the Rockets are really trying to stay in the 4th and avoid the 3rd spot like Harden implied, that would seem to help the chances of the Clippers staying in the top 5 and the Spurs receiving their pick.

[ABC]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 62-18
Thunder 58-21
Clippers 55-24
Heat 54-25
Pacers 54-26
Rockets 52-27

The Clippers have 3 games left and their magic number to guarantee a top 5 record is currently 1 (although they have already clinched at worst a tie for 5th best record, which would necessitate a random draw for draft position).

[Uriel]

The Clippers have the 3rd best record:

Spurs 62-18
Thunder 58-21
Clippers 55-24
Heat 54-25
Pacers 54-26
Rockets 52-27

The Clippers have 3 games left and their magic number to guarantee a top 5 record is currently 1 (although they have already clinched at worst a tie for 5th best record, which would necessitate a random draw for draft position).
We got this. :tu Amazing how our front office can score an extra draft pick by giving up someone as insignificant as Curtis Jerrells.

[Dex]

We got this. :tu Amazing how our front office can score an extra draft pick by giving up someone as insignificant as Curtis Jerrells.

But I thought the front office was terrible because they can't just magically pull a Ginobili out of their ass every year?

[Beaverfuzz]

What's the latest with this?

tl;dr

[Assman]

What's the latest with this?

tl;dr

You mean what changed in the 21 minutes between ABC's post and yours? Probably nothing.

[ElNono]

Now that we have the #1 seed all wrapped up, time to track this thing...

[Beaverfuzz]

You mean what changed in the 21 minutes between ABC's post and yours? Probably nothing.

Anything changed now?

[Aztecfan03]

Anything changed now?

Yes. Clippers won tonight so they clinched a top-5 record.

[Aztecfan03]

If the Mavs finish in the top 10, OKC gets their first round pick.

Not sure about tie-breakers, but Mavs are at 9 right now, ahead of Chicago and Memphis by two wins and zero losses( so 1 game). Dallas would have to lose to memphis and depending on tie breakers chicago and memphis would have to win out or lose 1( or 1 of those and toronto win out maybe) for okc to not get the pick.

[Captivus]

bump?

[ABC]

bump?

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=231401&p=7241317

[Captivus]

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=231401&p=7241317

Thx, I looked for a new thread but didnt see that one.

[ABC]

Thx, I looked for a new thread but didnt see that one.

No worries. It fell out of the first few pages like a rock.

For others looking, the Spurs did obtain the Clippers' second round pick. Here is info. about it:


http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=231401&p=7241317

/thread