Gotta love Obamacare

[Wild Cobra]

Wow. Watch everyone's faces:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UuA2_P-m4Sk

[TSA]

Well if Jeff can't afford it...thanks Obama

[boutons_deux]

Well if Jeff can't afford it...thanks Obama

the insurance companies set the prices, not obama

[Wild Cobra]

the insurance companies set the prices, not obama
Based on the new and improved requirements.

Think they can operate at a loss?

[Spurminator]

Based on the new and improved requirements.

Think they can operate at a loss?

Think they're anywhere close to operating at a loss?

[boutons_deux]

i read a couple weeks some of the insurance companies are seeing greatly increased revenues

the long term question will it be enough to cover claims

[Wild Cobra]

Think they're anywhere close to operating at a loss?
How close to zero revenue should they be comrade?

[Spurminator]

How close to zero revenue should they be comrade?

Nowhere close, and they aren't. You're the one that suggested there is anything close to a risk of that. Good soldier.

[Wild Cobra]

Nowhere close, and they aren't. You're the one that suggested there is anything close to a risk of that. Good soldier.
I am suggesting that if they didn't raise their prices because of the added requirements they must meet, that they would be at a loss.

[Spurminator]

I am suggesting that if they didn't raise their prices because of the added requirements they must meet, that they would be at a loss.

:lol Would they? Did they tell you that?

[Spurminator]

Reduced profits <> Operating at a loss

[Wild Cobra]

Reduced profits <> Operating at a loss
Does it matter? It's a competitive market and companies will reduce their prices to where they can to attract more market share. If you care to show evidence they make too much profit, have at it.

[rascal]

I am suggesting that if they didn't raise their prices because of the added requirements they must meet, that they would be at a loss.

Don't buy that lie.

[Wild Cobra]

Don't buy that lie.
Prove it's a lie.

My God man. this was pointed out over and over, by experts of varying disciplines, years ago, that Obamacare would raise costs. You guys believed the leftist propaganda then, and you refuse to buy the FACTS that the left lied, and the right was right.

[Spurminator]

Does it matter? It's a competitive market and companies will reduce their prices to where they can to attract more market share. If you care to show evidence they make too much profit, have at it.

You didn't answer the question. Don't ask me for evidence when you consistently prove unwilling to provide your own. How do you know they'd be operating at a loss if they had kept costs flat?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

^Wild Chodebrah accusing someone of buying into propaganda :lmao

[Wild Cobra]

You didn't answer the question. Don't ask me for evidence when you consistently prove unwilling to provide your own. How do you know they'd be operating at a loss if they had kept costs flat?
I think the fact is is costing more is plenty of evidence. Past concerns from the right are proving correct. Do you deny that?

[Wild Cobra]

Remember this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uC4bXmcUvw

There were some republicans that actually read the bill and tried to stop it. there were several warnings coming true today.

[Spurminator]

I think the fact is is costing more is plenty of evidence.

Because they'd never otherwise raise prices unless they were at risk of operating at a loss. I suppose you also believe layoffs only happen when companies just can't afford to pay for so many employees anymore. They are our benevolent job creators, after all.


Past concerns from the right are proving correct. Do you deny that?

Is it supposed to impress me that people knew that multi-billion dollar companies would take advantage of controversial government regulation to raise prices and blame anyone but themselves? I knew this would happen too. I guess I get imaginary points or something too? Cool!

It's still ultimately their choice to raise costs.

[boutons_deux]

Remember this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uC4bXmcUvw

There were some republicans that actually read the bill and tried to stop it. there were several warnings coming true today.

they weren't/aren't trying to stop it rationally, just reflexive, automatic obstructionism to anything Dem, denying the Dems' legitimacy, ability to govern

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Based on the new and improved requirements.

Think they can operate at a loss?

Your corporate overlords are making record profits.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

http://www.forbes.com/sites/brucejapsen/2013/10/26/despite-glitches-obamacare-profit-windfall-to-insurers-well-underway/

[Spurminator]

In another life, WC complained that government regulations against child labor caused costs to rise.

[baseline bum]

In another life, WC complained that government regulations against child labor caused costs to rise.

This one too likely

[Wild Cobra]

In another life, WC complained that government regulations against child labor caused costs to rise.


This one too likely
OK, where's the third stooge?

Oh wait...

I have him on IGNORE!

[Spurminator]

Come on soldier, you can do better than that!

[Drachen]

I think the fact is is costing more is plenty of evidence. Past concerns from the right are proving correct. Do you deny that?

I agree with WC here. Back in 2006 when I was selling health and life insurance, I couldn't get in front of any potential customers. Like none. Every time I would call someone, they were all very polite, but they inevitably said "no thank you, I don't need to switch. My health insurance premium went down by a significant amount this year and has been creeping down at an ever faster rate for 7 or 8 years now." Obamacare seems to have reversed that trend.

[RandomGuy]

How close to zero revenue should they be comrade?

So an insurance company has to provide health insurance and charge enough to have profits?

Doesn't that force the cost of insurance, healthcare to be more than it would be without the profit motive?

How much administrative overhead for the average US hospital/physician is caused by the variety of health insurers and what they will/won't cover and how much they will pay?

[RandomGuy]

I agree with WC here. Back in 2006 when I was selling health and life insurance, I couldn't get in front of any potential customers. Like none. Every time I would call someone, they were all very polite, but they inevitably said "no thank you, I don't need to switch. My health insurance premium went down by a significant amount this year and has been creeping down at an ever faster rate for 7 or 8 years now." Obamacare seems to have reversed that trend.

How much increase in premiums is due to falling bond returns?

Post hoc propter hoc fallacy. You have not eliminated other possible causes of premium increases.

[boutons_deux]

My health insurance premium went down by a significant amount this year and has been creeping down at an ever faster rate for 7 or 8 years now.

anecdotes are nearly always meaningless.

Health Premiums Up 50 Percent From 2003 to 2010 - Report

http://media.nationaljournal.com/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=13068

http://www.nationaljournal.com/healthcare/health-premiums-up-50-percent-from-2003-to-2010-report-20111117

[101A]

In all seriousness. The employer should simply drop health insurance. He's obviously small enough, he won't need to pay a penalty. Then his employees could each go onto the exchange, pick up the plan/premium that works best for them, AND qualify for a subsidy. As long as the employer offers a plan, a subsidy is not available to any of his employees. His agent should have pointed this out to him (the agent would then lose income, however, so he most likely hasn't).

[boutons_deux]

anecdotes are nearly always meaningless.

Health Premiums Up 50 Percent From 2003 to 2010 - Report

http://media.nationaljournal.com/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=13068

http://www.nationaljournal.com/healthcare/health-premiums-up-50-percent-from-2003-to-2010-report-20111117



The above shows why and how the for-profit health care racket is the biggest destroyer of household wealth, and why a no-profit federal health insurance (medicare from birth) is the only solution. And then add in no-profit govt owned/operated hospitals, clinics with medical staff as govt employees where their only financial incentive is health care delivery efficiency.

[Drachen]

Jesus Christ people. Ok let me spell it out for you.


I agree with WC here. Back in 2006 when I was selling health and life insurance, I couldn't get in front of any potential customers. Like none. Every time I would call someone, they were all very polite, but they inevitably said "no thank you, I don't need to switch. My health insurance premium went down by a significant amount this year and has been creeping down at an ever faster rate for 7 or 8 years now." Obamacare seems to have reversed that trend.

[TeyshaBlue]

:lol:lol

[MannyIsGod]

I agree with WC here. Back in 2006 when I was selling health and life insurance, I couldn't get in front of any potential customers. Like none. Every time I would call someone, they were all very polite, but they inevitably said "no thank you, I don't need to switch. My health insurance premium went down by a significant amount this year and has been creeping down at an ever faster rate for 7 or 8 years now." Obamacare seems to have reversed that trend.

:tu

I too experienced the same difficulty when I was selling Health Insurance back in the early 2000s. In those good Bush years, premiums just kept dropping!!!

[Wild Cobra]

So an insurance company has to provide health insurance and charge enough to have profits?

Doesn't that force the cost of insurance, healthcare to be more than it would be without the profit motive?

From a static viewpoint, it probably does. However, when profit is no longer a concern, inefficiency increases. this is how it ends up costing more. Just look at almost any government run program. very few operate as efficiently as a for profit business.

[RandomGuy]

From a static viewpoint, it probably does. However, when profit is no longer a concern, inefficiency increases. this is how it ends up costing more. Just look at almost any government run program. very few operate as efficiently as a for profit business.

How do you know that? Data?

[boutons_deux]

"when profit is no longer a concern, inefficiency increases"

Like in your corrupt, wasteful beloved military?