What has happened to Timmy's defense and rebounding?

[TDfan2007]

His defense has taken a nosedive in just about every way since the playoffs have started. He's routinely getting beat to rebounds, staring at the ball-handler off of the pnr (even more than usual), and is even late on his helpside rotations. The Spurs need Timmy to be far more engaged defensively for the rest of this series, especially since he'll be guarding non-factors in Adams/Collison/Perkins for most of the game.

My main question is where did this massive drop in defensive execution and effectiveness come from?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

He is moving like shit because of his knees most likely.

[superbigtime]

dude has 80,000 miles on arthritic knees

[Splits]

He's done, take him out to pasture. Is it too late to tank for Wiggins?

[TheGoldStandard]

Coasting

[Ron Swanson]

He's done, take him out to pasture. Is it too late to tank for Wiggins?

Bonner and our 1st to Cleveland should do it.

[Splits]

468864242113064960

[SpurPadre]

He gets a free pass because he's frickin' TD but then so should Manu because he's frickin' Manu. They're both way past their primes and still giving it their all at this point in their respective careers. We gotta take anything they can currently give us, tbh. Everyone else in the team is open to scrutiny.

[Prime Time]

Well, the dude is 38. The fact he can still get 27&7 at this age is unreal.

[LoneStarState'sPride]

#21 being the scrub we all know he really is, tbh.

[Prime Time]

He gets a free pass because he's frickin' TD but then so should Manu because he's frickin' Manu. They're both way past their primes and still giving it their all at this point in their respective careers. We gotta take anything they can currently give us, tbh. Everyone else in the team is open to scrutiny.
Manu gets hated on due to the 'mistakes' he made even in his prime. But that's really just spoiled Spurs fans being spoiled.

:cry:cry We should have 7 titles :cry:cry

[spurraider21]

Duncan's lack of mobility on the defensive end is nothing new. Defensively, he does well against teams that play big, since it allows him to camp out in front of the rim

[Dverde]

I think this is a great thread. Timmy has falling off the allowing offensive rebounding stat. Tiago has shielded him on it.

[spurs10]

Well his shoulders are probably tired from carrying the bench for the Mavs series. He is also still scoring a lot. 27 points is insane! Sorry he's not doing enough for you! :lol

[Man In Black]

Tim...DO WHAT YOU DO...the system will drop 115 points on those scrubs from OKC. Rest up so you can take home TITLE #5.

[ElNono]

He got old. Luckily, he has help and he'll have his up games too. We wouldn't be where we are without him.

[Prose]

Well, the dude is 38. The fact he can still get 27&7 at this age is unreal.


Exactly !!!!!! stupid post man. While agree he can't hedge any more. What he brings as a rim protector at the age of 38 is amazing.

[21209]

Timmy's decline is nowhere near the decline of Kevin Garnett.

And, to think there was once a debate as to who the better player was.

[Cowboys_Wear_Spurs]

I think Tim is just tired from the Portland series. He did an excellent job boxing out Lopez for most games. Spurs and Co. held Portland well below their average of OFF rb per game, which they were #1 in the regular season and playoffs up to that point.

It just awesome seeing that Spurs can rely on both Splitter and Baynes to spell Duncan for long stretches. Spurs had their biggest run Monday when Baynes was on the court.

[Chomag]

Hopefully TD can find that extra gear in him for one last push. I dont think we will need much of his contribution for the Thunder series (as it's a speed game) but no way we could do it without him against Miami. Having said that though it's amazing what Tim is still doing at his age.

[spursparker9]

I notice it in the Portland series. Robin Lopez was constantly out-rebounding Timmy, which remind me that in the 1st round, Dwight Howard was constantly out-rebounding Robin Lopez.

Now Timmy mostly will just tap the rebound and hope that Kawhi or Danny can go for the second jump and grab it.

[Phenomanul]

Let's not forget that knee tweak against Dallas (in the last regular season game vs. Dallas)... He has looked slower since then... in other words it could be that he's allowing his body sufficient time to recover... or his body simply lost an appreciable amount of mobility from that tweak...

[Chinook]

I don't get some of the responses in this thread. The OP asserts Tim's defense has fallen off, and people respond with essentially, "You're stupid. Look at his offense." That doesn't address the issue at all. Tim's been horrible guarding the PnR for a couple of years now, but teams didn't really seem to catch on to that until the GS series. Part of Tim's struggles are physical, his lack of mobility affecting his ability to get up on the ball-handler. But part of it is his unwillingness to show hard to contain penetration. He constantly sinks to protect the drive, but his mobility is so bad that guards can snake-dribble right past him. Tim compounds this problem by going for chase-down blocks that he rarely gets, often resulting in a foul.

Duncan needs to just commit to hedging strongly and relying on his help to have his back protecting the rim from the roller. Right now, he's not helping anyone by being in no man's land. This explains the rebounding thing, too, as he is often too far away from the basket to get the board (because despite what some folks think on here, rebounds don't just magically teleport to Duncan's hands just because he's on the floor).

[Agloco]

Reliably:

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-w7GpYhHecp4/AAAAAAAAAAI/AAAAAAAAACs/apVTJiLmJNs/photo.jpg

[ErnestLynch]

Because he turns 39 on Sunday ?

Appreciate him while you can.

[mclinejr]

Coasting

[DesignatedT]

Duncan still alters more shots than any other player. His presence is well known by the opposition, even if he isn't blocking as many shots.

As for rebounds, with Splitter improving dramatically on the glass and Leonard in the fold he doesn't have to grab all the boards thankfully. If those guys weren't playing he'd have his usual 15 boards a night but that isn't needed anymore.

[Spur|n|Austin]

Because he turns 39 on Sunday ?

Appreciate him while you can.

He just turned 38.

[pgardn]

With Ibaka gone Tim did not see as much Perkins and got exposed to the PnR.
This will move him out of position and moving. That's really tough on him now.
He has been a position timing rebounder and defender for some time now.

I think he does a great job with his hands tipping rebounds still. One thing he has not lost much of is length.
As stated, Splitters mobility with height, and Leonard's ability to get longer rebounds have helped us tremendously.

In the Portland series Duncan spent a lot of time engaged with Lopez. Lopez played very hard every game, he was clearly not thinking his team was at a severe disadvantage. Lopez put in a huge effort imo.

[Kool Bob Love]

We wouldn't be where we are without him.

feels.

[letmk]

I don't get some of the responses in this thread. The OP asserts Tim's defense has fallen off, and people respond with essentially, "You're stupid. Look at his offense." That doesn't address the issue at all. Tim's been horrible guarding the PnR for a couple of years now, but teams didn't really seem to catch on to that until the GS series. Part of Tim's struggles are physical, his lack of mobility affecting his ability to get up on the ball-handler. But part of it is his unwillingness to show hard to contain penetration. He constantly sinks to protect the drive, but his mobility is so bad that guards can snake-dribble right past him. Tim compounds this problem by going for chase-down blocks that he rarely gets, often resulting in a foul.

Duncan needs to just commit to hedging strongly and relying on his help to have his back protecting the rim from the roller. Right now, he's not helping anyone by being in no man's land. This explains the rebounding thing, too, as he is often too far away from the basket to get the board (because despite what some folks think on here, rebounds don't just magically teleport to Duncan's hands just because he's on the floor).

TImmy does not defend PnR as well as Splitter, but he has more blocks than fouls (not just PnR fouls) during the regular season. Where does this "Tim compounds this problem by going for chase-down blocks that he rarely gets, often resulting in a foul." come from?

[Uriel]

Someone from the Express-News tweeted that Duncan's knees flared up after he banged knees with Monta Ellis in Game 1 of the Dallas series.

[Chinook]

TImmy does not defend PnR as well as Splitter, but he has more blocks than fouls (not just PnR fouls) during the regular season. Where does this "Tim compounds this problem by going for chase-down blocks that he rarely gets, often resulting in a foul." come from?

His blocks don't come from defending the PnR. They come from him being near the rim. Tim's the best rim-protector in the league when he can play in a phone booth, but he's awful in motion. He's taken to fouling (and allowing and-1s) when he gets beat recently when he should just let the player score.

[Prime Time]

Plus, I know a lot of you wanted Duncan to have his very own version of the twin towers at this age, but '97 Tim Duncan isn't walking through that door.

Besides, I doubt Duncan could carry the same defensive burden that '01-'03 Robinson did (I actually never saw David play at those ages, but I always hear about how he was a great defensive player.) Duncan has aged quite the opposite, making scoring his best attribute. Having a smart, physical, motivated Tiago Splitter to shut down the likes of Dirk/LaMarcus is really just what Duncan needs at this age.

Honestly, it feels like we're all living in a NBA 2k video game and some dude just boosted all of Tiago's defensive/rebounding ratings due to being too lazy to actually make a couple of trades.

[letmk]

His blocks don't come from defending thr PnR. They come from him being near the rim. Tim's the best rim-protector in the league when he can play in a phone booth, but he's awful in motion. He's taken to fouling (and allowing and-1s) when he gets beat recently.

All in all, Timmy averages 1.8 fouls per game. Care to elaborate that into your "often resulting in a foul" argumet?

[Chinook]

All in all, Timmy averages 1.8 fouls per game. Care to elaborate that into your "often resulting in a foul" argumet?

Yeah. All three of his fouls last game where the result of out-of-control contests off poor screen defense. One was a foolish swipe at Westbrook as Russ drove to the rim. Another was a push in Westbrook's back. And the third was him trying to soft-close on Durant after sinking on a PnR. That was just last game. His fouls on Ellis during the end of Game Six of the Dallas series were of the same nature.

When was the last time Tim got a block from behind?

[wildchild]

And guys think the better option defending OKC is Tim out as only answer...

What about the rest of our guys defending the pick and roll better? Tim isn't the guy who was caught in no man's land in his attempted double team on Durant.

What about the times when Tim helped and our other guy never recovered?

What about the OKC screens? Westbrook/Durant never need call for another screen because the first is ridiculously efficient, under screens is our best strategy against a great screen-setting and so good shooting team?

I'm too lazy to write so I just copy.
When people said Tim doesn't have the fresh legs to prevent the ball-handler from getting to the rim and gets back to recover to the roll man...I just remember the pick and roll defense is a team defense, particularly against OKC.
Just for Pop's design or just because they forget, the Spurs didn't help well from the weak side, didn't fight over the screen to take away any space, not defense on the screener...We shouldn't blame Tim for all the mistakes on PnR defense.

[DesignatedT]

Yeah. All three of his fouls last game where the result of out-of-control contests off poor screen defense. One was a foolish swipe at Westbrook as Russ drove to the rim. Another was a push in Westbrook's back. And the third was him trying to soft-close on Durant after sinking on a PnR. That was just last game. His fouls on Ellis during the end of Game Six of the Dallas series were of the same nature.

When was the last time Tim got a block from behind?

You make it sound like this is happening every time down the court or something. Tony does the same exact thing to bigs on a regular basis. It's part of the game. Little guys are quicker and trickier then bigger guys. Tim has regressed defensively some with age and that's to be expected. He's still a good defender and does a lot more good than bad.

[Chinook]

You make it sound like this is happening every time down the court or something. Tony does the same exact thing to bigs on a regular basis. It's part of the game. Little guys are quicker and trickier then bigger guys. Tim has regressed defensively some with age and that's to be expected. He's still a good defender and does a lot more good than bad.

People are trying to twist this. Duncan doesn't always foul or give up a shot on a PnR, because the ball-handler doesn't always attack. Sometimes, they pull up for a shot, which Ellis and Carter did to great effect in the Dallas series. Duncan sinks instead of hedging, which allows for the handler to get a clean look off a good screen. That would be somewhat acceptable if Duncan managed to sink all the way back into the paint, but he doesn't instead, he stands in no man's land, which means he's not going to stop penetration either. That is a problem, one that he could fix but doesn't. It's one thing to concede either the shot or the drive, but Duncan is conceding both right now, and fouling to boot.

As I said before, Tim is an overall good defender. But he can't handle small-ball for PnR-heavy teams. He doesn't do more good than bad in those situations. He literally didn't make one good play defending the PnR/PnP in Game One. It's even more noticeable when the Medium Three aren't involved in the play, as they do much more to cover for Duncan than people want to accept. Good luck trying to stop a PnR if Manu or Parker is the perimeter defender with Tim behind them.

Tiago, Diaw (when he was the center) and Baynes each had fantastic defensive games. If OKC doesn't play two bigs, the Spurs will have three superior defensive options.

[DesignatedT]

As I said before, Tim is an overall good defender. But he can't handle small-ball for PnR-heavy teams.

I agree he isn't always the best option in these scenarios.

[DesignatedT]

Duncan defending Thunder bigs

When Tim Duncan defended Oklahoma City's interior players, offense was almost non-existent. Between Kendrick Perkins, Steven Adams and Nick Collison they combined for just seven touches and 0-for-1 shooting from the floor in 7:13 of matchup time.

http://stats.nba.com/featured/sportvu_matchup_data_west_fin_2014_05_20.html?ls=i ref:nbahpt13a

[Chinook]

And guys think the better option defending OKC is Tim out as only answer...

What about the rest of our guys defending the pick and roll better? Tim isn't the guy who was caught in no man's land in his attempted double team on Durant.

Yes, yes he was. Manu's foul on Durant was in the large part the result of Tim giving a half-hearted double-team in no man's land, realizing his mistake and leaving Manu out to dry when he sank again. As for the other guys, they all defended it really well. The PnR wasn't a problem at all when Duncan's man didn't set the screen.


What about the times when Tim helped and our other guy never recovered?

That didn't happen, at least not against Durant, Westbrook, Jackson or Fisher. The only possible exception was when Duncan helped Green stop a Russ iso and Westbrook got the board and scored while Green was flat-footed. I counted that as Danny's fault, though. The whole reason why Duncan's defense is a problem is because he's NOT helping; he's leaving his guards out to dry.


What about the OKC screens? Westbrook/Durant never need call for another screen because the first is ridiculously efficient, under screens is our best strategy against a great screen-setting and so good shooting team?

OKC's screens were not effective. The Spurs bottled them up very well.


I'm too lazy to write so I just copy.
When people said Tim doesn't have the fresh legs to prevent the ball-handler from getting to the rim and gets back to recover to the roll man...I just remember the pick and roll defense is a team defense, particularly against OKC.
Just for Pop's design or just because they forget, the Spurs didn't help well from the weak side, didn't fight over the screen to take away any space, not defense on the screener...We shouldn't blame Tim for all the mistakes on PnR defense.

What you're saying is exactly why I got the numbers myself instead of getting them from ESPN some other site. I wanted to look at each possession and see which Spur was most responsible for each result. Basketball is a team sport, but individual mistakes precipitate team collapses. Duncan played poor TEAM DEFENSE.

[Chinook]

http://stats.nba.com/featured/sportvu_matchup_data_west_fin_2014_05_20.html?ls=i ref:nbahpt13a

I didn't look at the bigs, although it probably wouldn't take a long time to do so. However, the trio is averaging around 10ppg in 50mpg. So they would be expected to score 1.4 points in the seven minutes Duncan played them. They weren't really a tough assignment.

[wildchild]

Chinook
I don't like players always under screens against OKC and I didn't see a great job of the rest of the guys defending the pick and roll (except two), but I really hope you're right about that, because it means the Spurs can neutralize one of best Thunder offensive weapons.

[Chinook]

Chinook
I don't like players always under screens against OKC and I didn't see a great job of the rest of the guys defending the pick and roll (except two), but I really hope you're right about that, because it means the Spurs can neutralize one of best Thunder offensive weapons.

What? No one went under the screens against OKC's stars, and if they did, that wouldn't be Duncan's fault, as he wouldn't actually be in the play after that point. The defending big comes into play when the perimeter defender goes OVER the screen, since doing so opens up a driving lane. Going under the screen negates the driving the lane but allows a shot. The problem with what Duncan was doing is that he'd sink when the guard went over the screen, which left a midrange shot open or (because of Duncan's lack of mobility) a somewhat more narrow driving lane. Had Duncan hedged strongly like Splitter, Baynes and Diaw did, the ball-handler for OKC would have neither had an open shot or a clear driving lane. The roll-man would have been open instead.

By not hedging by also not fully sinking, Duncan allowed the PnR ball-handler to both drive and shoot, but he stopped the roll-man. The problem with that is that OKC's roll-men aren't really threats, especially without Ibaka. Essentially, the perimeter defenders were going over screens expecting help from Duncan, and he wasn't giving it to them. That left them out to dry. Instead, either he needs to step up an hedge or the perimeter defenders have to concede the shot and go under the screen. It shouldn't be a debate as to which one is preferable.

[benstanfield]

Tim is basically unplayable in small ball on the defensive end. When he's the only big we're basically giving up open midrange jumpers. Thankfully Ibaka is out or else things would be even worse.

The problem, though, is that if we advance and face Miami, they play as much if not more small ball than the Thunder typically would. Bosh has been playing like shit this series but he's still even more of a shooting threat than Ibaka. Tim's only chance in a MIA series would be to punish Bosh on the low block whenever they go small, but even then it would be tough to play him over Splitter against small ball. It's come to the point where you almost try to stay big with Duncan and Splitter/Diaw and see if you can't hide Tim on a slower wing like Sefalosha.

I said before the series I figured Pop would live and die with Duncan as the primary big against small ball, and lo and behold I was wrong; for the first time I can recall he went with Stiffler for a big stretch of the fourth. It will be interesting to see how this plays out, as every team we face from here on will play a lot more small ball, except Indiana who will lose to Miami in five games, book it.

[100%duncan]

TD is coasting to avenge the 6 tbh

[ElNono]

Tim did mention he wasn't pleased with his rebounding effort in Game 1. I think that's largely where his greatest value is on the defensive end these days. The arrival of a good rebounder like Kawhi has diminished that a bit, but you can't have enough good, fundamental box outs and rebounding bigs and this team certainly needs them.

[Chinook]

Tim is basically unplayable in small ball on the defensive end. When he's the only big we're basically giving up open midrange jumpers. Thankfully Ibaka is out or else things would be even worse.

The problem, though, is that if we advance and face Miami, they play as much if not more small ball than the Thunder typically would. Bosh has been playing like shit this series but he's still even more of a shooting threat than Ibaka. Tim's only chance in a MIA series would be to punish Bosh on the low block whenever they go small, but even then it would be tough to play him over Splitter against small ball. It's come to the point where you almost try to stay big with Duncan and Splitter/Diaw and see if you can't hide Tim on a slower wing like Sefalosha.

I said before the series I figured Pop would live and die with Duncan as the primary big against small ball, and lo and behold I was wrong; for the first time I can recall he went with Stiffler for a big stretch of the fourth. It will be interesting to see how this plays out, as every team we face from here on will play a lot more small ball, except Indiana who will lose to Miami in five games, book it.

It's not as big of a deal against Miami because of their personnel. Lebron is the only one of Miami's stars who's a threat to shoot a pull-up three off a screen. (Allen and Chalmers are pretty much the only other ones in the rotation). This means the Spurs can go under screens against the Heat, which they can't do on OKC. Also, Miami is not nearly as effective in screening with their bigs as OKC is. They get a much bigger advantage running a 2/3 PnR with Wade and James. But just like with OKC's 1/3 PnR, the Heat don't gain a major advantage by doing this, since Danny is a capable forward defender and Kawhi is a capable guard defender. The Spurs have to stop penetration first; they'll gladly concede jumpers.

Duncan's biggest concern will be closing out on Bosh. Green and Leonard will get the perimeter.

[Jimcs50]

This thread is ludicrous

[Chinook]

It's clearly not. Just because you want to ignore it doesn't mean it's not an issue.

[DesignatedT]

I remember Pop rolling with Splitter rather than Duncan during important stretches during the GS series last year. As for the NBA finals; I'm not sure how anyone who watched that series would have preferred Tiago to Duncan out on the floor. I don't care what the numbers say/said.

[Russ]

How many did his man get?

[letmk]

Yeah. All three of his fouls last game where the result of out-of-control contests off poor screen defense. One was a foolish swipe at Westbrook as Russ drove to the rim. Another was a push in Westbrook's back. And the third was him trying to soft-close on Durant after sinking on a PnR. That was just last game. His fouls on Ellis during the end of Game Six of the Dallas series were of the same nature.

When was the last time Tim got a block from behind?

if you are using small samples only, MVP Durant was called Mr. Unreliable.

[Chinook]

if you are using small samples only, MVP Durant was called Mr. Unreliable.

I'm not. Duncan's PnR defense has been horrible for years. Teams just started exploiting that last year. You're trying to argue that semantically by attacking my use of often.

[DPG21920]

I don't get Spurs fans getting so defensive and extrapolating this one question to meaning Tim sucks everywhere. Spurs are amazing in large part due to Tim's play on both ends, but for those side-stepping this issue, I don't get it. I can even understand getting upset at the question since the answer is fairly obvious, but to act like the results don't warrant the question is a bit silly.

Tim has been an amazing defender his entire career and even to this day does more good than bad. However, to what should be noone's surprise, his lateral quickness and ability to help on the perimeter (namely PnR situations) has slowly deteriorated with age. Again, this is not a surprise to anyone who watches and knows how long Tim has been playing.

Digging deeper, in this playoffs, this is about the worst you have seen it. The playoffs in the West are filled with explosive guards (Monta, Lillard, Westbrook...) and that only serves to emphasis this aspect of his game that has deteroriated. The thing that is more disappointing and inexplicable is the rebounding. Tim has guarded in every single series a non-scoring big. Tiago has unquestionably been the anchor of the defense and taking the top scoring threat individually and in help defense with the PnR since it's usually his guy (Dirk/Aldridge) involved.

Tim has guarded Dalembert, Robin Lopez and now Perkins all of which are awful offensive players. So not only has Tim got to coast on those guys, his one job was to keep people off the glass and in the first two rounds Dalembert/Lopez looked like prime Shaq. That's all you need to know to even anecdotally assess where Tim's defense/rebounding has been. He's still been a plus and his offense was huge in the early parts of the Mavs series and in game one against OKC, but the rbounding has me perplexed considering he's not having to guard offensive minded bigs. His only job is to keep them off the glass.

Looking at it further, beyond that job, and you see Chinook is correct in that Tim more than ever has been caught in no-mans land. I mentioned this several times during the first two rounds. He wasn't boxing out, he wasn't fully hedging and he wasn't deep enough to block shots. Tim is amazing when they try and attack him directly in the low post, but he has been out of position and has lacked the ability to make up for that in recovery due to dwindling athleticism.

It is what it is and hasn't stopped the Spurs from rolling and he does far more good than bad normally, but in this playoff, in this specific area, he has not done well and it's really not a secret tbh..

[Chinook]

^ Boom.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I don't get some of the responses in this thread. The OP asserts Tim's defense has fallen off, and people respond with essentially, "You're stupid. Look at his offense." That doesn't address the issue at all. Tim's been horrible guarding the PnR for a couple of years now, but teams didn't really seem to catch on to that until the GS series. Part of Tim's struggles are physical, his lack of mobility affecting his ability to get up on the ball-handler. But part of it is his unwillingness to show hard to contain penetration. He constantly sinks to protect the drive, but his mobility is so bad that guards can snake-dribble right past him. Tim compounds this problem by going for chase-down blocks that he rarely gets, often resulting in a foul.

Duncan needs to just commit to hedging strongly and relying on his help to have his back protecting the rim from the roller. Right now, he's not helping anyone by being in no man's land. This explains the rebounding thing, too, as he is often too far away from the basket to get the board (because despite what some folks think on here, rebounds don't just magically teleport to Duncan's hands just because he's on the floor).

Teams caught on quite some time ago. Losing to the Suns a few years ago was when it started getting really bad. We zone it up more now and most teams cannot make him pay. OKC wants to keep Perkins on him for defense and you can hide him there Bogut and smallball is a different animal even if he zones behind the play he cannot recover on high pick and rolls if he shows at all.

[Baam]

Bottom line is Tim's tosb defense is better than prime Splitter's offense. Splitter has been guarded by the weakest defenders in every series and Dirk was probably tied with Harden for worst defense in the whole POs yet he never did shit in the post, I have even seen Calderon guard him pretty successfully (Splitter flopped and got a generous call one time which was pretty pathetic but he basically couldn't do shit) ... I think we should be more concerned about Splitter than about Tim. That said it's incredibly hard to retire at the right time and it could get very ugly for Tim in the not so distant future if it gets any worse... Even a little bit...

We're talking about the windows closing every year but really it might be the last year of Tim playing at the level needed to win a championship, unless they invent a new PED or something, he's just getting too old.

[BillMc]

This thread is ludicrous

Yep

[cd021]

Duncan RS Per 36 minutes TRR (total rebounding rate)-12.1
Duncan PS Per 36 minutes TRR (total rebounding rate)-8.9

he is grabbing 3.2 rebounds fewer per 36 minutes than in the regular season.


his Drtg has also dropped form 98 to 106 (-8)

[Jimcs50]

Duncan RS Per 36 minutes TRR (total rebounding rate)-12.1
Duncan PS Per 36 minutes TRR (total rebounding rate)-8.9

he is grabbing 3.2 rebounds fewer per 36 minutes than in the regular season.


his Drtg has also dropped form 98 to 106 (-8)


Check the percentage of 3 point shots attempted against us in playoffs compared to regular season. If I'm not mistaken, there are a lot more long rebounds in playoffs because of that fact. Hence, fewer that TD is responsible for.

[Jimcs50]

22/game

[Chinook]

If Duncan isn't supposed to board long misses, how on Earth was he going to help at the end of the fourth in Game Six?

[Seventyniner]

If Duncan isn't supposed to board long misses, how on Earth was he going to help at the end of the fourth in Game Six?

^ Boom.

[superjames1992]

He's just old. That's all. He has lost some of his speed, but he's still a decent rim-protector against bigger teams and his offense is still good. He's still one of the best power forwards in the NBA.

If you want to look at a real TOSB, look no further than Kevin Garnett. :lol

[Jimcs50]

If Duncan isn't supposed to board long misses, how on Earth was he going to help at the end of the fourth in Game Six?

Those were not long rebounds.

[DPG21920]

Again, no one is trying to say Tim isn't great or still a very, very good player :lol. It's just one aspect of his game and how he's struggling. It happens and he's still one of the GOAT's and one of the best bigs in the game today all things considered.

[Chinook]

Those were not long rebounds.

How was Pop supposed to know that? You're assuming (falsely by the by) that Duncan is less responsible for rebounds off missed threes. If that's the case, why would he be desirable to have in the game to grab misses when everyone knew Miami was going to shoot threes?

[Jimcs50]

How was Pop supposed to know that? You're assuming (falsely by the by) that Duncan is less responsible for rebounds off missed threes. If that's the case, why would he be desirable to have in the game to grab misses when everyone knew Miami was going to shoot threes?

He was not in game in order for Spurs to put 5 players to guard the 3 point shooters. I saw nothing wrong with that strategy at the time. But it back fired

[cd021]

Check the percentage of 3 point shots attempted against us in playoffs compared to regular season. If I'm not mistaken, there are a lot more long rebounds in playoffs because of that fact. Hence, fewer that TD is responsible for.

3pt shots don't necessarily mean long rebounds. It really depends on the shooter. Better shooters ,who miss tend to hit the rim and occasionally hit the backboard as well slowing down the speed the ball come off the hoop.

Still one would think his boarding would have been better so far. Splitters per minute boards are essentially the same, despite guarding farther away from the basket.

[sexinthatsx]

/thread.

[Chinook]

/thread.

Not really. I'll elaborate tomorrow in the other thread, but for now, I'll say tonight's performance makes Game One's even less excusable.

[DesignatedT]

Thread title should be changed to " what happened to Timmy's p&r defense and lateral quickness" with the clear response being age.

[therealtruth]

It's never a good strategy to allow the 3's and try to get the rebound when up 3. Force them into contested 2's or foul. Anyway Pop has already said they had some defensive breakdowns on those last possessions.

[ElNono]

well, he said before game 2 that he wanted to do better rebounding... and he did... keep it going old man...