Tiago's contract a later year

[Baam]

Hum how can you justify giving Boris less than Tiago at this point ? How did they sold Manu on taking less than Tiago (probably felt guilty about the Finals but Tiago was even worse than him in that series)...

There's also the issue of preserving cap space for the 2015 summer, but they had no issue bending that rule for Tiago...

I also think that Green in 2015 will look at Tiago's deal and ask for big bucks...

Im worried about the consequences of that deal... Both in term of cap space and in term of internal salary scale... If Tiago has another bad Finals then I think he should be traded for sure.

Edit : cant edit the title ffs...

[RD2191]

Too many good big men in the West. Out East maybe I could see trading him but we need him to get out of the West, tbh.

[ChumpDumper]

Justice is not a verb.

[Baam]

Posted from my phone with the shitty autocorrect, edited some stuff but the title can't be changed so that sucks...

[davidbowie]

He earned it this playoffs

[Baam]

He earned it this playoffs

You mean he outplayed Manu and Boris?

[testies]

How about Boris defending LMA and Dirk for the whole series.

Now respond after thinking of such nightmare

[look_at_g_shred]

Finals can't start soon enough.

[Chinook]

You mean he outplayed Manu and Boris?

Damned straight in the first two series. That's saying something with Manu having a good Round 1.

[Baam]

How about Boris defending LMA and Dirk for the whole series.

Now respond after thinking of such nightmare

Boris guarded Blake Griffin in 2012, we swept the series and had the best Spurs offense ever... Beside he did guard these guys off the bench...

[testies]

Boris guarded Blake Griffin in 2012, we swept the series and had the best Spurs offense ever... Beside he did guard these guys off the bench...

he was very bad against LMA for what I recall...

elite defense >>> bringing a spark off the bench, we already have plenty of offense

lets not go back to 2011 levels

[Baam]

Damned straight in the first two series. That's saying something with Manu having a good Round 1.

Fair point, but imo they're not in the same ballpark when it come to their influence on the game, we're comparing creators to the layup king who benefits from the playmaking of the other two...

[PingPong]

Baam never gives up.

[Jenks]

How about Boris defending LMA and Dirk for the whole series.

Now respond after thinking of such nightmare
Yeah I don't understand people jumping on Tiago after one series that presented a matchup problem. If you weigh defense as much as offense the guy was probably the Spurs MVP through the first two rounds.

If anything, Splitter is a fucking deal, not a bad contract.

If you need perspective:
Step 1) Compare Tiago's contract to Asik's
Step 2) Compare LMA's performance in the first and second rounds (even scratching the first couple games of round 1)
Step 3) Compare Splitter to Asik offensively.
Step 4) Stop it.

[Baam]

It's funny that Pop's answer to the 2012 backdoor sweep was starting Tiago and then when we finally beat the Thunder Tiago plays 10min a game behind Boris and Bonner... Something went wrong there... Tiago was never the answer of going deeper in the POs and even cost the team a ring but hey for some reason the FO chose to extend him... Richard Jefferson 2.0.

[hater]

Without Tiago we r shining shoes after round 1

Also without Tiago we end up with 4th seed tops

[Baam]

Without Tiago we r shining shoes after round 1

Also without Tiago we end up with 4th seed tops

Nope we don't know that, the offense with another player starting would have been way better, the dynamics would have been completely different...

Anyway I just made my case, will stop bringing it up anywhere else. You can disagree for sure, but there's still something troubling in there for anyone who was enamored with that 2012 team...

[FromWayDowntown]

It's funny that Pop's answer to the 2012 backdoor sweep was starting Tiago and then when we finally beat the Thunder Tiago plays 10min a game behind Boris and Bonner... Something went wrong there... Tiago was never the answer of going deeper in the POs and even cost the team a ring but hey for some reason the FO chose to extend him... Richard Jefferson 2.0.

Right -- Tiago was completely worthless in the 2013 West Finals against Memphis. Tiago's failings are solely a matter of how deep the Spurs are in the playoffs and have nothing to do with who they're playing and the matchups those opponents present.

[Jenks]

Nope we don't know that, the offense with another player starting would have been way better, the dynamics would have been completely different...

Anyway I just made my case, will stop bringing it up anywhere else.
I can't tell if you're genuinely retarded or just don't know anything about basketball

[Baam]

I can't tell if you're genuinely retarded or just don't know anything about basketball

Both tbh.

[look_at_g_shred]

Hey Baam here's an idea...let's just trade Tiago and our first to the Knicks for Tyson Chandler. Problem solved :hat

[Baam]

I just wonder if changing a team that won 20 in a row and was the most pleasing to watch since the GOAT Celtics team actually served a purpose or not... Or was it just Pop outsmarting himself... I really don't know... Maybe Tim gets too worn down if they don't I can acknowledge that possibility.

[Juggity]

Worthwhile big men are hard to come by in this league. When you have one who does a good job, you pay him or you lose him. This spurs team without Tiago is probably a second round ceiling team (Of course everything depends on matchups, so it's hard to say for certain).

But just think about what would happen if the spurs came up against Memphis without Tiago. 2011 all over again.

[Cklbmk]

People still don't understand the Spurs.

Spurs get a bunch of people that fill different roles and have different skill sets. This allows them to match up ideally against whoever they play against.

Having 2 bigs on the court isn't always ideal. When you have to compete against one of the top 3-5 bigs of all time for only 1 spot you don't win.


Now how many bigs play defense at Tiago's level? Very few. What do those bigs make?

It's not about team impact, it's about how replaceable you are. Simply put it'd be very hard and very expensive to replace Tiago.

[Baam]

People still don't understand the Spurs.

Spurs get a bunch of people that fill different roles and have different skill sets. This allows them to match up ideally against whoever they play against.

Having 2 bigs on the court isn't always ideal. When you have to compete against one of the top 3-5 bigs of all time for only 1 spot you don't win.


Now how many bigs play defense at Tiago's level? Very few. What do those bigs make?

It's not about team impact, it's about how replaceable you are. Simply put it'd be very hard and very expensive to replace Tiago.

The team is successful so people are back to venerating Pop and the FO but we have seen them make many mistakes, fewer than most teams for sure but still they get it wrong from time to time...

[FromWayDowntown]

I'd say that more people get that than don't.

The beauty of this Spurs team (like some others from the past) is that their depth and versatility make them well-suited to play against almost any style and to deal with almost any matchup issue. It would be asinine of Popovich to say that the only way the Spurs will play is the way that they most often play. That sort of stubbornness was one of the things that Spurs fans criticized Pop for in the early years of his tenure. They wouldn't have played themselves into each of the last 2 Finals if Pop had insisted that 2 bigs was the only way his team could possibly play.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

It all boils down to match-ups and the Spurs have the versatility to match-up with anyone. We don't dominate teams like Memphis without Tiago. There's a reason Memphis is a tough out for any team in this league, and it's their inside presence. Tiago helps negate that. He's a huge asset for the Spurs. Tiago's contract was worth it.

[Baam]

I'd say that more people get that than don't.

The beauty of this Spurs team (like some others from the past) is that their depth and versatility make them well-suited to play against almost any style and to deal with almost any matchup issue. It would be asinine of Popovich to say that the only way the Spurs will play is the way that they most often play. That sort of stubbornness was one of the things that Spurs fans criticized Pop for in the early years of his tenure. They wouldn't have played themselves into each of the last 2 Finals if Pop had insisted that 2 bigs was the only way his team could possibly play.

The problem is that he went away from that incredible team/lineup since then, he underplayed Boris massively even in the Finals...

The bottom line is that you can't argue with the result if they win, the problem is that there's still an argument because 1/ they lost 2/ Splitter was the worst player in the Finals and 3/ when Pop goes back to that incredible 2012 lineup we beat the only team that beat that 2012 team... So there's a pretty clear argument that they got it wrong.

[FromWayDowntown]

The problem is that he went away from that incredible team since then, he underplayed Boris massively even in the Finals...

The bottom line is that you can't argue with the result, the problem is that there's still an argument because 1/ they lost 2/ Splitter was the worst player in the Finals and 3/ when Pop goes back to that incredible 2012 lineup we beat the only team that beat that 2012 team... So there's a pretty clear argument that they got it wrong.

That 2012 lineup didn't beat the 2012 Thunder; they beat the 2014 Thunder. And with that, Tiago's minutes may have been diminished from other rounds (and the regular season), but his ability to credibly spell Duncan when Pop went to the Big + Stretch 4 lineups to matchup better with the 2014 Thunder was also important.

As it is, Tiago is basically paid like a middle-of-the-pack center and there's plenty of reason to think they've gotten a bargain in getting him at that price (and on a contract that apparently gets smaller and smaller by the year).

I think it's really hard to argue that Tiago and his contract have cost the Spurs in any significant way. The much stronger argument is that Tiago is a significant part of the Spurs successes and that they don't get to consecutive Finals if Tiago isn't on the roster and doing the things that he has done for this team.

[Malice]

This franchise is far from perfect. However, the difference between this team, and say a certain big market team out east, is they dont give out cap destroying contracts and rarely pay over market value. As cliche as it might sound, big men are prized specifically cerebral big men like Splitter. When they do sign a lame ass player ie Dick Jefferson, they move them, or cut their loses.

[spurraider21]

Baam (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=43690) i've asked you this same question a billion times and you always dodge it. fuck it i'll try again

what did you think of Splitter's defense against Dirk and Aldridge?
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[Seventyniner]

I just can't fathom how Splitter's contract could possibly be worse now than it was a year ago. If you think it was bad then it has to be better now because it decreases and is a year closer to expiring.

Also, Splitter's defense > Diaw's offense imo.

[hater]

Nope we don't know that, the offense with another player starting would have been way better, the dynamics would have been completely different...

Anyway I just made my case, will stop bringing it up anywhere else. You can disagree for sure, but there's still something troubling in there for anyone who was enamored with that 2012 team...

there's nothing to disagree. Without Tiago we have noone to guard Dirk and we get sent home in the 1st round. pretty fucking simple

the same thing can be said about round 2 and Lamarcus

[TheGreatYacht]

$10M for someone who didin't do shit last year... PATFO got lucky he ended up being useful for 2 rounds



Aaaaaaaand now he'll be a (-) for the final 2 rounds

[chazley]

Tiago is an elite rim protector/pick and roll defender. And oh yeah, he can play elite man-to-man defense on LMA and Dirk. Sure, he can't play against teams that like to play small, but then he becomes the best backup Center in the league.

You lock those guys up for as long as you can.

[Baam]

Tiago is an elite rim protector/pick and roll defender. And oh yeah, he can play elite man-to-man defense on LMA and Dirk. Sure, he can't play against teams that like to play small, but then he becomes the best backup Center in the league.

You lock those guys up for as long as you can.

He was stastically the worst player of the Finals so I dont think it's clear about him being such a great backup center...

[CGD]

Steal of a contract. Don't forget the deal is front loaded, so there will actually be some cap Releif as the years go on.

Boris had a great year this year. He's is also older.

[ducks]

he is so much better then lopez
splitter d during the season helped keep Duncan so he is effective in postseason and does not look like kg

[spurraider21]

3 years age difference is also a thing. Splitter would also get a lot of interest just because he's a center... they get interest on the market regardless of talent

[will_spurs]

Tiago's contract sounded good last year. He played even better this year, asserted himself in his role, and was key in the first 2 rounds of the playoffs, especially against Dirk. Therefore his contract looks even better right now.

[Drom John]

The issue with Diaw is what's the best he can get from another team? His Charlotte days scare some, and those that might like him don't have cap space or are rebuilding. Could Kobe tolerate Boris (it would be fun watching).
Meanwhile, Portland was interest in Splitter.
I'm more concerned with Mills.

[Genjuro]

The fact that the Spurs don't have any dominant player anymore makes it especially hard to stick to a basic rotation and still prevail against the NBA's very best. The Spurs have managed to build an incredibly versatile roster that gets things done in many different scenarios. He's one of the big reasons why teams with big scoring frontcourts are not a problem anymore. Tiago has been crucial in several playoff series, and useful centers come expensive. Overreacting to a player struggles against certain teams is particularly wrong with this team.

[Brazil]

Tiago's contract sounded good last year. He played even better this year, asserted himself in his role, and was key in the first 2 rounds of the playoffs, especially against Dirk. Therefore his contract looks even better right now.

/ Thread

[heyheymymy]

Baam brings bunk takes on the reg imo tbh