Sugar

[InRareForm]

http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2014/06/being-happy-with-sugar/372220/

[pgardn]

Pgardn's hint for the day.

I you like food, and don't wish to be fat, exercise.

Further, my recipe: Now this can be tough on some people but it will work.

If you can reach this goal eventually and stay on it you can eat more, much more.
Attain a heart rate of 65% max for your age and hold that rate for 45 minutes.
Do this every other day. Remember this is the goal, most will not be able to do this immediately. If you are older it will take much longer to attain this. (220 - age)x 0.65 This works for about 60% of the population. 20% have a higher max heart rate, 20% below. ( I have hints on how to determine this as well)

In order to attain this type of heart rate and hold it you will have to use the 4 biggest muscles in your body. All are in the legs/butt. You will have to use these muscles aerobically to get up to the 65% max and hold it for 45min. Running jogging is the easiest way to accomplish this, but will be hell on your skeleton long term unless you find softer surfaces than roads. Leaf litter trails, new Tartan tracks, running in the pool. Intersperse this with swimming and biking or those classes that require movement with little rest time, aerobics. ( I have further recommendations on how to vary your running)

Get er done.

I plan to run before the game tonight, swim tomorrow, happy exercising.

[boutons_deux]

http://normaleating.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/american-sugar-consumption.jpg

[sickdsm]

Sounds like the typical natural is better for you no matter what bs.

Tell us again boutons about the health evils of HFCS?


Or how roundup is so bad even though science says otherwise?


They still can't make up their minds if eggs are good or bad for us.

[boutons_deux]

Sounds like the typical natural is better for you no matter what bs.

Tell us again boutons about the health evils of HFCS?


Or how roundup is so bad even though science says otherwise?


They still can't make up their minds if eggs are good or bad for us.

HFCS is evil

roundup is evil, non-Monsanto, non-GMO scientists prove it. The Mississippi is a toxic sewer poisoning the Guld thanks to Roundup and other BigAg chemicals.

eggs were slimed due to cholesterol, but cholesterol fear-mongering is nothing but a BigPharma scam to sell statins for everyone, all ages, even kids. Organic eggs from free range chickens fed a good diet are excellent food.

[pgardn]

HFCS is evil

roundup is evil, non-Monsanto, non-GMO scientists prove it. The Mississippi is a toxic sewer poisoning the Guld thanks to Roundup and other BigAg chemicals.

eggs were slimed due to cholesterol, but cholesterol fear-mongering is nothing but a BigPharma scam to sell statins for everyone, all ages, even kids. Organic eggs from free range chickens fed a good diet are excellent food.

Big Pharma slimed cholesterol?

No, they slimed saturated fats and excess sugar both of which lead to eventually to elevated LDLs and triglycerides. This still is the current thinking, nothing has changed. Blame the food packaging that is told to tout the evils of cholesterol in food instead of saturated fat and sugar.

Statins lower the level of both thus cholesterol in the blood stream. But there is a trade off.
if people would get their butts off the internet chair and moving this would be much less of a problem...
So what are you doing today Boots? A run, bicycle, swim, what?

Petroleum based products are a far far bigger problem than roundup in the Mississippi.

[boutons_deux]

Big Pharma slimed cholesterol?

No, they slimed saturated fats and excess sugar both of which lead to eventually to elevated LDLs and triglycerides. This still is the current thinking, nothing has changed. Blame the food packaging that is told to tout the evils of cholesterol in food instead of saturated fat and sugar.

Statins lower the level of both thus cholesterol in the blood stream. But there is a trade off.
if people would get their butts off the internet chair and moving this would be much less of a problem...
So what are you doing today Boots? A run, bicycle, swim, what?

Petroleum based products are a far far bigger problem than roundup in the Mississippi.

The BigPharma cholesterol/statins scam started with one erroneous report in the 1950s. Statins are only helpful for CVD patients who refuse to change their lifestyle (diet + exercise)

The low-fat (no distinction on which kind of fats, and saturated fat didn't distinguish between artificially hydrogenated/saturated fat (eg, Crisco and similar garbage), mammal fat, and naturally saturated vegetable oil, like healthful coconut and palm oil, neither of which can be produced by US BigAg). ALL fat fell under the "low fat" marketing bullshit.

But BigFood's low-fat crap needed help with flavor, so sugar, salt, and all kinds of synthetic chemicals were added as flavor and color enhancers.

BigOil/BigChem's pollution of the the Mississippi is mostly occurring in toxic, polluted cancer-cluster Louisiana. Roundup, x-icide, nitrogen/potassium fert runoff starts all along the Mississippi and its feeder rivers.

[sickdsm]

More water contamination occurs with residential runoff than ag.

Homemade natural vinegar/salt weed killer are much more toxic than gyphospate.

Fact.

[pgardn]

The BigPharma cholesterol/statins scam started with one erroneous report in the 1950s. Statins are only helpful for CVD patients who refuse to change their lifestyle (diet + exercise)

The low-fat (no distinction on which kind of fats, and saturated fat didn't distinguish between artificially hydrogenated/saturated fat (eg, Crisco and similar garbage), mammal fat, and naturally saturated vegetable oil, like healthful coconut and palm oil, neither of which can be produced by US BigAg). ALL fat fell under the "low fat" marketing bullshit.

But BigFood's low-fat crap needed help with flavor, so sugar, salt, and all kinds of synthetic chemicals were added as flavor and color enhancers.

BigOil/BigChem's pollution of the the Mississippi is mostly occurring in toxic, polluted cancer-cluster Louisiana. Roundup, x-icide, nitrogen/potassium fert runoff starts all along the Mississippi and its feeder rivers.

Wrong about coconut oil. Jury is still out.

Personally I am staying away because it Is highly saturated and staying with less saturated vegetable oils right now.

[TeyshaBlue]

This stupid thread puts an Archies earworm in my head every time I see it. :bang

[pgardn]

This stupid thread puts an Archies earworm in my head every time I see it. :bang

Personally I like health stuff.
Biochemistry of the body is still very complex and the findings are difficult.

[boutons_deux]

Wrong about coconut oil. Jury is still out.

Personally I am staying away because it Is highly saturated and staying with less saturated vegetable oils right now.

coconut oil is naturally saturated, and medium chain fattty acids. Totally different presentation to human metabolism, esp compared with hydrogenated shit from BigFood and from mammal fat.

[pgardn]

coconut oil is naturally saturated, and medium chain fattty acids. Totally different presentation to human metabolism, esp compared with hydrogenated shit from BigFood and from mammal fat.

Dont matter if it's natural or not except that the fatty acid chains do have a unique makeup.

It's still saturated.

Im staying away until further notice. Saturated fats still can compact more tightly and still take in minerals to produce arteriosclerosis. If you find some really compelling evidence otherwise feel free to post it.

[pgardn]

And of course this all is made much more complex as there is clearly a genetic component controlling how we process different bio molecules. This is not straightforward stuff.

I fully expect mouse to show up proclaiming how science is a useless process.

[sickdsm]

HFCS is evil

roundup is evil, non-Monsanto, non-GMO scientists prove it. The Mississippi is a toxic sewer poisoning the Guld thanks to Roundup and other BigAg chemicals.

eggs were slimed due to cholesterol, but cholesterol fear-mongering is nothing but a BigPharma scam to sell statins for everyone, all ages, even kids. Organic eggs from free range chickens fed a good diet are excellent food.


Can you provide me with some better alternatives to roundup that are safer?


Nope. Its a contact killer with no residual. Spray your garden then plant it the next day. Everything will grow as normal.


Got some data on that eggs Dr.?


You're still a shitty person for eating those eggs you know. No different than me or anyone else.

http://www.upc-online.org/freerange.html

[TDMVPDPOY]

is there a graphy sugar vs drugs?

[boutons_deux]

In spite of Europe's huge chemical companies, atrazine is banned in Europe, but continues BigChem runs wild and poisons America.

How a Big Agribusiness Firm Infiltrated the EPA and Made a Mockery of Science

Atrazine is the second most commonly used herbicide in the US and is used on more than 50% of all corn crops. It is one of Syngenta’s most profitable chemicals with sales at over $300 million a year. Banned in the EU, atrazine remains on the market in the US despite scores of scientific publications demonstrating its role in abnormal sexual development. Almost insoluble in water, atrazine contaminates drinking water supplies at 30 times the concentration demonstrated to cause severe sexual abnormalities in animal models (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/11/111128121549.htm).

Recently unsealed court documents from the lawsuit have disclosed (http://100r.org/2013/06/pest-control-syngentas-secret-campaign-to-discredit-atrazines-critics/) how Syngenta launched a multimillion-dollar campaign to disrepute and suppress scientific research, and influence the US Environmental Protection Agency to prevent a ban on atrazine.

Tyrone Hayes, a professor of Integrative Biology at UC Berkeley has demonstrated in his research that atrazine leads to health problems, reproductive issues and birth defects. Hayes is a vocal proponent of legislative action to ban the dissemination of atrazine in water supplies. The court documents showed that Syngenta specifically attacked Hayes’ work with its smear campaign.

In addition to smear campaigns, Syngenta hired a private detective agency to look into the personal backgrounds of scientists on an advisory panel at the EPA, the judge presiding over the lawsuit, and Hayes. The documents also reveal (http://www.alternet.org/newsandviews/article/776820/how_global_chemical_giant_syngenta_paid_third_part y_pundits_spin_the_%22news%22_on_atrazine) a host of third-party organizations and independent "experts" who were on Syngenta’s payroll and supplied with Syngenta’s data in order to make public statements or write op-ed pieces in support of atrazine. Often, these experts were supplied directly with material that company employees edited or wrote.

Syngenta’s Coverup

It all started in 1997 when Hayes was employed by Syngenta to study atrazine, which was under review by the EPA. Hayes’ experimental research on the developmental growth of frogs began to reveal (http://www.motherjones.com/environment/2011/11/tyrone-hayes-atrazine-syngenta-feud-frog-endangered) that even at levels of atrazine as low as 0.1 parts per billion (ppb), the chemical was capable of causing males to develop as hermaphrodites. Some males developed female organs and were even capable of mating with normal males and producing eggs. As reported in top peer-reviewed journals such as PNAS (http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2010/02/12/0909519107.abstract) and Nature (http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v419/n6910/full/419895a.html), at exposure to 0.1 ppb (http://www.pnas.org/content/99/8/5476) atrazine the frogs showed extremely reduced levels of testosterone and feminized voice boxes.

As Hayes amassed data, Syngenta downplayed his results, citing problems with statistics or asking him to repeat studies, often nitpicking or questioning his credibility or scientific skills.

In 2000, Hayes resigned from the panel. He continued to speak at conferences, publicizing his ongoing research in the lab. Meanwhile, Syngenta employees began to show up at conferences to publicly besmirch his data. Sporadically, the campaign turned into threats of violence. In a Democracy Now (http://www.democracynow.org/2014/2/21/silencing_the_scientist_tyrone_hayes_on) interview with Amy Goodman, Hayes said:

“Tim Pastoor, for example, before I would give a talk, would literally threaten, whisper in my ear that he could have me lynched, or he said he would send some of his 'good ol’ boys to show me what it’s like to be gay,’ or at one point he threatened my wife and my daughter with sexual violence.”


Shockingly, even though Syngenta settled the lawsuit for $105 million (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-05-25/syngenta-pays-105-million-to-settle-herbicide-lawsuits.html) in late 2012 after eight years of litigation, it still maintains that amount of atrazine present in the water is much lower than would be required to cause damage. In an article (http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonentine/2014/03/10/did-the-new-yorker-botch-puff-piece-on-frog-scientist-tyrone-hayes-turning-rogue-into-beleaguered-hero/) in Forbes published a week after the New Yorker story, Jon Entine criticized Hayes and claimed that “after numerous follow up studies by the EPA and a score of scientists… evidence of endocrine related problems Hayes claimed to have identified… are nowhere to be found.”

...

http://www.alternet.org/personal-health/how-big-agribusiness-firm-infiltrated-epa-and-made-mockery-science

[boutons_deux]

Dangerous Pesticides Showing Up More and More In Our Urine and Breast Milk

In early April, the shocking news that breast milk carries many times the allowable amount of glyphosate, also called Roundup, came out on the web. Glyphosate is a poison that defoliates plants, but back in the late 1990s, farmers began planting soybeans that resisted the chemical, bouncing back from a dowse of Glyphosate like they had just enjoyed a spring rain, while the weeds around them died. The Frankenstein soybeans were followed by releases of genetically modified corn, cotton, canola and sugar beets. Now, many crops carry the gene.

As a result, according to the release, scientists found glyphosate at “760 to 1600 times higher than the European Drinking Water Directive allows for individual pesticides.” These levels are less than allowable levels set by America’s Environmental Protection Agency. The EPA has been led to believe that glyphosate exits the body and does not accumulate. How could they think that?

The answer is that, in an atmosphere of austerity and trade secrets, the government listens to industry scientists. Senior Monsanto scientist Dan Goldstein recently stated “If ingested, glyphosate is excreted rapidly, does not accumulate in body fat or tissues, and does not undergo metabolism in humans.”

The website Sustainable Pulse, directed by Henry Rowlands, broke the breast-milk news. Rowlands has been a longtime critic of the biotech industry. Immediately, big ag released criticisms of the study’s small sample numbers, but the assertion that America is drowning in Roundup should be investigated. And the story, co-released by Moms Across America, continued that urine from American consumers had also been tested and researchers found 10 times the glyphosate as urine in European consumers.

America’s favorite herbicide, Roundup, has been sprayed on an estimated 90% of American farmland, and we don’t know how to go back to normal.

In fact, American regulators are set to approve even more chemicals for even more genetically modified crops.

Next summer, dicamba and 2,4D will certainly be approved, making it legal and even recommended for farmers to spray their fields with these elements that were part of Agent Orange, the defoliant used to clear jungles in the Vietnam war.

While this story might seem to only affect farmers, who continue to plant genetically modified organism (GMO) crops, it should be the major story for American citizens. Not only is this chemical going into future Americans at an alarming rate, denying its regulation is a major part of American international policy.

Internationally, consumers have rejected GMOs while US trade agreements insist that GMOs be allowed. Russia allows import of GMOs, but insists on labeling if foods contain over 0.9% of the stuff.

In contrast, the US has insisted, under the sway of Monsanto and other US firms that produce GMOs and chemicals, that it is America’s mission to “feed the world” and that GMOs are the only way to do it. We have, they remind us, nine billion hungry mouths to feed in the future.

http://www.alternet.org/food/dangerous-pesticides-are-showing-more-and-more-our-urine-and-breast-milk

US corporations are fucking the planet for profit.

[boutons_deux]

http://www.scientificamerican.com/sciam/cache/file/11916770-1CDE-4898-9484D822968AAEC1_article.jpg?C207B

Sugar May Harm Brain Health


A poor diet can eat away at brain health. Now a study in Neurology helps elucidate why. It suggests that eating a lot of sugar or other carbohydrates can be hazardous to both brain structure and function.

Diabetes, which is characterized by chronically high levels of blood glucose, has been linked to an elevated risk of dementia and a smaller hippocampus, a brain region critical for memory. The new study sought to identify whether glucose had an effect on memory even in people without the disease because having it could induce other brain changes that confound the data. In the experiment, researchers at the Charité University Medical Center in Berlin evaluated both short- and long-term glucose markers in 141 healthy, nondiabetic older adults. The participants performed a memory test and underwent imaging to assess the structure of their hippocampus.

Higher levels on both glucose measures were associated with worse memory, as well as a smaller hippocampus and compromised hippocampal structure. The researchers also found that the structural changes partially accounted for the statistical link between glucose and memory. According to study co-author Agnes Flöel, a neurologist at Charité, the results “provide further evidence that glucose might directly contribute to hippocampal atrophy,” but she cautions that their data cannot establish a causal relation between sugar and brain health.

These findings indicate that even in the absence of diabetes or glucose intolerance, higher blood sugar may harm the brain and disrupt memory function. Future research will need to characterize how glucose exerts these effects and whether dietary or lifestyle interventions might reverse such pathological changes.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/sugar-may-harm-brain-health/?&WT.mc_id=SA_WR_20140709

[sickdsm]

What a load of BS.

What is the background of whoever wrote that propaganda?

Next summer, dicamba and 2,4D will certainly be approved, making it legal and even recommended for farmers to spray their fields with these elements that were part of Agent Orange, the defoliant used to clear jungles in the Vietnam war.

Dicamba and 2,4 d have been approved for a long long time.

New gmo beans with resistance will be approved. Totally different things.

If your complainng about toxicity of herbicide don't start whining about GMO's. Those chems were used and still are on non gmo.



Comparing 24d to agent orange is a lot like saying water is bad because it's used in alcohol.

24d was NOT the problem component in agent orange. How can someone pretend it is?

[The Reckoning]

she cautions that their data cannot establish a causal relation between sugar and brain health.

[boutons_deux]

"Next summer, dicamba and 2,4D will certainly be approved"

absolutely does not mean those or any others approved by BigChem's marketing arm, the FDA/USDA, are safe. The captured regulatory agencies "throw it out there" because the corps say it's ok, then see if kill/maims people, animals, etc.

Same with BigPharma, throw out there, see what happens.

Hilarious how you right-wingers ABSOLUTELY HATE govt but trust it with your and the environment's health. :lol

[Wild Cobra]

I don't know all the biological science between thse, but what I gather, regular table sugar and HFCS have the same two molecule components. The difference is table sugar is made from sugar cane, beets, etc, and the fructose glucose content are a perfect 50%/50%. It is a more stable molecule and not absorbed in the stomach, but requires metabolism in the small intestine. This leads to positive nutrition for the gut flora to digest our foods. HFCS on the other hand are not in this complimentary 50/50 mix, processed to enhance sweetness, and much of the molecules break down in the stomach, being more immediately dissolved in our bloodstream rather than being broken down before entering the bloodstream. Once the glucose-fructose bond is broken, it can directly pass into the blood. Probably why it is sweeter also. Breaks down more readily in out mouth.

[pgardn]

I don't know all the biological science between thse, but what I gather, regular table sugar and HFCS have the same two molecule components. The difference is table sugar is made from sugar cane, beets, etc, and the fructose glucose content are a perfect 50%/50%. It is a more stable molecule and not absorbed in the stomach, but requires metabolism in the small intestine. This leads to positive nutrition for the gut flora to digest our foods. HFCS on the other hand are not in this complimentary 50/50 mix, processed to enhance sweetness, and much of the molecules break down in the stomach, being more immediately dissolved in our bloodstream rather than being broken down before entering the bloodstream. Once the glucose-fructose bond is broken, it can directly pass into the blood. Probably why it is sweeter also. Breaks down more readily in out mouth.

Where did you get this?

[pgardn]

It's so full of wrong, did you make something up, again?

[Wild Cobra]

It's so full of wrong, did you make something up, again?
OK, show me.

[sickdsm]

Been around for over 40 years. What's your excitement now? Scared that agricultural runoff might match residential pollution?


Also I wasn't aware Wikipedia was a govt controlled source of info. Thanks anyway.

[pgardn]

OK, show me.


What is table sugar?
What is/are the differences between sucrose, glucose and fructose?
What carbohydrate, lipid, or protein is absorbed in the stomach?
What carbohydrate is metabolized in the stomach?
What does metabolized mean?
What carbohydrates are broken down in the stomach?
What does more immediately dissolved in the bloodstream mean?
How is it that a glucose- fructose bond breakage causes something to be sweeter after it has passed through the mouth?
Do glucose-fructose bonds break in the mouth?

So once you have the chance to look this up, because you do look things up, then you will be able to ask some legitimate questions. And then maybe we will both learn something.

Or I can just answer all the questions except for one... Because I am questioning your question in one of them. When it comes to computer stuff I basically read and learn. Same with macroeconomics and many other topics. You just love to wade into almost any conversation that involves some prior knowledge and projectile vomit. And you constantly do this. Why? (Last question)

[boutons_deux]

Been around for over 40 years. What's your excitement now? Scared that agricultural runoff might match residential pollution?Also I wasn't aware Wikipedia was a govt controlled source of info. Thanks anyway.

The widespread overweight/obesity epidemic began about 40 years ago.

"The intermediately sugary HFCS-55, introduced in the late 1970s, is the most commonly used sweetener in U.S. soft drinks."

http://earthsky.org/human-world/a-brief-history-of-high-fructose-corn-syrup

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/dec2008_Metabolic-Dangers-of-High-Fructose-Corn-Syrup_01.htm

The (http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/dec2008_Metabolic-Dangers-of-High-Fructose-Corn-Syrup_01.htmThe) epidemic of NAFLD and kidney disease also correlates well with the vast expansion of HFCS in damn near everything.

Nutrition is extremely complicated, but the circumstantial evidence against HFCS is pretty strong.

Also, the low-fat scam started in the 1970s. BigFood either created (along with BigMedicine) and/or followed the low-fat scam by replacing most of the fat in their food-like industrial substances with empty carbs like HFCS.

Any time I hear a "certified, diploma'd nutritionist" say "a calorie is a calorie" or "low-fat", I laugh. It's nearly always some bitch who probably took lots of "home ec" in HS.

The low-fat scam very obviously has not produced a low-fat population.

It's really hilarious how you right-wingers/Fox ALWAYS trust/support (Repug)govt or BigCorps when non-right-wingers take a position on ANY issue against govt or BigCorps. It's knee-jerk, faith-based, political/social contrarianism gone crazy.

[Wild Cobra]

Sucrose is a disaccharide. Too large of a molecule to enter the bloodstream before being digested. HFCS, is just two monosaccharides, glucose and fructuse mixed in water, and has a small percentage of higher saccharides, usually under 10%. They are smaller molecules not bonded to anything, and do not require any metabolism to enter the blood. Natural fructose in fruits are bonded to fiber, requiring digestion before it can be absorbed.

[Wild Cobra]

This doesn't address HFCS, but that's because there is no bond between the simple sugars in it.

Interesting link on the digestion of sugars:

http://www.medbio.info/horn/sugars4kids/how_are_sugars_digested.htm

[pgardn]

Sucrose is a disaccharide. Too large of a molecule to enter the bloodstream before being digested. HFCS, is just two monosaccharides, glucose and fructuse mixed in water, and has a small percentage of higher saccharides, usually under 10%. They are smaller molecules not bonded to anything, and do not require any metabolism to enter the blood. Natural fructose in fruits are bonded to fiber, requiring digestion before it can be absorbed.

Yea.

So you see your previous errors?

[boutons_deux]

do not require any metabolism to enter the blood

pass through the digestive tract and through the liver without modification, right into the bloodstream?

search "hfcs liver"

assholes here defending Corn-Refiners-Association industrial crap HFCS! :lol

and why the fuck does shitty old modern corn need refining anyway?

[Wild Cobra]

Yea.

So you see your previous errors?
I see a minor miss-recollection that doesn't invalidate my point, and that I corrected.

What do you see?

Remember, I started with: "I don't know all the biological science between thse, but what I gather"

This was something I studied in the past, and simply didn't recall 100%.

Again, what do you see? Anything of importance?

[sickdsm]

The widespread overweight/obesity epidemic began about 40 years ago.

"The intermediately sugary HFCS-55, introduced in the late 1970s, is the most commonly used sweetener in U.S. soft drinks."

http://earthsky.org/human-world/a-brief-history-of-high-fructose-corn-syrup

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/dec2008_Metabolic-Dangers-of-High-Fructose-Corn-Syrup_01.htm

The (http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2008/dec2008_Metabolic-Dangers-of-High-Fructose-Corn-Syrup_01.htmThe) epidemic of NAFLD and kidney disease also correlates well with the vast expansion of HFCS in damn near everything.

Nutrition is extremely complicated, but the circumstantial evidence against HFCS is pretty strong.

Also, the low-fat scam started in the 1970s. BigFood either created (along with BigMedicine) and/or followed the low-fat scam by replacing most of the fat in their food-like industrial substances with empty carbs like HFCS.

Any time I hear a "certified, diploma'd nutritionist" say "a calorie is a calorie" or "low-fat", I laugh. It's nearly always some bitch who probably took lots of "home ec" in HS.

The low-fat scam very obviously has not produced a low-fat population.

It's really hilarious how you right-wingers/Fox ALWAYS trust/support (Repug)govt or BigCorps when non-right-wingers take a position on ANY issue against govt or BigCorps. It's knee-jerk, faith-based, political/social contrarianism gone crazy.





Lolz. I was responding to your trash about herbicide and you come back with obesity and sugar.

It's all agent oranges fault, amirite?

[Wild Cobra]

pass through the digestive tract and through the liver without modification, right into the bloodstream?

search "hfcs liver"

assholes here defending Corn-Refiners-Association industrial crap HFCS! :lol

and why the fuck does shitty old modern corn need refining anyway?

I understand the liver/fructose conversion to cholesterol. Fructose also doesn't cause an insulin response like glucose does.

[sickdsm]

pass through the digestive tract and through the liver without modification, right into the bloodstream?

search "hfcs liver"

assholes here defending Corn-Refiners-Association industrial crap HFCS! :lol

and why the fuck does shitty old modern corn need refining anyway?

Why do most foods need to be refined? Grind some beet pulp in your coffee or purée some cane the next time you bake a cake.

[pgardn]

I don't know all the biological science between thse, but what I gather, regular table sugar and HFCS have the same two molecule components. The difference is table sugar is made from sugar cane, beets, etc, and the fructose glucose content are a perfect 50%/50%. It is a more stable molecule and not absorbed in the stomach, but requires metabolism in the small intestine. This leads to positive nutrition for the gut flora to digest our foods. HFCS on the other hand are not in this complimentary 50/50 mix, processed to enhance sweetness, and much of the molecules break down in the stomach, being more immediately dissolved in our bloodstream rather than being broken down before entering the bloodstream. Once the glucose-fructose bond is broken, it can directly pass into the blood. Probably why it is sweeter also. Breaks down more readily in out mouth.

there are 3 molecules sucrose, glucose and fructose... They are different molecules. One sucrose molecule (table sugar) is very different from one individual fructose and one individual glucose. Your body reacts differently to each...

Do I need to continue? This is just the start...

[pgardn]

What is table sugar?
What is/are the differences between sucrose, glucose and fructose?
What carbohydrate, lipid, or protein is absorbed in the stomach?
What carbohydrate is metabolized in the stomach?
What does metabolized mean?
What carbohydrates are broken down in the stomach?
What does more immediately dissolved in the bloodstream mean?
How is it that a glucose- fructose bond breakage causes something to be sweeter after it has passed through the mouth?
Do glucose-fructose bonds break in the mouth?



There is all the above still. I answered the first and second in my previous post. Then we can go on to why HFCS is so popular with the food industry. Boutons stuff.

[Wild Cobra]

there are 3 molecules sucrose, glucose and fructose... They are different molecules. One sucrose molecule (table sugar) is very different from one individual fructose and one individual glucose. Your body reacts differently to each...

Do I need to continue? This is just the start...
Agreed.

So?

What makes you think I don't understand, especially after my later posts?

[Wild Cobra]

There is all the above still. I answered the first and second in my previous post. Then we can go on to why HFCS is so popular with the food industry. Boutons stuff.
I understand these aspects. I don't like HFCS and avoid it when I can. I will consume small quantities when I have limited choices.

I'm not going to play a 20 questions when I have better things to do.

I was attempting to show that not all sugars are equal like so many HFCS pushers like to claim. That they do metabolize differently.

[pgardn]

What carbohydrate, lipid, or protein is absorbed in the stomach?
What carbohydrate is metabolized in the stomach?
What does metabolized mean?
What carbohydrates are broken down in the stomach?
What does more immediately dissolved in the bloodstream mean?
How is it that a glucose- fructose bond breakage causes something to be sweeter after it has passed through the mouth?
Do glucose-fructose bonds break in the mouth?



)

Answer them.
You wanted to know, do your work.

[Wild Cobra]

Answer them.
You wanted to know, do your work.
I have no intention of wasting my time.

If you need those answers, you go look.

Do you agree they three sugars metabolize differently or not?

[pgardn]

I understand these aspects. I don't like HFCS and avoid it when I can. I will consume small quantities when I have limited choices.

I'm not going to play a 20 questions when I have better things to do.

I was attempting to show that not all sugars are equal like so many HFCS pushers like to claim. That they do metabolize differently.

Then don't ask me to correct your massive wrongness.

[pgardn]

OK, show me.

I know the answers.
The questions were for your understanding that you did, and then did not want.

Do we revisit public education in Texas and Capacitors again as well...
How is the board supposed to give credence to your climate stuff when there are so many other outright wrongs... Or anything for that manner. Establish some sort of reliability for gods sake.

[Wild Cobra]

I know the answers.
The questions were for your understanding that you did, and then did not want.

Do we revisit public education in Texas and Capacitors again as well...
How is the board supposed to give credence to your climate stuff when there are so many other outright wrongs... Or anything for that manner. Establish some sort of reliability for gods sake.
Why are you such an ass, and cannot accept when people revise what they mistakenly said before?

What does that say about your lack of character FuzzyToo?

[Wild Cobra]

Then don't ask me to correct your massive wrongness.
There was no "massive wrongness" to correct after I revised my initial words.

[pgardn]

Why are you such an ass, and cannot accept when people revise what they mistakenly said before?

What does that say about your lack of character FuzzyToo?

The ass is a person who randomly puts stuff up and asks to be taken seriously.
Just don't comment on stuff you don't know about, is that so difficult?

And then certainly don't ask for clarification. It's not that hard. Opinions are welcome. Just don't lace them with stuff that is flat out wrong. I will report you to the better consumer of carb bureau for intended contamination of product.

[pgardn]

There was no "massive wrongness" to correct after I revised my initial words.

Yes there is.
At least the way you presented it, massive.

[Wild Cobra]

Yes there is.
At least the way you presented it, massive.
Yet you wont prove I'm wrong.

Goodday.

[pgardn]

I don't know all the biological science between thse, but what I gather, regular table sugar and HFCS have the same two molecule components. The difference is table sugar is made from sugar cane, beets, etc, and the fructose glucose content are a perfect 50%/50%. It is a more stable molecule and not absorbed in the stomach, but requires metabolism in the small intestine. This leads to positive nutrition for the gut flora to digest our foods. HFCS on the other hand are not in this complimentary 50/50 mix, processed to enhance sweetness, and much of the molecules break down in the stomach, being more immediately dissolved in our bloodstream rather than being broken down before entering the bloodstream. Once the glucose-fructose bond is broken, it can directly pass into the blood. Probably why it is sweeter also. Breaks down more readily in out mouth.

More stable, nope.
Stomach... Stomach? Why do you even mention the stomach when referring to carbohydrates?

And it continues... Those questions were asked so you would read and then possibly understand that what you write is... Massively wrong.

So yes good day. I now understand that when you say you want to know how wrong you are, you really don't want to know how wrong you are.

[Wild Cobra]

What the fuck is your problem?

"I don't know all the biological science between thse, but what I gather,"

Can you not understand what this means? And why, after I revise this in my next posts, do you stick to this?

Why are you so butthurt over this Fuzzy?

I mean wanna-be-fuzzy...

[pgardn]

OK, show me.

[pgardn]

He said yes, so I took this to mean No.

-Woody Allen

[Wild Cobra]

Why do you insist I school you?


More stable, nope.

For sucrose, a disaccharide, it takes (I believe) an specific enzyme, to break the bond between the fructose and glucose. This doesn't happen till it's in the small intestine.


Stomach... Stomach? Why do you even mention the stomach when referring to carbohydrates?

Because glucose will enter the bloodstream through the stomach lining. I believe fructose does too. HFCS has these as free, unbonded molecules. In other words, monosaccharides.



And it continues... Those questions were asked so you would read and then possibly understand that what you write is... Massively wrong.

I'm sorry, I don't see what my "massively wrong" mistakes are. You insinuate this, but will not prove my "massive" mistake.



So yes good day. I now understand that when you say you want to know how wrong you are, you really don't want to know how wrong you are.
LOL...

No, I just want you to put up, or shut up. You are looking like an ignorant jerk like fuzzy. I do believe you are capable of being better than that.

[pgardn]

Why do you insist I school you?


For sucrose, a disaccharide, it takes (I believe) an specific enzyme, to break the bond between the fructose and glucose. This doesn't happen till it's in the small intestine.


Because glucose will enter the bloodstream through the stomach lining. I believe fructose does too. HFCS has these as free, unbonded molecules. In other words, monosaccharides.


I'm sorry, I don't see what my "massively wrong" mistakes are. You insinuate this, but will not prove my "massive" mistake.


LOL...

No, I just want you to put up, or shut up. You are looking like an ignorant jerk like fuzzy. I do believe you are capable of being better than that.

NO sucrose is less stable because IT CAN be broken down outside of cells

in cells it takes many many enzymes to completely break down fructose and glucose (see cellular respiration)
The small intestine has NO enzymes to break down glucose or fructose

Glucose does NOT enter the bloodstream via the stomach lining.
Fructose does NOT enter the bloodstream via the stomach lining.

HFCS also has sucrose.

So far you are patently WRONG with everything above.
Do you wish to continue Mr. Put up shut up?

[Wild Cobra]

NO sucrose is less stable because IT CAN be broken down outside of cells

in cells it takes many many enzymes to completely break down fructose and glucose (see cellular respiration)
The small intestine has NO enzymes to break down glucose or fructose

Glucose does NOT enter the bloodstream via the stomach lining.
Fructose does NOT enter the bloodstream via the stomach lining.

HFCS also has sucrose.

So far you are patently WRONG with everything above.
Do you wish to continue Mr. Put up shut up?

LOL...

That does not coincide with the things I have read.

I'm not talking about "breaking down" glucose or fructose FuzzyToo. Why are you ASSuming things I don't say? I have revised my initial post on this, repeatedly said so, but you keep going back to it.

And yes, Glucose factually can be absorbed into the bloodstream from the stomach. This is fact.

Sucrose cannot be absorbed in the stomach, or small intestine. The enzyme has to break the bond between the two before the can be absorbed.

HFCS may have sucrose, but I don't think it will exceed 10% of the sugars.

You contend I am wrong, but you will not back it up...

[pgardn]

LOL...

That does not coincide with the things I have read.

I'm not talking about "breaking down" glucose or fructose FuzzyToo. Why are you ASSuming things I don't say? I have revised my initial post on this, repeatedly said so, but you keep going back to it.

And yes, Glucose factually can be absorbed into the bloodstream from the stomach. This is fact.

Sucrose cannot be absorbed in the stomach, or small intestine. The enzyme has to break the bond between the two before the can be absorbed.

HFCS may have sucrose, but I don't think it will exceed 10% of the sugars.

You contend I am wrong, but you will not back it up...

Show me where you have read:

sucrose is more stable than monosaccharides
why do you think I asked you what metabolism means "Mr. Having a Breakdown"
glucose absorbed in the small intestine as is fructose, only alcohol has any appreciable absorption in the stomach, the stomach does very little absorption of ANY bio molecules!

HFCS can have widely varying amounts of Sucrose.

Where did you get so many things wrong from, it's quite amazing you are so stalwartly misinformed. I really want to read this. And then actually read YOUR OWN site posted.

Good God... You never cease to amaze me...

And we we still have not finished, the screen must be blood red for you, massacre...

If you require me to guide you with sites forget it.
You are just WRONG and when you actually decide to read something about this you will find this out.
If you don't believe what I have written... So what. Wallow in your ignorance.

In your world was Duncan traded to Miami yet?

[Wild Cobra]

Show me where you have read:

sucrose is more stable than monosaccharides

I didn't say I read that. My initial post was revised. My initial post was worded poorly.



why do you think I asked you what metabolism means "Mr. Having a Breakdown"

WTF?



glucose absorbed in the small intestine as is fructose, only alcohol has any appreciable absorption in the stomach, the stomach does very little absorption of ANY bio molecules!

Your wording suggests you have found the evidence that some glucose is absorbed in the stomach like I said.



HFCS can have widely varying amounts of Sucrose.

Perhaps, but most have under 10% of anything other than glucose and fructose.



Where did you get so many things wrong from, it's quite amazing you are so stalwartly misinformed. I really want to read this. And then actually read YOUR OWN site posted.

Good God... You never cease to amaze me...

I don't see anything you pointed out as wrong. It looks more like you are misunderstanding my words, and failing to ask me too elaborate.



And we we still have not finished, the screen must be blood red for you, massacre...

No red.

I'm getting tired of you lack of proper debate though.



If you require me to guide you with sites forget it.
You are just WRONG and when you actually decide to read something about this you will find this out.
If you don't believe what I have written... So what. Wallow in your ignorance.


LOL...

I've been thinking the same thing. Were you looking in a mirror when you wrote that?

I guess you are stubborn in believing old knowledge. It might be recent years they discovered glucose is also absorbed in the stomach. I don't know how old this new knowledge is, but it used to be thought it was only absorbed in the small intestines.

[pgardn]

I didn't say I read that. My initial post was revised. My initial post was worded poorly.


WTF?


Your wording suggests you have found the evidence that some glucose is absorbed in the stomach like I said.


Perhaps, but most have under 10% of anything other than glucose and fructose.


I don't see anything you pointed out as wrong. It looks more like you are misunderstanding my words, and failing to ask me too elaborate.


No red.

I'm getting tired of you lack of proper debate though.



LOL...

I've been thinking the same thing. Were you looking in a mirror when you wrote that?

I guess you are stubborn in believing old knowledge. It might be recent years they discovered glucose is also absorbed in the stomach. I don't know how old this new knowledge is, but it used to be thought it was only absorbed in the small intestines.

Glucose is not absorbed in the stomach it is absorbed in the small intestine. As is fructose. Don't try to slither out of your complete misunderstanding of the stomach.

I asked you before what breakdown means since your lack of knowledge disagrees and misuse of terms disagrees with every medical finding for normal human beings. Read your own site, the one you posted, read it and follow the links.

And your pretending to stumble upon new evidence when you had no idea what the old tried and true evidence was is disingenuous and more than pitiful.

You wanted more, I gave you more.
Pssss... We never went to the moon, it's old stuff.
join the 9/11 crew on this site. Contact robdiaz.

[sickdsm]

Long argument short:

HFCS has made sugar cheap and more available. Arguing about the nuances of its formation vs honey vs agave vs cane is just taking the focus off the problem.

People eat too damn much junk and don't do enough physical activity. They want to say its someone else's fault they are a lard bucket.

It's not the twinkies or mtn dew that made you fat.

In moderation.

[Wild Cobra]

Pssss... We never went to the moon, it's old stuff.
join the 9/11 crew on this site. Contact robdiaz.

No thanks. You might want to be a member of that group, I don't.

[pgardn]

Long argument short:

HFCS has made sugar cheap and more available. Arguing about the nuances of its formation vs honey vs agave vs cane is just taking the focus off the problem.

People eat too damn much junk and don't do enough physical activity. They want to say its someone else's fault they are a lard bucket.

It's not the twinkies or mtn dew that made you fat.

In moderation.

Yep.

Read the beginning of the thread.
Exercise, moderation.

The food industry does its best to hide simple sugar content.
For guys like WC who can't read... or don't look at serving size numbers, it's not good.

[pgardn]

No thanks. You might want to be a member of that group, I don't.

Keep believing what you have written.
Its massively wrong.

You really belong. Being the non status quo trailblazer you have become in biochemistry...

[Wild Cobra]

Long argument short:

HFCS has made sugar cheap and more available. Arguing about the nuances of its formation vs honey vs agave vs cane is just taking the focus off the problem.

I agree for the most part.

One thing that most should not disagree with is that the enzymes in the small intestines can only break the bonds of so many disaccharides in a given time, therefore there is a limit of sugar absorption. Monosaccharides effectively have no such limit of absorption because they are already in an absorbable form.



People eat too damn much junk and don't do enough physical activity. They want to say its someone else's fault they are a lard bucket.

Would the excessive junk food eating be so bad if all the sugars were disaccharides?



It's not the twinkies or mtn dew that made you fat.


Didn't Twinkies use to be made from cane sugar?



In moderation.
Like everything.

There are known cases of people dying from drinking too much water.

[Winehole23]

Texas Ag Commissioner Sid Miller sticks up for bake sales, deep fat fryers and local choice:

http://www.texastribune.org/2015/04/24/heated-debate-surrounds-millers-push-deep-fryers-s/

[boutons_deux]

Texas Ag Commissioner Sid Miller sticks up for bake sales, deep fat fryers and local choice:

http://www.texastribune.org/2015/04/24/heated-debate-surrounds-millers-push-deep-fryers-s/

Freedom!

Liberty!

BigAg M$s!

[Winehole23]

what do home baked cupcakes and deep fat fryers have to do with BigAg?

[Winehole23]

I'll take my answer off the air, thanks.

[boutons_deux]

what do home baked cupcakes and deep fat fryers have to do with BigAg?

highly processed, and subsidized, BigAg flour and sugar, then the BigAg's shit chicken, potatoes, and vegetable oil.

[Winehole23]

french fries and fried chicken and oil to throw in the fryer.

fair points. something to do with BigAg. I see it more as Miller seeking the sympathy of obese and gluttonous Texans.


.
(deep fat frying has its place anywhere a hard-working Texan needs a cheap, quick meal. the quality of the french fries and fried chicken may vary from place to place.)

[sickdsm]

highly processed, and subsidized, BigAg flour and sugar, then the BigAg's shit chicken, potatoes, and vegetable oil.

I eat chicken every day. Potatoes most days. Always boughten bread.

I've lost 20 lbs the past two months, mainly choosing chicken for my meat. Why is this shit food? I could deep fry celery and put chocolate and salt on it, it doesn't mean celery is bad for you???