Boris Diaw looking to get a 2 year $18-$20 contract with Spurs

[Ditty]

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/lawrence-bulls-joakim-noah-calling-carmelo-answering-article-1.1838772

It's in the slamdunks part of the article.

[Poolboy5623]

Yikes..that seems like a bit more than I thought he'd get.

[benstanfield]

2 for 18 is absurd. That's like the opening offer, where the Spurs then offer 2 for 10 and they meet somewhere in the middle.

How does 3 for 18 sound, Boris?

[SanDiegoSpursFan]

Terrible source

[Robz4000]

Yikes.

[Poolboy5623]

2/ 12-14...get it done.

[Mel_13]

No sources cited.

Pure and utter speculation from a NY tabloid columnist.

Nothing to see here.

[timtonymanu]

Yeah, that source isn't reliable.

[DesignatedT]

A 2 year deal would end up being great for the spurs, even at that price. Boris is piling up a lot of miles on himself quickly and committing to him long term would be more worrisome than what he's going to be getting payed IMO.

I think he will want at least a three year deal though.

[benefactor]

Three years at that price is much more likely.

[Emperor]

Thanks for everything Boris, good luck with whatever team that pays you that amount.

[Ditty]

2 years $14-$15 would be fair.

[DesignatedT]

Thanks for everything Boris, good luck with whatever team that pays you that amount.

Do you just not pay attention to anything that's being said or what. This is pure speculation by some random dude.

[Emperor]

Do you just not pay attention to anything that's being said or what. This is pure speculation by some random dude.

Calm your tits guy was just joking :lol

[TheGreatYacht]

If Splitter can get 10M/yr out of the PATFO... Why can't Boris :lol

[Poolboy5623]

If diaw is gonna get that, or close, wth is mills gonna receive? ?

[exstatic]

If diaw is gonna get that, or close, wth is mills gonna receive? ?

Less. He's an incomplete player, unlike Boris, who can pretty much play any position.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Spurstalk is fucking unbielevable.

Kawhi Leonard 5 years/$80M = "sweet man"

Boris Diaw 2 years/$18M = "douchebag fag"

Never...fucking...change :lmao

[cd021]

3 years/ 18 with a team option for the 3rd...

[Prime Time]

Oh my lawd. Lets wait until we get some legit sources before aiming 5+ pages.

[ironman2886]

No sources at all. The guy just says, "Boris Deal will be looking for a 2 year 18-20 million dollar deal." What a moron.

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/250x250/50974272.jpg

[Diego20]

2 years $14-$15 would be fair.

This.

[Ron Swanson]

We just stepped on the gas. Next stop - 10 pages.

[baseline bum]

I think he'll get something around 3 years, $20 million, fully guaranteed.

[AFBlue]

Dude pretty much revived his career and had a major impact on this championship team. I think two years at $20M is a bit much, but I think he could easily command $7-8M per year. If I had to guess, I'd say he ends up right in the middle...2yrs, $15M.

[Brazil]

:lol that's a journalist making an assumption and giving his opinion. There is no quote or source

[T Park]

3 years 22 million. Get it done.

[PingPong]

16-18 million for 2 years isn't bad.

[jag]

Spurstalk is fucking unbielevable.

Kawhi Leonard 5 years/$80M = "sweet man"

Boris Diaw 2 years/$18M = "douchebag fag"

Never...fucking...change :lmao

Stop posting

[Sean Cagney]

Yeah, that source isn't reliable.

And that about says it all, won't even bother reading.

[benefactor]

Stop posting
Not until he gives us some hard hitting analysis about Manu and what he feels his maximum single game production might be. I am eagerly waiting to read it so that I might digest some of the depth within.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Stop posting

:lmao still mad that I regulated the shit out of you

Someone get this effective grey-named faggot a spur for having the largest post count without ever saying anything of value. 70% of your posts are vapid, mind-numbing one liners without a shred of analysis of original insight.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Not until he gives us some hard hitting analysis about Manu and what he feels his maximum single game production might be. I am eagerly waiting to read it so that I might digest some of the depth within.

In the meantime let's regale ourselves with the masterfully insightful posts of jag -



Golden God





Free Tiago







:cry way too much class going on








This dude about to discover a whole new world of tramps





Who can't help but feel their neurons being stimulated by reading that?

Shall we continue?



:cry





http://www.wheresweems.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Robin-Lopez-Reaction.gif





My nigga





Sign Patty. Sign Boris



Wow, we should sign Patty and sign Boris. Thank you so, so fucking much for that brilliant fucking insight. I bet you're just jumping out of your seat to see what this substance-less faggot has to say next.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Let's be perfectly clear. I don't give a shit about your dumb ass worst posters list. This isn't some contrived act that I'm doing just for the sake of becoming infamous on these boards. I'm literally pointing out the fact that jag has nothing (read: N-O-T-H-I-N-G) of value to contribute to these boards.

[InRareForm]

I guess the downside of being a great team, the persons of the collective unit have to be paid, and paid good.

[DMC]

Other than RJ, this team doesn't have a history of overpaying people.

[DMC]

I guess the downside of being a great team, the persons of the collective unit have to be paid, and paid good.
Not in this system. The persons can be replaced.

[jag]

Let's be perfectly clear. I don't give a shit about your dumb ass worst posters list. This isn't some contrived act that I'm doing just for the sake of becoming infamous on these boards. I'm literally pointing out the fact that jag has nothing (read: N-O-T-H-I-N-G) of value to contribute to these boards.

Trying so hard to get noticed. So hard

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Trying so hard to get noticed. So hard

Thanks for proving my point. Another smug, vapid response that adds nothing to the discussion.

[Cry Havoc]

"Joel Embiid had a stress fracture of his back only three months ago and last Friday underwent surgery on his right foot to repair a broken bone. There might not be two worse injuries on a medical record for a 7-footer to enter the NBA with, meaning he’ll fall in Thursday’s draft. The Cavs would have taken him if he hadn’t required surgery on his foot, but now they aren’t going to touch him at No. 1 unless it’s to trade him. One team that sounds very interested in Embiid is Utah, at No. 5. The Jazz can put together a package including Enes Kanter, a future No. 1 and their pick and probably get Embid. It might take even less, considering Embiid’s first season could be a waste due to his latest injury. At No. 4, the Magic can put together a package featuring Aaron Afflalo or Tobias Harris plus its pick. . . . Maccabi Tel Aviv offered its head coach, David Blatt, around $1 million per season to stay on after it won the Euroleague title this season, but Blatt wanted north of $1 million annually. Maccabi then told Blatt it was moving on, so he was without a job when CSKA of Russia came calling with a three-year, $7.5 million offer. But his wife didn’t want to move back to Moscow, where her husband had once coached. With nowhere else to go, he interviewed for the Cleveland Cavs’ post. Although Blatt was rumored to be Steve Kerr’s choice for his new No. 1 assistant with the Warriors, people who know him say he never intended to take an assistant’s job in his first NBA gig because he felt it was beneath him. Now the 55-year-old Princeton grad is the Cavs’ head man and the first coach to make the jump from the Euroleague to the NBA, after about a dozen coaches interviewed or were contacted about the post, and not one felt it was worth it to get involved with Cleveland owner Dan Gilbert. His deal is for four years and could be worth as much as $20 million. “Wait till Blatt gets lectured and scolded by Gilbert,” said one source, citing the owner’s management style. “But wait till Gilbert finds out that Blatt will yell right back.” Meanwhile, nobody thinking straight believes that Kyrie Irving: A) wants to stay in Cleveland, playing for a person who has never coached in the NBA; B) will ever sign a long-term extension, even if it’s for the maximum. But stranger things have happened. . . . Kerr tabbed Alvin Gentry, who interviewed for the Cavs’ job and was Doc Rivers’ top aide with the Clippers, as his No. 1 assistant. . . . Pat Riley picked up on his team’s mental fatigue during the playoffs and heard more about it during the Heat players’ exit interviews. “I understand it, but I don’t accept it,” Riley said. “Maybe they didn’t know how to prepare themselves for four straight years in the NBA Finals. If that’s an excuse or is used as a crutch, well, it takes a special team with the right mentality and the right focus to be able to do that and then also win the championship. If the players are saying it was a tough year, it was a grind, every game, every night, well, welcome to the NBA and welcome to the world of what it takes to win the NBA championship. You should go talk to Bill Russell and see how he handled that. I know it’s a different era today, but the mentality that you need to have is still the same.” Those were some brutally tough words, but every one rings true. His challenge to James to show some guts and stay and not look to run out the first open door he finds was classic Riley, even if his critics harkened back to his decision to bolt the Knicks after four seasons and accused him of being more than a little hypocritical. Here he tried to push the right buttons to get James to think twice about leaving. We’ll see if it works, although James has given no indication he’s leaving July 1, with his options next to none. “He had me so fired up and motivated!” Magic Johnson said of his old coach’s 55-minute throwing-down-the-gauntlet session. “I wish I could play for him again!”"

That is literally one paragraph. I seriously hope he's not getting paid to be a writer. That is fucking terrible. I'm serious. I haven't written like that since 7th grade.

[BackHome]

You two need to get a room..:)

[jag]

:lol calling me smug or vapid. You're like a chick. Does this mean I'm not your type? Does this mean you can't see yourself being with a guy like me, faggot? :lol you thinking you've ever "regulated" anyone on these forums. You're that random, borderline retarded GNSF who said Manu would never score 20 again. That obviously bothers you, so you're trying to reinvent yourself as the shittiest poster on the forum just so people will notice you.

The irony of this guy calling out multiple people for not "adding" to the discussion:



Ignore this faggot :lmao


You're correct.


Kobe literally admitted in an interview recently that his contract was at least in part a lifetime achievement award :lmao


:lmao


And I think Paul George's contract is absolutely horrendous. The guy is nowhere near being a superstar.


:lmao


No one wants to live in San Antonio :lmao


:lmao

:rollin :rollin

:lmao


Another quality take from a "2nd team All spurs talk poster" (... :lmao). What substance. What insight.

:lmao

...

:rollin

[jARS mEsH sEt]

:lol calling me smug or vapid. You're like a chick. Does this mean I'm not your type? Does this mean you can't see yourself being with a guy like me, faggot? :lol you thinking you've ever "regulated" anyone on these forums. You're that random, borderline retarded GNSF who said Manu would never score 20 again. That obviously bothers you, so you're trying to reinvent yourself as the shittiest poster on the forum just so people will notice you.

The irony of this guy calling out multiple people for not "adding" to the discussion:

:lmao spending all that time going through my posting history when you're trying so hard to be cool and "not notice" me.

:rollin

[jag]

I'm not sure what "being cool" has to do with anything. You're only ever noticed because you're a shit poster. It didn't take much effort to point that out.

[Robz4000]

Holy shit, jag committing murder in public :wow...

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Holy shit, jag (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8191) committing murder in public :wow...

I don't want to interrupt while you two faggots are sucking each other off, tbh :lmao

[jag]

Another classic example of Jars "regulating" dudes. Solid work, brah

[Vito Corleone]

The Spurs don't just hand out big contracts like that.

There has to be a market for him at that price and I don't see another team offering him that kind of money. Most teams might offer him the mid-level exemption which I'm sure the Spurs can beat. When it's all said and done, I see him getting somewhere around 3 years at 20 to 25 million. Which is perfect since his third year he becomes very trade-able.

[Robz4000]

I don't want to interrupt while you two faggots are sucking each other off, tbh :lmao

:lol Manu really ruined your life, didn't he?

[Spurs 4 The Win]

Yall all look like retarded no life faggets

[spurs1990]

If Splitter can get 10M/yr out of the PATFO... Why can't Boris :lol

Again, what does the PATFO mean. I figure last part stands for front office.

[Robz4000]

Again, what does the PATFO mean. I figure last part stands for front office.

Pop and the Front Office

[tholdren]

2 years for 20 and then trade for lebron

[jag]

Taking a break from that nonsense, I'll say this about Boris so I don't completely shitty up the thread. As far as contract negotiations go it's going to be very difficult to gauge his market value. It was much easier with Tiago because you could look around the League and see what other guys at his size were making relative to their production. Boris is very different in that I think his value/usefulness for the Spurs is unique to the Spurs. I don't think you'll see that quality of play from him on many, if any, other teams. His special relationship with Tony, his respect for Pop and the Spurs unique chemistry, have everything to do with his leading every player in the Finals with a +74.

So how do you gauge his market value? I dont think 32 year old Boris Diaw is worth more than the MLE to anyone else in the League. But to the Spurs? I think he's worth more. If the Spurs lose Mills, CoJo steps in. He's not as skilled as Patty, but the Spurs at least have a fallback option. Where do the Spurs go for a PF if they lose Boris? Duncan and Splitter are Centers. And the offense isn't what it should be with both on the floor together.

A +74 Finals PF, is worth quite a bit to this team. But it's an interesting scenario where his value doesn't translate past the Spurs. His leverage is that he'll just walk, but it's not going to be for more money.

[benefactor]

:lol...what a fantastic meltdown. Glad I could be of assistance.

[Mel_13]

Taking a break from that nonsense, I'll say this about Boris. As far as contract negotiations go it's going to be very difficult to gauge his market value. It was much easier with Tiago because you could look around the League and see what other guys at his size were making relative to their production. Boris is very different in that I think his value/usefulness for the Spurs is unique to the Spurs. I don't think you'll see that quality of play from him on many, if any, other teams. His special relationship with Tony, his respect for Pop and the Spurs unique chemistry, have everything to do with his leading every player in the Finals with a +74.

So how do you gauge his market value? I dont think 32 year old Boris Diaw is worth more than the MLE to anyone else in the League. But to the Spurs? I think he's worth more. If the Spurs lose Mills, CoJo steps in. He's not as skilled as Patty, but the Spurs at least have a fallback option. Where do the Spurs go for a PF if they lose Boris? Duncan and Splitter are Centers. And the offense isn't what it should be with both on the floor together.

A +74 Finals PF, is worth quite a bit to this team. But it's an interesting scenario where his value doesn't translate past the Spurs. His leverage is that he'll just walk, but it's not going to be for more money.

That would certainly seem to be true when you talk about teams that could remotely be considered contenders. The MLE is 4yrs/21M. I say the Spurs make their first offer at 3yrs/21M and get Boris wrapped up before he even talks to another team.

[benefactor]

:lol calling me smug or vapid. You're like a chick. Does this mean I'm not your type? Does this mean you can't see yourself being with a guy like me, faggot? :lol you thinking you've ever "regulated" anyone on these forums. You're that random, borderline retarded GNSF who said Manu would never score 20 again. That obviously bothers you, so you're trying to reinvent yourself as the shittiest poster on the forum just so people will notice you.

The irony of this guy calling out multiple people for not "adding" to the discussion:
http://cdn.gifbay.com/2012/12/muay_thai_front_kick_ko-20461.gif

[jag]

That would certainly seem to be true when you talk about teams that could remotely be considered contenders. The MLE is 4yrs/21M. I say the Spurs make their first offer at 3yrs/21M and get Boris wrapped up before he even talks to another team.

I think he could be had for 3yrs/18, possibly with a player option. But then you're playing the game and running the risk of him looking around. I still go back to my first point though, I don't see how he could get more than that.

[Mel_13]

I think he could be had for 3yrs/18, possibly with a player option. But then you're playing the game and running the risk of him looking around. I still go back to my first point though, I don't see how he could get more than that.

Yeah, it's a weird situation. He is extremely valuable to the Spurs, but he probably won't get much love in free agency. There are probably some teams that still view the way he left Charlotte as a huge red flag.

[Vito Corleone]

I think he could be had for 3yrs/18, possibly with a player option. But then you're playing the game and running the risk of him looking around. I still go back to my first point though, I don't see how he could get more than that.

The way others could win him is more years like around 4 years then you have to pay him more to keep him.

[100%duncan]

:lol that's a journalist making an assumption and giving his opinion. There is no quote or source
This. Almost had a heartattack tho

[Ice009]

If Boris really does want that kind of money, he really needs to get his ass in shape. Not have bets with teammates like Patty Mills and then come back in the same shape as the previous year while Mills worked his ass off in the off-season to get in much better shape. I know the extra weight helps Boris in the post, but he can tone up a lot more and be an even better player. If he does that I'd happily pay him 9 million per season, but he's gotta be committed to working out and take his diet seriously before I even think about giving him that much money.

And how has Mills earned a contract bigger than Danny Green's? I've seen numbers thrown around that are much higher than what Danny Green got. Why should he get more than Green got?

[Mel_13]

Why should he get more than Green got?

The amount he can command is determined by what another team will offer him in 2014, not what Danny Green got from the Spurs in 2012.

[jARS mEsH sEt]

Taking a break from that nonsense, I'll say this about Boris so I don't completely shitty up the thread. As far as contract negotiations go it's going to be very difficult to gauge his market value. It was much easier with Tiago because you could look around the League and see what other guys at his size were making relative to their production. Boris is very different in that I think his value/usefulness for the Spurs is unique to the Spurs. I don't think you'll see that quality of play from him on many, if any, other teams. His special relationship with Tony, his respect for Pop and the Spurs unique chemistry, have everything to do with his leading every player in the Finals with a +74.

So how do you gauge his market value? I dont think 32 year old Boris Diaw is worth more than the MLE to anyone else in the League. But to the Spurs? I think he's worth more. If the Spurs lose Mills, CoJo steps in. He's not as skilled as Patty, but the Spurs at least have a fallback option. Where do the Spurs go for a PF if they lose Boris? Duncan and Splitter are Centers. And the offense isn't what it should be with both on the floor together.

A +74 Finals PF, is worth quite a bit to this team. But it's an interesting scenario where his value doesn't translate past the Spurs. His leverage is that he'll just walk, but it's not going to be for more money.

:lmao so you admit you completely derailed his thread with your cum guzzling circle jerk with benefaggot and Rod-slurper9000


:lol...what a fantastic meltdown. Glad I could be of assistance.

Hey man you should thank me. I actually got vag to post something of merit once out of 100 posts :rollin

[Ice009]

The amount he can command is determined by what another team will offer him in 2014, not what Danny Green got from the Spurs in 2012.

Why should he get more money than Danny Green. I think the most the Spurs should pay him is what Green got. I don't understand why he'd be worth more. What is your opinion on the matter?

[Mel_13]

Why should he get more money than Danny Green. I think the most the Spurs should pay him is what Green got. I don't understand why he'd be worth more. What is your opinion on the matter?

I can't be any clearer.

If another team offer Mills the MLE, the Spurs can match the offer or watch him leave. They can't tell him that he has to stay in San Antonio for the same salary as Danny.

[exstatic]

Why should he get more money than Danny Green. I think the most the Spurs should pay him is what Green got. I don't understand why he'd be worth more. What is your opinion on the matter?

It's not what you think or what Danny thinks. It's what the market will bear. 3 and D's are one best values in the league right now, which means they are usually underpaid.

[elemento]

I really don't see him getting this kind of money

Despite his amazing display in the Finals, teams around the league know that Diaw needs to be motivated in the right environment to succeed.

I think he stays and Manu's last contract is absolutely the ceiling of Diaw's contract.

[Mel_13]

I really don't see him getting this kind of money

Despite his amazing display in the Finals, teams around the league know that Diaw needs to be motivated in the right environment to succeed.

I think he stays and Manu's last contract is absolutely the ceiling of Diaw's contract.

I think a third year at that salary is very possible. Couple that with a two year extension for Tony and then those contracts expire with Splitter's in 2017.

[jkid12456]

rofl then mills shold get something similar to that tbh..

[Mel_13]

rofl then mills shold get something similar to that tbh..

rofl no

[benefactor]

:lmao so you admit you completely derailed his thread with your cum guzzling circle jerk with benefaggot and Rod-slurper9000



Hey man you should thank me. I actually got vag to post something of merit once out of 100 posts :rollin
I think you are short a few emoticons, try hard.

[Ice009]

I can't be any clearer.

If another team offer Mills the MLE, the Spurs can match the offer or watch him leave. They can't tell him that he has to stay in San Antonio for the same salary as Danny.

I understand all that. I didn't say that I didn't.

I also asked what your opinion is on what he's worth. I didn't think that could be anymore clearer.

IMO I don't think he's worth more money than what Green got. Green brings more to the table, plays defense and can shoot the 3 ball just as well or better.

If teams offer him more, then that's up to the Spurs if they want to pay him more, that's not my decision. If it was me, I'd offer him what Green got or possibly a bit more to get him back on the team. I really like him, but don't know if I'd want to pay him twice as to what Green is getting like some of these numbers out there suggest.

[Mel_13]

I understand all that. I didn't say that I didn't.

You kept saying he shouldn't get more than Danny. To me, Danny's salary is irrelevant to a decision on how far to go with Mills (Just as Splitter's salary is irrelevant to what they will they offer Diaw). Mills fills a different role and it's a different summer with a different set of variables.

At any rate, I've posted about this in several Mills threads already. I believe that they'll try to get him for something around 3/10, but I wouldn't be surprised to see them go all the way up to 4/16. Somewhere above 4M per year, they probably have to let him go.

[Ice009]

You kept saying he shouldn't get more than Danny. To me, Danny's salary is irrelevant to a decision on how far to go with Mills (Just as Splitter's salary is irrelevant to what they will they offer Diaw). Mills fills a different role and it's a different summer with a different set of variables.

At any rate, I've posted about this in several Mills threads already. I believe that they'll try to get him for something around 3/10, but I wouldn't be surprised to see them go all the way up to 4/16. Somewhere above 4M per year, they probably have to let him go.

OK, thank-you, just wanted your opinion. I don't have time to read all the previous threads and posts. I agree with everything you said then, and I would pay him what you've suggested. Hopefully Spurs can get him for around the 4M per season range. I don't mind paying him a bit more than Green as the variables are different, so I guess you can't do an apples to apples comparison between the summers and free agency.

[DMX7]

They know he really wants to come back, I think we get him cheaper.

[elemento]

I think a third year at that salary is very possible. Couple that with a two year extension for Tony and then those contracts expire with Splitter's in 2017.

Yeah, I could see it that way too Mel.

[TheCerebral1]

Three years between 6M and 7M seems about fair. Though with what he's done the last two years, someone could offer him more. It all depends on what he's looking to accomplish.

[Baam]

Boris already won a chip with TP, he's fullfilled his dream, if they try to lowball him he can easily decide to go somewhere else.

It's pretty obvious he's more valuable than Splitter... Imo you give him the most money on the shortest deal possible. Something like 2yrs 20M sounds right, with eventually the second year non garanteed to keep flexibility for 2015.

[SilverSpur]

2 years. 10 - 12 mil. Take it or leave it. We should consider bringing over
ERAZAM LORBECK, if he doesn't except or bring him over anyway. Remember we still have to sign Patty Mills. Actually patty should be signed first.
We should threaten Boris with trading him to Charlotte, LOL, Just joking

[monkeypunk]

2 years. 10 - 12 mil. Take it or leave it. We should consider bringing over
ERAZAM LORBECK if he doesn't except or bring him over anyway. Remember we still have to sign Patty Mills. Actually patty should be signed first.

I think Diaw is the priority, he's a rare bird. Pass first, defense playing, can hit the outside shot bigs are few and far between, especially considering established chemistry with existing players.

Patty is a luxury at the backup point. You can replace his abilities but not his heart.

They both need to be brought back but you'll be hard pressed to replace Diaws near triple double in the Finals at his price.

Lorbek is older and may have a big buyout on his deal he resigned when we brought Diaw in instead of him. I'd bring Lorbek in on the cheap but wouldn't offer him the moon...

[spurraider21]

I only know jars as the guy who started the Manu 20pt thread and was serious about it

[Brazil]

Here are a couple of thoughts on that discussion.

i agree Boris has a very particular skill set and way of playing basketball. I don't believe he will receive interest of shitty teams because of Charlotte experience. Now I also believe the way spurs played and won a chip is gonna inspire other teams. League is full of guys linked to spurs in a way or another and willing to play basketball team, the proper Miami heat will I'm sure focusing on moving the ball next year. Saying Boris would not receive interest of any other teams is foolish. Any team committed to build a winning franchise or already contender would be pretty stupid to not have a look at Boris.

i disagree Boris is less valuable than Danny other than for the age. Boris is a pretty good defender, his versatility is remarkable, he gives match up advantage on almost all the team of the league, his play making at his position is unique. His skill set is way more complicated for the spurs to replace than Danny.

At the end as I already said spurs know what they have, Boris is well aware of what spurs has to offer, both side will find a fair value. Now argument saying he is gonna be cheap cauz he likes playing with Parker and pop and other teams don't care about him is stupid. Boris is no Matt bonner.

[BackHome]

In the end Boris and Mills will sign with the Spurs because they are with good friends/coaches and both are having fun. As long as it's fair value they will sign the dotted line.

[BlackSwordsMan]

2 for a bag of doritos fuck this bum

[Obi Juan Kenobi]

That would certainly seem to be true when you talk about teams that could remotely be considered contenders. The MLE is 4yrs/21M. I say the Spurs make their first offer at 3yrs/21M and get Boris wrapped up before he even talks to another team.

I agree, I think 3 years, 21 million sounds like a fair deal for both sides involved...

[will_spurs]

Yeah, it's a weird situation. He is extremely valuable to the Spurs, but he probably won't get much love in free agency. There are probably some teams that still view the way he left Charlotte as a huge red flag.

Boris didn't choose to play for Atlanta or Charlotte. Actually the only teams he chose to play for in his entire career are the Suns and the Spurs.

I don't think he will go somewhere for more money if he isn't convinced that that team (and the coach) is the right team for him. Similarly I can't see any franchise offering him good money if they haven't understod that. It's quite obvious by now that he can be great when properly motivated, and really crappy when not.

This being said I'm sure there are quite a few teams that would welcome him and find a way to "play him right". The Warriors come to mind.

[Mel_13]

Boris didn't choose to play for Atlanta or Charlotte. Actually the only teams he chose to play for in his entire career are the Suns and the Spurs.

I don't think he will go somewhere for more money if he isn't convinced that that team (and the coach) is the right team for him. Similarly I can't see any franchise offering him good money if they haven't understod that. It's quite obvious by now that he can be great when properly motivated, and really crappy when not.

This being said I'm sure there are quite a few teams that would welcome him and find a way to "play him right". The Warriors come to mind.

That all supports my view of the Boris situation. The teams that might be a suitable match for Boris don't have more than the MLE available. I think that if the Spurs offer a deal with an annual salary in the 6-7M dollar range for 3 years that everything will get signed very quickly and without any drama.

[slick'81]

It will be interesting to see what other teams are willing to offer not only Boris but patty.obviously Diaw is the more important piece

[Baam]

That all supports my view of the Boris situation. The teams that might be a suitable match for Boris don't have more than the MLE available. I think that if the Spurs offer a deal with an annual salary in the 6-7M dollar range for 3 years that everything will get signed very quickly and without any drama.

A team like Pheonix would welcome him with open arms I'm pretty sure... It only takes one team...

[Mel_13]

A team like Pheonix would welcome him with open arms I'm pretty sure... It only takes one team...

You're right that it only takes one team to make a market for a NBA free agent.

[TheGreatYacht]

This is what happens when PATFO overpays for easily expendable players like Splitter... Now everyone wants big $$$

Pau Gasol will happily sign for that kind of money... HELLO PAU

[Mel_13]

This is what happens when PATFO overpays for easily expandable players like Splitter... Now everyone wants big $$$

Pau Gasol will happily sign for that kind of money... HELLO PAU

Splitter received precisely his market value.

[tholdren]

Splitter received precisely his market value.
not really, but you can keep spouting that shit if it makes you feel good

[Mel_13]

not really, but you can keep spouting that shit if it makes you feel good

Really, and precisely.

[spurraider21]

not really, but you can keep spouting that shit if it makes you feel good
6

[TheGreatYacht]

not really, but you can keep spouting that shit if it makes you feel good
Don't waste your time. He'll agree with anything the Spurs do. He probably thinks they got a bargain on the Jefferson contract

[tholdren]

Really, and precisely.
no he didnt. Spurs FO shat the bed and valued him much higher than they should have. There isnt really another way to look at it.

[manufan10]

Splitter proved his worth vs Dallas and Portland.

[tholdren]

Splitter is a CAREER 8ppg 5RPG (they arent even good rebounds) and got signed for 10 mil a year? Thats about 2-3 million too much. You have Gibson and Gortat with better numbers, and sitting in the 7 million range. That is splitters value.

[tholdren]

Splitter proved his worth vs Dallas and Portland.
Splitter did not prove he was 10 times better against Blair. Anyone who says that, is lying, and thinking too much with heart, and too little with head.

[tholdren]

And he proved he wasnt worth 10 million a year getting worked in the WCF and F...

[TheGreatYacht]

I can't believe people actually think Splitter is worth Gortat money

http://youtu.be/QL307vascww

[.G.]

Splitter will only get better. Had a dream he and Duncan were laughing hysterically as they celebrated a championship in the closing moments of a Finals, wearing their home jerseys. Knew it wasn't GM5. Has to be next year....

As for Diaw....Nigga needs to get PAID by PATFO.

[Mel_13]

no he didnt. Spurs FO shat the bed and valued him much higher than they should have. There isnt really another way to look at it.

He received precisely his market value. That's really indisputable. You can argue that the Spurs should have let him walk rather than paying his market value, but you can't argue that he was paid more than his market value.

[manufan10]

Splitter did not prove he was 10 times better against Blair. Anyone who says that, is lying, and thinking too much with heart, and too little with head.

Splitter helped keep Dirk in check against Dallas. Also kept Aldridge in check against Portland.

Miami and OKC are bad matchups for Splitter, which is why he went to the bench in the Finals.

[tholdren]

He received precisely his market value. That's really indisputable. You can argue that the Spurs should have let him walk rather than paying his market value, but you can't argue that he was paid more than his market value.

No, it is not indisputable, even with your trash connotation on "market value" First of all, there is no way to know his "true market value" in a capped salary system like the NBA. Some trash team could have offered him higher had they not been over cap, or any cap. So really we could argue MARKET VALUE for days.

You keep saying MARKET value, when MARKET VALUE means the value that he would get in an OPEN MARKET. I understand what you are trying to do, get people to argue with you about MARKET VALUE and then claim that MARKET VALUE is the price that the spurs paid for him, but that's technically, not the whole truth on MARKET VALUE.

Interesting how you keep talking about trolls on here....

In other news, yes, the Spurs overpaid for Splitter and should have let him walk so his conceived MARKET VALUE would be lower.

it's sad that you try to do this

[tholdren]

I almost expect a copy and pasted definition of market value

[BatManu20]

If you have to overpay a bit to keep Boris then so be it. We can't afford to not re-sign him, he's too important to our team's success. I'd hate to lose Patty but Diaw is more important. Hopefully we find a way to retain both.

[BackHome]

Splitter is not fancy but he gets the job done he has excellent hands is a smart player and is getting better. Would you rather have Splitter or a nut case like Cousins who makes how much? I think this was the break out season for him he will get more minutes next year and will help win games.

I don't know why everyone is getting all worked up about Diaw and Patty both will be signed to Spurs friendly contracts.

[Mel_13]

No, it is not indisputable, even with your trash connotation on "market value" First of all, there is no way to know his "true market value" in a capped salary system like the NBA. Some trash team could have offered him higher had they not been over cap, or any cap. So really we could argue MARKET VALUE for days.

You keep saying MARKET value, when MARKET VALUE means the value that he would get in an OPEN MARKET. I understand what you are trying to do, get people to argue with you about MARKET VALUE and then claim that MARKET VALUE is the price that the spurs paid for him, but that's technically, not the whole truth on MARKET VALUE.

Interesting how you keep talking about trolls on here....

In other news, yes, the Spurs overpaid for Splitter and should have let him walk so his conceived MARKET VALUE would be lower.

it's sad that you try to do this

Wow.

Splitter was a restricted free agent last summer.

He offered his services on the open market.

Portland prepared an offer sheet for 4yrs/36 million dollars.

That was his market value.

Splitter gave the Spurs the chance to offer an equal contract before he signed the offer sheet.

They did and he signed it.

So you can argue that they should have let Portland pay him the 4/36 and moved on without him, but Splitter was getting a contract for 4/36 one way or the other. That was his market value.

[tholdren]

If you have to overpay a bit to keep Boris then so be it. We can't afford to not re-sign him, he's too important to our team's success. I'd hate to lose Patty but Diaw is more important. Hopefully we find a way to retain both.

Yes, but if diaw is asking to put the organization into downgrade because of his money chasing, is he even a Spurs guy?

[TheGreatYacht]

Splitter is not fancy but he gets the job done he has excellent hands is a smart player and is getting better. Would you rather have Splitter or a nut case like Cousins who makes how much? I think this was the break out season for him he will get more minutes next year and will help win games.

I don't know why everyone is getting all worked up about Diaw and Patty both will be signed to Spurs friendly contracts.
Give me a young stud and future all star in Cousins for 13M over a 28yr old Splitter earning 10M to defend shooting bigs and set picks.... If D'Antoni could coach MWP, no doubt Pop can set Cousins straight

[tholdren]

Wow.

Splitter was a restricted free agent last summer.

He offered his services on the open market.

Portland prepared an offer sheet for 4yrs/36 million dollars.

That was his market value.

Splitter gave the Spurs the chance to offer an equal contract before he signed the offer sheet.

They did and he signed it.

So you can argue that they should have let Portland pay him the 4/36 and moved on without him, but Splitter was getting a contract for 4/36 one way or the other. That was his market value.

not really. There were teams who couldnt offer him money, right? because they were over the cap, or would be, right? then there isnt any way to know his real MARKET VALUE because other teams could have bid higher/paid higher, had there been no cap. then that number would be his MARKET VALUE...

and see, you told the audience we couldnt argue market value, proven wrong again.

[DAF86]

Spurstalk is fucking unbielevable.

Kawhi Leonard 5 years/$80M = "sweet man"

Boris Diaw 2 years/$18M = "douchebag fag"

Never...fucking...change :lmao

Really? You're the one calling out folks for critizicing a Spurs player contract extension? :lol

[tholdren]

Splitter is not fancy but he gets the job done he has excellent hands is a smart player and is getting better. Would you rather have Splitter or a nut case like Cousins who makes how much? I think this was the break out season for him he will get more minutes next year and will help win games.

I don't know why everyone is getting all worked up about Diaw and Patty both will be signed to Spurs friendly contracts.

no, if my options were splitter or cousins, I would take Splitter because of his demeanor. The whole point, from my angle, is that we overpaid for splitter and now are seeing some issues arise because of it, albeit indirectly. To me, it is hard to tell Diaw he's not worth splitter money because he's not, but splitter isnt either. The real issue is, Diaw is BETTER than Splitter, so how can you not pay him more? It was foolish to pay Splitter as much as we did, for 8ppg and 5 rpg.

[Mel_13]

not really. There were teams who couldnt offer him money, right? because they were over the cap, or would be, right? then there isnt any way to know his real MARKET VALUE because other teams could have bid higher/paid higher, had there been no cap. then that number would be his MARKET VALUE...

and see, you told the audience we couldnt argue market value, proven wrong again.

What are you talking about? His real market value was determined by a real contract offer received on the open market. For Tiago Splitter in the summer of 2013, the value of that contract was 4 years/36 million dollars.

[ElNono]

I think something in the Channing Frye range would work. He's due $6.8m next season.

[Baam]

The Spurs don't have the means to get Ilyasova now that Bonner and De Colo are off the books. Maybe a big sign-and-trade if Diaw and/or Mills gets overpaid by someone else. They could use cap space if both Patty AND Diaw walk, but I don't know if that is worth losing the MLE in addition to a big.

Unless they move Tiago of course... We have a saying over here that says "to reign is to foresee"... If they want to repeat (reign) they better better think long and hard about the way they wanna play next year...



Splitter is not fancy but he gets the job done he has excellent hands is a smart player and is getting better. Would you rather have Splitter or a nut case like Cousins who makes how much? I think this was the break out season for him he will get more minutes next year and will help win games.

I don't know why everyone is getting all worked up about Diaw and Patty both will be signed to Spurs friendly contracts.

The Splitter is getting better myth is annoying, guy is 30 he's what he is, we're seeing a prime Splitter out there... And everyone would take Cousins no question asked.

[tholdren]

What are you talking about? His real market value was determined by a real contract offer received on the open market. For Tiago Splitter in the summer of 2013, the value of that contract was 4 years/36 million dollars.

Open market means unrestricted access... doesnt a salary cap restrict access?


Again, we are arguing market value, something you said couldnt be done.

[Baam]

I think something in the Channing Frye range would work. He's due $6.8m next season.

Seriously it's like comparing Bosh to Matt Bonner...

[Mel_13]

Open market means unrestricted access... doesnt a salary cap restrict access?


Again, we are arguing market value, something you said couldnt be done.

It's understood by all reasonable posters that all discussions of salary, contracts, and the like are within the confines on the CBA between the NBA and the players.

[ElNono]

Seriously it's like comparing Bosh to Matt Bonner...

Well, that's Frye last year of his contract, which normally means it's overpaid, due to the increases. I do think Diaw is the better player, but we're talking starting salary for Boris, and I think $6-7m range (with yearly increases) is probably something the Spurs could work with in order to keep Patty around too.

The starting salary is the key here. The Spurs only have $8m committed for 15-16, so they can offer more in later years.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

So many of you rooting for the FO to get a bargain. You do what you have to in order to bring this core back for another run. Simple as that.

[Mel_13]

Well, that's Frye last year of his contract, which normally means it's overpaid, due to the increases. I do think Diaw is the better player, but we're talking starting salary for Boris, and I think $6-7m range (with yearly increases) is probably something the Spurs could work with in order to keep Patty around too.

The starting salary is the key here. The Spurs only have $8m committed for 15-16, so they can offer more in later years.

If Boris was willing, they'd probably prefer a decreasing contract rather than an increasing one. They won't, in most scenarios, be using cap space this summer. Better to have less salary committed in a summer where they're more likely to need cap space.

[ElNono]

If Boris was willing, they'd probably prefer a decreasing contract rather than an increasing one. They won't, in most scenarios, be using cap space this summer. Better to have less salary committed in a summer where they're more likely to need cap space.

While I understand that line of thinking, I don't necessarily agree with it, for a number of different reasons.

[Mel_13]

While I understand that line of thinking, I don't necessarily agree with it, for a number of different reasons.

Care to share one or two? I don't see the downside for the team.

[Sean Cagney]

So many of you rooting for the FO to get a bargain. You do what you have to in order to bring this core back for another run. Simple as that.

YES, do not pull a Cuban and blow up a title team as we saw backfired bigtime.

[Mel_13]

YES, do not pull a Cuban and blow up a title team as we saw backfired bigtime.

Team history tells us that the FO's first choice will be to bring everyone back. Strangely enough, large numbers of STers criticized the FO for doing just that in 2007.

[Sean Cagney]

Team history tells us that the FO's first choice will be to bring everyone back. Strangely enough, large numbers of STers criticized the FO for doing just that in 2007.

Your right! The thing is though Boston pulled a big trade for two guys and LA got Gasol gifted to them! If that doesn't happen? Would the Spurs ring? Nobody expected that other stuff to happen so I guess expect the unexpected at times. I think they bring them all back, they have such a chemistry and the role players are young enough IMO not to get worn out. I know Manu will be older and Tim too! If Parker takes off the summer he should be fresh and ready because he is not too old yet.

If they let two go and bring in some other pieces what happens? Boris and Patty are key to this team and know it well IMO, too much of a risk at this point to let them walk and start over.

[Ice009]

Team history tells us that the FO's first choice will be to bring everyone back. Strangely enough, large numbers of STers criticized the FO for doing just that in 2007.

The Spurs weren't as deep back then, and other teams reloaded and made some really, really big moves. I still think it was the wrong decision to not try very hard on upgrading the team back then. Boston, LA and Phoenix all made gigantic moves that really put the Spurs at a disadvantage. Still, with a healthy Manu, who knows what would have happened if the Spurs had beaten LA and made the finals. They didn't have any depth though to cover for the Manu injury, so I think it hurt them by not trying to upgrade the team from the get go.

This Spurs team is much deeper, so I won't say that they need to reload like I thought the 2007 team should have. I think that they should try and bring the same team back, but also still look at trying to get an upgrade or two if at all possible.

[Mel_13]

The Spurs weren't as deep back then and other teams reloaded and made some really, really big moves. I still think it was the wrong decision to not try very hard on upgrading the team back then. Boston, LA and Phoenix all made gigantic moves that really put the Spurs at a disadvantage. Still, with a healthy Manu, who knows what would have happened if the Spurs had beaten LA and made the finals. They didn't have any depth though to cover for the Manu injury, so I think it hurt them by not trying to upgrade the team from the get go.

This Spurs teams is much deeper, so I won't say that they need to reload like I thought the 2007 team should have. The Spurs should still look at trying to get an upgrade or two if at all possible though.

That's true. The 2007 team wasn't nearly as deep as the 2014 team and most STers remember 2007 as the summer that Scola was lost.

[ElNono]

Care to share one or two? I don't see the downside for the team.

Sure. In the immediacy, I think there's a sense of urgency for obvious reasons, and I think winning the title only exacerbates it. Diaw is truly a irreplaceable component on this version of the team. Even if there's a risk he could become complacent with a fat check, I think they'll rather roll the dice and try to give themselves the best odds for next season.

Looking longer term, I think they'll have plenty of cap space regardless, even if they throw a max or near-max deal to Kawhi. I'm also not sold yet they're going full rebuild if Tim and Manu hangs them up next season. There's just too many variants out there, but if they can offer a loyalty contract to Tony, along with keeping Kawhi in a central role, and Green in an affordable deal, I think they'll try that for a couple of seasons.

[Strategic]

How many guys out there can be a backup point guard, a back up two guard, a back up small forward, a back up power forward, and a back up center on offense, then turn around and be a back up two guard, a back up small forward, a back up power forward and a back up center on defense? All in the same game, but not at the same time, smart ass. Oh, and in a pinch he can start at all of these spots also. Boris Diaw is one of the two players (rested Manu) that made us forget that this board and some other entities cried for the Spurs to acquire a backup small forward for half of this past season. Keep him, and if possible help him lose another ten.

[Chinook]

Scola

You were right, man. Every thread becomes a Scola thread eventually.

[Mel_13]

Sure. In the immediacy, I think there's a sense of urgency for obvious reasons, and I think winning the title only exacerbates it. Diaw is truly a irreplaceable component on this version of the team. Even if there's a risk he could become complacent with a fat check, I think they'll rather roll the dice and try to give themselves the best odds for next season.

Looking longer term, I think they'll have plenty of cap space regardless, even if they throw a max or near-max deal to Kawhi. I'm also not sold yet they're going full rebuild if Tim and Manu hangs them up next season. There's just too many variants out there, but if they can offer a loyalty contract to Tony, along with keeping Kawhi in a central role, and Green in an affordable deal, I think they'll try that for a couple of seasons.

I don't have any great issue with assessment, but how does a decreasing contract for Diaw have a negative effect?

[Mel_13]

You were right, man. Every thread becomes a Scola thread eventually.

A SpursTalk trademark since 2007.

[Chinook]

Sure. In the immediacy, I think there's a sense of urgency for obvious reasons, and I think winning the title only exacerbates it. Diaw is truly a irreplaceable component on this version of the team. Even if there's a risk he could become complacent with a fat check, I think they'll rather roll the dice and try to give themselves the best odds for next season.

Looking longer term, I think they'll have plenty of cap space regardless, even if they throw a max or near-max deal to Kawhi. I'm also not sold yet they're going full rebuild if Tim and Manu hangs them up next season. There's just too many variants out there, but if they can offer a loyalty contract to Tony, along with keeping Kawhi in a central role, and Green in an affordable deal, I think they'll try that for a couple of seasons.

But why would having an increasing contract help that? I agree with Mel that having a decreasing contract ($6M--$5M--$4M yes, that's not a possible deal; it's just an example) would be best for both Diaw and the team, since it maximized 2016 cap space (which may end up being the big year if Duncan plays for two more seasons) and it gives Boris his money immediately. The only downside is that the Spurs could not take as much salary back by trading a front-loaded expiring contract than they could if it were back-loaded. But even that con is negated by the smaller salary being easier to trade.

[ElNono]

I don't have any great issue with assessment, but how does a decreasing contract for Diaw have a negative effect?

Oh sorry, I was addressing the last part of your post (the "Better to have less salary committed in a summer where they're more likely to need cap space." part)

I don't think the Spurs will be able to do a decreasing deal if they plan to keep Patty. I don't know how many teams are lining up to offer Diaw over $6m a year, but I suspect there could be a few.

I think Boris is, just like Pau, looking at one of his last generally good paydays of his career. There were even talks of him being Finals MVP worthy. He's in a position of strength right now to fetch good money, and I can't blame him.

I'll be ecstatic if the Spurs can secure his services for next season, even if it comes at a relative cost.

[ElNono]

But why would having an increasing contract help that? I agree with Mel that having a decreasing contract ($6M--$5M--$4M yes, that's not a possible deal; it's just an example) would be best for both Diaw and the team, since it maximized 2016 cap space (which may end up being the big year if Duncan plays for two more seasons) and it gives Boris his money immediately. The only downside is that the Spurs could not take as much salary back by trading a front-loaded expiring contract than they could if it were back-loaded. But even that con is negated by the smaller salary being easier to trade.

yeah, just clarified that. Post right above :D

[Chinook]

Unless they move Tiago of course... We have a saying over here that says "to reign is to foresee"... If they want to repeat (reign) they better better think long and hard about the way they wanna play next year...




The Splitter is getting better myth is annoying, guy is 30 he's what he is, we're seeing a prime Splitter out there... And everyone would take Cousins no question asked.

I agree on both counts, in the sense that the Spurs are going to have to move away from a twin-towers default SL pretty soon and that Tiago has a trade value. I'm not in favor of targeting Marc Gasol in 2015 like some posters are because I don't think a two-center lineup will work well with the future makeup of the team (it's not even working all that well now in certain match-ups). I wouldn't even think about trading Splitter for Ilyasova, though. Cousins? Obviously. Amir Johnson? Yes if enough sweeteners were included. Ilyasova/Thad Young/Millsap? Nope. That's just bad for business.

[Mel_13]

Oh sorry, I was addressing the last part of your post (the "Better to have less salary committed in a summer where they're more likely to need cap space." part)

I don't think the Spurs will be able to do a decreasing deal if they plan to keep Patty. I don't know how many teams are lining up to offer Diaw over $6m a year, but I suspect there could be a few.

I think Boris is, just like Pau, looking at one of his last generally good paydays of his career. There were even talks of him being Finals MVP worthy. He's in a position of strength right now to fetch good money, and I can't blame him.

I'll be ecstatic if the Spurs can secure his services for next season, even if it comes at a relative cost.

Got it.

Yeah, they have to sign Boris if they're serious about trying to repeat. I'll stand by 3/21 as a number that gets it done, but I'd imagine that they're prepared to go further than that.

[Chinook]

I'll be ecstatic if the Spurs can secure his services for next season, even if it comes at a relative cost.

Am I the only one who constantly struggles to spell that work because of the poster here with the very similar name?

[ElNono]

Am I the only one who constantly struggles to spell that work because of the poster here with the very similar name?

It's Firefox spell-checker FTW here...

[Mel_13]

It's Firefox spell-checker FTW here...

I love those squiggly red lines.

[Chinook]

It's Firefox spell-checker FTW here...

Nah, I just avoid typing that word altogether. It's just the more healthy and sensible approach all around.

[Arguendo]

not really. There were teams who couldnt offer him money, right? because they were over the cap, or would be, right? then there isnt any way to know his real MARKET VALUE because other teams could have bid higher/paid higher, had there been no cap. then that number would be his MARKET VALUE...

and see, you told the audience we couldnt argue market value, proven wrong again.


I very rarely feel the need to chime in on a discussion here but wow.

Tholdren, do you have any idea what context means?

In a discussion regarding NBA salaries, free agents, and the like, market value is defined and limited by the existing CBA because the market providing the valuations is made up by the 30 NBA teams who are regulated by the CBA.

This is not fucking micro-Econ 101. There is not a theoretical perfect free market (anywhere), nor is each and every party a rational actor (ever), and there are barriers and transaction costs (always). You are arguing bullshit and showing yourself to be an idiot.

The market value of a player, especially a RFA, is what can be obtained by a given player, during a given period. Variables such as available talent/FAs, current and expected rosters, available cap space and exceptions shape and define the market value at a certain time. And market value is static, linked to a certain point in time and to certain variable such as those discussed in the previous sentence.

Tiago's value was unambiguously and unquestionably set by Portland and matched by the Spurs. There is absolutely no arguing that past market value, it's his current contract.

Please quit making the world a worse place.

[will_spurs]

not really. There were teams who couldnt offer him money, right? because they were over the cap, or would be, right? then there isnt any way to know his real MARKET VALUE because other teams could have bid higher/paid higher, had there been no cap. then that number would be his MARKET VALUE...

So what you're arguing is that Splitter's "real market value" (if there was no CBA) would be even higher than what Portland offered him, or what the Spurs paid for him.

So what you mean is that Splitter is effectively being underpaid by the Spurs. Thanks for making it clear that you agree with all of us 100%.

[benefactor]

I very rarely feel the need to chime in on a discussion here but wow.

Tholdren, do you have any idea what context means?

In a discussion regarding NBA salaries, free agents, and the like, market value is defined and limited by the existing CBA because the market providing the valuations is made up by the 30 NBA teams who are regulated by the CBA.

This is not fucking micro-Econ 101. There is not a theoretical perfect free market (anywhere), nor is each and every party a rational actor (ever), and there are barriers and transaction costs (always). You are arguing bullshit and showing yourself to be an idiot.

The market value of a player, especially a RFA, is what can be obtained by a given player, during a given period. Variables such as available talent/FAs, current and expected rosters, available cap space and exceptions shape and define the market value at a certain time. And market value is static, linked to a certain point in time and to certain variable such as those discussed in the previous sentence.

Tiago's value was unambiguously and unquestionably set by Portland and matched by the Spurs. There is absolutely no arguing that past market value, it's his current contract.

Please quit making the world a worse place.
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/2074645/crossedup.gif

[jag]

So what you're arguing is that Splitter's "real market value" (if there was no CBA) would be even higher than what Portland offered him, or what the Spurs paid for him.

So what you mean is that Splitter is effectively being underpaid by the Spurs. Thanks for making it clear that you agree with all of us 100%.

He doesnt know what he's arguing. He continues to think Splitter is overpaid, but he has no idea what that really means.

[Mel_13]

Poor tholdren. Simultaneously taking up yacht's defense in two separate threads armed only with his wit and the fragmented memories of his high school econ course had a rather predictable end.

[tholdren]

He doesnt know what he's arguing. He continues to think Splitter is overpaid, but he has no idea what that really means.

You both aren't very smart.

First, Mel, you claim that we cannot argue MARKET VALUE, you're wrong, as we still continue to argue it. Seems fairly simple. Next, Mel, you complain about trolling, but you do the same. If you don't know it, then it's a sad revelation for you, and possibly Jag, as you've posted on this site THOUSANDS of times. Agian, seems strange for all the time you claim not to have.

And finally, mel, you seem to have almost gotten the gist of everything copied by jag. I AM ARGUING THAT his value COULD be higher, I'm really trying to reinforce that the term MARKET VALUE is arbitrary in capped salary situations because in an OPEN MARKET, theoretically, there would be no accessibility issues such as cap. I also am stating that this value is extreme, based on the two players I mentioned earlier that are better than Tiago, making 2-3 million less.

The only error in communication I see here is your continuance to dismiss that you have been proven wrong in multiple posts, deflect conversations, and are not really as smart (logically, as you do seem to know something about business and CBA) as you think.

My suggestions: work on your logic, it's lacking; stop posting so much on ST, you look like a loser; stop being a dick, you're calling out people for the same things you do, but they have slightly better arguments.

No need to respond, we're finished here.

[Mel_13]

we're finished here.

You certainly are.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

... I AM ARGUING THAT his value COULD be higher, I'm really trying to reinforce that the term MARKET VALUE is arbitrary in capped salary situations because in an OPEN MARKET, theoretically, there would be no accessibility issues such as cap. I also am stating that this value is extreme, based on the two players I mentioned earlier that are better than Tiago, making 2-3 million less.


Are you slow or what? This is an NBA forum discussing NBA players and there IS a cap under the CBA. No one cares how much Tiago would get at McDonalds. How many people do you need to spell it for you?

[will_spurs]

I'm wrong. I have no clue what I'm talking about. I'm applying the same strategy as a former US President, namely "if I repeat a lie enough times, it will become truth" (except it won't).

FIFY.

[dg7md]

We have to keep Boris. I don't care what we spend. We have to keep him. No way we win the title without Diaw...

[jag]

You certainly are.

:lol

[TampaDude]

Jesus H. Christ, people...can't we just enjoy the championship for a while before starting with all the nanny-ass bullshit? :lol

[benefactor]

Jesus H. Christ, people...can't we just enjoy the championship for a while before starting with all the nanny-ass bullshit? :lol
ST regressed to it's mean the morning after, tbh.

[anakha]

ST regressed to it's mean the morning after, tbh.

Not true.

It lasted a couple of days at least. :lol

[vander]

If Diaw values money over success on the court, why did he get fat and pathetic in Charlotte? he could have made a LOT more money...

[TheGreatYacht]

Boris making TD take a paycut. Tbh

[Drom John]

And how has Mills earned a contract bigger than Danny Green's? I've seen numbers thrown around that are much higher than what Danny Green got. Why should he get more than Green got?

In 2011-12 Danny Green had 4.5 WS + 0.3 playoff WS; .142 WS/48 & .065 playoff WS/48. That's the context for the Green contract.

In 2013-14 Patty Mills had 5.6 WS + 1.1 playoff WS; .175 WS/48 & .141 playoff WS/48. That's the context for Mill's contract in an offseason that Amin Elhassen says is weak in PG.

[EVAY]

Boris making TD take a paycut. Tbh

except that he didn't, did he?

[Chinook]

In 2011-12 Danny Green had 4.5 WS + 0.3 playoff WS; .142 WS/48 & .065 playoff WS/48. That's the context for the Green contract.

In 2013-14 Patty Mills had 5.6 WS + 1.1 playoff WS; .175 WS/48 & .141 playoff WS/48. That's the context for Mill's contract in an offseason that Amin Elhassen says is weak in PG.

It's a little disingenuous to compare Green in 66 games to Mills in 81 games. In reality as the rate stats suggests, they pretty much had the same WS impact. But Green as a 3-and-D player can't be defined by win-shares, so he wins the tie, in my opinion. His regular season was much more impressive. However, his WCF really drug down his rating for the playoffs (in addition to a disappointing Utah series). I wouldn't mind if Mills gets a bigger contract Green got two years ago, but I don't think those stats really show why he should.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

3 years 15-18 is what Boris will get. He's 32, so unlikely to get more than 5 or 6 mil a year, and Spurs probably can't keep Patty if they give Boris 8-10mil/yr.

The other possibility is 2 years 13-15mil structured: 5mil first year, 10 the year after.

I still think he'll take 15-18/3 and be happy as Larry to make that kind of money from ages 32-35.

PS And Patty will get 18-22/4. He's entering his prime, thrives on the big stage, may have another level of improvement in him (in terms of running the team, passing and finishing around the rim), and I think the Spurs see him as a big part of the post-Manu/TD succession plan. If you can get that for 5mil/yr you take it and run!

[Proxy]

We have to keep Boris. I don't care what we spend. We have to keep him. No way we win the title without Diaw...

yep, he was as important as anyone against OKC and MIA

[MaNu4Tres]

3 years 15-18 is what Boris will get. He's 32, so unlikely to get more than 5 or 6 mil a year, and Spurs probably can't keep Patty if they give Boris 8-10mil/yr.

The other possibility is 2 years 13-15mil structured: 5mil first year, 10 the year after.

I still think he'll take 15-18/3 and be happy as Larry to make that kind of money from ages 32-35.

PS And Patty will get 18-22/4. He's entering his prime, thrives on the big stage, may have another level of improvement in him (in terms of running the team, passing and finishing around the rim), and I think the Spurs see him as a big part of the post-Manu/TD succession plan. If you can get that for 5mil/yr you take it and run!


My best guess is Diaw 2 year 15-16 mil; Patty 3 year 14-15 mil.

[~O~]

13 to 16 is about right. Annually, that's close to max territory

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

My best guess is Diaw 2 year 15-16 mil; Patty 3 year 14-15 mil.

Why wouldn't the team offer Patty a four-year deal? They are trying to build a succession plan, and if he is part of it, you lock him up for as long as you can, especially since he is just entering his prime.

[Skull-1]

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/basketball/knicks/lawrence-bulls-joakim-noah-calling-carmelo-answering-article-1.1838772

It's in the slamdunks part of the article.

Eighteen bucks? Screw that surrender-prone, French fatass! Max $14.50 !!! Si se puede!

[MannyIsGod]

Why wouldn't the team offer Patty a four-year deal? They are trying to build a succession plan, and if he is part of it, you lock him up for as long as you can, especially since he is just entering his prime.

Who's the last guard not named Tony or Manu the Spurs gave a 4 year deal to?

[Mel_13]

That would certainly seem to be true when you talk about teams that could remotely be considered contenders. The MLE is 4yrs/21M. I say the Spurs make their first offer at 3yrs/21M and get Boris wrapped up before he even talks to another team.

If you've watched the Spurs operate for the last decade, it's really not that hard to predict what they're going to do.

[TD 21]

If you've watched the Spurs operate for the last decade, it's really not that hard to predict what they're going to do.

Yeah. There was an internal cap at work here that the vast majority was unaware of and that was, Ginobili's contract. Even though Diaw's contract won't be distributed as such, they were never going to pay him a cent more than $7.5M on average.

[Spursfanfromafar]

If you've watched the Spurs operate for the last decade, it's really not that hard to predict what they're going to do.

I have never followed the salary cap and pricing strategy with any diligence.

Could you please explain how you made the correct guess of 3 yrs/21 M and how this relates to the MLE?

[Mel_13]

I have never followed the salary cap and pricing strategy with any diligence.

Could you please explain how you made the correct guess of 3 yrs/21 M and how this relates to the MLE?

The Spurs like to get things done quickly and without any fuss. They wanted Boris, that much was obvious. My guess was that Boris would have trouble attracting offers in excess of the MLE (which was 4/21 last year and is 4/22.8 this year). I estimated that an offer for the full value of the MLE, paid over three years rather than four years, would be enough to keep Boris off the market. It might be a slight overpay, but it recognizes Boris' value to the team and avoids the possibility that some other team that fails to land a big fish offered crazy money to him.

[Ron Swanson]

Good call. :tu

[Spursfanfromafar]

The Spurs like to get things done quickly and without any fuss. They wanted Boris, that much was obvious. My guess was that Boris would have trouble attracting offers in excess of the MLE (which was 4/21 last year and is 4/22.8 this year). I estimated that an offer for the full value of the MLE, paid over three years rather than four years, would be enough to keep Boris off the market. It might be a slight overpay, but it recognizes Boris' value to the team and avoids the possibility that some other team that fails to land a big fish offered crazy money to him.

Thanks. Makes sense. Especially the last line.