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Kori Ellis
08-25-2005, 12:11 AM
Buck Harvey: Time to heal? Parker's shot
Web Posted: 08/25/2005 12:00 AM CDT

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/basketball/nba/spurs/stories/MYSA082505.1C.COL.BKNharvey.spurs.17a42330.html


San Antonio Express-News

Tony Parker's knee has healed. His jumper has not.

The Spurs are working on that. Just as they are in Chicago today trying to convince Michael Finley to shoot for them, they are also in Paris trying to convince Parker to make a few for them.

The Spurs are optimistic, mostly because they hired a shooting coach who has helped others. But even this coach will be pressed to change Parker this offseason, and this goes back to the sore knee, and this fits into Gregg Popovich not wanting Parker to play for the French national team this summer.

During the European championships — with pride and country on the line — will Parker want to risk a new shooting stroke?

Chip Engelland will make do. He was a Duke captain in the early '80s before bouncing around the minor leagues. But it's as a shooting guru where he has made his name.

Parker won't be Engelland's only project. The way the Spurs shoot free throws, Engelland should stay busy.

Earlier this month, for example, Engelland worked with Ian Mahinmi, the Spurs' 2005 draft pick. Everyone understands he will need a few years, but Mahinmi showed off one number when he was in San Antonio that means more than any shooting percentage.

The teen measured at a full 6-foot-11, an inch more than before. :smokin

Still, if there's one player who the Spurs had in mind when they hired Engelland, it's Parker. Not even Finley would improve the Spurs next season as much as an accurate Parker would.

So it's no coincidence that Engelland is in Paris now, and Parker has reason to listen. Engelland worked for the Nuggets last season, and Phil Jackson wanted him this season.

But Parker should be most impressed with Engelland's credentials because of one player he helped. Steve Kerr. About a dozen years ago the two went to dinner — they attended the same Los Angeles-area high school — when Kerr was in a shooting slump with the Bulls.

Engelland told Kerr to open his legs wider for better balance. Kerr listened, found success and later hired Engelland as his personal coach.

Grant Hill later did the same, and Engelland took Hill back to the basics. Hill stood 5 feet from the basket, his legs balanced, shooting with the ball in one hand, over and over again. Hill had to earn the right to shoot from farther out.

"It was a little humbling for him, I'm sure," Engelland said then. "You have to start out like a 10-year-old. In some ways, it's easier to teach a 10-year-old this stuff because they have not developed any habits yet. Someone who's older has a lot more to erase."

For Parker, the erasing will be an emotional chore. The Spurs questioned Parker's form from the day they drafted him, and he's tried to change. But when the tension grew — when he needed to score — he would go back to what he knew.

Sometimes, on the way to two championships, the old form came through. In overtime against Denver, in the close-out game against the Suns. Weren't those moments enough?

Parker knows the answer, and he's mentioned Tiger Woods as his model. Parker isn't a golfer, but he understands what it meant for Tiger to twice rebuild his swing.

But Parker never had Tiger's basics, nor has his stroke ever been compared to Kerr's or Hill's. Parker, instead, has a contorted shot that doesn't begin to fit into Engelland's equation.

When Parker cocks his head and spins the ball, is there anything balanced about it?

Engelland will proceed slowly, with bites of advice that Parker can swallow, and he will begin by finding a better ball position. Given time — and some trust — the combination could mesh.

But Engelland works with a distinct disadvantage now. Instead of being able to practice what he's learning, Parker will have to play with it.

Popovich knows all about this. He tried to talk Parker out of the European championships because of tendonitis in one of Parker's knees, but Parker was obstinate.

Was Parker being insensitive to the Spurs? Both Tim Duncan and Manu Ginobili played for their respective countries in Athens last summer.

Popovich and Parker compromised. Parker agreed to skip practices this month to rest the leg, and the plan worked. Parker has no pain today.

Still, that doesn't mean the European championships won't hurt him. Parker should be in a gym, going over Engelland's tutorial, using this time to rebuild his stroke. He will instead be on the floor.

So what happens then? Won't Parker naturally go back to what he knows, just as he has done as a Spur, because there simply hasn't been enough time?

The Spurs will see soon enough.

biggerspursfanthanu
08-25-2005, 12:24 AM
Tony will be fine, He can flat out play. I am really not too concerned about his form, as much as i am about his ability to not turn over the rock in a crowd (goes for a couple of other guys too). I guess that just comes with our style of play though.

xcoriate
08-25-2005, 01:06 AM
wtf is Buck Harvey to tell Parker what he should be doing in his off-season.

xcoriate
08-25-2005, 01:07 AM
Thats sweet that Ian is 6'11 as well, I remember the draft bio I read had him at around 6'9. He'll probably end up being a full 7'0

picnroll
08-25-2005, 07:23 AM
wtf is Buck Harvey to tell Parker what he should be doing in his off-season.

.... or Pop either. :rolleyes

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 07:56 AM
Still, that doesn't mean the European championships won't hurt him. Parker should be in a gym, going over Engelland's tutorial, using this time to rebuild his stroke. He will instead be on the floor.

:wtf. I love how Buck Harvey has written about a million Manu loving articles this summer praising Manu and all that he means to Argentina and Argentinian Basketball, yet he disses Parker for trying to do the same thing that Manu and Tim Duncan did last summer.

JUUOT
08-25-2005, 08:03 AM
:wtf. I love how Buck Harvey has written about a million Manu loving articles this summer praising Manu and all that he means to Argentina and Argentinian Basketball, yet he disses Parker for trying to do the same thing that Manu and Tim Duncan did last summer.

I am with you on this one... I understand in principle that spurs interest are what counts for pop. but national teams is all what has survived the sportbusiness (kind of lol) just let the kid play with his friends and be proud to represent its country. he will be as proud as before to be a spurs once he will be done.

buck should get out of pop's ass and stop thinking about business and listen to the PASSION

kolko
08-25-2005, 08:10 AM
:wtf. I love how Buck Harvey has written about a million Manu loving articles this summer praising Manu and all that he means to Argentina and Argentinian Basketball, yet he disses Parker for trying to do the same thing that Manu and Tim Duncan did last summer.

That was Johnny Ludden.

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 08:12 AM
That was Johnny Ludden.


Sorry Typo...still the point I was trying to make was the same. I think Ludden has also written a lot of those Manu articles this summer too.

Aggie Hoopsfan
08-25-2005, 08:17 AM
Popovich knows all about this. He tried to talk Parker out of the European championships because of tendonitis in one of Parker's knees, but Parker was obstinate.

And some here said the Spurs were cool with Parker playing over there. Oops.


I love how Buck Harvey has written about a million Manu loving articles this summer praising Manu and all that he means to Argentina and Argentinian Basketball, yet he disses Parker for trying to do the same thing that Manu and Tim Duncan did last summer.

Get it straight, Ludden was in Argentina doing the fluff pieces on Manu.

Buck Harvey pretty much writes as the voice of Gregg Popovich. If Harvey is calling out Parker, you can bet that (compromise aside) Pop is not happy at all with Tony playing.


but national teams is all what has survived the sportbusiness (kind of lol) just let the kid play with his friends and be proud to represent its country

buck should get out of pop's ass and stop thinking about business and listen to the PASSION


The problem with that is 1) it is a business and 2) both Manu and Duncan got hit with injuries this past season.

AND the last time Tony played summer ball, he also ended up hurt the following season. So I'd say it's about more than business - it's about health.

Aggie Hoopsfan
08-25-2005, 08:19 AM
the point I was trying to make was the same. I think Ludden has also written a lot of those Manu articles this summer too.

No, you have no point. Johnny Ludden wrote all the Manu lovefest articles this summer.

You called out Ludden for praising Manu and criticizing Tony (that would be your point), when in reality it was Ludden praising Manu and Harvey (a different reporter altogether) criticizing Tony.

Try again.

picnroll
08-25-2005, 08:26 AM
Where would it be better to have Engelland working with Parker, in SA where he could work with all the other Spurs or in Paris?

Sure wish I could get job where I had a three month vacation where I could do what I want and get paid $8 million doing it.

Dingle Barry
08-25-2005, 08:27 AM
It is because it is France, a non-country

Marcus Bryant
08-25-2005, 08:28 AM
Ludden had to justify the trip down there as well as keep the Spurs happy.

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 08:29 AM
No, you have no point. Johnny Ludden wrote all the Manu lovefest articles this summer.

You called out Ludden for praising Manu and criticizing Tony (that would be your point), when in reality it was Ludden praising Manu and Harvey (a different reporter altogether) criticizing Tony.

Try again.


I love how you feel the need to be a big time asshole. Get the fuck over yourself AHF.

You're right, I did confuse Buck Harvey and Johnny Ludden's articles, but next time you want to correct someone, try doing it without coming across as an SOB.

Aggie Hoopsfan
08-25-2005, 08:38 AM
No, you go fuck yourself. Your whole point was that Ludden was a hypocrite, which clearly wasn't the case.

If you can be an ass to the wrong reporter, I can point out your error however the hell I feel like :)

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 08:49 AM
No, you go fuck yourself. Your whole point was that Ludden was a hypocrite, which clearly wasn't the case.

If you can be an ass to the wrong reporter, I can point out your error however the hell I feel like :)


Sorry, I didn't realize that you and Buck had a personal relationship going on and that my mistakingly saying something negative about him would cause you to go into a hissy fit. :rolleyes

xcoriate
08-25-2005, 09:34 AM
.... or Pop either. :rolleyes


I'm struggling to find the relevance of what you said.


Parker should be in a gym

THAT RIGHT THERE, IS BUCK TELLING PARKER WHAT HE SHOULD BE DOING.

It's not Pop, its not a quote.

Next time lets hear something that makes sense.

picnroll
08-25-2005, 09:50 AM
and this fits into Gregg Popovich not wanting Parker to play for the French national team this summer.

It's been reported two ro three times that Pop didn't want Parker to play this summer. That Parker and Pop reached a compromise. A compromise means Pop didn't get what he wanted.

smeagol
08-25-2005, 10:02 AM
No, you go fuck yourself. Your whole point was that Ludden was a hypocrite, which clearly wasn't the case.
I thought her point was that Harvey is a hypocrite. I'm confused . . . :depressed

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 10:07 AM
I thought her point was that Harvey is a hypocrite. I'm confused . . . :depressed


See? Even he's a jackass and got the 2 confused. I thought that Harvey was the same guy who's been writing all those Manu articles this summer praising him for supporting Argentina etc. However, it was actually Ludden. My underlying point was that Parker is doing the same thing that Manu and Duncan did last summer---representing his home country in international basketball.

AHF was just being obnoxious by pointing out my mistaking the 2 writers, however, you're right, he also confused the 2 in that post. :rolleyes

Aggie Hoopsfan
08-25-2005, 10:41 AM
Oh brother, now I'm in Grammar 101.

I wasn't confused. You were implying the original writer who was writing the Manu lovefest stuff (Ludden) was a hypocrite for criticizing Parker.

That was my point, that you calling out the writer who praised Manu for trashing Parker was wrong.


My underlying point was that Parker is doing the same thing that Manu and Duncan did last summer-

Your original point was trashing a hypocritical writer, which proved to be two different people.

I'm not trying to be an asshole. I agree with Buck - I'd like to see Tony over here working on his game, instead of running around for Team France. Duncan and Ginobili both limped to the finish line this year because of playing summer ball last year, and I don't want to see Tony go down in December with an injury because he was running around in Europe this summer.

Plus, as a Parker fan, the moment he gets that jumper going consistently, the kid's an All-Star, and the Spurs are damn near unbeatable. If wanting him to focus on that instead of Team France makes me selfish, well fuck it - I'm selfish.

I'm obviously not the only one, because Pop had to "compromise" with him (read, Pop had to settle for a middle ground instead of getting what he wants).

Just know if Tony goes down this year and it has a significantly negative impact on this squad, he's going to have a heap of criticism leveled, deservedly so.

SequSpur
08-25-2005, 12:06 PM
Arguing about 2 dipshit reporters who couldn't write an article for the thrifty nickle is fucking gay.

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 12:18 PM
Arguing about 2 dipshit reporters who couldn't write an article for the thrifty nickle is fucking gay.


You're right Sequ.

MaNuMaNiAc
08-25-2005, 01:13 PM
LOL, its nice to be on the spectator end of a heated discussion! :)

Mixability
08-25-2005, 01:16 PM
LOL, its nice to be on the spectator end of a heated discussion! :)

:tu :lol

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 01:17 PM
LOL, its nice to be on the spectator end of a heated discussion! :)


:lol Can we consider this a heated discussion?


Not my fault, AHF is the only A-hole I fight with on the forum and mean it :angel

1Parker1
08-25-2005, 01:19 PM
Anyways, back to topic, I think it's great that Parker is working with the Coach even as we speak. By his estimates, if he's ready to go with a consistent shot in 3 years...Tony will just be hitting his prime at 26!

JUUOT
08-25-2005, 01:22 PM
hitting prime when cornerstone like horry and bowen will be gone. sounds like a good idea.
it will also be when Ian is joining creating the new french conection the new force of the league, proudly supported by manu and TD !!!!

ObiwanGinobili
08-25-2005, 01:41 PM
I like this article. it gives me hope.
alot more hope for TP then I had beofre we hired englellland <sp?>

yes, it ewould be alot better for the Spurs if Tony didin;t play for france this summer...but I really can't hold that against him.
It's his home. It;s an honor, and I'm sure he feels its his duty.

wildbill2u
08-25-2005, 02:33 PM
wtf is Buck Harvey to tell Parker what he should be doing in his off-season.

absolutely right--Pop should be all over his case. The annals of sport are littered with players who screwed themselves up with injuries doing something outside of their regular job.

Young folks always think they and their body is invincible.

I wonder if there isn't something in the contract that could prevent this and keep him on a SPURS regimen, not a personal ego trip.

JUUOT
08-25-2005, 02:55 PM
absolutely right--Pop should be all over his case. The annals of sport are littered with players who screwed themselves up with injuries doing something outside of their regular job.

Young folks always think they and their body is invincible.

I wonder if there isn't something in the contract that could prevent this and keep him on a SPURS regimen, not a personal ego trip.

disgusting vision
tony, good men, want to represent like other did and dont want to let his fans (in france) and his friends (they played together since they are teenagers) down
In times when everybody complain about younger that do not have any values...and only cares about money...
i guess people will never be happy... :pctoss

xcoriate
08-25-2005, 06:24 PM
Theres not something in the contract because they can't. It is the players off-season, ie. their holiday. They get to choose what they do. The way you guys propose things no one would do anything but be the bitch their respective team wants them to be.

It's TPs choice and he made it. Pop doesn't get a say, it was good they reached a compromise that at least means Parker listened to his selfish request. They know players are going to play for their national teams, and that is especially true of international players. Its not like this is a suprise. Maybe if they trade TD for Vince Carter we won't have to worry about national teams, or Manu for a scrub shooting guard with no pride and no other aspiratins except for money.

TPMG2007
08-26-2005, 12:28 AM
As a TP fan, I'm happy that he is playing for the National team just as I was happy that TD and Manu played in the Olympics. I wonder if Pop was upset that Manu and Tim played during the Olympics? I guess he couldn't of, since he was one of the coaches for the US team. I don't see what the problem is now, maybe because it isn't the Olympics. TP is working on his shot. I don't see how he isn't doing anything. The only reason Pop should be concerned is because last time Tony played for France, he was tired and started the season slow. But that's why there's 82 games, so I don't get some people's comments about him playing in France.

TheTruth
08-26-2005, 01:08 AM
Earlier this month, for example, Engelland worked with Ian Mahinmi, the Spurs' 2005 draft pick. Everyone understands he will need a few years, but Mahinmi showed off one number when he was in San Antonio that means more than any shooting percentage.

The teen measured at a full 6-foot-11, an inch more than before.

SWEET, hopefully he'll be a legit 7 foot before he is done.