What's the reason for the Duncan-centric offense?

[Malik Hairston]

Tim is still very good at scoring by playing off the ball, positioning himself well, getting in position and sealing for the entry pass, quick catch and hooks, etc..

Why have the Spurs suddenly reverted to the Duncan-centric, 1999-2008 offense that we hadn't seen the past 3 years, tbh?..

Duncan's post numbers have been atrocious the past 3 years, he doesn't have the body to be a great post player anymore, nor does he have the speed to excel as a face-up creator..

I doubt it's going to last, since it's not something they focused on the past 3 years, but why do you guys think Pop has decided to experiment with it, so far in this early season?..

[Mugen]

Offense has been terrible to start the season so far. It won't last, but Pop just probably in mad scientist mode tbh.

[exstatic]

Duncan is getting his touches...plus Splitter's. Posting up doesn't mean scoring.

[spurraider21]

To keep him from playing too laxed. Don't want a lame duck season

[Robz4000]

Messina trying to add his own wrinkle to The System; he's a big proponent of inside-out ball. When/if Splitter returns it'll get better.

[hyhy]

Lack of off-ball movement tbh.
Its supposed to go in, and out. Teams were supposed to double team duncan, and timmy to pass to the open man and open everything up.
The problem now is, duncan is not commanding double teams, which is why he has to go at it to the one on one, and hope that the double team will come.

[timtonymanu]

I think it also has to do with the Cavs atrocious interior defense. Might as well ride the hot hand.

[Horse]

I think it was just this game he had many matchup advantages, was just missing shots he can make.

[Malik Hairston]

Duncan is getting his touches...plus Splitter's. Posting up doesn't mean scoring.

No, it doesn't, but he's getting way more touches in the post and on the wing as a creator, this year..

I'm doing the numbers right now, but so far, the % of his touches in this scenario are way up compared to 2013 and 2014..it's strange that Pop is choosing to go with an option that has been extremely inefficient the past 2-3 years..

[BatManu20]

Parker's struggles, imo.

[SanDiegoSpursFan]

Maybe letting Parker take it easy for the beginning of the season?

[jag]

Poor perimeter shooting?

[Malik Hairston]

Lack of off-ball movement tbh.
Its supposed to go in, and out. Teams were supposed to double team duncan, and timmy to pass to the open man and open everything up.
The problem now is, duncan is not commanding double teams, which is why he has to go at it to the one on one, and hope that the double team will come.

But that doesn't explain why they're throwing him the ball more often in that setting, though, compared to the past few years..

Is it due to Parker's struggles as a creator, so far this year?..or just experimenting early on?..

I'm not looking for the reason why it's inefficient, I'm asking why they're running so much Duncan-centric offense compared to prior years?(it's early, sample size is small, but % is much higher than the past few years)..

[DesignatedT]

Lol smh

[apalisoc_9]

Duncan posting up is just garbage..he had a great game today, but he was garbage in against GSW, LAX, SaCramento and many other games.

I don't know really..maybe Duxnan just want touches, it's not worthwhile experimenting with him anyway.

Parker again with the lack of willingness to shoot.

[Uriel]

When the home team is making a big run and the crowd is going crazy, going down low to the post is usually a good way to calm things down.

[Malik Hairston]

I think it also has to do with the Cavs atrocious interior defense. Might as well ride the hot hand.

They've been running a lot of Duncan offense all season, tbh, not just tonight..it seemed like tonight was even more than usual, though..

[apalisoc_9]

Anyone saying it's a matchup, it's not really..Bogut had Duncan against GSW and they throw him the ball inside way too often he was almost killing the team...

[Malik Hairston]

Duncan posting up is just garbage..he had a great game today, but he was garbage in against GSW, LAX, SaCramento and many other games.

I don't know really..maybe Duxnan just want touches, it's not worthwhile experimenting with him anyway.

Parker again with the lack of willingness to shoot.

Timmy had a solid game tonight, but it wasn't due to his touches as a creator, at all..he was inefficient in that regard, once again..

His best offense tonight was when the Spurs utilized him like they did the past few seasons, which is throwing it to him off the catch for a quick decision or a finish..

[apalisoc_9]

Timmy had a solid game tonight, but it wasn't due to his touches as a creator, at all..he was inefficient in that regard, once again..

His best offense tonight was when the Spurs utilized him like they did the past few seasons, which is throwing it to him off the catch for a quick decision or a finish..

I should have clarified my post. I'm a huge fan of timmy getting the ball inside, but not in a post up situation...He's awful as a Creator. I don't think there's a logical reason to why they're doing it, really seems like Duxan just wants to see for himself if he really is done as a creator or not, which he is.

timmy needs those passes inside the paint of a dribble from a teammate.., kawhi driving, tony being aggressive creates those touches..But Tony is being a huge pussy right now, and I don't know why..

[hyhy]

retirement year?

[Brunodf]

The guards are playing like s#it and the shooters can't make 3s

[RD2191]

Final season, tbh.

[mkurts]

Unless Parker can stop sucking, this will not change. At least Manu is doing some facilitating.

Without Duncan and Diaw tonight we get blown out by Cavs.

[TheGreatYacht]

"Don't run the offense through Parker"

"Why are they running the offense through Duncan?"

OP, would you rather see Manu shoot all the shots like Kobe?

[apalisoc_9]

Part of the reason why Parker is suxking is beXause we've been running way too many Duncan post ups lately..that leaves him standing in the corner and not getting in rhythm.

[Ice009]

Duncan can do whatever he wants. Doesn't matter what anyone here thinks.

[Malik Hairston]

"Don't run the offense through Parker"

"Why are they running the offense through Duncan?"

OP, would you rather see Manu shoot all the shots like Kobe?

I'd rather they move the ball and alternate as facilitators/scores like the Spurs are known to do..

Occasionally throwing the ball into Duncan is fine, so is giving it to Parker to ISO, but they don't have to do it on 100 consecutive plays and kill the offense..

[mkurts]

"Don't run the offense through Parker"

"Why are they running the offense through Duncan?"

OP, would you rather see Manu shoot all the shots like Kobe?

I don't think he watched the whole game. The offense went through Duncan and Diaw only after Parker could not dribble his way inside and jumpers failing, and 3pt shots not falling. Most points tonight were in the paint, as the shooters struggled.

[The Reckoning]

need splitter back. he played much more of a role than people realize.

[Malik Hairston]

I don't think he watched the whole game. The offense went through Duncan and Diaw only after Parker could not dribble his way inside and jumpers failing, and 3pt shots not falling. Most points tonight were in the paint, as the shooters struggled.

:lol People have been complaining about Duncan-offense for a few games now, it wasn't just tonight..

Duncan is my favorite player of all-time, but he has been an extremely inefficient ISO and post player the past 3 years..

[BillMc]

Duncan jealous of Kobe.

[apalisoc_9]

They say I worship Kawhi, but these Duncan homers...:lmao

Reminds me of Kobe fans who fail to see how he is ruining his team..playing Blind.:lmao

even I criticize kawhi.

[midnightpulp]

Didn't have a chance to watch the game, but my guess is that maybe Pop didn't want to get into a shootout/running game with the Cavs and went through Duncan to slow the pace and grind the game on the back of our defense, which has been pretty solid this year.

Once the offense returns to form and we get healthy, hopefully it'll be back to space and pace.

[TheGreatYacht]

I'd rather they move the ball and alternate as facilitators/scores like the Spurs are known to do..

Occasionally throwing the ball into Duncan is fine, so is giving it to Parker to ISO, but they don't have to do it on 100 consecutive plays and kill the offense..
Na I'm joking, but I'm sure that will change when our 4 role players come back. Our shooters are struggling and Parker is playing like a bitch right now. Hopefully Pop doesn't run Duncan down by December tbh

[sprrs]

Honestly, as long as we're winning games, I'm fine with Pop being in mad scientist mode. Let the Spurs experiment until April. I'd prefer opposing teams not getting exposure to our offense until the playoffs.

[spurraider21]

Parker just doesn't look like he has that same gear he used to

[Dre_7]

Duncan can do whatever he wants. Doesn't matter what anyone here thinks.

[pgardn]

The D on Duncan has been atrocious. Teams have not even tried to help on him and have had bad defenders on him, especially tonite.

Im totally fine with him inside as his jumper has been very inconsistent. Also playing alongside mostly Boris v. Tiago gives us better spacing. Boris is very comfy with the ball out high, Tiago is not.

[Kool Bob Love]

nevermind,. Op loves talking to himself. Strange.

[xellos88330]

Defenses are playing tight on the players moving w/o the ball. They understand that the Spurs ball movement and spacing kills and are trying to force more 1 on 1 style play to counter that danger. If the ball starts moving, they are in trouble. It is only natural that teams figure it out. Now it is up to the Spurs to counter.

[superbigtime]

Tim's still fukn badass. I love it.

[siraulo23]

Parker's been pretty average and the spurs shooting has been pretty bad so far

[FuzzyLumpkins]

:lol hand-wringing over weird lineups and playcalling in November.

[spurraider21]

where has Chinook been?

[100%duncan]

Because one just cannot simply replicate one of the best basketball ever displayed ever. It's easy to point out that they are always giving the ball to someone to ISO (Duncan, parker etc.) but that's because flawless ball movement and elite 3 point shooting just don't go by easily. Spurs fans will be so spoiled of last season's run because we witnessed one of the greatest basketball teams ever but there's no guarantee that they can reach that level again.

Besides, the Spurs have never been healthy so far which means fewer options. Splitter could have taken TD's minutes and added 10 pts 7 rebounds, Mills and Beli could have came in and shot 5-6 threes in all and all of this "X-player" centric talk wouldn't exist since the offense will look much better.

[apalisoc_9]

:lol hand-wringing over weird lineups and playcalling in November.

It's a basketball site meant for basketball discussions..no one is "hand-wringing"

[100%duncan]

They say I worship Kawhi, but these Duncan homers...:lmao

Reminds me of Kobe fans who fail to see how he is ruining his team..playing Blind.:lmao

even I criticize kawhi.

Duncan also doesn't shoot more than half of the team's attempts at 36% smartass

[Tuddy]

He was punishing Bosh in the post in the 2013 finals IIRC. He also schooled Tyson Chandler a couple of times when they played the Mavs this year, just doesn't seem to be a consistent threat. If a team goes small he can still dominate down there with the right matchup.

[Nathan89]

They say I worship Kawhi, but these Duncan homers...:lmao

Reminds me of Kobe fans who fail to see how he is ruining his team..playing Blind.:lmao

even I criticize kawhi.

Now Duncan is ruining the Spurs :lmao

[apalisoc_9]

^

:lmao

Completely missed the point.

[objective]

Tony Parker's troubles probably play a role. He can't even break down rookie second round nobodies at this point

[apalisoc_9]

Tony Parker's troubles probably play a role. He can't even break down rookie second round nobodies at this point

Or maybe he doesn't want to..

He was A+ against GSW...

[Nathan89]

^

:lmao

Completely missed the point.

If your point wasn't being made with a terrible comparison I wouldn't have shown how to stupid the comparison was.

[apalisoc_9]

Not a stupid comparison at all IMO.

We have people saying here Duncan can do whatever he wants even if it is detrimental to the team ( 4 down)

That's similar to saying Kobe can take as many shots as he wants..

[100%duncan]

If by people you mean 1 poster, sure. :rolleyes

[poeticism707]

Because one just cannot simply replicate one of the best basketball ever displayed ever. It's easy to point out that they are always giving the ball to someone to ISO (Duncan, parker etc.) but that's because flawless ball movement and elite 3 point shooting just don't go by easily. Spurs fans will be so spoiled of last season's run because we witnessed one of the greatest basketball teams ever but there's no guarantee that they can reach that level again.

Besides, the Spurs have never been healthy so far which means fewer options. Splitter could have taken TD's minutes and added 10 pts 7 rebounds, Mills and Beli could have came in and shot 5-6 threes in all and all of this "X-player" centric talk wouldn't exist since the offense will look much better.

This. Last years Spurs Title Team Was a thing of Legend. Arguably the GOAT of all Champions. Hope, but don't hold your breath about them getting back to that.

And if that weren't enough, the Spurs are injured. Missing two ABSOLUTELY key pieces in Tiago and Patty. Without Patty and Tiago, the Spurs likely won't average 100 points per game.

The real question is, where the hell is Leonard? Why is this "max player" dropping a whopping 12 points per game way to often? Yes, this is his pre- season, but it's getting real old watching TD pull this guy's ass out the fire, game after game.

That's right, 40 year old TD, baling out Leonard.

Kawhi, GET YOUR HEAD IN THE GAME.

CUT THE COASTING ON O.

ATTACK.

[benstanfield]

Tonight they might as well have tossed the ball out of bound and set up the defense rather than post up Duncan down low. He made one turnaround shot off the glass in crunch time, but it was pretty brutal to watch ~10 possessions just get flushed down the toilet on missed bank shots while they were killing TD with the Verajao PnR. Between Duncan postups and TP dribbling directly to the block and either turning the ball over or passing to Danny Green as the shotclock expires, the Spurs are currently spotting opponents like ~15 possessions a game and still winning. Scary part is, if Tony is done we're basically stuck with this. I haven't seen Parker get to the rim for a layup in a halfcourt set all season.

[Spur|n|Austin]

4-down bitches :pop:

[spurraider21]

there are stretches where Duncan in the post does well for us.

-Overtime of game 6 against the Thunder last year
-2nd quarter of game 5 against Miami... HUGE part of our comeback, where Duncan attacked Haslem on several consecutive possessions. Haslem blocked him once, but Duncan scored every other time on him in that quarter, including at least one and-1.

He's obviously not capable of doing that for games at a time like in his prime (god, it must be easy to coach a team when u have a guy that can do that for 38+ minutes :lol), but its still a calming force for the rest of the team. Sucks the road crowd out of the game, slows the pace down, and gives guys a chance to catch their breath. When Parker runs the full loop for 3-4 straight possessions, its draining. Kawhi is always very active on defense and tries to push-push-push in transition. 4-down gives them a breather

[FuzzyLumpkins]

It's a basketball site meant for basketball discussions..no one is "hand-wringing"

Discussion can indicate anxiety about an event. The two notions are not mutually exclusive.

Parker is in Horry mode and getting double teamed on the high pick and roll.
Kawhi needs work on his shot selection and it takes them 15 seconds down in the shot clock to get him the ball on the post when they call the play and he passes it to Duncan with the shot clock at 2.
Manu and Leonard cannot hit 3s to save their lives allowing their man to sag into the post.
They were running Green off the three point line and him off the dribble is an adventure.
Boris is got 14 shots.

They posted Duncan up about a half dozen times. I don't see what the whinging is about.