Poster Wars, midnightpulp vs Kool

[rogues]

These posters clashed many a time. midnight is well versed and is the guy who you'd typically want to avoid in an internet argument. Kool is the most persistent troll ever on ST, and maybe arguably throughout forums on the net.

One on one in a ring, no holds barred, who would win, tbh?..

[scanry]

If Kool is really Cedric, mid takes this easily.

[midnightpulp]

The Kool vs. Me days were some good times.

His record vs. me is quite poor (I'd estimate it at something like 3578 to 0), but he's always been a worthy opponent due to his persistence.

Some classics:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185695&highlight=Kool

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=185025&highlight=Kool

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=183050&highlight=Kool

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=174264&page=2&highlight=Kool (Kool falls for 90210 Copypasta)

And when I found an old profile of his at a black-only dating site:

http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=184089

http://i762.photobucket.com/albums/xx261/OGBobbyJohsonOWNsKoolaidman/koolaid3-1.jpg

http://www.blackplanet.com/koolaid_man/

Love ya, Kool :toast

[Arcadian]

midnight and it's not close.

You see, the difference is, he has coherent thoughts and writes well, and koolaid is just another faggot troll. Never take a troll over a good poster, obviously.

[Robz4000]

Mid vs Kool is like a professional boxer against a special needs child. The only advantage the latter has is retard strength.

[Malik Hairston]

Mid is a HOF poster, but Kool is actually pretty comparable to Kobe IMO..

In his prime, he was one of the most effective trolls of all-time and dominated ST..however, the past few years have been really, really ugly, where his threads barely generate any traffic and his game is just hideous..

A lot of people here weren't around when Kool could draw a ton of traffic in every thread..to them, he's just a clown figure..

[DPG21920]

Coincided with him trying to get too big for his pants and challenge a certain poster who stands tall IMVHO

[midnightpulp]

Coincided with him trying to get too big for his pants and challenge a certain poster who stands tall IMVHO

The Karmic Welch

Classic ST moment.

[Thread]

Deeps is just so small.

[unforeseen]

Mid is more nigga than Kool, tbh

[Koolaid_Man]

These posters clashed many a time. midnight is well versed and is the guy who you'd typically want to avoid in an internet argument. Kool is the most persistent troll ever on ST, and maybe arguably throughout forums on the net.

One on one in a ring, no holds barred, who would win, tbh?..

I don't need to brag or post old shit like Midget..obviously he's suffering from confidence issues just like the OCD he suffers from...that lil bitch knows just like these ho's I be fucking that I got that fireyuh....

true blue bout it....this is how the shit goes down between us....he's a coward and he knows it...and this goes for any of you pussy ass white boys

2TTH8UZQU3Y

[Buddy Mignon]

I like mid, but he has a studdery voice and he's small in stature. Kool wins this one simply by the fact that he was sweethearting Kori while her ol man was on his death bed. That nigga came out tbe hhospital looking for Kool's head... lol.

[Malik Hairston]

Lakers posters in the prime of ST:

- Kool: Kobe
- Lakaluva:Magic; GOAT-level poster that had his career derailed by a shocking announcement(HIV vs. Naruto)
- 21 Blessings: Shaq
- Cobbler: Andrew Bynum

[rogues]

I like mid, but he has a studdery voice and he's small in stature. Kool wins this one simply by the fact that he was sweethearting Kori while her ol man was on his death bed. That nigga came out tbe hhospital looking for Kool's head... lol.
In your prime, BD would fuck you up, albeit in a competitive bout, tbh..too bad your Naruto loving was unearthed and you became this sad fuckboy you now are..

[DPG21920]

Kool does have a gay sex tape as well. He and Kobe do have a lot of similarities. Now, he just starts threads with great inefficiency while the Lakers lose.

[Splits]

Lakers posters in the prime of ST:

- Kool: Kobe
- Lakaluva:Magic; GOAT-level poster that had his career derailed by a shocking announcement(HIV vs. Naruto)
- 21 Blessings: Shaq
- Cobbler: Andrew Bynum

:lol spot on. Dale is Nash, tbh

[rogues]

:lol spot on. Dale is Nash, tbh
:lol First thing you ever post that is actually funny

[Koolaid_Man]

I like mid, but he has a studdery voice and he's small in stature. Kool wins this one simply by the fact that he was sweethearting Kori while her ol man was on his death bed. That nigga came out tbe hhospital looking for Kool's head... lol.

:lol Yep that nigga was mad as fuck...starting threads about it and shit....but i didnt intend to be e-cucking the site owner. :lol

Guess I'm a real motherfucker.

[m>s]

Kool don't make me call taco meat Jackson up in here

[sook]

I used to think mid was a troll when he was shitting on laker fans, but dude has a vast amount of NBA knowledge.

[m>s]

Yup he's pretty knowledgable about basketball he should definitely stick to what he knows best, I lose respect for him whenever he starts to go off topic and try to discuss things that are over his head

[xellos88330]

I actually think it would be a draw.

Mid would start out wrecking Kool, then Kool would do nothing but talk and backpedal for a couple weeks, finally feel good enough to fight again, get wrecked, start talking and backpedaling again for the next couple of weeks, rinse and repeat.

[midnightpulp]

Yup he's pretty knowledgable about basketball he should definitely stick to what he knows best, I lose respect for him whenever he starts to go off topic and try to discuss things that are over his head

Like what?

When I tell you ancient Germanics were a bunch of barbaric monkeys on the level of people you consider "subhumans," that's not discussing something that is over my head, it's simply documented fact.

Same thing with your laughable understanding of genetics.

Just trying to help, brother.

[m>s]

Not in the mood to argue but check this out it's interesting

http://takimag.com/article/the_thug_gene/print#axzz3KZbrkAnw

[midnightpulp]

Not in the mood to argue but check this out it's interesting

http://takimag.com/article/the_thug_gene/print#axzz3KZbrkAnw

That article is irrelevant.

Where your misunderstanding lies is in your belief that genetic traits remain static throughout generations and will be passed on losslessly to descendants regardless of environmental conditions.

Genes carrying phenotypical traits express themselves through interaction with the environment (anything from diet to pollution), becoming heritable traits. But phenotypes are plastic and can undergo mutation influenced by the environment. The "warrior gene" phenotype is 20% more common in modern people of African descent because their recent ancestors (from African Americans raised in poverty to Blacks raised under Apartheid) lived in a stressful, often times violent, environment that expressed the "warrior gene" at a greater frequency than other ethnic groups. The Chinese, another group of people who have experienced impoverished and violent conditions, express the gene at an even higher rate than blacks.

And no doubt the half-naked, animal skin wearing, barbaric German "master race" of antiquity expressed the gene at a high rate. But the gene recessed as that group of people cultivated themselves under generations of civilization.

More on the "warrior gene."

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/cross-check/2011/04/26/code-rage-the-warrior-gene-makes-me-mad-whether-i-have-it-or-not/

http://scientiasalon.wordpress.com/2014/07/31/the-extreme-warrior-gene-a-reality-check/

[DMC]

Like what?

When I tell you ancient Germanics were a bunch of barbaric monkeys on the level of people you consider "subhumans," that's not discussing something that is over my head, it's simply documented fact.

Same thing with your laughable understanding of genetics.

Just trying to help, brother.

Based on what I've read here, only a couple people here actually have any real understanding of genetics.

[midnightpulp]

Based on what I've read here, only a couple people here actually have any real understanding of genetics.

I'm no expert myself, and even scientists don't have any real understanding since the field is beyond complex (especially now with epigenetics influencing yet another paradigm shift), but I do wish laymen would at least have an elementary understanding that doesn't let them be misguided by click-bait pop science articles that claim China has found the "intelligence gene" and is on the fast path to engineering 200 IQ super babies that will take over the world in 20 years and other such similar tripe, like claims of there being a gene that determines whether or not you read the paper while taking a shit.

[Koolaid_Man]

I used to think mid was a troll when he was shitting on laker fans, but dude has a vast amount of NBA knowledge.

:lmao Vast NBA knowledge?...you fucking clowns are an endless source of comedy gold....:lmao:lmao Mid knows what he finds on the NBA stats websites...:lmaoshit that's available to anyone....when mid starts talking about the X's and O's of how to play the game when he really understands the difference between the pinch and high post offense...running plays at the elbows or when he can talk to me about defensive schemes designed to stop effective wing players then we can have this conversation about what he knows...he can't talk about those things because he's never played the game on ANY level. All he can do is pull up stat generator's...Dude is weak and unimpressive....there's only one guy here that can actually speak basketball as if he was a coach and it's LakaLuva...I dare mid to go up against Luva from an X's and O's standpoint and if Mid tries to copy shit from the internet like he does it will show....Luva is the real basketball guru... tbh

[midnightpulp]

:lmao Vast NBA knowledge?...you fucking clowns are an endless source of comedy gold....:lmao:lmao Mid knows what he finds on the NBA stats websites...:lmaoshit that's available to anyone....when mid starts talking about the X's and O's of how to play the game when he really understands the difference between the pinch and high post offense...running plays at the elbows or when he can talk to me about defensive schemes designed to stop effective wing players then we can have this conversation about what he knows...he can't talk about those things because he's never played the game on ANY level. All he can do is pull up stat generator's...Dude is weak and unimpressive....there's only one guy here that can actually speak basketball as if he was a coach and it's LakaLuva...I dare mid to go up against Luva from an X's and O's standpoint and if Mid tries to copy shit from the internet like he does it will show....Luva is the real basketball guru... tbh

:lol acting like X's and O's are difficult to understand.

[Koolaid_Man]

:lol acting like X's and O's are difficult to understand.

:lmao admitting that I'm right...Mr. Stat stealer poser

[midnightpulp]

:lmao admitting that I'm right...Mr. Stat stealer poser

?

Parroting the offense and defensive schemes you learned on your high school team doesn't betray any kind of advanced basketball knowledge.

Everyone who's played knows what HORNS, a UCLA cut, the Triangle offense, a Give and Go, a Box + 1, 2-3 Zone, etc are.

The reason advanced stats are discussed so much on here is because their predictive power is much better than your traditional "per game" stats and are revolutionizing how teams build rosters.

The reason your Lakers are dragging their ass at the bottom of the conference is because they still think we're in the 1980's. I don't think they've even been to a Sloan Conference.

[Koolaid_Man]

?

Parroting the offense and defensive schemes you learned on your high school team doesn't betray any kind of advanced basketball knowledge.

Everyone who's played knows what HORNS, a UCLA cut, the Triangle offense, a Give and Go, a Box + 1, 2-3 Zone, etc are.

The reason advanced stats are discussed so much on here is because their predictive power is much better than your traditional "per game" stats and are revolutionizing how teams build rosters.

The reason your Lakers are dragging their ass at the bottom of the conference is because they still think we're in the 1980's. I don't think they've even been to a Sloan Conference.

:lol Face Palm..where is Luva when I need him...listen dipshit...parroting stats you stole off-line portrays even less of any kind of advanced basketball knowledge as opposed to knowledge of the game you learned while actually playing....don't get mad at me because I just exposed your fat couch potato ass....Luva and I know all about your kind....:lmao

[midnightpulp]

:lol Face Palm..where is Luva when I need him...listen dipshit...parroting stats you stole off-line portrays even less of any kind of advanced basketball knowledge as opposed to knowledge of the game you learned while actually playing....don't get mad at me because I just exposed your fat couch potato ass....Luva and I know all about your kind....:lmao

Anyone who proclaims to have "knowledge of the game" wouldn't still be stuck using per game stats in 2014.

Okay, here's an easy X's and O's question that has nothing to do with analytics: Why are the Spurs a historically mediocre offensive rebounding team in the Popovich Era?

[Koolaid_Man]

Anyone who proclaims to have "knowledge of the game" wouldn't still be stuck using per game stats in 2014.

Okay, here's an easy X's and O's question that has nothing to do with analytics: Why are the Spurs a historically mediocre offensive rebounding team in the Popovich Era?

:lmao ok Einstein...and LOL as if I follow Spurs basketball...maybe it's a philosophy that Pop teaches I don't know all I can speak on is the basics of basketball in general...let me educate you for a sec....while it's good to be balanced most teams don't emphasize offensive rebounding simply because it's possible to hurt yourself in transition D. Depending on how your team is constructed....typically if you have the bigs they can crash the offensive glass along with a wing player on the baseline weak side......if the other team has speed and good passing....along with great defensive players then you're fucked if your team philosophy is offensive glass...for example a team like golden state shouldn't be worried about offensive glass since they shoot at a high % if they get a rebound from their center then fine but that shouldn't be their MO....besides I don't think they have the personnel to be great offensive rebounding team anyways....I could on and on their are other reasons just naming a few...

holla at me once your done with your research :lol

[midnightpulp]

:lmao ok Einstein...and LOL as if I follow Spurs basketball...maybe it's a philosophy that Pop teaches I don't know all I can speak on is the basics of basketball in general...let me educate you for a sec....while it's good to be balanced most teams don't emphasize offensive rebounding simply because it's possible to hurt yourself in transition D. Depending on how your team is constructed....typically if you have the bigs they can crash the offensive glass along with a wing player on the baseline weak side......if the other team has speed and good passing....along with great defensive players then you're fucked if your team philosophy is offensive glass...for example a team like golden state shouldn't be worried about offensive glass since they shoot at a high % if they get a rebound from their center then fine but that shouldn't be their MO....besides I don't think they have the personnel to be great offensive rebounding team anyways....I could on and on their are other reasons just naming a few...

holla at me once your done with your research :lol

Correct.

And this is what I mean when I say X's and O's are largely commonsense now and don't really require any advanced understanding of anything to comprehend. Spurs run pretty simple offensive schemes, but it's so effective because it's precisely executed (most of the time).

X's and O's in basketball have pretty much been "solved." We know spacing is a good thing. We know long 2's are not a high quality shot. We know the zone defense can be countered with good outside shooting, sharp side-to-side passing, and/or drive-and-kick penetration. I could go on.

Now we're onto analytics, which are helping us determine player value more accurately. For instance they reveal that Kobe has been a net negative on the defensive end for the last 10 years, which goes against the common perception of him being this lockdown defensive player. Armed with this knowledge, coaches can now shift a player like Kobe to guarding their weakest perimeter player, which Jackson, Brown, D'Antoni, and now Scott did/have been doing.

Don't fret, though. According to the most cutting edge data, Kobe is still a top 20 player of all-time :toast

[Koolaid_Man]

Correct.

And this is what I mean when I say X's and O's are largely commonsense now and don't really require any advanced understanding of anything to comprehend. Spurs run pretty simple offensive schemes, but it's so effective because it's precisely executed (most of the time).

X's and O's in basketball have pretty much been "solved." We know spacing is a good thing. We know long 2's are not a high quality shot. We know the zone defense can be countered with good outside shooting, sharp side-to-side passing, and/or drive-and-kick penetration. I could go on.

Now we're onto analytics, which are helping us determine player value more accurately. For instance they reveal that Kobe has been a net negative on the defensive end for the last 10 years, which goes against the common perception of him being this lockdown defensive player. Armed with this knowledge, coaches can now shift a player like Kobe to guarding their weakest perimeter player, which Jackson, Brown, D'Antoni, and now Scott did/have been doing.

Don't fret, though. According to the most cutting edge data, Kobe is still a top 20 player of all-time :toast

Lol. No they're not common sense. You had no idea about what i just told you and X's and O's can really get complicated. Stats viewing is what's easy. It requires no real analysis of the game and it explains why you live by them without understanding the real dynamics of the game. For example.....why do I say Kobe is better than Duncan athletically and stat wise....and why is Kobes scoring more impressive than MJs even though MJ did it in less seasons? Simple, because Tim and MJ never had to share the ball. They never had to play with a ball dominate Big like Shaq and still be at the top.

That is why stats cant truly be measured....no matter who we're discussing. Stats cant see those intangibles and so they get diluted. Tim as first option has inferior stats to Kobe as 2nd option. MJ ran the Bulls uncontested whereas Kobe was forced to share his cookies.....and yes Kobe proved he could win titles without Shaq so let me kill that discredited argument before you lames bring it up.

[midnightpulp]

Lol. No they're not common sense. You had no idea about what i just told you and X's and O's can really get complicated. Stats viewing is what's easy. It requires no real analysis of the game and it explains why you live by them without understanding the real dynamics of the game. For example.....why do I say Kobe is better than Duncan athletically and stat wise....and why is Kobes scoring more impressive than MJs even though MJ did it in less seasons? Simple, because Tim and MJ never had to share the ball. They never had to play with a ball dominate Big like Shaq and still be at the top.

That is why stats cant truly be measured....no matter who we're discussing. Stats cant see those intangibles and so they get diluted. Tim as first option has inferior stats to Kobe as 2nd option. MJ ran the Bulls uncontested whereas Kobe was forced to share his cookies.....and yes Kobe proved he could win titles without Shaq so let me kill that discredited argument before you lames bring it up.

Your approach to the game is antiquated, Kool, sorry to say.


Simple, because Tim and MJ never had to share the ball. They never had to play with a ball dominate Big like Shaq and still be at the top.

:lol What kind of argument is this? You do realize that Shaq and Kobe were the only legitimate offensive options on those title teams, the rest of roster being filled out with blue collar role players (Fish, Fox, Horry)? Kobe got plenty of touches alongside Shaq, nearly identical to what he got when he was playing with Gasol and Odom.


Tim as first option has inferior stats to Kobe as 2nd option.

Why do you keep regurgitating this nonsense? Is PPG all you look at?


Stats cant see those intangibles and so they get diluted.

For a guy who champions "intangibles," you sure focus on PPG a lot, which is like the least "intangible" related stat there is. The primary reason I have Duncan over Kobe is because of the intangible. A great big man will always affect the game in more ways than a great wing.

[scanry]

^ Mid, you're wasting your time with Cedric. While Duncan's anchoring the defense and giving the reigns to Kawhi (he's still putting up 14/10 and shooting 50% btw), Kobe's ego is too busy chucking the Lakers to lottery.

As bad as DK was as a wizard, they still won 38-40 games. These Lakers would be lucky to win 20 games tbh. BTW let's see how long this Kobe Johnson will last before he starts chucking. I give him 2-3 games tops.

[Buddy Mignon]

^ Mid, you're wasting your time with Cedric. While Duncan's anchoring the defense and giving the reigns to Kawhi (he's still putting up 14/10 and shooting 50% btw), Kobe's ego is too busy chucking the Lakers to lottery.

As bad as DK was as a wizard, they still won 38-40 games. These Lakers would be lucky to win 20 games tbh. BTW let's see how long this Kobe Johnson will last before he starts chucking. I give him 2-3 games tops.


Jim does not shoot 50%, you jackass. He's currently at 48% and will drop further as the season goes on. Duncan is not anchoring shit... the Spurs do a great job at forcing teams to shoot long jump shots. They have a great system in place and a coach that forces players to buy in, or hit the bricks. Their defense has nothing to do with Jim at all, which is why when any of their leading three players miss a game they don't miss a beat.

Also, Jim shoots at a lesser clip than Kareem, Wilt, Shaq, Hakeem, Ewing, and even D. Rob. The nigga has been basically been carried for the last 10 years of his career.

[Thread]

As bad as DK was as a wizard, they still won 38-40 games.

That's the rumor. Hard to find video evidence.

[Koolaid_Man]

Your approach to the game is antiquated, Kool, sorry to say.



:lol What kind of argument is this? You do realize that Shaq and Kobe were the only legitimate offensive options on those title teams, the rest of roster being filled out with blue collar role players (Fish, Fox, Horry)? Kobe got plenty of touches alongside Shaq, nearly identical to what he got when he was playing with Gasol and Odom.



Why do you keep regurgitating this nonsense? Is PPG all you look at?



For a guy who champions "intangibles," you sure focus on PPG a lot, which is like the least "intangible" related stat there is. The primary reason I have Duncan over Kobe is because of the intangible. A great big man will always affect the game in more ways than a great wing.

Actually my approach is what makes these NBA stars millionaires....not yours....putting up points and being a a great player who's considered unstoppable is an intangible....look at what's happening to Kevin Love...he's exposed now that he's not hiding out in Minny...:lol Fisher, Fox, and Horry took their fair share of shots...in fact didn't Horry say recently that he looked Kobe off in favor of Shaq? :lol Kobe got the same amount of touches as he did while playing with Odom and Gasol because as his 6,000 assists would show he indeed shares the ball :lol..PPG is always the holy grail in every single sport....it's ALL about PPG....in Hockey it's about scoring the puck....in football it's about touchdowns...in baseball it's about RBI's....in Basketball it's about scoring baskets....:lol A great big man is indeed more valuable than wing players the problem you have is the 2 most notable exceptions to the rule in MJ and Kobe....

and they say you're better than me....please :hat I just bent you over backwards....

and Scanry.... Cedrique out :toast

[Buddy Mignon]

I used to think mid was a troll when he was shitting on laker fans, but dude has a vast amount of NBA knowledge.

Mid is a nerd that sits behind a keyboard quoting advanced stats to make himself feel better because he never had the balls to actually play the game. He may possess the knowledge, but its far from applied... and there's a huge a difference.

[midnightpulp]

Actually my approach is what makes these NBA stars millionaires....not yours....putting up points and being a a great player who's considered unstoppable is an intangible....look at what's happening to Kevin Love...he's exposed now that he's not hiding out in Minny...:lol Fisher, Fox, and Horry took their fair share of shots...in fact didn't Horry say recently that he looked Kobe off in favor of Shaq? :lol Kobe got the same amount of touches as he did while playing with Odom and Gasol because as his 6,000 assists would show he indeed shares the ball :lol..PPG is always the holy grail in every single sport....it's ALL about PPG....in Hockey it's about scoring the puck....in football it's about touchdowns...in baseball it's about RBI's....in Basketball it's about scoring baskets....:lol A great big man is indeed more valuable than wing players the problem you have is the 2 most notable exceptions to the rule in MJ and Kobe....

and they say you're better than me....please :hat I just bent you over backwards....

and Scanry.... Cedrique out :toast

Allen Iverson has a higher PPG than Kobe.

Following your logic, A.I.>Kobe.

You know the PPG as a Holy Grail argument is flawed, Kool. Quit fronting.


A great big man is indeed more valuable than wing players the problem you have is the 2 most notable exceptions to the rule in MJ and Kobe....

The stats don't support Kobe in this case.

RAPM is now widely regarded as the best stat that measures player value. FWIW, this is only for the regular season, but you can see that the most successful players (ring wise) of the post Jordan era dominate the top of the list.

http://oi61.tinypic.com/34td255.jpg

Except old Kirby, of course. He's down there with Baron Davis :lol

Time to start considering better stats, Kool. Just like anything else, times change and practical knowledge evolves.

[Koolaid_Man]

Mid is a nerd that sits behind a keyboard quoting advanced stats to make himself feel better because he never had the balls to actually play the game. He may possess the knowledge, but its far from applied... and there's a huge a difference.

ohh it's applied when his gay ass is getting fucked :lol shoot a jumper in my ass nigga :lol body me in the paint

[Koolaid_Man]

Allen Iverson has a higher PPG than Kobe.

Following your logic, A.I.>Kobe.

You know the PPG as a Holy Grail argument is flawed, Kool. Quit fronting.



The stats don't support Kobe in this case.

RAPM is now widely regarded as the best stat that measures player value. FWIW, this is only for the regular season, but you can see that the most successful players (ring wise) of the post Jordan era dominate the top of the list.

http://oi61.tinypic.com/34td255.jpg

Except old Kirby, of course. He's down there with Baron Davis :lol

Time to start considering better stats, Kool. Just like anything else, times change and practical knowledge evolves.


where is AI all-time...unless he's at the top of the list it's all for naught.... try again...next time without all the rambling bullshit :lol

[midnightpulp]

where is AI all-time...unless he's at the top of the list it's all for naught.... try again...next time without all the rambling bullshit :lol

Nice deflection.

How do you like Kobe being the same value as Baron Davis?

[Leetonidas]

Kool trying to talk shit about other poster's b-ball knowledge when he literally knows nothing about basketball and consistently has the shittiest takes on ST 99% of the time :lmao

[Thread]

Nice deflection.

How do you like Kobe being the same value as Baron Davis?

:rolleyes

[midnightpulp]

Mid is a nerd that sits behind a keyboard quoting advanced stats to make himself feel better because he never had the balls to actually play the game. He may possess the knowledge, but its far from applied... and there's a huge a difference.

Then why is there such a high correlation between advanced stats and player/team success?


But it's far from applied

Pretty much every front office and coaching staff in the league is "applying" analytics to their program.

Except the Lakers, of course, who are stuck in the Dark Ages :lol

[Leetonidas]

Mid is a nerd that sits behind a keyboard quoting advanced stats to make himself feel better because he never had the balls to actually play the game. He may possess the knowledge, but its far from applied... and there's a huge a difference.

The only thing you know how to apply is jizz to your anime comics faggot :lol

[Thread]

Then why is there such a high correlation between advanced stats and player/team success?



Pretty much every front office and coaching staff in the league is "applying" analytics to their program.

Just another aside to make a dollar & a dime. Sooner or later you have to get down to the business of gettin' down. (You) do that. Nobody else does.

[midnightpulp]

Just another aside to make a dollar & a dime. Sooner or later you have to get down to the business of gettin' down. (You) do that. Nobody else does.

Analytics ain't a sham, Cub.

Robert Horry? A guy you side and rep. Analytics confirms his value is higher than bucketheads like Dwight Howard. The per game stats camp would never acknowledge his value because Horry's box score doesn't look "pretty."

Tiago Splitter? A player you "called." Analytics backs him, too.

How about a clown like Jamal Crawford? You probably would cite him as a loser, right?

Well, analytics would confirm that since Crawford is a net negative when he's in the game.

These new stats are just backing up instinct. Their quantifying the "intangible."

[Thread]

Analytics ain't a sham, Cub.

Robert Horry? A guy you side and rep. Analytics confirms his value is higher than bucketheads like Dwight Howard. The per game stats camp would never acknowledge his value because Horry's box score doesn't look "pretty."

Tiago Splitter? A player you "called." Analytics backs him, too.

How about a clown like Jamal Crawford? You probably would cite him as a loser, right?

Well, analytics would confirm that since Crawford is a net negative when he's in the game.

These new stats are just backing up instinct. Their quantifying the "intangible."

Pie-in-the-sky because the college guys want in, but, don't want to wait on line like everybody else has been doing for a century. Cheap fucks.

[scanry]

Jim does not shoot 50%, you jackass. He's currently at 48% and will drop further as the season goes on. Duncan is not anchoring shit... the Spurs do a great job at forcing teams to shoot long jump shots. They have a great system in place and a coach that forces players to buy in, or hit the bricks. Their defense has nothing to do with Jim at all, which is why when any of their leading three players miss a game they don't miss a beat.

Also, Jim shoots at a lesser clip than Kareem, Wilt, Shaq, Hakeem, Ewing, and even D. Rob. The nigga has been basically been carried for the last 10 years of his career.

You're a retard if that's what tickles your anime loving ass. I suggest you atleast watch a few Spurs games before you troll Duncan not anchoring the paint. The Spurs have the #1 defense (atleast that's what they said during the Celtics broadcast). The players buying into the system has every thing to do with Tim. The LA media may exaggerate the effort Kobe puts in during practice, but guess what, Tim puts in just as much if not more. Tim has taken care of his body and has played more games than Kobe in the regular season and the playoffs.

BTW Tim has outlasted the careers of Hakeem, Shaq, Ewing & D Rob. Tim's & KAJ's numbers are neck and neck in their 18th season.

You can beat your drum for all we could care, but the fact that Tim has surpassed Kobe doesn't sit pretty in your little anime fantasy. Boy who would have though the general public & the media would soundly pick Tim over Kobe after all your cute little trolling the past few years. :lol

[scanry]

That's the rumor. Hard to find video evidence.

It's not a rumor Dale. DK was horrible to watch during his Wizard days. He did shoot better than Kobe though. Story of his life ain't it?

[Thread]

It's not a rumor Dale. DK was horrible to watch during his Wizard days. He did shoot better than Kobe though. Story of his life ain't it?

No, Scan, you're being petty & small. You're bitter because ringing wasn't enough for "you." Thought it would be because Kobe was flat on his back and you figured he'd never return to his 25-5-5 self. Now that he has ringing isn't enough.

Ya poor thing, you.

[midnightpulp]

Jim does not shoot 50%, you jackass. He's currently at 48% and will drop further as the season goes on. Duncan is not anchoring shit... the Spurs do a great job at forcing teams to shoot long jump shots. They have a great system in place and a coach that forces players to buy in, or hit the bricks. Their defense has nothing to do with Jim at all, which is why when any of their leading three players miss a game they don't miss a beat.

Also, Jim shoots at a lesser clip than Kareem, Wilt, Shaq, Hakeem, Ewing, and even D. Rob. The nigga has been basically been carried for the last 10 years of his career.

Duncan is like 2 makes away from 50%. Irrelevant.


which is why when any of their leading three players miss a game they don't miss a beat.

Do you even research your opinions before spouting off? The Spurs winning percentage is 20 points lower when Duncan isn't in the lineup.

And why is it do you think they can force opponents into long 2s? Because they have an all-time great paint anchor patrolling the paint. And if Duncan isn't the anchor, why has the defense been anywhere from 5 to 10 points worse when he isn't on the floor?

Oh, and you don't want me mentioning all the wings that shoot better than Kobe. That list is longer than your Naruto watch list.

[Buddy Mignon]

Then why is there such a high correlation between advanced stats and player/team success?



Pretty much every front office and coaching staff in the league is "applying" analytics to their program.

Except the Lakers, of course, who are stuck in the Dark Ages :lol


Mid, you've been trying to make your case that using advanced stats to judge the success of a player should be the gold standard for years. Due to the fact that I've played the game I will always disagree with you because you know nothing about heart, determination, will, and desire, which can't be measured through stats. You're no more than the color commentator sitting next to the retired HOF legend trying to sound smart, but looks and sounds ridiculous. I remember when Simmons got his first chance on ESPN to debate Magic, and Magic basically face-palmed that geek for sounding so idiotic. You're that guy, Mid... and I'm that HOF'er that you're sitting next to trying to sound smart. Just in this thread alone you've made an ass out of yourself already.

"You do realize that Shaq and Kobe were the only legitimate offensive options on those title teams, the rest of roster being filled out with blue collar role players"

"The primary reason I have Duncan over Kobe is because of the intangible."

^^^ Those are your quotes above there.:lol The fact that you admit that Kobe won 3 straight titles with only one legitimate offensive option that couldn't shoot free throws or make a shot outside of the paint speaks volumes!!! And your second quote? You're not writing a novel here so there's no need for fluff. Kobe went through 8 different coaches. A rape case. A lazy jealous heart co-star that jumped ship when he couldn't get his way. A future HOF coach that told him to dial back his play to allow his jealous heart co-star to be the center of attention. That same HOF coach left when it got tough and wrote a tell-all book about Kobe, then begged Kobe to come back so Kobe could carry his long legged ass to two more titles. A blood thirsty media that wants his head for getting away with rape, and not being Lebron. A career ending Achilles injury, followed by a season ending knee injury, and the guy comes back to lead the league in scoring and just set a mark of the ONLY player to record 30k points and 6k assists. And you're talking intangibles? Give me a fucking break, Mid.

You see Mid... we're not cut from the same material, which is why "you don't get it." I notice that all of you use Jordan to trump Kobe when measuring his greatness. I think that's a complement, but its intended as an insult. Those that are cut from my material know for a fact that Kobe is a greater player than Duncan and has had a better career as well. But instead of talking about advanced stats and shit... I'm going to take your ace of spade and use it against you. This is me channeling my inner Kobe and saying, "GET THE FUCK OUT OF THE WAY!!!"


a57OYN-gTVo

[scanry]

No, Scan, you're being petty & small. You're bitter because ringing wasn't enough for "you." Thought it would be because Kobe was flat on his back and you figured he'd never return to his 25-5-5 self. Now that he has ringing isn't enough.

Ya poor thing, you.

Wasn't that your m.o. all these years? I'm not at all bitter. In fact i'm just relieved that the player of the generation can no longer be questioned from here on out. I've visited quite a few NBA forums and i was surprised to see that Tim was held in higher regard (than Kobe) even before he rang last June. 5 is now the icing tbh.

Dale, you have it the other way around. It's you who we pity tbh. The sad little 25-5-5 validates that.

[Thread]

I've visited quite a few NBA forums and i was surprised to see that Tim was held in higher regard (than Kobe)

I'll just bet you were.

[Buddy Mignon]

Wasn't that your m.o. all these years? I'm not at all bitter. In fact i'm just relieved that the player of the generation can no longer be questioned from here on out. I've visited quite a few NBA forums and i was surprised to see that Tim was held in higher regard (than Kobe) even before he rang last June. 5 is now the icing tbh.

Dale, you have it the other way around. It's you who we pity tbh. The sad little 25-5-5 validates that.


No, Jim is liked more than Kobe. Kobe's milestones are greater. A 3-peat and a back to back to get to 5 is much harder than getting there every other year or some shit y'all used to say. Se my video above if you need clarity.

[scanry]

You see Mid... we're not cut from the same material, which is why "you don't get it." I notice that all of you use Jordan to trump Kobe when measuring his greatness. I think that's a complement, but its intended as an insult. Those that are cut from my material know for a fact that Kobe is a greater player than Duncan and has had a better career as well. But instead of talking about advanced stats and shit... I'm going to take your ace of spade and use it against you. This is me channeling my inner Kobe and saying, "GET THE FUCK OUT OF THE WAY!!!"



Who you fooling tbh? Duncan has him beat in every which way. Now that the media has started looking more into analytics & advanced stats, Kobe is getting shredded. This is a different era my friend. Players can no longer be trigger happy. You either play within the system or you're out.

[scanry]

No, Jim is liked more than Kobe. Kobe's milestones are greater. A 3-peat and a back to back to get to 5 is much harder than getting there every other year or some shit y'all used to say. Se my video above if you need clarity.

Why bring Shaq into this?

[Buddy Mignon]

Who you fooling tbh? Duncan has him beat in every which way. Now that the media has started looking more into analytics & advanced stats, Kobe is getting shredded. This is a different era my friend. Players can no longer be trigger happy. You either play within the system or you're out.

The media invented this shit. I can contend that its the rape. You think its a different era... that's until the next Kobe comes along. Outlier, God-given talent... call it what you want... he's on the way, and no amount of team sports or advanced stats will stop him.

[Thread]

The media invented this shit.

Yes,,,like Global Warming and Climate Change, just another excuse to separate man from his $. Cocksuckers.

[midnightpulp]

Mid, you've been trying to make your case that using advanced stats to judge the success of a player should be the gold standard for years. Due to the fact that I've played the game I will always disagree with you because you know nothing about heart, determination, will, and desire, which can't be measured through stats. You're no more than the color commentator sitting next to the retired HOF legend trying to sound smart, but looks and sounds ridiculous. I remember when Simmons got his first chance on ESPN to debate Magic, and Magic basically face-palmed that geek for sounding so idiotic. You're that guy, Mid... and I'm that HOF'er that you're sitting next to trying to sound smart. Just in this thread alone you've made an ass out of yourself already.

"You do realize that Shaq and Kobe were the only legitimate offensive options on those title teams, the rest of roster being filled out with blue collar role players"

"The primary reason I have Duncan over Kobe is because of the intangible."

^^^ Those are your quotes above there.:lol The fact that you admit that Kobe won 3 straight titles with only one legitimate offensive option that couldn't shoot free throws or make a shot outside of the paint speaks volumes!!! And your second quote? You're not writing a novel here so there's no need for fluff. Kobe went through 8 different coaches. A rape case. A lazy jealous heart co-star that jumped ship when he couldn't get his way. A future HOF coach that told him to dial back his play to allow his jealous heart co-star to be the center of attention. That same HOF coach left when it got tough and wrote a tell-all book about Kobe, then begged Kobe to come back so Kobe could carry his long legged ass to two more titles. A blood thirsty media that wants his head for getting away with rape, and not being Lebron. A career ending Achilles injury, followed by a season ending knee injury, and the guy comes back to lead the league in scoring and just set a mark of the ONLY player to record 30k points and 6k assists. And you're talking intangibles? Give me a fucking break, Mid.

You see Mid... we're not cut from the same material, which is why "you don't get it." I notice that all of you use Jordan to trump Kobe when measuring his greatness. I think that's a complement, but its intended as an insult. Those that are cut from my material know for a fact that Kobe is a greater player than Duncan and has had a better career as well. But instead of talking about advanced stats and shit... I'm going to take your ace of spade and use it against you. This is me channeling my inner Kobe and saying, "GET THE FUCK OUT OF THE WAY!!!"


a57OYN-gTVo

:lol I don't compare Kirby to Jordan. He's more properly compared to Wade, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and even Baron Davis, as my stats illustrate :lol


The fact that you admit that Kobe won 3 straight titles with only one legitimate offensive option that couldn't shoot free throws or make a shot outside of the paint speaks volumes!!!

And that other "option" was one of the greatest players of all-time, perhaps with the greatest peak in NBA history. When Kobe finally emerged as the lead after Shaq bolted, he was surrounded with 3 legitimate options in Gasol, Odom, and Bynum (when he wasn't hurt).

Also, quit spinning it like Kobe was primarily responsible for the 3 peat. Did you forget he got outplayed by Austin Croshere in the 2000 Finals? :lol

And the fact Kobe went through so many coaches says more about Kobe than anything else.

What this is really about is that you're against advanced stats because they don't verify your perceived status of Kobe's greatness.

[Buddy Mignon]

:lol I don't compare Kirby to Jordan. He's more properly compared to Wade, Ray Allen, Paul Pierce, and even Baron Davis, as my stats illustrate :lol



And that other "option" was one of the greatest players of all-time, perhaps with the greatest peak in NBA history. When Kobe finally emerged as the lead after Shaq bolted, he was surrounded with 3 legitimate options in Gasol, Odom, and Bynum (when he wasn't hurt).

Also, quit spinning it like Kobe was primarily responsible for the 3 peat. Did you forget he got outplayed by Austin Croshere in the 2000 Finals? :lol

And the fact Kobe went through so many coaches says more about Kobe than anything else.

What this is really about is that you're against advanced stats because they don't verify your perceived status of Kobe's greatness.


I accept your admission of defeat.

[scanry]

The media invented this shit. I can contend that its the rape. You think its a different era... that's until the next Kobe comes along. Outlier, God-giving talent... call it what you want... he's on the way, and no amount of team sports or advanced stats will stop him.

I'm not so sure especially with the new superstars focusing more on efficiency than volume. Even Kerr is turning Curry around. Look at Durant & Lebron. The new players are going to model their game after them tbh.

Memo & Kobe may be the dying breed.

[midnightpulp]

The media invented this shit. I can contend that its the rape. You think its a different era... that's until the next Kobe comes along. Outlier, God-given talent... call it what you want... he's on the way, and no amount of team sports or advanced stats will stop him.

(note, I'm considering much more than PER here, which you know I often use)

Kareem: All time great advanced stats

Jordan: All time great advanced stats

Magic: All time great advanced stats

Lebron: All time great advanced stats

Bird: All time great advanced stats

Shaq: All time great advanced stats

Hakeem: All time great advanced stats

Kobe? Always in the 20's or even lower when you examine his advanced stats.

Why is he the odd man out? Because of the media? :lol

[Buddy Mignon]

(note, I'm considering much more than PER here, which you know I often use)

Kareem: All time great advanced stats

Jordan: All time great advanced stats

Magic: All time great advanced stats

Lebron: All time great advanced stats

Bird: All time great advanced stats

Shaq: All time great advanced stats

Hakeem: All time great advanced stats

Kobe? Always in the 20's or even lower when you examine his advanced stats.

Why is he the odd man out? Because of the media? :lol

Let's see... Kobe has more rings than Shaq, Hakeem, Bird, and Lebron. That's it and that's all.

[Thread]

(note, I'm considering much more than PER here, which you know I often use)

Kareem: All time great advanced stats

Jordan: All time great advanced stats

Magic: All time great advanced stats

Lebron: All time great advanced stats

Bird: All time great advanced stats

Shaq: All time great advanced stats

Hakeem: All time great advanced stats

Kobe? Always in the 20's or even lower when you examine his advanced stats.

Why is he the odd man out? Because of the media? :lol


"The Media invented this shit."

[midnightpulp]

I accept your admission of defeat.

You didn't even make any coherent points and resorted to ad hominem (calling me a nerd) and arguments from emotion.

I like advanced stats because they are proven to be more accurate than your beloved per game stats (which are just as arbitrarily conceived). This isn't about some fatwa against your boy.

Also, advanced stats support the perceived greatness of other Lakers Hall of Famers. So what's the problem?

[midnightpulp]

Let's see... Kobe has more rings than Shaq, Hakeem, Bird, and Lebron. That's it and that's all.

The ring argument?

I thought you played team ball in high school? Tell me the last time any single player beat a 12 man team by himself.

[Buddy Mignon]

You didn't even make any coherent points and resorted to ad hominem (calling me a nerd) and arguments from emotion.

I like advanced stats because they are proven to be more accurate than your beloved per game stats (which are just as arbitrarily conceived). This isn't about some fatwa against your boy.

Also, advanced stats support the perceived greatness of other Lakers Hall of Famers. So what's the problem?

Look who's emotional.:lol Me calling you a nerd is no more an insult than you calling me a jock. You gotta know who you are in the world, mid. I noticed you didn't touch that video.

[scanry]

Yes,,,like Global Warming and Climate Change, just another excuse to separate man from his $. Cocksuckers.

Did your old ass watch Interstellar tbh?

But seriously do you even know how much coal Asia, North & South America is burning for their thermal power plants? Try the tropical countries and you'll really see the change in person.Japan & Sri Lanka are going to go under. Maldives, Thailand beaches & Mauritius will no longer exist. Vietnam isn't looking good either.

[midnightpulp]

Look who's emotional.:lol Me calling you a nerd is no more an insult than you calling me a jock. You gotta know who you are in the world, mid. I noticed you didn't touch that video.

You really don't know how to debate. Calling me a nerd doesn't do anything for your position. Make a point, a counterargument. Tell me why advanced stats are simply media created frivolity while per game stats should be taken as some kind of gospel.

Your vid also doesn't address any points, either.

Again, this is about advanced stats not being kind to your boy.

However, you can take solace in the fact they justify the status of other Lakers greats.

[Buddy Mignon]

Did your old ass watch Interstellar tbh?

But seriously do you even know how much coal Asia, North & South America is burning for their thermal power plants? Try the tropical countries and you'll really see the change in person.Japan & Sri Lanka are going to go under. Maldives, Thailand beaches & Mauritius will no longer exist. Vietnam isn't looking good either.

Wow!!! You're using that hack of a movie Interstellar as some sort of measuring stick for the future. :lol

[AlexJones]

Wow!!! You're using that hack of a movie Interstellar as some sort of measuring stick for the future. :lol

:lol

[Thread]

:lol

Damn, and usually Scan would never permit himself to get caught short like this.

Poor Scan.

[scanry]

Wow!!! You're using that hack of a movie Interstellar as some sort of measuring stick for the future. :lol

"But seriously"

I've always wanted to ask you where you went to college?

[scanry]

Damn, and usually Scan would never permit himself to get caught short like this.

Poor Scan.

I would have brought up the day after tomorrow if I wanted a global warming reference. I wanted to see how your old ass would react to a movie like Interstellar, which is about space travel BTW.

[Thread]

I would have brought up the day after tomorrow if I wanted a global warming reference. I wanted to see how your old ass would react to a movie like Interstellar, which is about space travel BTW.

Movies ain't real life, Scan. That's why they're movies.

[Buddy Mignon]

You really don't know how to debate. Calling me a nerd doesn't do anything for your position. Make a point, a counterargument. Tell me why advanced stats are simply media created frivolity while per game stats should be taken as some kind of gospel.

Your vid also doesn't address any points, either.

Again, this is about advanced stats not being kind to your boy.

However, you can take solace in the fact they justify the status of other Lakers greats.


I never even once mentioned per game stats in this thread. We're talking greatness... intangibles. You said Jim was the better player because of intangibles. I gave you a counterargument, and the video proves my point.

Chris Paul, Barkley, Dwight Howard and Tracey McGrady all have higher PER's than Magic, Kobe, Kareem, and Moses Malone. Yet, the latter four were more dominant individually, and won more rings. But, if we were going to use your silly method of building a team we'd have no rings... correct?

[Thread]

I never even once mentioned per game stats in this thread. We're talking greatness... intangibles. You said Jim was the better player because of intangibles. I gave you a counterargument, and the video proves my point.

Chris Paul, Barkley, Dwight Howard and Tracey McGrady all have higher PER's than Magic, Kobe, Kareem, and Moses Malone. Yet, the latter four were more dominant individually, and won more rings. But, if we were going to use your silly method of building a team we'd have no rings... correct?

Migs, the voice of reason & moderation in troubled times.

Christ, I cringe, absolutely shake in my boots at the contemplation of this NBA Forum without the Lakers contingent. Sweet Jesus.

[Buddy Mignon]

"But seriously"

I've always wanted to ask you where you went to college?

Using space travel to locate Tesseracts in the future to communicate with yourself from the past, huh? Anything is not possible, scan.

[Buddy Mignon]

Migs, the voice of reason & moderation in troubled times.

Christ, I cringe, absolutely shake in my boots at the contemplation of this NBA Forum without the Lakers contingent. Sweet Jesus.

Have you seen the movie The Road? You'd be that guy... plodding along with his son, Mid.

[Thread]

Have you seen the movie The Road? You'd be that guy... plodding along with his son, Mid.

Hell, yeah, a million questions. I wouldn't be near as patient as "Poppa" was. I'd hit him a good one, then have him for supper.

[Buddy Mignon]

Hell, yeah, a million questions. I wouldn't be near as patient as "Poppa" was. I'd hit him a good one, then have him for supper.


Now that little motherfucker is on synergy.com scrambling trying to find an argument, instead of realizing there's honor in admitting you're wrong.

[Thread]

Now that little motherfucker is on synergy.com scrambling trying to find an argument, instead of realizing there's honor in admitting you're wrong.

Of course, Spur Fan can never admit being wrong. Ever. No decency.

[midnightpulp]

I never even once mentioned per game stats in this thread. We're talking greatness... intangibles. You said Jim was the better player because of intangibles. I gave you a counterargument, and the video proves my point.

Chris Paul, Barkley, Dwight Howard and Tracey McGrady all have higher PER's than Magic, Kobe, Kareem, and Moses Malone. Yet, the latter four were more dominant individually, and won more rings. But, if we were going to use your silly method of building a team we'd have no rings... correct?

Yeah. I think Duncan is a better teammate, less selfish, more agreeable, all while keeping a similar competitive fire and "killer instinct" as Kobe. What proves that more than saying, "We'll do it this time," and then doing it? I also meant "intangibles" in terms of doing the little things that aren't measured statistically: Setting picks, altering shots in the paint, basketball IQ, and the like. I also think Kobe's most acclaimed intangible (killer instinct) often times manifests itself negatively on the court in the form of shot selection and ball dominance. You ever play with a ball dominant player? Tell me what happens to the offense's rhythm and defense's intensity when a single player is dominating the ball? Here's where you tell me you were the ball dominant player. But anyone who's played basketball has played with a ball dominant player at times.

You love Kobe's style because it's a face-to-face, flamboyant, entertaining style of basketball that reduces a team game into a one-on-one competition. I know that vibes with a supposed "Alpha" personality like yourself (which is funny considering you're a fan of the greatest team player in NBA history, but whatever).


Chris Paul, Barkley, Dwight Howard and Tracey McGrady all have higher PER's than Magic, Kobe, Kareem, and Moses Malone. Yet, the latter four were more dominant individually, and won more rings. But, if we were going to use your silly method of building a team we'd have no rings... correct?

I'm using more than PER in my evaluation. Howard has other advanced stats that aren't too great. Barkley is an advanced stat beast, but stupidly partied during the 1993 Finals, which probably cost him a ring. Chris Paul and TMAC have pretty small sample sizes, so they're not really worth considering.

And yeah, I'd consider the personality (intangibles) of the guys I was building a team with. It's one of the reasons the Spurs been so successful. They get guys who have a compatible chemistry. It's why the Showtime Lakers were so successful. Bird's Celtics, etc.

Kobe's personality seems like it's a detriment to team cohesion more often than not. I'm not surprised things went south when Fisher left.

[midnightpulp]

Of course, Spur Fan can never admit being wrong. Ever. No decency.

What am I wrong about?

[Buddy Mignon]

Yeah. I think Duncan is a better teammate, less selfish, more agreeable, all while keeping a similar competitive fire and "killer instinct" as Kobe. What proves that more than saying, "We'll do it this time," and then doing it? I also meant "intangibles" in terms of doing the little things that aren't measured statistically: Setting picks, altering shots in the paint, basketball IQ, and the like. I also think Kobe's most acclaimed intangible (killer instinct) often times manifests itself negatively on the court in the form of shot selection and ball dominance. You ever play with a ball dominant player? Tell me what happens to the offense's rhythm and defense's intensity when a single player is dominating the ball? Here's where you tell me you were the ball dominant player. But anyone who's played basketball has played with a ball dominant player at times.

You love Kobe's style because it's a face-to-face, flamboyant, entertaining style of basketball that reduces a team game into a one-on-one competition. I know that vibes with a supposed "Alpha" personality like yourself (which is funny considering you're a fan of the greatest team player in NBA history, but whatever).



I'm using more than PER in my evaluation. Howard has other advanced stats that aren't too great. Barkley is an advanced stat beast, but stupidly partied during the 1993 Finals, which probably cost him a ring. Chris Paul and TMAC have pretty small sample sizes, so they're not really worth considering.

And yeah, I'd consider the personality (intangibles) of the guys I was building a team with. It's one of the reasons the Spurs been so successful. They get guys who have a compatible chemistry. It's why the Showtime Lakers were so successful. Bird's Celtics, etc.

Kobe's personality seems like it's a detriment to team cohesion more often than not. I'm not surprised things went south when Fisher left.


I don't accept your compromise at all. And I'll come back later to dissect this post. I've noticed throughout history that the men that have accomplished the greatest feats have had extremely unlikable personalities. Mid, who has accomplished more? Jesus, or the Devil. I'll leave you with this clip to ponder over.


7DMDscGOUpg

[midnightpulp]

I don't accept your compromise at all. And I'll come back later to dissect this post. I've noticed throughout history that the men that have accomplished the greatest feats have had extremely unlikable personalities. Mid, who has accomplished more? Jesus, or the Devil. I'll leave you with this clip to ponder over.


7DMDscGOUpg

Jesus.

Christianity has played a significant role in building Western Civilization.

[Koolaid_Man]

Yeah. I think Duncan is a better teammate, less selfish, more agreeable, all while keeping a similar competitive fire and "killer instinct" as Kobe. Before I say anything to your dumbass let me say this...there are two kinds of men in this world. Givers and Takers....Tim is a giver and Kobe is a taker....Tim is a nice guy and Kobe is an asshole. That I think we can all agree on. Now if Tim was anything like Kobe he would still be married but he's not. If time was a better teammate, less selfish, and more agreeable as a teammate then what does that make him as a husband. It's all a facade...all the adulation appears to be based on fraud science. At least with Kobe what you see is what you get....no need to put on pretenses like yall do in SA. Fact is Tammy does not posses Kobe's killer instinct. You cannot be agreeable and less selfish while being compared to Kobe. What proves that more than saying, "We'll do it this time," and then doing it? I also meant "intangibles" in terms of doing the little things that aren't measured statistically: Setting picks, altering shots in the paint, basketball IQ, and the like. Kobe has a higher basketball IQ than Duncan. The 2 guard position requires it. The 4 and 5 positions doesn't require much by way of IQ because they don't have to make many decisions with the ball. In fact every poll out there (surveyed GM's and Players) on who has the highest BBALL IQ has Kobe topping the list. Here's the latest > IQ POLL (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/ball_dont_lie/post/Kobe-Bryant-has-highest-basketball-IQ-poll-sa?urn=nba,205934) I also think Kobe's most acclaimed intangible (killer instinct) often times manifests itself negatively on the court in the form of shot selection and ball dominance. Again - Tis the difference between real men and pacifists. Kobe is a taker. Let's break it down starting with (1) Shaq. My point is Tim Duncan and MJ never had to deal with a force and personality of a SHAQ. He was a big bad bully who did and got what he wanted. He was also very lazy due to his girth and everyone was in shock and awe of him except Kobe. Kobe saw that he was lazy and challenged him. Kobe's motto was "If you're going to lead me then do so by example." Shaq refused to so Kobe chased the games biggest personality and player right out of LA all because he didn't want to put in the effort. How is that not noble. You fuckers talk about lazy black men and yet when you get one who works his ass off to the nth degree you get your panties in a twist. Go figure. My (2nd) point is that if Kobe wasn't playing with a lazy Shaq he was playing with inferior talent. Odom was always one Marijuana test away from a lifetime NBA ban. While Gasol was a classic underachiever at 0-12 in the play-offs before joining Kobe in LA. Neither Odom or Gasol will make the HOF. Whereas Parker and Ginobilli will both make it. ;-) Never has Tim played outside of a different system and never has be played for multiple coaches. The ONE-TIME let me repeat the ONE-TIME that Tim played for a different coach outside of a different system. He literally QUIT on his fucking country. HE QUIT ON HIS COUNTRY PERIOD!!!! END OF STORY!!! He didn't have the skills to play outside of his comfort zone his San Antonio. No way is the dude an all-time great. For all of Kobe's faults he never quit on his country. Never has Tim played with the likes of Smush Parker, Chucky Atkins, Chris Mihm, Kwame Brown and on and on and on....Tim has always played with All-stars, great defensive players, and three not one or two but THREE 1st Ballot HOF'ers at his side if you include Robinson. Kobe's never had that luxury. NEVER!!! You ever play with a ball dominant player? Tell me what happens to the offense's rhythm and defense's intensity when a single player is dominating the ball? So when a single player is dominating the ball then look at the WHY? Has Tim Duncan ever played with a player that came to him and asked him not to pass him the ball because he was scared. Has He? Fuck No. This is the type of shit Kobe's had to deal with. Kobe went to LA so there's haters Tim went to SA so he had no pressure and no stress....he didn't have Hollywood and the whole world waiting to see him fail on a global scale he was in fucking country ass cow town SA where there's no such thing as pressure....a town where you can literally buy court-side seats for 35 cents. So there is a big difference in overall expectations. It's sink or swim. Tammy's never had the pressure....it's been easy for him. Here's where you tell me you were the ball dominant player. But anyone who's played basketball has played with a ball dominant player at times. Shaq was the most bullyish force the league has seen or ever will see...there is no personality to compare. Tim and MJ didn't have to deal with that shit...everyone that Pop brought have been robot type players. I give Pop credit for running a tight ship and developing his system but Pop cannot deal with strong personalities. Dennis Rodman (case in point) Dennis was a teachable moment for Pop..Pop couldn't handle it and so Dennis went on to get 3 more rings with MJ. Again my giver and taker scenario...real men are not gonna let you strip them of their identity....so if you can't handle playing with a Kobe or Rodman, or MJ then get the fuck on...not everyone is cut from the same cloth....I know one thing if I'm in a foxhole I don't want to see Tim Duncan or anyone who thinks like him.

You love Kobe's style because it's a face-to-face, flamboyant, entertaining style of basketball that reduces a team game into a one-on-one competition. No we love Kobe's style because we're also Alpha's...and it's what we can relate to. We're not bitch-made pacifists. Kobe's is nothing but a by-product of the American way. No? Isn't it all about getting yours, eating first, and then feeding those who want it as bad as you. Isn't that what American Captilism is all about? Ain't that what you sissy boys cry about everyday in the Club forum regarding blacks. ;-) I know that vibes with a supposed "Alpha" personality like yourself (which is funny considering you're a fan of the greatest team player in NBA history, but whatever).


I'm using more than PER in my evaluation. Howard has other advanced stats that aren't too great. Barkley is an advanced stat beast, but stupidly partied during the 1993 Finals, which probably cost him a ring. Chris Paul and TMAC have pretty small sample sizes, so they're not really worth considering.

And yeah, I'd consider the personality (intangibles) of the guys I was building a team with. It's one of the reasons the Spurs been so successful. They get guys who have a compatible chemistry. No...They get givers. Weak guys...guys who can play but are inheerently weak men. It's why the Showtime Lakers were so successful. Bird's Celtics, etc. The Showtime Lakers were successful because Magic came in and took it from Kareem....and made everyone else follow....those teams were successful because they had more takers than givers. The Spurs are lucky by-products of a watered down era. especially there last two titles.

Kobe's personality seems like it's a detriment to team cohesion more often than not. It's all about leadership styles. Not to be offensive but if Kobe and Ducan played together....Duncan would naturally concede to Kobe because it's his personality....he would have no fight and he'd be afraid of Kobe....it's that simple....Dude has no heart to stand up to anyone....the look is all in his eyes and his body language...he's a giver and Kobe would have took it.....I'm not surprised things went south when Fisher left.

Hey Mid see my comments above in blue :hat

[m>s]

Kool don't make me call up taco meat jackson

[Koolaid_Man]

Kool don't make me call up taco meat jackson

LOL. tell him to come from underneaths his mothers dingy sheets..

[m>s]

kool i compared you to shaq in the other thread because you both have sbc's

[midnightpulp]

:lol Hollywood
:lol Comparing team sports to war
:lol Givers and takers
:lol Olympics (and you always forget to mention Tim was still the best player on that team)
:lol Foxholes


Sorry, Kool. But your argument is uncompelling and filled with the kind of speculative nonsense we'd come to expect from Kobe fans.

I am pleased that at least you backed up your basketball IQ contention with some kind of data. But I have to disagree with that particular GM poll (as I'm sure you did when GMs never once selected Kobe as a player they'd build around. See pic: http://oi62.tinypic.com/2d91max.jpg )

I agree more with Dime Mag's list, even though I think Kobe is ranked too high: http://dimemag.com/2013/10/nbas-10-smartest-players/4/

And by the way, Popovich never coached Dennis Rodman. That was Bob Hill. I also think Gasol is a shoe in for the Hall of Fame.

[scanry]

Kool don't make me call up taco meat jackson

:lol But isn't that mono tbh?

[scanry]

Migs, the voice of reason & moderation in troubled times.

Christ, I cringe, absolutely shake in my boots at the contemplation of this NBA Forum without the Lakers contingent. Sweet Jesus.

You would wouldn't ya? Your boy is getting shredded by mid.

[Splits]

Mid absolutely destroying niggas in this thread, per par. Dude is not just a ST HOF, he's the best poster of this era. Narutoluva, Kool, Dale, et al getting punished without mercy with Mid's truth bombs

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lzxiyu8Btb1qj3i85.gif

Nobody can compete with bball takes against Mid*. He's legend.

*his USA USA takes suck, tbh

[Koolaid_Man]

Mid absolutely destroying niggas in this thread, per par. Dude is not just a ST HOF, he's the best poster of this era. Narutoluva, Kool, Dale, et al getting punished without mercy with Mid's truth bombs

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lzxiyu8Btb1qj3i85.gif

Nobody can compete with bball takes against Mid*. He's legend.

*his USA USA takes suck, tbh


:lol uhh ok

[Splits]

:lol uhh ok

Yeah, cuz this illegible garbage is legendary:

http://i.imgur.com/i2TocXY.png

Who can even decipher what you're saying?

:lmao Cedrique
:lmao hasn't had a decent bball take in 5 years
:lmao pwned by Mid on a daily basis
:lmao routinely voted worst poster in NBA forum
:lmao bumps threads which prove he's a loser
:lmao backtracking from timvp when he was trying to score on Kori
:lmao Lakers
:lmao Kobifanboi
:lmao destroyed by everyone on this board
:lmao only person who respects him is Dale
:lmao fried chicken
:lmao obsessed with black cock
:lmao talks about gays 90% of his posts
:lmao never has a take anyone agrees with
:lmao even discredited posters like rogues shit on him
:lmao watermelon
:lmao grilling fried chicken
:lmao Haitian name (Cedrique)
:lmao doesn't speak french even though he comes from a French colony
:lmao barely speaks ebonics
:lmao is there a more disrespected poster on ST?

[Koolaid_Man]

uuh ok :lol

[Thread]

Yeah, cuz this illegible garbage is legendary:

http://i.imgur.com/i2TocXY.png

Who can even decipher what you're saying?

:lmao Cedrique
:lmao hasn't had a decent bball take in 5 years
:lmao pwned by Mid on a daily basis
:lmao routinely voted worst poster in NBA forum
:lmao bumps threads which prove he's a loser
:lmao backtracking from timvp (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=8) when he was trying to score on Kori
:lmao Lakers
:lmao Kobifanboi
:lmao destroyed by everyone on this board
:lmao only person who respects him is Dale
:lmao fried chicken
:lmao obsessed with black cock
:lmao talks about gays 90% of his posts
:lmao never has a take anyone agrees with
:lmao even discredited posters like rogues (http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/member.php?u=35986) shit on him
:lmao watermelon
:lmao grilling fried chicken
:lmao Haitian name (Cedrique)
:lmao doesn't speak french even though he comes from a French colony
:lmao barely speaks ebonics
:lmao is there a more disrespected poster on ST?

He lives in Los Angeles
I've been in his mother's basement
He lives down there
Has his own corner of his mother's basement
Has shag rug
It's purple & gold
Has a two burner hot plate
With a cloth plug...yeah, a cloth one
A double, not a single bed
In the corner of that basement
The clothes chute from upstairs empties into
that corner. Yeah, right there, it's kool
Has a Clapper, and it's one that actually
works. Yeah.

[Splits]

uuh ok :lol

:lmao where's the Kirby shoutout?
:lmao no idea how the salary cap works
:lmao posting ridiculous lineups which make the Lakers "relevant" but could never happen
:lmao pretending to have basketball knowledge
:lmao would be homeless if parents weren't importing drugs
:lmao no job
:lmao never worked in his life
:lmao pretends to fuck hoes, can't even keep his KFC nametag
:lmao trying to talk basketball
:lmao all takes come down to kirby>duncan cuz gayyyy!!!!
:lmao can't name a single poster on ST who respects him
:lmao most ridiculed poster on ST
:lmao owned by Mid on a daily/weekly/annual basis
:lmao never won a debate
:lmao homer of 2nd banana on a legacy-destroying tour

[Splits]

He lives in Los Angeles
I've been in his mother's basement
He lives down there
Has his own corner of his mother's basement
Has shag rug
It's purple & gold
Has a two burner hot plate
With a cloth plug...yeah, a cloth one
A double, not a single bed
In the corner of that basement
The clothes chute from upstairs empties into
that corner. Yeah, right there, it's kool
Has a Clapper, and it's one that actually
works. Yeah.

:lmao only poster who can vouch for Cedrique is a senile old man
:lmao admits he lives in his mother's basement
:lmao has dirty laundry dumped from upstairs onto his makeshift "bed"
:lmao clapper
:lmao corner of a basement
:lmao father in jail
:lmao mistaking a Laker blanket for a purple shawl that Cedrique pissed on when he was wasted
:lmao purple and piss
:lmao even Dale can't defend the worst poster on ST

[Thread]

:lmao where's the Kirby shoutout?
:lmao no idea how the salary cap works
:lmao posting ridiculous lineups which make the Lakers "relevant" but could never happen
:lmao pretending to have basketball knowledge
:lmao would be homeless if parents weren't importing drugs
:lmao no job
:lmao never worked in his life
:lmao pretends to fuck hoes, can't even keep his KFC nametag
:lmao trying to talk basketball
:lmao all takes come down to kirby>duncan cuz gayyyy!!!!
:lmao can't name a single poster on ST who respects him
:lmao most ridiculed poster on ST
:lmao owned by Mid on a daily/weekly/annual basis
:lmao never won a debate
:lmao homer of 2nd banana on a legacy-destroying tour

Resides in Van Nuys
Kicks white ass all the time
Lets me watch
His mother yells a lot
I get 1/2 of the 500 smackers
We talk about Deeps all the time
He hates you
Tells me to hit you with what you bought me
Wants to watch
"Adam 12" was filmed on his block, right there
His mother slept with Jack Webb
Jack Webb is his father
Mark 7 is Kool's middle name
Fore!!!

[midnightpulp]

Mid absolutely destroying niggas in this thread, per par. Dude is not just a ST HOF, he's the best poster of this era. Narutoluva, Kool, Dale, et al getting punished without mercy with Mid's truth bombs

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lzxiyu8Btb1qj3i85.gif

Nobody can compete with bball takes against Mid*. He's legend.

*his USA USA takes suck, tbh

:lol

Eh, I'm not overly patriotic, and I do keep my political positions rather fluid, never really subscribing to one side, the other, or the center for very long. I typically follow where the evidence (which is of course manipulated to hell and back per the agenda, but I try to find the most objective presentations) and arguments take me. For instance, it was Paul Krugman who convinced me that we might straining ourselves on the immigration front.

[Thread]

I typically follow where the evidence (which is of course manipulated to hell and back per the agenda, but I try to find the most objective presentations) and arguments take me.

Like the (miss record.) Ya chickenshit.

[Buddy Mignon]

Yeah. I think Duncan is a better teammate, less selfish, more agreeable, all while keeping a similar competitive fire and "killer instinct" as Kobe. What proves that more than saying, "We'll do it this time," and then doing it? I also meant "intangibles" in terms of doing the little things that aren't measured statistically: Setting picks, altering shots in the paint, basketball IQ, and the like. I also think Kobe's most acclaimed intangible (killer instinct) often times manifests itself negatively on the court in the form of shot selection and ball dominance. You ever play with a ball dominant player? Tell me what happens to the offense's rhythm and defense's intensity when a single player is dominating the ball? Here's where you tell me you were the ball dominant player. But anyone who's played basketball has played with a ball dominant player at times.

You love Kobe's style because it's a face-to-face, flamboyant, entertaining style of basketball that reduces a team game into a one-on-one competition. I know that vibes with a supposed "Alpha" personality like yourself (which is funny considering you're a fan of the greatest team player in NBA history, but whatever).



I'm using more than PER in my evaluation. Howard has other advanced stats that aren't too great. Barkley is an advanced stat beast, but stupidly partied during the 1993 Finals, which probably cost him a ring. Chris Paul and TMAC have pretty small sample sizes, so they're not really worth considering.

And yeah, I'd consider the personality (intangibles) of the guys I was building a team with. It's one of the reasons the Spurs been so successful. They get guys who have a compatible chemistry. It's why the Showtime Lakers were so successful. Bird's Celtics, etc.

Kobe's personality seems like it's a detriment to team cohesion more often than not. I'm not surprised things went south when Fisher left.


Mid... I don't think you give a shit about intangibles, or likable teammates. You only tout it because it fits the narrative the media has created for your organization. You see... rape was a horrible act until Neal did it. You got a drunk driving GM at the helm of your ship. Imagine a Laker texting his teammates wife for some pussy. You got a staunch atheist too... and he ain't apologizing, either. Just think if Kobe had said, "FIBA SUCKS... and I'm never going back." I've studied the nature of man, Mid... nothing you do surprises me. Just look at your hypocrisy in plain daylight. In one breath you claim Jim is a better player due to intangibles, but carry the 6/24 Kobe flag at the same time. All while failing to mention that Kobe grabbed more rebounds than Pierce, KG, and Ray combined... 17 that is... while still guarding their best all around player in Rajon. You talk that 6/24 shit as if Kobe had reached into his back pocket and given one back. But it was just the opposite... he got sweet revenge, and that FMVP.

I don't really care for Kobe's style of play... its his effort that I respect. He knows who he is... and has never pretended to be otherwise. I don't feel cheated by Kobe like I did Shaq. You talk about the building blocks of why other teams were so successful, yet Kobe has had more team success than Shaq and Duncan. You act like Kobe didn't get his going directly through Duncan... with and without Shaq. Kobe has proved all of his doubters wrong, while Duncan has yet to defend it. No matter how you slice it, Mid... Kobe comes out on top of Duncan. Personal stats, Olympic Golds, All NBA Teams, defending his titles. While Duncan has had his minutes limited for the past 6 years, and sitting out back2back nights... Kobe is still going strong in his 19th year.

[HI-FI]

^, yeah, definitely not Ghost_of_Gashir

[scanry]

I don't really care for Kobe's style of play... its his effort that I respect. He knows who he is... and has never pretended to be otherwise. I don't feel cheated by Kobe like I did Shaq. You talk about the building blocks of why other teams were so successful, yet Kobe has had more team success than Shaq and Duncan. You act like Kobe didn't get his going directly through Duncan... with and without Shaq. Kobe has proved all of his doubters wrong, while Duncan has yet to defend it. No matter how you slice it, Mid... Kobe comes out on top of Duncan. Personal stats, Olympic Golds, All NBA Teams, defending his titles. While Duncan has had his minutes limited for the past 6 years, and sitting out back2back nights... Kobe is still going strong in his 19th year.

This retard again. Hey dummy, Kobe has not had more team success than Duncan. Unlike Kobe, Duncan & Shaq were great right off the bat. Duncan was the league's best player in just his second season. Shaq & Duncan were neck and neck as the league's best player for the next 7 years. By the time Kobe drove away Shaq and established his foothold, Lebron took the reigns of the league.

If you felt cheated by Shaq, you don't deserve 3 of those championships. Without Shaq, you don't have Phil and without him, you have a glorified TMac in Kobe. People don't give Shaq enough credit for his dominance and you're a fool if you think it made no difference on Kobe's game. Kobe got better because of Shaq and it made him work that much harder to have an impact.

[spurraider21]

^, yeah, definitely not Ghost_of_Gashir
A bitter Asian male muddling his way through life

[Thread]

This retard again. Hey dummy, Kobe has not had more team success than Duncan. Unlike Kobe, Duncan & Shaq were great right off the bat. Duncan was the league's best player in just his second season. Shaq & Duncan were neck and neck as the league's best player for the next 7 years. By the time Kobe drove away Shaq and established his foothold, Lebron took the reigns of the league.

If you felt cheated by Shaq, you don't deserve 3 of those championships. Without Shaq, you don't have Phil and without him, you have a glorified TMac in Kobe. People don't give Shaq enough credit for his dominance and you're a fool if you think it made no difference on Kobe's game. Kobe got better because of Shaq and it made him work that much harder to have an impact.

Kobe: 2

Daddy: 1

[Koolaid_Man]

If you felt cheated by Shaq, you don't deserve 3 of those championships. Without Shaq, you don't have Phil and without him, you have a glorified TMac in Kobe. People don't give Shaq enough credit for his dominance and you're a fool if you think it made no difference on Kobe's game. Kobe got better because of Shaq and it made him work that much harder to have an impact.

The problem you have is a glorified T-MAC never went back to back no Shaq not even with Yao holding it down for him. :hat

You need a better argument if you want any credibility because Kobe shattered that one :lol....Tim Duncan has proven to be a one dimensional system player....he doesn't have to make decisions with the ball...rendering his game, thought process, and IQ meaningless...it's the same for all big men....they're like dumb Sasquatches. Rimmy Duncan is no different. Kobe was dominant in high school breaking all of Wilt Chamberlain's high school scoring records in Philly so his greatness was destined. Kobe actually made Shaq better by virtue of his demand that he work....you got the game all twisted little kid...

[Brazil]

:lmao what a poor display from Lakers fans...

[scanry]

The problem you have is a glorified T-MAC never went back to back no Shaq not even with Yao holding it down for him. :hat

You need a better argument if you want any credibility because Kobe shattered that one :lol....Tim Duncan has proven to be a one dimensional system player....he doesn't have to make decisions with the ball...rendering his game, thought process, and IQ meaningless...it's the same for all big men....they're like dumb Sasquatches. Rimmy Duncan is no different. Kobe was dominant in high school breaking all of Wilt Chamberlain's high school scoring records in Philly so his greatness was destined. Kobe actually made Shaq better by virtue of his demand that he work....you got the game all twisted little kid...

Whatever you say Cedric. :lol

A rook who was given the reigns in his 1st training. Yeah let's call him a system player.

Boiled down Rimmy Duncan is still better and a more accomplished baller than Kobe. I could throw a bunch of stats and advanced metrics,

[Koolaid_Man]

Whatever you say Cedric. :lol

A rook who was given the reigns in his 1st training. Yeah let's call him a system player.

Boiled down Rimmy Duncan is still better and a more accomplished baller than Kobe. I could throw a bunch of stats and advanced metrics,

are you really that dense....am I supposed to be insulted...:lol let me help you out kid

[Koolaid_Man]

feel better now...:lol what a moron...oops had to change my Avi and take Cedricque down ....due to Kori's edict...

[scanry]

feel better now...:lol what a moron...oops had to change my Avi and take Cedricque down ....due to Kori's edict...

Why would I feel better dude? Duncan rang last June.

[Buddy Mignon]

Whatever you say Cedric. :lol

A rook who was given the reigns in his 1st training. Yeah let's call him a system player.

Boiled down Rimmy Duncan is still better and a more accomplished baller than Kobe. I could throw a bunch of stats and advanced metrics,


Kobe came straight from HS, you idiot. Jim wasted four years in college and didn't win shit while he was there, and just happened to offend plenty of women while he was there. Kobe's 5 is more impressive than Jim's 5 and Shaq's 4.

[Brazil]

Kobe came straight from HS, you idiot. Jim wasted four years in college and didn't win shit while he was there, and just happened to offend plenty of women while he was there. Kobe's 5 is more impressive than Jim's 5 and Shaq's 4.

:lol

sorry dude but every time I see one of your posts... I just think about naruto... I wish I could take what you write seriously but I can't

that's pretty fucked up

[scanry]

Kobe came straight from HS, you idiot. Jim wasted four years in college and didn't win shit while he was there, and just happened to offend plenty of women while he was there. Kobe's 5 is more impressive than Jim's 5 and Shaq's 4.

Lebron came out of HS and stuck with the team that drafted him. Kobe on the other hand went all beta on Charlotte and was Eddie freaking Jones's backup in LA. Fucking embarrassing to say the least.

Kobe's 5th may have been more impressive than Duncan's 5th, but Rimmy's 1st, 2nd & 3rd were a lot more impressive than the beta's. Try to :downspin:that you retard.