Leonard the ball stopper

[ElNono]

Anybody else noticed he's been ballhogging a lot more the last few games? Grabs rebound, brings the ball up the court and ignores Parker in the corner. Dismisses Duncan in the post, calls for a screen and his jumper.

We won it all last season with great ball movement, and unselfishness... is this going to be a problem long term, tbh?

[Mikeanaro]

Honestly I like that, I said something about during the last game thread.
Is not a problem he needs to build that game Manu is not gonna drive forever and someday he and Tim will not be playing anymore gotta be ready for transition.

[spursparker9]

Rather Kawhi do it than Parker tbh.

[Brunodf]

I am not a big fan of Kawhi(or Tony) long jumpers with 18 seconds on the shot clock tbh...

If he misses that can lead to easy fastbreak points... If he makes its just 2 points in 6 seconds that didn't waste any energy from the opposite team...

[exstatic]

Rather Kawhi do it than Parker tbh.

The point. You missed it. :lol

[jermaine]

But he's also one of our best passers. He make great decisions with the ball most times.

[Hoops Czar]

Nono not trolling hard enough, tbh.

[spurraider21]

Kawhisolation is mediocre

[Budkin]

Noticed he hasn't been giving it up on 2v1 breaks lately.

[RD2191]

OP dropping nukes.

[313]

But he's also one of our best passers. He make great decisions with the ball most times.he has decent vision at best

[boutons_deux]

he will develop better passing, vision, etc. he'll learn to make others better.

[Kool Bob Love]

That's Pop's call.

[Malik Hairston]

It's a necessity during the meaningless regular season, tbh..Spurs need to experiment with different looks with the big 3's inconsistency in creating..

The Spurs aren't going to be able to play with the same ball movement and beautiful basketball as last year until everybody is on the same page, especially Diaw and Splitter, they have struggled this season..

I know NBA fans love to overrate and overreact to regular season basketball, but this is the time where you experiment..

[KL2]

He said in the post game he's still not 100% and rushed a few things, hasn't really been healthy all season long. I expect those jumpers to start falling as he gets back into shape as well as his 3 ball. Leonard sparks the offense with his defense and rebounding, he gets the ball, pushes it up court, creates havoc on the defense. Spurs get a mismatch, easy shot, score. Things like those won't show up on the stat sheet.

Leonard and this team are going to get better as time goes on, I'm already seeing Leonard being more vocal out there and defenses respecting him. Regular season is the time to make your mistakes and correct them.

[Hoops Czar]

He said in the post game he's still not 100% and rushed a few things, hasn't really been healthy all season long.

So he's making excuses. Parker never made excuses.


I expect those jumpers to start falling as he gets back into shape as well as his 3 ball. Leonard sparks the offense with his defense and rebounding, he gets the ball, pushes it up court, creates havoc on the defense. Spurs get a mismatch, easy shot, score. Things like those won't show up on the stat sheet.

Yes they do. They show up as a rebound, assist and two points.


Leonard and this team are going to get better as time goes on, I'm already seeing Leonard being more vocal out there and defenses respecting him.
Defenses have always respected his mid-range jumper.
Regular season is the time to make your mistakes and correct them.

Funny as how this doesn't apply to Parker.

[apalisoc_9]

Parker isn't 23 years old..

Hoops

:lol

[look_at_g_shred]

OP dropping nukes.

[look_at_g_shred]

Parker isn't 23 years old..

Hoops

:lol
Die in a fire faggot

[Hoops Czar]

Parker isn't 23 years old..

Hoops

:lol

Yet, you compare him to one

Soc :lmao

[apalisoc_9]

KL2 obviously implied experimentation. The only thing Parker should be experimenting with is his Role Player status..

Hoops

:lol

[KL2]

So he's making excuses. Parker never made excuses.

He's merely explaining why he's missed so many easy shots, such as point blank layups which have slipped out of his injured hand numerous times. Parker doesn't make excuses, he just gives up on his team, like last years playoffs sitting out games against OKC and POR, luckily MVP Leonard carried us.


Yes they do. They show up as a rebound, assist and two points.

Not if an extra pass is made. Leonard breaks down defense with his aggressive push off the rebound, creates mismatches for everybody on the court, he draws in the already mismatched defense, passes out, Spurs penetrate again suck in the already discombobulated defense, pass out, wide open 3. All you see is a Leonard rebound on the stat sheet.


Defenses have always respected his mid-range jumper.

They're starting to pay attention to him when he has the ball in any situation, he's starting to get a reputation as one of the best players in the league, the players know that's an MVP they're playing against. More defensive attention means less attention on his teammates. He's got the ability to post/rebound on almost anybody unlike Parker, making his defensive attention more valuable and unique.


Funny as how this doesn't apply to Parker.

Leonard is helping his team night after night, he's the MVP. His offense isn't coming at the cost of his teammates, he is making them all better. Leonard steps it up in the playoffs, Parker does not. Leonard is 23 years old, not even in his prime. Parker's had years and years to develop, he's not gonna get any better especially defensively where he's really fallen off.

It took Parker something like 7 years before he developed anything more than a layup/tear drop, 13 years to finally develop a damn 3pt shot which he takes in a select few situations, can't make that shit up. People can't even wait a few months with Leonard as the #1 option trying to develop chemistry and overall as a player lol, already more accomplished and developed than most players in the NBA.

[Hoops Czar]

He's merely explaining why he's missed so many easy shots, such as point blank layups which have slipped out of his injured hand numerous times. Parker doesn't make excuses, he just gives up on his team, like last years playoffs sitting out games against OKC and POR, luckily MVP Leonard carried us.



Not if an extra pass is made. Leonard breaks down defense with his aggressive push off the rebound, creates mismatches for everybody on the court, he draws in the already mismatched defense, passes out, Spurs penetrate again suck in the already discombobulated defense, pass out, wide open 3. All you see is a Leonard rebound on the stat sheet.



They're starting to pay attention to him when he has the ball in any situation, he's starting to get a reputation as one of the best players in the league, the players know that's an MVP they're playing against. More defensive attention means less attention on his teammates. He's got the ability to post/rebound on almost anybody unlike Parker, making his defensive attention more valuable and unique.



Leonard is helping his team night after night, he's the MVP. His offense isn't coming at the cost of his teammates, he is making them all better. Leonard steps it up in the playoffs, Parker does not. Leonard is 23 years old, not even in his prime. Parker's had years and years to develop, he's not gonna get any better especially defensively where he's really fallen off.

It took Parker something like 7 years before he developed anything more than a layup/tear drop, 13 years to finally develop a damn 3pt shot which he takes in a select few situations, can't make that shit up. People can't even wait a few months with Leonard as the #1 option trying to develop chemistry and overall as a player lol, already more accomplished and developed than most players in the NBA.

I really hate to be the one to break this to you, but Leonard's ONLY real value is his defense. He's not the great offensive threat you think he is. He has great teammates which in turn, makes Leonard a better player overall offensively. His teammates put him in a position to succeed. Nearly 63% of his FG's are assisted to this season yet, nobody gives credit to the passer. Unless Leonard's defender falls asleep, Kiwi takes a couple dribbles toward the paint, stops, a.) shoots a 15-footer b.)passes the ball out to the top of the key. Put Leonard in another uniform and make him the number 1 option, and he wouldn't be half the player he is today. Yet, we'll mock TP for taking mid range jumpers.

Parker gave up on his team but you nor I really can contest to the pain or discomfort Parker was feeling during the time in which you say "he gave up on his team". I guess that's convenient because it fits your narrative to a tee.

Btw, Leonard was essentially a lottery pick. Parker was the 28th pick overall. Kudos to the Spurs coaching staff for sticking with the 19 year-old and teaching him the game of basketball.

[apalisoc_9]

I really hate to be the one to break this to you, but Leonard's ONLY real value is his defense. He's not the great offensive threat you think he is. He has great teammates which in turn, makes Leonard a better player overall offensively. His teammates put him in a position to succeed. Nearly 63% of his FG's are assisted to this season yet, nobody gives credit to the passer. Unless Leonard's defender falls asleep, Kiwi takes a couple dribbles toward the paint, stops, a.) shoots a 15-footer b.)passes the ball out to the top of the key. Put Leonard in another uniform and make him the number 1 option, and he wouldn't be half the player he is today.

Parker gave up on his team but you nor I really can contest to the pain or discomfort Parker was feeling during the time in which you say "he gave up on his team". I guess that's convenient because it fits your narrative to a tee.

Btw, Leonard was essentially a lottery pick. Parker was the 28th pick overall. Kudos to the Spurs coaching staff for sticking with the 19 year-old and teaching him the game of basketball.

:lmao

[DJR210]

I really hate to be the one to break this to you, but Leonard's ONLY real value is his defense. He's not the great offensive threat you think he is. He has great teammates which in turn, makes Leonard a better player overall offensively. His teammates put him in a position to succeed. Nearly 63% of his FG's are assisted to this season yet, nobody gives credit to the passer. Unless Leonard's defender falls asleep, Kiwi takes a couple dribbles toward the paint, stops, a.) shoots a 15-footer b.)passes the ball out to the top of the key. Put Leonard in another uniform and make him the number 1 option, and he wouldn't be half the player he is today. Yet, we'll mock TP for taking mid range jumpers.

Parker gave up on his team but you nor I really can contest to the pain or discomfort Parker was feeling during the time in which you say "he gave up on his team". I guess that's convenient because it fits your narrative to a tee.

Btw, Leonard was essentially a lottery pick. Parker was the 28th pick overall. Kudos to the Spurs coaching staff for sticking with the 19 year-old and teaching him the game of basketball.

:lol Kawhi has more value than just defense

[Clipper Nation]

I really hate to be the one to break this to you, but Leonard's ONLY real value is his defense.

You are fucking retarded. Just stop having basketball takes altogether, it's not working out for you.

[Mikeanaro]

JUST DEFENSE

[gilmor2002]

Fucking Spurstalks now complaining about Kawhi being ball-hog..

Wake up man.. Manu and Duncan won't be here next year if Spurs don't repeat..

[ElNono]

I love Kiwi, tbh... just bringing up something I noticed, it's not a bad thing, as other people said, this is the time to experiment...

[Hoops Czar]

You are fucking retarded. Just stop having basketball takes altogether, it's not working out for you.

32,000 + posts and none the wiser. You're the last person that should be dogging someone about basketball takes. Leonard generates offense with his defense. He's rarely able to create offense for himself and his passing is nothing to write home about. He's your prototypical, no-nonsense jump shooter shooting at a career low 45% from 2 and 33% from 3. 68% of lay ups, 82% of his dunks, and 68% of his jump shots come via the assist. The so-called number one option needs some passing guards to get him involved in the offense because he can rarely generate offense for himself. No wonder Kiwi backers want Parker's head on a swivel. A guy like Leonard, full of athleticism, should be demanding the ball and taking it to the basket on every possession, not settling for mid range jumpers, in which he's shooting a robust 37% from beyond 5 ft (89-237 ... 18/52 34%, 4th Q/OT) That's Corey Brewer territory.. Most of his J-shots beyond the arc come via penetration from Parker/Ginobili/Mills/Joseph and he only cans 33% of those wide open J's. Heck, If I was playing pg and knew those numbers beforehand and didn't see Leonard underneath the basket, I'd look the other way too.

[Malik Hairston]

:lol argument is 63% of his shots are assisted..

Well, ya, that's how it works for virtually every non-combo guard(Harden, Wade, Ginobili, etc) or PG in the NBA outside of Lebron, Durant(even Durant has 53% of his shots assisted) and Carmelo:lol..

Bradley Beal: 69%
Wes Matthews: 64%
Nic Batum: 69%
Tobias Harris: 61%
Klay Thompson: 65%
Chandler Parsons: 62%
Jimmy Butler: 65%
Wilson Chandler: 61%
Luol Deng: 68%

That's generally how the position works..

[Hoops Czar]

:lol argument is 63% of his shots are assisted..

Well, ya, that's how it works for virtually every non-combo guard(Harden, Wade, Ginobili, etc) or PG in the NBA outside of Lebron, Durant(even Durant has 53% of his shots assisted) and Carmelo:lol..

Bradley Beal: 69%
Wes Matthews: 64%
Nic Batum: 69%
Tobias Harris: 61%
Klay Thompson: 65%
Chandler Parsons: 62%
Jimmy Butler: 65%
Wilson Chandler: 61%
Luol Deng: 68%

That's generally how the position works..

None of those players are #1 options. Half those guys you called overrated. With the exception of Deng, theyr'e all primarily jump shooters. That's all they do. We're talking about MVPKiwi here.

[ChumpDumper]

It's a necessity during the meaningless regular season, tbh..Spurs need to experiment with different looks with the big 3's inconsistency in creating..

The Spurs aren't going to be able to play with the same ball movement and beautiful basketball as last year until everybody is on the same page, especially Diaw and Splitter, they have struggled this season..

I know NBA fans love to overrate and overreact to regular season basketball, but this is the time where you experiment..crofl

Now the regular season is meaningless.

Why do you get so upset over regular season games then?

[Malik Hairston]

crofl

Now the regular season is meaningless.

Why do you get so upset over regular season games then?

I do? I'm one of the leaders of the "meaningless games" argument:lol..

[Malik Hairston]

None of those players are #1 options. Half those guys you called overrated. With the exception of Deng, theyr'e all primarily jump shooters. That's all they do. We're talking about MVPKiwi here.

Your argument is that Kawhi is meaningless and has no value on offense because 63% of his shots are assisted..are all the players I listed meaningless on offense? Is every player in the NBA that isn't a combo guard, a PG or Lebron/Durant/Carmelo meaningless on offense?

[Hoops Czar]

Your argument is that Kawhi is meaningless and has no value on offense because 63% of his shots are assisted..are all the players I listed meaningless on offense? Is every player in the NBA that isn't a combo guard, a PG or Lebron/Durant/Carmelo meaningless on offense?

No, I said he is primarily a defender. If he gives the Spurs offense, then, it's a bonus. With his shooting %'s of 36% beyond 5 ft (That's Corey Brewer territory), I can see why he gets overlooked so often. There are posters here who feel he should be the #1 option and the dead head starting at point needs to recognize and witness the miracle at SF. "Leonard's not getting enough touches." The Spurs are losing because TP is ignoring Leonard in the corner." I'm saying his offense is a product of the system and it's highly inefficient at this point in his career. That may change down the line but, that's not the case now. Those guys you mentioned are basically role players with the possible exceptions of *2015 Klay Thompson and *2015 Jimmy Butler. I really thought we were talking about "one of the best players in the game." There's suppose to be a big difference between Leonard and the guys you mentioned. Would you consider trading Leonard for any of those players mentioned?

[KL2]

I really hate to be the one to break this to you, but Leonard's ONLY real value is his defense. He's not the great offensive threat you think he is. He has great teammates which in turn, makes Leonard a better player overall offensively. His teammates put him in a position to succeed. Nearly 63% of his FG's are assisted to this season yet, nobody gives credit to the passer. Unless Leonard's defender falls asleep, Kiwi takes a couple dribbles toward the paint, stops, a.) shoots a 15-footer b.)passes the ball out to the top of the key. Put Leonard in another uniform and make him the number 1 option, and he wouldn't be half the player he is today. Yet, we'll mock TP for taking mid range jumpers.

Clearly you don't know what you're watching. He is one of the best post SF's in the NBA, those aren't his teammates making those post moves, backing down his defender, making those turn around fade away shots while his teammates get credited for an assist for lmao. He's great in the pick and roll, he can perfectly replicate Parker's penetrate and drive too. He was hitting guys with all sorts of passes in the beginning of the season, the problem was Daye, Anderson, Diaw, Belli, everyone was bricking their shots. Of course you weren't paying attention to this. And that whole penetration break down the defense thing after a rebound is not minor, it's huge to the Spurs' offense. His aggression creates for others.

Leonard rarely gets put in position to make plays, Parker on the other hand has the entire offense tailored towards him lmao. Practically everything Leonard gets out there is the product of himself. You want to see a system player watch Parker's '07 Finals highlights, Duncan is involved in practically every scoring play, that is a true system player.


Parker gave up on his team but you nor I really can contest to the pain or discomfort Parker was feeling during the time in which you say "he gave up on his team". I guess that's convenient because it fits your narrative to a tee.


Either way Leonard lead the Spurs without Parker, stepping up his game both times thanks to TP being out.


Btw, Leonard was essentially a lottery pick. Parker was the 28th pick overall. Kudos to the Spurs coaching staff for sticking with the 19 year-old and teaching him the game of basketball.


Parker has been playing pro basketball since he was 15, developing and playing among elite competition since he was a teen. Leonard played for some unknown high school and college nobody heard of, made it to the NBA, revamped his shot by himself without the assistance of Spurs staff during the lockout, turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA lmao. He's proven time and time again, give him reps, he'll get better. Parker needs to take a back seat, Spurs need to tailor the offense towards Leonard.

[rasuo214]

Lets see thread starts off by calling Kawhi a ballhog but Hoops shows up as the hero that we all know he is and explains why he isn't by pointing out Kawhi's % of FGM that were assisted. Thanks.

[Hoops Czar]

Clearly you don't know what you're watching. He is one of the best post SF's in the NBA, those aren't his teammates making those post moves, backing down his defender, making those turn around fade away shots while his teammates get credited for an assist for lmao.

Duly noted.


He's great in the pick and roll, he can perfectly replicate Parker's penetrate and drive too. He was hitting guys with all sorts of passes in the beginning of the season, the problem was Daye, Anderson, Diaw, Belli, everyone was bricking their shots. Of course you weren't paying attention to this. And that whole penetration break down the defense thing after a rebound is not minor, it's huge to the Spurs' offense. His aggression creates for others.

Exactly. He takes a couple dribbles, stops, pulls up and clanks a 15 footer 64% of the time. Parker's %'s are a little higher though. Yet, Parker is a lazy slug who punishes the team by using an exorbitant amount of court time selfishly over dribbling and shooting his team out of games while completely ignoring the best player on the court.


Leonard rarely gets put in position to make plays, Parker on the other hand has the entire offense tailored towards him lmao. Practically everything Leonard gets out there is the product of himself. You want to see a system player watch Parker's '07 Finals highlights, Duncan is involved in practically every scoring play, that is a true system player.

Sure he does. He makes plays with his defense all the time. Sometimes, it leads to easy offense.


Either way Leonard lead the Spurs without Parker, stepping up his game both times thanks to TP being out.

I knew it was somehow all Parker's fault.




Parker has been playing pro basketball since he was 15, developing and playing among elite competition since he was a teen. Leonard played for some unknown high school and college nobody heard of, made it to the NBA, revamped his shot by himself without the assistance of Spurs staff during the lockout, turned into one of the best shooters in the NBA lmao. He's proven time and time again, give him reps, he'll get better. Parker needs to take a back seat, Spurs need to tailor the offense towards Leonard.

Stats would disagree with this but, I digress. The Spurs have actually been a better offensive team with Leonard off the floor. The defense on the other hand, yeesh! I agree, he will get better, but, it's a bit too early to tailor your offense around a player who's shooting 36% beyond 5 ft. Maybe when Parker is traded in the offseason, we will all be able to breathe a huge sigh of relief knowing the future has finally arrived. Time to start adding some rings to the left hand to go with those already occupying the right.

[Hoops Czar]

Lets see thread starts off by calling Kawhi a ballhog but Hoops shows up as the hero that we all know he is and explains why he isn't by pointing out Kawhi's % of FGM that were assisted. Thanks.

This is a troll thread. Soc and Fuck didn't bite.

[rasuo214]

BTW Hoops you posted Kawhi's outside 5 ft shooting % (37.75% according to NBA.com) it isn't that far off from guys like Westbrook (36.58%), Lebron (38.85%) and Harden (38.40%).

Kawhi's OffRtg is also highest on the team (107)

Harden is 107.8, Lebron 110.3, Butler 106.3, Westbrook 106.7, Durant 105.9



So yea Kawhi's biggest impact is on the defensive end (+rebounding) lets not act like he's some marginal/average offensive player. Maybe that is system related but then you could also apply that to the rest of the team as well.

[FkLA]

How is the teams leading scorer just a defensive guy?:lol

OP is kinda right, Kawhi has been attacking often when he gets the ball. I do think he's also being a willing passer when the pass is there to be made though. Better than the alternative of sitting in the corner since our Big Two need all the help they can get shouldering the load bc a certain PG has been MIA all season. He can be erratic at times but I think hes shown enough flashes to where you just have to live with the errors and allow him to grow...I think he has the ability to dominate the large majority of SFs in the post and eventually should be used as point forward as well.

[FireMicoHalili]

Yes we can afford to experiment because it's not like the Suns, Pels, and the Thunder are breathing down the Spurs' necks

[siraulo23]

yeah regular season is the time to get kawhi to iso a bit more, but heading to the POs they gotta come back to that ball movement that won them the 'ship

[FkLA]

Yes we can afford to experiment because it's not like the Suns, Pels, and the Thunder are breathing down the Spurs' necks

Yeah bc allowing him to spread his wings is costing the Spurs wins...

5-1 since his return and the only reason the Bulls game was close in the first half was bc of Kawhis isos.

[pgardn]

I don't believe we have fully integrated KL in the offense. Last year he grew wings in the playoffs on the offensive end. This year he appears to have confidence in an even wider array of shots. This changes the offensive roles of other players. Pop has got to find someway to integrate these changes while still moving the ball around effectively.

[hater]

Fucking Spurstalks now complaining about Kawhi being ball-hog....

[EVAY]

I don't believe we have fully integrated KL in the offense. Last year he grew wings in the playoffs on the offensive end. This year he appears to have confidence in an even wider array of shots. This changes the offensive roles of other players. Pop has got to find someway to integrate these changes while still moving the ball around effectively.

Bingo.

this is what I have been seeing all season.

The team is truly TRYING to get Kawhi more involved in the offensive sets. But to do that, they have to change some of what their offense has been doing for the last three years.
It is occasionally difficult to watch the process. Lots of times when Kawhi tries to iso, our bigs are unsure where to go and the spacing gets crowded. Plus, when he isos, our guards are not going to be in the motion offense they have been running for years.

All of this is to say it is not a fun thing to watch sometimes. It may be necessary to get to where the team wants to be by the playoffs, but it is not always pretty.

I believe that all of the team members want to do what Pop wants them to do. The ability to remember how to get it done differently from what worked before is not easy all the time.

[TheGreatYacht]

OP dropping nukes.

[FireMicoHalili]

Yeah bc allowing him to spread his wings is costing the Spurs wins...

5-1 since his return and the only reason the Bulls game was close in the first half was bc of Kawhis isos.
5-1 since his return due to Kawhisos? S t r e t c h.

[TheGreatYacht]

Yeah bc allowing him to spread his wings is costing the Spurs wins...

5-1 since his return and the only reason the Bulls game was close in the first half was bc of Kawhis isos.
4-1*
Blazers, W
Jazz, W <--- lol
Nuggets, W <--- lol
Bulls, L
Lakers, W <--- lol

[apalisoc_9]

No, I said he is primarily a defender. If he gives the Spurs offense, then, it's a bonus. With his shooting %'s of 36% beyond 5 ft (That's Corey Brewer territory), I can see why he gets overlooked so often. There are posters here who feel he should be the #1 option and the dead head starting at point needs to recognize and witness the miracle at SF. "Leonard's not getting enough touches." The Spurs are losing because TP is ignoring Leonard in the corner." I'm saying his offense is a product of the system and it's highly inefficient at this point in his career. That may change down the line but, that's not the case now. Those guys you mentioned are basically role players with the possible exceptions of *2015 Klay Thompson and *2015 Jimmy Butler. I really thought we were talking about "one of the best players in the game." There's suppose to be a big difference between Leonard and the guys you mentioned. Would you consider trading Leonard for any of those players mentioned?

What a liar....

[FireMicoHalili]

What a liar....
Mainstream player fan

[wildbill2u]

Many people wanted Kwahi to shoot more. I'm not sure he is ready to be a true shooter, but he is definitely taking control of the offense and the ball in order to shoot.

This isn't the Beautiful Game that won the 5th title. It will be interesting to see if Pop is on board with this youngster taking over the offense after he encouraged him to shoot more.

[ChumpDumper]

Kawhi let the Lakers win the third quarter!

!

[EVAY]

Many people wanted Kwahi to shoot more. I'm not sure he is ready to be a true shooter, but he is definitely taking control of the offense and the ball in order to shoot.

This isn't the Beautiful Game that won the 5th title. It will be interesting to see if Pop is on board with this youngster taking over the offense after he encouraged him to shoot more.

More and more people are beginning to note this.

Question is, will Kawhi?

[ducks]

Last game tp hit a wide open teammate 5-8 times and they missed the shots
Had they made half he would have 4 more assist
Also he hit players that were fouled and got free throws but no assist
Stats do not provide the whole story

Try watching the games

[Hoops Czar]

Last game tp hit a wide open teammate 5-8 times and they missed the shots
Had they made half he would have 4 more assist
Also he hit players that were fouled and got free throws but no assist
Stats do not provide the whole story

Try watching the games'

Nice try. This logic only works with Kiwi.

[rasuo214]

Personally I have no problem with Parker on offense, occasionally he'll keep the ball too long and he hasn't been as good as previous seasons but if he's capable of coming even close to his previous offensive production then he'll be worth playing. His defense is an issue though but maybe it's just me but he looks like he has improved from earlier in the season (still not a good defender but just needs to not be another black hole like Marco).

[313]

32,000 + posts and none the wiser. You're the last person that should be dogging someone about basketball takes. Leonard generates offense with his defense. He's rarely able to create offense for himself and his passing is nothing to write home about. He's your prototypical, no-nonsense jump shooter shooting at a career low 45% from 2 and 33% from 3. 68% of lay ups, 82% of his dunks, and 68% of his jump shots come via the assist. The so-called number one option needs some passing guards to get him involved in the offense because he can rarely generate offense for himself. No wonder Kiwi backers want Parker's head on a swivel. A guy like Leonard, full of athleticism, should be demanding the ball and taking it to the basket on every possession, not settling for mid range jumpers, in which he's shooting a robust 37% from beyond 5 ft (89-237 ... 18/52 34%, 4th Q/OT) That's Corey Brewer territory.. Most of his J-shots beyond the arc come via penetration from Parker/Ginobili/Mills/Joseph and he only cans 33% of those wide open J's. Heck, If I was playing pg and knew those numbers beforehand and didn't see Leonard underneath the basket, I'd look the other way too.

Whew that nuke

[313]

Personally I have no problem with Parker on offense, occasionally he'll keep the ball too long and he hasn't been as good as previous seasons but if he's capable of coming even close to his previous offensive production then he'll be worth playing. His defense is an issue though but maybe it's just me but he looks like he has improved from earlier in the season (still not a good defender but just needs to not be another black hole like Marco).
He's never been a great defender but he's been pretty bad these last couple of years. Mostly due to him being screened off his man so easily.

[Malik Hairston]

God, it's cute that Hoops Czar tried to drop numbers to support himself for once, but wow, inaccurate numbers and random criteria

1. Says Leonard is a poor shooter outside of 5-feet(which is a really specific criteria:lol), but then says Leonard is a product of the Spurs system(the system that has usually relegated him to spot-up shooting the past 2 years)..makes a lot of sense:lol..

Kawhi's game isn't suited for the Spurs system, which even Pop has said..the SF position for the Spurs system makes it much more difficult for Leonard, just like we saw with Richard Jefferson..it's a guard-oriented system, as we're seeing in Atlanta, where Teague is putting up Parker numbers..

2. Says Leonard is inefficient..60% True Shooting in 2014, 59.2% in 2013..ridiculous efficiency, one of the most efficient players in the NBA

3. Says Leonard can't create because 63% of his shots are assisted..well, I already provided the list of all the key SFs in the NBA outside of Lebron/Carmelo/Durant..not to mention he was one of the 3-5 best post-up players in the NBA the past 2 years according to Synergy..overall, 2nd best half-court offense creator for the Spurs the past 2 years, too

4. Says Leonard doesn't have an impact on offense..3rd best offensive on/off metrics on the team the past 2 seasons behind Manu and Mills

5. Says Leonard should take the ball and drive on every possession, ignoring that the Spurs system doesn't work that way and that Duncan/Splitter clog the lane..not that he would know this, but Leonard's numbers skyrocket when he plays with Diaw/Splitter or Duncan/Diaw, rather than Duncan/Splitter, too

[Malik Hairston]

No, I said he is primarily a defender. If he gives the Spurs offense, then, it's a bonus. With his shooting %'s of 36% beyond 5 ft (That's Corey Brewer territory), I can see why he gets overlooked so often. There are posters here who feel he should be the #1 option and the dead head starting at point needs to recognize and witness the miracle at SF. "Leonard's not getting enough touches." The Spurs are losing because TP is ignoring Leonard in the corner." I'm saying his offense is a product of the system and it's highly inefficient at this point in his career. That may change down the line but, that's not the case now. Those guys you mentioned are basically role players with the possible exceptions of *2015 Klay Thompson and *2015 Jimmy Butler. I really thought we were talking about "one of the best players in the game." There's suppose to be a big difference between Leonard and the guys you mentioned. Would you consider trading Leonard for any of those players mentioned?

:lol 1. Corey Brewer's career TS% is 50..Leonard's is 58%, so far..nice comparison, not to mention the massive disparity in assisted % of shots

2. You keep moving the goal posts..first, you said Leonard can't create because 63% of his shots are assisted..I showed you the list of SFs in the NBA, now you're essentially changing your argument to "Leonard should be like Lebron/Durant/Carmelo"

Nobody has said that Kawhi is on the level of those players as an offensive creator..even if he was, the Spurs' system isn't built that way

3. None of the players I mentioned are role players..they're all top 3 offensive contributors to their team at the SF position..Klay Thompson and Jimmy Butler are top 2 options on their teams

4. Leonard is a better player than all of the guys I mentioned, because there's more to the game than your definition of creating offense:lol..that doesn't have anything to do with your argument

[Hoops Czar]

:lol 1. Corey Brewer's career TS% is 50..Leonard's is 58%, so far..nice comparison, not to mention the massive disparity in assisted % of shots

2. You keep moving the goal posts..first, you said Leonard can't create because 63% of his shots are assisted..I showed you the list of SFs in the NBA, now you're essentially changing your argument to "Leonard should be like Lebron/Durant/Carmelo"

Nobody has said that Kawhi is on the level of those players as an offensive creator..even if he was, the Spurs' system isn't built that way

3. None of the players I mentioned are role players..they're all top 3 offensive contributors to their team at the SF position..Klay Thompson and Jimmy Butler are top 2 options on their teams

4. Leonard is a better player than all of the guys I mentioned, because there's more to the game than your definition of creating offense:lol..that doesn't have anything to do with your argument

First off, you showed me a a list of SF's, half of which you called overrated. Now, you're using them in an argument to thwart off Kiwi's ineptitude on offense primarily because it fits into your so-called narrative. I'm not the one with the convoluted connotations but, you and your obvious troll handles on the other hand. :lmao My projections of Leonard have remained steadfast that he'll be no better than a prime Shawn Marion. However, "He shut down the best player on the planet in the finals, therefore, he must be among the best." The Spurs will need to surround Kiwi with a strong supporting cast in the future if this team has expectations when Duncan and Ginobili retire.

Yes, Leonard does a wonderful job bumping up his true shooting % with layups and slam dunks which he does roughly 28% (55-87/67%) of the time. Unfortunately, that leaves 82% of his shots outside of 5 ft , in which he continues to shoot a low % (36%). Doesn't Pop realize that works against Kiwi? :lol I'm not buying the whole Duncan and Splitter clogging the paint argument because that wasn't such the case in last year's finals. "The Spurs concept of team basketball was the best in NBA history." You don't need to be a stat hound to see how poor of a shooter Leonard is this year. If you're prerogative is to compare him to a bunch of pure shooting SF's, then you have at it but the said players you quoted above are basically role players with the exceptions of the before mentioned *2015 versions of Klay Thompson and Jimmy Butler. However, you conveniently glossed over that comment in my post presumably because of the toxic emission of fumes coming out of your rear caboose, clouding your judgment.
Leonard can create in transition when he has open court and numbers to work with. He is without a doubt nearly unwatchable in the half court. He takes a couple dribbles toward the paint stops and passes the ball out to the top of the key. That's if he doesn't hack up a half-baked 15 footer that barely touches rim. I'm not saying he can't improve but he hasn't reached "elite" status on offense yet so I have no problem with him NOT being the number one option. There's a reason the Spurs offense has actually been better without Leonard this year. It's the defense that suffered the most.

I can't make much sense out of the rest of this post. Maybe I forgot to use quotations for # 4. I don't put Leonard above many of those players yet. But if you read Spurstalk more often :lol, you'd understand the reality of overrating one of it's own.

How many of those guy you mentioned would you give max money to? :lol

[Malik Hairston]

^^ Typical, bunch of inaccurate gibberish and no facts to back his argument, as usual..

Moving the goal posts, ignoring the numbers, making shit up, the usual Poops Czar moves..

[ElNono]

I'm not buying the whole Duncan and Splitter clogging the paint argument because that wasn't such the case in last year's finals.

Have no horse in this race, but it's well know that's the reason Pop started Diaw since Game 3 and Kawhi became superlative after playing average the first two games. The Spurs just obliterated Miami after that change.

[itzsoweezee]

eat a dick you fucking moron. your observations are the fucking worst.

[Hoops Czar]

Have no horse in this race, but it's well know that's the reason Pop started Diaw since Game 3 and Kawhi became superlative after playing average the first two games. The Spurs just obliterated Miami after that change.

It's possible. But I think it had more to do with team basketball rather than just Leonard.

[Malik Hairston]

First off, you showed me a a list of SF's, half of which you called overrated. Now, you're using them in an argument to thwart off Kiwi's ineptitude on offense primarily because it fits into your so-called narrative. I'm not the one with the convoluted connotations but, you and your obvious troll handles on the other hand. :lmao

Your claim is that Leonard has no offensive value because 63% of his shots are assisted..my point is that it's a ridiculous argument, and I gave you the list of SFs in the NBA and their assisted %..it's a simple concept that you can't seem to understand:lol..there are only 3 SFs in the NBA that are unique to the prototypical SF role..nobody said Leonard should be playing the same role as Lebron/Durant/Carmelo

All the players I named are good offensive players..they are nowhere near the all-around players that Leonard is, though..you seem to be ignoring every facet of basketball outside of shot-creation, for some reason(probably because you're an idiot:lol)..



Yes, Leonard does a wonderful job bumping up his true shooting % with layups and slam dunks which he does roughly 28% (55-87/67%) of the time. Unfortunately, that leaves 82% of his shots outside of 5 ft , in which he continues to shoot a low % (36%). Doesn't Pop realize that works against Kiwi? :lol

This is irrelevant..you said he's inefficient, when in reality, he has been one of the most efficient players in the NBA the past 2 years:lmao..now it matters how he gets his points? :lol..

You compared him to Corey Brewer's career 50% TS, which is way off, as usual..


I'm not buying the whole Duncan and Splitter clogging the paint argument because that wasn't such the case in last year's finals. "The Spurs concept of team basketball was the best in NBA history."

:lmao the Duncan/Splitter combination was barely used in the past 2 Finals, you moron..Leonard's numbers skyrocket when he plays with Diaw, rather than the Duncan/Splitter combination..you can ignore the numbers if you want, though..


You don't need to be a stat hound to see how poor of a shooter Leonard is this year. If you're prerogative is to compare him to a bunch of pure shooting SF's, then you have at it but the said players you quoted above are basically role players with the exceptions of the before mentioned *2015 versions of Klay Thompson and Jimmy Butler.

:lol Role players?

Jimmy Butler: 22% usage
Chandler Parsons: 21%
Wilson CHandler: 20%
Klay Thompson: 28%
Luol Deng: 20%
Tobias Harris: 24%
Wes Matthews: 20%
Bradley Beal: 21%

Literally, none of those players are role players, you moron:lmao..they're all high-usage players


Leonard can create in transition when he has open court and numbers to work with. He is without a doubt nearly unwatchable in the half court. He takes a couple dribbles toward the paint stops and passes the ball out to the top of the key. That's if he doesn't hack up a half-baked 15 footer that barely touches rim. I'm not saying he can't improve but he hasn't reached "elite" status on offense yet so I have no problem with him NOT being the number one option. There's a reason the Spurs offense has actually been better without Leonard this year. It's the defense that suffered the most.

A bunch of gibberish with no facts, and ignoring that Leonard has the 3rd highest offensive on/off for the Spurs the past 2 years



How many of those guy you mentioned would you give max money to? :lol

All of those players are good offensive players..Kawhi is just as good offensively + an elite defender, elite rebounder and elite playoff performer..ya, it's a no-brainer:lol..

So, according to Hoops Czar, if you aren't a PG, James Harden, or Durant/Carmelo/Lebron, you're a role player that doesn't have value on offense:lmao..

[Hoops Czar]

Your claim is that Leonard has no offensive value because 63% of his shots are assisted..my point is that it's a ridiculous argument, and I gave you the list of SFs in the NBA and their assisted %..it's a simple concept that you can't seem to understand:lol..there are only 3 SFs in the NBA that are unique to the prototypical SF role..nobody said Leonard should be playing the same role as Lebron/Durant/Carmelo

All the players I named are good offensive players..they are nowhere near the all-around players that Leonard is, though..you seem to be ignoring every facet of basketball outside of shot-creation, for some reason(probably because you're an idiot:lol)..

I didn't say he had zero offensive value you clown. I said he's primarily a defender. Just another contrived analysis on your part.





:lmao the Duncan/Splitter combination was barely used in the past 2 Finals, you moron..Leonard's numbers skyrocket when he plays with Diaw, rather than the Duncan/Splitter combination..you can ignore the numbers if you want, though..



:lol Role players?

Jimmy Butler: 22% usage
Chandler Parsons: 21%
Wilson CHandler: 20%
Klay Thompson: 28%
Luol Deng: 20%
Tobias Harris: 24%
Wes Matthews: 20%
Bradley Beal: 21%

Literally, none of those players are role players, you moron:lmao..they're all high-usage players

:lmao:lmao:lmaoUsage rates doesn't mean what you think it means. Parker has a usage rate of 24.9%. "He should be a role player." "He's hurting the team." "He needs to be coming off the bench." Go hammer some Jack Daniels you hack! They're role players.




A bunch of gibberish with no facts, and ignoring that Leonard has the 3rd highest offensive on/off for the Spurs the past 2 years

Contributed to great team basketball which you choose to ignore. Go figure that he's most efficient with Ginobili on the court. It's going to be sad to see him go. conversely, he's terrible with Parker on the floor. Well of course, Parker ignores him. Go figure.



All of those players are good offensive players..Kawhi is just as good offensively + an elite defender, elite rebounder and elite playoff performer..ya, it's a no-brainer:lol..

So, according to Hoops Czar, if you aren't a PG, James Harden, or Durant/Carmelo/Lebron, you're a role player that doesn't have value on offense:lmao..

More drivel. Beal is having an awful offensive season. I never put him in the elite class of Harden, Durant and James. However, half this forum has been doing just that since last year's finals. He's a product of the system. I never said he wasn't better than a role player so there goes 2/3's of your list right sans the two I already mentioned. :lol "Leonard is a dynamic offensive weapon." and you're comparing him to role players.:lol 82% of Leonard's shots taken this year have been beyond 5 ft, most of them beyond 10. There's too much talent and athleticism in that body to settle for outside jumpers. I do watch the games and he can rarely take his man off the dribble to the basket. It almost always leads to a jumper or a kick out. When he approaches 40% in the paint rather than his current 28%, I'll be a believer.

Better stay away from Gasol in the offseason because Leonard can't operate with bigs in the paint. It cramps his style.

[mystargtr34]

:lol Poops Czar

[wildchild]

Bingo.

this is what I have been seeing all season.

The team is truly TRYING to get Kawhi more involved in the offensive sets. But to do that, they have to change some of what their offense has been doing for the last three years.
It is occasionally difficult to watch the process. Lots of times when Kawhi tries to iso, our bigs are unsure where to go and the spacing gets crowded. Plus, when he isos, our guards are not going to be in the motion offense they have been running for years.

All of this is to say it is not a fun thing to watch sometimes. It may be necessary to get to where the team wants to be by the playoffs, but it is not always pretty.

I believe that all of the team members want to do what Pop wants them to do. The ability to remember how to get it done differently from what worked before is not easy all the time.

Kawhi's usage percentage didn't increase high this season, every game Tim and Tony took more shots than him.

But agree with you, a few times it seems like the team try to change some things to involve more him. And if Pop does that consistently it will be the good move.

Granted, it's not always nice to watch, it's a work in progress, but we can't act like Tony is still the most dominant point guard in the league.
He's an amazing player -injuries/fatigue limited him this and last season- but the offensive system must change because when the Spurs run the offense taking the old page with Tony against good teams, we know what happened, Westbrook, Lillard, Rose ate him alive last games.

Offensive roles have changed these years, from Duncan-centered offense to offense based on Tony's isos and pick-and-rolls, now it's time to change again to a more distributed offense.

That's why we need to improve Leonard's offensive game, and his development will help Tony's game, too.
Because opposite defenders won't take Parker as the only perimeter offensive threat and when other teams focus more on Leonard or he will get a double team that will be a great benefit to Tony.

The Spurs need Leonard to become a reliable 1-b offensive option and I can't blame Pop if he really tries to do that.



This isn't the Beautiful Game that won the 5th title. It will be interesting to see if Pop is on board with this youngster taking over the offense after he encouraged him to shoot more.

Well, Leonard was the leading scorer of the Finals last three games and the offense looked really beautiful with him on the court in those games.

[apalisoc_9]

Well, Leonard was the leading scorer of the Finals last three games and the offense looks really beautiful with him on the court in those games.

Boom!

[Mr Bones]

Kawhi's OffRtg is also highest on the team (107)

Harden is 107.8, Lebron 110.3, Butler 106.3, Westbrook 106.7, Durant 105.9

So yea Kawhi's biggest impact is on the defensive end (+rebounding) lets not act like he's some marginal/average offensive player. Maybe that is system related but then you could also apply that to the rest of the team as well.

Where are you getting your ORtg numbers? This site-- http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/SAS/2015.html says Kawhi has the 9th highest offensive rating on the team, but shares the #1 DRtg with Duncan.

[rasuo214]

Where are you getting your ORtg numbers? This site-- http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/SAS/2015.html says Kawhi has the 9th highest offensive rating on the team, but shares the #1 DRtg with Duncan.

http://stats.nba.com/team/#!/1610612759/players/advanced/?sort=OFF_RATING&dir=1

He's #2 now.

[cd021]

It's possible. But I think it had more to do with team basketball rather than just Leonard.

it was definitely Diaw that helped Leonard go off in games 3-5. Splitter and Duncan, together, kills the spacing. Just having Diaw draw his man out 15-18 feet makes a world of difference. Not to mention his passing. The Spurs slaughtered Miami when Diaw was on the floor. The Spurs bench did a great job of extending leads with Mills-Manu-Diaw and Splitter all having great series and played well together.

[Brazil]

How is the teams leading scorer just a defensive guy?:lol

OP is kinda right, Kawhi has been attacking often when he gets the ball. I do think he's also being a willing passer when the pass is there to be made though. Better than the alternative of sitting in the corner since our Big Two need all the help they can get shouldering the load bc a certain PG has been MIA all season. He can be erratic at times but I think hes shown enough flashes to where you just have to live with the errors and allow him to grow...I think he has the ability to dominate the large majority of SFs in the post and eventually should be used as point forward as well.

not sure you are capable anymore to post anything on the spurs not mentioning a certain PG :rolleyes

On the point tho, I think Kawhi like Durant is not a "natural" but he will work on his playmaking and his assists... Durant started his 4 / 5 first years with less than 3 per game, he is now around 5.
Defense are now much more focused on stopping him on the O end... it's gonna create a lot of opportunities for his team mates. He has to learn recognize those and give the ball. He is a fast learner so I'm not worried it will come soon not necessarily this year tho.

[tmtcsc]

I appreciate Kawhi being more aggressive and vocal. Any time you can have a player draw double-teams or make the offense unpredictable / difficult to defend, it helps the team. - Except in the case of forced shots. If he gets to the point where the defense starts to concentrate on him, I have no doubt he will find an open teammate for an easy bucket or 3 pointer.

[Brazil]

I'm giving Hoops credit... He successfully went under Harlem skin :lol

[wildchild]

I'm giving Hoops credit... He successfully went under Harlem skin :lol

We all know Hoops is constantly wrong about everything, the league, the teams, the players...it's not necessary to remember every one of Hoops' bad takes like Harlem does.

Handled correctly, a negative post is a great opportunity to draw attention to another point you want to talk. So the best response is no response and find the other side of the same comment, that's the smart game.

Plus, guys shouldn't react in the heat of the moment, don't return the fire, just take a breather, because Hoops will make himself look bad sooner or later, he has done a magnificent job of doing that all these years.

[dabom]

We all know Hoops is constantly wrong about everything, the league, the teams, the players...it's not necessary to remember every one of Hoops' bad takes like Harlem does.

Handled correctly, a negative post is a great opportunity to draw attention to another point you want to talk. So the best response is no response and find the other side of the same comment, that's the smart game.

Plus, guys shouldn't react in the heat of the moment, don't return the fire, just take a breather, because Hoops will make himself look bad sooner or later, he has done a magnificent job of doing that all these years.


Hoops is seriously bad at everything including his player analysis. Dude has zero credibility at this point.

[Hoops Czar]

it was definitely Diaw that helped Leonard go off in games 3-5. Splitter and Duncan, together, kills the spacing. Just having Diaw draw his man out 15-18 feet makes a world of difference. Not to mention his passing. The Spurs slaughtered Miami when Diaw was on the floor. The Spurs bench did a great job of extending leads with Mills-Manu-Diaw and Splitter all having great series and played well together.

Well, like Marion, Leonard needs a lot of open court and less traffic jams.. With Diaw in the lineup, the Spurs can get out in transition more and that's where Leonard is at his best. He's been relatively quiet in the half court game this year mainly because he's shooting such a poor % from the field. Many will say he can't penetrate with Duncan and Splitter sharing the same air space. I think that's a lot of hogwash. The only thing it does is prevents Kiwi from grabbing offensive rebounds and putbacks. He's had ample opportunity to penetrate this year with Duncan and Diaw on the floor, and the most typical result is a couple of dribbles, a kick out or a forced 15-footer. The only time I've seen him successfully penetrate to the rim is through a screen set by Duncan/Diaw/Bonner or a complete bust in coverage. His half court mainly consists of standing in the corner, waiting for the pass by a penetrating guard, a complete and egregious misuse of talent.

If the Spurs want to maximize Leonard's full potential, they are going to have to change their entire offensive philosophy going forward.

[Hoops Czar]

We all know Hoops is constantly wrong about everything, the league, the teams, the players...it's not necessary to remember every one of Hoops' bad takes like Harlem does.

Handled correctly, a negative post is a great opportunity to draw attention to another point you want to talk. So the best response is no response and find the other side of the same comment, that's the smart game.

Plus, guys shouldn't react in the heat of the moment, don't return the fire, just take a breather, because Hoops will make himself look bad sooner or later, he has done a magnificent job of doing that all these years.

Are you still wearing the same wet, soggy pampers from the last time I schooled your ass? You have to get on with your life my man. Take a look in the mirror, let out a scream or two then, go back to living because life is too short.

[Hoops Czar]

I'm giving Hoops credit... He successfully went under Harlem skin :lol

:lol That's my schtick, don't wear it out. Where there's a Harlem, you'll find a Hoops.

[KL2]

Hoops reminds me of Wimp Lo from Kung pow, he thinks losing is winning...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d696t3yALAY

[dabom]

:lmao

[FuzzyLumpkins]

We all know Hoops is constantly wrong about everything, the league, the teams, the players...it's not necessary to remember every one of Hoops' bad takes like Harlem does.

Handled correctly, a negative post is a great opportunity to draw attention to another point you want to talk. So the best response is no response and find the other side of the same comment, that's the smart game.

Plus, guys shouldn't react in the heat of the moment, don't return the fire, just take a breather, because Hoops will make himself look bad sooner or later, he has done a magnificent job of doing that all these years.

Hoops Czar used to post all the time with another ninny Texas 2 Step. Whatever happened to that guy?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Kawhi never became consistently aggressive on offense until game 3 of the finals. Prior to that he would have games where they would feed him the ball but he always deferred.

He's bought in now. Keep in mind that at the beginning of the year his team mates didn't react to his post ups and gtfo of the paint. Now Baynes, Splitter, and Duncan rotate to the high post. He isn't a complete black hole in hte post either. He will pass it down the baseline or kick it out when he sees the double team.

Off the dribble he does have bit of blinders though. Spurs have a system on how players move off or penetration and he needs to see it better. He has improved his shot and ball handling and his career assist trajectory has been a steady climb. Only 23.5 years old and working with an elite player development staff, I like his chances.

If he can become a playmaker off the dribble he will be completely dynamic and likely dominating offensively.

[wildchild]

Are you still wearing the same wet, soggy pampers from the last time I schooled your ass?

You definitely have a rare concept of how to win and who wins an argument.

IIRC "the last time" I was talking about how Leonard changes everything on this team, about how vital he is to win...so there isn't a really dispute as to the winner. You figured wrong, again.

If there is a true winner in any thread about Kawhi, you're certainly not that guy.




You have to get on with your life my man. Take a look in the mirror, let out a scream or two then, go back to living because life is too short
That was a very kind gesture and a nice tip. Thanks man!
I appreciate it but you shouldn't worry about my life. I'm a happy man...and a lucky guy.
Like here, on ST.
I played -in good company of course, the best guys I can trust- all my money on Kawhi Leonard dark horse years ago.
We were betting against you/the haters/the critics, and we all know what happens when someone bets on an unknown horse and he wins the race....






http://i.imgur.com/rxxPAnWl.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/6lrG6r3l.jpg

[TheGreatYacht]

We've really been struggling against garbage teams lately. OP was up to something, tbh. Ball movement over <45fg% KawhISO's

[hater]

Kawhi is one of the most overrated Spurs in recent times

[TheGreatYacht]

Pop finally recognized that KawhISO's aren't the solution and benched him in the 4th quarter for Cory Joseph. Worked out great, tbh.

560667803250749442

[loveforthegame]

Too bad we didn't still have Hill instead.

Maybe Pop should just keep Leonard on the bench and see how that works out.

[Hoops Czar]

Can't blame Pop for wanting to win.

[loveforthegame]

Hope Pop tries that against the Clippers on Saturday.

Bet it would work against the Warriors, OKC, and some of the other top teams too.

[apalisoc_9]

Hope Pop tries that against the Clippers on Saturday.

Bet it would work against the Warriors, OKC, and some of the other top teams too.

[TheGreatYacht]

Anybody else noticed he's been ballhogging a lot more the last few games? Grabs rebound, brings the ball up the court and ignores Parker in the corner. Dismisses Duncan in the post, calls for a screen and his jumper.

We won it all last season with great ball movement, and unselfishness... is this going to be a problem long term, tbh?

Dont worry anymore EN, he's retired 611655082422218753

[ElNono]

:lol this thread

[dabom]

ElNono with the bads on this thread. I'm pretty sure I tossed it up to mile trolling. :lmao

[TheGreatYacht]

:lol this thread
A lot of truth nukes, tbh :lol

[spurraider21]

:lol this thread
op with the mainstream media takes imo