Stats show that no quarterback gets more help than Struggle Wilson [Archive]

spurraider21

01-25-2015, 11:38 PM

according to their findings Andrew Luck gets more help than Tom Brady :lol... and we saw how the pats roster was just heads and toes above the colts

but yeah, i'm sure wilson gets help... seahawks have an elite defense and one of the best running backs in the league. they obviously need ways to compensate for their horrid collection of weapons in the passing game. their offensive line thrives in run blocking and is mediocre in pass protection. as i've said many times, their roster is not built to be pass happy at all. that said, wilson still tends to put up good individual numbers. he's not immune to having some terrible games, like against Dallas earlier in the year and against Green Bay in the NFC championship game this year.

i dont get why this is such a revelation to you though :lol... and article that says a team with a great defense can make up for poor offensive performances

Malik Hairston

01-25-2015, 11:44 PM

Well, ya, this should be obvious to anybody:lol..

Clipper Nation

01-25-2015, 11:45 PM

seahawks have an elite defense and one of the best running backs in the league. they obviously need ways to compensate for their horrid collection of weapons in the passing game.
Including their quarterback.

spurraider21

01-26-2015, 12:02 AM

Including their quarterback.
higher QBR than Rivers :lol

wilson does well with his attempts, they're obviously not built to be a high-volume passing team. it would waste their best offensive player in Lynch.

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 01:08 AM

it would waste their best offensive player in Lynch.
Philo finally admitting that Lynch is the alpha and Team Leader :wow

spurraider21

01-26-2015, 01:15 AM

Philo finally admitting that Lynch is the alpha and Team Leader :wow
he's their best offensive player... he's an elite RB and Wilson isn't an elite QB. that's not really questioned by anybody (though avante might say Wilson is elite)

but QB is still the most impactful and least replaceable position. Prime Adrian Peterson was a force the league hasn't seen the likes if which in quite some time, but the Vikings offenses overall were still mediocre despite that (except for the Favre year) because they were held back by mediocre quarterbacks. the seahawks had Lynch before Wilson, and he was the same Lynch.

LT was the best player on the Chargers offenses when he was at his peak... that doesn't mean Rivers was an afterthought though.

go back to basically any recent superbowl champ and tell me those QB's didn't have help. maybe they didn't quite have defenses like Seattle, but they probably had better passing weapons, etc

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 01:27 AM

but QB is still the most impactful and least replaceable position
Not on the Seahawks :lol

spurraider21

01-26-2015, 01:31 AM

Not on the Seahawks :lol
on any team

even having a merely average, competent QB is huge in today's league. if you have a bad QB, ur entirely fucked. and if you hit the reset button on the QB position (ie, allow Wilson to walk so you can keep other players), it can ruin the window of a good roster. it can take 2-3 years to develop a QB, and even longer if your first QB doesn't pan out

look at this year's texans tbh... they have a pretty damn good roster, but the lack of even a competent QB really fucked them over. same with cleveland (browns were doing fine when Hoyer was playing average ball to start the year). put russell wilson on Houston and they were easily a playoff team and probably a division winner

Avante

01-26-2015, 01:32 AM

I said back before he ever took an NFL snap that this kid would be special and what have we seen? He's went 10-0 vs SB winning QB's. He's went 6-1 in playoff games. His stats on a par with any other third year QB ever. Most wins by any QB in three seasons. Only third year QB to start in two SB's.

He is everything I said he would be.

And....he's never had a great TE or wide receiver.

Imagine this guy with Reggie Wayne, Marvin Harrison and Dallas Clark or Isacc Bruce, Torry Holt and Marshall Faulk out of the back field. Give him The Gronk or a Calvin Johnson.

Anyone not seeing the stress he puts on a defense doesn't understand the game. A defender knows where Peyton/Tom will be, there no fear at all of them hurting you with their legs....none. Totally different deal with Russell Wilson.

This weakass....he has a running game, a stud defense.....hahahahaha!!!!!!!!! Only a know nothing would play that totally ignoring the fact he has no stud receivers backing anyone off, receivers that can be single covered.

Russell Wilson is a great young talent the most dynamic QB playing today, the best runner/passer the game has ever seen.

I like doing this.

Only 300 passer/100 rusher in a game.
Only NFC QB to throw for 26 TD's as a rookie.
Highest passer rating of any third year QB.
Most wins ever by a third year QB.
Only third year QB to start two SB's.
Left the NCAA as the all time passing efficency leader.

How anyone cannot get all that....?????

Stats prove Russell Wilson is already an elite quarterback

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 01:46 AM

Avante

01-26-2015, 01:49 AM

Lynch and the defense, you the real MVP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U94nA4Nf3wQ

There has never been a more successful QB after three seasons. Facts are cool.

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 01:50 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEP6GoKsl_c

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uWNC6YGS6R8

spurraider21

01-26-2015, 01:51 AM

they're a great team... this is why they're in their second straight superbowl

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 01:53 AM

they're a great team... this is why they're in their second straight superbowl

Yep... a great team with a great running game, great defense... only flaw is the QB position, tbh.

Avante

01-26-2015, 01:53 AM

Do I really need that long list of great running backs who never played in a SB? How about....Barry Sanders?

So it's not all about passing the ball......is it?

Avante

01-26-2015, 01:54 AM

Yep... a great team with a great running game, great defense... only flaw is the QB position, tbh.

What third year QB has done it better?

Thebesteva

01-26-2015, 01:55 AM

Well, ya, this should be obvious to anybody:lol..

Sadly, if Seahawks win, people will be talking about how Wilson is the new Brady and going to take over the league. I can already visualize the graphic showing the all time great QB's to repeat with Wilsons shitty name on that epic list

SanAntonioSpurs23

01-26-2015, 01:56 AM

Struggle Wilson is a good qb, but he is NOT elite

spurraider21

01-26-2015, 01:56 AM

Sadly, if Seahawks win, people will be talking about how Wilson is the new Brady and going to take over the league. I can already visualize the graphic showing the all time great QB's to repeat with Wilsons shitty name on that epic list
Patfan points out how much butthurt their team success causes... and Russell Wilson is becoming like that on SpursTalk :lol

Avante

01-26-2015, 01:56 AM

Sadly, if Seahawks win, people will be talking about how Wilson is the new Brady and going to take over the league. I can already visualize the graphic showing the all time great QB's to repeat with Wilsons shitty name on that epic list

Compare RW's three year stats with any other QB after three seasons.

Avante

01-26-2015, 01:57 AM

Struggle Wilson is a good qb, but he is NOT elite

The stats tell a different story.

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 02:01 AM

The stats tell a different story.

Nah, the stats actually show he's not elite.

In fact, since 2012, Wilson’s first year in the league, the Seahawks have 15 wins in which their quarterback posted a below-average Total QBR, five more than any other team in the NFL. That includes both of Seattle’s NFC Championship wins during that time.

Based on Wilson’s game-level QBRs in the last three seasons, he has almost 10 more wins than expected. No other player has six more wins than expected during that time.

So how have Wilson and the Seahawks been able to defy the odds? One word: defense.

In the last three seasons, the Seahawks have contributed 4.4 points per game to their net scoring margin on defense, by far the best defensive efficiency in the NFL. Only Alex Smith (2.1) and Andy Dalton (2.1) have had defenses that contributed more than two expected points per game in their starts during that time.

Seattle’s defense has a knack for playing its best when Wilson and the offense are at their worst. Since the start of 2012, Wilson has had 22 games with a QBR below 50, including 15 wins. In those games, Seattle has held its opponents to an average QBR of 34.0 and has had a per-game defensive efficiency of +7.3. In Wilson’s games with an above-average QBR, the Seahawks have allowed a 45.7 average QBR and have had a +2.4 defensive efficiency rating.

Translation: in 30% of the Seahawks' wins in the Struggle era, he's played like a below-average quarterback and the defense has completely bailed him out. "Elite" my ass :lol

SanAntonioSpurs23

01-26-2015, 02:01 AM

The stats tell a different story.

You're right, they say he's an average qb who benefits from his defense and running game.

Avante

01-26-2015, 02:06 AM

Nah, the stats actually show he's not elite.

How many QB's come straight out of college into a starting role? Why do you contine to totally ignore the fact he's never had great receivers....well?

Translation: in 30% of the Seahawks' wins in the Struggle era, he's played like a below-average quarterback and the defense has completely bailed him out. "Elite" my ass :lol

Avante

01-26-2015, 02:07 AM

You're right, they say he's an average qb who benefits from his defense and running game.

No they don't. Why not try actually looking at his stats, it does help.

Avante

01-26-2015, 02:08 AM

Nah, the stats actually show he's not elite.

Translation: in 30% of the Seahawks' wins in the Struggle era, he's played like a below-average quarterback and the defense has completely bailed him out. "Elite" my ass :lol

How come all those like myself who really understand the game disagree with you?

Give me the name of any QB who ever played the game and I will compare their first three seasons to RW's. Let's see how they stack up.

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 02:10 AM

Actually, I was wrong about the percentage. In reality, 35% of their wins have been in spite of Struggle playing at a below-average level.

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 02:11 AM

all those like myself who really understand the game

:lmao

Avante

01-26-2015, 02:11 AM

Actually, I was wrong about the percentage. In reality, 35% of their wins have been in spite of Struggle playing at a below-average level.

So who is he better than? Anyone?

Avante

01-26-2015, 02:12 AM

:lmao

I;m not the one...you gotta pass pass and pass...HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Clipper Nation

01-26-2015, 02:16 AM

I;m not the one...you gotta pass pass and pass...HAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

With you, it's "run, run, run, two yards and a cloud of dust" until you need to start making excuses for Struggle, at which point it becomes "he has no weapons in the passing game :cry"

Avante

01-26-2015, 02:25 AM

With you, it's "run, run, run, two yards and a cloud of dust" until you need to start making excuses for Struggle, at which point it becomes "he has no weapons in the passing game :cry"

Amazing, wow~~~~~~~~~~~

Two yards and a cloud of dust won't win a fucking thing...ok? What will win his ...THIRD and SHORT...ok? Football is all about...THIRD DOWN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!...ok?

When you can run the ball, you will be in third and two/three....now what? Yep..run? pass? When in third and more than 4...PASS!!!!!!!!!!!!!...now think.

Like talking to a little kid, wow~~~~~~~~~~~

AND..when you can run the ball you consume time, which gives your D a blow.

Rookies, sheesh~~~~~~~~~~~~

Avante

01-26-2015, 02:27 AM

How many great/HOF type QB's came right out of college and started every game their first three pro football seasons, well?

Johnny Unitas was cut
Joe Montana, Dan Marino, Big Ben, John Elway...didn't start every game their rookie season. Brett Favre was dumped. Aaron Rodgers sat on a bench for how long? Tom Brady sat on a bench for how long? How long before Terry Bradshaw was the starter?

I challenge anyone to show me another QB who stepped right out of the NCAA into pro football and comes close to comparing to RW when it comes to...

wins
comp%
TD/INT ratio
passer rating

Come on give me a name of someone who compares.

RW's stats totally dwarf those of Peyton Mannings after three seasaons, not even close. So who did it better after three seasons......well?

Silver&Black

01-26-2015, 02:50 AM

The saying is "Defense wins championships"

Not...."Elite QB play wins championships"

Raven

01-26-2015, 03:33 AM

higher QBR than Rivers :lol

wilson does well with his attempts, they're obviously not built to be a high-volume passing team. it would waste their best offensive player in Lynch.

:bobo

Raven

01-26-2015, 03:41 AM

according to their findings Andrew Luck gets more help than Tom Brady :lol... and we saw how the pats roster was just heads and toes above the colts

i'm pretty sure i'd trade edelman, amendola and lolfell for moncrief and ty hilton in a heartbeat. Our best running back apparently is a guy pittsburgh kicked in the butt midseason and made it through waivers no problem. The offence has been good, but it took time and true mastery from the coaching, sometimes beating the overwhelming odds (lolfell producing, really?) and we've been very lucky with injuries. I don't see many of our players on offence getting big contracts at all, perhaps even getting kicked out of the league the moment BB decides they are done with the team. Gronk of course is a different matter.

Avante

01-26-2015, 03:42 AM

Andrew Luck career

comp% 58.6
td/int...86/43
passer rating....86.6

RW

63.5
72/26
98.6

No matter what QB you use it will resemble that, RW getting the nod. Talking first three seasons.

spurraider21

01-26-2015, 04:35 AM

i'm pretty sure i'd trade edelman, amendola and lolfell for moncrief and ty hilton in a heartbeat. Our best running back apparently is a guy pittsburgh kicked in the butt midseason and made it through waivers no problem. The offence has been good, but it took time and true mastery from the coaching, sometimes beating the overwhelming odds (lolfell producing, really?) and we've been very lucky with injuries. I don't see many of our players on offence getting big contracts at all, perhaps even getting kicked out of the league the moment BB decides they are done with the team. Gronk of course is a different matter.
so you really think the difference in that game was just Brady is THAT much better a player than Luck? :lol

Raven

01-26-2015, 04:45 AM

so you really think the difference in that game was just Brady is THAT much better a player than Luck? :lol

In a way, yes. Tom and the coaching. They simply were able to gameplan any way they saw fit and when that didnt work, like against baltimore, tom made the difference. Him and edelman i mean :lol.