Uninsured Ex-Sheriff Who Fought O-care Struggles To Pay Medical Bills

[RandomGuy]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/sheriff-mack-gofundme-medical-bills


Former Arizona county sheriff Richard Mack, a fierce opponent of Obamacare and a leader in the "constitutional sheriff" movement, is struggling to pay his medical bills after he and his wife each faced serious illnesses. The former sheriff and his wife do not have health insurance and started a GoFundMe campaign to solicit donations from family and friends to cover the costs of their medical care.

"Because they are self-employed, they have no medical insurance and are in desperate need of our assistance," reads a note on Mack's personal website.

Mack, the founder of the Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association, suffered a heart attack in January and is in recovery. His wife fell ill late last year. Mack is on the board of Oath Keepers, a right-wing fringe group made up of police and military veterans, and is known for supporting Cliven Bundy in his standoff against the federal government. He is also an ardent opponent of Obamacare.

"The States do not have to take or support or pay for Obamacare or anything else from Washington DC. The States are not subject to federal direction," he wrote on his website, outlining how state governments can block President Obama.

The CSPOA lauded South Carolina for using Mack's 1992 lawsuit against gun control legislation to attempt to nullify the Affordable Care Act in the state.

"Now as states wake up to their true power and responsibility, we have SC taking exemplary action to protect their citizens from an out of control federal government," a CSPOA blog post about the South Carolina bill reads.

Mack founded the CSPOA to "unite all public servants and sheriffs, to keep their word to uphold, defend, protect, preserve, and obey the Constitutions of the United States of America" and described the group as "the army to set our nation free." The CSPOA is helping to get the word out about the fundraising campaign to offset the Macks' medical expenses.

"Since it appears that recovery will take a good deal of time with associated expenses, I struggle to not feel stress – both the stress of thinking about huge hospital and other medical bills as well as regular living expenses while I am unable to work -- and also the stress of not being able to accomplish what I am so passionate about doing for others," Mack wrote in a note on his GoFundMe page. "It is difficult and humbling to say that we need your help, but we do."



:lmao



http://memeguy.com/photos/images/oh-the-irony-8234.jpg

[ElNono]

Nothing to gloat about, IMO. And I'm willing to bet it's not going to change one iota the way he thinks, unfortunately.

[hitmanyr2k]

I have to question the intelligence of someone who doesn't get healthcare for himself or his family when he can afford it. He better start changing his thinking because that most likely won't be the last heart attack or major ailment he suffers. And if he did suffer another setback only to hang on for awhile and then die he'll be leaving his family holding the bag with some hefty medical expenses.

[DMC]

Just because a person doesn't agree with a plan doesn't mean some plan isn't needed. You can be against Obamacare and still believe in healthcare reform.

[boutons_deux]

Just because a person doesn't agree with a plan doesn't mean some plan isn't needed. You can be against Obamacare and still believe in healthcare reform.

As sheriff, this asshole had some influence on some people, and he used it to trash ACA. That's a lot more than "doesn't agree"

[DMC]

As sheriff, this asshole had some influence on some people, and he used it to trash ACA. That's a lot more than "doesn't agree"

How does what you said detract at all from the point I made?

Person A disagrees with ACA
Person A gets sick without coverage

Conclusion: ACA is good

Boutons is against the law requiring 5 point harness in all cars
Boutons is injured in an auto accident

5 point harnesses are a good idea

[boutons_deux]

How does what you said detract at all from the point I made?

Person A disagrees with ACA
Person A gets sick without coverage

Conclusion: ACA is good

Boutons is against the law requiring 5 point harness in all cars
Boutons is injured in an auto accident

5 point harnesses are a good idea

wonderful bullshit!

The Great Boutons only has dominating influence here on ST, not as holder and ex-holder of public office.

[DMC]

wonderful bullshit!

The Great Boutons only has dominating influence here on ST, not as holder and ex-holder of public office.

You don't seem to understand how logic works.

[boutons_deux]

You don't seem to understand how logic works.

you don't seem to understand how influence from an ELECTED local govt official of enforcement authority works.

[MultiTroll]

Just because a person doesn't agree with a plan doesn't mean some plan isn't needed. You can be against Obamacare and still believe in healthcare reform.
Great, what is Sheriff Repugs plan?

Just like years ago when the Dem congressman put up the sign for the Republican Health Care Plan.

1. Don't get sick
2. If you get sick, die soon.

[DMC]

Great, what is Sheriff Repugs plan?

Just like years ago when the Dem congressman put up the sign for the Republican Health Care Plan.

1. Don't get sick
2. If you get sick, die soon.

Any time I see a "just like" comment instead of an explanation, I know it's a deflection.

I didn't die before ACA. I still have the same coverage as before.

What you should say is

1. Don't get sick if you don't have coverage
2. Die if you get sick and you don't have coverage OR go to an indigent clinic like the rest of the homeless people.

[DMC]

you don't seem to understand how influence from an ELECTED local govt official of enforcement authority works.

You think a sheriff's opinions affects votes or policy? lol

[ElNono]

Just because a person doesn't agree with a plan doesn't mean some plan isn't needed. You can be against Obamacare and still believe in healthcare reform.

I agree with this. I think ACA is a shit sandwich, but my main dislike has to do with the fact that it doesn't address cost.

Still, unlike the sheriff, I don't think this is an area where "free market" solutions really exist. The fiduciary duty to shareholders will almost always trump what's best for the patient. So government intervention is a must.

[boutons_deux]

"it doesn't address cost."

CBO just put out a report this week that ACA is reducing health care costs.

Will ACA reduce the $1T overcharging in the $3T annual amount? no If ACA had aggressively gone after cost, the health care industry would have Harry-and-Louise'd it, to death.

[ElNono]

[COLOR=#000000]Will ACA reduce the $1T overcharging in the $3T annual amount? no

Well, there you go. It doesn't really address cost. It empowered insurance co's to wrestle better prices due to higher, compulsive membership.

But the actual prices haven't changed at all. You can ask anybody that's uninsured and pays out of pocket.

[boutons_deux]

Well, there you go. It doesn't really address cost. It empowered insurance co's to wrestle better prices due to higher, compulsive membership.

But the actual prices haven't changed at all. You can ask anybody that's uninsured and pays out of pocket.

ACA doesn't set prices.

Govt has been reducing Medicare payments to doctors for a couple decades, another attempt coming up soon, but Congress has always kicked it down the road. That charade existed long before ACA. But there are 1000s of doctors who refuse Medicare patients, and 1000s more who are cash only. You pay out of pocket and claim with your insurance.

Health care, hyper-expensive, hyper-cartelized, no competition, hyper-hyper-complicated, is just another way America is fucked and unfuckable. Unfucking is blocked by BigCorp's whores in Congress (eg, Baucus, Liebermann blocking public option)

[Spurminator]

ACA doesn't set prices.

Which is what he's saying.

[boutons_deux]

Which is what he's saying.

and I'm saying govt has tried to reduce prices paid to docs for Medicare services, and it keeps getting kicked down the road, FOR YEARS.

[angrydude]

Of course he needs help. Health Insurance costs have gone up a lot due to Obamacare.

[ElNono]

Of course he needs help. Health Insurance costs have gone up a lot due to Obamacare.

Apparently, they have a lot of problems but that one isn't one of them:

The former sheriff and his wife do not have health insurance

[ElNono]

and I'm saying govt has tried

No they haven't. They negotiated a sweet deal with BigPharma, they blocked Medicare from negotiating bulk prices, etc. You were actually bitching about all that stuff.

[Th'Pusher]

Well, there you go. It doesn't really address cost. It empowered insurance co's to wrestle better prices due to higher, compulsive membership.

But the actual prices haven't changed at all. You can ask anybody that's uninsured and pays out of pocket.

It's a little disingenuous to completely disregard the fact that going after cost was politically untenable. I understand this is a false choice, but would you rather have the ACA or what was the status quo before the ACA?

[Koolaid_Man]

Just because a person doesn't agree with a plan doesn't mean some plan isn't needed. You can be against Obamacare and still believe in healthcare reform.

BDgcc5Sif3k

[ElNono]

It's a little disingenuous to completely disregard the fact that going after cost was politically untenable. I understand this is a false choice, but would you rather have the ACA or what was the status quo before the ACA?

There's nothing disingenuous about pointing out something obvious from the law. Whether it was "politically untenable" or whatever the excuse, it's clear that it's one area where the ACA fell very short, which is disappointing given how difficult it is to pass healthcare reform in this country.

ACA vs status quo is shit sandwich 1 vs shit sandwich 2. You could argue one shit sandwich is better than the other, but at the end of the day it's still a shit sandwich.

All that said, I've mentioned in the past that at least one positive thing about ACA is that it could be a stepping stone to something better. If you want an omelet, you gotta break some eggs. In that sense, I think rattling the status quo was a positive, even if the replacement is no better.

[Th'Pusher]

There's nothing disingenuous about pointing out something obvious from the law. Whether it was "politically untenable" or whatever the excuse, it's clear that it's one area where the ACA fell very short, which is disappointing given how difficult it is to pass healthcare reform in this country.

Just so we're on the same page, is it your position that something with more effective cost controls could have passed congress? And if so, what would it look like?

[ElNono]

Just so we're on the same page, is it your position that something with more effective cost controls could have passed congress? And if so, what would it look like?

We're not discussing what "Congress can pass". We're discussing that ACA did nothing to control overinflated prices, which is one of the main drivers of health expenditure in this country.

The reason why that happened is simply anecdotal. Whether it's because Congress is co-opted, or they didn't have the balls or votes. It's all academic.

There's not going to be real healthcare reform until you clearly put patient care over profit motive.

[angrydude]

There's not going to be real healthcare reform until you clearly put patient care over profit motive.

Do you mean running it at a loss?

Or eliminating unnecessary costs (the insurance companies)?

[ElNono]

Do you mean running it at a loss?

Or eliminating unnecessary costs (the insurance companies)?

The latter + capping margins through price controls, or it's not going to work.

If the private sector wants to offer a "concierge" type of service for extra cost, they certainly offer that for those that want it and can afford it.

[boutons_deux]

"patient care over profit motive."

that would violate a for-profit corporation's fiduciary duty, so patient care as a priority won't EVER happen in USA.

[Th'Pusher]

There's not going to be real healthcare reform until you clearly put patient care over profit motive.

I agree with you, but arguing the means to get to that end without consideration of the monied and political interest is the academic exercise. The ACA is what was politically feasible to pass at the time. That's what healthcare reform looks like in the US.

[ElNono]

that would violate a for-profit corporation's fiduciary duty, so patient care as a priority won't EVER happen in USA.

That's why I said that "corporation's fiduciary duty" has to be out of the picture.


I agree with you, but arguing the means to get to that end without consideration of the monied and political interest is the academic exercise. The ACA is what was politically feasible to pass at the time. That's what healthcare reform looks like in the US.

I didn't argue the "means". I argued that ACA did nothing to address the real elephant in the room. That's real, not academic.

Academic is discussing how we can change Congress so the next time, whenever that might be, a better solution is "politically feasible".

At that point we enter in the realm of "America, fucked and unfuckable", etc...

[boutons_deux]

At that point we enter in the realm of "America, fucked and unfuckable", etc...

we are there, been there quite awhile, no escaping, it's getting worse by the year, if not faster.

Wanna go faster? in 2016, hand Exec and Congress to Repugs, along with SCOTUS.

[RandomGuy]

Nothing to gloat about, IMO. And I'm willing to bet it's not going to change one iota the way he thinks, unfortunately.

Not gloating, per se. I find it funny in a sad sort of way, but not gloating. I wouldn't really wish that on anyone. I might even give the guy $5 bucks.

As to whether it would change his mind, I can only hope that this episode highlights for him the failure of libertarian social theories.

Lastly:
http://www.investopedia.com/financial-edge/0310/top-5-reasons-people-go-bankrupt.aspx

Top reason people go bankrupt:

1) Medical Expenses

​​​A study done at Harvard University indicates that this is the biggest cause of bankruptcy, representing 62% of all personal bankruptcies. One of the interesting caveats of this study shows that 78% of filers had some form of health insurance, thus bucking the myth that medical bills affect only the uninsured.

Rare or serious diseases or injuries can easily result in hundreds of thousands of dollars in medical bills - bills that can quickly wipe out savings and retirement accounts, college education funds and home equity. Once these have been exhausted, bankruptcy may be the only shelter left, regardless of whether the patient or his or her family was able to apply health coverage to a portion of the bill or not. (Find out what you can do to avoid a financial meltdown when there's a medical emergency. Read Steering Clear Of Medical Debt.)

The costs of this are socialized anyway. It is buried in the interest you pay for every kind of loan you might ever need to take.

[boutons_deux]

You don't have to go bankrupt. Ms just can't find money to pay medical bills.

Medical Debt Among People With Health Insurance

An estimated 1 in 3 Americans report having difficulty paying their medical bills – that is, they have had problems affording medical bills within the past year, or they are gradually paying past bills over time, or they have bills they can’t afford to pay at all.1 (http://kff.org/private-insurance/report/medical-debt-among-people-with-health-insurance/view/footnotes/#footnote-98143-1)

Medical debt – and a host of related problems – can result when people can’t afford to pay their medical bills.

While the chances of falling into medical debt are greater for people who are uninsured, most people who experience difficulty paying medical bills have health insurance.

Medical debt can arise when people must pay out-of-pocket for care not covered by health insurance or to which cost-sharing (such as deductibles) applies.

Medical debt might also result from health insurance premiums that individuals find difficult to afford.2 (http://kff.org/private-insurance/report/medical-debt-among-people-with-health-insurance/view/footnotes/#footnote-98143-2) The consequences of medical debt can be severe.

People with unaffordable medical bills report higher rates of other problems – including difficulty affording housing and other basic necessities, credit card debt, bankruptcy, and barriers accessing health care.

http://kff.org/private-insurance/report/medical-debt-among-people-with-health-insurance/

But Repugs and BigCorp will abort any proposals for govt no-profit public insurance option.